Re: [time-nuts] HQ 5370B manual available
Hello, I've modified those two pages, could you check if they reflect the intended changes? http://www.rbarrios.com/manuals/5370B_page5-8_corrected.pdf http://www.rbarrios.com/manuals/5370B_page8-113_corrected.pdf If we are 100% sure they are now correct, I will replace the old ones with them. Regards, Roberto EB4EQA Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2011 08:46:42 -0800 From: Dan Rae Subject: Re: [time-nuts] HQ 5370B manual available To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement Message-ID: <4d63e872.4000...@verizon.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed On 2/22/2011 7:42 AM, J.D. Bakker wrote: At 06:23 -0800 22-02-2011, Dan Rae wrote: Be aware that there are some odd errors in this manual that I pointed out when I was working on mine a while ago, but it may have been on the -hp- list... That would be in http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/hp_agilent_equipment/message/17686 and onward, right? JDB. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] VCXO help
That's a bit of an open question since it depends on many things. So I realize this may be a bit too generic, but hey you said "any hints ;)". Simple example that I know to work in linux, and the same principle should work in windows. 1 - make i2c interface with parallel port + couple of resistors 2 - bit-bang i2c protocol 3 - Write To The Registers You Need [tm] You only have to invest the time for 1 & 2 once, and then you can do the same trick for all other i2c ic's out there as well. What you could also do is grab an avr board (arduino du jour) with an avr on it that does spi, i2c and rs232. There's plenty that have these features. Write a small C program that accepts commands over rs232, and writes registers over i2c or spi. That way you only need to buy a cheap arduino and write a small program in C for the avr. Compile with sdcc... For me I'd use SPI, connect to a board I already have, and use a small perl script that I already have for this sort of thing, but that's no help to you. :P Other methods as well, it just depends on what you are comfortable with, and what you already have lying around... regards, Fred "ehydra at arcor.de" wrote: > Hm. Concerning the CS2x00. Is there a PC software available to program > it via i2c? I mean without this IDT monster software. > > Any hint is welcome! ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] HQ 5370B manual available
On 02/26/11 01:53 AM, paul swed wrote: Thats interesting I had no idea that you might be able to put a better copy on the agilent site. Well, it would need Agilent's permission of course - someone there would need to agree to it, and someone put it on the web site. That is probably no easy task in a company like Agilent. At the time I created that PDF, someone was employed by Agilent who was getting manuals together to put on the site. I suspect he has moved on to other things, and so it might be very difficult to get a copy replaced. But if there is universal agreement it's better, then it should be replaced. It seems a bit pointless Agilent making available the copy I created, if a better one exists. I only had an A4 scanner, so the circuit diagrams were like a jigsaw, but at the time it was the only PDF available. Dave On Fri, Feb 25, 2011 at 6:43 PM, David Kirkbywrote: On 22 February 2011 12:17, John Miles wrote: Nice scan, thanks! Same edition as David Kirkby's earlier scan, but with full-page foldouts. This one goes on the iPad for sure. -- john, KE5FX The 5370B manual on the Agilent web site is a downsampled version of the one I produced. From what I gather, Roberto's done a better job than me, so it would be worth trying to get the one on the Agilent web site changed. I would certainly not feel insulted. Dave ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. -- A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text. Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing? A: Top-posting. Q: What is the most annoying thing in e-mail? Dave ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] pts 160 power problem
Hi, Since this thread is about a PTS repair, I think this is not too much OT. I need the manual for my PTS 040, I already have one for the 160 from Didier's site and while both models are similar end employ most the same modules, I would like to have the specific one for my model. According to PTS web site this model is still on production, but I think that asking PTS for one would cost me much more than I paid for the real thing. If anybody knows were I can get one I'll appreciate very much. Regards, Ignacio, EB4APL El 26/02/2011 0:27, J. Forster wrote: That depends on the phase of the moon and your religion. Sometimes low-ESR aluminum; other times good Tantalums (150D or CS-13s) No two people agree on this issue. -John == thanks everyone. i found a cache of tantalum caps in the output amp module. also, there isn't any output any more. struggling to get all those @#@ screws out so i can get to them. should i find new tantalum caps, or is there a better substitute? dave On Fri, Feb 25, 2011 at 11:29 AM, wrote: In a message dated 25/02/2011 17:13:01 GMT Standard Time, dave.mall...@gmail.com writes: i tried another more robust 5v supply, but that goes to 4.5v and ng output. i removed each of the plug-in decades, one at a time, looking for the guilty one. no joy. i also removed the left rear module (uses 5v). the other two modules only use 12v. which is fine. has anyone been here before? could it be a problem in the backplane (a work of art, btw)? --- Hi Dave I've used quite a few of these and have never yet experienced an actual component failure, obviously not saying it can't happen just that once sorted yours should remain pretty reliable. As John already suggested I'd also look for possible fautly tantalums or other capacitors across the supply but would also suggest removing all the modules from the motherboard at the same time before proceeding any furter and checking if the symptoms still persist. I know what you've done has probably eliminated the modules but it would be a shame to tear into the backplane if you just happened to have more than one faulty module. I did once receive a previously working PTS160 by post that refused to play and eventually located a very small solder blob, presumably from inside the associated module, that had dropped into an edge connector and wedged between a couple of pins, that was fun:-) If you haven't already found it there's a manual for the PT160 on Didier's site. _http://www.ko4bb.com/cgi-bin/manuals.pl?dir=05%29_GPS_Timing/PTS_ (http://www.ko4bb.com/cgi-bin/manuals.pl?dir=05)_GPS_Timing/PTS) regards Nigel GM8PZR ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. -- Dave Mallery, K5EN (ubuntu linux 10.10) HC31 Box 99E; Williamsburg, NM 87942 no gates... no windows! free at last! linux counter #64628 (since 1997) "People aren't as dumb as Microsoft needs them to be." --PJ, May 2007 ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] HQ 5370B manual available
Thats interesting I had no idea that you might be able to put a better copy on the agilent site. On Fri, Feb 25, 2011 at 6:43 PM, David Kirkby wrote: > On 22 February 2011 12:17, John Miles wrote: > > Nice scan, thanks! Same edition as David Kirkby's earlier scan, but with > full-page foldouts. This one goes on the iPad for sure. > > > > -- john, KE5FX > > The 5370B manual on the Agilent web site is a downsampled version of > the one I produced. From what I gather, Roberto's done a better job > than me, so it would be worth trying to get the one on the Agilent web > site changed. I would certainly not feel insulted. > > Dave > > ___ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to > https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there. > ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] HP 5061
Sorry, thought that was going off-list. The offer stands to anyone else who might have any -60109 parts they want to get rid of. :) -- john, KE5FX > -Original Message- > From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com]On > Behalf Of John Miles > Sent: Friday, February 25, 2011 5:48 PM > To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement > Subject: Re: [time-nuts] HP 5061 > > > Hi, Bert -- > > If there's a 10811-60109 OCXO, I'd be interested in buying that > from you in > the $100 neighborhood. > > -- john > > > -Original Message- > > From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com]On > > Behalf Of ewkeh...@aol.com > > Sent: Friday, February 25, 2011 4:54 PM > > To: time-nuts@febo.com > > Subject: [time-nuts] HP 5061 > > > > > > Cleaning out an attic that I had not touched in ten years I found > > some HP > > 5061A manuals, HP 10811 manuals, AC and DC power cords, plastic feet and > > most the parts of a unit. If there is interest please contact me > > directly. > > Bert Kehren > > ___ > > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > > To unsubscribe, go to > > https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > > and follow the instructions there. > > > > > ___ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to > https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there. > ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] HP 5061
Hi, Bert -- If there's a 10811-60109 OCXO, I'd be interested in buying that from you in the $100 neighborhood. -- john > -Original Message- > From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com]On > Behalf Of ewkeh...@aol.com > Sent: Friday, February 25, 2011 4:54 PM > To: time-nuts@febo.com > Subject: [time-nuts] HP 5061 > > > Cleaning out an attic that I had not touched in ten years I found > some HP > 5061A manuals, HP 10811 manuals, AC and DC power cords, plastic feet and > most the parts of a unit. If there is interest please contact me > directly. > Bert Kehren > ___ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to > https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there. > ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] HP 5061
Cleaning out an attic that I had not touched in ten years I found some HP 5061A manuals, HP 10811 manuals, AC and DC power cords, plastic feet and most the parts of a unit. If there is interest please contact me directly. Bert Kehren ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] PN sequence generation using GPS
Hi Obviously I'd have to be in the neighborhood (as in well under a KM away). To be bothered by a fast system, I'd also have to be there already. With a poor system, I'd be bothered further out and could track it further out. I would put a good RF filter in front of the detector to get rid of a lot of the clutter. Switchers aren't going to put out 10 watts of RF at 144 MHz. The biggest thing would be cable TV leakage that's "in band". If I had to put something together this weekend, I'd chop the front end out of a donor radio and keep it's RF stage intact. That would take care of a lot of the little loss issues that the filtering would bring to the party. My real concern is more interference to GPS from some of these odd systems various commercial outfits come up with. I'd like to be able to keep running timing via GPS for a while. The same things that apply to tracking down a strange ham system apply equally to other spread spectrum systems. Simply figuring out who / what / where is going to get harder as time goes on. Bob On Feb 25, 2011, at 1:55 PM, Chuck Harris wrote: > Of course. A simple field strength meter comes to mind. But how > are you going to know that you want to stand at my mailbox and look? > > And with a direct sequence system, the power is going to be smeared so > thin over a wide band that you really won't have anything to see, other > than a bulk reading of power in my vicinity. I'm already doing that with > the switching supplies, compact fluorescent lamps, ordinary fluorescent > lamps, cell phones, wireless routers, microwave ovens, ... It's a literal > RF sewer over here! > > -Chuck Harris > > Bob Camp wrote: >> Hi >> >> If you are putting out> 20 watts and I'm close enough to see your mailbox, >> I'll detect you with some pretty simple >> stuff. >> >> Bob > > ___ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] VCXO help
That price differential is definitely a big reason why I don't use that sort of adapter board. A $5 chip in a $12 adapter is just crazy. I could be spending that same money on trying out this or that nifty part... But like Chris pointed out, for BGA it would make sense. No way am I going to try hand soldering those. ;) - Original Message From: paul swed To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement Sent: Fri, February 25, 2011 9:51:03 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] VCXO help Boy even though they are $12 for larger packages I would need them. It is so easy to create solder bridges. I can get away with direct connections to 14 pin or less and honestly have to say about 10. It seems crazy because the micro as an example might be $5. But thats the reality. regards Paul On Fri, Feb 25, 2011 at 3:20 PM, Chris Albertson wrote: > On Fri, Feb 25, 2011 at 11:02 AM, Tijd Dingen > wrote: > > Hello Chris, > > > > No I didn't know SchmartBoards, thanks for the tip. > > > > Although maybe I am missing something... I just checked their site, and > > watched the videos, but I couldn't find anything I'd spend $12 on. > > > > When you say that it is "expensive at $12 each, but you need only one", > > do you mean that as "you only need to buy one gizmo once and you can > > reuse it to solder multiple different QFNs for several of you > prototypes"? > > No I meant one per project or one per chip > > If you can solder these by hand to a PCB you don't need this. > "SchmartBoards" are for people who can't. the little boards are just > breakout boards. You solder the chip to the SchmartBoard and then > each lead goes to a larger through hole that is easier to use. > Basically it turns a QFN chip in to a part with .1" lead pitch. > > Their innovation was to use a router to mill out the PCB so the chip > self-aligns and can't slide off the pads, so like I said you can > solder it with eyes closed. The traces going to the pads are in > little trenches with fiber/epoxy walls between so you can't make a > solder bridge > > The traces on the PCB are actually milled out trenches that are filled > with solder. You place the chip in the board then place the solder > iron some distance from the chip and the solder in the trench melts. > These are aimed at someone who wants to prototype with SMT components > > Maybe you don't need this is you can hand solder QFN but hand > soldering BGA is hard and they have these for BGA too. > > -- > = > Chris Albertson > Redondo Beach, California > > ___ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to > https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there. > ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] pts 160 power problem
Hi Far easier to simply replace them with modern tantalum parts than to try to find something else. Modern parts are likely to run a very long time. Bob On Feb 25, 2011, at 6:24 PM, Dave Mallery wrote: > thanks everyone. > > i found a cache of tantalum caps in the output amp module. also, there > isn't any output any more. > struggling to get all those @#@ screws out so i can get to them. > > should i find new tantalum caps, or is there a better substitute? > > dave > > On Fri, Feb 25, 2011 at 11:29 AM, wrote: > >> >> In a message dated 25/02/2011 17:13:01 GMT Standard Time, >> dave.mall...@gmail.com writes: >> >> i tried another more robust 5v supply, but that goes to 4.5v and ng >> output. >> >> i removed each of the plug-in decades, one at a time, looking for the >> guilty >> one. no joy. i also removed the left rear module (uses 5v). the other >> two >> modules only use 12v. which is fine. >> >> has anyone been here before? could it be a problem in the backplane (a >> work >> of art, btw)? >> >> >> >> --- >> Hi Dave >> >> >> I've used quite a few of these and have never yet experienced an actual >> component failure, obviously not saying it can't happen just that once >> sorted >> yours should remain pretty reliable. >> >> >> As John already suggested I'd also look for possible fautly tantalums or >> other capacitors across the supply but would also suggest removing all the >> modules from the motherboard at the same time before proceeding any furter >> and checking if the symptoms still persist. >> I know what you've done has probably eliminated the modules but it would >> be a shame to tear into the backplane if you just happened to have more >> than >> one faulty module. >> >> I did once receive a previously working PTS160 by post that refused to play >> and eventually located a very small solder blob, presumably from inside >> the associated module, that had dropped into an edge connector and wedged >> between a couple of pins, that was fun:-) >> >> If you haven't already found it there's a manual for the PT160 on Didier's >> site. >> >> _http://www.ko4bb.com/cgi-bin/manuals.pl?dir=05%29_GPS_Timing/PTS_ >> (http://www.ko4bb.com/cgi-bin/manuals.pl?dir=05)_GPS_Timing/PTS) >> >> regards >> >> Nigel >> GM8PZR >> >> ___ >> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com >> To unsubscribe, go to >> https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts >> and follow the instructions there. >> > > > > -- > Dave Mallery, K5EN (ubuntu linux 10.10) > HC31 Box 99E; Williamsburg, NM 87942 > > no gates... > no windows! >free at last! > linux counter #64628 (since 1997) > > "People aren't as dumb as Microsoft needs them to be." > --PJ, May 2007 > ___ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] VCXO help
Heh, I could care less about typos. I just honestly didn't understand what you meant. The best matches I could come up with was "bubble counter" and "doubler". And since a bubble counter made no sense in this context and a doubler did, I thought I'd go with that guess and run with it. So now with that out of the way, the reason I find this interesting is that there are probably more people on this list that need a fairly simple yet "good enough" quality 100+ MHz reference locked to a 5/10 MHz reference. In fact I know of a few already... Taking my case I'd like to end up with a GPSDO with 10 MHz output and distribute that to a number of other projects. One project being a counter for which I need a low jitter reference of anywhere between 100 MHz and 500 MHz, whichever frequency happens to coincide with the easiest design tradeoffs to realize. So for the low jitter version I would use the CVHD-950 VCXO series as per Said's advice in the "10MHz to 80MHz frequency multiplier suggestions" thread, together with an ADF4002. And for the simpler design, with worse but still okay phase noise/jitter, I would use the ADF4360-9. And you, based on your requirements for your project, would maybe go for the Cirrus Logic CS2300-CP. And other people on this list would need something which is fairly similar to one variety or the other. It would be nice if we had a collection of simple solutions where we have schematics + gerbers, from which time-nuts members could pick the one they need for their project and not spend too much time re-inventing the wheel. Just spend the time to familiarize themselves with a particular well designed and known-to-work wheel that fits the needs for their project. Think "sparkfun", but with a distinct time-nutty flavor. Anyways, sorry for going a wee bit off-topic... regards, Fred "Bert Kehren" wrote: > English and fingers are not perfect and I did not check before I send > it sorry about that. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Fwd: [armyradios] OT: Photos of New Zealand Earthquake
> From another list. The pics are really something! > http://www.theatlantic.com/infocus/2011/02/earthquake-in-new-zealand/100013/ Thanks. There is a good shot of the Timeball near the end: http://cdn.theatlantic.com/static/infocus/nzq022211/s_n51_02231709.jpg The Timeball Station is seen to be badly damaged, a day after the 6.3-magnitude earthquake in the township of Lyttelton near Christchurch, New Zealand, Wednesday, Feb. 23, 2011. (AP Photo/New Zealand Herald, Sarah Ivey) -- These are my opinions, not necessarily my employer's. I hate spam. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] HQ 5370B manual available
On 22 February 2011 12:17, John Miles wrote: > Nice scan, thanks! Same edition as David Kirkby's earlier scan, but with > full-page foldouts. This one goes on the iPad for sure. > > -- john, KE5FX The 5370B manual on the Agilent web site is a downsampled version of the one I produced. From what I gather, Roberto's done a better job than me, so it would be worth trying to get the one on the Agilent web site changed. I would certainly not feel insulted. Dave ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] pts 160 power problem
That depends on the phase of the moon and your religion. Sometimes low-ESR aluminum; other times good Tantalums (150D or CS-13s) No two people agree on this issue. -John == > thanks everyone. > > i found a cache of tantalum caps in the output amp module. also, there > isn't any output any more. > struggling to get all those @#@ screws out so i can get to them. > > should i find new tantalum caps, or is there a better substitute? > > dave > > On Fri, Feb 25, 2011 at 11:29 AM, wrote: > >> >> In a message dated 25/02/2011 17:13:01 GMT Standard Time, >> dave.mall...@gmail.com writes: >> >> i tried another more robust 5v supply, but that goes to 4.5v and ng >> output. >> >> i removed each of the plug-in decades, one at a time, looking for the >> guilty >> one. no joy. i also removed the left rear module (uses 5v). the >> other >> two >> modules only use 12v. which is fine. >> >> has anyone been here before? could it be a problem in the backplane (a >> work >> of art, btw)? >> >> >> >> --- >> Hi Dave >> >> >> I've used quite a few of these and have never yet experienced an actual >> component failure, obviously not saying it can't happen just that once >> sorted >> yours should remain pretty reliable. >> >> >> As John already suggested I'd also look for possible fautly tantalums or >> other capacitors across the supply but would also suggest removing all >> the >> modules from the motherboard at the same time before proceeding any >> furter >> and checking if the symptoms still persist. >> I know what you've done has probably eliminated the modules but it >> would >> be a shame to tear into the backplane if you just happened to have more >> than >> one faulty module. >> >> I did once receive a previously working PTS160 by post that refused to >> play >> and eventually located a very small solder blob, presumably from >> inside >> the associated module, that had dropped into an edge connector and >> wedged >> between a couple of pins, that was fun:-) >> >> If you haven't already found it there's a manual for the PT160 on >> Didier's >> site. >> >> _http://www.ko4bb.com/cgi-bin/manuals.pl?dir=05%29_GPS_Timing/PTS_ >> (http://www.ko4bb.com/cgi-bin/manuals.pl?dir=05)_GPS_Timing/PTS) >> >> regards >> >> Nigel >> GM8PZR >> >> ___ >> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com >> To unsubscribe, go to >> https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts >> and follow the instructions there. >> > > > > -- > Dave Mallery, K5EN (ubuntu linux 10.10) > HC31 Box 99E; Williamsburg, NM 87942 > > no gates... > no windows! > free at last! > linux counter #64628 (since 1997) > > "People aren't as dumb as Microsoft needs them to be." > --PJ, May 2007 > ___ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to > https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there. > > ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] pts 160 power problem
thanks everyone. i found a cache of tantalum caps in the output amp module. also, there isn't any output any more. struggling to get all those @#@ screws out so i can get to them. should i find new tantalum caps, or is there a better substitute? dave On Fri, Feb 25, 2011 at 11:29 AM, wrote: > > In a message dated 25/02/2011 17:13:01 GMT Standard Time, > dave.mall...@gmail.com writes: > > i tried another more robust 5v supply, but that goes to 4.5v and ng > output. > > i removed each of the plug-in decades, one at a time, looking for the > guilty > one. no joy. i also removed the left rear module (uses 5v). the other > two > modules only use 12v. which is fine. > > has anyone been here before? could it be a problem in the backplane (a > work > of art, btw)? > > > > --- > Hi Dave > > > I've used quite a few of these and have never yet experienced an actual > component failure, obviously not saying it can't happen just that once > sorted > yours should remain pretty reliable. > > > As John already suggested I'd also look for possible fautly tantalums or > other capacitors across the supply but would also suggest removing all the > modules from the motherboard at the same time before proceeding any furter > and checking if the symptoms still persist. > I know what you've done has probably eliminated the modules but it would > be a shame to tear into the backplane if you just happened to have more > than > one faulty module. > > I did once receive a previously working PTS160 by post that refused to play > and eventually located a very small solder blob, presumably from inside > the associated module, that had dropped into an edge connector and wedged > between a couple of pins, that was fun:-) > > If you haven't already found it there's a manual for the PT160 on Didier's > site. > > _http://www.ko4bb.com/cgi-bin/manuals.pl?dir=05%29_GPS_Timing/PTS_ > (http://www.ko4bb.com/cgi-bin/manuals.pl?dir=05)_GPS_Timing/PTS) > > regards > > Nigel > GM8PZR > > ___ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to > https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there. > -- Dave Mallery, K5EN (ubuntu linux 10.10) HC31 Box 99E; Williamsburg, NM 87942 no gates... no windows! free at last! linux counter #64628 (since 1997) "People aren't as dumb as Microsoft needs them to be." --PJ, May 2007 ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Fwd: [armyradios] OT: Photos of New Zealand Earthquake
>From another list. The pics are really something! -John = Original Message Subject: [armyradios] OT: Photos of New Zealand earthquake From:"David McLendon" Date:Fri, February 25, 2011 3:16 pm To: "armyradios" -- http://www.theatlantic.com/infocus/2011/02/earthquake-in-new-zealand/100013/ ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] AD-YU Electronics Precision Phase Meter Type 406L
From: John Raymond Dore Subject: [time-nuts] AD-YU Electronics Precision Phase Meter Type 406L AD-YU Electronics Precision Phase Meter Type 406L Has anyone got an instruction manual or service manual? I have the Phase Meter and now need some information. John GW3XPK johnrd...@gmail.com -- There's a manual for your 406L listed at http://www.manualsplus.com. Cheers, David dgminala at mediacombb dot net ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Nerd facts - 45 years since Allan variance article
On 2/25/11 1:28 PM, paul swed wrote: seems the first document doesn't work. Any other way to get it? Just tried it, and it worked for me... you could probably find it by googling the title or the document number (NASA SP-80) it's probably also in NTRS (NASA Technical Report Server) although a quick search didn't turn it up. but here's the link that the handle maps to http://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/casi.ntrs.nasa.gov/19660001092_1966001092.pdf It shows up in NTRS in an odd way.."Short-Term Frequency Stability" with the abstract: "Panel discussion on frequency stability measurement techniques" (301 pages: that's quite a lengthy panel discussion. almost as long as some of the threads on this list..) [1] http://hdl.handle.net/2060/19660001092 [2] http://tf.boulder.nist.gov/general/pdf/7.pdf [3] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allan_variance ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] HQ 5370B manual available
Thank you for the scan Roberto On Tue, Feb 22, 2011 at 10:51 AM, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: > In message , Roberto Barrios > write > s: > > Beautiful job Roberto! > > Thanks a lot! > > Poul-Henning > > -- > Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 > p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 > FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe > Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by incompetence. > > ___ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to > https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there. > ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Nerd facts - 45 years since Allan variance article
seems the first document doesn't work. Any other way to get it? On Sat, Feb 19, 2011 at 8:09 AM, Magnus Danielson < mag...@rubidium.dyndns.org> wrote: > Fellow time-nuts, > > I thought that a small blip on the screen to alert you on historical > context was appropriate. > > In 1964 NASA and IEEE held a "NASA-IEEE Symposium on Short-Term Stability" > [1] producing a nice set of articles. > > This was followed a special issue of IEEE proceedings on Frequency > Stability in Feb 1966. In this the articles "Statistics of Atomic Frequency > Standards" by David W. Allan [2] summarise various M-sample variance > measures, analyses them and find them bias-related to the 2-sample variance. > Further, the analysis provide proof for the convergence problems for large M > values, thus showing that the 2-sample variance provides a base-case which > every other M-sample variance can be related to. Essentially this kills the > interest in M-sample variances and replaces it with the 2-sample variance. > Similarly, for dead-time values they can using bias functions be related to > non dead-time values. So, this unified variance of 2-sample and no dead-time > is proposed as a unified vairance later called Allan's variance or Allan > variance in todays speach. > > Anyway, it is now 45 years ago since that article (and several others worth > reading). I've tried to get a summary in the Allan variance article on > Wikipedia [3]. After these articles the field has been improved > significantly by improved analysis on biases, noise-separations, statistical > certainty and improved estimators to achieve the high statistical certainty. > > [1] http://hdl.handle.net/2060/19660001092 > > [2] http://tf.boulder.nist.gov/general/pdf/7.pdf > > [3] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allan_variance > > Cheers, > Magnus > > ___ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to > https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there. > ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] VCXO help
Hm. Concerning the CS2x00. Is there a PC software available to program it via i2c? I mean without this IDT monster software. Any hint is welcome! - Henry ewkeh...@aol.com schrieb: Thanks for the info Fred The problem is the package. Looking at the Cirrus Logic CS 2300-CP and use a bubbler. Since I start out with 5 or 10 MHz there must be something out there that can be soldered. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] VCXO help
Boy even though they are $12 for larger packages I would need them. It is so easy to create solder bridges. I can get away with direct connections to 14 pin or less and honestly have to say about 10. It seems crazy because the micro as an example might be $5. But thats the reality. regards Paul On Fri, Feb 25, 2011 at 3:20 PM, Chris Albertson wrote: > On Fri, Feb 25, 2011 at 11:02 AM, Tijd Dingen > wrote: > > Hello Chris, > > > > No I didn't know SchmartBoards, thanks for the tip. > > > > Although maybe I am missing something... I just checked their site, and > > watched the videos, but I couldn't find anything I'd spend $12 on. > > > > When you say that it is "expensive at $12 each, but you need only one", > > do you mean that as "you only need to buy one gizmo once and you can > > reuse it to solder multiple different QFNs for several of you > prototypes"? > > No I meant one per project or one per chip > > If you can solder these by hand to a PCB you don't need this. > "SchmartBoards" are for people who can't. the little boards are just > breakout boards. You solder the chip to the SchmartBoard and then > each lead goes to a larger through hole that is easier to use. > Basically it turns a QFN chip in to a part with .1" lead pitch. > > Their innovation was to use a router to mill out the PCB so the chip > self-aligns and can't slide off the pads, so like I said you can > solder it with eyes closed. The traces going to the pads are in > little trenches with fiber/epoxy walls between so you can't make a > solder bridge > > The traces on the PCB are actually milled out trenches that are filled > with solder. You place the chip in the board then place the solder > iron some distance from the chip and the solder in the trench melts. > These are aimed at someone who wants to prototype with SMT components > > Maybe you don't need this is you can hand solder QFN but hand > soldering BGA is hard and they have these for BGA too. > > -- > = > Chris Albertson > Redondo Beach, California > > ___ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to > https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there. > ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] VCXO help
On Fri, Feb 25, 2011 at 11:02 AM, Tijd Dingen wrote: > Hello Chris, > > No I didn't know SchmartBoards, thanks for the tip. > > Although maybe I am missing something... I just checked their site, and > watched the videos, but I couldn't find anything I'd spend $12 on. > > When you say that it is "expensive at $12 each, but you need only one", > do you mean that as "you only need to buy one gizmo once and you can > reuse it to solder multiple different QFNs for several of you prototypes"? No I meant one per project or one per chip If you can solder these by hand to a PCB you don't need this. "SchmartBoards" are for people who can't. the little boards are just breakout boards. You solder the chip to the SchmartBoard and then each lead goes to a larger through hole that is easier to use. Basically it turns a QFN chip in to a part with .1" lead pitch. Their innovation was to use a router to mill out the PCB so the chip self-aligns and can't slide off the pads, so like I said you can solder it with eyes closed. The traces going to the pads are in little trenches with fiber/epoxy walls between so you can't make a solder bridge The traces on the PCB are actually milled out trenches that are filled with solder. You place the chip in the board then place the solder iron some distance from the chip and the solder in the trench melts. These are aimed at someone who wants to prototype with SMT components Maybe you don't need this is you can hand solder QFN but hand soldering BGA is hard and they have these for BGA too. -- = Chris Albertson Redondo Beach, California ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] VCXO help
English and fingers are not perfect and I did not check before I send it sorry about that Bert Kehren In a message dated 2/25/2011 10:50:03 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, tijddin...@yahoo.com writes: Pardon my ignorance, but what is a bubbler? Is that time-nut speak for a frequency doubler of some sort? Guessing at a doubler since you mention needing a 100 MHz output, and the CS2300 only has a 6-75 MHz output range. Just thinking aloud here... IF (big if ;) you are considering doubling, you might just as well use the ICS670-03. Add a flip-flop between the FBCLK and FBIN to serve as an external divide-by-two. Then you can use the x5 and x10 settings to give you an effective division factor of 10 and 20 respectively. Which in turn gives you 100 MHz output for that 5 Mhz or 10 MHz input. regards, Fred "Bert Kehren" wrote: > I need to multiply by 10 and 20, 670-2 can not multiply by 20. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] PN sequence generation using GPS
If you want RF sewer - look at ethernet over power (e.g. Devolo) - it's horrid. Regards, David Partridge ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] VCXO help
Hello Chris, No I didn't know SchmartBoards, thanks for the tip. Although maybe I am missing something... I just checked their site, and watched the videos, but I couldn't find anything I'd spend $12 on. When you say that it is "expensive at $12 each, but you need only one", do you mean that as "you only need to buy one gizmo once and you can reuse it to solder multiple different QFNs for several of you prototypes"? If that, then I missed it on their site. Link please? If you mean "you only need 1 QFN chip for this particular project, so spending $12 on an adapter board that you can use precisely once is not that expensive", then never mind. Then I will keep doing my current style prototyping style by hand, and spend the $12 on beer to soothe my nerves after the soldering. ;) Or spend $24 on having several PCBs manufactured that have more than just 2 QFN's on them. If you have a ready made pcb with an actual soldermask then QFN's are pretty easy. The challenge is for when you don't have a pcb with soldermask but still want to use that nifty QFN gizmo in your current "want to try it NOW" prototype. I hope I missed something, because an easy way to prototype QFN's that does not involve spending a fortune on adapter boards would be welcome. regards, Fred "Chris Albertson" wrote: > Have you seen "SchmartBoards" I think with one of those you could > solder QFM with eyes closed, literally. Hard to describe how they > work but the board is milled so the chip fits in sort of like in a > socket then you heat the trace. A local store "Fry's" caries them > now. Expensive at $12 each but you only need one > More info including video of the process here > http://www.schmartboard.com/ ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] PN sequence generation using GPS
Of course. A simple field strength meter comes to mind. But how are you going to know that you want to stand at my mailbox and look? And with a direct sequence system, the power is going to be smeared so thin over a wide band that you really won't have anything to see, other than a bulk reading of power in my vicinity. I'm already doing that with the switching supplies, compact fluorescent lamps, ordinary fluorescent lamps, cell phones, wireless routers, microwave ovens, ... It's a literal RF sewer over here! -Chuck Harris Bob Camp wrote: Hi If you are putting out> 20 watts and I'm close enough to see your mailbox, I'll detect you with some pretty simple stuff. Bob ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] PN sequence generation using GPS
Moving beyond part 97 and ahead to some new potentially authorized applications. The FCC has mandated a narrowbanding initiative for land mobile frequencies from 150-512 MHz. This frees up 12.5 KHz bandwidth channels BETWEEN the current incumbent allocations. A frequency hopped technique could utilize the new blank spaces in the spectrum and create a new mode of multiple access service. -- Joe Leikhim Leikhim and Associates Communications Consultants Oviedo, Florida www.Leikhim.com jleik...@leikhim.com 407-982-0446 WWW.LEIKHIM.COM ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] pts 160 power problem
In a message dated 25/02/2011 17:13:01 GMT Standard Time, dave.mall...@gmail.com writes: i tried another more robust 5v supply, but that goes to 4.5v and ng output. i removed each of the plug-in decades, one at a time, looking for the guilty one. no joy. i also removed the left rear module (uses 5v). the other two modules only use 12v. which is fine. has anyone been here before? could it be a problem in the backplane (a work of art, btw)? --- Hi Dave I've used quite a few of these and have never yet experienced an actual component failure, obviously not saying it can't happen just that once sorted yours should remain pretty reliable. As John already suggested I'd also look for possible fautly tantalums or other capacitors across the supply but would also suggest removing all the modules from the motherboard at the same time before proceeding any furter and checking if the symptoms still persist. I know what you've done has probably eliminated the modules but it would be a shame to tear into the backplane if you just happened to have more than one faulty module. I did once receive a previously working PTS160 by post that refused to play and eventually located a very small solder blob, presumably from inside the associated module, that had dropped into an edge connector and wedged between a couple of pins, that was fun:-) If you haven't already found it there's a manual for the PT160 on Didier's site. _http://www.ko4bb.com/cgi-bin/manuals.pl?dir=05%29_GPS_Timing/PTS_ (http://www.ko4bb.com/cgi-bin/manuals.pl?dir=05)_GPS_Timing/PTS) regards Nigel GM8PZR ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] PN sequence generation using GPS
Hi If you are putting out > 20 watts and I'm close enough to see your mailbox, I'll detect you with some pretty simple stuff. Bob On Feb 25, 2011, at 1:16 PM, Chuck Harris wrote: > I guess that is why I mentioned something about doing it competently. > > The FCC so seriously winged the methods usable by hams as to render them > effectively useless. > > A nice direct sequence spread spectrum system with a couple of MHz > spread would be well below the background noise of any narrow band > receiver. Sure, you could find it with a wide band detector if you were > close by, but how would you know that you weren't looking at some other > anomaly, like a bad insulator, or trash coming off of fluorescent lamps? > > Done correctly, you could run spread spectrum just about anywhere you wanted > to, and remain undetected. Using direct sequence, you would be so low in > power density that it could easily be argued that you were operating within > the constraints of a part 15 device's leakage. > > -Chuck Harris > > Bob Camp wrote: >> Hi >> >> Remember that this started out running a sequence that was 127 hops long. >> With something that short, it's pretty likely you will be rude to somebody. >> >> Even if you are running a massive hop rate, I can likely walk around and >> track you down within the average neighborhood. A diode detector behind a >> bandpass filter and a small-ish directional antenna is about all I'd try to >> use. >> >> I suspect it would also work with one of the power detector chips. Range >> wise, a lot would depend on just how good your local cable company is at >> keeping their stuff running right. I'm not really sure the chip would add a >> lot of range in a normal setting. >> >> Bob > > ___ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] PN sequence generation using GPS
I guess that is why I mentioned something about doing it competently. The FCC so seriously winged the methods usable by hams as to render them effectively useless. A nice direct sequence spread spectrum system with a couple of MHz spread would be well below the background noise of any narrow band receiver. Sure, you could find it with a wide band detector if you were close by, but how would you know that you weren't looking at some other anomaly, like a bad insulator, or trash coming off of fluorescent lamps? Done correctly, you could run spread spectrum just about anywhere you wanted to, and remain undetected. Using direct sequence, you would be so low in power density that it could easily be argued that you were operating within the constraints of a part 15 device's leakage. -Chuck Harris Bob Camp wrote: Hi Remember that this started out running a sequence that was 127 hops long. With something that short, it's pretty likely you will be rude to somebody. Even if you are running a massive hop rate, I can likely walk around and track you down within the average neighborhood. A diode detector behind a bandpass filter and a small-ish directional antenna is about all I'd try to use. I suspect it would also work with one of the power detector chips. Range wise, a lot would depend on just how good your local cable company is at keeping their stuff running right. I'm not really sure the chip would add a lot of range in a normal setting. Bob ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] pts 160 power problem
Hi What ever it is, it's getting *HOT* while it does it. You should just about be able to see smoke off of it. A touch test (with the possibility of a burn) is the fast way to track this down. Bob On Feb 25, 2011, at 12:58 PM, paul swed wrote: > Thats my suggestion also you have a cap someplace giving you trouble. > > On Fri, Feb 25, 2011 at 12:15 PM, J. Forster wrote: > >> Look for a shorted Tantalum decoupling capacitor on the DC power line(s). >> >> -John >> >> = >> >> >>> hi >>> >>> i recently bought a pts160. when first turned on, the 5v was pulled >> quite >>> low: < 3v. after an hour or so, the condition cured, the 5v = 5.1v and >>> the >>> output matched the decades. >>> then, it died again. so i know there is a unit worth saving. >>> >>> i tried another more robust 5v supply, but that goes to 4.5v and ng >>> output. >>> >>> i removed each of the plug-in decades, one at a time, looking for the >>> guilty >>> one. no joy. i also removed the left rear module (uses 5v). the other >>> two >>> modules only use 12v. which is fine. >>> >>> has anyone been here before? could it be a problem in the backplane (a >>> work >>> of art, btw)? >>> >>> many thanks... >>> >>> dave >>> -- >>> Dave Mallery, K5EN (ubuntu linux 10.10) >>> HC31 Box 99E; Williamsburg, NM 87942 >>> >>> no gates... >>> no windows! >>>free at last! >>> linux counter #64628 (since 1997) >>> >>> "People aren't as dumb as Microsoft needs them to be." >>> --PJ, May 2007 >>> ___ >>> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com >>> To unsubscribe, go to >>> https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts >>> and follow the instructions there. >>> >>> >> >> >> >> ___ >> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com >> To unsubscribe, go to >> https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts >> and follow the instructions there. >> > ___ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] pts 160 power problem
Thats my suggestion also you have a cap someplace giving you trouble. On Fri, Feb 25, 2011 at 12:15 PM, J. Forster wrote: > Look for a shorted Tantalum decoupling capacitor on the DC power line(s). > > -John > > = > > > > hi > > > > i recently bought a pts160. when first turned on, the 5v was pulled > quite > > low: < 3v. after an hour or so, the condition cured, the 5v = 5.1v and > > the > > output matched the decades. > > then, it died again. so i know there is a unit worth saving. > > > > i tried another more robust 5v supply, but that goes to 4.5v and ng > > output. > > > > i removed each of the plug-in decades, one at a time, looking for the > > guilty > > one. no joy. i also removed the left rear module (uses 5v). the other > > two > > modules only use 12v. which is fine. > > > > has anyone been here before? could it be a problem in the backplane (a > > work > > of art, btw)? > > > > many thanks... > > > > dave > > -- > > Dave Mallery, K5EN (ubuntu linux 10.10) > > HC31 Box 99E; Williamsburg, NM 87942 > > > > no gates... > > no windows! > > free at last! > > linux counter #64628 (since 1997) > > > > "People aren't as dumb as Microsoft needs them to be." > > --PJ, May 2007 > > ___ > > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > > To unsubscribe, go to > > https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > > and follow the instructions there. > > > > > > > > ___ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to > https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there. > ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] AD-YU Electronics Precision Phase Meter Type 406L
AFAIK there are no groups for that unit. AD-YU is pretty much an orphan, although the meters are fairly common. Try BAMA and Dave at ArtekMedia. FWIW, -John === > AD-YU Electronics Precision Phase Meter Type 406L > Has anyone got an instruction manual or service manual? > I have the Phase Meter and now need some information. > John GW3XPK johnrd...@gmail.com > ___ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to > https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there. > > ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] AD-YU Electronics Precision Phase Meter Type 406L
AD-YU Electronics Precision Phase Meter Type 406L Has anyone got an instruction manual or service manual? I have the Phase Meter and now need some information. John GW3XPK johnrd...@gmail.com ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] pts 160 power problem
Look for a shorted Tantalum decoupling capacitor on the DC power line(s). -John = > hi > > i recently bought a pts160. when first turned on, the 5v was pulled quite > low: < 3v. after an hour or so, the condition cured, the 5v = 5.1v and > the > output matched the decades. > then, it died again. so i know there is a unit worth saving. > > i tried another more robust 5v supply, but that goes to 4.5v and ng > output. > > i removed each of the plug-in decades, one at a time, looking for the > guilty > one. no joy. i also removed the left rear module (uses 5v). the other > two > modules only use 12v. which is fine. > > has anyone been here before? could it be a problem in the backplane (a > work > of art, btw)? > > many thanks... > > dave > -- > Dave Mallery, K5EN (ubuntu linux 10.10) > HC31 Box 99E; Williamsburg, NM 87942 > > no gates... > no windows! > free at last! > linux counter #64628 (since 1997) > > "People aren't as dumb as Microsoft needs them to be." > --PJ, May 2007 > ___ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to > https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there. > > ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] VCXO help
> assumes you don't mind QFN packages. You know, the little buggers with 0.5 > mm pitch and no pins. Have you seen "SchmartBoards" I think with one of those you could solder QFM with eyes closed, literally. Hard to describe how they work but the board is milled so the chip fits in sort of like in a socket then you heat the trace.A local store "Fry's" caries them now. Expensive at $12 each but you only need one More info including video of the process here http://www.schmartboard.com/ -- = Chris Albertson Redondo Beach, California ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] pts 160 power problem
hi i recently bought a pts160. when first turned on, the 5v was pulled quite low: < 3v. after an hour or so, the condition cured, the 5v = 5.1v and the output matched the decades. then, it died again. so i know there is a unit worth saving. i tried another more robust 5v supply, but that goes to 4.5v and ng output. i removed each of the plug-in decades, one at a time, looking for the guilty one. no joy. i also removed the left rear module (uses 5v). the other two modules only use 12v. which is fine. has anyone been here before? could it be a problem in the backplane (a work of art, btw)? many thanks... dave -- Dave Mallery, K5EN (ubuntu linux 10.10) HC31 Box 99E; Williamsburg, NM 87942 no gates... no windows! free at last! linux counter #64628 (since 1997) "People aren't as dumb as Microsoft needs them to be." --PJ, May 2007 ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] PN sequence generation using GPS
Hi Remember that this started out running a sequence that was 127 hops long. With something that short, it's pretty likely you will be rude to somebody. Even if you are running a massive hop rate, I can likely walk around and track you down within the average neighborhood. A diode detector behind a bandpass filter and a small-ish directional antenna is about all I'd try to use. I suspect it would also work with one of the power detector chips. Range wise, a lot would depend on just how good your local cable company is at keeping their stuff running right. I'm not really sure the chip would add a lot of range in a normal setting. Bob -Original Message- From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On Behalf Of jimlux Sent: Friday, February 25, 2011 10:57 AM To: time-nuts@febo.com Subject: Re: [time-nuts] PN sequence generation using GPS On 2/25/11 7:13 AM, scmcgr...@gmail.com wrote: > Speaking as a ham, if this is tried you will have hams complaining and DF'ing the offending signal. > Speaking as a ham, and as someone who used to build (and attempt to detect and jam) systems like this for a living.. The odds that a OO would see and recognize the signal is vanishingly small. As for DFing? It would be very difficult, considering that you need a wideband receiver to see the signal, and there are usually plenty of other signals in the band. Yes.. if I were radiating a few watts, and you were my next door neighbor, so my signal was really strong, and I used a slow hop rate, and you had a fast sweep spectrum analyzer.. you "might" be able to see it. IF you knew what to look for. More likely, you'd be talking about it to your friends and various mailing lists (like this one), and someone who knows someone who knows someone who is "interested" in such things would find out, and THEY would get out the fancy gear and they would track you down. That's what leads to the guy in the government car sitting outside your house one morning with "just a few questions". Basically, it all comes down to the "rude rule" - if you're rude to others, bad things happen. If you're fooling with a 10-20 hop/second hopper on, say, 2 meters, and you happen to put the local repeater input frequencies in your hop list, and you don't hop over the entire 4 MHz band, so you're hammering the repeater every few seconds.. and you run your link 24/7, yep.. you deserve the abuse you'll get. But for most people.. the hopper's interference would barely be noticeable. (4 MHz, 5 kHz channel spacing is 800 hop channels.. so at 10 hops/sec, you'd hit the same channel every 80 seconds.. And if you use a hop sequence that is longer than 800 (no reason not to...), it's not even like a repetitive interference. Maybe a weak signal guy running JT65 or something might notice something on their waterfall, but maybe not. > Chuck, you are correct in that no one but the hams care but the reason behind this is that policing the ham bands has been delegated to the hams and specifically certified 'Official Observers'. Once a infraction and especially a.unlicensed infraction is noted penalties are pretty severe and swift. > > If you want to do this get a 'experimental license' Well.. that *would* be a better solution, and the way to really go. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] OT: NZ Christchurch member
Hi: The Richter method of analyzing earthquakes is based on what can be learned from a simple seismometer. For example by looking at the time difference between the P wave and the main shaking you can determine how far away the epicenter is located. The Richter number depends on the peak of the main shaking. But the energy depends on the integral of the magnitude of the shaking over the time it lasts. The damage is proportional to the total energy not it's peak. The public is used to hearing the Richter number even though it does not really describe the damage level. For example I had just left work when the Loma Prieta quake happened and was standing in front of the building watching the wall sized windows oil canning. With each cycle the window displacement was getting larger. If the quake had lasted about 30 second longer all the windows would have exploded, either with glass going into the building or coming at those of us standing in in front. We started to get on the ground to get some protection, but then the quake stopped. http://www.prc68.com/I/Seismometer.shtml Have Fun, Brooke Clarke http://www.PRC68.com William H. Fite wrote: For meteorologists and geologists, the Richter scale has a carefully defined meaning and is used only for purposes where that definition fits. This per a friend of mine who does seismic stuff for NOAA: Him: The Richter number means something very specific to us and something quite different to the media. Actually, the Richter doesn't have a great deal of analytical value to us. You can say, this is a Category Four hurricane but that really tells you very little about what is going on in the storm. Richter is like that. Me: You're saying that the Richter is a poor predictor of surface disruption? Him: Well, obviously a 9 will be expected to do much more damage than a 6 but it is at best a very rough indicator. The location of the epicenter and a dozen other factors play into it. Me: So how do you assess the damage potential? Him: Lots of people think we still rely mainly on the old pendulum-and-stylus seismographs from the 1930s. Actually, we take a great many measurements in addition to seismometry. But when it comes to assessing the damage, we go outside and look, just like the TV stations do. And his final comment: By the way, did you know that when the shuttle launches we capture that on virtually every strain guage seismometer in the country? I found that interesting. On Thu, Feb 24, 2011 at 10:56 PM, jimlux wrote: On 2/24/11 5:23 PM, Bob Bownes wrote: What is the conversion factor for Richter to dBm? :) Bob As a guy with degrees in geology and EE. I really should know this...:) Especially since both are log scales.. The problem is that Richter is log magnitude displacement on a particular kind of seismometer (which is sort of a low pass filter) and dBm is log power. However, there should be some sort of scale factor that converts it. I think it's energy goes as amplitude^1.5. there's also a scale factor for how far the seismograph is from the epicenter. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] OT: NZ Christchurch member
The last 'modern' seismometers I worked with (as an undergrad in the early 80's) were all three axis laser interferometry based. I'm sure they've gotten a bit better since then. Not only could we pick up a shuttle launch from 1,400 miles away, we could pick up frat parties from across town on the old strain gauge monster at the top of the hill. :) It was one of my first exposures to filtering actually. As your friend said, 'Richter' is not actually used by seismologists anymore, they use the moment magnitude scale for larger quakes, which, while similar, is different. It's more about energy released than about motion. Back to your regularly scheduled discussion. Bob On Fri, Feb 25, 2011 at 11:09 AM, jimlux wrote: > On 2/25/11 7:55 AM, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: >> >> In message, >> "Wil >> liam H. Fite" writes: >> >>> Me: You're saying that the Richter is a poor predictor of surface >>> disruption? >> >> For damage assement you really need a vector-version of richter, >> vertical does a lot more damage than horizontal on average. >> > > > Yes.. I doubt anyone still uses the torsion seismometer Richter used, > although more modern scales (moment magnitude, etc.) still relate back (e.g. > they set the calibration to match for some notional set of events).. > > That way, people have an idea... A Magnitude 3 earthquake within a few tens > of km of me will be noticeable, if it's quiet. A magnitude 4 will be very > noticeable, and a 5 will be exciting. A 6 will wake you up in the middle of > the night. I'd compare it to something like Mohs hardness, except actually > with a quantitative basis. (People who work with material properties like > hardness use other scales anyway) > > It's a "roughly quantitative" measure of energy release, in the same sense > that kilotons are for explosions. It's like that whole "cup of gasoline: > dynamite" comparison.. it's the rate of energy (e.g. power) that creates the > qualitative difference between running my camping stove and blasting. > > We do the same thing in time-nuttery.. we use log scales to talk about > performance.. dBc/Hz for phase noise, and really, just the exponent to talk > about ADEV. (nobody gets excited about the difference between 1.1E-13 and > 1.5E-13... but the difference between 1E-11 and 1E-15 is worth talking > about) > > Maybe we should start promulgating dBallan? > > And maybe get an SI unit... The "Allan", although since the fractional > frequency error is dimensionless > > ___ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to > https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there. > ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] OT: NZ Christchurch member
On 2/25/11 7:55 AM, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: In message, "Wil liam H. Fite" writes: Me: You're saying that the Richter is a poor predictor of surface disruption? For damage assement you really need a vector-version of richter, vertical does a lot more damage than horizontal on average. Yes.. I doubt anyone still uses the torsion seismometer Richter used, although more modern scales (moment magnitude, etc.) still relate back (e.g. they set the calibration to match for some notional set of events).. That way, people have an idea... A Magnitude 3 earthquake within a few tens of km of me will be noticeable, if it's quiet. A magnitude 4 will be very noticeable, and a 5 will be exciting. A 6 will wake you up in the middle of the night. I'd compare it to something like Mohs hardness, except actually with a quantitative basis. (People who work with material properties like hardness use other scales anyway) It's a "roughly quantitative" measure of energy release, in the same sense that kilotons are for explosions. It's like that whole "cup of gasoline: dynamite" comparison.. it's the rate of energy (e.g. power) that creates the qualitative difference between running my camping stove and blasting. We do the same thing in time-nuttery.. we use log scales to talk about performance.. dBc/Hz for phase noise, and really, just the exponent to talk about ADEV. (nobody gets excited about the difference between 1.1E-13 and 1.5E-13... but the difference between 1E-11 and 1E-15 is worth talking about) Maybe we should start promulgating dBallan? And maybe get an SI unit... The "Allan", although since the fractional frequency error is dimensionless ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] PN sequence generation using GPS
On 2/25/11 7:13 AM, scmcgr...@gmail.com wrote: Speaking as a ham, if this is tried you will have hams complaining and DF'ing the offending signal. Speaking as a ham, and as someone who used to build (and attempt to detect and jam) systems like this for a living.. The odds that a OO would see and recognize the signal is vanishingly small. As for DFing? It would be very difficult, considering that you need a wideband receiver to see the signal, and there are usually plenty of other signals in the band. Yes.. if I were radiating a few watts, and you were my next door neighbor, so my signal was really strong, and I used a slow hop rate, and you had a fast sweep spectrum analyzer.. you "might" be able to see it. IF you knew what to look for. More likely, you'd be talking about it to your friends and various mailing lists (like this one), and someone who knows someone who knows someone who is "interested" in such things would find out, and THEY would get out the fancy gear and they would track you down. That's what leads to the guy in the government car sitting outside your house one morning with "just a few questions". Basically, it all comes down to the "rude rule" - if you're rude to others, bad things happen. If you're fooling with a 10-20 hop/second hopper on, say, 2 meters, and you happen to put the local repeater input frequencies in your hop list, and you don't hop over the entire 4 MHz band, so you're hammering the repeater every few seconds.. and you run your link 24/7, yep.. you deserve the abuse you'll get. But for most people.. the hopper's interference would barely be noticeable. (4 MHz, 5 kHz channel spacing is 800 hop channels.. so at 10 hops/sec, you'd hit the same channel every 80 seconds.. And if you use a hop sequence that is longer than 800 (no reason not to...), it's not even like a repetitive interference. Maybe a weak signal guy running JT65 or something might notice something on their waterfall, but maybe not. Chuck, you are correct in that no one but the hams care but the reason behind this is that policing the ham bands has been delegated to the hams and specifically certified 'Official Observers'. Once a infraction and especially a.unlicensed infraction is noted penalties are pretty severe and swift. If you want to do this get a 'experimental license' Well.. that *would* be a better solution, and the way to really go. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] OT: NZ Christchurch member
In message , "Wil liam H. Fite" writes: >Me: You're saying that the Richter is a poor predictor of surface >disruption? For damage assement you really need a vector-version of richter, vertical does a lot more damage than horizontal on average. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by incompetence. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] HP 3586A/B/C entirely referenced to 10MHz: A solution
OK here is the place I get myself in trouble. Because I have really not gone through the math though I certainly did play with the total LSB to USB diff of 3700 Hz etc. Simple thought. Why not preset counters down that loop and reset at zero as an example. Preload them with the usb/lsb number granted these could be 10 or 100 x higher then needed and then divided to have a symmetrical output. The clock would be either 1 or 10 mc from the ref. Granted I still like the DDS option actually but this approach might be easier for those of us that like 14 and 16 leg dead bugs. That can be seen and soldered to. ;-) Regards Paul On Thu, Feb 24, 2011 at 4:09 PM, paul swed wrote: > Bill you beat me to the punch. > I completely agree that a DDS would allow both frequencies with very very > small offsets. > Granted its more complicated and costly. But then it would be locked. > I have 5 3586s all running so am always interested in possible updates and > was aware of the bfo. > Regards > Paul. > > > On Thu, Feb 24, 2011 at 3:48 PM, WB6BNQ wrote: > >> Hi Bert, >> >> I am wondering if you would not do better using a DDS. Specifically, I am >> thinking >> of the Analog Devices 9913 which has the ability to fractionally modify >> the >> accumulator. I hadn't really put much thought in it, perhaps a regular >> DDS would >> work as well. >> >> BillWB6BNQ >> >> >> "Bert, VE2ZAZ" wrote: >> >> > Hi Everyone, >> > >> > Some recent tests I have made on my HP 3586B Selective Level Meter have >> > confirmed that the detected audio drifts a lot as a function of ambient >> > temperature. A day/night change of 1.5 degree Celcius was clearly >> visible on >> > Spectrum Lab samples. I could actually find out how many times and when >> the >> > central home furnace had cycled in-out overnight. It gave a neat plot >> which I >> > post here: https://www.onlinefilefolder.com/3sFcUl8Z8i8zy7 >> > >> > So I have been looking at modifying my HP 3586B SLM so that it becomes >> entirely >> > synchronized off the external 10MHz reference. As you probably know, all >> stages >> > exept the final one, the SSB LO (BFO), are derived from the 10MHz >> reference. >> > The SSB LO chain is made of two free-running crystals used for LSB and >> USB >> > detection. In my unit (3586B, option 003), the detection LO frequencies >> are >> > 13775 Hz and 17475 Hz. These two frequencies are not directly >> math-related to >> > any other internal reference (at least I could not personally find any). >> BTW, >> > the IF LO rate is 15625 Hz. >> > >> > I have substituted a function generator instead of the internal >> oscillators just >> > to see how much the off-centering would affect the audio quality, and >> found out >> > that this works well as long as it is not too far off the designed LO >> rates. The >> > closest 10MHz-derived integer rate I could find that will work for audio >> tone >> > measurement is divide-by-726 (13774.104... Hz) in LSB. The closest USB >> rate >> > would be divide-by-572 (17482.5... Hz), much farther than the LSB one. >> So the >> > LSB rate difference of around 0.9 Hz can be neglected when keying in the >> > frequency and listening to regular radio signals. When making absolute >> audio >> > measurements, subtracting that delta is easy to achieve in post >> processing. >> > Besides, the frequency and amplitude measurement capabilities of the >> instrument >> > are not altered by this mod. To me this would seem like an acceptable >> compromise >> > that is simple to implement and would add long-term stability. My intent >> is to >> > have a single chip (in this case, an 8-pin PIC divider) do the trick, as >> we are >> > dealing with tTL level signals here. >> > >> > But can I do better? >> > How much more complex? >> > Can I avoid PLLs? >> > All mixer stages become synchronized to a single source. Is this an >> issue for >> > reliable audio detection? >> > Am I missing something here? >> > >> > As always, I truly enjoy your feedback and am quite convinced I will >> learn >> > something new once more. >> > >> > Thanks, >> > >> > Bert, VE2ZAZ >> > >> > ___ >> > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com >> > To unsubscribe, go to >> https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts >> > and follow the instructions there. >> >> >> ___ >> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com >> To unsubscribe, go to >> https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts >> and follow the instructions there. >> > > ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] OT: NZ Christchurch member
For meteorologists and geologists, the Richter scale has a carefully defined meaning and is used only for purposes where that definition fits. This per a friend of mine who does seismic stuff for NOAA: Him: The Richter number means something very specific to us and something quite different to the media. Actually, the Richter doesn't have a great deal of analytical value to us. You can say, this is a Category Four hurricane but that really tells you very little about what is going on in the storm. Richter is like that. Me: You're saying that the Richter is a poor predictor of surface disruption? Him: Well, obviously a 9 will be expected to do much more damage than a 6 but it is at best a very rough indicator. The location of the epicenter and a dozen other factors play into it. Me: So how do you assess the damage potential? Him: Lots of people think we still rely mainly on the old pendulum-and-stylus seismographs from the 1930s. Actually, we take a great many measurements in addition to seismometry. But when it comes to assessing the damage, we go outside and look, just like the TV stations do. And his final comment: By the way, did you know that when the shuttle launches we capture that on virtually every strain guage seismometer in the country? I found that interesting. On Thu, Feb 24, 2011 at 10:56 PM, jimlux wrote: > On 2/24/11 5:23 PM, Bob Bownes wrote: > >> What is the conversion factor for Richter to dBm? :) >> >> Bob >> As a guy with degrees in geology and EE. I really should know this...:) >> >> >> > Especially since both are log scales.. > > The problem is that Richter is log magnitude displacement on a particular > kind of seismometer (which is sort of a low pass filter) and dBm is log > power. However, there should be some sort of scale factor that converts it. > > I think it's energy goes as amplitude^1.5. there's also a scale factor for > how far the seismograph is from the epicenter. > > > ___ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to > https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there. > ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] VCXO help
Pardon my ignorance, but what is a bubbler? Is that time-nut speak for a frequency doubler of some sort? Guessing at a doubler since you mention needing a 100 MHz output, and the CS2300 only has a 6-75 MHz output range. Just thinking aloud here... IF (big if ;) you are considering doubling, you might just as well use the ICS670-03. Add a flip-flop between the FBCLK and FBIN to serve as an external divide-by-two. Then you can use the x5 and x10 settings to give you an effective division factor of 10 and 20 respectively. Which in turn gives you 100 MHz output for that 5 Mhz or 10 MHz input. regards, Fred "Bert Kehren" wrote: > I need to multiply by 10 and 20, 670-2 can not multiply by 20. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] PN sequence generation using GPS
Hi Scott, Speaking as a ham, I can tell you that no one will even notice that you are there. Frequency hop SS signals, when done correctly, only land for a few milliseconds at seemingly random frequencies within their band. Because their PN sequence makes them appear random, there aren't any identifiable rhythms to their signals that would signal their presence... just a slight increase in background noise. They really aren't noticeable with the usual narrow bandwidth tuned rice boxes that most hams use. I have played extensively with frequency hoppers, like the PRC117, and absent a wideband receiver, that covers their entire band, you would never know they are there. -Chuck Harris scmcgr...@gmail.com wrote: Speaking as a ham, if this is tried you will have hams complaining and DF'ing the offending signal. Chuck, you are correct in that no one but the hams care but the reason behind this is that policing the ham bands has been delegated to the hams and specifically certified 'Official Observers'. Once a infraction and especially a.unlicensed infraction is noted penalties are pretty severe and swift. If you want to do this get a 'experimental license' Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] PN sequence generation using GPS
Speaking as a ham, if this is tried you will have hams complaining and DF'ing the offending signal. Chuck, you are correct in that no one but the hams care but the reason behind this is that policing the ham bands has been delegated to the hams and specifically certified 'Official Observers'. Once a infraction and especially a.unlicensed infraction is noted penalties are pretty severe and swift. If you want to do this get a 'experimental license' Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry -Original Message- From: Chuck Harris Sender: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2011 01:49:36 To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement Reply-To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement Subject: Re: [time-nuts] PN sequence generation using GPS jimlux wrote: > you *could* call the FCC and ask them... > > Or, just build whatever, and wait for someone to complain, and say you > misinterpreted the rules. Unless you're a jerk, I suspect that they > won't fine you or anything else. Given the quality of the rank-and-file ham, and the fact that nobody, but hams really care what happens on the ham bands, who would ever know? I think you could run any form of SS you wanted to on the ham bands for the rest of your life, and as long as you were semi-competent about it (eg. didn't cause interference) you would remain undetected. -Chuck Harris ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Low-cost GPS for NTP server (from Sure Electronics)
Folks, Just to let you know I got the Sure GPS module: http://www.sureelectronics.net/goods.php?id=99 working as a source for an NTP server. I added a couple of wire links to get the PPS signal flowing down the DCD line of the 9-pin RS-232 connector. It seems to be a very sensitive unit, and it worked out of the box. My hardware patches are documented here: http://www.satsignal.eu/ntp/FreeBSD-GPS-PPS.htm#sure Tom Van Baak's Web page was an inspiration: http://www.leapsecond.com/pages/MG1613S/ especially the animated GIF! Now all we need is a comparison between the PPS from this board and true UTC Cheers, David -- SatSignal software - quality software written to your requirements Web: http://www.satsignal.eu Email: david-tay...@blueyonder.co.uk ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] VCXO help
I need to multiply by 10 and 20, 670-2 can not multiply by 20.Thanks. Bert In a message dated 2/25/2011 8:03:55 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, tijddin...@yahoo.com writes: Well, I know Geraldo Lino de Campos on this list is using an ICS670-03 for this purpose. For me personally that part is too jittery by about a decade, but for your purpose it might just be the right compromise. Certainly has a friendlier package. datasheet: http://www.idt.com/products/getDoc.cfm?docID=18461996 Slight detour about soldering QFN's for prototyping. It is not /that/ bad. I will admit that when given the choice between QFNs and TSOPs I will pick the latter, but QFNs are do-able. All it takes is patience and a Can-Do attitude. Well, mainly patience really. ;) You can do those QFNs for example dead bug style on a solid copperclad ground plane. The trick then is to use aluminum foil to cover the pads you already soldered, and fluxfluxflux. You can put the decoupling caps real close in a sort of stonehenge around it. Like I said, requires a bit of patience, but it's fun when it actually works, plus you get better at it pretty fast. :) regards, Fred "Bert Kehren" wrote: > Thanks for the info Fred > The problem is the package. Looking at the Cirrus Logic CS 2300-CP and use > a bubbler. Since I start out with 5 or 10 MHz there must be something out > there that can be soldered. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] VCXO help
Thanks for the input, do not forget the total system cost has to be $200, the latest version has a simple VCO but I would like to eliminate component selection, may stay with the present design, but the Cirrus CS 2300 followed by a bubbler may be the answer. Maybe there is something like the 2300 out there that goes to 100 MHz in a package that normal time-nuts (if there is such a thing) can solder. Bert In a message dated 2/25/2011 9:33:43 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, jim...@earthlink.net writes: On 2/25/11 3:05 AM, ewkeh...@aol.com wrote: > As part of the D/M project the counter uses a 100 MHz VCO with an AD 4001 > PLL. To simplify further I would like to consider a very simple VCXO, easily > available components, no tuning, any ideas out there. For once phase noise > is of no concern. > Bert Kehren > no tuning, but you *do* need some adjustment range, right (it needs a voltage control port?) what about one of the TCXOs out there that has the "resistor trim" for frequency? Just randomly.. A Vectron TX400 has a +/-12 ppm tuning range on the EFC input.. that's about 1200 Hz... http://www.vectron.com/products/tcxo/tx-400.pdf Digikey shows a whole bunch of Crystek VCOs for around $20-30 ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] VCXO help
On 2/25/11 3:05 AM, ewkeh...@aol.com wrote: As part of the D/M project the counter uses a 100 MHz VCO with an AD 4001 PLL. To simplify further I would like to consider a very simple VCXO, easily available components, no tuning, any ideas out there. For once phase noise is of no concern. Bert Kehren no tuning, but you *do* need some adjustment range, right (it needs a voltage control port?) what about one of the TCXOs out there that has the "resistor trim" for frequency? Just randomly.. A Vectron TX400 has a +/-12 ppm tuning range on the EFC input.. that's about 1200 Hz... http://www.vectron.com/products/tcxo/tx-400.pdf Digikey shows a whole bunch of Crystek VCOs for around $20-30 ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] VCXO help
Bert, first of all I'm really happy you're digging into this -- it's been on my list of "projects for someday" for a long time! One thing working in your favor is that the actual BFO frequency is way down at audio; the BFO crystals at around 2 MHz are divided by 1000 before hitting the mixer. So that gives you 40dB of help on the phase noise, as well as reducing any frequency offset that DDS step size might impose. John Tijd Dingen said the following on 02/25/2011 08:02 AM: Well, I know Geraldo Lino de Campos on this list is using an ICS670-03 for this purpose. For me personally that part is too jittery by about a decade, but for your purpose it might just be the right compromise. Certainly has a friendlier package. datasheet: http://www.idt.com/products/getDoc.cfm?docID=18461996 Slight detour about soldering QFN's for prototyping. It is not /that/ bad. I will admit that when given the choice between QFNs and TSOPs I will pick the latter, but QFNs are do-able. All it takes is patience and a Can-Do attitude. Well, mainly patience really. ;) You can do those QFNs for example dead bug style on a solid copperclad ground plane. The trick then is to use aluminum foil to cover the pads you already soldered, and fluxfluxflux. You can put the decoupling caps real close in a sort of stonehenge around it. Like I said, requires a bit of patience, but it's fun when it actually works, plus you get better at it pretty fast. :) regards, Fred "Bert Kehren" wrote: Thanks for the info Fred The problem is the package. Looking at the Cirrus Logic CS 2300-CP and use a bubbler. Since I start out with 5 or 10 MHz there must be something out there that can be soldered. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] VCXO help
Well, I know Geraldo Lino de Campos on this list is using an ICS670-03 for this purpose. For me personally that part is too jittery by about a decade, but for your purpose it might just be the right compromise. Certainly has a friendlier package. datasheet: http://www.idt.com/products/getDoc.cfm?docID=18461996 Slight detour about soldering QFN's for prototyping. It is not /that/ bad. I will admit that when given the choice between QFNs and TSOPs I will pick the latter, but QFNs are do-able. All it takes is patience and a Can-Do attitude. Well, mainly patience really. ;) You can do those QFNs for example dead bug style on a solid copperclad ground plane. The trick then is to use aluminum foil to cover the pads you already soldered, and fluxfluxflux. You can put the decoupling caps real close in a sort of stonehenge around it. Like I said, requires a bit of patience, but it's fun when it actually works, plus you get better at it pretty fast. :) regards, Fred "Bert Kehren" wrote: > Thanks for the info Fred > The problem is the package. Looking at the Cirrus Logic CS 2300-CP and use > a bubbler. Since I start out with 5 or 10 MHz there must be something out > there that can be soldered. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] VCXO help
Thanks for the info Fred The problem is the package. Looking at the Cirrus Logic CS 2300-CP and use a bubbler. Since I start out with 5 or 10 MHz there must be something out there that can be soldered. In a message dated 2/25/2011 7:17:42 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, tijddin...@yahoo.com writes: Hello Bert, That rationale sounds suspiciously familiar. The quest for an ever simpler VCO, that is. At the expense of some additional phase noise compared to VCXO+PLL, you could use an ADF4360-9. It is readily available at for example digikey, currently for $6.26. For my fpga based counter project I had pretty much the same thing as what (I think) you are doing. Simplify it wherever possible... So first use a PLL with integrated VCO, and see if the phase noise/jitter is not the limiting factor to your performance. If it turns out to be limiting, you can always do the more complicated VCXO + PLL + loop filter later. Anyway, that ADF4360-9 suggestion is working under the assumption that you are feeding it something like a 5 or 10 MHz reference signal. And it also assumes you don't mind QFN packages. You know, the little buggers with 0.5 mm pitch and no pins. regards, Fred "Bert Kehren" wrote: > As part of the D/M project the counter uses a 100 MHz VCO with an AD 4001 > PLL. To simplify further I would like to consider a very simple VCXO, easily > available components, no tuning, any ideas out there. For once phase noise > is of no concern. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] VCXO help
A circuit design? Look for 96MHz variants. Many out there. Example: http://www.qsl.net/dk1ag/96mhz_e.pdf - Henry -- ehydra.dyndns.info ewkeh...@aol.com schrieb: As part of the D/M project the counter uses a 100 MHz VCO with an AD 4001 PLL. To simplify further I would like to consider a very simple VCXO, easily available components, no tuning, any ideas out there. For once phase noise is of no concern. Bert Kehren ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] VCXO help
Hello Bert, That rationale sounds suspiciously familiar. The quest for an ever simpler VCO, that is. At the expense of some additional phase noise compared to VCXO+PLL, you could use an ADF4360-9. It is readily available at for example digikey, currently for $6.26. For my fpga based counter project I had pretty much the same thing as what (I think) you are doing. Simplify it wherever possible... So first use a PLL with integrated VCO, and see if the phase noise/jitter is not the limiting factor to your performance. If it turns out to be limiting, you can always do the more complicated VCXO + PLL + loop filter later. Anyway, that ADF4360-9 suggestion is working under the assumption that you are feeding it something like a 5 or 10 MHz reference signal. And it also assumes you don't mind QFN packages. You know, the little buggers with 0.5 mm pitch and no pins. regards, Fred "Bert Kehren" wrote: > As part of the D/M project the counter uses a 100 MHz VCO with an AD 4001 > PLL. To simplify further I would like to consider a very simple VCXO, easily > available components, no tuning, any ideas out there. For once phase noise > is of no concern. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Vectron 229-5657 pin out
Anyone have the pin out on a Vectron 229-5657 oscillator? I have several in the 100 MHz range. Tnx! 73, Mike, N1JEZ "A closed mouth gathers no feet" ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] VCXO help
As part of the D/M project the counter uses a 100 MHz VCO with an AD 4001 PLL. To simplify further I would like to consider a very simple VCXO, easily available components, no tuning, any ideas out there. For once phase noise is of no concern. Bert Kehren ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Earthquake meets time ball
Thanks and perhaps your right :) At least time seems to ticking by OK even if I no longer have anything locked to it. Cheers, Steve On 25/02/2011, Rob Kimberley wrote: > Glad to hear you are safe Steve - Time Nuts wouldn't quite be the same > without you! > Good luck down there mate. > > Rob > > -Original Message- > From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On > Behalf Of Steve Rooke > Sent: 24 February 2011 10:13 AM > To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement > Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Earthquake meets time ball > > Many thanks, I appreciate your kind thoughts. If your any good at fixing > power, water, sewerage and can get the ADSL up on my newly re-connected > phone line, as dial-up is really boring, I'd welcome that with open arms. I > do have a petrol generator now but getting it was a real bun-fight and I was > lucky to grab one off the trailer as they were being delivered to the > hardware store. Believe me they went like hot cakes. Getting petrol was a > case of queuing for ages miles down the road just to be rationed to $50 > worth of fuel for the car and the jerry-can to run the generator. Wish I had > my old Land Rover right now as you practically need a 4x4 to drive on the > roads around here. But we are coping ok and there is a great spirit here > with many people dragging their bbqs into the streets and cooking up their > meat from the freezer and offering to all who come by as it's going off in > their freezers. There's a artesian well-head in a local school that is > overflowing as the power is off and is cannot be controlled, and I can get > to it on foot with bottles I can fill by holding them under the running > water. All this water needs to be boiled and I'm lucky that I bought a > propane gas little cooking hob last time we had a quake so I'm able to do > that and heat up food. It's just like camping here as you have to dig a hole > in the garden for the number 1's and 2's too. > It's OK, we are surviving and it'll all sort itself out eventually. > > Sorry for this OT post. > > Cheers, Steve > > On 24/02/2011, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: >> In message >> , >> Stev >> e Rooke writes: >> >> Keep smiling Steve, and let us know if we can do anything for you. >> >> -- >> Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 >> p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 >> FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe >> Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by > incompetence. >> >> ___ >> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to >> https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts >> and follow the instructions there. >> > > > -- > Steve Rooke - ZL3TUV & G8KVD > The only reason for time is so that everything doesn't happen at once. > - Einstein > > ___ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to > https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there. > > > > ___ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to > https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there. > -- Steve Rooke - ZL3TUV & G8KVD The only reason for time is so that everything doesn't happen at once. - Einstein ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
