Re: [Talk-GB] I have a philosophical question...

[Miguel Sevilla-Callejo]

I like your reply Gareth!

>From my point of view it's wrong trying to compare OSM to Google Maps or
other centralized mapping projects because we, OSM Contributors, a huge
variety of people, have different interests. I use to compare the way we
contribute in OSM as the way free software developers do to improve some
programs and, following this idea, I recommend to have a view to the E.S
Raymond's essay: "The Cathedral and the Bazaar" [1] . We are the bazaar in
the mapping realm!

Cheers

Miguel

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Cathedral_and_the_Bazaar

--
*Miguel Sevilla-Callejo*
Doctor in Geography
- Research Assistance at the Pyrenean Institute of Ecology - Spanish
National Research Council
- Associate Lecturer at Dpto. of Geography & Territorial Planning at
University of Zaragoza (Spain)
- Collaborative Mapping / Mapeado Colaborativo / Geoinquietos group
co-coordinator (Zaragoza, Spain)
- Freelance consultant & researcher - Member #698, Spanish Professional
Association of Geographers


On Mon, 14 Jan 2019 at 00:55, Gareth L  wrote:

> It’s easy to forget that OSM is a geographically referenced database of
> objects. That just happens to be rendered as a map. If you want to know how
> many post boxes have the George the 5th cypher, you can query the
> database to find out. If you want to limit that by geographic bounds (say,
> a city’s limits) then great, you can do that.
>
>
>
> Google maps things to keep people in their ecosystem and find more out
> about where people want to go. They care most about points of interest so
> they can advertise accordingly, or suggest to those points of
> interest/businesses that they may want to pay google money so they get seen
> better than they would do normally. It’s why cities have streetview data
> barely a year old, but country roads are 7 years out of date. There’s
> little money in covering it.
>
>
>
> Roads/lane markings are getting a lot of attention because of assistive
> driving system development causing a shedload of money being pumped into
> that area of interest.
>
>
>
> I like adding to OSM as a pedestrian. It’s annoying to walk a circuitous
> route to a shop only to find there’s an alleyway that will take you there
> in 10% of the time.
>
>
>
> The freely available database allows interesting data to be presented with
> low barrier to entry. As academia finds, it’s annoying to have to pay to
> view a journal behind a paywall, when you dunno if it even has the info you
> want.
>
>
>
> A couple weaknesses for the main OSM ‘map’ I’ve found:
>
> Transport routes (particularly buses) change too frequently and would be
> better as a separate service that is overlaid onto an OSM derived map.
>
>
>
> All the different features that people have as priorities to add are
> valid, but it’s sometimes tricky to figure out the best order to add them
> in. Why add all the stiles and gates to a field before you have the
> footpaths added? Or adding bins and benches by roads before defining what
> kind of pavement/sidewalk it has.*
>
>
>
> A couple Strengths of OSM:
>
>
>
> Updates are fast. Google/bing are less fast at updating areas, and
> especially so if in a quiet region. OS only publish a new paper map when
> the old one has gone out of print, meaning the Leicestershire map is more
> out of date than the more popular peak district ones.
>
>
>
> If you want more info available on xyz feature.. you can add it, and
> encourage others to do so also.
>
>
>
>
>
> So, back to the philosophical question: I’d say it’s all important.
> However, the order that things are best added to the map could be helpful
> to know. Not in a tollgate “don’t add z until qrstuvwxy has been added
> first” way, but knowing what additional information is enabled to be added
> as a result of you adding a certain feature.
>
>
>
> *sidewalks are such a nightmare in general in osm with no easy approach on
> how to best add them, it seems.
>
>
>
> Not an easy question!
>
> Gareth
>
>
>
> *From: *BD 
> *Sent: *13 January 2019 23:10
> *To: *talk-gb@openstreetmap.org
> *Subject: *[Talk-GB] I have a philosophical question...
>
>
>
> Hi All,
>
>
>
> I do make my little contribution to the effort of OSM. Recently I added
> some data to Mapillary and consider adding more (for the use of other
> mappers).
>
>
>
> After reading someone's OSM profile I started to think and now have some
> doubts... We (mappers) are concentrating on various areas of the map. Some
> are dedicated to buildings, some to geographical features others add
> businesses etc. Can someone explain what is the aim of OSM, are we trying
> to build a map better than Bing and Googl

Re: [Talk-GB] Hi everyone

[Miguel Sevilla-Callejo]

Hello,

In Spanish comunnity when someone ask about a forum I recommend to check
the mailing list via nabble.com.

Here you can check talk-gb list:
http://gis.19327.n8.nabble.com/Great-Britain-f5372682.html

There you can search for topics too, reply messages or even have a RSS url
tu subscribe with your favorite feeder reader.

Cheers

--
*Miguel Sevilla-Callejo*
Doctor en Geografía


On Sun, 4 Nov 2018 at 11:44, Andy Townsend  wrote:

> On 04/11/2018 08:53, Jez Nicholson wrote:
> >
> > Finally, I don't know who checks chnagesets. Can someone enlighten us
> > please?
> >
>
> I don't know anyone in GB who explicitly checks the
> "review_requested=yes" changeset tag, though it is available in QA tools
> such as OSMCha that can search those.  I think people (in GB) are more
> likely to look for "new mappers near them" either by noticing new edits
> locally or via some other means (for example, a bot posts "first edits"
> to the #osm-gb IRC channel).
>
> Best Regards,
>
> Andy
>
>
>
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Re: [Talk-GB] Edits in Wales

[Miguel Sevilla-Callejo]

Hello,

As a foreigner and someone arriving to a place where people are using both
languages (my experience is living for almost 2 years in Aberystwyth, North
Wales) I'm still thinking you should use both names for "name" tag as you
can see on official maps (not only OS maps) or signs. I'm thinking in
street names not in place names, where you could have more idea if Welsh or
English name is common.

Sorry to insist but you will undermine, especially, Welsh names, for a
generic rendering that uses "name" tags. Think about that.

Of course, for me, it's a must to fill "name:cy" and "name:en" too.

Moreover, there is nothing except an aesthetic problem, to use the "mix"
approach for "name". What's the point to not use same approach used in
other multilingual places of the World?

May be we could discuss that in the generic/global Talk mail list to know
other opinions.

Cheers

Miguel

--
*Miguel Sevilla-Callejo*
Doctor en Geografía

On 25 March 2018 at 20:30, Curon Davies <cur...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi Ben,
>
> A general response to your points:
>
>>
>>- There is no single name for many places. In Wales most places have
>>a name that they are called when communicating in English and a name that
>>they are called when communicating in Welsh. In neither language are both
>>names used.
>>
>>  Informally some English names are used in Welsh, but vice versa is less
> likely.
>
>>
>>- So the most important thing is that we label them with the English
>>and Welsh name tags
>>
>>
>>- What then should we include in the "name" tag? Including both
>>alternates seems, at first sight, like an attractive solution.
>>
>> It should be noted that both OS and Harvey maps generally include both
> names, it would be nice if the default OSM renderer reflected this.
>
>
>>
>>- But what about the city of Henffordd or the town of Amwythig? They
>>have Welsh names and English names so the logic would be to use both in 
>> the
>>name tag. Except Hereford - Henffordd and Shrewsbury - Amwythig are in
>>England and, I suspect, there would not be support to use bilingual names
>>in OSM outside of the current boundary of Wales. I don't challenge that 
>> but
>>I'd see it as a political judgement about the boundaries of Wales and the
>>status of the Welsh language within the United Kingdom rather than a
>>mapping decision.
>>
>> The two examples mentioned are in English only on an OS maps, but
> Oswestry (Croesoswallt) is named in both English and Welsh, despite being
> over the border.
>
>>
>>- In the UK generally "name" refers to the name by which it is known
>>when communicating in English. It seems most straightforward, and least
>>politically fraught, to me to continue this practice in Wales,.
>>
>> OS maps including both, although arguably this is a rendering problem.
> Why shouldn't OSM reflect this?
>
>>
>>- The fundamental problem is that there is no "name" which is
>>correct. In the medium term, as long as the name:cy and name:en are 
>> correct
>>then the value of "name" should become less significant. Then it can be up
>>to the user to decide if they want to display English, Welsh or both (and
>>if both which language taking priority).
>>
>> The problem currently, is that display choice isn't available.
>
> Regards
> Curon
>
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Re: [Talk-GB] Edits in Wales

[Miguel Sevilla-Callejo]

Great initiative! Congratulations Ben,

I'm sure you have more knowledge than me about the use of Welsh but I'd
considerate an other the option for your propose for the generic "name"
tag: the bilingual one.

So, as I suggested last summer [1], and it was in the previous edition of
the wiki, I'd use, for some situations (e.g. Aberytwyth street names) both
languages in "name" tag with a "/" as separation following the indications
and panels you could see in the field [2]. I guess It is a neutral an a
real bilingual approach for a non English or Welsh render of OSM maps.

What do you expect if I'm editing OSM in the ground and I see a bilingual
panels to fill for the name tag? Well, I did what I saw: a bilingual name
as you could see in other bilingual places of the World like Basque Country
[3].

Cheers

Miguel

[1] follow this threat from the beginning:
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-gb/2017-August/020465.html
[2] https://www.mapillary.com/map/im/j1ngoo9wTxbfXfnMdcEGVA
[3] https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Multilingual_names#Spain

--
*Miguel Sevilla-Callejo*
Doctor en Geografía

On 23 March 2018 at 17:04, Ben Proctor <b...@satorilab.org> wrote:

> Hi all
>
> I was lurking on this list when the original discussion started and it was
> in my head when someone approached me about running a mapping project in
> Wales. We've been using a little Welsh Government funding to support a
> Welsh Language render of osm (currently just covering Wales)
> https://openstreetmap.cymru . We've also been raising the profile of osm
> in Wales, particularly in Welsh speaking communities. We hope to continue
> this work over the coming months and grow a stronger osm community in
> Wales. Here are the blogs about the project in English
> http://cardiff.theodi.org/tag/mapiocymru/ and in Welsh
> http://cardiff.theodi.org/cy/tag/mapiocymru/
>
> We've been discussing the issue of multi-language tagging as part of this
> project and we would like to propose an update to the Welsh language
> section of the Wiki https://wiki.openstreetmap.
> org/wiki/Multilingual_names#Wales
>
> I'd appreciate any comment and thoughts.
>
> Cheers
>
> Ben
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *Wales is a bilingual country and many place names have both English and
> Welsh versions. When communicating in English some places are known by
> their Welsh name and some by their English name. When communicating in
> Welsh all places are know by their Welsh name. Bilingual names (English and
> Welsh versions) are not used in Wales. *
>
> *In general the name tag should contain the name generally used when
> communicating in English. In some cases this will be the Welsh name. If in
> doubt look for local usage / signage.*
>
>
>
> *Where possible please add a name:cy which is the name in Welsh for the
> place. Please add this tag even if the name tag uses the name in Welsh.It
> may also be helpful to add a name:en, especially if the name tag uses the
> name in Welsh.*
>
> *Examples:*
> *name - Swansea*
> *name:cy - Abertawe*
>
> *name - Caernarfon*
> *name:cy - Caernarfon*
>
> *name - Heol Eglyws*
> *name:cy - Heol Eglyws*
> *name:en - Church Road*
>
>
>
> On 16 August 2017 at 14:10, Adam Snape <adam.c.sn...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> The 'best mapping method' is somewhat subjective. If it were the sole
>> criteria, then we would instantly create documentation to replace lots of
>> the less than ideal tags which have developed and explicitly depreciate
>> either the classic (highway=footway/bridleway/cycleway) or 'alternative'
>> (highway= path, access=*) tagging schemes. We don't because there is no
>> consensus and existing use counts for a lot.
>>
>> If there is genuine consensus upon a better way then perhaps this should
>> be documented. In the absence of such consensus, documenting how we
>> actually currently map is preferable (because it is already prevalent and
>> verifiable) to not documentating or documenting one school of thought on
>> how we ought to map (but don't yet).
>>
>> Adam
>>
>> On 16 August 2017 at 11:20, Dave F <davefoxfa...@btinternet.com> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> On 16/08/2017 00:22, Warin wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 16-Aug-17 05:27 AM, Philip Barnes wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>   The wiki is after all intended to document how people map not
>>>>> dictate how they should map.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I would think that the wiki should guide to the best mapping method,
>>>> not what people have done in the past (as found using taginfo for 
>>>> example!).
>>>>
>>>
>>> +1
>>>

Re: [Talk-gb-westmidlands] [Talk-GB] "Secret" nuclear bunkers under London and Birmingham

[Miguel Sevilla-Callejo]

It depends on the license of the data and if it's a trusted source (if data
is reliable).

--
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El 17/12/2017 13:33, "Andy Mabbett" <a...@pigsonthewing.org.uk> escribió:

> We all know, I expect, about the Anchor Exchange[1] in Birmingham, and
> the Kingsway Exchange[2], in London, but this blog post[3] has maps
> and geo-data (Land Registry INDEX Inspire polygons) for both, that
> I've not seen before.
>
> [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anchor_telephone_exchange
>
> [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kingsway_telephone_exchange
>
> [3] https://whoownsengland.org/2017/12/15/how-land-registry-
> data-reveals-londons-secret-tunnels/
>
> Can we import the data?
>
> --
> Andy Mabbett
> @pigsonthewing
> http://pigsonthewing.org.uk
>
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Re: [Talk-GB] Welsh language map

[Miguel Sevilla-Callejo]

Very good news!

I was "fighting" last summer about the use of Welsh in OSM, here [0], here
[1] and here [2]

You could have a look in to the wiki [3] too

Have luck!

[0] https://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/50943658

[1a] https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-gb/2017-July/020416.html
[1b]
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-gb/2017-August/020465.html

[2] https://twitter.com/msevilla00/status/895940842321567744

[3] https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Multilingual_names#Wales

--
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Doctor en Geografía

On 15 November 2017 at 15:55, Ben Proctor <b...@satorilab.org> wrote:

>
>
> On 15 November 2017 at 14:38, SK53 <sk53@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Hi Ben,
>>
>> Good to hear.
>>
>> I actually have a version of Carto-CSS which displays welsh names when
>> present. It merely replaces all instances of name in the Carto-CSS queries
>> with a more complicated bit of SQL. For complicated logistical reasons I
>> haven't uploaded this to github, but can put aside some time to do so now.
>> The style also has blue motorways!
>>
>
> Hi Jerry
>
>
>
> That's excellent. Especially the motorways :-)
>
>
>>
>> Less successfully I have been trying to create a welsh name transparent
>> overlay. This would be useful for places like Leicester Liverpool and
>> London which have Welsh names but are outside the principality. A full set
>> of tiles covering the UK for a handful of names is overkill. Apart from
>> styling issues (finding colours and offsets which are legible with the main
>> carto style), the biggest issue is names of areas which are multi-line and
>> of variable size, and therefore more or less impossible to offset so that
>> both the Welsh name & the name on the Carto style are visible.
>>
>
> There are a number of things we'd like to get into once we've done this
> bit:
> - the idea of creating a Welsh language Atlas of the UK and the world is
> very attractive (but definitely a phase 2 development)
> - the discussion about how to handle English and Welsh side by side is
> something to work through. Though there is a use case for a Welsh language
> only render there are also use cases for Bilingual renders. (phase 2 again)
> a transparent overlay sounds like a very interesting angle...
>
>
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Jerry
>>
>> On 15 November 2017 at 13:31, Ben Proctor <b...@satorilab.org> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi all
>>>
>>> The Welsh Government announced yesterday a grant to ODI-Cardiff to fund
>>> some work around the Welsh language on OSM.
>>>
>>> This is our announcement
>>>
>>> In English http://cardiff.theodi.org/2017/11/14/map-i-gymru/
>>> and in Welsh http://cardiff.theodi.org/cy/2017/11/14/map-i-gymru/
>>>
>>> In the way of these things, the funding application was put together at
>>> the last minute and, though we heard a couple of weeks ago that we would be
>>> getting the grant we couldn't talk about it publicly until yesterday.
>>>
>>> We hope to:
>>> - create a Welsh language tileserver (building on the excellent cysom
>>> project)
>>> - do some work to encourage tagging in the Welsh language and to
>>> encourage more mapping in Wales
>>> - encourage organisations in Wales (including the public sector) to make
>>> more use of OSM including by demonstrating one or two simple Welsh
>>> language uses
>>>
>>> The funding covers a project until end of March and we will also be
>>> looking for opportunities for ongoing funding/support to keep the server
>>> infrastructure viable into the medium term.
>>>
>>> We have contacted a few people off list to talk about this project but
>>> I'm conscious that there are people who have been very actively mapping in
>>> Wales for some time who we haven't had the chance to contact.
>>>
>>> We really hope to work with the whole community on this. Any
>>> suggestions, insights, ideas, "definitely don't do this..." experiences etc
>>> would be very gratefully received.
>>>
>>> Cheers
>>>
>>> --
>>> Ben Proctor
>>> ODI-Cardiff / The Satori Lab
>>>
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>>>
>>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Ben Proctor
> Technical Director
> b...@satorilab.org | @likeaword | 07904 1234 98
> *The Satori Lab*, 22 Windsor Place Cardiff. CF10 3BY Wales, UK
>
>
> The Satori Lab Ltd is a company registered in Wales.
> Registered number: 8857719.
> Registered office: 22 Windsor Place, Cardiff, CF10 3BY
>
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Re: [Talk-GB] Fwd: Re: Edits in Wales

[Miguel Sevilla-Callejo]

El 14/8/2017 14:42, "Andy Townsend"  escribió:

Hi Miguel,

A question.  Many places in Wales are predominantly Welsh- or predominantly
English-speaking.  For somewhere like https://www.openstreetmap.org/
node/3378387351 , if "name" was a compound of both the Welsh and English
names rather than the more frequently / locally used version, how would I
know what the preferred name actually was?


Of course there could be places as nodes it could have an English or Welsh
name as their more common one. A survey is needed for that.

Anyway an neutral approach is right from my point of view and I was talking
mainly about street names.


Currently the answer is easy - look at the "name" tag.  If "name" is
instead a compound, how do you suggest a map consumer - or someone just
looking at a map - should do that?


Yes


There are several places in the World like some regions in Spain, as I said
before, where we use this approach.

I guess some of you don't like only for eastetic problem and I'm afraid
some could think Welsh is a minor or not serious language (even within the
BBC in London some think so...)

Anyway there is no reason to have the most frequently situation I found:
name=English; name:cy=Welsh_name. In this situation Welsh is been relegated
to a second place. Then, at least we have to add a "name:en" and later
let's think what to do with "name" tag. It's cristal clear for me.

No more comments about the arbitrary and unilateral change in the wiki.
It's amazing! I'm telling that in Spanish community and they couldn't
believe.

Saludos

Miguel


Best Regards,

Andy



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Re: [Talk-GB] Edits in Wales

[Miguel Sevilla-Callejo]

I do not agree your change of the Wiki. You should ask before to do it.

At least you could add a link to this thread or something like "this issue
is under discussion".

Cheers

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El 14/8/2017 14:30, "Richard Fairhurst" <rich...@systemed.net> escribió:

> I've fixed the wiki to reflect Chris's comments, given that he's a resident
> of Wales and has a long pedigree in creating the Welsh-language rendering
> so
> is better qualified than the rest of us to pronounce on this.[1] The much
> shorter text should hopefully also be easier for new mappers to follow.
>
>
> Marc Gemis wrote:
> > my conclusion: please do not map in the UK.
>
> Absolutely not - everyone is and should be welcome. But it's generally good
> practice in OSM, whatever the country, to "be liberal in what you add,
> conservative in what you change". If you find yourself changing vast
> swathes
> of existing data, you should generally ask yourself why it was as it was.
> Sometimes there's a good reason, but that reason is usually TIGER!
>
> Richard
>
> [1] though I'm not going to completely absent myself from this given that I
> partly have a degree in this stuff, as part of which I was fortunate enough
> to be taught by people who know more about Brittonic placenames than pretty
> much anyone ;)
>
>
>
> --
> View this message in context: http://gis.19327.n8.nabble.
> com/Edits-in-Wales-tp5899896p5900648.html
> Sent from the Great Britain mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>
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[Talk-GB] Fwd: Re: Edits in Wales

[Miguel Sevilla-Callejo]

Ops, I see I reply these other two emails privately.

Despite the miss interpretation I guess it's useful to show my point of
view.

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-- Mensaje reenviado --
De: "Miguel Sevilla-Callejo" <msevill...@gmail.com>
Fecha: 14/8/2017 10:45
Asunto: Re: [Talk-GB] Edits in Wales
Para: "Marc Gemis" <marc.ge...@gmail.com>
Cc:

Thank you for the clarification.
I didn't understand, LOL
Well, I could reply one by one which is Ok ;-)
Thanks

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El 14/8/2017 10:37, "Marc Gemis" <marc.ge...@gmail.com> escribió:

> >
> > my conclusion: please do not map in the UK.
> >
>
> Sorry for not being more clear: this is not my advice. This what I
> feel this thread is passing as a message.
> it should be much easier to add /update any feature without having to
> consult the community to find out the hidden rules.
>
> regards
>
> m.
>
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[Talk-GB] Fwd: Re: Edits in Wales

[Miguel Sevilla-Callejo]

I'm forwarding an email I sent only to Andy  by mistake yesterday.

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-- Mensaje reenviado --
De: "Andy Townsend" <ajt1...@gmail.com>
Fecha: 13/8/2017 19:04
Asunto: Re: [Talk-GB] Edits in Wales
Para: <talk-gb@openstreetmap.org>
Cc:

On 11/08/2017 17:19, Brian Prangle wrote:
>
> ...  and goes to the first source of what is seen to be the authoritative
> source - the wiki- to seek guidance,
>
>
> Unfortunately, the wiki isn't always "the authoritative source".  Articles
> written there include both "descriptive" and "prescriptive" ones - saying
> how mappers currently map things, and telling them how they _should_ map
> things.  When it comes to "how to map things" often there needs to be a
> discussion, because no one person has the whole picture.  Sometimes people
> writing wiki articles take great care to represent the different views
> where they exist and try and thread a consensus course through them (Harry
> Wood please take a bow at this point); and sometimes they don't.
>
> For example, https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Sidewalks says that "The
> simplest method is to tag the associated highway with sidewalk
> <https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:sidewalk>=both/left/right/no
> (none is sometimes used, but no is preferred
> <https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:sidewalk>)", despite
> https://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/keys/sidewalk#values showing that
> "none" is the more popular value.  I tried to make the wiki reflect usage
> but it was immediately changed back because "The statement never
> described predominant usage, but preferred usage. That hasn't changed.".
> Clearly someone thinks that _they_ know better than me and the majority of
> sidewalk mappers in OSM.  Rather than "insisting" it is correct as per
> https://www.xkcd.com/386/ I decided that life was too short.  I suspect
> that something rather similar has happened with regard to language tagging
> in Wales.
>
> and then asks, from etiquette, what the local community thinks,
>
>
> To be fair, from reading the emails it doesn't read to me like that was
> what was happening; it reads very much like he was telling everyone that
> disagreed with him that they were wrong without offering any reasoning
> beyond "the wiki says...".
>
> Unfortunately every multiple-language situation is complicated (and with a
> DWG hat on I've been involved in quite a few).  Some communities (Belgium
> being a notable early example) have settled on a compound "name" that
> doesn't reflect any language name on the ground but is intended to indicate
> that both have equal value; some - possibly the majority, but not by much -
> go with name as the "most used value" - so "Eteläinen Rautatiekatu" rather
> than the rather large mouthful "Eteläinen Rautatiekatu / Södra
> Järnvägsgatan"* for the street in Helsinki that I used to stay when working
> there, despite all street signs being bilingual.  Some have gone for
> locally-relevant variations of both.  However it's always the wishes of the
> local mappers that should hold most sway (and, again from personal
> experience with a DWG hat on, that can get difficult when one community is
> under-represented in OSM).
>
> *Can this discussion  specifically address what is wrong with the wiki
> page on Welsh placenames
> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Multilingual_names#Wales
> <https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Multilingual_names#Wales> and suggest
> improvements?*
>
>
> I'd start by asking some more Welsh mappers!  So far we've had the person
> who created the original cyosm map arguing against a compound name, along
> with a number of (very) frequent visitors from England.  Other than the
> person who raised the issue we've not yet had much of a balancing
> population on the other side of the argument; but not everyone follows
> changeset discussion comments or this list.  When the status of Western
> Sahara was raised with the DWG I went through a fairly long process which
> started at https://forum.openstreetmap.org/viewtopic.php?pid=602864#
> p602864 to ensure that everyone's views could be taken on board and to
> make sure that no-one was missed - I made sure that ever mapper in the
> region who'd recently mapped affected objects had a comment in a changeset
> discussion (and if no reply a direct message) in what appeared to be their
> usual language.  Contacting _every_ mapper who's mapped in Wales is
> unlikely to be feasible but contacting a subset of regular mappers (perhaps
> based edit count > a certain value) and based on some sort of "

Re: [Talk-GB] Edits in Wales

[Miguel Sevilla-Callejo]

On 10 August 2017 at 15:11, Lester Caine <les...@lsces.co.uk> wrote:

> On 10/08/17 14:32, Miguel Sevilla-Callejo wrote:
> > Please, came to Wales and have a look of the bilingual situation within
> > your country.
> My origins are the Isle of Man and Manx is an even less used language
> than Welsh but is being added back to signs! I'm up in North Wales next
> week ... and make regular trips down the M50 and on into South Wales ...
>
>
Great, so you know...


> > You could have an idea of how it is going the language issue here
> > following the legal situation. Let's have a look of Welsh Language
> > (Wales) Measure 2011 (part 1):
> >
> > " [...] the treatment of the Welsh language no less favourably than the
> > English language;"
> >
> > I expect the same for my favourite spatial and free data base...
>
> The whole point is that political disputes arise world wise, so the
> simple rule is 'map what you see' ...


I'm agree with you. It's what I do.

Yes, fieldwork and local knowledge it is our best tool over other mapping
project.

with regards 'Queens Square' I see
> from Google that there MAY have been a bus terminus at some point in
> time, but that no longer exists? I would presume that the slip road in
> front of the town hall was the actual location, but that 'Queen's
> Square' consists off the green areas and possibly the forecourt of the
> town hall. THAT is not easy to decide by observation, but the Road tags
> do not need to be changed, just the footpaths and park area added and
> tagged ... local knowledge is required to interpret the signs ... at the
> very least the slip road needs adding on OSM.
>

I'll take more photos, will upload to Mapillary and I'll try to fix the
area.

By the way, do you know better imagery over this area? Satellite ones are
no so good.

I'm looking for more local collaborators in the time I'm visiting the
University... Let's see.

Bests

Miguel


>
> --
> Lester Caine - G8HFL
> -
> Contact - http://lsces.co.uk/wiki/?page=contact
> L.S.Caine Electronic Services - http://lsces.co.uk
> EnquirySolve - http://enquirysolve.com/
> Model Engineers Digital Workshop - http://medw.co.uk
> Rainbow Digital Media - http://rainbowdigitalmedia.co.uk
>
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Re: [Talk-GB] Edits in Wales

[Miguel Sevilla-Callejo]

On 10 August 2017 at 13:18, Lester Caine <les...@lsces.co.uk> wrote:

> On 10/08/17 11:15, Miguel Sevilla-Callejo wrote:
> > Hi Lester,
>
> God I hate replying to top posters :(
>

[I do not really understand]

Hello to all of you (British OSM Community?)


> > Have you read the Wiki [1]? Have you see street sing pictures [2][3]?
> That wiki page does not ACTUALLY say 'only map what is visible'
> The tag covering the sign for Queen's Square should have ...
> name=MAES Y FRENHINES QUEEN'S SQ.
>

> > I'm improving the DATA adding a neutral and appropriate "name" tag as
> > well as the "name:en" and "name:cy" tags.
> And I would tag those as
> name:cy=Maes Y Frenhines
> name:en=Queen's Square
>
>
Great! I've just see there is a need to correct this place. No Square is
placed there... I will.

Let's see Stryd Portland / Portland Street
https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/16281189
https://www.mapillary.com/map/im/j1ngoo9wTxbfXfnMdcEGVA
What's wrong there? There is a name, name:en and name:cy tags in an
appropriate way. Two weeks ago it was no name:en or neutral name tags. It
is improving the DATA from my point of view.


> Other translations would probably be based off the English version as I
> don't think there are many other Welsh to xxx dictionaries? So expanding
> the 'SQ.' element is important.
>
>
No comments. I did... sure.


> The problem is that while I search for Queen's Sq Aberystwyth it is
> being found as Queens' Road
> http://www.openstreetmap.org/search?query=Queen%27s%20Sq%
> 20Aberystwyth#map=18/52.41657/-4.08115
> so local knowledge is needed to explain the signage ...
>

This place is still not edited... as I said. Someone mixed with Queen's
Road... I'll check later.


>
> > I guess that the wiki says is the way to do it, right?
> The wiki does not ACTUALLY say that is right - or wrong - which is the
> problem? Should the case used on the signs be followed, should shorthand
> be expanded to make searching easier.
>

As whatever OSMapper could expect I followed the wiki...


> > Here we are to argue if it is wrong of not but from my point of view
> > it's the right approach because it is the same as in other bilingual
> > places around the World: some places in Spain, Belgium, etc.
> Since it is widely accepted that the wiki is simply guidelines then as I
> said "This is still a bit of a woolly area".


"simply guidelines"? I understood it is our reference.


> What is still accepted is
> that the key structure is English and so the default when nothing is
> defined should be 'English' so putting the english element first can be
> argued as the 'correct' approach, and I would prefer that I can find
> 'Queen's Square' easily which is more difficult when 'name' element is
> randomly ordered.


I absolutely disagree with your English-centric point of view. There is a
huge World outside with people who speaks other languages witch must be
represented as such in the diversity/real OSM spatial database.

Are you pretending to promote English name over Welsh only because you
"prefer that"?


> Added to which other countries have their own wars on
> who's language is more important. So we ended up with all the extra keys
> under 'name' http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:name with the
> comment against 'name' being what I would consider a rule and the one I
> described ... except it misses the problem of case.
>
>
Please, came to Wales and have a look of the bilingual situation within
your country.

You could have an idea of how it is going the language issue here following
the legal situation. Let's have a look of Welsh Language (Wales) Measure
2011 (part 1):

" [...] the treatment of the Welsh language no less favourably than the
English language;"

I expect the same for my favourite spatial and free data base...

Regards

Miguel


> < trim out of place stuff and sig should never be quoted! >
>
> --
> Lester Caine - G8HFL
> -
> Contact - http://lsces.co.uk/wiki/?page=contact
> L.S.Caine Electronic Services - http://lsces.co.uk
> EnquirySolve - http://enquirysolve.com/
> Model Engineers Digital Workshop - http://medw.co.uk
> Rainbow Digital Media - http://rainbowdigitalmedia.co.uk
>
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>
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Re: [Talk-GB] Edits in Wales

[Miguel Sevilla-Callejo]

Hi Lester,

Have you read the Wiki [1]? Have you see street sing pictures [2][3]?

I'm improving the DATA adding a neutral and appropriate "name" tag as well
as the "name:en" and "name:cy" tags.

I guess that the wiki says is the way to do it, right?

Here we are to argue if it is wrong of not but from my point of view it's
the right approach because it is the same as in other bilingual places
around the World: some places in Spain, Belgium, etc.

Cheers

Miguel

[1] https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Multilingual_names#Wales
[2] https://www.mapillary.com/map/im/BVAjyV5Yt6hediIk7Lqv4w
[3] https://www.mapillary.com/map/im/j1ngoo9wTxbfXfnMdcEGVA

--
*Miguel Sevilla-Callejo*
Doctor en Geography / @msevilla00

On 10 August 2017 at 08:40, Lester Caine <les...@lsces.co.uk> wrote:

> On 09/08/17 23:40, Miguel Sevilla-Callejo wrote:
> > So I would like to translate here why I'm using a neutral approach for
> > the bilingual tagging in Wales: mainly because I'm following the wiki.
>
> This is still a bit of a woolly area, but name= should only contain the
> information that is actually DISPLAYED locally. So if the street sign
> has only welsh or only english that is what appears in 'name'. This may
> also result in different tags on the same object where signage has
> different spellings or ordering, but someone looking for 'Fford-y-Mor
> Terrace Road' will have a good chance of seeing that on a sign. If the
> signs only have 'Fford-y-Mor' then one knows not to look for 'Terrace
> Road' ... In countries where different alphabets are used reading the
> signs can be challenging ;)
>
> This is then supported by name:en and name:cy along with additional
> name:* translations where people feel the need to generate them.
> Rendering a 'translated' map is then a matter of selecting the available
> name elements in the right order with 'name' being the final fallback,
> but 'Terrace Road' may be preferable for some translations even when the
> displayed name is only 'Fford-y-Mor' ... It depends just what the DATA
> is actually being used for?
>
> Making the DATA easy to use is the key element here not any particular
> rendering approach, but this has been messed up somewhat with there not
> being a consistent way to handle the evolution of the data. Many parts
> of Wales have been 'improving' the prominence of Welsh so what was only
> displayed in English now has the official Welsh signage as well. Using
> 'old_name' may be a way to record some of the changes, but we do need a
> much better defined way of handling the large amount of historic name
> changes that are currently 'lost' in the change logs! OHM needs to be
> feed automatically with data that the general consensus deems not
> appropriate to retain in OSM and the evolution of things like names are
> simply part of that.
>
> --
> Lester Caine - G8HFL
> -
> Contact - http://lsces.co.uk/wiki/?page=contact
> L.S.Caine Electronic Services - http://lsces.co.uk
> EnquirySolve - http://enquirysolve.com/
> Model Engineers Digital Workshop - http://medw.co.uk
> Rainbow Digital Media - http://rainbowdigitalmedia.co.uk
>
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>
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Re: [Talk-GB] Edits in Wales

[Miguel Sevilla-Callejo]

Sorry, the link to the changeset is incomplete in my last email, here is
the correct one:
https://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/50943658
Cheers
M

--
*Miguel Sevilla-Callejo*
Doctor en Geografía

On 9 August 2017 at 23:40, Miguel Sevilla-Callejo <msevill...@gmail.com>
wrote:

> Hello again,
>
> I started to edit around and within Aberystwyth, Wales. Yesterday I did an
> edition to fix the bilingual labelling of some streets as I explained
> before in this thread but other user (Mike Baggaley) is asking to me to
> remove and change a neutral approach for labelling the streets [1].
>
> I understood that this list is the proper place to discuss and to start a
> consensus in the way to edit within the UK.
>
> So I would like to translate here why I'm using a neutral approach for the
> bilingual tagging in Wales: mainly because I'm following the wiki.
>
> I'll invite Mike Baggaley or whoever thinks I'm doing an inappropriate
> editions to consider joint this thread here and argue about.
>
> Just in case, next, I copy and paste my reply to Mike Baggaley in the
> changeset discussion where I explained mi position:
>
> "I disagree with you [to not use "Welsh name / English name" for "name"
> tag].
>
> If you please read the wiki you will read how to tag in multilingual
> situations.
>
> First, "name" tag could be use as you can see in street sings [1]. You can
> check on Mapillary how are labelled [2][3]
>
> Second, "Welsh name / English name" label for "name" tag is recommended
> for a neutral or bilingual version in Wales [4].
>
> Moreover, from the legal point of view, in Wales, in general, and in
> Ceredigion Council, in particular, Welsh is as important as English [5].
> Even Ordnance Survey has labelled some streets of Aberystwyth in both
> languages in their maps! [6]
>
> In conclusion, it is not necessary to change my editions because are
> appropriates."
>
> Bests
>
> Miguel
>
> [0] https://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/
> [1] https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:name
> [2] https://www.mapillary.com/map/im/BVAjyV5Yt6hediIk7Lqv4w
> [3] https://www.mapillary.com/map/im/j1ngoo9wTxbfXfnMdcEGVA
> [4] https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Multilingual_names#Wales "In the
> name field, a neutral or a bilingual version can be entered."
> [5] http://www.legislation.gov.uk/mwa/2011/1/contents
> [6] http://map.ceredigion.gov.uk/connect/?mapcfg=COMMUNITY_AND_LIVING
>
>
> --
> *Miguel Sevilla-Callejo*
> Doctor en Geografía
>
> On 27 July 2017 at 14:48, Miguel Sevilla-Callejo <msevill...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> Hi again,
>>
>> As far as I understand the wiki, my experience in Spanish bilingual
>> situations and the common sense (as you can see in street signals) I'm
>> going to change name=* to a neutral way as far as I could because is non
>> sense to have only English name in name=* tag (and adding name:en=* if do
>> not exist).
>>
>> I see (may be SK53 add them) there are name:cy tag in many streets [1] so
>> is as easy to edit name=* adding the Welsh name before as you can see in
>> the streets, add name:en=* if necessary.
>>
>> Cheers
>>
>> Miguel
>>
>> [1] e.g. way of the photo http://imgur.com/VkxGasm -->
>> http://www.openstreetmap.org/way/152547339
>>
>> --
>> *Miguel Sevilla-Callejo*
>> Doctor en Geografía
>>
>> On 27 July 2017 at 14:29, SK53 <sk53@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Miguel,
>>>
>>> I tend to agree with you. However, we have never had a consensus on
>>> which approach to use. Perhaps because we have few mappers in Wales and
>>> even fewer who are Welsh speakers by preference. Certainly using an English
>>> road name in Welsh-speaking areas of Wales is likely to put off Welsh
>>> speakers from contributing, so I tend to regard using both names as a
>>> quasi-political compromise. It's not easy to parse but will be intelligible
>>> to all, and does not require the elaborate explanation about name:en and
>>> name:cy.
>>>
>>> So be prepared for people querying this approach.
>>>
>>> From a perspective of entering the data it is important to add name:en
>>> and name:cy.
>>>
>>> Ironically I have been using Aber to test a mapnik overlay of Welsh
>>> names, so more data would be very useful.
>>>
>>> Jerry
>>>
>>> On 27 July 2017 at 14:15, Miguel Sevilla-Callejo <msevill...@gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hello Phil,
>>>>
>>&g

Re: [Talk-GB] Edits in Wales

[Miguel Sevilla-Callejo]

Hello again,

I started to edit around and within Aberystwyth, Wales. Yesterday I did an
edition to fix the bilingual labelling of some streets as I explained
before in this thread but other user (Mike Baggaley) is asking to me to
remove and change a neutral approach for labelling the streets [1].

I understood that this list is the proper place to discuss and to start a
consensus in the way to edit within the UK.

So I would like to translate here why I'm using a neutral approach for the
bilingual tagging in Wales: mainly because I'm following the wiki.

I'll invite Mike Baggaley or whoever thinks I'm doing an inappropriate
editions to consider joint this thread here and argue about.

Just in case, next, I copy and paste my reply to Mike Baggaley in the
changeset discussion where I explained mi position:

"I disagree with you [to not use "Welsh name / English name" for "name"
tag].

If you please read the wiki you will read how to tag in multilingual
situations.

First, "name" tag could be use as you can see in street sings [1]. You can
check on Mapillary how are labelled [2][3]

Second, "Welsh name / English name" label for "name" tag is recommended for
a neutral or bilingual version in Wales [4].

Moreover, from the legal point of view, in Wales, in general, and in
Ceredigion Council, in particular, Welsh is as important as English [5].
Even Ordnance Survey has labelled some streets of Aberystwyth in both
languages in their maps! [6]

In conclusion, it is not necessary to change my editions because are
appropriates."

Bests

Miguel

[0] https://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/
[1] https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:name
[2] https://www.mapillary.com/map/im/BVAjyV5Yt6hediIk7Lqv4w
[3] https://www.mapillary.com/map/im/j1ngoo9wTxbfXfnMdcEGVA
[4] https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Multilingual_names#Wales "In the
name field, a neutral or a bilingual version can be entered."
[5] http://www.legislation.gov.uk/mwa/2011/1/contents
[6] http://map.ceredigion.gov.uk/connect/?mapcfg=COMMUNITY_AND_LIVING


--
*Miguel Sevilla-Callejo*
Doctor en Geografía

On 27 July 2017 at 14:48, Miguel Sevilla-Callejo <msevill...@gmail.com>
wrote:

> Hi again,
>
> As far as I understand the wiki, my experience in Spanish bilingual
> situations and the common sense (as you can see in street signals) I'm
> going to change name=* to a neutral way as far as I could because is non
> sense to have only English name in name=* tag (and adding name:en=* if do
> not exist).
>
> I see (may be SK53 add them) there are name:cy tag in many streets [1] so
> is as easy to edit name=* adding the Welsh name before as you can see in
> the streets, add name:en=* if necessary.
>
> Cheers
>
> Miguel
>
> [1] e.g. way of the photo http://imgur.com/VkxGasm -->
> http://www.openstreetmap.org/way/152547339
>
> --
> *Miguel Sevilla-Callejo*
> Doctor en Geografía
>
> On 27 July 2017 at 14:29, SK53 <sk53@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Hi Miguel,
>>
>> I tend to agree with you. However, we have never had a consensus on which
>> approach to use. Perhaps because we have few mappers in Wales and even
>> fewer who are Welsh speakers by preference. Certainly using an English road
>> name in Welsh-speaking areas of Wales is likely to put off Welsh speakers
>> from contributing, so I tend to regard using both names as a
>> quasi-political compromise. It's not easy to parse but will be intelligible
>> to all, and does not require the elaborate explanation about name:en and
>> name:cy.
>>
>> So be prepared for people querying this approach.
>>
>> From a perspective of entering the data it is important to add name:en
>> and name:cy.
>>
>> Ironically I have been using Aber to test a mapnik overlay of Welsh
>> names, so more data would be very useful.
>>
>> Jerry
>>
>> On 27 July 2017 at 14:15, Miguel Sevilla-Callejo <msevill...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Hello Phil,
>>>
>>> Thanks for your reply, great to know someone is editing or/checking
>>> editions around.
>>>
>>> Respect the issue about the street names if you follow wiki indications
>>> for multilingual names [1] you could read for Welsh that "It is better to
>>> use *name:en* for English names and *name:cy* for the Welsh name. In
>>> the *name* field, a neutral or a bilingual version can be entered."
>>> [2]. So it's time to proceed in the correct mode.
>>>
>>> You can see an example of street sing here: http://imgur.com/VkxGasm
>>>
>>> I guess we should follow the neutral bilingual approach for that rather
>>> than to use only Welsh (which in top) or English name

Re: [Talk-GB] Edits in Wales

[Miguel Sevilla-Callejo]

Hi again,

As far as I understand the wiki, my experience in Spanish bilingual
situations and the common sense (as you can see in street signals) I'm
going to change name=* to a neutral way as far as I could because is non
sense to have only English name in name=* tag (and adding name:en=* if do
not exist).

I see (may be SK53 add them) there are name:cy tag in many streets [1] so
is as easy to edit name=* adding the Welsh name before as you can see in
the streets, add name:en=* if necessary.

Cheers

Miguel

[1] e.g. way of the photo http://imgur.com/VkxGasm -->
http://www.openstreetmap.org/way/152547339

--
*Miguel Sevilla-Callejo*
Doctor en Geografía

On 27 July 2017 at 14:29, SK53 <sk53@gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi Miguel,
>
> I tend to agree with you. However, we have never had a consensus on which
> approach to use. Perhaps because we have few mappers in Wales and even
> fewer who are Welsh speakers by preference. Certainly using an English road
> name in Welsh-speaking areas of Wales is likely to put off Welsh speakers
> from contributing, so I tend to regard using both names as a
> quasi-political compromise. It's not easy to parse but will be intelligible
> to all, and does not require the elaborate explanation about name:en and
> name:cy.
>
> So be prepared for people querying this approach.
>
> From a perspective of entering the data it is important to add name:en and
> name:cy.
>
> Ironically I have been using Aber to test a mapnik overlay of Welsh names,
> so more data would be very useful.
>
> Jerry
>
> On 27 July 2017 at 14:15, Miguel Sevilla-Callejo <msevill...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> Hello Phil,
>>
>> Thanks for your reply, great to know someone is editing or/checking
>> editions around.
>>
>> Respect the issue about the street names if you follow wiki indications
>> for multilingual names [1] you could read for Welsh that "It is better to
>> use *name:en* for English names and *name:cy* for the Welsh name. In the
>> *name* field, a neutral or a bilingual version can be entered." [2]. So
>> it's time to proceed in the correct mode.
>>
>> You can see an example of street sing here: http://imgur.com/VkxGasm
>>
>> I guess we should follow the neutral bilingual approach for that rather
>> than to use only Welsh (which in top) or English name.
>>
>> In Spain we have same regions with this issue and we are use to manage.
>>
>> Telegram is like WhatsApp, a Instant Messenger platform, initially focus
>> in mobile [3] and we use in Spain to re-emplace IRC [4] despite we
>> connected both services through Riot.im [4]
>>
>> By the way, I'm one of the administrator of the Non-official,
>> unauthorized OpenStreetMap supergroup on Telegram: @openstreetmaporg [5]
>>
>> We keep in contact
>>
>> Cheers
>>
>> Miguel
>>
>> [1] http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Multilingual_names
>> [2] http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Multilingual_names#Wales
>> [3] https://telegram.org/
>> [4] http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/List_of_OSM_centric_Teleg
>> ram_accounts
>> [5] https://telegram.me/OpenStreetMapOrg
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> *Miguel Sevilla-Callejo*
>> Doctor en Geografía
>>
>> On 27 July 2017 at 13:25, Philip Barnes <p...@trigpoint.me.uk> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Hi Miguel,  welcome to Wales or should I say Croisi y Cymru.
>>>
>>> I am based in the Marches on the border so my mapping is regularly both
>>> sides of the border. I do keep an eye on mid Wales through whodidit as we
>>> are very sparse on mappers in that area.
>>>
>>> >
>>> >I'm looking for other contributors in Wales, Ceredigion or even within
>>> >Aberystwyth to coordinate with them to star editions here.
>>> >
>>> >For instance, I found that all street names should be tagged in Welsh
>>> >and
>>> >English in the name=* as you can see in the street signals or as I
>>> >found it
>>> >must be in the OSM wiki [3]
>>>
>>> I would disagree with that, I prefer to map the top name in name and
>>> then use name:cy and name:en tags. In my experience that is the norm.
>>> Experience tells me that is far easier if the name contains a single
>>> language. In Ceredigion I would expect that to be usually Cymraig.
>>> >
>>> >Moreover, I'm taking some street level photos to upload to Mapillary
>>> >[3]
>>> >and adding some notes [4] for future contributions.
>>> >
>>> >All feedback is welcome, I'm on

Re: [Talk-GB] Edits in Wales

[Miguel Sevilla-Callejo]

Hello Phil,

Thanks for your reply, great to know someone is editing or/checking
editions around.

Respect the issue about the street names if you follow wiki indications for
multilingual names [1] you could read for Welsh that "It is better to use
*name:en* for English names and *name:cy* for the Welsh name. In the *name*
field, a neutral or a bilingual version can be entered." [2]. So it's time
to proceed in the correct mode.

You can see an example of street sing here: http://imgur.com/VkxGasm

I guess we should follow the neutral bilingual approach for that rather
than to use only Welsh (which in top) or English name.

In Spain we have same regions with this issue and we are use to manage.

Telegram is like WhatsApp, a Instant Messenger platform, initially focus in
mobile [3] and we use in Spain to re-emplace IRC [4] despite we connected
both services through Riot.im [4]

By the way, I'm one of the administrator of the Non-official, unauthorized
OpenStreetMap supergroup on Telegram: @openstreetmaporg [5]

We keep in contact

Cheers

Miguel

[1] http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Multilingual_names
[2] http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Multilingual_names#Wales
[3] https://telegram.org/
[4] http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/List_of_OSM_centric_Telegram_accounts
[5] https://telegram.me/OpenStreetMapOrg



--
*Miguel Sevilla-Callejo*
Doctor en Geografía

On 27 July 2017 at 13:25, Philip Barnes <p...@trigpoint.me.uk> wrote:

>
>
> Hi Miguel,  welcome to Wales or should I say Croisi y Cymru.
>
> I am based in the Marches on the border so my mapping is regularly both
> sides of the border. I do keep an eye on mid Wales through whodidit as we
> are very sparse on mappers in that area.
>
> >
> >I'm looking for other contributors in Wales, Ceredigion or even within
> >Aberystwyth to coordinate with them to star editions here.
> >
> >For instance, I found that all street names should be tagged in Welsh
> >and
> >English in the name=* as you can see in the street signals or as I
> >found it
> >must be in the OSM wiki [3]
>
> I would disagree with that, I prefer to map the top name in name and then
> use name:cy and name:en tags. In my experience that is the norm. Experience
> tells me that is far easier if the name contains a single language. In
> Ceredigion I would expect that to be usually Cymraig.
> >
> >Moreover, I'm taking some street level photos to upload to Mapillary
> >[3]
> >and adding some notes [4] for future contributions.
> >
> >All feedback is welcome, I'm on Telegram too (same user as OSM) so you
> >can
> >contact to me there too.
>
> I am not sure what telegram is, the UK community hang out on IRC in
> #talk-gb, you are welcome to join us.
> >
> >Cheers & happy mapping
>
> Have fun,  and certainly visit New Quay (Under Milk Wood), while you are
> in Ceredigion.
>
> Phil. (trigpoint)
>
> --
> Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.
>
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>
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[Talk-GB] Edits in Wales

[Miguel Sevilla-Callejo]

Hello,

I'm Miguel Sevilla-Callejo, msevilla00 OSM user [1], an active user withing
the Spanish OSM Community despite I do not have to many editions and I'm
spending some weeks in the UK. I'm based on Aberystwyth, Wales and, as you
can imagine I checked how our favourite spatial data base is going around...

I'm looking for other contributors in Wales, Ceredigion or even within
Aberystwyth to coordinate with them to star editions here.

For instance, I found that all street names should be tagged in Welsh and
English in the name=* as you can see in the street signals or as I found it
must be in the OSM wiki [3]

Moreover, I'm taking some street level photos to upload to Mapillary [3]
and adding some notes [4] for future contributions.

All feedback is welcome, I'm on Telegram too (same user as OSM) so you can
contact to me there too.

Cheers & happy mapping

[1] http://www.openstreetmap.org/user/msevilla00
[2] http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Multilingual_names#Wales
[3] https://www.mapillary.com/app/user/msevilla00
[4] http://www.openstreetmap.org/user/msevilla00/notes

--
*Miguel Sevilla-Callejo*
Doctor in Geography

a. Research Assistance at the Pyrenean Institute of Ecology - Spanish
National Research Council
b. Associate Lecturer at Dpto. of Geography & Territorial Planning at
University of Zaragoza
c. Freelance consultant & researcher - Member #698, Spanish Professional
Association of Geographers
d. Visitor Scholar in Dept. Geography and Earth Sciences at Aberystwyth
University
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