Re: [SWCollect] Even marginally ethical?

[Marco Thorek]

Jim Leonard schrieb:
> 
> Stephane Racle wrote:
> > And it goes on every day in a number of industries. :-)
> 
> Yes, but that doesn't mean it has to go on in ours.  This mailing list
> has several prominent people of the software collecting movement as
> members, and I don't think it's a stretch to say that, if we all acted
> in unison, we could strongly influence the state of software collecting
> today.  

I agree. We'd be like, uh, Enron :-)

Marco

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Re: [SWCollect] B. McCoy

[BL]

http://www.playthings.com/index.asp?layout=article&webzine=playthings&publication=playthings&articleid=CA62242

Don't know if you would consider that verification, but it's from 2001.

Brad
- Original Message - 
From: "Lee K. Seitz" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Software Collecting" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, April 27, 2004 6:38 PM
Subject: [SWCollect] B. McCoy


> I'm looking to verify the identity of a man named Bing McCoy.  (I'll
> explain later, if you're interested.)  He claims to be a past partner
> of Jordan Weisman in a business named Cyber Forge, which created games,
> although I'm unsure exactly what kind.  He also created a PC game called
> Freefall, if I'm interpreting correctly.  Anyone heard of him?  Google
> searches are coming up with few details.  Thanks.
>
> -- 
> Lee K. Seitz
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> --
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[SWCollect] B. McCoy

[Lee K. Seitz]

I'm looking to verify the identity of a man named Bing McCoy.  (I'll
explain later, if you're interested.)  He claims to be a past partner
of Jordan Weisman in a business named Cyber Forge, which created games,
although I'm unsure exactly what kind.  He also created a PC game called
Freefall, if I'm interpreting correctly.  Anyone heard of him?  Google
searches are coming up with few details.  Thanks.

-- 
Lee K. Seitz
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

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Re: Re: [SWCollect] Even marginally ethical?

[ommail]

HEY--ONLY 1 SLAP-PER-PERCIEVED-IMPROPRIETY!

Dan, I understand what you're getting at--not the money aspect of it--just showing 
that a rare items sells will bring out the others who want to sell.

My personal belief is that this works thru patience, and advertising.  It happens 
eventually anyway (look at DRASH!), and will happen for ALL of the things we are 
hunting for.

By advertising, I mean that if you were to put an article or two on the web about the 
items that you desire, someone will eventually see it, and put it up for sale.

Joe
> 
> From: Jim Leonard <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Date: 2004/04/27 Tue PM 12:15:59 EDT
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re: [SWCollect] Even marginally ethical?
> 
> Stephane Racle wrote:
> > And it goes on every day in a number of industries. :-)
> 
> Yes, but that doesn't mean it has to go on in ours.  This mailing list 
> has several prominent people of the software collecting movement as 
> members, and I don't think it's a stretch to say that, if we all acted 
> in unison, we could strongly influence the state of software collecting 
> today.  So, (slaps Dan on the wrist again)
> 
> BTW, if it sounds like I'm mad or harboring something, I'm not.  I'm 
> just presenting one side of the debate.  Belive me, I have a lot of 
> software that goes for $5 today and would have gone for $40 4-5 years 
> ago... price fixing would help me earn some cash.  But I'm not willing 
> to trade my morals and ethics for it :)
> -- 
> Jim Leonard ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
> World's largest electronic gaming project:http://www.MobyGames.com/
> A delicious slice of the demoscene:http://www.MindCandyDVD.com/
> Various oldskool PC rants and ramblings:   http://www.oldskool.org/
> 
> 
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> 
> 


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Re: [SWCollect] Origin Museum email address

[ommail]

Hi Stuart!

Yes--I'm avoiding spam--my new email addresses are as follows:

treefortjoe-at-hotmail-dot-com=Ebay stuff
ommail-at-cox-dot-net=this forum
originmuseum-at-crius-dot-net=regular mail.

The spammers almost knocked me out of business--I believe that I only recently have 
resolved it.

Joe

> 
> From: "Feldhamer, Stuart" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Date: 2004/04/27 Tue AM 11:16:39 EDT
> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: [SWCollect] Origin Museum email address
> 
> Someone help me out with Joe's current email address. Joe, you should update the 
> address on your site, unless you're purposely doing it to avoid spam... BTW, A 
> search on google turned up this:
>  
> 
> 03-13-2004, 01:35 
> 
> 
> Unregistered 
> Guest
> Posts: n/a 
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
>   _  
> 
> I tried to e-mail that address earlier tonight to contact the site admins, and my 
> mail got returned with the following error:
> 
> retry time not reached for any host after a long failure period
> 
> If the site admin could contact me at   [EMAIL PROTECTED], 
> it would be appreciated. I have a question or two to ask.   
>  
>  
> Hope the HTML mail doesn't bother someone.
>  
> Stuart
> 
> 



Someone help me out 
with Joe's current email address. Joe, you should update the address on your 
site, unless you're purposely doing it to avoid spam... BTW, A search on google 
turned up this:
 


  
  

  03-13-2004, 01:35 

  

  


  
Unregistered 
Guest

Posts: n/a 


  [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  

  I tried to e-mail that address earlier tonight to contact the site 
  admins, and my mail got returned with the following error:retry 
  time not reached for any host after a long failure periodIf the 
  site admin could contact me at [EMAIL PROTECTED], it would be appreciated. I 
  have a question or two to ask. 
 
Hope the HTML mail 
doesn't bother someone.
 
Stuart

Re: [SWCollect] Even marginally ethical?

[Jim Leonard]

Stephane Racle wrote:
That is, a lot of white-collar criminals only get a "slap on the wrist".
Sad to say, that is true.  :-(
--
Jim Leonard ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
World's largest electronic gaming project:http://www.MobyGames.com/
A delicious slice of the demoscene:http://www.MindCandyDVD.com/
Various oldskool PC rants and ramblings:   http://www.oldskool.org/
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Re: [SWCollect] Even marginally ethical?

[Stephane Racle]

I didn't mean to imply that it should, and I'm with you on this. I just 
thought it was a funny juxtaposition of words:

"It's artificial price fixing.  (slaps Dan on wrist)"
That is, a lot of white-collar criminals only get a "slap on the wrist".
Stephane
Jim Leonard wrote:
Stephane Racle wrote:
And it goes on every day in a number of industries. :-)

Yes, but that doesn't mean it has to go on in ours.  This mailing list 
has several prominent people of the software collecting movement as 
members, and I don't think it's a stretch to say that, if we all acted 
in unison, we could strongly influence the state of software 
collecting today.  So, (slaps Dan on the wrist again)

BTW, if it sounds like I'm mad or harboring something, I'm not.  I'm 
just presenting one side of the debate.  Belive me, I have a lot of 
software that goes for $5 today and would have gone for $40 4-5 years 
ago... price fixing would help me earn some cash.  But I'm not willing 
to trade my morals and ethics for it :)

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Re: [SWCollect] Even marginally ethical?

[Jim Leonard]

Stephane Racle wrote:
And it goes on every day in a number of industries. :-)
Yes, but that doesn't mean it has to go on in ours.  This mailing list 
has several prominent people of the software collecting movement as 
members, and I don't think it's a stretch to say that, if we all acted 
in unison, we could strongly influence the state of software collecting 
today.  So, (slaps Dan on the wrist again)

BTW, if it sounds like I'm mad or harboring something, I'm not.  I'm 
just presenting one side of the debate.  Belive me, I have a lot of 
software that goes for $5 today and would have gone for $40 4-5 years 
ago... price fixing would help me earn some cash.  But I'm not willing 
to trade my morals and ethics for it :)
--
Jim Leonard ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
World's largest electronic gaming project:http://www.MobyGames.com/
A delicious slice of the demoscene:http://www.MindCandyDVD.com/
Various oldskool PC rants and ramblings:   http://www.oldskool.org/

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Re: [SWCollect] Even marginally ethical?

[Stephane Racle]

And it goes on every day in a number of industries. :-)
Jim Leonard wrote:
Dan Chisarick wrote:
Not quite.  The idea is that no outsider bids on the item.

Doesn't matter -- it's still deception to raise the price of an item. 
Just because *that one auction* doesn't sell at the higher price 
doesn't mean that others won't.  It's artificial price fixing.  (slaps 
Dan on wrist)

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Re: [SWCollect] Even marginally ethical?

[Jim Leonard]

Dan Chisarick wrote:
Not quite.  The idea is that no outsider bids on the item.
Doesn't matter -- it's still deception to raise the price of an item. 
Just because *that one auction* doesn't sell at the higher price doesn't 
mean that others won't.  It's artificial price fixing.  (slaps Dan on wrist)
--
Jim Leonard ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
World's largest electronic gaming project:http://www.MobyGames.com/
A delicious slice of the demoscene:http://www.MindCandyDVD.com/
Various oldskool PC rants and ramblings:   http://www.oldskool.org/

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Re: [SWCollect] Origin Museum email address

[C.E. Forman]

[EMAIL PROTECTED]

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Feldhamer, Stuart 
  To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  Sent: Tuesday, April 27, 2004 10:16 
  AM
  Subject: [SWCollect] Origin Museum email 
  address
  
  Someone help me 
  out with Joe's current email address. Joe, you should update the address on 
  your site, unless you're purposely doing it to avoid spam... BTW, A search on 
  google turned up this:
   
  
  


  
03-13-2004, 01:35 
  

  

  
  

  Unregistered 
  Guest
  
  Posts: n/a 
  
  
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 



I tried to e-mail that address earlier tonight to contact the site 
admins, and my mail got returned with the following error:retry 
time not reached for any host after a long failure periodIf the 
site admin could contact me at [EMAIL PROTECTED], it would be appreciated. I 
have a question or two to ask. 
   
  Hope the HTML mail 
  doesn't bother someone.
   
  Stuart

[SWCollect] Origin Museum email address

[Feldhamer, Stuart]

Someone help me out 
with Joe's current email address. Joe, you should update the address on your 
site, unless you're purposely doing it to avoid spam... BTW, A search on google 
turned up this:
 


  
  

  03-13-2004, 01:35 

  

  


  
Unregistered 
Guest

Posts: n/a 


  [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  

  I tried to e-mail that address earlier tonight to contact the site 
  admins, and my mail got returned with the following error:retry 
  time not reached for any host after a long failure periodIf the 
  site admin could contact me at [EMAIL PROTECTED], it would be appreciated. I 
  have a question or two to ask. 
 
Hope the HTML mail 
doesn't bother someone.
 
Stuart

Re: [SWCollect] Even marginally ethical?

[C.E. Forman]

> Despite the amount of thought I put into it, I do not plan (nor do I
> advocate) doing this.  Bad idea.  Very wrong.  Don't do it.

I have to agree.  Pretending to sell something you don't actually have is
dishonest, regardless of whether you take any money for it in the end.  If
anyone got word of it, it could sow a lot of distrust in our community.
(Eyal Katz and that T-shirt asshole have done far too much damage already.)

> Now something that would be more on the level is an "ebay want list"
> where people list items they're interested in and how much they're
> willing to pay.

The problems with these are (1) eBay will can "wanted" auctions if they see
them, and (2) morons who don't read the listings will bid on it thinking
it's an actual item for sale, meaning final value fees and possible negative
feedback when they realize you don't have it.

> It just seems that the game collecting sites that have
> 'want lists' don't really seem that effective.

I assume YOIS's waiting list falls into this category?  The problem is that
most people who run collecting sites are themselves collectors, so if they
find something good, they're going to keep a personal copy before they start
offerring it to others who've asked for it.  And because of the nature of
rare items, spare copies are very few and far-between.  So you get lots of
entries but most of them never get filled.  Unfortunately, once you've
started up a list in your early days, if you just drop everyone who's
already signed up on it, you get those people upset at you because you sold
to someone else when they had asked first.  That's where I am right now.

On the other hand, I usually have somebody write me once every few weeks
with something they have that's on my own personal want-list (the great big
huge monstrosity that has its own page).  So people do seem to notice.


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Re: [SWCollect] Even marginally ethical?

[Dan Chisarick]

Not quite.  The idea is that no outsider bids on the item.  The goal is 
to get people who have these items to list them when they see the 
(bogus) selling price, not bilk a poor collector (or wealthy one as the 
case may be).  No one actually pays the 'winning' amount.  The only 
safe way (not shafting someone) I can think of doing this is to list 
something with a high "buy it now" and immediately (before the listing 
hits the searches) have an insider bid on it.  Then again, this does 
raise the perceived value of an item, having the same effect as 
shilling, so I see your point.  Tomas had a similar point.  I'll change 
my ID to 'SN4KE_01L' :)

Despite the amount of thought I put into it, I do not plan (nor do I 
advocate) doing this.  Bad idea.  Very wrong.  Don't do it.

Now something that would be more on the level is an "ebay want list" 
where people list items they're interested in and how much they're 
willing to pay.  It just seems that the game collecting sites that have 
'want lists' don't really seem that effective.  Flashing dollar signs 
seem to be more productive in getting people's attention.  Besides, I'd 
gather that a fair percentage of people who list classic games don't 
know enough to hit game collector sites, but they do know ebay.

On Apr 27, 2004, at 2:56 AM, Jim Leonard wrote:
Dan Chisarick wrote:
Evil?  Immoral?  Risky?
All of the above.  It's called "shilling" on ebay, and gets you 
booted'n'banned.  Not in favor of it.  :)
--
Jim Leonard ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
http://www.oldskool.org/
Want to help an ambitious games project? 
http://www.mobygames.com/
Or check out some trippy MindCandy at 
http://www.mindcandydvd.com/

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