Re: [QUAD-L] After death
Everyone has their own opinion on this, I am sure. So here is mine. I have NO IDEA! I know there have been times in my life when it has been influenced by a guidiance or spirit or GOD. I think all religion have the same basic principle. Believe in a higher power. Be good to one another. Basically be nice! I know when bad things happen everyone says why did God let it happen. And that things, like becoming a quad, happen for a reason. I kind of think that is bull. I think accidents happen to good or bad people. It is how you deal with the situation that makes it ok or hell to deal with. You can become a quad and sit and dwell and get pissed at the world or feel sorry for yourself. I know everyone has these feelings sometimes. But you can also use your experiences to make a difference for someone else. Life does not always come out like we plan. But it is like going on a trip. The fun part...the most exciting parts are the ones that were not planned. Like getting lost or finding a neat place that you did not know existed along the road. If everything went as planned it would be kind of boring to know what was coming next every single second of our lives. The good parts are the parts that we did not even know was coming. I am not sure what exist in the afterlife..but I know there is no harm in being a good person. If there is a God...I know that he does have a sense of humor. And I am sure we keep him entertained here. And a lot of the times I am sure he is shaking his head and wondering how we do the things we do to each other. Ok..I have rambled on and still have not figured out if there is an afterlife or not. I know that I intend to make the best of this life. The restwell, I will find out when I go down that road too. Amy andrea murray [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: YES, Thank God that I almost died, I wouldn't be graduating next month. I whouldn't be giving motivational speeches, I wouldn't be helping people, Wheelchair Warrior Jessica Ann Gordon [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Apr 14, 2007, at 3:39 PM, kaye allard wrote: LOL Angie! I believe that is what is considered as properly assuming the correct karma. Speaking of extremism, or, life and death with a religious and nonsensical perspective, watch this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g285x4sUKoo omg -- that's some f'd up stuff! thank god i have not been brainwashed! =jessica - Ahhh...imagining that irresistible new car smell? Check out new cars at Yahoo! Autos. - Ahhh...imagining that irresistible new car smell? Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.
FW: Re: [QUAD-L] After death
Voltaire said: If God did not exist, it would be necessary to invent him. How true. From: Amy Davis [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: andrea murray [EMAIL PROTECTED],Jessica Ann Gordon [EMAIL PROTECTED] CC: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [QUAD-L] After death Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2007 06:07:37 -0700 (PDT) Everyone has their own opinion on this, I am sure. So here is mine. I have NO IDEA! I know there have been times in my life when it has been influenced by a guidiance or spirit or GOD. I think all religion have the same basic principle. Believe in a higher power. Be good to one another. Basically be nice! I know when bad things happen everyone says why did God let it happen. And that things, like becoming a quad, happen for a reason. I kind of think that is bull. I think accidents happen to good or bad people. It is how you deal with the situation that makes it ok or hell to deal with. You can become a quad and sit and dwell and get pissed at the world or feel sorry for yourself. I know everyone has these feelings sometimes. But you can also use your experiences to make a difference for someone else. Life does not always come out like we plan. But it is like going on a trip. The fun part...the most exciting parts are the ones that were not planned. Like getting lost or finding a neat place that you did not know existed along the road. If everything went as planned it would be kind of boring to know what was coming next every single second of our lives. The good parts are the parts that we did not even know was coming. I am not sure what exist in the afterlife..but I know there is no harm in being a good person. If there is a God...I know that he does have a sense of humor. And I am sure we keep him entertained here. And a lot of the times I am sure he is shaking his head and wondering how we do the things we do to each other. Ok..I have rambled on and still have not figured out if there is an afterlife or not. I know that I intend to make the best of this life. The restwell, I will find out when I go down that road too. Amy andrea murray [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: YES, Thank God that I almost died, I wouldn't be graduating next month. I whouldn't be giving motivational speeches, I wouldn't be helping people, Wheelchair Warrior Jessica Ann Gordon [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Apr 14, 2007, at 3:39 PM, kaye allard wrote: LOL Angie! I believe that is what is considered as properly assuming the correct karma. Speaking of extremism, or, life and death with a religious and nonsensical perspective, watch this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g285x4sUKoo omg -- that's some f'd up stuff! thank god i have not been brainwashed! =jessica - Ahhh...imagining that irresistible new car smell? Check out new cars at Yahoo! Autos. - Ahhh...imagining that irresistible new car smell? Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.
Re: [QUAD-L] After death
I don't believe there's a hell, (besides here at times), but I hear they have the best parties!! -Angie Dan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: When, or if, I die, I'm going straight to Hell because I've been a bad boy and besides that where all my friends are :) Dan V - Ahhh...imagining that irresistible new car smell? Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.
[QUAD-L] After death
Funny, but if there was no Hell, then there is no down. The is no Yang. There would be no out. I'm think there is a Hell. Otherwise, where would the bad people go. W In a message dated 4/15/2007 11:34:54 A.M. Central Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I don't believe there's a hell, (besides here at times), but I hear they have the best parties!! -Angie Dan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: When, or if, I die, I'm going straight to Hell because I've been a bad boy and besides that where all my friends are :) Dan V ** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.
Re: [QUAD-L] After death
I once read a book titled 'Why do bad things happen to good people'. It was written by a Religious leader a Rabbi, Priest or whatever. The gist of it was that God put us here and that was that. He did not believe in Divine intervention. Much like your post Amy. One of my mottos is 'Life is a crap shoot'. You get what you get - deal with it. I have to laugh when people attribute everything to God. 'A tornado was coming and we took refuge in our church. All the other buildings around us were destroyed but not our church! That's because God protected us.' This same type of thinking happens when the church was demolished by the tornado and everyone inside was killed. 'It's all part of God's plan. We don't understand it but we're sure He has a reason for this'. Prayer may comfort you but IMHO it won't affect the outcome - nor should it. Dan V At 06:07 AM 4/15/2007 -0700, Amy Davis said something that elicited my response: Everyone has their own opinion on this, I am sure. So here is mine. I have NO IDEA! I know there have been times in my life when it has been influenced by a guidiance or spirit or GOD. I think all religion have the same basic principle. Believe in a higher power. Be good to one another. Basically be nice! I know when bad things happen everyone says why did God let it happen. And that things, like becoming a quad, happen for a reason. I kind of think that is bull. I think accidents happen to good or bad people. It is how you deal with the situation that makes it ok or hell to deal with. You can become a quad and sit and dwell and get pissed at the world or feel sorry for yourself. I know everyone has these feelings sometimes. But you can also use your experiences to make a difference for someone else. Life does not always come out like we plan. But it is like going on a trip. The fun part...the most exciting parts are the ones that were not planned. Like getting lost or finding a neat place that you did not know existed along the road. If everything went as planned it would be kind of boring to know what was coming next every single second of our lives. The good parts are the parts that we did not even know was coming. I am not sure what exist in the afterlife..but I know there is no harm in being a good person. If there is a God...I know that he does have a sense of humor. And I am sure we keep him entertained here. And a lot of the times I am sure he is shaking his head and wondering how we do the things we do to each other. Ok..I have rambled on and still have not figured out if there is an afterlife or not. I know that I intend to make the best of this life. The restwell, I will find out when I go down that road too. Amy andrea murray [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g285x4sUKoohttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g285x4sUKoo omg -- that's some f'd up stuff! thank god i have not been brainwashed! =jessica Ahhh...imagining that irresistible new car smell? Check out http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=48245/*http://autos.yahoo.com/new_cars.html;_ylc=X3oDMTE1YW1jcXJ2BF9TAzk3MTA3MDc2BHNlYwNtYWlsdGFncwRzbGsDbmV3LWNhcnM-new cars at Yahoo! Autos. Ahhh...imagining that irresistible new car smell? Check out http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=48245/*http://autos.yahoo.com/new_cars.html;_ylc=X3oDMTE1YW1jcXJ2BF9TAzk3MTA3MDc2BHNlYwNtYWlsdGFncwRzbGsDbmV3LWNhcnM-new cars at Yahoo! Autos.
Re: [QUAD-L] After death
LOL! I don't believe in Hell either or Heaven for that matter. I'm hoping the hereafter is entering another plane, another dimention. Our bodies are made up of energy and energy is never destroyed it just move to a different dimention. I'm hoping I'll be united with those loved ones that have passed on. Dan V At 09:34 AM 4/15/2007 -0700, Angie Novak said something that elicited my response: I don't believe there's a hell, (besides here at times), but I hear they have the best parties!! -Angie Dan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: When, or if, I die, I'm going straight to Hell because I've been a bad boy and besides that where all my friends are :) Dan V Ahhh...imagining that irresistible new car smell? Check out http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=48245/*http://autos.yahoo.com/new_cars.html;_ylc=X3oDMTE1YW1jcXJ2BF9TAzk3MTA3MDc2BHNlYwNtYWlsdGFncwRzbGsDbmV3LWNhcnM-new cars at Yahoo! Autos.
[QUAD-L] God, and Heaven-Hell
If you live a good life as IF there really IS a God and Heaven or Hell
and die to find out it was not true--YOU LOST NOTHING.BUT IF you live and
deny God and Heaven Or Hell and DIE to find out THERE IS a GOD and it's All
TRUE---{{YOU LOST EVERYTHING.}} But God wants no robots, that's why he
gave Mankind free will and choices. As a matter of fact he even granted his
Angels free willWhen Lucifer Tried to overthrow God, He took 1/3 of God's
angels with him by decieving them to follow him.
Dan H.
[QUAD-L] Not receiving the postings
I am not receiving any postings from the quad-list, but do receive individual postings. Glenn ** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.
Re: [QUAD-L] God, and Heaven-Hell
What is Hell like? Is it really like being burned alive for all eternity? Or is
that a euphemism?
Dan V
At 11:28 AM 4/15/2007 -0700, Danny Hearn said something that elicited my
response:
If you live a good life as IF there really IS a God and Heaven or Hell
and die to find out it was not true--YOU LOST NOTHING.BUT IF you live
and deny God and Heaven Or Hell and DIE to find out THERE IS a GOD and it's
All TRUE---{{YOU LOST EVERYTHING.}} But God wants no robots, that's
why he gave Mankind free will and choices. As a matter of fact he even
granted his Angels free willWhen Lucifer Tried to overthrow God, He took
1/3 of God's angels with him by decieving them to follow him.
Dan H.
Re: [QUAD-L] God, and Heaven-Hell
Just a few questions, how did you hear about the thing with Lucifer? And are
you saying faith is just covering all the bases? Have you noticed not many
churches want cripples that don't seem to get any better. I have gone to
several churches where the pastor has looked directly at me and said god
answers the prayers of all true believers. If I don't have a church to go to on
Sundays then where will I get my weekly dosage of guilt?
I must be a true believer or I wouldn't feel guilty about this e mail.
john
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Quad-list@eskimo.com
Sent: Sun, 15 Apr 2007 2:28 PM
Subject: [QUAD-L] God, and Heaven-Hell
If you live a good life as IF there really IS a God and Heaven or Hell
and die to find out it was not true--YOU LOST NOTHING.BUT IF you live and
deny God and Heaven Or Hell and DIE to find out THERE IS a GOD and it's All
TRUE---{{YOU LOST EVERYTHING.}} But God wants no robots, that's why he
gave Mankind free will and choices. As a matter of fact he even granted his
Angels free willWhen Lucifer Tried to overthrow God, He took 1/3 of God's
angels with him by decieving them to follow him.
Dan H.
AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free from
AOL at AOL.com.
RE: [QUAD-L] God, and Heaven-Hell
Dan...
What if you live a truly good life and do not deny the existence of God,
Heaven and Hell, but do not have a core belief that they do in fact exist?
Would it not be hypocritical to state that you do believe in their existence
just in case?
The big problem I have with many organized religions is you either accept
and believe, or you are doomed, regardless of how well you have lived your
life and the goodness in your heart and deeds. This is particularly true
with Christian religions.
FWIW, I do believe in a supreme being (a.k.a. God), hope there is a Heaven,
and hope there is not a Hell. Pretty sure about the first one, not sure
about the last two.
Steve
_
From: Danny Hearn [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Sunday, April 15, 2007 2:29 PM
To: Quad-list@eskimo.com
Subject: [QUAD-L] God, and Heaven-Hell
If you live a good life as IF there really IS a God and Heaven or
Hell and die to find out it was not true--YOU LOST NOTHING.BUT IF you
live and deny God and Heaven Or Hell and DIE to find out THERE IS a GOD and
it's All TRUE---{{YOU LOST EVERYTHING.}} But God wants no robots,
that's why he gave Mankind free will and choices. As a matter of fact he
even granted his Angels free willWhen Lucifer Tried to overthrow God, He
took 1/3 of God's angels with him by decieving them to follow him.
Dan H.
Re: [QUAD-L] God, and Heaven-Hell
On Apr 15, 2007, at 3:17 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have gone to several churches where the pastor has looked directly at me and said god answers the prayers of all true believers. i once had a cab driver ask what happened to me and after i told him i was paralyzed in a car accident he told me if i read the bible i will walk again -- it's people like this who turn me off from religion. =jessica
RE: [QUAD-L] After death
What constitutes bad? Ok, Hitler was a bad person and Mother Theresa was a good person, but most people fall somewhere in between those two. Where is the line drawn to separate the good and bad people? Steve _ From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, April 15, 2007 12:43 PM To: quad-list@eskimo.com Subject: [QUAD-L] After death Funny, but if there was no Hell, then there is no down. The is no Yang. There would be no out. I'm think there is a Hell. Otherwise, where would the bad people go. W In a message dated 4/15/2007 11:34:54 A.M. Central Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I don't believe there's a hell, (besides here at times), but I hear they have the best parties!! -Angie Dan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: When, or if, I die, I'm going straight to Hell because I've been a bad boy and besides that where all my friends are :) Dan V _ See what's free at AOL.com http://www.aol.com?ncid=AOLAOF0002000503 .
RE: [QUAD-L] After death
People know in their hearts what is good or evil.I'm not here to argue for gods existance, but just think if humankind followed only the basic beliefs of the 10 commandments.we would not even need a single jail, sadly that is not the case though. Steve Oldaker [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What constitutes bad? Ok, Hitler was a bad person and Mother Theresa was a good person, but most people fall somewhere in between those two. Where is the line drawn to separate the good and bad people? Steve - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, April 15, 2007 12:43 PM To: quad-list@eskimo.com Subject: [QUAD-L] After death Funny, but if there was no Hell, then there is no down. The is no Yang. There would be no out. I'm think there is a Hell. Otherwise, where would the bad people go. W In a message dated 4/15/2007 11:34:54 A.M. Central Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I don't believe there's a hell, (besides here at times), but I hear they have the best parties!! -Angie Dan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: When, or if, I die, I'm going straight to Hell because I've been a bad boy and besides that where all my friends are :) Dan V - See what's free at AOL.com.
Re: [QUAD-L] After death
On Apr 15, 2007, at 3:40 PM, Steve Oldaker wrote: What constitutes bad? General list of sins in accordance with the Bible: Anger Evil thoughts Arguing Foolishness Bitterness Fornication Blasphemy Gossip Breaking promises Hypocrisy Not believing in Jesus Failing to pray for someone Complaining Adultery Deceit Lying Disobedience to parents Lust Doubt Pride Envy Unforgiveness Evil speaking Watching bad things
Re: [QUAD-L] After death
You forgot gluttony. God hates fat people - they are going straight to Hell. Dan V At 03:52 PM 4/15/2007 -0400, Jessica Ann Gordon said something that elicited my response: On Apr 15, 2007, at 3:40 PM, Steve Oldaker wrote: What constitutes bad? General list of sins in accordance with the Bible: Anger Evil thoughts Arguing Foolishness Bitterness Fornication Blasphemy Gossip Breaking promises Hypocrisy Not believing in Jesus Failing to pray for someone Complaining Adultery Deceit Lying Disobedience to parents Lust Doubt Pride Envy Unforgiveness Evil speaking Watching bad things
Re: [QUAD-L] After death
Otherwise, where would the bad people go. Somewhere in Northern Indiana I believe.!!! Dave In a message dated 4/15/2007 9:43:19 A.M. US Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Funny, but if there was no Hell, then there is no down. The is no Yang. There would be no out. I'm think there is a Hell. Otherwise, where would the bad people go. W In a message dated 4/15/2007 11:34:54 A.M. Central Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I don't believe there's a hell, (besides here at times), but I hear they have the best parties!! -Angie Dan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: When, or if, I die, I'm going straight to Hell because I've been a bad boy and besides that where all my friends are :) Dan V See what's free at _AOL.com_ (http://www.aol.com/?ncid=AOLAOF0002000503) . Dave _Visit My Home Page_ (http://www.users.qwest.net/~daveoc/index.html) ** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.
Re: [QUAD-L] After death
There better be a Heaven and a Hell. If I end up sitting beside Hitler, I'm going to be really pissed. Dave In a message dated 4/15/2007 10:16:49 A.M. US Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: LOL! I don't believe in Hell either or Heaven for that matter. I'm hoping the hereafter is entering another plane, another dimention. Our bodies are made up of energy and energy is never destroyed it just move to a different dimention. I'm hoping I'll be united with those loved ones that have passed on. Dan V At 09:34 AM 4/15/2007 -0700, Angie Novak said something that elicited my response: I don't believe there's a hell, (besides here at times), but I hear they have the best parties!! -Angie Dan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: When, or if, I die, I'm going straight to Hell because I've been a bad boy and besides that where all my friends are :) Dan V Ahhh...imagining that irresistible new car smell? Check out _new cars at Yahoo! Autos._ (http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=48245/*http://autos.yahoo.com/new_cars.html;_ylc=X3oDMTE1YW1jcXJ2BF9TAzk3MTA3MDc2BHNlYwNt YWlsdGFncwRzbGsDbmV3LWNhcnM-) Dave _Visit My Home Page_ (http://www.users.qwest.net/~daveoc/index.html) ** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.
Re: [QUAD-L] After death
I think things don't happen FOR a reason. I think things have been BECAUSE OF a reason. Like how my SCI happened. The man driving wasn't paying attention to his turn signal, or watching the road. That's why it happened. No divine plan, I think. Just my opinion. -Angie Amy Davis [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:Everyone has their own opinion on this, I am sure. So here is mine. I have NO IDEA! I know there have been times in my life when it has been influenced by a guidiance or spirit or GOD. I think all religion have the same basic principle. Believe in a higher power. Be good to one another. Basically be nice! I know when bad things happen everyone says why did God let it happen. And that things, like becoming a quad, happen for a reason. I kind of think that is bull. I think accidents happen to good or bad people. It is how you deal with the situation that makes it ok or hell to deal with. You can become a quad and sit and dwell and get pissed at the world or feel sorry for yourself. I know everyone has these feelings sometimes. But you can also use your experiences to make a difference for someone else. Life does not always come out like we plan. But it is like going on a trip. The fun part...the most exciting parts are the ones that were not planned. Like getting lost or finding a neat place that you did not know existed along the road. If everything went as planned it would be kind of boring to know what was coming next every single second of our lives. The good parts are the parts that we did not even know was coming. I am not sure what exist in the afterlife..but I know there is no harm in being a good person. If there is a God...I know that he does have a sense of humor. And I am sure we keep him entertained here. And a lot of the times I am sure he is shaking his head and wondering how we do the things we do to each other. Ok..I have rambled on and still have not figured out if there is an afterlife or not. I know that I intend to make the best of this life. The restwell, I will find out when I go down that road too. Amy andrea murray [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: YES, Thank God that I almost died, I wouldn't be graduating next month. I whouldn't be giving motivational speeches, I wouldn't be helping people, Wheelchair Warrior Jessica Ann Gordon [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Apr 14, 2007, at 3:39 PM, kaye allard wrote: LOL Angie! I believe that is what is considered as properly assuming the correct karma. Speaking of extremism, or, life and death with a religious and nonsensical perspective, watch this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g285x4sUKoo omg -- that's some f'd up stuff! thank god i have not been brainwashed! =jessica - Ahhh...imagining that irresistible new car smell? Check out new cars at Yahoo! Autos. - Ahhh...imagining that irresistible new car smell? Check out new cars at Yahoo! Autos. - Ahhh...imagining that irresistible new car smell? Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.
Re: [QUAD-L] After death
That's a major thing with religion, right? Fear of where you'll be going from how you lived your life after you die. It's a way to keep people in line, although not everyone follows that line. The bad people. I think everyone goes to the same place, what happens there happens. -Angie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Funny, but if there was no Hell, then there is no down. The is no Yang. There would be no out. I'm think there is a Hell. Otherwise, where would the bad people go. W In a message dated 4/15/2007 11:34:54 A.M. Central Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I don't believe there's a hell, (besides here at times), but I hear they have the best parties!! -Angie Dan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: When, or if, I die, I'm going straight to Hell because I've been a bad boy and besides that where all my friends are :) Dan V - See what's free at AOL.com. - Ahhh...imagining that irresistible new car smell? Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.
Re: [QUAD-L] After death
That's a major thing with religion, right? Fear of where you'll be going from how you lived your life after you die. It's a way to keep people in line, although not everyone follows that line. The bad people. I think everyone goes to the same place, what happens there happens. -Angie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Funny, but if there was no Hell, then there is no down. The is no Yang. There would be no out. I'm think there is a Hell. Otherwise, where would the bad people go. W In a message dated 4/15/2007 11:34:54 A.M. Central Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I don't believe there's a hell, (besides here at times), but I hear they have the best parties!! -Angie Dan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: When, or if, I die, I'm going straight to Hell because I've been a bad boy and besides that where all my friends are :) Dan V - See what's free at AOL.com. - Ahhh...imagining that irresistible new car smell? Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.
Re: [QUAD-L] God, and Heaven-Hell
After my injury, our church kicked us out. They sent a letter in the mail
saying we were no longer parishioners. Guess they missed our weekly donation.
-Angie
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:Just a few questions, how did you hear about the
thing with Lucifer? And are you saying faith is just covering all the bases?
Have you noticed not many churches want cripples that don't seem to get any
better. I have gone to several churches where the pastor has looked directly at
me and said god answers the prayers of all true believers. If I don't have a
church to go to on Sundays then where will I get my weekly dosage of guilt?
I must be a true believer or I wouldn't feel guilty about this e mail.
john
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Quad-list@eskimo.com
Sent: Sun, 15 Apr 2007 2:28 PM
Subject: [QUAD-L] God, and Heaven-Hell
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good life as IF there really IS a God and Heaven or Hell and die to find out it
was not true--YOU LOST NOTHING.BUT IF you live and deny God and Heaven Or
Hell and DIE to find out THERE IS a GOD and it's All TRUE---{{YOU LOST
EVERYTHING.}} But God wants no robots, that's why he gave Mankind free will and
choices. As a matter of fact he even granted his Angels free willWhen
Lucifer Tried to overthrow God, He took 1/3 of God's angels with him by
decieving them to follow him.
Dan H.
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RE: [QUAD-L] God, and Heaven-Hell
If one believes in the goodness of God, then I don't see how they can believe
in Hell. I think I'm a relatively good person and having said that, I could
never send anyone to Hell where they would endure everlasting torture. Where is
the goodness in that? Are we not taught that God is all knowing and all loving
and forgives us of our sins? As Jesus said as he was dying on the cross
Forgive them Father for they do not know what they do. He didn't say Hey
Dad, send these bastards to Hell.
We are like children to God. Imagine that you are the parents of twin 4 year
old boys. They are playing at the top of a flight of stairs. One of them gets
angry with the other and pushes him down the flight of stairs knowing well that
the child will get hurt and the child dies. The surviving twin shows no remorse
since most 4 year olds haven't yet developed that capacity. Would you as their
parent/God send this child to Hell?
Dan V
At 03:18 PM 4/15/2007 -0400, Steve Oldaker said something that elicited my
response:
Dan...
What if you live a truly good life and do not deny the existence of God,
Heaven and Hell, but do not have a core belief that they do in fact exist?
Would it not be hypocritical to state that you do believe in their existence
just in case?
The big problem I have with many organized religions is you either accept and
believe, or you are doomed, regardless of how well you have lived your life
and the goodness in your heart and deeds. This is particularly true with
Christian religions.
FWIW, I do believe in a supreme being (a.k.a. God), hope there is a Heaven,
and hope there is not a Hell. Pretty sure about the first one, not sure about
the last two.
Steve
--
From: Danny Hearn [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Sunday, April 15, 2007 2:29 PM
To: Quad-list@eskimo.com
Subject: [QUAD-L] God, and Heaven-Hell
If you live a good life as IF there really IS a God and Heaven or Hell
and die to find out it was not true--YOU LOST NOTHING.BUT IF you live
and deny God and Heaven Or Hell and DIE to find out THERE IS a GOD and it's
All TRUE---{{YOU LOST EVERYTHING.}} But God wants no robots, that's
why he gave Mankind free will and choices. As a matter of fact he even
granted his Angels free willWhen Lucifer Tried to overthrow God, He took
1/3 of God's angels with him by decieving them to follow him.
Dan H.
Re: [QUAD-L] God, and Heaven-Hell
we didn't get kicked out of our church, but people sure acted different
towards us. And then I had the whole you are a bad girl for having
premarital sex and that's why you were in an accident comment.
I agree with the whole notion that things happen as an effect of a cause
that was made (like two people deciding to race on the highway) rather than
because it was supposed to happen. I must say that although I wasn't
exactly religious after my accident, I learned a new meaning of what faith
means. Not faith in God but just plain old faith that you can effect your
environment with work, good deeds, bad deeds, etc. also that there are
things that happen that involved us that we can't explain.
The Mystic law of cause and effect can be applied to any situation in the
universe. It makes more sense to me than God and gives me the courage to
want to affect my own environment. It fits in with evolution, but then so
does God if you talk to the right person. I don't think the whole God thing
is a bad idea, I just happen to view my universe in a different way. we all
use whatever works for us. And whatever makes sense.
I can't really say what happened to me after my accident that turned me off
of the church. For my entire life I had gone through the motions and never
really acquired something in my heart that went along with the faith I grew
up in. suddenly, it occurred to me how much of a waste of time all that
stuff was -- doing what other people wanted me to do. And that was my
little awakening after my accident. Then I became quite rebellious,
including exploring other spiritual practices.
On 4/15/07, Angie Novak [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
After my injury, our church kicked us out. They sent a letter in the mail
saying we were no longer parishioners. Guess they missed our weekly
donation.
-Angie
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Just a few questions, how did you hear about the thing with Lucifer?
And are you saying faith is just covering all the bases? Have you noticed
not many churches want cripples that don't seem to get any better. I have
gone to several churches where the pastor has looked directly at me and said
god answers the prayers of all true believers. If I don't have a church to
go to on Sundays then where will I get my weekly dosage of guilt?
I must be a true believer or I wouldn't feel guilty about this e mail.
john
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Quad-list@eskimo.com
Sent: Sun, 15 Apr 2007 2:28 PM
Subject: [QUAD-L] God, and Heaven-Hell
If you live a good life as IF there really IS a God and Heaven or
Hell and die to find out it was not true--YOU LOST NOTHING.BUT IF you
live and deny God and Heaven Or Hell and DIE to find out THERE IS a GOD and
it's All TRUE---{{YOU LOST EVERYTHING.}} But God wants no robots,
that's why he gave Mankind free will and choices. As a matter of fact he
even granted his Angels free willWhen Lucifer Tried to overthrow God, He
took 1/3 of God's angels with him by decieving them to follow him.
Dan H.
--
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--
Life is 440 horsepower in a 2-cylinder engine.
-Henry Miller
[QUAD-L] After death-transition
In a message dated 4/15/2007 3:50:28 P.M. Central Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I think everyone goes to the same place, what happens there happens. -Angie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Funny, but if there was no Hell, then there is no down. The is no Yang. There would be no out. I'm think there is a Hell. Otherwise, where would the bad people go. W You think. I think. We all think. The is the power of natural law. Freedom to think. Some of us, stink at think. While other think of stinking. I never get those two right I stink. Er Ooops Think. W ** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.
[QUAD-L] Religion and keeping people in line-- what country are you living in?????
No one is using religion to keep you in line..In America you are free to believe as you desire.. there is even a Satanic church and dozens of other weird cults . You do as you please and no one forces you here in America. Besides If religion keeps people So IN LINE why is everything such a mess financially and Moraly. The largest population on Earth.CHINA hates freedom of religions, because they like strict control over their people -- media and even how they think., same in places like North Korea. Dan H.
RE: [QUAD-L] After death
I like Einstein saying that God does not play with dice. This meaning everything has a formula, each more beautiful than the others. We are the garden, where God is the Gardener. The plants are in His image. If going through this wheelchair business cultivates me closer to His image, then it must. True or not to others, I know that just thinking this stuff is injury related. In my years I have seen and met the kindness of people not experienced previously. Much more work to be done here, I am surely in progress but I know years ahead of time. Sour grapes or truth? This question makes more since to me opposed to, why me. Merrill _ From: Dan [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, April 15, 2007 9:50 AM To: quad-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [QUAD-L] After death I once read a book titled 'Why do bad things happen to good people'. It was written by a Religious leader a Rabbi, Priest or whatever. The gist of it was that God put us here and that was that. He did not believe in Divine intervention. Much like your post Amy. One of my mottos is 'Life is a crap shoot'. You get what you get - deal with it. I have to laugh when people attribute everything to God. 'A tornado was coming and we took refuge in our church. All the other buildings around us were destroyed but not our church! That's because God protected us.' This same type of thinking happens when the church was demolished by the tornado and everyone inside was killed. 'It's all part of God's plan. We don't understand it but we're sure He has a reason for this'. Prayer may comfort you but IMHO it won't affect the outcome - nor should it. Dan V At 06:07 AM 4/15/2007 -0700, Amy Davis said something that elicited my response: Everyone has their own opinion on this, I am sure. So here is mine. I have NO IDEA! I know there have been times in my life when it has been influenced by a guidiance or spirit or GOD. I think all religion have the same basic principle. Believe in a higher power. Be good to one another. Basically be nice! I know when bad things happen everyone says why did God let it happen. And that things, like becoming a quad, happen for a reason. I kind of think that is bull. I think accidents happen to good or bad people. It is how you deal with the situation that makes it ok or hell to deal with. You can become a quad and sit and dwell and get pissed at the world or feel sorry for yourself. I know everyone has these feelings sometimes. But you can also use your experiences to make a difference for someone else. Life does not always come out like we plan. But it is like going on a trip. The fun part...the most exciting parts are the ones that were not planned. Like getting lost or finding a neat place that you did not know existed along the road. If everything went as planned it would be kind of boring to know what was coming next every single second of our lives. The good parts are the parts that we did not even know was coming. I am not sure what exist in the afterlife..but I know there is no harm in being a good person. If there is a God...I know that he does have a sense of humor. And I am sure we keep him entertained here. And a lot of the times I am sure he is shaking his head and wondering how we do the things we do to each other. Ok..I have rambled on and still have not figured out if there is an afterlife or not. I know that I intend to make the best of this life. The restwell, I will find out when I go down that road too. Amy andrea murray [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g285x4sUKoo omg -- that's some f'd up stuff! thank god i have not been brainwashed! =jessica Ahhh...imagining that irresistible new car smell? Check out new http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=48245/*http:/autos.yahoo.com/new_cars.html;_ylc= X3oDMTE1YW1jcXJ2BF9TAzk3MTA3MDc2BHNlYwNtYWlsdGFncwRzbGsDbmV3LWNhcnM- cars at Yahoo! Autos. Ahhh...imagining that irresistible new car smell? Check out new http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=48245/*http:/autos.yahoo.com/new_cars.html;_ylc= X3oDMTE1YW1jcXJ2BF9TAzk3MTA3MDc2BHNlYwNtYWlsdGFncwRzbGsDbmV3LWNhcnM- cars at Yahoo! Autos.
Re: [QUAD-L] Religion and keeping people in line-- what country are you living in?????
I'm not sure which post you are replying to, but I beg to differ. lots of people use religion to keep others in line for one reason or another. Sometimes it's tradition and/or money. and so far, there are two people here who belief may have evidence of that in their lives (I am including myself here). granted, it is people who try to keep other people in line. But you are certainly right -- no one is using anything to keep me in line because that will never happen. ever hear of the Church of the flying spaghetti monster? LOL: http://www.venganza.org/ On 4/15/07, Danny Hearn [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: * No one is using religion to keep you in line..In America you are free to believe as you desire.. there is even a Satanic church and dozens of other weird cults . You do as you please and no one forces you here in America. Besides If religion keeps people So IN LINE why is everything such a mess financially and Moraly. The largest population on Earth.CHINA hates freedom of religions, because they like strict control over their people -- media and even how they think., same in places like North Korea. Dan H. * -- Life is 440 horsepower in a 2-cylinder engine. -Henry Miller
RE: [QUAD-L] after death
Yes Ron I’ve thought about that very thing and I don’t know if there’s a God out there but if we’re his children why doesn’t he help us or spank the idiots in charge of this mess. I just try to live a decent life. Mark Jackson RollinOn _ From: RONALD L PRACHT [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, April 14, 2007 12:35 AM To: quad-list@eskimo.com Subject: [QUAD-L] after death Has anyone considered the thought that after death their is nothing but a dirt nap? That it doesnt matter what you did or didnt do in life we all end up the same. That thousands of years ago some smart individual realized that human beings have to believe in something to go on, and if they think some higher power is watching over them they might live a better life. And religion makes it easy to control the masses. Has anyone ever also realized that the high iq people such as doctors, scientists, and many others mostly dont believe in god. The lower the iq the greater the belief in god. LoL just thoughts that run through my mind Ron c7 9 yrs post -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.446 / Virus Database: 269.4.0/759 - Release Date: 4/12/2007 7:58 PM -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.446 / Virus Database: 269.4.0/759 - Release Date: 4/12/2007 7:58 PM
Re: Fwd: Re: [QUAD-L] after death
Everyone has different experiences. When I nearly drowned at the time of my SCI, I was under water for probably three minutes at least. Years of swimming lessons had taught me not to panic if I have a problem in the water, so I didn't. When I realized I wasn't going to be able to surface because I couldn't move, I started saying my goodbyes, and trying not to inhale water. Eventually, I blacked out. I saw no angels, or demons, or anything, but I don't claim that doesn't mean there's life after death - I don't know. I do know there can be hell on earth, and central pain syndrome is one example. :( Alan -- --- Posted by alanh77[at]comcast.net using MR/2 ICE Newsreader #564 Proudly using eComstation 1.21 (OEM OS/2) BBS - The Nerve Center Telnet FidoNet 261/1000 tncbbs.no-ip.com ---
Re: [QUAD-L] About injury area where spine and neck were fused.
In [EMAIL PROTECTED], on 04/11/07 at 04:37 PM, Danny Hearn [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: Has anyone on the list ever had to go back for more surgury or Fusion where they had their neck and spine fixed back into place ??? I have a syrinx and have been having lots of pain and problems with my left arm.I was sent to an arm and shoulder bone specialist. they told me they think it's spinal related and my area where my spine was fused seems to be moving forward out of place, kind of like a chicken neck type of thing. I am trying to find out if any others have had trouble's with their spine repair and or neck fusion. Thanks Dan H. When my spine was fused (C-4 to C-6), the doctor told me that if a bomb went off near me, those three bones would stay together. 25 years later, the fusion is fine, but my disks above and below it are degenerating. If you have a syrinx that's affecting your function, it's probably a good idea to look into treating it. Go to sciwire.com (CareCure forums) and search for threads on syrinx and syringomyelia. The current recommended treatment is untethering the cord to collapse the syrinx, rather than shunting. Alan -- --- Posted by alanh77[at]comcast.net using MR/2 ICE Newsreader #564 Proudly using eComstation 1.21 (OEM OS/2) BBS - The Nerve Center Telnet FidoNet 261/1000 tncbbs.no-ip.com ---
Re: [QUAD-L] freedom of speech
In [EMAIL PROTECTED], on 04/10/07 at 11:23 AM, Angie Novak [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: While I don't agree with religious, racial or homosexual slurs, they aren't against the law. As far as I know. Yes, it is ignorant, but people are entitled to what they believe, and if they choose to voice their opinions, although they aren't politically correct, it is their right to do so. The apologies are to save face, that's all. I wouldn't intentionally insult anyone on their beliefs, race, or sexual preference. But it is a right, freedom of speech, which includes unfavorable speech as well. If I'm wrong, let me know. Seriously, let me know if I'm wrong about the law. I know I don't expect anybody to kiss my rear if I'm offended by something. I don't think anyone should have to do that. Imus being fired wasn't a free speech issue, it was a money issue. Sponsors were pulling out from his show. If not, he may well have been back after the two week suspension. The government (federal, state, local) didn't censor him. Free speech doesn't mean that one's speech can't have repercussions, especially something said by a public figure. Alan -- --- Posted by alanh77[at]comcast.net using MR/2 ICE Newsreader #564 Proudly using eComstation 1.21 (OEM OS/2) BBS - The Nerve Center Telnet FidoNet 261/1000 tncbbs.no-ip.com ---
Re: [QUAD-L] Not receiving the postings
In a message dated 4/15/2007 1:53:44 P.M. Central Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I am not receiving any postings from the quad-list, but do receive individual postings. Glenn I'm getting your postings Glenn. I'm wondering if you have your spam setting set too high. W ** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.
RE: [QUAD-L] God, and Heaven-Hell
I totally agree Dan,
That’s what I have a problem with, if we are his children how can he stand
by and watch his small kids starve to death or die by aids at 2-3 years old
and a lot of people will never even hear the word Jesus or God but they go
to hell because of geography?
I don’t buy it, if my father was to sit by and watch me suffer and did
nothing and at the same time preached to me about love thy fellow man and
treat people like you would like to be treated. How can I have more
compassion than God if he is the great one?
Just my opinion,
Mark Jackson
RollinOn
_
From: Dan [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Sunday, April 15, 2007 3:49 PM
To: Quad-list@eskimo.com
Subject: RE: [QUAD-L] God, and Heaven-Hell
If one believes in the goodness of God, then I don't see how they can
believe in Hell. I think I'm a relatively good person and having said that,
I could never send anyone to Hell where they would endure everlasting
torture. Where is the goodness in that? Are we not taught that God is all
knowing and all loving and forgives us of our sins? As Jesus said as he was
dying on the cross Forgive them Father for they do not know what they do.
He didn't say Hey Dad, send these bastards to Hell.
We are like children to God. Imagine that you are the parents of twin 4 year
old boys. They are playing at the top of a flight of stairs. One of them
gets angry with the other and pushes him down the flight of stairs knowing
well that the child will get hurt and the child dies. The surviving twin
shows no remorse since most 4 year olds haven't yet developed that capacity.
Would you as their parent/God send this child to Hell?
Dan V
At 03:18 PM 4/15/2007 -0400, Steve Oldaker said something that elicited my
response:
Dan...
What if you live a truly good life and do not deny the existence of God,
Heaven and Hell, but do not have a core belief that they do in fact exist?
Would it not be hypocritical to state that you do believe in their existence
just in case?
The big problem I have with many organized religions is you either accept
and believe, or you are doomed, regardless of how well you have lived your
life and the goodness in your heart and deeds. This is particularly true
with Christian religions.
FWIW, I do believe in a supreme being (a.k.a. God), hope there is a Heaven,
and hope there is not a Hell. Pretty sure about the first one, not sure
about the last two.
Steve
_
From: Danny Hearn [HYPERLINK
mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Sunday, April 15, 2007 2:29 PM
To: Quad-list@eskimo.com
Subject: [QUAD-L] God, and Heaven-Hell
If you live a good life as IF there really IS a God and Heaven or
Hell and die to find out it was not true--YOU LOST NOTHING.BUT IF you
live and deny God and Heaven Or Hell and DIE to find out THERE IS a GOD and
it's All TRUE---{{YOU LOST EVERYTHING.}} But God wants no robots,
that's why he gave Mankind free will and choices. As a matter of fact he
even granted his Angels free willWhen Lucifer Tried to overthrow God, He
took 1/3 of God's angels with him by decieving them to follow him.
Dan H.
--
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Checked by AVG Free Edition.
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7:58 PM
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No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.5.446 / Virus Database: 269.4.0/759 - Release Date: 4/12/2007
7:58 PM
Re: [QUAD-L] After death
In a message dated 4/15/2007 2:41:20 P.M. Central Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: What constitutes bad? Ok, Hitler was a bad person and Mother Theresa was a good person, but most people fall somewhere in between those two. Where is the line drawn to separate the good and bad people? There is a true standard, its called Natural Order. Its been called a number of things... by a number of people. People know the difference between between right and wrong, good and bad, moral and unmoral. w ** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.
Re: [QUAD-L] After death
Angie, What about those of us who weren't in an accident, but because of an unforeseen or unpreventable illness, became paralyzed in a matter of minutes?? I know I had anything to do with it, this is not be what I would've chosen. Naomi C-4 quad since July 2, 2005 Transverse Myelitis ** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.
Re: [QUAD-L] After death
It was a Jewish Rabbi. That book is used by and suggested for those who counsel others in time of supportive need. Good reading too! W In a message dated 4/15/2007 11:51:02 A.M. Central Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I once read a book titled 'Why do bad things happen to good people'. It was written by a Religious leader a Rabbi, Priest or whatever. The gist of it was that God put us here and that was that. He did not believe in Divine intervention. Much like your post Amy. One of my mottos is 'Life is a crap shoot'. You get what you get - deal with it. I have to laugh when people attribute everything to God. 'A tornado was coming and we took refuge in our church. All the other buildings around us were destroyed but not our church! That's because God protected us.' This same type of thinking happens when the church was demolished by the tornado and everyone inside was killed. 'It's all part of God's plan. We don't understand it but we're sure He has a reason for this'. Prayer may comfort you but IMHO it won't affect the outcome - nor should it. Dan V ** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.
[QUAD-L] Gap or No-Gap be sure.
After all is said and done, everyone who could have stepped up to the plate, took off running like scared chickens. The GAP insurance will pay the difference between your regular insurance pay out and the NADA value of your totaled vehicle as if it were in shiny excellent condition. My Regular insurance (Farmers) paid off the Blue Book value of my van without covering any upgrades or customized additions. They claimed they didn't know I had anything special done to the van. The credit union made a special deal of finding out why I was paying 20k for a van bluebooked at 10k. They immediately oked the deal and sent the info to my ins company. You guessed it - everything except the HC modifications. The bottom line was that I had to pay the extra 10k for the HC modifications out of my pocket. Farmers now claims I am completely covered for 15K worth of extra equipment over the NADA value of the van. I sure hope some Karma catches up to these weasels. Evidently the credit union now has some new rules in place when dealing with HC drivers. Yippie - I taught them a lesson. BE SURE YOU ARE ADEQUATELY COVERED ! Dave _Visit My Home Page_ (http://www.users.qwest.net/~daveoc/index.html) ** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.
Re: [QUAD-L] freedom of speech
I think the excess eggs should be served at communion. Like the caviar of Christ or something. Maybe add a caudacill from Mary false and malicious statement or report about someone Dan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Dan T, If you can find them, where are they? Are they really Hate talk? Are they really slander (actually the correct word is libel)? If so, please give me the legal definition of the two (you can use a free on-line dictionary) and how they relate. I am also a Catholic but I was not offended by anything I read on this topic. Dan V At 08:34 PM 4/13/2007 -0700, Dan T said something that elicited my response: Dan, I can find those items you questioned below and they are particularly offensive to me as a Catholic. Dan T. Dan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What in the Hell are you people talking about! Hate talk? By who? Slander? By who? Remember boys and girls just because someone doesn't agree with you, you can't start calling them names. If you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen. In other words, grow up. Dan V Jim Lubin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You can't use freedom of speech to justify hate speech. It was completely uncalled for, as were most of his other rants. Angie, I think you were the one that brought up the freedom of speech issue but with that freedom comes responsibility. No one has the right to slander others or their beliefs. A point or opinion can be expressed civilly. Dan T.
Re: [QUAD-L] God, and Heaven-Hell
Angie, what church are you talking about? sorry to hear about your bad
experience with church. Churches and their members are human and there are
good and bad just like every part of life.
Angie Novak [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: After my injury, our church kicked us
out. They sent a letter in the mail saying we were no longer parishioners.
Guess they missed our weekly donation.
-Angie
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Just a few questions, how did you hear about the
thing with Lucifer? And are you saying faith is just covering all the bases?
Have you noticed not many churches want cripples that don't seem to get any
better. I have gone to several churches where the pastor has looked directly at
me and said god answers the prayers of all true believers. If I don't have a
church to go to on Sundays then where will I get my weekly dosage of guilt?
I must be a true believer or I wouldn't feel guilty about this e mail.
john
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Quad-list@eskimo.com
Sent: Sun, 15 Apr 2007 2:28 PM
Subject: [QUAD-L] God, and Heaven-Hell
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FONT-SIZE: 10pt; BORDER-LEFT: 0px; BORDER-BOTTOM: 0px; FONT-FAMILY: Verdana;
BACKGROUND-COLOR: white } .AOLWebSuiteCompose P { PADDING-RIGHT: 0px;
PADDING-LEFT: 0px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0px; MARGIN: 0px; PADDING-TOP: 0px }
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BORDER-RIGHT: #dadad6 1px solid; BORDER-TOP: #dadad6 1px solid; BACKGROUND:
#f4f4f4 no-repeat center center; BORDER-LEFT: #dadad6 1px solid; WIDTH: 275px;
BORDER-BOTTOM: #dadad6 1px solid; HEIGHT: 206px } If you live a
good life as IF there really IS a God and Heaven or Hell and die to find out it
was not true--YOU LOST NOTHING.BUT IF you live and deny God and Heaven Or
Hell and DIE to find out THERE IS a GOD and it's All TRUE---{{YOU LOST
EVERYTHING.}} But God wants no robots, that's why he gave Mankind free will and
choices. As a matter of fact he even granted his Angels free willWhen
Lucifer Tried to overthrow God, He took 1/3 of God's angels with him by
decieving them to follow him.
Dan H.
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RE: Re: [QUAD-L] after death
Mike, very interesting post... good work Mike Murach [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 1. SMART SCIENTIFIC PEOPLE BELIEVE TOO Nicholas Copernicus (1473-1543) Copernicus was the Polish astronomer who put forward the first mathematically based system of planets going around the sun. He attended various European universities, and became a Canon in the Catholic church in 1497. His new system was actually first presented in the Vatican gardens in 1533 before Pope Clement VII who approved, and urged Copernicus to publish it around this time. Copernicus was never under any threat of religious persecution - and was urged to publish both by Catholic Bishop Guise, Cardinal Schonberg, and the Protestant Professor George Rheticus. Copernicus referred sometimes to God in his works, and did not see his system as in conflict with the Bible. 2. Sir Fancis Bacon (1561-1627) Bacon was a philosopher who is known for establishing the scientific method of inquiry based on experimentation and inductive reasoning. In De Interpretatione Naturae Prooemium, Bacon established his goals as being the discovery of truth, service to his country, and service to the church. Although his work was based upon experimentation and reasoning, he rejected atheism as being the result of insufficient depth of philosophy, stating, It is true, that a little philosophy inclineth mans mind to atheism, but depth in philosophy bringeth men's minds about to religion; for while the mind of man looketh upon second causes scattered, it may sometimes rest in them, and go no further; but when it beholdeth the chain of them confederate, and linked together, it must needs fly to Providence and Deity. (Of Atheism) 3. Johannes Kepler (1571-1630) Kepler was a brilliant mathematician and astronomer. He did early work on light, and established the laws of planetary motion about the sun. He also came close to reaching the Newtonian concept of universal gravity - well before Newton was born! His introduction of the idea of force in astronomy changed it radically in a modern direction. Kepler was an extremely sincere and pious Lutheran, whose works on astronomy contain writings about how space and the heavenly bodies represent the Trinity. Kepler suffered no persecution for his open avowal of the sun-centered system, and, indeed, was allowed as a Protestant to stay in Catholic Graz as a Professor (1595-1600) when other Protestants had been expelled! 4. Galileo Galilei (1564-1642) Galileo is often remembered for his conflict with the Roman Catholic Church. His controversial work on the solar system was published in 1633. It had no proofs of a sun-centered system (Galileo's telescope discoveries did not indicate a moving earth) and his one proof based upon the tides was invalid. It ignored the correct elliptical orbits of planets published twenty five years earlier by Kepler. Since his work finished by putting the Pope's favorite argument in the mouth of the simpleton in the dialogue, the Pope (an old friend of Galileo's) was very offended. After the trial and being forbidden to teach the sun-centered system, Galileo did his most useful theoretical work, which was on dynamics. Galileo expressly said that the Bible cannot err, and saw his system as an alternate interpretation of the biblical texts. 5. Rene Descartes (1596-1650) Descartes was a French mathematician, scientist and philosopher who has been called the father of modern philosophy. His school studies made him dissatisfied with previous philosophy: He had a deep religious faith as a Roman Catholic, which he retained to his dying day, along with a resolute, passionate desire to discover the truth. At the age of 24 he had a dream, and felt the vocational call to seek to bring knowledge together in one system of thought. His system began by asking what could be known if all else were doubted - suggesting the famous I think therefore I am. Actually, it is often forgotten that the next step for Descartes was to establish the near certainty of the existence of God - for only if God both exists and would not want us to be deceived by our experiences - can we trust our senses and logical thought processes. God is, therefore, central to his whole philosophy. What he really wanted to see was that his philosophy be adopted as standard Roman Catholic teaching. Rene Descartes and Francis Bacon (1561-1626) are generally regarded as the key figures in the development of scientific methodology. Both had systems in which God was important, and both seem more devout than the average for their era. 6. Isaac Newton (1642-1727) In optics, mechanics, and mathematics, Newton was a figure of undisputed genius and innovation. In all his science (including chemistry) he saw mathematics and numbers as central. What is less well known is that he was devoutly religious and saw numbers as involved in understanding God's plan for history from
