RE: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band
I feel a little pessimistic about this, in that I expect it to happen more frequently as time passes. I hope I'm wrong, but I can't help feeling that we are going to gradually lose our spectrum as companies with deep pockets buy our frequencies out from under us. Richard www.n7tgb.net http://www.n7tgb.net/ Government's first duty is to protect the people, not run their lives. -- Ronald Reagan _ From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of George Henry Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 11:15 AM To: repeater-builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band Re: the waiver request by ReconRobotics for 420 - 450 MHz operation. Hams get the shaft again... George, KA3HSW / WQGJ413
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band
You can count on it. They are already after over-the-air broadcast and satelite TV spectrum, and the TV people have deeper pockets than ham radio ever will. Chuck WB2EDV - Original Message - From: Richard To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 3:11 PM Subject: RE: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band I feel a little pessimistic about this, in that I expect it to happen more frequently as time passes. I hope I'm wrong, but I can't help feeling that we are going to gradually lose our spectrum as companies with deep pockets buy our frequencies out from under us. Richard www.n7tgb.net Government's first duty is to protect the people, not run their lives. -- Ronald Reagan From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of George Henry Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 11:15 AM To: repeater-builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band Re: the waiver request by ReconRobotics for 420 - 450 MHz operation. Hams get the shaft again... George, KA3HSW / WQGJ413
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band
Ah George, Don't worry! The first time the device fails to deliver the goods to the Public Safety guys, they'll stop using it. Good luck to them. They'll have fun running up against the 1,000watt erp of many 70cm repeaters. 73, Dave Wa3gin _ From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of George Henry Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 2:15 PM To: repeater-builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band Re: the waiver request by ReconRobotics for 420 - 450 MHz operation. Hams get the shaft again... George, KA3HSW / WQGJ413
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band
On 3/3/2010 1:11 PM, Richard wrote: I feel a little pessimistic about this, in that I expect it to happen more frequently as time passes. I hope I'm wrong, but I can't help feeling that we are going to gradually lose our spectrum as companies with deep pockets buy our frequencies out from under us. Richard www.n7tgb.net http://www.n7tgb.net/ Government's first duty is to protect the people, not run their lives. -- Ronald Reagan All we have to do is prove our use of the Spectrum is more valuable than a radio controlled robot. Oh wait... Nate WY0X
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band
If it crosses international boundries I expect it not to happen To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com From: gbis-reply-...@gbis.com Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2010 12:11:05 -0800 Subject: RE: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band I feel a little pessimistic about this, in that I expect it to happen more frequently as time passes. I hope I'm wrong, but I can't help feeling that we are going to gradually lose our spectrum as companies with deep pockets buy our frequencies out from under us. Richardwww.n7tgb.net Government's first duty is to protect the people, not run their lives. -- Ronald Reagan From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of George Henry Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 11:15 AM To: repeater-builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band Re: the waiver request by ReconRobotics for 420 - 450 MHz operation. Hams get the shaft again... George, KA3HSW / WQGJ413 _ Get the latest jobs delivered. Sign up for SEEK Jobmail. http://clk.atdmt.com/NMN/go/157639755/direct/01/
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band
Take that crap up to 2.4 GHz with the rest of the garbage.
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band
Maybe, but in my opinion the foot is clearly in the door. Chuck WB2EDV - Original Message - From: David Jordan To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 3:02 PM Subject: RE: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band Ah George, Don't worry! The first time the device fails to deliver the goods to the Public Safety guys, they'll stop using it. Good luck to them. They'll have fun running up against the 1,000watt erp of many 70cm repeaters. 73, Dave Wa3gin
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band
At 11:15 AM 03/03/10, you wrote: Re: the waiver request by ReconRobotics for 420 - 450 MHz operation. Hams get the shaft again... George, KA3HSW / WQGJ413 Someone needs to turn the tables on the rest of them - file for primary on 220-222 MHz.
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band
Since they'd be competing with high powered repeaters and government radars, I thought 2.4 gig would have been a better choice than 70cm, but that's just me... Richard www.n7tgb.net http://www.n7tgb.net/ Government's first duty is to protect the people, not run their lives. -- Ronald Reagan _ From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of DCFluX Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 12:24 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band Take that crap up to 2.4 GHz with the rest of the garbage.
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band
So... is anyone gonna buy one of these things to see just what kind of interference it will actually make in the 70cm band? 1 watt max and .25 watt nominal is enough to key up a poorly tuned and set up nearby repeater or a distant sensitively configured repeater, and enough to produce decent QRM on existing nearby voice and data communications especially as it is using an analog video and operational control system. -Brian / KF4ZWZ On Wed, Mar 3, 2010 at 1:10 PM, Richard gbis-reply-...@gbis.com wrote: Since they'd be competing with high powered repeaters and government radars, I thought 2.4 gig would have been a better choice than 70cm, but that's just me... Richard www.n7tgb.net Government's first duty is to protect the people, not run their lives. -- Ronald Reagan -- *From:* Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto: repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] *On Behalf Of *DCFluX *Sent:* Wednesday, March 03, 2010 12:24 PM *To:* Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com *Subject:* Re: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band Take that crap up to 2.4 GHz with the rest of the garbage.
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band
Or even unused traditional UHF TV channels which are only 30 MHz higher. The bad part of this is if something goes to court, the jury will likely side with those protecting lives over ham chat no matter what the laws say and the hams will lose. Joe M. Richard wrote: Since they'd be competing with high powered repeaters and government radars, I thought 2.4 gig would have been a better choice than 70cm, but that's just me... Richard www.n7tgb.net http://www.n7tgb.net/ Government's first duty is to protect the people, not run their lives. -- Ronald Reagan *From:* Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] *On Behalf Of *DCFluX *Sent:* Wednesday, March 03, 2010 12:24 PM *To:* Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com *Subject:* Re: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band Take that crap up to 2.4 GHz with the rest of the garbage. No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.733 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2720 - Release Date: 03/03/10 02:34:00
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band
There are plenty of options.the FCC has set aside spectrum just for Public Safety and such devices, but they need input from us or all they hear is the vendor biased story.not sure why the FCC felt compelled to allow this request. Perhaps the vendor was concerned about building attenuation. I believe the erp of the devices is extremely low. I understand future 4G wireless services may be moving to 3.5Ghz, so the really big carriers won't be interested in UHF. The world has to be in a position to provide a dedicated channel per sq meter of area and that number of channels is only available when you start at the 1.9GHhz range and work your way up! 70cm is going to be around for a long time. Enjoy, Dave Wa3gin _ From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Richard Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 4:10 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band Since they'd be competing with high powered repeaters and government radars, I thought 2.4 gig would have been a better choice than 70cm, but that's just me... Richard www.n7tgb.net http://www.n7tgb.net/ Government's first duty is to protect the people, not run their lives. -- Ronald Reagan _ From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of DCFluX Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 12:24 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band Take that crap up to 2.4 GHz with the rest of the garbage.
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band
On Wed, 3 Mar 2010, George Henry wrote: Re: the waiver request by ReconRobotics for 420 - 450 MHz operation. Hams get the shaft again... Who wants to be the first to sue the FCC? -- Kris Kirby, KE4AHR Disinformation Analyst
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band
What? Just go and turn on your PL... come on! Lets use the technology that we claim we know so well... - Original Message - From: Brian Raker To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 4:51 PM Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band So... is anyone gonna buy one of these things to see just what kind of interference it will actually make in the 70cm band? 1 watt max and .25 watt nominal is enough to key up a poorly tuned and set up nearby repeater or a distant sensitively configured repeater, and enough to produce decent QRM on existing nearby voice and data communications especially as it is using an analog video and operational control system. -Brian / KF4ZWZ On Wed, Mar 3, 2010 at 1:10 PM, Richard gbis-reply-...@gbis.com wrote: Since they'd be competing with high powered repeaters and government radars, I thought 2.4 gig would have been a better choice than 70cm, but that's just me... Richard www.n7tgb.net Government's first duty is to protect the people, not run their lives. -- Ronald Reagan From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of DCFluX Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 12:24 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band Take that crap up to 2.4 GHz with the rest of the garbage.
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band
This is why public safety has its own band and spectrum. Where the hell is our beloved ARRL fighting for our spectrum and fighting off these goons. There is a lot of spectrum in the 220Mhz, why don't they use this since its hardly used in the commercial market. Mike Mullarkey K7PFJ _ From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of George Henry Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 12:15 PM To: repeater-builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band Re: the waiver request by ReconRobotics for 420 - 450 MHz operation. Hams get the shaft again... George, KA3HSW / WQGJ413
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band
No they will just cry like the military did with the PAVE PAWS SHIT. Mike Mullarkey K7PFJ 6886 Sage Ave Firestone, Co 80504 303-736-9693 _ From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of David Jordan Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 1:03 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band Ah George, Don't worry! The first time the device fails to deliver the goods to the Public Safety guys, they'll stop using it. Good luck to them. They'll have fun running up against the 1,000watt erp of many 70cm repeaters. 73, Dave Wa3gin _ From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of George Henry Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 2:15 PM To: repeater-builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band Re: the waiver request by ReconRobotics for 420 - 450 MHz operation. Hams get the shaft again... George, KA3HSW / WQGJ413
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band
Yea, well from where I see it there is a new chief in town and he don't have a clue. Mike Mullarkey K7PFJ _ From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nate Duehr Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 1:22 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band On 3/3/2010 1:11 PM, Richard wrote: I feel a little pessimistic about this, in that I expect it to happen more frequently as time passes. I hope I'm wrong, but I can't help feeling that we are going to gradually lose our spectrum as companies with deep pockets buy our frequencies out from under us. Richard www.n7tgb.net http://www.n7tgb.net/ Government's first duty is to protect the people, not run their lives. -- Ronald Reagan All we have to do is prove our use of the Spectrum is more valuable than a radio controlled robot. Oh wait... Nate WY0X
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band
Mike, R U talking about Ms. Smith, the desk jockey that replaced Riley? If so I agree...clueless in Gettysburg! - Original Message - From: k7...@skybeam.com To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 6:16 PM Subject: RE: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band Yea, well from where I see it there is a new chief in town and he don't have a clue. Mike Mullarkey K7PFJ -- From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nate Duehr Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 1:22 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band On 3/3/2010 1:11 PM, Richard wrote: I feel a little pessimistic about this, in that I expect it to happen more frequently as time passes. I hope I'm wrong, but I can't help feeling that we are going to gradually lose our spectrum as companies with deep pockets buy our frequencies out from under us. Richard www.n7tgb.net Government's first duty is to protect the people, not run their lives. -- Ronald Reagan All we have to do is prove our use of the Spectrum is more valuable than a radio controlled robot. Oh wait... Nate WY0X
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band
I'll tell ya what... I'll get one of these toys for our Fire Chief to test out and we'll see how it does...P-25 sucks below ground level and dies above the 14th fl ... so there is already plenty of issues in Public Safety...if these folks don't sell a bunch of these toys soon enough they'll be out of business and have no impact on us secondary users... I'm not losing any sleep over this one. We have bigger fish to fry... - Original Message - From: k7...@skybeam.com To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 6:15 PM Subject: RE: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band No they will just cry like the military did with the PAVE PAWS SHIT. Mike Mullarkey K7PFJ 6886 Sage Ave Firestone, Co 80504 303-736-9693 -- From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of David Jordan Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 1:03 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band Ah George, Don't worry! The first time the device fails to deliver the goods to the Public Safety guys, they'll stop using it. Good luck to them. They'll have fun running up against the 1,000watt erp of many 70cm repeaters. 73, Dave Wa3gin -- From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of George Henry Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 2:15 PM To: repeater-builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band Re: the waiver request by ReconRobotics for 420 - 450 MHz operation. Hams get the shaft again... George, KA3HSW / WQGJ413
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band
HAHA, Beloved ARRL... how much time do you thing those boys in Newington spend on this planet? Not much I can tell you. I enjoy following them and keeping track of how frequently they reverse their position on issues by 180 degrees. Pretty pathetic performance on our behalf I would say...subjective opinion of one! - Original Message - From: k7...@skybeam.com To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 6:13 PM Subject: RE: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band This is why public safety has its own band and spectrum. Where the hell is our beloved ARRL fighting for our spectrum and fighting off these goons. There is a lot of spectrum in the 220Mhz, why don't they use this since its hardly used in the commercial market. Mike Mullarkey K7PFJ -- From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of George Henry Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 12:15 PM To: repeater-builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band Re: the waiver request by ReconRobotics for 420 - 450 MHz operation. Hams get the shaft again... George, KA3HSW / WQGJ413
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band
On Wed, 3 Mar 2010, David Jordan wrote: There are plenty of options?the FCC has set aside spectrum just for Public Safety and such devices, but they need input from us or all they hear is the vendor biased story?not sure why the FCC felt compelled to allow this request. Perhaps the vendor was concerned about building attenuation. I believe the erp of the devices is extremely low. Guys, they have authorized a user to transmit NTSC video in a section of spectrum reserved for RADAR; NTSC video has no previous nor presently known use as RADAR. -- Kris Kirby, KE4AHR Disinformation Analyst
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band
I want to see what happens when the USAF complains of interference to the PAVE PAWS system, like they did with the 70cm repeater operators. After all, the coppers in the Bay Area (SF/Oakland) and New York have deep pockets and each will probably buy a few of these at several grand a piece - only to find out they cause interference to the Military. Sure, only 1W. Uh-huh. Can you say OOOPS?!?!?! I knew you could. I'll bet nobody has thought of that issue yet. Mark - N9WYS From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com On Behalf Of David Jordan Ah George, Don't worry! The first time the device fails to deliver the goods to the Public Safety guys, they'll stop using it. Good luck to them. They'll have fun running up against the 1,000watt erp of many 70cm repeaters. 73, Dave Wa3gin _ From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com On Behalf Of George Henry Re: the waiver request by ReconRobotics for 420 - 450 MHz operation. Hams get the shaft again... George, KA3HSW / WQGJ413
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band
Didn't the ARRL do that over BPL? Mark - N9WYS -Original Message- From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com On Behalf Of Kris Kirby On Wed, 3 Mar 2010, George Henry wrote: Re: the waiver request by ReconRobotics for 420 - 450 MHz operation. Hams get the shaft again... Who wants to be the first to sue the FCC? -- Kris Kirby, KE4AHR
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band
Amateur Radio is NOT PRIMARY on 70cm in the U.S.. Never have been. Never will be. We are SECONDARY ...and NTIA let's us behave like we're primary... most of the time. That's why we lost with previous military systems (ask folk near Camp Pendleton about that one), we lost with PAVE PAWS, and we'll probably lose on this one too. Nate WY0X
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band
Actually, DPL/PL doesn't help. It only signals to the receiver when to open squelch is all. If someone is transmitting and this thing decides to transmit at the same time, you'll get an earful of noise, PL or not. -Brian On Wed, Mar 3, 2010 at 3:02 PM, WA3GIN wa3...@comcast.net wrote: What? Just go and turn on your PL... come on! Lets use the technology that we claim we know so well... - Original Message - *From:* Brian Raker brian.ra...@gmail.com *To:* Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com *Sent:* Wednesday, March 03, 2010 4:51 PM *Subject:* Re: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band So... is anyone gonna buy one of these things to see just what kind of interference it will actually make in the 70cm band? 1 watt max and .25 watt nominal is enough to key up a poorly tuned and set up nearby repeater or a distant sensitively configured repeater, and enough to produce decent QRM on existing nearby voice and data communications especially as it is using an analog video and operational control system. -Brian / KF4ZWZ On Wed, Mar 3, 2010 at 1:10 PM, Richard gbis-reply-...@gbis.com wrote: Since they'd be competing with high powered repeaters and government radars, I thought 2.4 gig would have been a better choice than 70cm, but that's just me... Richard www.n7tgb.net Government's first duty is to protect the people, not run their lives. -- Ronald Reagan -- *From:* Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto: repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] *On Behalf Of *DCFluX *Sent:* Wednesday, March 03, 2010 12:24 PM *To:* Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com *Subject:* Re: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band Take that crap up to 2.4 GHz with the rest of the garbage.
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band
That is a real stretch...these things are to be used for incidents that require them...how many many high rise building fires do you have in your town...think you can live with a little interference every 20 yrs. Get real. - Original Message - From: Brian Raker To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 6:54 PM Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band Actually, DPL/PL doesn't help. It only signals to the receiver when to open squelch is all. If someone is transmitting and this thing decides to transmit at the same time, you'll get an earful of noise, PL or not. -Brian On Wed, Mar 3, 2010 at 3:02 PM, WA3GIN wa3...@comcast.net wrote: What? Just go and turn on your PL... come on! Lets use the technology that we claim we know so well... - Original Message - From: Brian Raker To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 4:51 PM Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band So... is anyone gonna buy one of these things to see just what kind of interference it will actually make in the 70cm band? 1 watt max and .25 watt nominal is enough to key up a poorly tuned and set up nearby repeater or a distant sensitively configured repeater, and enough to produce decent QRM on existing nearby voice and data communications especially as it is using an analog video and operational control system. -Brian / KF4ZWZ On Wed, Mar 3, 2010 at 1:10 PM, Richard gbis-reply-...@gbis.com wrote: Since they'd be competing with high powered repeaters and government radars, I thought 2.4 gig would have been a better choice than 70cm, but that's just me... Richard www.n7tgb.net Government's first duty is to protect the people, not run their lives. -- Ronald Reagan From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of DCFluX Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 12:24 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band Take that crap up to 2.4 GHz with the rest of the garbage.
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band
On 3/3/2010 5:29 PM, WA3GIN wrote: That is a real stretch...these things are to be used for incidents that require them...how many many high rise building fires do you have in your town...think you can live with a little interference every 20 yrs. Get real. The numbers are public in every jurisdiction, so it's not hard to figure out. Best numbers I have for my municipality (Denver) is from 2008... 84,953 alarms 1043 fires 0 2-Alarm Fires 1 3-Alarm Fire 668 Structure Fires 17 Other Fires Within Structures 4201 Other Rescues (meaning not Automobiles) This counts no portion of our suburbs, only the tiny City and Country of Denver proper. Numerous suburbs also multiple structures higher than ten stories. We're just a little 3.5 million person city, compared to the big cities on the coasts who are actually LESS likely to buy these things (they're broke, remember? California thinks IOU's are U.S. Currency, last I heard) We have just under three structure fires on average per day in just the main portion of the city. There's some tables at the end of the 2008 document that show all calls that included Hazardous Conditions... that's probably not detailed enough to assume a robot would be used, but it's a starting point for analysis. Also columns on how often the Hazmat Rescue teams were called out. Anyone that wants to can find out this information about your local department... instead of guessing. I'm not arguing whether or not these things will get used a lot, nor their interference potential -- just pointing out that getting the real numbers for my area took 5 minutes on Google and 5 more to type this. Nate WY0X
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band
This is already happening in Australia. Amateurs are secondary users for 420-450MHz, with military and radio location being primary. A few years ago our ACMA introduced Low Interference Potential Devices license class (any modulation, for any purpose, 25 mW maximum, no license required). Allegedly this was to allow luxury cars to be imported without modifying their electronic door and security keys. Not surprisingly there are a few luxury cars still parked near amateur repeaters that can't be unlocked :-) Due to poorly written legislation, a whole lot of other devices have now flooded the market, including continuously transmitting data modules, and all cause a lot of trouble to amateur operators and repeaters. The bottom end of the band 420-430MHz of the amateur band has also been eroded by government digital radio networks (because it's cheaper to import equipment from overseas that's already in that band). Amateurs in parts of the country are no longer allowed to use that part of the band. I hope the FCC doesn't follow suit although it sounds like they already are! Mark, VK3BYY _ From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Richard Sent: Thursday, 4 March 2010 07:11 AM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band I feel a little pessimistic about this, in that I expect it to happen more frequently as time passes. I hope I'm wrong, but I can't help feeling that we are going to gradually lose our spectrum as companies with deep pockets buy our frequencies out from under us. Richard www.n7tgb.net http://www.n7tgb.net/ Government's first duty is to protect the people, not run their lives. -- Ronald Reagan _ From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of George Henry Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 11:15 AM To: repeater-builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band Re: the waiver request by ReconRobotics for 420 - 450 MHz operation. Hams get the shaft again... George, KA3HSW / WQGJ413
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band
That is my concern, it'll be a foot in the door. Richard www.n7tgb.net http://www.n7tgb.net/ Government's first duty is to protect the people, not run their lives. -- Ronald Reagan _ From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Mark Harrison Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 4:40 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band This is already happening in Australia. Amateurs are secondary users for 420-450MHz, with military and radio location being primary. A few years ago our ACMA introduced Low Interference Potential Devices license class (any modulation, for any purpose, 25 mW maximum, no license required). Allegedly this was to allow luxury cars to be imported without modifying their electronic door and security keys. Not surprisingly there are a few luxury cars still parked near amateur repeaters that can't be unlocked :-) Due to poorly written legislation, a whole lot of other devices have now flooded the market, including continuously transmitting data modules, and all cause a lot of trouble to amateur operators and repeaters. The bottom end of the band 420-430MHz of the amateur band has also been eroded by government digital radio networks (because it's cheaper to import equipment from overseas that's already in that band). Amateurs in parts of the country are no longer allowed to use that part of the band. I hope the FCC doesn't follow suit although it sounds like they already are! Mark, VK3BYY _ From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Richard Sent: Thursday, 4 March 2010 07:11 AM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band I feel a little pessimistic about this, in that I expect it to happen more frequently as time passes. I hope I'm wrong, but I can't help feeling that we are going to gradually lose our spectrum as companies with deep pockets buy our frequencies out from under us. Richard www.n7tgb.net http://www.n7tgb.net/ Government's first duty is to protect the people, not run their lives. -- Ronald Reagan _ From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of George Henry Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 11:15 AM To: repeater-builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band Re: the waiver request by ReconRobotics for 420 - 450 MHz operation. Hams get the shaft again... George, KA3HSW / WQGJ413
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band
You know Motorola told us the same thing when our FD was getting interference from another jurisdiction on the same frequency. Well the ones that didn't know squat about radio listened to Motorola and well many times the mobiles could not even open the receiver because of the other transmitter capturing the receiver with no PL. Great technology but wrong reason. David From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Brian Raker Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 5:55 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band Actually, DPL/PL doesn't help. It only signals to the receiver when to open squelch is all. If someone is transmitting and this thing decides to transmit at the same time, you'll get an earful of noise, PL or not. -Brian On Wed, Mar 3, 2010 at 3:02 PM, WA3GIN wa3...@comcast.net wrote: What? Just go and turn on your PL... come on! Lets use the technology that we claim we know so well... - Original Message - From: Brian Raker mailto:brian.ra...@gmail.com To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 4:51 PM Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band So... is anyone gonna buy one of these things to see just what kind of interference it will actually make in the 70cm band? 1 watt max and .25 watt nominal is enough to key up a poorly tuned and set up nearby repeater or a distant sensitively configured repeater, and enough to produce decent QRM on existing nearby voice and data communications especially as it is using an analog video and operational control system. -Brian / KF4ZWZ On Wed, Mar 3, 2010 at 1:10 PM, Richard gbis-reply-...@gbis.com wrote: Since they'd be competing with high powered repeaters and government radars, I thought 2.4 gig would have been a better choice than 70cm, but that's just me... Richard www.n7tgb.net http://www.n7tgb.net/ Government's first duty is to protect the people, not run their lives. -- Ronald Reagan _ From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of DCFluX Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 12:24 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band Take that crap up to 2.4 GHz with the rest of the garbage.
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band
It's wideband so it's not going to key up your repeater and CTCSS does not solve interference - it just masks it. Joe M. WA3GIN wrote: What? Just go and turn on your PL... come on! Lets use the technology that we claim we know so well... - Original Message - *From:* Brian Raker mailto:brian.ra...@gmail.com *To:* Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com mailto:Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com *Sent:* Wednesday, March 03, 2010 4:51 PM *Subject:* Re: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band So... is anyone gonna buy one of these things to see just what kind of interference it will actually make in the 70cm band? 1 watt max and .25 watt nominal is enough to key up a poorly tuned and set up nearby repeater or a distant sensitively configured repeater, and enough to produce decent QRM on existing nearby voice and data communications especially as it is using an analog video and operational control system. -Brian / KF4ZWZ On Wed, Mar 3, 2010 at 1:10 PM, Richard gbis-reply-...@gbis.com mailto:gbis-reply-...@gbis.com wrote: Since they'd be competing with high powered repeaters and government radars, I thought 2.4 gig would have been a better choice than 70cm, but that's just me... Richard www.n7tgb.net http://www.n7tgb.net/ Government's first duty is to protect the people, not run their lives. -- Ronald Reagan *From:* Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com mailto:Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com mailto:Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com] *On Behalf Of *DCFluX *Sent:* Wednesday, March 03, 2010 12:24 PM *To:* Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com mailto:Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com *Subject:* Re: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band Take that crap up to 2.4 GHz with the rest of the garbage.
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band
Except for the fact these users will be SECONDARY to US. Still, try telling your local PD they have to shut their robot down because they are causing interference... Joe M. Nate Duehr wrote: Amateur Radio is NOT PRIMARY on 70cm in the U.S.. Never have been. Never will be. We are SECONDARY ...and NTIA let's us behave like we're primary... most of the time. That's why we lost with previous military systems (ask folk near Camp Pendleton about that one), we lost with PAVE PAWS, and we'll probably lose on this one too. Nate WY0X Yahoo! Groups Links
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band
yes and we live just fine with all the noise on the band...we're not looking for clear channel...we're not running AM ;-) - Original Message - From: MCH To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 9:51 PM Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band It's wideband so it's not going to key up your repeater and CTCSS does not solve interference - it just masks it. Joe M. WA3GIN wrote: What? Just go and turn on your PL... come on! Lets use the technology that we claim we know so well... - Original Message - *From:* Brian Raker mailto:brian.ra...@gmail.com *To:* Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com mailto:Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com *Sent:* Wednesday, March 03, 2010 4:51 PM *Subject:* Re: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band So... is anyone gonna buy one of these things to see just what kind of interference it will actually make in the 70cm band? 1 watt max and .25 watt nominal is enough to key up a poorly tuned and set up nearby repeater or a distant sensitively configured repeater, and enough to produce decent QRM on existing nearby voice and data communications especially as it is using an analog video and operational control system. -Brian / KF4ZWZ On Wed, Mar 3, 2010 at 1:10 PM, Richard gbis-reply-...@gbis.com mailto:gbis-reply-...@gbis.com wrote: Since they'd be competing with high powered repeaters and government radars, I thought 2.4 gig would have been a better choice than 70cm, but that's just me... Richard www.n7tgb.net http://www.n7tgb.net/ Government's first duty is to protect the people, not run their lives. -- Ronald Reagan -- *From:* Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com mailto:Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com mailto:Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com] *On Behalf Of *DCFluX *Sent:* Wednesday, March 03, 2010 12:24 PM *To:* Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com mailto:Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com *Subject:* Re: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band Take that crap up to 2.4 GHz with the rest of the garbage.
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band
Since hams are the secondary users of these frequencies I don't see any alternative. But really how often do you think these things are going to used? We've gotten used to not having 70 cm here in Northern California because of Pave-Paws don't really miss it. Dave W6DES -Original Message- From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com]on Behalf Of Mark Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 3:25 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [Repeater-Builder] Fw: FCC RO Involving the Amateur 70cm Band I want to see what happens when the USAF complains of interference to the PAVE PAWS system, like they did with the 70cm repeater operators. After all, the coppers in the Bay Area (SF/Oakland) and New York have deep pockets and each will probably buy a few of these at several grand a piece - only to find out they cause interference to the Military. Sure, only 1W. Uh-huh. Can you say OOOPS?!?!?! I knew you could. I'll bet nobody has thought of that issue yet. Mark - N9WYS From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com On Behalf Of David Jordan Ah George, Don't worry! The first time the device fails to deliver the goods to the Public Safety guys, they'll stop using it. Good luck to them. They'll have fun running up against the 1,000watt erp of many 70cm repeaters. 73, Dave Wa3gin _ From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com On Behalf Of George Henry Re: the waiver request by ReconRobotics for 420 - 450 MHz operation. Hams get the shaft again... George, KA3HSW / WQGJ413
