Re: Beta testing (was: Re: 3022 is awfull)
Hello Roelof, Thursday, October 28, 2004, 9:27:03 PM, you wrote: Hallo MaXxX, On Thu, 28 Oct 2004 19:55:34 +0200GMT (28-10-2004, 19:55 +0200, where I live), you wrote: M I'm asking for a way to make betatesting easier, as it was for the M short time between introducing the /REG parameter and turning to MSI M installations. Well, you could always configure another user account in Windows 2000 and do a second install. I realize that that might not be the optimal solution for you, but IMO beta testing should be done with a working configuration as beta testing should be testing whether the thing works in everyday use. Since everybody need to make his own decisions about running his/her system, you and I are entitled to different opinions on how to run tests. Never mind the cookie though. ;-) Thank you for your email. It will be actioned in due course -- Best regards, Clivemailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Current beta is 3.0.2.4 Rush | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
Hello Nick On Thursday, October 28, 2004, at 8:02:50 PM, Tony wrote: Can't say I agree with anything you wrote, this is about the best, fastest and so far, most efficient and capable version I've used for years. Perhaps, but there are an awful lot of users such as myself who are unable to even close The Bat, so I would have to say that for us it's not the best. I've just tried the 3.0.2.2 and experienced the failure to close. That was on XP SP1 and XP SP2, on Pentium and Athalon, with and without the Achim's Bayes Filter. All combinations failed in the same way. My conclusion - roll on the next beta please, this one is broken -- regards, Graham Using The Bat! 3.0.2.1 assisted by under Windows XP 5.1 (Build 2600, Service Pack 1) -- Notice: This e-mail message, together with any attachments, contains information of Merck Co., Inc. (One Merck Drive, Whitehouse Station, New Jersey, USA 08889), and/or its affiliates (which may be known outside the United States as Merck Frosst, Merck Sharp Dohme or MSD and in Japan, as Banyu) that may be confidential, proprietary copyrighted and/or legally privileged. It is intended solely for the use of the individual or entity named on this message. If you are not the intended recipient, and have received this message in error, please notify us immediately by reply e-mail and then delete it from your system. -- Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Graham I've just tried the 3.0.2.2 and experienced the failure to close. I've run through the open/close cycle a few times now and have experienced the failure to close problem only once so far, so what ever it is it's transient, to a point at least. - -- Stuart Hemming Using The Bat! v3.0.2.2 Rush on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 1 Aided by BayesIt! 0.7.3, MyGate and rss2mail. PGP Key available from ldap://keyserver.pgp.com Every calendar's days are numbered. -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: PGP SDK 3.0 Comment: Key available from ldap://keyserver.pgp.com; iQA/AwUBQYIXA9ttnLhkydF1EQJvCwCgl5WXZi8jImph5AX5K+63cChjAv8Anj7D 9WkuQ0fzfYM1dI+SfqBx4oAt =Z+TM -END PGP SIGNATURE- Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: Life with Betas (was: Re: 3022 is awfull)
Hello MaXxX, On Thursday, October 28, 2004 at 4:24:31 PM MaXxX [M] wrote: [...] M but the MSI installer installs where it does usually, without the M option to install as a separate setup. *hmmm* I actually wasn't able to find a MSI-installer for 3.0.2.2 ... Where did you get it from? -- Regards Peter Palmreuther (The Bat! v3.0.2.2 Rush on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 2) If you are sitting, just sit. If you are walking, just walk. Above all, don't wobble. Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
Hello Nick, A reminder of what Nick Andriash typed on: 29 October 2004 at 05:04:21 GMT +0200 NA Perhaps, but there are an awful lot of users such as myself who are unable NA to even close The Bat, so I would have to say that for us it's not the best. I fully understand and sympathize with you Nick and everyone else who is having problems. However those that find it flawless should also make this fact known otherwise Ritlabs would assume it works for no one. Perhaps if everyone experienced the same problems it would make it easier to fix. Not reporting the fact it works perfectly for some would, I believe, be just as bad as if no one reported it didn't work. Please don't think I'm reveling in my good fortune and the fact it works for me, I have tried to recreate the problem, to try and pinpoint it by transferring from one PC to another and back again but I just can't. I get the same impeccable performance on both my Toshiba Laptop and my home built cobbled together P4 Desktop. -- Best regards,Tony. _ The Bat! v3.0.2.2 Rush 29/10/2004 at 10:13 UTC 2ØØ4 - AWB Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re[2]: 3022 is awfull
Hello MAU, Thursday, October 28, 2004, 6:16:49 PM, you wrote: M Hello Allie, Set the test client to leave messages on the server. M No, because if I do I will _not_ be using my normal working environment M as I never leave messages on server. M Anyway, don't worry about me. There have been times in the past, and may M be in the future, that I do not engage in beta testing. But when I do, M _I_ decide to do so and _I_ decide to take the risk. Also, if normally M just do a daily backup, while I am beta testing I may easily set my M Second Copy 2000 to backup TB several times a day. The trick (for me at least) has been to start off conservatively and then as things look as though they are working well, begin to move more of the normal activity over to the beta until it is the main instance (assuming it works well enough for that wink). So on an initial install I will leave copies on the server so that if things crash badly I can still recover my email. When things have worked well for a while I will start adding plugins, filters, macros (actually I don't have many of those) and such and finally ... iff all of the above work well, I will stop using the old install and start clearing the server from the beta. It is more work, I have not lost any data doing things this way. -- Best regards, MikeDmailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Using The Bat! v3.0.2.1 on Windows ME 4.90 Build 3000 Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
On Friday, October 29, 2004, at 05:10 AM, Stuart Hemming wrote: Graham I've just tried the 3.0.2.2 and experienced the failure to close. I've run through the open/close cycle a few times now and have experienced the failure to close problem only once so far, so what ever it is it's transient, to a point at least. I've just installed this new beta on my machine here at work. Runs well and exits without problems. This exiting issue is quite an interesting problem. Seems that for those who have the hang, TB! is stuck doing something at shutdown. For one, I don't compress folders on exit. That could be something to look at. Are those having the problem compressing folders on exit? I can't really think of what else one could do upon exiting. The CC could be stuck doing something else. I keep my CC hidden at all times and work only with my IMAP accounts. No POP retrieval, though I have two POP accounts. One legacy and the other a storage account. -- -=[ Allie ]=- ... Overload--core meltdown sequence initiated. __ Running TB! v3.0.2.2 Rush or SquirrelMail WebMail for IMAP IMAP Server: MDaemon Pro | OS: Windows XP Pro (Service Pack 2) Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
Hello Allie Martin everyone else 29-Okt-2004 14:40, you wrote: For one, I don't compress folders on exit. That could be something to look at. Are those having the problem compressing folders on exit? I disabled the compress/remove on exit for all folders that used it, it makes no difference (after first try it quitted fine, then it hung again). -- Best regards, Alexander (http://www.neurowerx.de - ICQ 238153981) using v3.0.1.33 on Windows XP Pro Service Pack 2 They came to a round hole in the sky... glowing like fire... this, the raven said, was a star. -- Eskimo Creation myth Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
On Friday, October 29, 2004, at 07:40 AM, Allie Martin wrote: I can't really think of what else one could do upon exiting. The CC could be stuck doing something else. I keep my CC hidden at all times and work only with my IMAP accounts. No POP retrieval, though I have two POP accounts. One legacy and the other a storage account. I see that I'm sorely late and missed the thread on VF's being the apparent cause of the problem. Ignore these late thoughts. :) -- -=[ Allie ]=- ... A friend: someone who likes you even after they know you. __ Running TB! v3.0.2.2 Rush or SquirrelMail WebMail for IMAP IMAP Server: MDaemon Pro | OS: Windows XP Pro (Service Pack 2) Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: Life with Betas (was: Re: 3022 is awfull)
On Friday, October 29, 2004, at 12:33:00 PM, Peter Palmreuther spewed forth what is to be beheld below: *hmmm* I actually wasn't able to find a MSI-installer for 3.0.2.2 ... Where did you get it from? I did not. The release versions have MSI installers, but given that Ritlabs' policies make their Releases no better than Betas... you know. :P -- |\ /| \~~~/ \~~~/ | \/ | /\ \~/ ICQ# 3146019 || /__\ /___\ /_\ /___\IQ# 3.14159 Random church bulletin blooper: For those of you who have children and don't know it, we have a nursery downstairs. Flyin' high with The Bat! v3.0.1.33 over the swamps of Windows 2000 5.0 build 2195 Service Pack 4 Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
Hello Roelof, M No, because if I do I will _not_ be using my normal working environment M as I never leave messages on server. I know you're using Mercury as mail server and I'm not familiar with it, but my mail server enables me to send copies to an archive (I can set the archive to automatically expire to any period). I've been using Mailtraq for years now, but most mail servers I've tried in the past had a similar feature. Yes, I think it can be done with Mercury but I'm not doing it. M Anyway, don't worry about me. I won't. ;-) Thanks, what would you like to drink? ;-) -- Best regards, Miguel A. Urech (El Escorial - Spain) Using The Bat! v3.0.2.2 Rush on Windows 2000 5.0 Service Pack 4 Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
Hello Arjan, Set the test client to leave messages on the server. No, because if I do I will _not_ be using my normal working environment as I never leave messages on server. Then set the release version to leave messages on the server. That would serve no purpose and, anyway, that is not what I want to do. Thanks anyway, -- Best regards, Miguel A. Urech (El Escorial - Spain) Using The Bat! v3.0.2.2 Rush on Windows 2000 5.0 Service Pack 4 Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
Hello Allie, Don't worry about him. :) Thanks Allie :) -- Best regards, Miguel A. Urech (El Escorial - Spain) Using The Bat! v3.0.2.2 Rush on Windows 2000 5.0 Service Pack 4 Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
Hello MikeD, snipped a bit It is more work, I have not lost any data doing things this way. Doing it the way I do, I have not lost any data with any Beta version, at least yet :) -- Best regards, Miguel A. Urech (El Escorial - Spain) Using The Bat! v3.0.2.2 Rush on Windows 2000 5.0 Service Pack 4 Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
Hello Arjan, You could do that: 1) by running The Beta! version simultaneously on another machine (just like I did until I got fed up with it). 2) by running The Beta! version simultaneously on the same machine, but as an independent program. This should not be very hard to understand. I know it's not hard to understand, it is that I want to do it the way I do it now. Because it's simple and safe enough for me, and I'm willing to take the risks that may be involved. -- Best regards, Miguel A. Urech (El Escorial - Spain) Using The Bat! v3.0.2.2 Rush on Windows 2000 5.0 Service Pack 4 Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re[2]: 3022 is awfull
Hello MAU, Friday, October 29, 2004, 5:24:23 PM, you wrote: [Alternative Beta! testing setup] I know it's not hard to understand, it is that I want to do it the way I do it now. Because it's simple and safe enough for me, Sure, if it suits you, but running/testing on 2 machines on a LAN is much more fun. and I'm willing to take the risks that may be involved. Well, I can only wish you good luck then. -- Best regards, Arjanmailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Current beta is 3.0.2.4 Rush | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
Hello Tim, A reminder of what Tim Casten typed on: 28 October 2004 at 04:16:50 GMT +0200 TC This is the worst I have seen. I have spent the past 5 hours TC restoring going back in builds etc etc. Looks like you need Januks batch file, it's taken me less than 2 minutes to transfer from the Laptop to this desktop my complete TB installation and it's as if it's never been moved. Just got to see now if it misbehaves itself. -- Best regards,Tony. _ The Bat! v3.0.2.2 Rush 28/10/2004 at 09:04 UTC 2ØØ4 - AWB Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
On Thursday, October 28, 2004, at 4:32:44 AM, Thomas Martin threw back his cloak, climbed the podium, loudly cleared his throat and spoke: This is the worst I have seen. I have spent the past 5 hours restoring going back in builds etc etc. just a few words. That is the risk of Betas. Allow me to correct it a bit. That is the risk of Betas that insist on acting like Releases. Let me say it once more, for good measure, so that anybody concerned hears... BETA VERSIONS SHOULD NOT EVEN TRY TO INSTALL AS 'NORMAL' PROGRAMS. THEY SHOULD HAVE A DIFFERENT PROGRAM ID AND INSTALL SEPARATELY, NOT EVEN TOUCHING THE ORIGINAL CONFIGURATION. Geez. -- |\ /| \~~~/ \~~~/ | \/ | /\ \~/ ICQ# 3146019 || /__\ /___\ /_\ /___\IQ# 3.14159 Random church bulletin blooper: Wednesday the Ladies' Liturgy Group will meet. Mrs Johnson will sing, Put Me in My Little Bed accompanied by the Pastor. Flyin' high with The Bat! v3.0.1.33 over the swamps of Windows 2000 5.0 build 2195 Service Pack 4 Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
On Wednesday, October 27, 2004 at 9:16:27 PM [GMT -0500], Tim Casten wrote: I completely unistalled the Bat went back to 3.0 did a restore, then upgraded to this build and had the strangest occurance I have ever seen. A completely blank screen, nothing there except the Bat was downlading mail as the mail ticker was working and showing new mail downloaded, but I had no folders, nothing. This happened two or three times and I went back to build 10 before rc1 and all was seemed to be fine except all of my folders were gone. I then did a restore at that point and my message base and folders came back only to disappear the next time I restarted the Bat. I then had to do a restore again, and then upgraded to this newest beta again and it is the sluggish thing I have ever seen, its running terrible and don't even think about shutting the program down. You're using the backup utility to create backups that you restore from? I've never done a complete uninstall of TB! since using it in 1999. I've usually just switched executables. If I have a problem with the new one, I replace it with the one I was using before. The beta download consists of just the program executable. I rename the one I was using and then place the beta in the installation directory. I then try it. If I'm not happy, I just delete it and rename the old executable back to the right name. All this uninstalling and restoring may be causing you more harm than the beta itself, especially if you're using the tb-backup. It can be unpredictable how that work. My last use of it to restore to a copy of SecureBat! yielded only partial restoration. There was on SecureBat! build where with each restart, the folders would all disappear leaving only the basic default folders. So all this may be a mainly problems with restoring. What was your original reason for completely uninstalling TB!. This beta runs well on my system here. No catastrophes to speak of. -- -= Allie =- . Climate is what you expect. Weather is what you get. __ IMAP [ Client: The Bat! v3.0.2.2 Rush | Server: MDaemon Pro ] OS: Windows XP Pro (Service Pack 2) Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
Hello Tim, A reminder of what Tim Casten typed on: 28 October 2004 at 04:16:50 GMT +0200 TC This is the worst I have seen. ETC. ETC... Can't say I agree with anything you wrote, this is about the best, fastest and so far, most efficient and capable version I've used for years. I left it running all night, it faithfully collected my mail from 3 accounts every 10 minutes and still shuts down and fires up the fastest I've experienced from any version. Just a thought but could it be processor specific? We know it's not, or doesn't seem to be OS related. I'm going to join Mary in a little experiment. I'm going to transfer my complete Bat install from this Centrino Laptop over to my P4 Desktop PC and see if I get it hanging on there. Both are running XP Home with SP2. -- Best regards,Tony. _ The Bat! v3.0.2.2 Rush 28/10/2004 at 08:40 UTC 2ØØ4 - AWB Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
On Thursday, October 28, 2004 at 2:56:54 AM [GMT -0500], Tony Boom wrote: I'm going to join Mary in a little experiment. I'm going to transfer my complete Bat install from this Centrino Laptop over to my P4 Desktop PC and see if I get it hanging on there. Both are running XP Home with SP2. I agree with that experiment. I'm enjoying this beta as well and will try it on my machine at work which seems to find the last beta quite OK. I have no problems with 3.0.2.1 at work while I had serious problems with AV's at home. Both machines run XP Pro. But then again, the problems are reversed with PowerPro. I have macros that work well on my machine at home and at work, the very same macros are very problematic. Same OS and same PowerPro versions. Different hardware though and that's likely what makes the difference. -- -= Allie =- . Oxymoron: Senatorial Courtesy. __ IMAP [ Client: The Bat! v3.0.2.2 Rush | Server: MDaemon Pro ] OS: Windows XP Pro (Service Pack 2) Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
Hello Allie, I've never done a complete uninstall of TB! since using it in 1999. I've usually just switched executables. If I have a problem with the new one, I replace it with the one I was using before. The beta download consists of just the program executable. I rename the one I was using and then place the beta in the installation directory. I then try it. If I'm not happy, I just delete it and rename the old executable back to the right name. Same here except for a slight difference. I usually keep several versions of TB executable in the same installation directory (sharing it as well as message base, etc.) with slightly different names and with shortcuts to each on my desktop. This way, I can easily start the version I want/need at a certain moment. I must say that this peculiar configuration with several executables sharing the same installation has never been a problem at all for me. -- Best regards, Miguel A. Urech (El Escorial - Spain) Using The Bat! v3.0.2.2 Rush on Windows 2000 5.0 Service Pack 4 Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
SOT: Problems with PowerPro macros (was: Re: 3022 is awfull)
Hello Allie, In mid:[EMAIL PROTECTED] with Subject Re: 3022 is awfull Allie Marting wrote: But then again, the problems are reversed with PowerPro. I have macros that work well on my machine at home and at work, the very same macros are very problematic. Same OS and same PowerPro versions. Different hardware though and that's likely what makes the difference. If you use keyboard stroke macros the problems may come from different processor speeds. Last August I upgraded to a much faster PC and found that some of my macros would not always (or never) work. I traced this to the fact that they were executing too fast (i.e. before some menus, windows or dialogs would actually pop up) and had to adjust PowerPro's typing speed. In same cases I even had to include a /wait/ command so that macro execution would actually wait for the target application/window to get focus back or to open and get focus (i.e. wait active Sorting Office*). -- Best regards, Miguel A. Urech (El Escorial - Spain) Using The Bat! v3.0.2.2 Rush on Windows 2000 5.0 Service Pack 4 Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Life with Betas (was: Re: 3022 is awfull)
Hello MaXxX, Thursday, October 28, 2004, 04:39:08, you wrote: M That is the risk of Betas that insist on acting like Releases. Sorry, MaXxX, but I fail to see the reason of a Beta that does not function like the release product. M Let me say it once more, for good measure, so that anybody concerned M hears... M BETA VERSIONS SHOULD NOT EVEN TRY TO INSTALL AS 'NORMAL' PROGRAMS. M THEY SHOULD HAVE A DIFFERENT PROGRAM ID AND INSTALL SEPARATELY, NOT M EVEN TOUCHING THE ORIGINAL CONFIGURATION. Please allow me to offer my version (it is, of course, still beta): ## BETA VERSIONS *ARE* DANGEROUS. THERE ARE NO GUARANTEES, IMPLICIT OR EXPLICIT, THAT YOUR MAIL BASE WILL SURVIVE. TAKE ALL NECESSARY PRECAUTIONS TO SAFEGUARD YOUR DATA. USE AT YOUR OWNRISK ## This is part of the game. The function of a Beta is to be used, AS IF IT WERE THE REAL THING, by a sample population. -- ..hggdh.. Using The Bat! v3.0.1.33 and BayesIt! 0.7.3 on Windows 2000 5.0 Build 2195 Service Pack 4 pgpaBsmQmwwEZ.pgp Description: PGP signature Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: Life with Betas (was: Re: 3022 is awfull)
On Thursday, October 28, 2004, at 4:21:20 PM, Hggdh jumped on the stage, took a mike and sang: Please allow me to offer my version (it is, of course, still beta): ## BETA VERSIONS *ARE* DANGEROUS. THERE ARE NO GUARANTEES, IMPLICIT OR EXPLICIT, THAT YOUR MAIL BASE WILL SURVIVE. TAKE ALL NECESSARY PRECAUTIONS TO SAFEGUARD YOUR DATA. USE AT YOUR OWNRISK ## This is part of the game. The function of a Beta is to be used, AS IF IT WERE THE REAL THING, by a sample population. Sure, sure. As long as I can _ALSO_ be using a real version. The Bat is largely inconsistent in this manner - the executables can be run with specific /REG parameters, but the MSI installer installs where it does usually, without the option to install as a separate setup. Unless, of course, the developers wish the users to use other mail agents for their critical use, and TB only for testing it. But that makes little sense, does it? -- |\ /| \~~~/ \~~~/ | \/ | /\ \~/ ICQ# 3146019 || /__\ /___\ /_\ /___\IQ# 3.14159 Flyin' high with The Bat! v3.0.1.33 over the swamps of Windows 2000 5.0 build 2195 Service Pack 4 Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: Life with Betas (was: Re: 3022 is awfull)
Hello MaXxX, Sure, sure. As long as I can _ALSO_ be using a real version. The Bat is largely inconsistent in this manner - the executables can be run with specific /REG parameters, but the MSI installer installs where it does usually, without the option to install as a separate setup. See my mid:[EMAIL PROTECTED] on this same thread. -- Best regards, Miguel A. Urech (El Escorial - Spain) Using The Bat! v3.0.2.2 Rush on Windows 2000 5.0 Service Pack 4 Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: Life with Betas (was: Re: 3022 is awfull)
Hello hggdh, USE AT YOUR OWNRISK ## This is part of the game. The function of a Beta is to be used, AS IF IT WERE THE REAL THING, by a sample population. Agree 100%!!! Nobody is forced to use a Beta and _any_ beta tester should know he's taking a risk. -- Best regards, Miguel A. Urech (El Escorial - Spain) Using The Bat! v3.0.2.2 Rush on Windows 2000 5.0 Service Pack 4 Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
On Thursday, October 28, 2004, at 3:54:10 PM, MAU sculpted a piece of raw silicon into the thoughts below: Same here except for a slight difference. I usually keep several versions of TB executable in the same installation directory (sharing it as well as message base, etc.) with slightly different names and with shortcuts to each on my desktop. Oh dear, do we have to get through this again? It's been done already... I have a message base of, say, crucial importance. Backed up, of course, but still needed for everyday work. If I keep running a Release version, I'm happy and it works nicely. If I run a Beta EXE, I have to shut my Release version down, and back up my mail base. Fine, fine, but what if I want to just continue working, instead of JUST testing? The solution is very, very simple, and that is why I don't understand why it's not done yet. Changing the IDs by which TB! chooses its registry keys AND determines that it is running AND where/how it installs would solve all problems. I could install a The Bat! Beta to a different directory, with a different registry key, with a different mail base, running simultaneously with my The Bat! release installation, one never interfering with the other. This way, I can easily start the version I want/need at a certain moment. Well, you may be happy with completely separate testing and working time slices. I am not. I need to have a reliable e-mail client running 24/7. I'm not willing to shut it down just to test a new version that could well blow my message base to pieces and force me to restore from a backup. And backups don't solve ALL problems! What if I receive a very important message when running a badly broken beta? I don't have a backup of THAT message, right? And KABOOM goes the message base. Oops. Message gone. -- |\ /| \~~~/ \~~~/ | \/ | /\ \~/ ICQ# 3146019 || /__\ /___\ /_\ /___\IQ# 3.14159 Random church bulletin blooper: For those of you who have children and don't know it, we have a nursery downstairs. Flyin' high with The Bat! v3.0.1.33 over the swamps of Windows 2000 5.0 build 2195 Service Pack 4 Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
Hello Allie, A reminder of what Allie Martin typed on: 28 October 2004 at 13:14:10 GMT +0200 AM I agree with that experiment. Well so far everything is fine, but it's only been running an hour or so. I've opened and closed it quite a few times, before and after sending and receiving with no trouble. Only difference so far is it doesn't open quite so fast but I put that down to the fact the 1.7 Centrino maybe faster than a 2.4 Pentium 4. Not sure of the exact speed comparisons but I was told doubling the speed of a centrino chip gives the approximate P4 comparison speed? Either way, two totally different PC's and 3022 runs just as well on both... Touch wood so far anyway :) My wife uses a 1.8 Athlon so I may try it on there when I get time. -- Best regards,Tony. _ The Bat! v3.0.2.2 Rush 28/10/2004 at 12:20 UTC 2ØØ4 - AWB Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: SOT: Problems with PowerPro macros (was: Re: 3022 is awfull)
On Thursday, October 28, 2004, at 09:15 AM, MAU wrote: If you use keyboard stroke macros the problems may come from different processor speeds. Last August I upgraded to a much faster PC and found that some of my macros would not always (or never) work. I traced this to the fact that they were executing too fast (i.e. before some menus, windows or dialogs would actually pop up) and had to adjust PowerPro's typing speed. In same cases I even had to include a /wait/ command so that macro execution would actually wait for the target application/window to get focus back or to open and get focus (i.e. wait active Sorting Office*). It would seem that this is the case for me, though the machine with the problem is the slower of the two. One has a 3GHz P4 processor, while the other has a 2.2Ghz Celeron. The slower machine seems to be executing too quickly, so I put in a wait command and that hasn't helped. shrug I've just about given up getting that macro to work. It involves bringing windows in and out of focus as well as copying and pasting window contents. -- -=[ Allie ]=- ... Happiness isn't getting what you want, it's wanting what you got Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
Hello MaXxX, snipped quite a bit Well, you may be happy with completely separate testing and working time slices. I am not. I need to have a reliable e-mail client running 24/7. I'm not willing to shut it down just to test a new version that could well blow my message base to pieces and force me to restore from a backup. And backups don't solve ALL problems! What if I receive a very important message when running a badly broken beta? I don't have a backup of THAT message, right? And KABOOM goes the message base. Oops. Message gone. Then, don't volunteer to beta test. Period. :) -- Best regards, Miguel A. Urech (El Escorial - Spain) Using The Bat! v3.0.2.2 Rush on Windows 2000 5.0 Service Pack 4 Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
-Original Message- From: Tim Casten [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Oct 27, 2004 7:16 PM To: tbbeta [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: 3022 is awfull Hello tbbeta, This is the worst I have seen. I have spent the past 5 hours restoring going back in builds etc etc. I completely unistalled the Bat went back to 3.0 did a restore, then upgraded to this build and had the strangest occurance I have ever seen. A completely blank screen, nothing there except the Bat was downlading mail as the mail ticker was working and showing new mail downloaded, but I had no folders, nothing. This happened two or three times and I went back to build 10 before rc1 and all was seemed to be fine except all of my folders were gone. I then did a restore at that point and my message base and folders came back only to disappear the next time I restarted the Bat. I then had to do a restore again, and then upgraded to this newest beta again and it is the sluggish thing I have ever seen, its running terrible and don't even think about shutting the program down. Looks like your computer is really messed up. Sorry to hear it. -- Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/ Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
Hello Tony! On Thursday, October 28, 2004, 6:30 AM, you wrote: AM I agree with that experiment. TB Well so far everything is fine, but it's only been running an hour TB or so. I've opened and closed it quite a few times, before and TB after sending and receiving with no trouble. Since I began to keep a log of my closings and openings of TB!, yesterday at 4:30 p.m. yesterday, I have been unable to reproduce the hanging-on-exit behavior. I did 5 consecutive closes and re-launches between 4:30 p.m. and 4:44 p.m., each of them with 30 seconds of Fetching mail, and one within 10 seconds of Sending mail. I then ran TB! until 9:00 p.m., at which time I closed it--it closed in a flash--and shut the computer down. I launched TB! at 6:30 a.m., this morning, Thursday, October 28, and have run it continuously since, until 11:15 a.m. At that point I checked mail and immediately shut TB! down. It closed in a flash. I cannot reproduce the hang-ups which occurred to me when I first installed and began to use this beta. TB Only difference so far is it doesn't open quite so fast but I put that down TB to the fact the 1.7 Centrino maybe faster than a 2.4 Pentium 4. Not sure of TB the exact speed comparisons but I was told doubling the speed of a centrino TB chip gives the approximate P4 comparison speed? My processor is Pentium 4. TB Either way, two totally different PC's and 3022 runs just as well on TB both... Touch wood so far anyway :) Touch wood for me, too, for now. Tony, do you think this behavior could be ISP related? I had a lot of trouble with my ISP on Tuesday. TB! (v. 3.0.2.1) would tell me in the Connection Centre the number of messages, and then hang without displaying the Message Dispatcher. I had to close with Windows Task Manager to get out of the freeze. This went on intermittently for over 2 hours (I was going to comcast.net's web-mail page to clear out the messages during this time), and suddenly the bad behavior stopped and has not recurred since. I reported the behavior on tbudl and got one confirmation of a similar behavior involving the German ISP gmx. TB My wife uses a 1.8 Athlon so I may try it on there when I get time. Do, but from all the information we've gathered so far, I'm beginning to suspect some effect of ISP's on the Connection Centre. -- Best regards, Mary The Bat 3.0.2.2 Rush on Windows XP 5.1 2600 Service Pack 2 Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
On Thursday, October 28, 2004, at 5:38:53 PM, the world was changed forever by what MAU wrote: me to restore from a backup. And backups don't solve ALL problems! What if I receive a very important message when running a badly broken beta? I don't have a backup of THAT message, right? And KABOOM goes the message base. Oops. Message gone. Then, don't volunteer to beta test. Period. :) Pff. Great suggestion, sir. However it doesn't solve the problem, does it. -- |\ /| \~~~/ \~~~/ | \/ | /\ \~/ ICQ# 3146019 || /__\ /___\ /_\ /___\IQ# 3.14159 Random Broken English: Not to be used for the other use (on a Japanese food processor). Flyin' high with The Bat! v3.0.1.33 over the swamps of Windows 2000 5.0 build 2195 Service Pack 4 Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
Hello MaXxX everyone else 28-Okt-2004 19:33, you wrote: Then, don't volunteer to beta test. Period. :) Pff. Great suggestion, sir. However it doesn't solve the problem, does it. But it does - no one forces you to participate in the beta test program, aye? -- Best regards, Alexander (http://www.neurowerx.de - ICQ 238153981) using v3.0.1.33 on Windows XP Pro Service Pack 2 Farrell's Law: The most expensive component is the one that breaks. Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
On Thursday, October 28, 2004, at 7:37:51 PM, the world was changed forever by what Alexander S. Kunz wrote: Pff. Great suggestion, sir. However it doesn't solve the problem, does it. But it does - no one forces you to participate in the beta test program, aye? Hey, please. Are we talking about my participation, or about the ease of it? Can we please stick to it? My point: betatesting of The Bat! is unnecessarily tedious, and could easily be made more friendly. Your counterpoint: don't like it - get out. Super. -- |\ /| \~~~/ \~~~/ | \/ | /\ \~/ ICQ# 3146019 || /__\ /___\ /_\ /___\IQ# 3.14159 Japanese T-shirt collection: FUTURE F.A.G. (on a little boy, about 8) Flyin' high with The Bat! v3.0.1.33 over the swamps of Windows 2000 5.0 build 2195 Service Pack 4 Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: SOT: Problems with PowerPro macros (was: Re: 3022 is awfull)
Hello Allie, The slower machine seems to be executing too quickly, Have you tried tweaking the the typing speed? In case you don't know, which I doubt, look in Configuration/Setup/Advanced Setup/Limits for Delay in milliseconds for first and subsequent sent keys from *Keys -- Best regards, Miguel A. Urech (El Escorial - Spain) Using The Bat! v3.0.2.2 Rush on Windows 2000 5.0 Service Pack 4 Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
On Thursday, October 28, 2004, at 12:37 PM, Alexander S. Kunz wrote: But it does - no one forces you to participate in the beta test program, aye? Why not stop this? MaXXX wants to beta test. He just wishes to beta test without having to use his working installation as the beta test bed. He's looking for and asking for an easy way to run another installation in parallel to the one he relies on for day to day work. Prior to MSI installations, it was OK, but there are little glitches now that he mentioned. I don't find his concerns unreasonable. Clearly Ritlabs did too and offered something before. -- -=[ Allie ]=- ... Don't believe everything you hear or anything you say. Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
Hello MaXxX, on 28.10.2004 at 19:38 you wrote: On Thursday, October 28, 2004, at 7:37:51 PM, the world was changed forever by what Alexander S. Kunz wrote: Pff. Great suggestion, sir. However it doesn't solve the problem, does it. But it does - no one forces you to participate in the beta test program, aye? Hey, please. Are we talking about my participation, or about the ease of it? Can we please stick to it? Anyone heard of something called Dead Horse...? ;) -- Best regards, Manuel The Bat! 3.0.2.1, Windows XP Prof. 5.1 Build 2600 SP2 Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
On Thursday, October 28, 2004, at 7:45:48 PM, Manuel Breitfeld wrote the following words: Anyone heard of something called Dead Horse...? ;) A very nice thing to pronounce on a thread that has been getting derailed only lately. I'm asking for a way to make betatesting easier, as it was for the short time between introducing the /REG parameter and turning to MSI installations. People start suggesting that perhaps I shouldn't test, as if I hadn't been doing it for the last several years quite well. The suggestion of a dead horse, perhaps, is accepted. So, I get unnecessarily attacked, and my question is not answered, as the thread is closed. I don't like this scenario one bit. -- |\ /| \~~~/ \~~~/ | \/ | /\ \~/ ICQ# 3146019 || /__\ /___\ /_\ /___\IQ# 3.14159 Flyin' high with The Bat! v3.0.1.33 over the swamps of Windows 2000 5.0 build 2195 Service Pack 4 Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
Hello MaXxX! On Thursday, October 28, 2004, 12:55 PM, you wrote: M I don't like this scenario one bit. MaXxX, I don't like it either, as your contributions are very, very valuable. With Allie, I say that you make perfect sense. All that needs dead-horsing is the series of attacks suggesting that your request is unreasonable and suggesting for you to like it or leave it in regard to the present beta-testing set-up. -- Best regards, Mary The Bat (Professional Edition) 3.0.2.2 Rush on Windows XP 5.1 2600 Service Pack 2 Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
Hello Allie Martin everyone else 28-Okt-2004 19:40, you wrote: He's looking for and asking for an easy way to run another installation in parallel to the one he relies on for day to day work. It depends on the definition of beta, and how to use it (as it was already stated here). I remember the days when I tested different email programs. Setting the one I tested to leave mails on the server while at the same time carefully watching to not accidentally use the productive other program (that is set to delete mails from the server), and whatnot... personally, I find a parallel installation is just not usable for anything else but some testing. I for one wouldn't find the time to test in a real environment, if I weren't using my normal everyday installation. Thus, I create backups I revert to the previous version by exchanging the executable again easily. No harm done. And yes, I've had damaged message bases during the v3.01 beta cycle (but I never knew if it was the beta or something else that wrecked havoc), but it doesn't worry me because I'm using TB only for my private mails. Personally, I wouldn't use beta versions in a productive environment (I had that once with the XPSP2 RC's, and I'm cured, really). -- Best regards, Alexander (http://www.neurowerx.de - ICQ 238153981) using v3.0.1.33 on Windows XP Pro Service Pack 2 Deliplayer2 is playing: Obscured by Klaus I. by Pete Namlook, Klaus Schulze Bill Laswell from the 1998 album 'The Dark Side of the Moog VII' Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
Hello Alexander! On Thursday, October 28, 2004 at 8:08:53 PM you wrote: It depends on the definition of beta, and how to use it (as it was already stated here). Couldn't we just agree on everybody using beta as he likes? Corollary: ... at his own risk. -- Dierk Haasis :Dierk: Copy 'n' Concept The Bat 3.0.2.2 Rush on Windows XP 5.1 2600 Service Pack 2 Chat info for ICQ, AIM, MSN, Yahoo, Jabber upon request Neither the number of base pairs nor the number of genes in an organism's genome bears much if any relation to that organism's size or complexity. (Matt Ridley) Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
Hello Allie, Thursday, October 28, 2004, 12:40:49, you wrote: AM On Thursday, October 28, 2004, at 12:37 PM, Alexander S. AM Kunz wrote: But it does - no one forces you to participate in the beta test program, aye? AM Why not stop this? MaXXX wants to beta test. He just wishes to beta AM test without having to use his working installation as the beta test AM bed. AM He's looking for and asking for an easy way to run another AM installation in parallel to the one he relies on for day to day work. AM Prior to MSI installations, it was OK, but there are little glitches AM now that he mentioned. I don't find his concerns unreasonable. Clearly AM Ritlabs did too and offered something before. My own twopence: Yes, moving on to MSIs hase made testing betas much more difficult. And, yes, RL should help on this. And, YES, MaXxX is within reason with his request. And, now that I understand MaXxX's problem better, I do agree that RL should provide something that will allow two instances of TB! to be used. With due care -- for example, by setting the second (beta) one *not* to delete POP3 messages from teh server, one would be able even to concurrently run the production and the beta without impact. Of course, this still requires one to duplicate the message base, but this (I think) is a small problem. And, again I stress, it is up to RL to state HOW to do this. I am still right on what I said earlier, but I now think I was too limited in my view. -- ..hggdh.. Using The Bat! v3.0.1.33 and BayesIt! 0.7.3 on Windows 2000 5.0 Build 2195 Service Pack 4 pgpxBAICmGUFp.pgp Description: PGP signature Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
Hello George, Thursday, October 28, 2004, 12:45:28, you wrote: GMM Thursday, October 28, 2004, 8:42:35 PM, George M. Menegakis wrote: beta test must take the decision and the implicit risk. GMM s/test/tester ahhh, an UNIX user... Good. I was thinking I was alone here :-) s/test/tester/ -- ..hggdh.. Using The Bat! v3.0.1.33 and BayesIt! 0.7.3 on Windows 2000 5.0 Build 2195 Service Pack 4 pgpHz3hRjYypf.pgp Description: PGP signature Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Running multiple instances of TB (was 3022 is awfull)
Hello hggdh, Thursday, October 28, 2004, 1:29:38 PM, you wrote: h My own twopence: Yes, moving on to MSIs hase made testing betas much h more difficult. And, yes, RL should help on this. And, YES, MaXxX is h within reason with his request. h And, now that I understand MaXxX's problem better, I do agree that RL h should provide something that will allow two instances of TB! to be h used. With due care -- for example, by setting the second (beta) one h *not* to delete POP3 messages from teh server, one would be able even h to concurrently run the production and the beta without impact. Of h course, this still requires one to duplicate the message base, but h this (I think) is a small problem. h And, again I stress, it is up to RL to state HOW to do this. I have not tried this recently with TB (I use a separate machine for my testing these days), but here is something that has worked in the past for some programs. I will assume that the initial install is in C:/pgm-files/TheBat and the data is in C:/docs/TheBat. Rename those two directories to something like OldBat then install the new Beta version. Assume it is set up to use the same two directories, C:/pgm-files/TheBat and C:/docs/TheBat. Fine. Now all you need are two batch files. These will remane the associated directories. So Use-Old.bat will rename C:/pgm-files/TheBat to C:/pgm-files/BetaBat and C:/docs/TheBat to C:/docs/BetaBat then rename C:/pgm-files/OldBat to C:/pgm-files/TheBat and C:/docs/OldBat back to C:/docs/TheBat. And Use-Beta.bat will rename C:/pgm-files/TheBat to C:/pgm-files/OldBat and C:/docs/TheBat to C:/docs/OldBat then rename C:/pgm-files/BetaBat to C:/pgm-files/TheBat and C:/docs/BetaBat back to C:/docs/TheBat. To be safe, I would put tests that would make sure that the directories were in the appropriate configuration for the requested change or display a message. You could not run both at the same time this way (dangerous in any event) but gives you an easy way to switch between the two that should not have problems ... unless there are incompatible registry entries. In which case you could set about to fix those, but that is more difficult and risky. I have found the separate install on a test machine to be much safer. -- Best regards, MikeDmailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Using The Bat! v3.0.2.1 on Windows ME 4.90 Build 3000 Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
Hello Mary, A reminder of what Mary Bull typed on: 28 October 2004 at 18:38:35 GMT +0200 MB Tony, do you think this behavior could be ISP related? I had a lot of MB trouble with my ISP on Tuesday. Don't really know Mary, I collect mail from two providers, NTL who I get Broad Band access from `and 11 who host my domain name, I have a email account with both and I'm having no problems with either. TB seems to run faster on this Laptop than it does the desktop but that's a processor issue, not a Bat issue. 3022 runs perfectly fine on both of them. I was going to try it on my Wifes Celeron but I bought Adobe Premiere Elements today to go with my Digital Video camera so I've been playing with that instead. There doesn't seem to be any rhyme or reason to it, it seems to have affected all types of machine, processor type and OS so I don't know what to try next. All the PC's here came with XP installed so I have no other OS to try it on... Trying it on the SuSE box wouldn't be a fair comparison I don't think. Like someone suggested earlier, it may be a conflict with another application, one that you and I don't use. Don't fancy listing every bit of software on this PC to test the theory though :) Either way, I don't think people should get moody or fall out over it, that won't solve anything. I've been away all summer and I've come back to Crash, Bang, Wallop, think I'll go back to TBOT, they're more friendly on there! Just a JOKE, I don't mean it :) -- Best regards,Tony. _ The Bat! v3.0.2.2 Rush 28/10/2004 at 21:27 UTC 2ØØ4 - AWB Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
Hello Mary, I meant to comment on this point before but went to get a cuppa and forgot. A reminder of what Mary Bull typed on: 28 October 2004 at 18:38:35 GMT +0200 MB Do, but from all the information we've gathered so far, I'm beginning MB to suspect some effect of ISP's on the Connection Centre. One of my ISP's use authentication for both send and receive, the other doesn't, just receive. So wether that's a valid point or not I wouldn't know. -- Best regards,Tony. _ The Bat! v3.0.2.2 Rush 28/10/2004 at 21:46 UTC 2ØØ4 - AWB Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: SOT: Problems with PowerPro macros (was: Re: 3022 is awfull)
Hello Allie, Hmmm. You're into PowerPro, aren't you? ;) Not really. When I get a new program I usually try to see what it can do and what options it has but PowerPro has so many! I learnt enough to write a few keyboard macros and add some buttons and menus to TB and then forgot all about it. I'll have a look at that and contact you off-list in case of problems. You seem like a good fella to get some assistance with on this one. Hope you don't mind. ;) No, I don't mind if you don't mind paying for a beer each time ;-) Anyway, believe what I say above. There are thousands of things and options about PowerPro that I have never tried. -- Best regards, Miguel A. Urech (El Escorial - Spain) Using The Bat! v3.0.2.2 Rush on Windows 2000 5.0 Service Pack 4 Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re[2]: 3022 is awfull
Hello Allie, Thursday, October 28, 2004, 6:07:45 AM, you wrote: You're using the backup utility to create backups that you restore from? This was a backup that I had about 2 weeks ago. I've never done a complete uninstall of TB! since using it in 1999. I've usually just switched executables. If I have a problem with the new one, I replace it with the one I was using before. The beta download consists of just the program executable. I rename the one I was using and then place the beta in the installation directory. I then try it. If I'm not happy, I just delete it and rename the old executable back to the right name. I do the same, however this time when I went back to beta 19 everything went hawwire. -- Best regards, Timmailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re[2]: 3022 is awfull
Hello Alexander, Thursday, October 28, 2004, 1:37:51 PM, you wrote: But it does - no one forces you to participate in the beta test program, aye? You are absolutely right they don't unless the company releases a beta product as an official release, as we have recently experienced. -- Best regards, Timmailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
Hello MaXxX, Then, don't volunteer to beta test. Period. :) Pff. Great suggestion, sir. However it doesn't solve the problem, does it. Maxxx, I understand what you want. But I think that if you want to beta test you _have_ to take some risk and use the software in a real working environment. I know _I_ am taking a risk by doing what I describe in my reply to Allie mid:[EMAIL PROTECTED], but how else can I test TB with all the accounts, filters, templates, QTs, etc., that I normally use for my work? -- Best regards, Miguel A. Urech (El Escorial - Spain) Using The Bat! v3.0.2.2 Rush on Windows 2000 5.0 Service Pack 4 Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Beta testing (was: Re: 3022 is awfull)
Hallo MaXxX, On Thu, 28 Oct 2004 19:55:34 +0200GMT (28-10-2004, 19:55 +0200, where I live), you wrote: M I'm asking for a way to make betatesting easier, as it was for the M short time between introducing the /REG parameter and turning to MSI M installations. Well, you could always configure another user account in Windows 2000 and do a second install. I realize that that might not be the optimal solution for you, but IMO beta testing should be done with a working configuration as beta testing should be testing whether the thing works in everyday use. Since everybody need to make his own decisions about running his/her system, you and I are entitled to different opinions on how to run tests. Never mind the cookie though. ;-) -- Groetjes, Roelof Before we go any further, do you love me? The Bat! 3.0.2.2 Rush Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 2 1 pop3 account, server on LAN pgp91U8HbocCJ.pgp Description: PGP signature Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
Hallo Tim, On Wed, 27 Oct 2004 22:16:27 -0400GMT (28-10-2004, 4:16 +0200, where I live), you wrote: TC This is the worst I have seen. Can't confirm. I absolutely love it. Starts fast, exits as a breeze. I don't use any VF's though and I read that they're not functioning optimally. -- Groetjes, Roelof If worst comes to worst, you *CAN* turn most things off. The Bat! 3.0.2.2 Rush Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 2 1 pop3 account, server on LAN pgpf1MpfABw4M.pgp Description: PGP signature Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
On Thursday, October 28, 2004, at 04:19 PM, MAU wrote: Maxxx, I understand what you want. But I think that if you want to beta test you _have_ to take some risk and use the software in a real working environment. I know _I_ am taking a risk by doing what I describe in my reply to Allie mid:[EMAIL PROTECTED], but how else can I test TB with all the accounts, filters, templates, QTs, etc., that I normally use for my work? Prepare the other installation and then overwrite that alternative installation directory with the contents of your regular install. You now have parallel installations that are configured the same way. Set the test client to leave messages on the server. When one install is getting significantly different to the other, do another overwrite. The registry settings aren't really that important to the working of either installs. It's as you say, those templates and filters which aren't stored in the registry. -- -=[ Allie ]=- ... Point not found. A)bort, R)eread, I)gnore. Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: SOT: Problems with PowerPro macros (was: Re: 3022 is awfull)
On Thursday, October 28, 2004, at 03:53 PM, MAU wrote: Not really. When I get a new program I usually try to see what it can do and what options it has but PowerPro has so many! I learnt enough to write a few keyboard macros and add some buttons and menus to TB and then forgot all about it. That's been my approach as well. I learn and use on a need to know and use basis. :) No, I don't mind if you don't mind paying for a beer each time ;-) Anyway, believe what I say above. There are thousands of things and options about PowerPro that I have never tried. Sure. I didn't really expect you to know all about PowerPro. All I personally use it for at the moment, is for executing keyboard macros. That's it. I see you have some experience with debugging these macros. That's all. I'm not necessarily expecting exhaustive knowledge. :) -- -=[ Allie ]=- ... OK, I'm weird! But I'm saving up to become eccentric. Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
Hello Alexander, A reminder of what Alexander S. Kunz typed on: 28 October 2004 at 19:36:55 GMT +0200 ASK But it does - no one forces you to participate in the beta test program, ASK aye? With all due respect, it doesn't solve the problem. Beta testing involves finding problems and reporting them. If we all stuck to public releases there would be no new versions and if there was they'd be full of holes and bugs. There would be a very long time in between new versions if all testing were left to the developers. Granted people shouldn't moan about them all the time but there you go, such is life :) Just for the record, 3022 has been running on the other PC all day, starting up and shutting down with not a single problem. 3022 is absolutely perfect, don't know what your all moaning about :) -- Best regards,Tony. _ The Bat! v3.0.2.2 Rush 28/10/2004 at 21:10 UTC 2ØØ4 - AWB Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
Hello Allie, Set the test client to leave messages on the server. No, because if I do I will _not_ be using my normal working environment as I never leave messages on server. Anyway, don't worry about me. There have been times in the past, and may be in the future, that I do not engage in beta testing. But when I do, _I_ decide to do so and _I_ decide to take the risk. Also, if normally just do a daily backup, while I am beta testing I may easily set my Second Copy 2000 to backup TB several times a day. -- Best regards, Miguel A. Urech (El Escorial - Spain) Using The Bat! v3.0.2.2 Rush on Windows 2000 5.0 Service Pack 4 Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
Hallo MAU, On Fri, 29 Oct 2004 01:16:49 +0200GMT (29-10-2004, 1:16 +0200, where I live), you wrote: Set the test client to leave messages on the server. M No, because if I do I will _not_ be using my normal working environment M as I never leave messages on server. I know you're using Mercury as mail server and I'm not familiar with it, but my mail server enables me to send copies to an archive (I can set the archive to automatically expire to any period). I've been using Mailtraq for years now, but most mail servers I've tried in the past had a similar feature. M Anyway, don't worry about me. I won't. ;-) -- Groetjes, Roelof In spite of the cost of living, it's still popular. The Bat! 3.0.2.2 Rush Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 2 1 pop3 account, server on LAN pgpsstyZqtcCL.pgp Description: PGP signature Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
On Thu, 28 Oct 2004 23:19:32 +0200, MAU wrote: I know _I_ am taking a risk by doing what I describe in my reply to Allie mid:[EMAIL PROTECTED], but how else can I test TB with all the accounts, filters, templates, QTs, etc., that I normally use for my work? You could do that: 1) by running The Beta! version simultaneously on another machine (just like I did until I got fed up with it). 2) by running The Beta! version simultaneously on the same machine, but as an independent program. This should not be very hard to understand. Arjan -- [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
On Fri, 29 Oct 2004 01:16:49 +0200, MAU wrote: Set the test client to leave messages on the server. No, because if I do I will _not_ be using my normal working environment as I never leave messages on server. Then set the release version to leave messages on the server. Arjan -- [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
On Thursday, October 28, 2004, at 8:02:50 PM, Tony wrote: Can't say I agree with anything you wrote, this is about the best, fastest and so far, most efficient and capable version I've used for years. Perhaps, but there are an awful lot of users such as myself who are unable to even close The Bat, so I would have to say that for us it's not the best. -- -=Nick Andriash=- -=Creston, B.C. Canada=- The Bat! Pro v3.0.1.33 on Win XP Pro Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
At 19:37 [GMT+0200] on Thursday October 28 (actual time - 1:37am on Friday in Perth, Western Australia), you wrote: [snips] Then, don't volunteer to beta test. Period. :) Pff. Great suggestion, sir. However it doesn't solve the problem, does it. Alexander But it does - no one forces you to participate in the beta test program, Alexander aye? Depends. It's not like official releases are much different. -- cheers, Mic (reply address works) I have found that when you are deeply troubled there are things you get from the silent devoted companionship of a dog that you can get from no other source. Doris Day Actress Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
On Thursday, October 28, 2004 at 7:59:07 PM [GMT -0500], Arjan De Groot wrote: Then set the release version to leave messages on the server. Don't worry about him. :) -- -= Allie =- . If it walks out of your refrigerator, LET IT GO !! __ IMAP [ Client: The Bat! v3.0.2.2 Rush | Server: MDaemon Pro ] OS: Windows XP Pro (Service Pack 2) Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
On Thu 28-Oct-04 10:04pm -0400, Nick Andriash wrote: On Thursday, October 28, 2004, at 8:02:50 PM, Tony wrote: Can't say I agree with anything you wrote, this is about the best, fastest and so far, most efficient and capable version I've used for years. Perhaps, but there are an awful lot of users such as myself who are unable to even close The Bat, so I would have to say that for us it's not the best. There are a few annoying problems with the beta, such as not properly updating the virtual folders - particularly for those of us who read our mail with ctrl-right_arrow (you find yourself reading mail you've already read). But this close problem, which I've hit twice after repeatedly testing for it, doesn't appear to be a big deal. Closing TB! is something I don't do very often - perhaps once every week or two - usually it's when a new beta comes out :-) [Note: if you close down every night, as I do, use standby or hibernate.] Also, I've always been able to close with the Task Manager on both the 2 times it happened during that testing. -- Best regards, Bill The Bat! 3.0.2.2 Rush Pro - BayesIt! 0.7.3 - XP Pro SP2 - POP3 Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
3022 is awfull
Hello tbbeta, This is the worst I have seen. I have spent the past 5 hours restoring going back in builds etc etc. I completely unistalled the Bat went back to 3.0 did a restore, then upgraded to this build and had the strangest occurance I have ever seen. A completely blank screen, nothing there except the Bat was downlading mail as the mail ticker was working and showing new mail downloaded, but I had no folders, nothing. This happened two or three times and I went back to build 10 before rc1 and all was seemed to be fine except all of my folders were gone. I then did a restore at that point and my message base and folders came back only to disappear the next time I restarted the Bat. I then had to do a restore again, and then upgraded to this newest beta again and it is the sluggish thing I have ever seen, its running terrible and don't even think about shutting the program down. -- Best regards, Tim mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
Hello Tim, on Wednesday, 27. October 2004, at 22:16:27 [GMT -0400] you wrote regarding 3022 is awfull: This is the worst I have seen. I have spent the past 5 hours restoring going back in builds etc etc. just a few words. That is the risk of Betas. Just make a 'complete' backup of the registry entries of thebat, copy the mail folder to a secure place and everybody - specially you - is happy. -- Ciao Thomas Using: TheBat! 3.0.2.1 System: Windows XP Build 2600 Service Pack 2 PGP:Key-ID: 0x70D9F03B Visit: TheBat! World on http://www.thebatworld.de pgpQ193LzQpw5.pgp Description: PGP signature Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: 3022 is awfull
On Wed, 27 Oct 2004 22:16:27 -0400, Tim Casten [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello tbbeta, This is the worst I have seen. I have spent the past 5 hours restoring going back in builds etc etc. Have you filed appropriate bug reports? -- Kevin Current beta is 3.0.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
