[RBW] Re: Rambouillet as Tourer

[iamkeith]

I've linked to this archived page from Peter White during numerous similar 
threads, but it's still there and still relevant.  Good synopsis of the 
difference between the Ram and Hilsen when they were simultaneously 
available:

https://www.peterwhitecycles.com/rambouillet.php

*"These two frames are so similar, I've decided to keep them on the same 
page, at least until I think of a reason not to. If you start from the 
Rambouillet, the Hilsen has longer chainstays, by one centimeter. It also 
requires longer caliper brakes, because it has clearance for larger tires. 
Essentially the Rambouillet is great for fast day riding with the racer 
wannabees, brevets and credit card touring. The Hilsen is more into the 
loaded touring category. When you put full panniers on it, the handling 
will be a bit more stable than if you load down the Rambouillet. And with 
fat tires on the Hilsen, dirt roads will be more comfortable to ride on all 
day.*


*So for now the text below is what it has been ever since I started selling 
the Rambouillet frames several years ago. Virtually everything written here 
applies to the Hilsen, with the caveats above. Of course, we have no more 
Rivendell FframesAs soon as I have time, I'll list maximum tire sizes I'm 
happy recommending, with and without fenders. My recommendations have been 
a bit more conservative that Rivendell's recommendations in the past. I 
usually recommend a smaller maximum tire size with fenders than Riv does. 
It is somewhat personal preference; essentially how risk averse you are. 
The smaller the gap between the tire and the fender, the easier it is for 
something to get caught in there. I like lots of space; some people are 
happy with less. My recommendations are only that; recommendations. You're 
the one riding the bike, and accepting the risks that come with our 
favorite outdoor activity.*


*What's a Rambouillet? There are two ways to think of it. It's either a 
racing frame with a bit longer wheelbase, because the chainstays are 
longer; and provides a higher handlebar position, because the top tube 
slopes upwards a bit, and the headtube is extended; and there's lots of 
tire and fender clearance. Or it's a touring bike with a wheelbase that's 
too short for carrying heavy loads, so it's perfect for weekend tours where 
you're staying at B or hotels and don't need a tent, sleeping bag and 
lots of clothes."*

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW 
Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/6ef14782-b113-4e0c-b9cc-c9e932af6d1co%40googlegroups.com.

[RBW] Re: Rambouillet as Tourer

[Mike Godwin]

Thanks Rich

I remember the front title when i used to get the RR in the mail.

Mike SLO CA

On Saturday, September 12, 2020 at 1:58:41 PM UTC-7, RichS wrote:
>
> Mike,
>
> Take a look at Riv Reader 25 , pages 42-43. An excellent demonstration of 
> a lightweight touring setup on a Ram.
>
> Best,
> Rich in ATL
>
> On Sunday, September 6, 2020 at 5:49:00 PM UTC-4 Mike Godwin wrote:
>
>> Howdy, looking through the archives about using a Rambouillet as a 
>> touring machine. I toured along the spine of the Cascades and Sierra on a 
>> Specialized Sequoia, and along Highway 1 SF to LA.  The Rambouillet seems a 
>> bit more stout than the Sequoia.  Most of the old touring related posts 
>> here are from 2012 - 2014.  Any new news about tours folks have done on 
>> their Rambouillets?  What pannier arrangements did you use? Self-supported, 
>> road surface? 
>>
>> Mike SLO CA 
>>
>

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW 
Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/6d179f88-adb1-475c-a3be-5a433c7489fbo%40googlegroups.com.

[RBW] Re: Rambouillet as Tourer

[Wyatt]

Didn't weigh it, but yeah, I'd bet close to 30 pounds. I don't buy 
expensive ultralight weight stuff as a rule. Basic Eno hammock gear, plenty 
of food, camera, denatured alcohol and stove, change of clothes, lights, 
batteries, tools, spares, etc. Everything you'd need for 4-5 days on a 
summer tour aside from a couple of gas station runs. Rambo is the perfect 
for that kind of tour, imo.

On Thursday, September 10, 2020 at 8:49:34 PM UTC-5 dougP wrote:

> Wyatt:
>
> Do you know the weight of the load you were carrying in this picture?  It 
> looks substantial & camping gear tends to the heavy side.  I'm guessing 
> 20-30 lbs, including the bags.
>
> doug P
>
> On Thursday, September 10, 2020 at 2:08:52 PM UTC-7, Wyatt wrote:
>>
>> Rode the Natchez Trace not too long ago on my Rambo. ~450 miles, all 
>> paved, hammock camping. Loaded with Carradice Long Flap on the saddle and 
>> BXB Teardrop on the bars. The frame isn't right for racks, imo. Wouldn't 
>> want to load it much more than this, but it handled this load quite well. 
>> Easily enough extra room to pick up a six pack on the way the campsite at 
>> the end of day.
>>
>> These days, I've got it built up with 700x38 g-ones and a 1x9 drivetrain, 
>> which works great on zippy gravel day rides. Wouldn't want to tour off road 
>> on it, though. I think 38s are just a little too narrow for off road 
>> touring, imo, and the frame clearance is way too tight for anything larger.
>>
>> [image: Screen Shot 2020-09-10 at 4.07.25 PM.png][image: Screen Shot 
>> 2020-09-10 at 4.07.38 PM.png]
>>
>> On Thursday, September 10, 2020 at 10:36:47 AM UTC-5 mpc...@gmail.com 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I actually saw mine sitting on CL in Vermont. It had been hanging in a 
>>> garage for 3 years due to an injury.  I went to test ride it out of 
>>> curiosity and was immediately sold by the ride of the Riv. 
>>>
>>> Currently has the original 27 Ruffy Tuffys, gonna try to squeeze 33s on 
>>> it this weekend and see how it handles more gravel riding and a heavier 
>>> load.
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, September 9, 2020 at 1:53:28 PM UTC-4 bjmi...@gmail.com 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 By any chance, did you buy the one off eBay being sold by Walter? I 
 messaged him a few times about the bike and decided I needed something a 
 little more rugged, but man...that bike was very tempting.

 On Wednesday, September 9, 2020 at 10:00:23 AM UTC-5 mpc...@gmail.com 
 wrote:

> I personally just purchased a Ram that was sitting in a garage looking 
> beautiful but not being used. I've been wondering how hard I can push it, 
> especially on dirt/gravel. So, Andy, thank you for your insight here. The 
> more I read the more I'm gleaning that this bike should NOT be too 
> heavily 
> loaded. 
>
> On Monday, September 7, 2020 at 6:48:46 AM UTC-4 Fullylugged wrote:
>
>> The Ram was intended for lightish touring and it does that well. 
>> Handling with any kind of front load depends a lot on the handlebar type 
>> and stem length used. I toured with the stock Nitto Noodles. I used a 
>> Mark's rack with P-Clamps and a small Baggins bag with up to 5 lbs in 
>> it. I 
>> also used a Duluth Candy roll handlebar bag for lightweight, want quick 
>> access to stuff, like lip protector, my phone, etc. Mostly, supplies 
>> went 
>> into 2 Nashbar panniers on a lightweight aluminum rear rack. That was to 
>> keep the center of gravity lower. Rain jacket and pants, helmet cover 
>> was 
>> in a large Baggins bag on top of the rack. I had a Keven's bag under the 
>> saddle with tire change stuff. The bike was a little rear heavy that 
>> way. 
>> handling was fine, but picking up and carrying was different. I have 
>> almost 
>> always ridden the same 32 mm Paselas that were original issue.
>>
>> These days, that bike is re-configured as my Townie/Sunday Cruiser 
>> but still has a rack in back and a Baggins bag on top.
>>
>> Bruce
>>
>>

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW 
Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/0b0bb6e4-1b92-4188-b3a6-63eeb87fc5d8n%40googlegroups.com.

[RBW] Re: Rambouillet as Tourer

[dougP]

Wyatt:

Do you know the weight of the load you were carrying in this picture?  It 
looks substantial & camping gear tends to the heavy side.  I'm guessing 
20-30 lbs, including the bags.

doug P

On Thursday, September 10, 2020 at 2:08:52 PM UTC-7, Wyatt wrote:
>
> Rode the Natchez Trace not too long ago on my Rambo. ~450 miles, all 
> paved, hammock camping. Loaded with Carradice Long Flap on the saddle and 
> BXB Teardrop on the bars. The frame isn't right for racks, imo. Wouldn't 
> want to load it much more than this, but it handled this load quite well. 
> Easily enough extra room to pick up a six pack on the way the campsite at 
> the end of day.
>
> These days, I've got it built up with 700x38 g-ones and a 1x9 drivetrain, 
> which works great on zippy gravel day rides. Wouldn't want to tour off road 
> on it, though. I think 38s are just a little too narrow for off road 
> touring, imo, and the frame clearance is way too tight for anything larger.
>
> [image: Screen Shot 2020-09-10 at 4.07.25 PM.png][image: Screen Shot 
> 2020-09-10 at 4.07.38 PM.png]
>
> On Thursday, September 10, 2020 at 10:36:47 AM UTC-5 mpc...@gmail.com 
> wrote:
>
>> I actually saw mine sitting on CL in Vermont. It had been hanging in a 
>> garage for 3 years due to an injury.  I went to test ride it out of 
>> curiosity and was immediately sold by the ride of the Riv. 
>>
>> Currently has the original 27 Ruffy Tuffys, gonna try to squeeze 33s on 
>> it this weekend and see how it handles more gravel riding and a heavier 
>> load.
>>
>> On Wednesday, September 9, 2020 at 1:53:28 PM UTC-4 bjmi...@gmail.com 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> By any chance, did you buy the one off eBay being sold by Walter? I 
>>> messaged him a few times about the bike and decided I needed something a 
>>> little more rugged, but man...that bike was very tempting.
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, September 9, 2020 at 10:00:23 AM UTC-5 mpc...@gmail.com 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 I personally just purchased a Ram that was sitting in a garage looking 
 beautiful but not being used. I've been wondering how hard I can push it, 
 especially on dirt/gravel. So, Andy, thank you for your insight here. The 
 more I read the more I'm gleaning that this bike should NOT be too heavily 
 loaded. 

 On Monday, September 7, 2020 at 6:48:46 AM UTC-4 Fullylugged wrote:

> The Ram was intended for lightish touring and it does that well. 
> Handling with any kind of front load depends a lot on the handlebar type 
> and stem length used. I toured with the stock Nitto Noodles. I used a 
> Mark's rack with P-Clamps and a small Baggins bag with up to 5 lbs in it. 
> I 
> also used a Duluth Candy roll handlebar bag for lightweight, want quick 
> access to stuff, like lip protector, my phone, etc. Mostly, supplies went 
> into 2 Nashbar panniers on a lightweight aluminum rear rack. That was to 
> keep the center of gravity lower. Rain jacket and pants, helmet cover was 
> in a large Baggins bag on top of the rack. I had a Keven's bag under the 
> saddle with tire change stuff. The bike was a little rear heavy that way. 
> handling was fine, but picking up and carrying was different. I have 
> almost 
> always ridden the same 32 mm Paselas that were original issue.
>
> These days, that bike is re-configured as my Townie/Sunday Cruiser but 
> still has a rack in back and a Baggins bag on top.
>
> Bruce
>
>

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW 
Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/124ac629-e510-4e1a-8172-d4d730a96adao%40googlegroups.com.

Re: [RBW] Re: Rambouillet as Tourer

[Patrick Moore]

My blue Ram handled moderate (up to !~30 lb) rear loads on a Tubus Fly
pretty well, fwiw.

On Thu, Sep 10, 2020 at 3:09 PM Wyatt  wrote:

> Rode the Natchez Trace not too long ago on my Rambo. ~450 miles, all
> paved, hammock camping. Loaded with Carradice Long Flap on the saddle and
> BXB Teardrop on the bars.* The frame isn't right for racks, imo. *Wouldn't
> want to load it much more than this, but it handled this load quite well.
> Easily enough extra room to pick up a six pack on the way the campsite at
> the end of day.
>
> ---
Patrick Moore
Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW 
Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/CALuTfgvsnP1TDtMVoTWehrd%2BpVAyyqSTSzkTYN7ROVguzajMgQ%40mail.gmail.com.

[RBW] Re: Rambouillet as Tourer

[Michael Cyr]

I actually found one on Craigslist in Vermont - it had been sitting in a 
garage for 3 years. I was skeptical of the Riv appeal so went to test ride 
it out of curiosity more than anything - I was instantly sold. 

I'm currently running the original 27 Ruffy Tuffys which probably informs 
my skepticism of it being able to hand a substantial load.

Mike - that story sounds quite interesting. I'm generally curious to hear 
how much other folks have pushed their Rams as I start to push mine a bit. 

On Wednesday, September 9, 2020 at 1:53:28 PM UTC-4 bjmi...@gmail.com wrote:

> By any chance, did you buy the one off eBay being sold by Walter? I 
> messaged him a few times about the bike and decided I needed something a 
> little more rugged, but man...that bike was very tempting.
>
> On Wednesday, September 9, 2020 at 10:00:23 AM UTC-5 mpc...@gmail.com 
> wrote:
>
>> I personally just purchased a Ram that was sitting in a garage looking 
>> beautiful but not being used. I've been wondering how hard I can push it, 
>> especially on dirt/gravel. So, Andy, thank you for your insight here. The 
>> more I read the more I'm gleaning that this bike should NOT be too heavily 
>> loaded. 
>>
>> On Monday, September 7, 2020 at 6:48:46 AM UTC-4 Fullylugged wrote:
>>
>>> The Ram was intended for lightish touring and it does that well. 
>>> Handling with any kind of front load depends a lot on the handlebar type 
>>> and stem length used. I toured with the stock Nitto Noodles. I used a 
>>> Mark's rack with P-Clamps and a small Baggins bag with up to 5 lbs in it. I 
>>> also used a Duluth Candy roll handlebar bag for lightweight, want quick 
>>> access to stuff, like lip protector, my phone, etc. Mostly, supplies went 
>>> into 2 Nashbar panniers on a lightweight aluminum rear rack. That was to 
>>> keep the center of gravity lower. Rain jacket and pants, helmet cover was 
>>> in a large Baggins bag on top of the rack. I had a Keven's bag under the 
>>> saddle with tire change stuff. The bike was a little rear heavy that way. 
>>> handling was fine, but picking up and carrying was different. I have almost 
>>> always ridden the same 32 mm Paselas that were original issue.
>>>
>>> These days, that bike is re-configured as my Townie/Sunday Cruiser but 
>>> still has a rack in back and a Baggins bag on top.
>>>
>>> Bruce
>>>
>>

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW 
Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/feaf36b7-7a59-47a4-9b5e-25dbc4af27d4n%40googlegroups.com.

[RBW] Re: Rambouillet as Tourer

[Michael Cyr]

I actually saw mine sitting on CL in Vermont. It had been hanging in a 
garage for 3 years due to an injury.  I went to test ride it out of 
curiosity and was immediately sold by the ride of the Riv. 

Currently has the original 27 Ruffy Tuffys, gonna try to squeeze 33s on it 
this weekend and see how it handles more gravel riding and a heavier load.

On Wednesday, September 9, 2020 at 1:53:28 PM UTC-4 bjmi...@gmail.com wrote:

> By any chance, did you buy the one off eBay being sold by Walter? I 
> messaged him a few times about the bike and decided I needed something a 
> little more rugged, but man...that bike was very tempting.
>
> On Wednesday, September 9, 2020 at 10:00:23 AM UTC-5 mpc...@gmail.com 
> wrote:
>
>> I personally just purchased a Ram that was sitting in a garage looking 
>> beautiful but not being used. I've been wondering how hard I can push it, 
>> especially on dirt/gravel. So, Andy, thank you for your insight here. The 
>> more I read the more I'm gleaning that this bike should NOT be too heavily 
>> loaded. 
>>
>> On Monday, September 7, 2020 at 6:48:46 AM UTC-4 Fullylugged wrote:
>>
>>> The Ram was intended for lightish touring and it does that well. 
>>> Handling with any kind of front load depends a lot on the handlebar type 
>>> and stem length used. I toured with the stock Nitto Noodles. I used a 
>>> Mark's rack with P-Clamps and a small Baggins bag with up to 5 lbs in it. I 
>>> also used a Duluth Candy roll handlebar bag for lightweight, want quick 
>>> access to stuff, like lip protector, my phone, etc. Mostly, supplies went 
>>> into 2 Nashbar panniers on a lightweight aluminum rear rack. That was to 
>>> keep the center of gravity lower. Rain jacket and pants, helmet cover was 
>>> in a large Baggins bag on top of the rack. I had a Keven's bag under the 
>>> saddle with tire change stuff. The bike was a little rear heavy that way. 
>>> handling was fine, but picking up and carrying was different. I have almost 
>>> always ridden the same 32 mm Paselas that were original issue.
>>>
>>> These days, that bike is re-configured as my Townie/Sunday Cruiser but 
>>> still has a rack in back and a Baggins bag on top.
>>>
>>> Bruce
>>>
>>

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW 
Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/8dbefa47-cd84-4cf8-bf9e-73484edbf707n%40googlegroups.com.

[RBW] Re: Rambouillet as Tourer

[ascpgh]

Tom, here's some shots of my new Coast rando. I really did extract and list 
all the good things about my Rambouillet in my conversations with Johnny as 
well as describe its shortcomings to my actual uses. Reality was really 
important, you cannot have illusions of grandeur when planning a custom 
bike. I'm not going to be cycle touring the Gavia. We have two college 
graduates with us in quarantine, one we've been mentoring for four years 
and is just starting her career, the other working to take a new direction 
from what was lost to the pandemic, so I've got my non-vocational hands 
busy without imagining myself out on the endless road. 

I Provided Johnny comprehensive dimensions of my Rambouillet (with which he 
was very familiar), as I have ridden it for years and video my wife took of 
me riding it on level and uphill grades. I also provided specs on my 
commuter (Disc Trucker) and my riding summaries of each bike. I shared that 
my Carradice Nelson Longflap was my ideal volume luggage. All that along 
with the 650B wheels (sweet spot for tubeless, cushy ride on rough 
surfaces, wheels not noticeably resistant to accelerating) yielded his 
solution.

Here's a link to a shared album of my bike and some of the influencing 
process: https://photos.app.goo.gl/a3EPAQ4akrDqDGoF9



Andy Cheatham
Pittsburgh 


On Wednesday, September 9, 2020 at 1:17:26 PM UTC-4, Thomas B wrote:
>
> Hi Andy,
>
> Thanks for sharing your experience - would you mind sharing pictures of 
> the Coast?
>
> Tom
> El Cerrito, CA
>
> On Monday, September 7, 2020 at 2:45:13 AM UTC-7, ascpgh wrote:
>>
>> I rode my Rambouillet across the country on the Adventure Cycling 
>> Trans-Am route, Western Express route. Not self-supported. After the trip I 
>> wanted a bike like the Rambouillet, not like a Long Haul Trucker. The 
>> latter, without load, is like driving around in an F-250 pickup with 
>> nothing in it and I was happy to suffer some austerity of wardrobe options 
>> and a lot of hand washing on the trip to get it.  
>>
>> I used a Carradice Nelson Longflap on the long credit card tour and 
>> actually talked the others out of a self-supported trip because everyone 
>> would need a new bike. They didn't understand how much stuff we'd have to 
>> carry along every day and how much water volume above that the deserts of 
>> Utah were going to dictate That ride is completely different schlep if 
>> self-supporting. 
>>
>> The reasonable limit on my large (64cm) Ram was 20 pounds in the saddle 
>> bag (which is more than Grant wrote) and I could feel some poor handling at 
>> the top of that range since the load is up high. I still wonder how I 
>> carried enough in that 15 liters of space to account for all the weather 
>> and mechanical support. 
>>
>> I did enjoy a shower, bed and AC in the locations along the route we 
>> stayed because even those little places campsites were outside of town and 
>> half the fun of the route was knowing that you rolling into town on a bike 
>> was often the high point of peoples' day. Eating in a diner with them for 
>> dinner and breakfast provided conversations that kept the group fresh and 
>> gave us insight such as we hoped to as we crossed the country.
>>
>> I have added a Velo Orange rando bag in the front to gain more capacity 
>> for a short trip in potentially questionable weather on the 2012 Riv Rally 
>> East. I have to say that while I managed the load it was not a graceful 
>> fitment. I can't say that low front bags would be bad but it's be a shape 
>> to dampen that fork's liveliness by bridging it with a rack and loading it 
>> up. The lack of braze-ons of that bike is intentional.
>>
>> I learned a lot about riding my Ram with loads within its design 
>> intention and then beyond. I have that shorter experience in overload and I 
>> have ridden it extensively on the GAP. While it might have been designed to 
>> ride all surfaces, that takes it to 85% of the design limit. Its riding 
>> weight (it, me and cargo) are too rear biased and require rear tire 
>> pressure to be high enough (max 32 under fenders) to avoid pinch flats/rim 
>> dings on longer rides. It just wore me out at times, either by the duration 
>> of jostling on a hard tire or the time spend changing tubes from flats when 
>> more comfortable. 
>>
>> My years learning and riding my Rambouillet  helped me solidify the likes 
>> and dislikes I brought together in a new bike. I still do not want to ride 
>> a self-supported touring bike empty, which would be 90%+ of its time so my 
>> preference was to move the 20-25# load to the front (with low trail) to 
>> balance the wheels' loads allowing more even tire pressure, fewer rim dings 
>> and comfortable ride. I chose 650b x 42 tubeless to lower that flatting 
>> frequency. So I have that new bike, a Coast rando, and it does all that I 
>> wanted on day one. I still have the Rambouillet and am about to ride it to 
>> work in a few minutes. I wouldn't change a 

Re: [RBW] Re: Rambouillet as Tourer

[Toshi Takeuchi]

I would say the Ram is in between the Homer and Roadeo. It doesn’t have
braze-ons for racks which is one of my negatives for touring, although you
can use the fender mount for racks. I weigh 150 and my Homer felt good and
even springy (Is that what planing is?) when I had about 25-30 lbs on the
rear rack. I think the Homer would work fine for me for loaded touring.

Toshi


On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 5:40 PM dougP  wrote:

> Where does the Ram fit in compared to the Homer?  A friend did a tour down
> the coast with a Homer a few years ago & enjoyed the trip, no bike
> problems.  RBWHQ did tell him that Homer was intended to be a touring bike
> but they are also pretty conservative about such things.
>
> A definite consideration when loading a bike is rider weight and baggage.
> I've toured on my Atlantis & found that with 35-40 lbs of junk (easy to do
> when camping) the bike rides much more cushy than unloaded.  I'm middling
> in weight at 160.  The Atlantis could probably handle a 200 lb rider with
> full luggage.  My friend who toured on his Homer is quite thin & light.
>
> So if the Ram is not far off the Homer, you're probably OK if you're not
> lugging enough gear to go around the world.  Based on my own experience
> with my Atlantis, weight placement affects handling to a surprising degree,
> even on a purpose built touring bike.  After considerable fiddling, I've
> found that 60% front / 40% rear works best for me.  Too much on the rear
> causes it to wobble.  When we've had threads about panniers & weight
> placement, results vary all over the place, so your safest bet is to play
> around with it quite a bit before starting your tour.  Especially with all
> the gear for camping, 4 bags seems best.  I've done lodging tours with 2
> bags & prefer them on the front for ride & handling, but 20 lbs on the rear
> works OK as well.
>
> Sorry I had no Ram specific info to offer, but it looks like you got some
> responses that cover it.
>
> dougP
>
> On Sunday, September 6, 2020 at 2:49:00 PM UTC-7, Mike Godwin wrote:
>>
>> Howdy, looking through the archives about using a Rambouillet as a
>> touring machine. I toured along the spine of the Cascades and Sierra on a
>> Specialized Sequoia, and along Highway 1 SF to LA.  The Rambouillet seems a
>> bit more stout than the Sequoia.  Most of the old touring related posts
>> here are from 2012 - 2014.  Any new news about tours folks have done on
>> their Rambouillets?  What pannier arrangements did you use? Self-supported,
>> road surface?
>>
>> Mike SLO CA
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
>
>
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
> email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
>
>
> To view this discussion on the web visit
> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/609d7ff2-0bdb-40b8-98d7-5e949aa88715o%40googlegroups.com
> 
> .
>
>
>

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW 
Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/CAGB59xxCD%2BSx8guZKtrDDrqe9FOpi%3DdK9wUCCJc%3Dn5LvUU0N8A%40mail.gmail.com.

[RBW] Re: Rambouillet as Tourer

[dougP]

Where does the Ram fit in compared to the Homer?  A friend did a tour down 
the coast with a Homer a few years ago & enjoyed the trip, no bike 
problems.  RBWHQ did tell him that Homer was intended to be a touring bike 
but they are also pretty conservative about such things.

A definite consideration when loading a bike is rider weight and baggage.  
I've toured on my Atlantis & found that with 35-40 lbs of junk (easy to do 
when camping) the bike rides much more cushy than unloaded.  I'm middling 
in weight at 160.  The Atlantis could probably handle a 200 lb rider with 
full luggage.  My friend who toured on his Homer is quite thin & light.  

So if the Ram is not far off the Homer, you're probably OK if you're not 
lugging enough gear to go around the world.  Based on my own experience 
with my Atlantis, weight placement affects handling to a surprising degree, 
even on a purpose built touring bike.  After considerable fiddling, I've 
found that 60% front / 40% rear works best for me.  Too much on the rear 
causes it to wobble.  When we've had threads about panniers & weight 
placement, results vary all over the place, so your safest bet is to play 
around with it quite a bit before starting your tour.  Especially with all 
the gear for camping, 4 bags seems best.  I've done lodging tours with 2 
bags & prefer them on the front for ride & handling, but 20 lbs on the rear 
works OK as well. 

Sorry I had no Ram specific info to offer, but it looks like you got some 
responses that cover it.

dougP

On Sunday, September 6, 2020 at 2:49:00 PM UTC-7, Mike Godwin wrote:
>
> Howdy, looking through the archives about using a Rambouillet as a touring 
> machine. I toured along the spine of the Cascades and Sierra on a 
> Specialized Sequoia, and along Highway 1 SF to LA.  The Rambouillet seems a 
> bit more stout than the Sequoia.  Most of the old touring related posts 
> here are from 2012 - 2014.  Any new news about tours folks have done on 
> their Rambouillets?  What pannier arrangements did you use? Self-supported, 
> road surface? 
>
> Mike SLO CA 
>

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW 
Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/609d7ff2-0bdb-40b8-98d7-5e949aa88715o%40googlegroups.com.

Re: [RBW] Re: Rambouillet as Tourer

[Toshi Takeuchi]

I've done long randoneurring rides on my 650b converted Ram.  It was
definitely one of my favorite bikes ever, and was only replaced because I
got an even nicer custom Riv.  It had a front Mark's rack with P-clamps and
a rear saddlebag.  Never any handling issues.  I've used larger saddlebags
than the one pictured here for my longest rides.  I think it would be great
for credit card touring, but would want something beefier for larger loads.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/42771204@N00/8176967200/

Toshi


On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 12:57 PM Mike Godwin  wrote:

> When the Rambouillets first were advertised in the planning works, do you
> guys recall who (Ted King?)  did a dirt ride parallel to I-80 through the
> Humboldt Basin / Lake Lahontan (east of Reno) on a Rambouillet? That got me
> interested in the bike. The same test bike was on the floor at Riv, Grant
> loaned it to me for a weekend.  I rode it on pavement and through various
> parts of dirt trails on Mt Diablo. I eventually got RB005, a pre-production
> version. It fits 36 mm wide tires (actual) and would probably safely accept
> up to 40 mm wide tires. I did grocery runs on it, but never loaded touring
> with front and rear racks. Very capable multipurpose bikes.  So that was
> the origin of my question, they are capable of handling different riding
> conditions and uses, but loaded down, it seems they can handle front and
> rear loads too.
>
> Mike SLO CA
>
> On Wednesday, September 9, 2020 at 10:53:28 AM UTC-7, Ben Mihovk wrote:
>
>> By any chance, did you buy the one off eBay being sold by Walter? I
>> messaged him a few times about the bike and decided I needed something a
>> little more rugged, but man...that bike was very tempting.
>>
>> On Wednesday, September 9, 2020 at 10:00:23 AM UTC-5 mpc...@gmail.com
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I personally just purchased a Ram that was sitting in a garage looking
>>> beautiful but not being used. I've been wondering how hard I can push it,
>>> especially on dirt/gravel. So, Andy, thank you for your insight here. The
>>> more I read the more I'm gleaning that this bike should NOT be too heavily
>>> loaded.
>>>
>>> On Monday, September 7, 2020 at 6:48:46 AM UTC-4 Fullylugged wrote:
>>>
 The Ram was intended for lightish touring and it does that well.
 Handling with any kind of front load depends a lot on the handlebar type
 and stem length used. I toured with the stock Nitto Noodles. I used a
 Mark's rack with P-Clamps and a small Baggins bag with up to 5 lbs in it. I
 also used a Duluth Candy roll handlebar bag for lightweight, want quick
 access to stuff, like lip protector, my phone, etc. Mostly, supplies went
 into 2 Nashbar panniers on a lightweight aluminum rear rack. That was to
 keep the center of gravity lower. Rain jacket and pants, helmet cover was
 in a large Baggins bag on top of the rack. I had a Keven's bag under the
 saddle with tire change stuff. The bike was a little rear heavy that way.
 handling was fine, but picking up and carrying was different. I have almost
 always ridden the same 32 mm Paselas that were original issue.

 These days, that bike is re-configured as my Townie/Sunday Cruiser but
 still has a rack in back and a Baggins bag on top.

 Bruce

 --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
> email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
> To view this discussion on the web visit
> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/5fb9cdc5-8868-45aa-90cd-91a92c5c038bo%40googlegroups.com
> 
> .
>

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW 
Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/CAGB59xw30J3Yr2OursqNXLGfQHDrXabte1%3DRayf55uF675pYFA%40mail.gmail.com.

Re: [RBW] Re: Rambouillet as Tourer

[Patrick Moore]

I should add that I choose my load carriers as much for their unladen
handling as their loaded handling. The Ram handled well unladen, of course.

On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 2:59 PM Patrick Moore  wrote:

> I did no touring with my blue model, but I did carry many sizeable rear
> loads (Tubus Fly rack in case it makes a difference) and the Ram performed
> well with rear loads up to about 35 lb. More than that and the handling
> started to get a bit "wandery" but it did as well as the 2003 custom, which
> probably had stouter tubes, that I am presently debating whether to keep or
> to sell. IME, it's not always the stouter-tubed bikes that carry loads --
> at least rear loads -- best, but those that have the right combination (I
> suppose) of tubing, geometry, and of course a good rack.
>
> On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 1:57 PM Mike Godwin  wrote:
>
>> When the Rambouillets first were advertised in the planning works, do you
>> guys recall who (Ted King?)  did a dirt ride parallel to I-80 through the
>> Humboldt Basin / Lake Lahontan (east of Reno) on a Rambouillet? That got me
>> interested in the bike. The same test bike was on the floor at Riv, Grant
>> loaned it to me for a weekend.  I rode it on pavement and through various
>> parts of dirt trails on Mt Diablo. I eventually got RB005, a pre-production
>> version. It fits 36 mm wide tires (actual) and would probably safely accept
>> up to 40 mm wide tires. I did grocery runs on it, but never loaded touring
>> with front and rear racks. Very capable multipurpose bikes.  So that was
>> the origin of my question, they are capable of handling different riding
>> conditions and uses, but loaded down, it seems they can handle front and
>> rear loads too.
>>
>> Mike SLO CA
>>
>> On Wednesday, September 9, 2020 at 10:53:28 AM UTC-7, Ben Mihovk wrote:
>>
>>> By any chance, did you buy the one off eBay being sold by Walter? I
>>> messaged him a few times about the bike and decided I needed something a
>>> little more rugged, but man...that bike was very tempting.
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, September 9, 2020 at 10:00:23 AM UTC-5 mpc...@gmail.com
>>> wrote:
>>>
 I personally just purchased a Ram that was sitting in a garage looking
 beautiful but not being used. I've been wondering how hard I can push it,
 especially on dirt/gravel. So, Andy, thank you for your insight here. The
 more I read the more I'm gleaning that this bike should NOT be too heavily
 loaded.

 On Monday, September 7, 2020 at 6:48:46 AM UTC-4 Fullylugged wrote:

> The Ram was intended for lightish touring and it does that well.
> Handling with any kind of front load depends a lot on the handlebar type
> and stem length used. I toured with the stock Nitto Noodles. I used a
> Mark's rack with P-Clamps and a small Baggins bag with up to 5 lbs in it. 
> I
> also used a Duluth Candy roll handlebar bag for lightweight, want quick
> access to stuff, like lip protector, my phone, etc. Mostly, supplies went
> into 2 Nashbar panniers on a lightweight aluminum rear rack. That was to
> keep the center of gravity lower. Rain jacket and pants, helmet cover was
> in a large Baggins bag on top of the rack. I had a Keven's bag under the
> saddle with tire change stuff. The bike was a little rear heavy that way.
> handling was fine, but picking up and carrying was different. I have 
> almost
> always ridden the same 32 mm Paselas that were original issue.
>
> These days, that bike is re-configured as my Townie/Sunday Cruiser but
> still has a rack in back and a Baggins bag on top.
>
> Bruce
>
> --
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
>> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
>> email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
>> To view this discussion on the web visit
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/5fb9cdc5-8868-45aa-90cd-91a92c5c038bo%40googlegroups.com
>> 
>> .
>>
>
>
> --
>
> ---
> Patrick Moore
> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum
>
>

-- 

---
Patrick Moore
Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW 
Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/CALuTfgtQPA25K%2BzB7Cogq206mFXCMQt%3D3WY9ks3_GWkYZGzwTg%40mail.gmail.com.

Re: [RBW] Re: Rambouillet as Tourer

[Patrick Moore]

I did no touring with my blue model, but I did carry many sizeable rear
loads (Tubus Fly rack in case it makes a difference) and the Ram performed
well with rear loads up to about 35 lb. More than that and the handling
started to get a bit "wandery" but it did as well as the 2003 custom, which
probably had stouter tubes, that I am presently debating whether to keep or
to sell. IME, it's not always the stouter-tubed bikes that carry loads --
at least rear loads -- best, but those that have the right combination (I
suppose) of tubing, geometry, and of course a good rack.

On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 1:57 PM Mike Godwin  wrote:

> When the Rambouillets first were advertised in the planning works, do you
> guys recall who (Ted King?)  did a dirt ride parallel to I-80 through the
> Humboldt Basin / Lake Lahontan (east of Reno) on a Rambouillet? That got me
> interested in the bike. The same test bike was on the floor at Riv, Grant
> loaned it to me for a weekend.  I rode it on pavement and through various
> parts of dirt trails on Mt Diablo. I eventually got RB005, a pre-production
> version. It fits 36 mm wide tires (actual) and would probably safely accept
> up to 40 mm wide tires. I did grocery runs on it, but never loaded touring
> with front and rear racks. Very capable multipurpose bikes.  So that was
> the origin of my question, they are capable of handling different riding
> conditions and uses, but loaded down, it seems they can handle front and
> rear loads too.
>
> Mike SLO CA
>
> On Wednesday, September 9, 2020 at 10:53:28 AM UTC-7, Ben Mihovk wrote:
>
>> By any chance, did you buy the one off eBay being sold by Walter? I
>> messaged him a few times about the bike and decided I needed something a
>> little more rugged, but man...that bike was very tempting.
>>
>> On Wednesday, September 9, 2020 at 10:00:23 AM UTC-5 mpc...@gmail.com
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I personally just purchased a Ram that was sitting in a garage looking
>>> beautiful but not being used. I've been wondering how hard I can push it,
>>> especially on dirt/gravel. So, Andy, thank you for your insight here. The
>>> more I read the more I'm gleaning that this bike should NOT be too heavily
>>> loaded.
>>>
>>> On Monday, September 7, 2020 at 6:48:46 AM UTC-4 Fullylugged wrote:
>>>
 The Ram was intended for lightish touring and it does that well.
 Handling with any kind of front load depends a lot on the handlebar type
 and stem length used. I toured with the stock Nitto Noodles. I used a
 Mark's rack with P-Clamps and a small Baggins bag with up to 5 lbs in it. I
 also used a Duluth Candy roll handlebar bag for lightweight, want quick
 access to stuff, like lip protector, my phone, etc. Mostly, supplies went
 into 2 Nashbar panniers on a lightweight aluminum rear rack. That was to
 keep the center of gravity lower. Rain jacket and pants, helmet cover was
 in a large Baggins bag on top of the rack. I had a Keven's bag under the
 saddle with tire change stuff. The bike was a little rear heavy that way.
 handling was fine, but picking up and carrying was different. I have almost
 always ridden the same 32 mm Paselas that were original issue.

 These days, that bike is re-configured as my Townie/Sunday Cruiser but
 still has a rack in back and a Baggins bag on top.

 Bruce

 --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
> email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
> To view this discussion on the web visit
> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/5fb9cdc5-8868-45aa-90cd-91a92c5c038bo%40googlegroups.com
> 
> .
>


-- 

---
Patrick Moore
Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW 
Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/CALuTfgu1qBqieM3-TMdpZZHZKp63ST-EM83OmYmLQ64fQDZW5Q%40mail.gmail.com.

[RBW] Re: Rambouillet as Tourer

[Mike Godwin]

When the Rambouillets first were advertised in the planning works, do you 
guys recall who (Ted King?)  did a dirt ride parallel to I-80 through the 
Humboldt Basin / Lake Lahontan (east of Reno) on a Rambouillet? That got me 
interested in the bike. The same test bike was on the floor at Riv, Grant 
loaned it to me for a weekend.  I rode it on pavement and through various 
parts of dirt trails on Mt Diablo. I eventually got RB005, a pre-production 
version. It fits 36 mm wide tires (actual) and would probably safely accept 
up to 40 mm wide tires. I did grocery runs on it, but never loaded touring 
with front and rear racks. Very capable multipurpose bikes.  So that was 
the origin of my question, they are capable of handling different riding 
conditions and uses, but loaded down, it seems they can handle front and 
rear loads too.

Mike SLO CA

On Wednesday, September 9, 2020 at 10:53:28 AM UTC-7, Ben Mihovk wrote:

> By any chance, did you buy the one off eBay being sold by Walter? I 
> messaged him a few times about the bike and decided I needed something a 
> little more rugged, but man...that bike was very tempting.
>
> On Wednesday, September 9, 2020 at 10:00:23 AM UTC-5 mpc...@gmail.com 
> wrote:
>
>> I personally just purchased a Ram that was sitting in a garage looking 
>> beautiful but not being used. I've been wondering how hard I can push it, 
>> especially on dirt/gravel. So, Andy, thank you for your insight here. The 
>> more I read the more I'm gleaning that this bike should NOT be too heavily 
>> loaded. 
>>
>> On Monday, September 7, 2020 at 6:48:46 AM UTC-4 Fullylugged wrote:
>>
>>> The Ram was intended for lightish touring and it does that well. 
>>> Handling with any kind of front load depends a lot on the handlebar type 
>>> and stem length used. I toured with the stock Nitto Noodles. I used a 
>>> Mark's rack with P-Clamps and a small Baggins bag with up to 5 lbs in it. I 
>>> also used a Duluth Candy roll handlebar bag for lightweight, want quick 
>>> access to stuff, like lip protector, my phone, etc. Mostly, supplies went 
>>> into 2 Nashbar panniers on a lightweight aluminum rear rack. That was to 
>>> keep the center of gravity lower. Rain jacket and pants, helmet cover was 
>>> in a large Baggins bag on top of the rack. I had a Keven's bag under the 
>>> saddle with tire change stuff. The bike was a little rear heavy that way. 
>>> handling was fine, but picking up and carrying was different. I have almost 
>>> always ridden the same 32 mm Paselas that were original issue.
>>>
>>> These days, that bike is re-configured as my Townie/Sunday Cruiser but 
>>> still has a rack in back and a Baggins bag on top.
>>>
>>> Bruce
>>>
>>>

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW 
Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/5fb9cdc5-8868-45aa-90cd-91a92c5c038bo%40googlegroups.com.

[RBW] Re: Rambouillet as Tourer

[Ben Mihovk]

By any chance, did you buy the one off eBay being sold by Walter? I 
messaged him a few times about the bike and decided I needed something a 
little more rugged, but man...that bike was very tempting.

On Wednesday, September 9, 2020 at 10:00:23 AM UTC-5 mpc...@gmail.com wrote:

> I personally just purchased a Ram that was sitting in a garage looking 
> beautiful but not being used. I've been wondering how hard I can push it, 
> especially on dirt/gravel. So, Andy, thank you for your insight here. The 
> more I read the more I'm gleaning that this bike should NOT be too heavily 
> loaded. 
>
> On Monday, September 7, 2020 at 6:48:46 AM UTC-4 Fullylugged wrote:
>
>> The Ram was intended for lightish touring and it does that well. Handling 
>> with any kind of front load depends a lot on the handlebar type and stem 
>> length used. I toured with the stock Nitto Noodles. I used a Mark's rack 
>> with P-Clamps and a small Baggins bag with up to 5 lbs in it. I also used a 
>> Duluth Candy roll handlebar bag for lightweight, want quick access to 
>> stuff, like lip protector, my phone, etc. Mostly, supplies went into 2 
>> Nashbar panniers on a lightweight aluminum rear rack. That was to keep the 
>> center of gravity lower. Rain jacket and pants, helmet cover was in a large 
>> Baggins bag on top of the rack. I had a Keven's bag under the saddle with 
>> tire change stuff. The bike was a little rear heavy that way. handling was 
>> fine, but picking up and carrying was different. I have almost always 
>> ridden the same 32 mm Paselas that were original issue.
>>
>> These days, that bike is re-configured as my Townie/Sunday Cruiser but 
>> still has a rack in back and a Baggins bag on top.
>>
>> Bruce
>>
>

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW 
Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/c176d57e-8ce0-41e0-96a0-a81c2e0c8532n%40googlegroups.com.

[RBW] Re: Rambouillet as Tourer

[Thomas B]

Hi Andy,

Thanks for sharing your experience - would you mind sharing pictures of the 
Coast?

Tom
El Cerrito, CA

On Monday, September 7, 2020 at 2:45:13 AM UTC-7, ascpgh wrote:
>
> I rode my Rambouillet across the country on the Adventure Cycling Trans-Am 
> route, Western Express route. Not self-supported. After the trip I wanted a 
> bike like the Rambouillet, not like a Long Haul Trucker. The latter, 
> without load, is like driving around in an F-250 pickup with nothing in it 
> and I was happy to suffer some austerity of wardrobe options and a lot of 
> hand washing on the trip to get it.  
>
> I used a Carradice Nelson Longflap on the long credit card tour and 
> actually talked the others out of a self-supported trip because everyone 
> would need a new bike. They didn't understand how much stuff we'd have to 
> carry along every day and how much water volume above that the deserts of 
> Utah were going to dictate That ride is completely different schlep if 
> self-supporting. 
>
> The reasonable limit on my large (64cm) Ram was 20 pounds in the saddle 
> bag (which is more than Grant wrote) and I could feel some poor handling at 
> the top of that range since the load is up high. I still wonder how I 
> carried enough in that 15 liters of space to account for all the weather 
> and mechanical support. 
>
> I did enjoy a shower, bed and AC in the locations along the route we 
> stayed because even those little places campsites were outside of town and 
> half the fun of the route was knowing that you rolling into town on a bike 
> was often the high point of peoples' day. Eating in a diner with them for 
> dinner and breakfast provided conversations that kept the group fresh and 
> gave us insight such as we hoped to as we crossed the country.
>
> I have added a Velo Orange rando bag in the front to gain more capacity 
> for a short trip in potentially questionable weather on the 2012 Riv Rally 
> East. I have to say that while I managed the load it was not a graceful 
> fitment. I can't say that low front bags would be bad but it's be a shape 
> to dampen that fork's liveliness by bridging it with a rack and loading it 
> up. The lack of braze-ons of that bike is intentional.
>
> I learned a lot about riding my Ram with loads within its design intention 
> and then beyond. I have that shorter experience in overload and I have 
> ridden it extensively on the GAP. While it might have been designed to ride 
> all surfaces, that takes it to 85% of the design limit. Its riding weight 
> (it, me and cargo) are too rear biased and require rear tire pressure to be 
> high enough (max 32 under fenders) to avoid pinch flats/rim dings on longer 
> rides. It just wore me out at times, either by the duration of jostling on 
> a hard tire or the time spend changing tubes from flats when more 
> comfortable. 
>
> My years learning and riding my Rambouillet  helped me solidify the likes 
> and dislikes I brought together in a new bike. I still do not want to ride 
> a self-supported touring bike empty, which would be 90%+ of its time so my 
> preference was to move the 20-25# load to the front (with low trail) to 
> balance the wheels' loads allowing more even tire pressure, fewer rim dings 
> and comfortable ride. I chose 650b x 42 tubeless to lower that flatting 
> frequency. So I have that new bike, a Coast rando, and it does all that I 
> wanted on day one. I still have the Rambouillet and am about to ride it to 
> work in a few minutes. I wouldn't change a thing about it after these 
> years, proof of which is the Disc Trucker sitting next to it that has a 
> layer of dust because even with its generator hub and lights I'd rather be 
> riding the Ram with clip on battery lights for the commute instead of that 
> empty F-250.
>
> Andy Cheatham
> Pittsburgh
>
> On Sunday, September 6, 2020 at 5:49:00 PM UTC-4, Mike Godwin wrote:
>>
>> Howdy, looking through the archives about using a Rambouillet as a 
>> touring machine. I toured along the spine of the Cascades and Sierra on a 
>> Specialized Sequoia, and along Highway 1 SF to LA.  The Rambouillet seems a 
>> bit more stout than the Sequoia.  Most of the old touring related posts 
>> here are from 2012 - 2014.  Any new news about tours folks have done on 
>> their Rambouillets?  What pannier arrangements did you use? Self-supported, 
>> road surface? 
>>
>> Mike SLO CA 
>>
>

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW 
Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/41700a99-addb-4135-9aad-88e7d24c2e7fo%40googlegroups.com.

[RBW] Re: Rambouillet as Tourer

[Michael Cyr]

I personally just purchased a Ram that was sitting in a garage looking 
beautiful but not being used. I've been wondering how hard I can push it, 
especially on dirt/gravel. So, Andy, thank you for your insight here. The 
more I read the more I'm gleaning that this bike should NOT be too heavily 
loaded. 

On Monday, September 7, 2020 at 6:48:46 AM UTC-4 Fullylugged wrote:

> The Ram was intended for lightish touring and it does that well. Handling 
> with any kind of front load depends a lot on the handlebar type and stem 
> length used. I toured with the stock Nitto Noodles. I used a Mark's rack 
> with P-Clamps and a small Baggins bag with up to 5 lbs in it. I also used a 
> Duluth Candy roll handlebar bag for lightweight, want quick access to 
> stuff, like lip protector, my phone, etc. Mostly, supplies went into 2 
> Nashbar panniers on a lightweight aluminum rear rack. That was to keep the 
> center of gravity lower. Rain jacket and pants, helmet cover was in a large 
> Baggins bag on top of the rack. I had a Keven's bag under the saddle with 
> tire change stuff. The bike was a little rear heavy that way. handling was 
> fine, but picking up and carrying was different. I have almost always 
> ridden the same 32 mm Paselas that were original issue.
>
> These days, that bike is re-configured as my Townie/Sunday Cruiser but 
> still has a rack in back and a Baggins bag on top.
>
> Bruce
>

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW 
Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/a15606ef-c5f8-42de-9416-97ef0c2978c4n%40googlegroups.com.

[RBW] Re: Rambouillet as Tourer

[ascpgh]

I rode my Rambouillet across the country on the Adventure Cycling Trans-Am 
route, Western Express route. Not self-supported. After the trip I wanted a 
bike like the Rambouillet, not like a Long Haul Trucker. The latter, 
without load, is like driving around in an F-250 pickup with nothing in it 
and I was happy to suffer some austerity of wardrobe options and a lot of 
hand washing on the trip to get it.  

I used a Carradice Nelson Longflap on the long credit card tour and 
actually talked the others out of a self-supported trip because everyone 
would need a new bike. They didn't understand how much stuff we'd have to 
carry along every day and how much water volume above that the deserts of 
Utah were going to dictate That ride is completely different schlep if 
self-supporting. 

The reasonable limit on my large (64cm) Ram was 20 pounds in the saddle bag 
(which is more than Grant wrote) and I could feel some poor handling at the 
top of that range since the load is up high. I still wonder how I carried 
enough in that 15 liters of space to account for all the weather and 
mechanical support. 

I did enjoy a shower, bed and AC in the locations along the route we stayed 
because even those little places campsites were outside of town and half 
the fun of the route was knowing that you rolling into town on a bike was 
often the high point of peoples' day. Eating in a diner with them for 
dinner and breakfast provided conversations that kept the group fresh and 
gave us insight such as we hoped to as we crossed the country.

I have added a Velo Orange rando bag in the front to gain more capacity for 
a short trip in potentially questionable weather on the 2012 Riv Rally 
East. I have to say that while I managed the load it was not a graceful 
fitment. I can't say that low front bags would be bad but it's be a shape 
to dampen that fork's liveliness by bridging it with a rack and loading it 
up. The lack of braze-ons of that bike is intentional.

I learned a lot about riding my Ram with loads within its design intention 
and then beyond. I have that shorter experience in overload and I have 
ridden it extensively on the GAP. While it might have been designed to ride 
all surfaces, that takes it to 85% of the design limit. Its riding weight 
(it, me and cargo) are too rear biased and require rear tire pressure to be 
high enough (max 32 under fenders) to avoid pinch flats/rim dings on longer 
rides. It just wore me out at times, either by the duration of jostling on 
a hard tire or the time spend changing tubes from flats when more 
comfortable. 

My years learning and riding my Rambouillet  helped me solidify the likes 
and dislikes I brought together in a new bike. I still do not want to ride 
a self-supported touring bike empty, which would be 90%+ of its time so my 
preference was to move the 20-25# load to the front (with low trail) to 
balance the wheels' loads allowing more even tire pressure, fewer rim dings 
and comfortable ride. I chose 650b x 42 tubeless to lower that flatting 
frequency. So I have that new bike, a Coast rando, and it does all that I 
wanted on day one. I still have the Rambouillet and am about to ride it to 
work in a few minutes. I wouldn't change a thing about it after these 
years, proof of which is the Disc Trucker sitting next to it that has a 
layer of dust because even with its generator hub and lights I'd rather be 
riding the Ram with clip on battery lights for the commute instead of that 
empty F-250.

Andy Cheatham
Pittsburgh

On Sunday, September 6, 2020 at 5:49:00 PM UTC-4, Mike Godwin wrote:
>
> Howdy, looking through the archives about using a Rambouillet as a touring 
> machine. I toured along the spine of the Cascades and Sierra on a 
> Specialized Sequoia, and along Highway 1 SF to LA.  The Rambouillet seems a 
> bit more stout than the Sequoia.  Most of the old touring related posts 
> here are from 2012 - 2014.  Any new news about tours folks have done on 
> their Rambouillets?  What pannier arrangements did you use? Self-supported, 
> road surface? 
>
> Mike SLO CA 
>

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW 
Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/d57cc601-c133-4bc4-ba83-dc4ad7a7db4do%40googlegroups.com.