Re: [time-nuts] FRK

[Attila Kinali]

On Tue, 27 Feb 2018 13:53:36 -0500
ewkehren via time-nuts  wrote:

> I have never seen a FRK or M 100 that did not have a screw iin lamp but 
> Attila`s unit looks like nothing I have seen before,  I am not a Corby but 
> over time 20 units have passed through my hands  

My lamp is beneath the base plate, which I didn't take a photograph
of, because you don't see anything but some foam that I didn't want
to remove, out of fear it would just crumble in my hands.
>From what I can tell, the design is close to, but not exactly
as described in the FRK-L manual on Didier's site.


Attila Kinali
-- 
It is upon moral qualities that a society is ultimately founded. All 
the prosperity and technological sophistication in the world is of no 
use without that foundation.
 -- Miss Matheson, The Diamond Age, Neil Stephenson
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Re: [time-nuts] FRK

[paul swed]

Bert
OK it did look unusual.
Regards

On Tue, Feb 27, 2018 at 1:53 PM, ewkehren via time-nuts <time-nuts@febo.com>
wrote:

> PaulI have never seen a FRK or M 100 that did not have a screw iin lamp
> but Attila`s unit looks like nothing I have seen before,  I am not a Corby
> but over time 20 units have passed through my hands
> Bert
>
>
> Sent from my Galaxy Tab® A
>  Original message From: paul swed <paulsw...@gmail.com>
> Date: 2/27/18  1:45 PM  (GMT-05:00) To: Discussion of precise time and
> frequency measurement <time-nuts@febo.com> Subject: Re: [time-nuts] FRK
> Bert what I assume is the FRK lamp. it has a few wires and then 2 pins out
> of the side.
> Unless those are for mounting the lamp.
> Regards
> Paul
> WB8TSL
>
> On Tue, Feb 27, 2018 at 11:21 AM, Attila Kinali <att...@kinali.ch> wrote:
>
> > On Tue, 27 Feb 2018 09:01:31 -0500
> > Bob kb8tq <kb...@n1k.org> wrote:
> >
> > > Judging from the date codes on some of the parts, I’d guess that
> > > your FRL-L is from 1982. I’m only looking at a few parts that came
> > > through well enough in the picture to read (and that have what look
> > > like rational date codes …).
> >
> > Sorry, I didn't take much care when taking the pictures.
> > I can do better ones later.
> >
> > But yes, the board has definitely an 80s vibe. The whole construction
> > is different then what I am used to from 80s electronics, though.
> > But I guess that's because it was designed and manufactured for
> > hi-rel applications.
> >
> > Attila Kinali
> >
> > --
> > It is upon moral qualities that a society is ultimately founded. All
> > the prosperity and technological sophistication in the world is of no
> > use without that foundation.
> >  -- Miss Matheson, The Diamond Age, Neil Stephenson
> > ___
> > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
> > To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/
> > mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
> > and follow the instructions there.
> >
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Re: [time-nuts] FRK

[ewkehren via time-nuts]

PaulI have never seen a FRK or M 100 that did not have a screw iin lamp but 
Attila`s unit looks like nothing I have seen before,  I am not a Corby but over 
time 20 units have passed through my hands      
Bert


Sent from my Galaxy Tab® A
 Original message From: paul swed <paulsw...@gmail.com> Date: 
2/27/18  1:45 PM  (GMT-05:00) To: Discussion of precise time and frequency 
measurement <time-nuts@febo.com> Subject: Re: [time-nuts] FRK 
Bert what I assume is the FRK lamp. it has a few wires and then 2 pins out
of the side.
Unless those are for mounting the lamp.
Regards
Paul
WB8TSL

On Tue, Feb 27, 2018 at 11:21 AM, Attila Kinali <att...@kinali.ch> wrote:

> On Tue, 27 Feb 2018 09:01:31 -0500
> Bob kb8tq <kb...@n1k.org> wrote:
>
> > Judging from the date codes on some of the parts, I’d guess that
> > your FRL-L is from 1982. I’m only looking at a few parts that came
> > through well enough in the picture to read (and that have what look
> > like rational date codes …).
>
> Sorry, I didn't take much care when taking the pictures.
> I can do better ones later.
>
> But yes, the board has definitely an 80s vibe. The whole construction
> is different then what I am used to from 80s electronics, though.
> But I guess that's because it was designed and manufactured for
> hi-rel applications.
>
> Attila Kinali
>
> --
> It is upon moral qualities that a society is ultimately founded. All
> the prosperity and technological sophistication in the world is of no
> use without that foundation.
>  -- Miss Matheson, The Diamond Age, Neil Stephenson
> ___
> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
> To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/
> mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
> and follow the instructions there.
>
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Re: [time-nuts] FRK

[paul swed]

Bert what I assume is the FRK lamp. it has a few wires and then 2 pins out
of the side.
Unless those are for mounting the lamp.
Regards
Paul
WB8TSL

On Tue, Feb 27, 2018 at 11:21 AM, Attila Kinali  wrote:

> On Tue, 27 Feb 2018 09:01:31 -0500
> Bob kb8tq  wrote:
>
> > Judging from the date codes on some of the parts, I’d guess that
> > your FRL-L is from 1982. I’m only looking at a few parts that came
> > through well enough in the picture to read (and that have what look
> > like rational date codes …).
>
> Sorry, I didn't take much care when taking the pictures.
> I can do better ones later.
>
> But yes, the board has definitely an 80s vibe. The whole construction
> is different then what I am used to from 80s electronics, though.
> But I guess that's because it was designed and manufactured for
> hi-rel applications.
>
> Attila Kinali
>
> --
> It is upon moral qualities that a society is ultimately founded. All
> the prosperity and technological sophistication in the world is of no
> use without that foundation.
>  -- Miss Matheson, The Diamond Age, Neil Stephenson
> ___
> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
> To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/
> mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
> and follow the instructions there.
>
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Re: [time-nuts] FRK

[Attila Kinali]

On Tue, 27 Feb 2018 09:01:31 -0500
Bob kb8tq  wrote:

> Judging from the date codes on some of the parts, I’d guess that 
> your FRL-L is from 1982. I’m only looking at a few parts that came 
> through well enough in the picture to read (and that have what look 
> like rational date codes …).

Sorry, I didn't take much care when taking the pictures.
I can do better ones later.

But yes, the board has definitely an 80s vibe. The whole construction
is different then what I am used to from 80s electronics, though.
But I guess that's because it was designed and manufactured for
hi-rel applications. 

Attila Kinali

-- 
It is upon moral qualities that a society is ultimately founded. All 
the prosperity and technological sophistication in the world is of no 
use without that foundation.
 -- Miss Matheson, The Diamond Age, Neil Stephenson
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Re: [time-nuts] FRK

[ewkehren via time-nuts]

Which one are you talking aboutBert Kehren


Sent from my Galaxy Tab® A
 Original message From: paul swed <paulsw...@gmail.com> Date: 
2/27/18  9:26 AM  (GMT-05:00) To: Discussion of precise time and frequency 
measurement <time-nuts@febo.com> Subject: Re: [time-nuts] FRK 
Thanks for the pictures.
Curious on the rb lamp.
There seem to be 2 pins from the side. Is that a lamp start igniter?
Regards
Paul
WB8TSL

On Tue, Feb 27, 2018 at 9:01 AM, Bob kb8tq <kb...@n1k.org> wrote:

> Hi
>
> Judging from the date codes on some of the parts, I’d guess that
> your FRL-L is from 1982. I’m only looking at a few parts that came
> through well enough in the picture to read (and that have what look
> like rational date codes …).
>
> Bob
>
> > On Feb 27, 2018, at 5:30 AM, Attila Kinali <att...@kinali.ch> wrote:
> >
> > On Mon, 26 Feb 2018 20:04:56 -0800
> > "Tom Van Baak" <t...@leapsecond.com> wrote:
> >
> >> Bert's M100 Rb teardown photos are now here:
> >>
> >> http://leapsecond.com/bert/m100.htm
> >
> > For those, who would like to see the rest of M100/FRK,
> > I just took pictures of my FRK-L that was sitting on my
> > desk for way too long:
> >
> > http://time.kinali.ch/Efratom_FRK-L/
> >
> > Yes, there are only the pictures of the four PCBs from outside.
> > I didn't want to take the FRK further appart, as that would
> > require a soldering iron, and I really should be doing something
> > else.
> >
> >   Attila Kinali
> >
> > --
> > It is upon moral qualities that a society is ultimately founded. All
> > the prosperity and technological sophistication in the world is of no
> > use without that foundation.
> > -- Miss Matheson, The Diamond Age, Neil Stephenson
> > ___
> > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
> > To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/
> mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
> > and follow the instructions there.
>
> ___
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> mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
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>
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Re: [time-nuts] FRK

[paul swed]

Thanks for the pictures.
Curious on the rb lamp.
There seem to be 2 pins from the side. Is that a lamp start igniter?
Regards
Paul
WB8TSL

On Tue, Feb 27, 2018 at 9:01 AM, Bob kb8tq  wrote:

> Hi
>
> Judging from the date codes on some of the parts, I’d guess that
> your FRL-L is from 1982. I’m only looking at a few parts that came
> through well enough in the picture to read (and that have what look
> like rational date codes …).
>
> Bob
>
> > On Feb 27, 2018, at 5:30 AM, Attila Kinali  wrote:
> >
> > On Mon, 26 Feb 2018 20:04:56 -0800
> > "Tom Van Baak"  wrote:
> >
> >> Bert's M100 Rb teardown photos are now here:
> >>
> >> http://leapsecond.com/bert/m100.htm
> >
> > For those, who would like to see the rest of M100/FRK,
> > I just took pictures of my FRK-L that was sitting on my
> > desk for way too long:
> >
> > http://time.kinali.ch/Efratom_FRK-L/
> >
> > Yes, there are only the pictures of the four PCBs from outside.
> > I didn't want to take the FRK further appart, as that would
> > require a soldering iron, and I really should be doing something
> > else.
> >
> >   Attila Kinali
> >
> > --
> > It is upon moral qualities that a society is ultimately founded. All
> > the prosperity and technological sophistication in the world is of no
> > use without that foundation.
> > -- Miss Matheson, The Diamond Age, Neil Stephenson
> > ___
> > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
> > To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/
> mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
> > and follow the instructions there.
>
> ___
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> mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
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>
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Re: [time-nuts] FRK

[Bob kb8tq]

Hi

Judging from the date codes on some of the parts, I’d guess that 
your FRL-L is from 1982. I’m only looking at a few parts that came 
through well enough in the picture to read (and that have what look 
like rational date codes …).

Bob

> On Feb 27, 2018, at 5:30 AM, Attila Kinali  wrote:
> 
> On Mon, 26 Feb 2018 20:04:56 -0800
> "Tom Van Baak"  wrote:
> 
>> Bert's M100 Rb teardown photos are now here:
>> 
>> http://leapsecond.com/bert/m100.htm
> 
> For those, who would like to see the rest of M100/FRK,
> I just took pictures of my FRK-L that was sitting on my
> desk for way too long:
> 
> http://time.kinali.ch/Efratom_FRK-L/
> 
> Yes, there are only the pictures of the four PCBs from outside.
> I didn't want to take the FRK further appart, as that would
> require a soldering iron, and I really should be doing something
> else.
> 
>   Attila Kinali
> 
> -- 
> It is upon moral qualities that a society is ultimately founded. All 
> the prosperity and technological sophistication in the world is of no 
> use without that foundation.
> -- Miss Matheson, The Diamond Age, Neil Stephenson
> ___
> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
> To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
> and follow the instructions there.

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Re: [time-nuts] FRK

[ew via time-nuts]

Thank you Tom,  for the record the pictures where taken by Juerg Koegel my 
partner in crime
Bert Kehren
 
In a message dated 2/26/2018 11:05:19 PM Eastern Standard Time, 
t...@leapsecond.com writes:

 
 Bert's M100 Rb teardown photos are now here:

http://leapsecond.com/bert/m100.htm

/tvb

- Original Message - 
From: "ewkehren via time-nuts" <time-nuts@febo.com>
To: "Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement" <time-nuts@febo.com>
Sent: Sunday, February 25, 2018 6:05 AM
Subject: [time-nuts] FRK


We have pictures of the guts of a M100 the file is 1.8 M off list or permission 
to post

Bert Kehren 

Sent from my Galaxy Tab® A
___

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Re: [time-nuts] FRK

[ewkehren via time-nuts]

Thank you Attila, I have seen many FRK`and M 100 but not one like yours. Some 
boards are very different and it is very difficult  to get proper 
documentation.Bert Kehren

Sent from my Galaxy Tab® A
 Original message From: Attila Kinali <att...@kinali.ch> Date: 
2/27/18  5:30 AM  (GMT-05:00) To: Discussion of precise time and frequency 
measurement <time-nuts@febo.com> Subject: Re: [time-nuts] FRK 
On Mon, 26 Feb 2018 20:04:56 -0800
"Tom Van Baak" <t...@leapsecond.com> wrote:

> Bert's M100 Rb teardown photos are now here:
> 
> http://leapsecond.com/bert/m100.htm

For those, who would like to see the rest of M100/FRK,
I just took pictures of my FRK-L that was sitting on my
desk for way too long:

http://time.kinali.ch/Efratom_FRK-L/

Yes, there are only the pictures of the four PCBs from outside.
I didn't want to take the FRK further appart, as that would
require a soldering iron, and I really should be doing something
else.

Attila Kinali

-- 
It is upon moral qualities that a society is ultimately founded. All 
the prosperity and technological sophistication in the world is of no 
use without that foundation.
 -- Miss Matheson, The Diamond Age, Neil Stephenson
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Re: [time-nuts] FRK

[Attila Kinali]

On Mon, 26 Feb 2018 20:04:56 -0800
"Tom Van Baak"  wrote:

> Bert's M100 Rb teardown photos are now here:
> 
> http://leapsecond.com/bert/m100.htm

For those, who would like to see the rest of M100/FRK,
I just took pictures of my FRK-L that was sitting on my
desk for way too long:

http://time.kinali.ch/Efratom_FRK-L/

Yes, there are only the pictures of the four PCBs from outside.
I didn't want to take the FRK further appart, as that would
require a soldering iron, and I really should be doing something
else.

Attila Kinali

-- 
It is upon moral qualities that a society is ultimately founded. All 
the prosperity and technological sophistication in the world is of no 
use without that foundation.
 -- Miss Matheson, The Diamond Age, Neil Stephenson
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Re: [time-nuts] FRK

[Tom Van Baak]

Bert's M100 Rb teardown photos are now here:

http://leapsecond.com/bert/m100.htm

/tvb

- Original Message - 
From: "ewkehren via time-nuts" <time-nuts@febo.com>
To: "Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement" <time-nuts@febo.com>
Sent: Sunday, February 25, 2018 6:05 AM
Subject: [time-nuts] FRK


We have pictures of the guts of a M100 the file is 1.8 M off list or permission 
to post

Bert Kehren 

Sent from my Galaxy Tab® A
___

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Re: [time-nuts] FRK

[ewkehren via time-nuts]

Thank you I am presently only on my tablet I will be on my laptop in the 
morning do not think that there is much interest hardware or solder iron 1%Bert


Sent from my Galaxy Tab® A
 Original message From: Arnold Tibus <arnold.ti...@gmx.de> 
Date: 2/25/18  11:04 AM  (GMT-05:00) To: time-nuts@febo.com Subject: Re: 
[time-nuts] FRK 
Bert, you may upload it to this directory, which timenuts can then 
access and download as well, using this directory also:
https://my.hidrive.com/share/5fohndsi4k
The up- and downloads are much faster and there is no Mbit limit.
I will keep it open for a while. Give me a note if this ok for you.
Try it.
Of course, from time to time I will clean up a bit.

Regards,

Arnold, DK2WT

Am 25.02.2018 um 15:05 schrieb ewkehren via time-nuts:
> We have pictures of the guts of a M100 the file is 1.8 M off list or 
> permission to postBert Kehren
> 
> 
> Sent from my Galaxy Tab® A
> ___
> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
> To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
> and follow the instructions there.
> 

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Re: [time-nuts] FRK

[Arnold Tibus]

Bert, you may upload it to this directory, which timenuts can then 
access and download as well, using this directory also:

https://my.hidrive.com/share/5fohndsi4k
The up- and downloads are much faster and there is no Mbit limit.
I will keep it open for a while. Give me a note if this ok for you.
Try it.
Of course, from time to time I will clean up a bit.

Regards,

Arnold, DK2WT

Am 25.02.2018 um 15:05 schrieb ewkehren via time-nuts:

We have pictures of the guts of a M100 the file is 1.8 M off list or permission 
to postBert Kehren


Sent from my Galaxy Tab® A
___
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[time-nuts] FRK

[ewkehren via time-nuts]

We have pictures of the guts of a M100 the file is 1.8 M off list or permission 
to postBert Kehren 


Sent from my Galaxy Tab® A
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[time-nuts] FRK

[ew via time-nuts]

attached a picture of the open FRK
Bert Kehren___
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[time-nuts] FRK/M100 Lamps for sale!

[cdelect]

Hi,

I have a small quantity of good used FRK/M100 lamps I am getting rid of.

Offering here prior  to eBay.

$45.00 each which includes shipping in USA.

Contact me off list.

Cheers,

Corby

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Re: [time-nuts] FRK-L Rubidium

[Garren Davis]

Bob,

Just wanted to let you know your advice to let the FRK run for a while was spot 
on.
The lock voltage is down to 9.2 volts.

I was able to get my thunderbolt with the bad oscillator oven working by 
heating the
oscillator with a power resistor. After it locked I could see on an 
oscilloscope that
it and the FRK were both exactly the same. I plan on putting the thunderbolt 
oscillator
in an oven I'm building that will have proportional control and see how that 
works.

Thanks for the help.
Garren


-Original Message-
From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On Behalf 
Of Bob Camp
Sent: Saturday, February 09, 2013 10:14 AM
To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] FRK-L Rubidium

Hi

Let it run for a couple of days. If it's still up at   11V, I'd tweak it down 
a bit.

Bob

On Feb 9, 2013, at 12:38 PM, Garren Davis garren.da...@qlogic.com wrote:

 Found my problem with the FRK. R31 on the Osc board was burned and open. This 
 was caused by a shorted C16. Replaced and it is now locked. The lock voltage 
 is 12.7v. Is this good or should it be lower?

 Garren




 On Feb 9, 2013, at 6:10 AM, Bob Camp li...@rtty.us wrote:

 Hi

 How old is the FRK? Does it look like it's been run without a heat sink for 
 very long? They tend to get flaky if run for a while (many months) without 
 heat sinking. There's nothing mysterious about it. The MTBF of the parts 
 gets noticeably worse as the unit heats up.

 Bob

 On Feb 9, 2013, at 1:09 AM, Garren Davis garren.da...@qlogic.com wrote:


 Well for some reason the 10 Mhz stopped working on the FRK. Don't know why. 
 Started up the thunderbolt. It acquired satellites but then the DAC voltage 
 went to -5 volts. It's been there for an hour. Will this change after the 
 unit stabilizes? Going to bed. Will check it tomorrow.

 Garren




 On Feb 8, 2013, at 8:25 PM, Ed Palmer ed_pal...@sasktel.net wrote:

 Hi Garren,

 I suggest that you get the Thunderbolt working first.  Without a known 10 
 MHz source to compare to, you're flying blind.  Once the Tbolt is running, 
 you should be able to check the frequency of the FRK by feeding both into 
 your scope.  Trigger on the Tbolt and watch what the FRK does.  You should 
 see the trace scrolling in one direction, then slow down, then stop, then 
 scroll the other direction.  The 'stop' point is at 10 MHz.  The frequency 
 sweeps a total of 20-30 Hz so it's easy to see.  If you don't see the 
 'stop' point, the FRK isn't getting to 10 MHz.  Now use the best frequency 
 counter you've got to measure the Tbolt.  Regardless of the calibration of 
 your counter, the number your counter gives you becomes your 'new' 10 MHz. 
  Now measure the FRK to see if it's running fast or slow.

 You should check the temperature of the lamp.  It's easy to get at by 
 removing the cover in the center of the heat sink.  Probably best to 
 remove the cover and then power down before you go poking around inside!  
 The temperature of the cavity is also important, but getting to it is more 
 of a hassle - don't go there if you don't have to.

 Of course, check for the normal things like internal power supply 
 voltages, ripple, current drain (both initial and steady-state), etc.

 Regarding your second message, yes, the adjustment under the heat sink 
 near the edge is the C-field.  That won't help you at this point.  The 
 adjustment in the center of one side is the VCO.  You could try adjusting 
 it, but like I said, you're flying blind at this point.  You won't know if 
 you're adjusting closer to 10 MHz or further away.

 Good luck,

 Ed


 On 2/8/2013 6:12 PM, Garren Davis wrote:
 Been lurking on the list for a while and finally started playing
 with a FRK-L  rubidium frequency standard. I've had this thing for
 a while and decided to power it up and see what it would do. I do
 not get a lock. What I see is the lamp voltage at 8.54 volts which
 I think is good but the xtal control voltage swings from 2 volts
 to 15 volts and back to 2 volts and keeps cycling like that. I
 don't have a good frequency counter but I have a 3 Ghz 40 G/sample
 scope and it shows that the 10 MHz signal is there. I just don't
 know how accurate it is. Has anyone seen a problem like this? Can
 anyone point me to a place to start debugging this? I have the
 schematics and test tools. I am a test engineer so I'm not afraid
 to poke around in the guts of this thing. Hopefully I can get this
 thing running. I also have a thunderbolt that I'll get running
 this weekend. I don't know how deep I'll get into this time-nuts
 thing but I have this nice scope and a Wavecrest sitting in my
 garage

 a
 n
 d
 I'd lik
 e to put them to use. Any help would be appreciated.

 Garren

 ___
 time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to
 https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
 and follow the instructions

Re: [time-nuts] FRK-L Rubidium

[Garren Davis]

Ed, Bob,

This morning I noticed the crystal control voltage was down to 11 volts. I'll 
let it keep running to
see if it drops any further. The tuning capacitor is adjusted out about as far 
as I want to set it. Any
further and I think the adjustment screw will fall out. I did remove C11 as an 
experiment to see what
it would do to the frequency. It dropped a lot so now I know I can put a 
smaller one in if I need more
adjustment.

Next up is the Tbolt. I'm pretty sure the oven heater is not working. Has 
anyone taken apart the trimble
oscillator? It looks like it's sealed pretty good. I see quite a few for sale. 
Is it just easier to
replace it?

Thanks for all the help.

Garren

-Original Message-
From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On Behalf 
Of Ed Palmer
Sent: Sunday, February 10, 2013 11:02 AM
To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] FRK-L Rubidium

Hi Garren,

Yes, you're right.  Silly me, I made the mistake of believing what was written 
in the manual which says 2-12 volts. When I measure it, I see
~2-16 volts.  Let that be a warning to you.  This isn't the first time that 
manual has led me astray!  I should have known better.

Did you notice that the voltage changes as you adjust the capacitor on the 
side?  If the adjustment is at it's limit, you may have to change capacitors 
A3C11 and maybe A3C12 to get the oscillator back on frequency.  It's explained 
in the manual.  :-)  Let it settle for at least a few days and see which 
direction the crystal control voltage moves.  If it falls you're fine.  If it 
rises higher, you may want to look at the capacitors.  If you have to change 
the capacitors, be sure to use NP0/C0G type capacitors.

Bob's comments regarding the C-field are right on the money.  It's for fine 
tuning after you have a stable lock.  It won't help you obtain or maintain a 
lock.  You won't be able to adjust it without a known, stable
10 MHz reference source like the Tbolt and some good measurement equipment.

Ed

On 2/10/2013 9:27 AM, Garren Davis wrote:
 Hi Ed,

 The voltage swings from 2v to 17v. Doesn't that mean I have about 4 to 5 volt 
 margin if it's locked at 12 volts?

 I had to adjust the capacitor out almost all the way to get it to lock. If I 
 need to adjust it more can I use the C-field adjustment or should I stay away 
 from that?

 Garren


 On Feb 9, 2013, at 10:48 PM, Ed Palmer ed_pal...@sasktel.net wrote:

 Hi Garren,

 Congrats on your repair.  Since the crystal control voltage is spec'd as ~1 
 to 12 Vdc, you're apparently holding onto lock by the narrowest of margins.  
 You definitely want to adjust the oscillator to bring that voltage closer to 
 the middle of it's range.

 Ed

 On 2/9/2013 11:38 AM, Garren Davis wrote:
 Found my problem with the FRK. R31 on the Osc board was burned and open. 
 This was caused by a shorted C16. Replaced and it is now locked. The lock 
 voltage is 12.7v. Is this good or should it be lower?

 Garren

 On Feb 9, 2013, at 6:10 AM, Bob Camp li...@rtty.us wrote:

 Hi

 How old is the FRK? Does it look like it's been run without a heat sink 
 for very long? They tend to get flaky if run for a while (many months) 
 without heat sinking. There's nothing mysterious about it. The MTBF of the 
 parts gets noticeably worse as the unit heats up.

 Bob

 On Feb 9, 2013, at 1:09 AM, Garren Davis garren.da...@qlogic.com wrote:

 Well for some reason the 10 Mhz stopped working on the FRK. Don't know 
 why. Started up the thunderbolt. It acquired satellites but then the DAC 
 voltage went to -5 volts. It's been there for an hour. Will this change 
 after the unit stabilizes? Going to bed. Will check it tomorrow.

 Garren


 On Feb 8, 2013, at 8:25 PM, Ed Palmer ed_pal...@sasktel.net wrote:

 Hi Garren,

 I suggest that you get the Thunderbolt working first.  Without a known 
 10 MHz source to compare to, you're flying blind.  Once the Tbolt is 
 running, you should be able to check the frequency of the FRK by feeding 
 both into your scope.  Trigger on the Tbolt and watch what the FRK does. 
  You should see the trace scrolling in one direction, then slow down, 
 then stop, then scroll the other direction.  The 'stop' point is at 10 
 MHz.  The frequency sweeps a total of 20-30 Hz so it's easy to see.  If 
 you don't see the 'stop' point, the FRK isn't getting to 10 MHz.  Now 
 use the best frequency counter you've got to measure the Tbolt.  
 Regardless of the calibration of your counter, the number your counter 
 gives you becomes your 'new' 10 MHz.  Now measure the FRK to see if it's 
 running fast or slow.

 You should check the temperature of the lamp.  It's easy to get at by 
 removing the cover in the center of the heat sink.  Probably best to 
 remove the cover and then power down before you go poking around inside! 
  The temperature of the cavity is also important, but getting to it is 
 more of a hassle - don't go there if you don't have

Re: [time-nuts] FRK-L Rubidium

[Tom Miller]

It is possible to open the can if you are careful. A good vacuum desoldering 
tool is a good start to remove as much of the solder as possible. Then one 
would peal the can open a bit at a time. Then you need to find out where the 
failure is.


But to answer your question, yes just buy one, it's much easier. But first 
check that there is power to the heater.


- Original Message - 
From: Garren Davis garren.da...@qlogic.com
To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement 
time-nuts@febo.com

Sent: Monday, February 11, 2013 12:01 PM
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] FRK-L Rubidium



Ed, Bob,

This morning I noticed the crystal control voltage was down to 11 volts. 
I'll let it keep running to
see if it drops any further. The tuning capacitor is adjusted out about as 
far as I want to set it. Any
further and I think the adjustment screw will fall out. I did remove C11 as 
an experiment to see what
it would do to the frequency. It dropped a lot so now I know I can put a 
smaller one in if I need more

adjustment.

Next up is the Tbolt. I'm pretty sure the oven heater is not working. Has 
anyone taken apart the trimble
oscillator? It looks like it's sealed pretty good. I see quite a few for 
sale. Is it just easier to

replace it?

Thanks for all the help.

Garren

-Original Message-
From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On 
Behalf Of Ed Palmer

Sent: Sunday, February 10, 2013 11:02 AM
To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] FRK-L Rubidium

Hi Garren,

Yes, you're right.  Silly me, I made the mistake of believing what was 
written in the manual which says 2-12 volts. When I measure it, I see
~2-16 volts.  Let that be a warning to you.  This isn't the first time that 
manual has led me astray!  I should have known better.


Did you notice that the voltage changes as you adjust the capacitor on the 
side?  If the adjustment is at it's limit, you may have to change capacitors 
A3C11 and maybe A3C12 to get the oscillator back on frequency.  It's 
explained in the manual.  :-)  Let it settle for at least a few days and see 
which direction the crystal control voltage moves.  If it falls you're fine. 
If it rises higher, you may want to look at the capacitors.  If you have to 
change the capacitors, be sure to use NP0/C0G type capacitors.


Bob's comments regarding the C-field are right on the money.  It's for fine 
tuning after you have a stable lock.  It won't help you obtain or maintain a 
lock.  You won't be able to adjust it without a known, stable

10 MHz reference source like the Tbolt and some good measurement equipment.

Ed

On 2/10/2013 9:27 AM, Garren Davis wrote:

Hi Ed,

The voltage swings from 2v to 17v. Doesn't that mean I have about 4 to 5 
volt margin if it's locked at 12 volts?


I had to adjust the capacitor out almost all the way to get it to lock. If 
I need to adjust it more can I use the C-field adjustment or should I stay 
away from that?


Garren


On Feb 9, 2013, at 10:48 PM, Ed Palmer ed_pal...@sasktel.net wrote:


Hi Garren,

Congrats on your repair.  Since the crystal control voltage is spec'd as 
~1 to 12 Vdc, you're apparently holding onto lock by the narrowest of 
margins.  You definitely want to adjust the oscillator to bring that 
voltage closer to the middle of it's range.


Ed

On 2/9/2013 11:38 AM, Garren Davis wrote:
Found my problem with the FRK. R31 on the Osc board was burned and open. 
This was caused by a shorted C16. Replaced and it is now locked. The 
lock voltage is 12.7v. Is this good or should it be lower?


Garren

On Feb 9, 2013, at 6:10 AM, Bob Camp li...@rtty.us wrote:


Hi

How old is the FRK? Does it look like it's been run without a heat sink 
for very long? They tend to get flaky if run for a while (many months) 
without heat sinking. There's nothing mysterious about it. The MTBF of 
the parts gets noticeably worse as the unit heats up.


Bob

On Feb 9, 2013, at 1:09 AM, Garren Davis garren.da...@qlogic.com 
wrote:


Well for some reason the 10 Mhz stopped working on the FRK. Don't know 
why. Started up the thunderbolt. It acquired satellites but then the 
DAC voltage went to -5 volts. It's been there for an hour. Will this 
change after the unit stabilizes? Going to bed. Will check it 
tomorrow.


Garren


On Feb 8, 2013, at 8:25 PM, Ed Palmer ed_pal...@sasktel.net wrote:


Hi Garren,

I suggest that you get the Thunderbolt working first.  Without a 
known 10 MHz source to compare to, you're flying blind.  Once the 
Tbolt is running, you should be able to check the frequency of the 
FRK by feeding both into your scope.  Trigger on the Tbolt and watch 
what the FRK does.  You should see the trace scrolling in one 
direction, then slow down, then stop, then scroll the other 
direction.  The 'stop' point is at 10 MHz.  The frequency sweeps a 
total of 20-30 Hz so it's easy to see.  If you don't see the 'stop' 
point, the FRK isn't getting to 10 MHz.  Now use the best

Re: [time-nuts] FRK-L Rubidium

[Garren Davis]

Hi Ed,

The voltage swings from 2v to 17v. Doesn't that mean I have about 4 to 5 volt 
margin if it's locked at 12 volts?

I had to adjust the capacitor out almost all the way to get it to lock. If I 
need to adjust it more can I use the C-field adjustment or should I stay away 
from that?

Garren




On Feb 9, 2013, at 10:48 PM, Ed Palmer ed_pal...@sasktel.net wrote:

 Hi Garren,

 Congrats on your repair.  Since the crystal control voltage is spec'd as ~1 
 to 12 Vdc, you're apparently holding onto lock by the narrowest of margins.  
 You definitely want to adjust the oscillator to bring that voltage closer to 
 the middle of it's range.

 Ed

 On 2/9/2013 11:38 AM, Garren Davis wrote:
 Found my problem with the FRK. R31 on the Osc board was burned and open. 
 This was caused by a shorted C16. Replaced and it is now locked. The lock 
 voltage is 12.7v. Is this good or should it be lower?

 Garren

 On Feb 9, 2013, at 6:10 AM, Bob Camp li...@rtty.us wrote:

 Hi

 How old is the FRK? Does it look like it's been run without a heat sink for 
 very long? They tend to get flaky if run for a while (many months) without 
 heat sinking. There's nothing mysterious about it. The MTBF of the parts 
 gets noticeably worse as the unit heats up.

 Bob

 On Feb 9, 2013, at 1:09 AM, Garren Davis garren.da...@qlogic.com wrote:

 Well for some reason the 10 Mhz stopped working on the FRK. Don't know 
 why. Started up the thunderbolt. It acquired satellites but then the DAC 
 voltage went to -5 volts. It's been there for an hour. Will this change 
 after the unit stabilizes? Going to bed. Will check it tomorrow.

 Garren


 On Feb 8, 2013, at 8:25 PM, Ed Palmer ed_pal...@sasktel.net wrote:

 Hi Garren,

 I suggest that you get the Thunderbolt working first.  Without a known 10 
 MHz source to compare to, you're flying blind.  Once the Tbolt is 
 running, you should be able to check the frequency of the FRK by feeding 
 both into your scope.  Trigger on the Tbolt and watch what the FRK does.  
 You should see the trace scrolling in one direction, then slow down, then 
 stop, then scroll the other direction.  The 'stop' point is at 10 MHz.  
 The frequency sweeps a total of 20-30 Hz so it's easy to see.  If you 
 don't see the 'stop' point, the FRK isn't getting to 10 MHz.  Now use the 
 best frequency counter you've got to measure the Tbolt.  Regardless of 
 the calibration of your counter, the number your counter gives you 
 becomes your 'new' 10 MHz.  Now measure the FRK to see if it's running 
 fast or slow.

 You should check the temperature of the lamp.  It's easy to get at by 
 removing the cover in the center of the heat sink.  Probably best to 
 remove the cover and then power down before you go poking around inside!  
 The temperature of the cavity is also important, but getting to it is 
 more of a hassle - don't go there if you don't have to.

 Of course, check for the normal things like internal power supply 
 voltages, ripple, current drain (both initial and steady-state), etc.

 Regarding your second message, yes, the adjustment under the heat sink 
 near the edge is the C-field.  That won't help you at this point.  The 
 adjustment in the center of one side is the VCO.  You could try adjusting 
 it, but like I said, you're flying blind at this point.  You won't know 
 if you're adjusting closer to 10 MHz or further away.

 Good luck,

 Ed


 On 2/8/2013 6:12 PM, Garren Davis wrote:
 Been lurking on the list for a while and finally started playing with a 
 FRK-L  rubidium frequency standard. I've had this thing for a while and 
 decided to power it up and see what it would do. I do not get a lock. 
 What I see is the lamp voltage at 8.54 volts which I think is good but 
 the xtal control voltage swings from 2 volts to 15 volts and back to 2 
 volts and keeps cycling like that. I don't have a good frequency counter 
 but I have a 3 Ghz 40 G/sample scope and it shows that the 10 MHz signal 
 is there. I just don't know how accurate it is. Has anyone seen a 
 problem like this? Can anyone point me to a place to start debugging 
 this? I have the schematics and test tools. I am a test engineer so I'm 
 not afraid to poke around in the guts of this thing. Hopefully I can get 
 this thing running. I also have a thunderbolt that I'll get running this 
 weekend. I don't know how deep I'll get into this time-nuts thing but I 
 have this nice scope and a Wavecrest sitting in my garage
 and I'd
 like to put them to use. Any help would be appreciated.
 Garren


 ___
 time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
 To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
 and follow the instructions there.




This message and any attached documents contain information from QLogic 
Corporation or its wholly-owned subsidiaries that may be confidential. If you 
are not the intended recipient, you may not read, copy, distribute, or 

Re: [time-nuts] FRK-L Rubidium

[Garren Davis]

Bob,

That was my thoughts also. The GPS receiver and serial connection to the 
computer are working so I know the power connections are ok. I think I bought 
this through a group buy from someone on this list and they said all were 
tested before they were shipped. Maybe it was just time for the heater to fail. 
Are these trimbles repairable or is it easier to just replace these?

Garren




On Feb 9, 2013, at 8:14 AM, Bob Camp li...@rtty.us wrote:

 Hi

 The +12 V supply at 60 ma likely means that the heater in the OCXO is not 
 working. If you have 60 ma on the -12 V supply, it's pulling about 10X more 
 than it should.

 Bob

 On Feb 9, 2013, at 10:01 AM, Garren Davis garren.da...@qlogic.com wrote:

 Thanks for the reply.
 I found that the 12v current is only 60ma. I suppose that means the Osc. 
 heater is not working. I'm not having much luck with this time nuts stuff. 
 First the FRK and now the thunderbolt. Guess I'll start looking for another 
 one.

 Garren




 On Feb 9, 2013, at 6:01 AM, Bob Camp li...@rtty.us wrote:

 Hi

 DAC clamped at -5 volts suggests that the TBolt has issues. First thing to 
 check is the -12 volt supply. If it's missing, the DAC will indicate -5 on 
 the screen and be sitting at 0 in real life. There are a couple other 
 things in the DAC circuit that can make it malfunction.

 Bob

 On Feb 9, 2013, at 1:09 AM, Garren Davis garren.da...@qlogic.com wrote:


 Well for some reason the 10 Mhz stopped working on the FRK. Don't know 
 why. Started up the thunderbolt. It acquired satellites but then the DAC 
 voltage went to -5 volts. It's been there for an hour. Will this change 
 after the unit stabilizes? Going to bed. Will check it tomorrow.

 Garren




 On Feb 8, 2013, at 8:25 PM, Ed Palmer ed_pal...@sasktel.net wrote:

 Hi Garren,

 I suggest that you get the Thunderbolt working first.  Without a known 10 
 MHz source to compare to, you're flying blind.  Once the Tbolt is 
 running, you should be able to check the frequency of the FRK by feeding 
 both into your scope.  Trigger on the Tbolt and watch what the FRK does.  
 You should see the trace scrolling in one direction, then slow down, then 
 stop, then scroll the other direction.  The 'stop' point is at 10 MHz.  
 The frequency sweeps a total of 20-30 Hz so it's easy to see.  If you 
 don't see the 'stop' point, the FRK isn't getting to 10 MHz.  Now use the 
 best frequency counter you've got to measure the Tbolt.  Regardless of 
 the calibration of your counter, the number your counter gives you 
 becomes your 'new' 10 MHz.  Now measure the FRK to see if it's running 
 fast or slow.

 You should check the temperature of the lamp.  It's easy to get at by 
 removing the cover in the center of the heat sink.  Probably best to 
 remove the cover and then power down before you go poking around inside!  
 The temperature of the cavity is also important, but getting to it is 
 more of a hassle - don't go there if you don't have to.

 Of course, check for the normal things like internal power supply 
 voltages, ripple, current drain (both initial and steady-state), etc.

 Regarding your second message, yes, the adjustment under the heat sink 
 near the edge is the C-field.  That won't help you at this point.  The 
 adjustment in the center of one side is the VCO.  You could try adjusting 
 it, but like I said, you're flying blind at this point.  You won't know 
 if you're adjusting closer to 10 MHz or further away.

 Good luck,

 Ed


 On 2/8/2013 6:12 PM, Garren Davis wrote:
 Been lurking on the list for a while and finally started playing with a 
 FRK-L  rubidium frequency standard. I've had this thing for a while and 
 decided to power it up and see what it would do. I do not get a lock. 
 What I see is the lamp voltage at 8.54 volts which I think is good but 
 the xtal control voltage swings from 2 volts to 15 volts and back to 2 
 volts and keeps cycling like that. I don't have a good frequency counter 
 but I have a 3 Ghz 40 G/sample scope and it shows that the 10 MHz signal 
 is there. I just don't know how accurate it is. Has anyone seen a 
 problem like this? Can anyone point me to a place to start debugging 
 this? I have the schematics and test tools. I am a test engineer so I'm 
 not afraid to poke around in the guts of this thing. Hopefully I can get 
 this thing running. I also have a thunderbolt that I'll get running this 
 weekend. I don't know how deep I'll get into this time-nuts thing but I 
 have this nice scope and a Wavecrest sitting in my garage

 a
 n
 d
 I'd lik
 e to put them to use. Any help would be appreciated.

 Garren

 ___
 time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
 To unsubscribe, go to 
 https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
 and follow the instructions there.


 

 This message and any attached documents contain information from QLogic 
 Corporation or its wholly-owned subsidiaries that may 

Re: [time-nuts] FRK-L Rubidium

[Bob Camp]

Hi

The OCVCXO  tuning voltage adjust on the 10 MHz simply centers up the sweep 
process. It has no impact on the output frequency once the unit is locked up. 

The C field adjustment sets the Rb on frequency once it is locked. It is only 
used to set the unit on frequency. 

Since the range on the C field is maybe 0.002 ppm and the 10 MHz set is maybe 1 
ppm, there is little the C field would do to help the 10 MHz adjust. 

It is quite possible for the crystal in the 10 MHz oscillator to age further 
than tuning range on the oscillator. You can either replace the crystal (good 
luck)  or fiddle one of the fixed caps in the oscillator circuit (normally much 
easier). 

Bob

On Feb 10, 2013, at 10:27 AM, Garren Davis garren.da...@qlogic.com wrote:

 
 Hi Ed,
 
 The voltage swings from 2v to 17v. Doesn't that mean I have about 4 to 5 volt 
 margin if it's locked at 12 volts?
 
 I had to adjust the capacitor out almost all the way to get it to lock. If I 
 need to adjust it more can I use the C-field adjustment or should I stay away 
 from that?
 
 Garren
 
 
 
 
 On Feb 9, 2013, at 10:48 PM, Ed Palmer ed_pal...@sasktel.net wrote:
 
 Hi Garren,
 
 Congrats on your repair.  Since the crystal control voltage is spec'd as ~1 
 to 12 Vdc, you're apparently holding onto lock by the narrowest of margins.  
 You definitely want to adjust the oscillator to bring that voltage closer to 
 the middle of it's range.
 
 Ed
 
 On 2/9/2013 11:38 AM, Garren Davis wrote:
 Found my problem with the FRK. R31 on the Osc board was burned and open. 
 This was caused by a shorted C16. Replaced and it is now locked. The lock 
 voltage is 12.7v. Is this good or should it be lower?
 
 Garren
 
 On Feb 9, 2013, at 6:10 AM, Bob Camp li...@rtty.us wrote:
 
 Hi
 
 How old is the FRK? Does it look like it's been run without a heat sink 
 for very long? They tend to get flaky if run for a while (many months) 
 without heat sinking. There's nothing mysterious about it. The MTBF of the 
 parts gets noticeably worse as the unit heats up.
 
 Bob
 
 On Feb 9, 2013, at 1:09 AM, Garren Davis garren.da...@qlogic.com wrote:
 
 Well for some reason the 10 Mhz stopped working on the FRK. Don't know 
 why. Started up the thunderbolt. It acquired satellites but then the DAC 
 voltage went to -5 volts. It's been there for an hour. Will this change 
 after the unit stabilizes? Going to bed. Will check it tomorrow.
 
 Garren
 
 
 On Feb 8, 2013, at 8:25 PM, Ed Palmer ed_pal...@sasktel.net wrote:
 
 Hi Garren,
 
 I suggest that you get the Thunderbolt working first.  Without a known 
 10 MHz source to compare to, you're flying blind.  Once the Tbolt is 
 running, you should be able to check the frequency of the FRK by feeding 
 both into your scope.  Trigger on the Tbolt and watch what the FRK does. 
  You should see the trace scrolling in one direction, then slow down, 
 then stop, then scroll the other direction.  The 'stop' point is at 10 
 MHz.  The frequency sweeps a total of 20-30 Hz so it's easy to see.  If 
 you don't see the 'stop' point, the FRK isn't getting to 10 MHz.  Now 
 use the best frequency counter you've got to measure the Tbolt.  
 Regardless of the calibration of your counter, the number your counter 
 gives you becomes your 'new' 10 MHz.  Now measure the FRK to see if it's 
 running fast or slow.
 
 You should check the temperature of the lamp.  It's easy to get at by 
 removing the cover in the center of the heat sink.  Probably best to 
 remove the cover and then power down before you go poking around inside! 
  The temperature of the cavity is also important, but getting to it is 
 more of a hassle - don't go there if you don't have to.
 
 Of course, check for the normal things like internal power supply 
 voltages, ripple, current drain (both initial and steady-state), etc.
 
 Regarding your second message, yes, the adjustment under the heat sink 
 near the edge is the C-field.  That won't help you at this point.  The 
 adjustment in the center of one side is the VCO.  You could try 
 adjusting it, but like I said, you're flying blind at this point.  You 
 won't know if you're adjusting closer to 10 MHz or further away.
 
 Good luck,
 
 Ed
 
 
 On 2/8/2013 6:12 PM, Garren Davis wrote:
 Been lurking on the list for a while and finally started playing with a 
 FRK-L  rubidium frequency standard. I've had this thing for a while and 
 decided to power it up and see what it would do. I do not get a lock. 
 What I see is the lamp voltage at 8.54 volts which I think is good but 
 the xtal control voltage swings from 2 volts to 15 volts and back to 2 
 volts and keeps cycling like that. I don't have a good frequency 
 counter but I have a 3 Ghz 40 G/sample scope and it shows that the 10 
 MHz signal is there. I just don't know how accurate it is. Has anyone 
 seen a problem like this? Can anyone point me to a place to start 
 debugging this? I have the schematics and test tools. I am a test 
 engineer so I'm not afraid to poke around in 

Re: [time-nuts] FRK-L Rubidium

[Ed Palmer]

Hi Garren,

Yes, you're right.  Silly me, I made the mistake of believing what was 
written in the manual which says 2-12 volts. When I measure it, I see 
~2-16 volts.  Let that be a warning to you.  This isn't the first time 
that manual has led me astray!  I should have known better.


Did you notice that the voltage changes as you adjust the capacitor on 
the side?  If the adjustment is at it's limit, you may have to change 
capacitors A3C11 and maybe A3C12 to get the oscillator back on 
frequency.  It's explained in the manual.  :-)  Let it settle for at 
least a few days and see which direction the crystal control voltage 
moves.  If it falls you're fine.  If it rises higher, you may want to 
look at the capacitors.  If you have to change the capacitors, be sure 
to use NP0/C0G type capacitors.


Bob's comments regarding the C-field are right on the money.  It's for 
fine tuning after you have a stable lock.  It won't help you obtain or 
maintain a lock.  You won't be able to adjust it without a known, stable 
10 MHz reference source like the Tbolt and some good measurement equipment.


Ed

On 2/10/2013 9:27 AM, Garren Davis wrote:

Hi Ed,

The voltage swings from 2v to 17v. Doesn't that mean I have about 4 to 5 volt 
margin if it's locked at 12 volts?

I had to adjust the capacitor out almost all the way to get it to lock. If I 
need to adjust it more can I use the C-field adjustment or should I stay away 
from that?

Garren


On Feb 9, 2013, at 10:48 PM, Ed Palmer ed_pal...@sasktel.net wrote:


Hi Garren,

Congrats on your repair.  Since the crystal control voltage is spec'd as ~1 to 
12 Vdc, you're apparently holding onto lock by the narrowest of margins.  You 
definitely want to adjust the oscillator to bring that voltage closer to the 
middle of it's range.

Ed

On 2/9/2013 11:38 AM, Garren Davis wrote:

Found my problem with the FRK. R31 on the Osc board was burned and open. This 
was caused by a shorted C16. Replaced and it is now locked. The lock voltage is 
12.7v. Is this good or should it be lower?

Garren

On Feb 9, 2013, at 6:10 AM, Bob Camp li...@rtty.us wrote:


Hi

How old is the FRK? Does it look like it's been run without a heat sink for 
very long? They tend to get flaky if run for a while (many months) without heat 
sinking. There's nothing mysterious about it. The MTBF of the parts gets 
noticeably worse as the unit heats up.

Bob

On Feb 9, 2013, at 1:09 AM, Garren Davis garren.da...@qlogic.com wrote:


Well for some reason the 10 Mhz stopped working on the FRK. Don't know why. 
Started up the thunderbolt. It acquired satellites but then the DAC voltage 
went to -5 volts. It's been there for an hour. Will this change after the unit 
stabilizes? Going to bed. Will check it tomorrow.

Garren


On Feb 8, 2013, at 8:25 PM, Ed Palmer ed_pal...@sasktel.net wrote:


Hi Garren,

I suggest that you get the Thunderbolt working first.  Without a known 10 MHz 
source to compare to, you're flying blind.  Once the Tbolt is running, you 
should be able to check the frequency of the FRK by feeding both into your 
scope.  Trigger on the Tbolt and watch what the FRK does.  You should see the 
trace scrolling in one direction, then slow down, then stop, then scroll the 
other direction.  The 'stop' point is at 10 MHz.  The frequency sweeps a total 
of 20-30 Hz so it's easy to see.  If you don't see the 'stop' point, the FRK 
isn't getting to 10 MHz.  Now use the best frequency counter you've got to 
measure the Tbolt.  Regardless of the calibration of your counter, the number 
your counter gives you becomes your 'new' 10 MHz.  Now measure the FRK to see 
if it's running fast or slow.

You should check the temperature of the lamp.  It's easy to get at by removing 
the cover in the center of the heat sink.  Probably best to remove the cover 
and then power down before you go poking around inside!  The temperature of the 
cavity is also important, but getting to it is more of a hassle - don't go 
there if you don't have to.

Of course, check for the normal things like internal power supply voltages, 
ripple, current drain (both initial and steady-state), etc.

Regarding your second message, yes, the adjustment under the heat sink near the 
edge is the C-field.  That won't help you at this point.  The adjustment in the 
center of one side is the VCO.  You could try adjusting it, but like I said, 
you're flying blind at this point.  You won't know if you're adjusting closer 
to 10 MHz or further away.

Good luck,

Ed


On 2/8/2013 6:12 PM, Garren Davis wrote:

Been lurking on the list for a while and finally started playing with a FRK-L  
rubidium frequency standard. I've had this thing for a while and decided to 
power it up and see what it would do. I do not get a lock. What I see is the 
lamp voltage at 8.54 volts which I think is good but the xtal control voltage 
swings from 2 volts to 15 volts and back to 2 volts and keeps cycling like 
that. I don't have a good frequency counter but I have a 3 

Re: [time-nuts] FRK-L Rubidium

[Bob Camp]

Hi

DAC clamped at -5 volts suggests that the TBolt has issues. First thing to 
check is the -12 volt supply. If it's missing, the DAC will indicate -5 on the 
screen and be sitting at 0 in real life. There are a couple other things in the 
DAC circuit that can make it malfunction.

Bob

On Feb 9, 2013, at 1:09 AM, Garren Davis garren.da...@qlogic.com wrote:

 
 Well for some reason the 10 Mhz stopped working on the FRK. Don't know why. 
 Started up the thunderbolt. It acquired satellites but then the DAC voltage 
 went to -5 volts. It's been there for an hour. Will this change after the 
 unit stabilizes? Going to bed. Will check it tomorrow.
 
 Garren
 
 
 
 
 On Feb 8, 2013, at 8:25 PM, Ed Palmer ed_pal...@sasktel.net wrote:
 
 Hi Garren,
 
 I suggest that you get the Thunderbolt working first.  Without a known 10 
 MHz source to compare to, you're flying blind.  Once the Tbolt is running, 
 you should be able to check the frequency of the FRK by feeding both into 
 your scope.  Trigger on the Tbolt and watch what the FRK does.  You should 
 see the trace scrolling in one direction, then slow down, then stop, then 
 scroll the other direction.  The 'stop' point is at 10 MHz.  The frequency 
 sweeps a total of 20-30 Hz so it's easy to see.  If you don't see the 'stop' 
 point, the FRK isn't getting to 10 MHz.  Now use the best frequency counter 
 you've got to measure the Tbolt.  Regardless of the calibration of your 
 counter, the number your counter gives you becomes your 'new' 10 MHz.  Now 
 measure the FRK to see if it's running fast or slow.
 
 You should check the temperature of the lamp.  It's easy to get at by 
 removing the cover in the center of the heat sink.  Probably best to remove 
 the cover and then power down before you go poking around inside!  The 
 temperature of the cavity is also important, but getting to it is more of a 
 hassle - don't go there if you don't have to.
 
 Of course, check for the normal things like internal power supply voltages, 
 ripple, current drain (both initial and steady-state), etc.
 
 Regarding your second message, yes, the adjustment under the heat sink near 
 the edge is the C-field.  That won't help you at this point.  The adjustment 
 in the center of one side is the VCO.  You could try adjusting it, but like 
 I said, you're flying blind at this point.  You won't know if you're 
 adjusting closer to 10 MHz or further away.
 
 Good luck,
 
 Ed
 
 
 On 2/8/2013 6:12 PM, Garren Davis wrote:
 Been lurking on the list for a while and finally started playing with a 
 FRK-L  rubidium frequency standard. I've had this thing for a while and 
 decided to power it up and see what it would do. I do not get a lock. What 
 I see is the lamp voltage at 8.54 volts which I think is good but the xtal 
 control voltage swings from 2 volts to 15 volts and back to 2 volts and 
 keeps cycling like that. I don't have a good frequency counter but I have a 
 3 Ghz 40 G/sample scope and it shows that the 10 MHz signal is there. I 
 just don't know how accurate it is. Has anyone seen a problem like this? 
 Can anyone point me to a place to start debugging this? I have the 
 schematics and test tools. I am a test engineer so I'm not afraid to poke 
 around in the guts of this thing. Hopefully I can get this thing running. I 
 also have a thunderbolt that I'll get running this weekend. I don't know 
 how deep I'll get into this time-nuts thing but I have this nice scope and 
 a Wavecrest sitting in my garage an
 d
 I'd lik
 e to put them to use. Any help would be appreciated.
 
 Garren
 
 ___
 time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
 To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
 and follow the instructions there.
 
 
 
 
 This message and any attached documents contain information from QLogic 
 Corporation or its wholly-owned subsidiaries that may be confidential. If you 
 are not the intended recipient, you may not read, copy, distribute, or use 
 this information. If you have received this transmission in error, please 
 notify the sender immediately by reply e-mail and then delete this message.
 
 ___
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To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
and follow the instructions there.

Re: [time-nuts] FRK-L Rubidium

[Bob Camp]

Hi

How old is the FRK? Does it look like it's been run without a heat sink for 
very long? They tend to get flaky if run for a while (many months) without heat 
sinking. There's nothing mysterious about it. The MTBF of the parts gets 
noticeably worse as the unit heats up.

Bob

On Feb 9, 2013, at 1:09 AM, Garren Davis garren.da...@qlogic.com wrote:

 
 Well for some reason the 10 Mhz stopped working on the FRK. Don't know why. 
 Started up the thunderbolt. It acquired satellites but then the DAC voltage 
 went to -5 volts. It's been there for an hour. Will this change after the 
 unit stabilizes? Going to bed. Will check it tomorrow.
 
 Garren
 
 
 
 
 On Feb 8, 2013, at 8:25 PM, Ed Palmer ed_pal...@sasktel.net wrote:
 
 Hi Garren,
 
 I suggest that you get the Thunderbolt working first.  Without a known 10 
 MHz source to compare to, you're flying blind.  Once the Tbolt is running, 
 you should be able to check the frequency of the FRK by feeding both into 
 your scope.  Trigger on the Tbolt and watch what the FRK does.  You should 
 see the trace scrolling in one direction, then slow down, then stop, then 
 scroll the other direction.  The 'stop' point is at 10 MHz.  The frequency 
 sweeps a total of 20-30 Hz so it's easy to see.  If you don't see the 'stop' 
 point, the FRK isn't getting to 10 MHz.  Now use the best frequency counter 
 you've got to measure the Tbolt.  Regardless of the calibration of your 
 counter, the number your counter gives you becomes your 'new' 10 MHz.  Now 
 measure the FRK to see if it's running fast or slow.
 
 You should check the temperature of the lamp.  It's easy to get at by 
 removing the cover in the center of the heat sink.  Probably best to remove 
 the cover and then power down before you go poking around inside!  The 
 temperature of the cavity is also important, but getting to it is more of a 
 hassle - don't go there if you don't have to.
 
 Of course, check for the normal things like internal power supply voltages, 
 ripple, current drain (both initial and steady-state), etc.
 
 Regarding your second message, yes, the adjustment under the heat sink near 
 the edge is the C-field.  That won't help you at this point.  The adjustment 
 in the center of one side is the VCO.  You could try adjusting it, but like 
 I said, you're flying blind at this point.  You won't know if you're 
 adjusting closer to 10 MHz or further away.
 
 Good luck,
 
 Ed
 
 
 On 2/8/2013 6:12 PM, Garren Davis wrote:
 Been lurking on the list for a while and finally started playing with a 
 FRK-L  rubidium frequency standard. I've had this thing for a while and 
 decided to power it up and see what it would do. I do not get a lock. What 
 I see is the lamp voltage at 8.54 volts which I think is good but the xtal 
 control voltage swings from 2 volts to 15 volts and back to 2 volts and 
 keeps cycling like that. I don't have a good frequency counter but I have a 
 3 Ghz 40 G/sample scope and it shows that the 10 MHz signal is there. I 
 just don't know how accurate it is. Has anyone seen a problem like this? 
 Can anyone point me to a place to start debugging this? I have the 
 schematics and test tools. I am a test engineer so I'm not afraid to poke 
 around in the guts of this thing. Hopefully I can get this thing running. I 
 also have a thunderbolt that I'll get running this weekend. I don't know 
 how deep I'll get into this time-nuts thing but I have this nice scope and 
 a Wavecrest sitting in my garage an
 d
 I'd lik
 e to put them to use. Any help would be appreciated.
 
 Garren
 
 ___
 time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
 To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
 and follow the instructions there.
 
 
 
 
 This message and any attached documents contain information from QLogic 
 Corporation or its wholly-owned subsidiaries that may be confidential. If you 
 are not the intended recipient, you may not read, copy, distribute, or use 
 this information. If you have received this transmission in error, please 
 notify the sender immediately by reply e-mail and then delete this message.
 
 ___
 time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
 To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
 and follow the instructions there.

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To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
and follow the instructions there.

Re: [time-nuts] FRK-L Rubidium

[Garren Davis]

Thanks for the reply.
I found that the 12v current is only 60ma. I suppose that means the Osc. heater 
is not working. I'm not having much luck with this time nuts stuff. First the 
FRK and now the thunderbolt. Guess I'll start looking for another one.

Garren




On Feb 9, 2013, at 6:01 AM, Bob Camp li...@rtty.us wrote:

 Hi

 DAC clamped at -5 volts suggests that the TBolt has issues. First thing to 
 check is the -12 volt supply. If it's missing, the DAC will indicate -5 on 
 the screen and be sitting at 0 in real life. There are a couple other things 
 in the DAC circuit that can make it malfunction.

 Bob

 On Feb 9, 2013, at 1:09 AM, Garren Davis garren.da...@qlogic.com wrote:


 Well for some reason the 10 Mhz stopped working on the FRK. Don't know why. 
 Started up the thunderbolt. It acquired satellites but then the DAC voltage 
 went to -5 volts. It's been there for an hour. Will this change after the 
 unit stabilizes? Going to bed. Will check it tomorrow.

 Garren




 On Feb 8, 2013, at 8:25 PM, Ed Palmer ed_pal...@sasktel.net wrote:

 Hi Garren,

 I suggest that you get the Thunderbolt working first.  Without a known 10 
 MHz source to compare to, you're flying blind.  Once the Tbolt is running, 
 you should be able to check the frequency of the FRK by feeding both into 
 your scope.  Trigger on the Tbolt and watch what the FRK does.  You should 
 see the trace scrolling in one direction, then slow down, then stop, then 
 scroll the other direction.  The 'stop' point is at 10 MHz.  The frequency 
 sweeps a total of 20-30 Hz so it's easy to see.  If you don't see the 
 'stop' point, the FRK isn't getting to 10 MHz.  Now use the best frequency 
 counter you've got to measure the Tbolt.  Regardless of the calibration of 
 your counter, the number your counter gives you becomes your 'new' 10 MHz.  
 Now measure the FRK to see if it's running fast or slow.

 You should check the temperature of the lamp.  It's easy to get at by 
 removing the cover in the center of the heat sink.  Probably best to remove 
 the cover and then power down before you go poking around inside!  The 
 temperature of the cavity is also important, but getting to it is more of a 
 hassle - don't go there if you don't have to.

 Of course, check for the normal things like internal power supply voltages, 
 ripple, current drain (both initial and steady-state), etc.

 Regarding your second message, yes, the adjustment under the heat sink near 
 the edge is the C-field.  That won't help you at this point.  The 
 adjustment in the center of one side is the VCO.  You could try adjusting 
 it, but like I said, you're flying blind at this point.  You won't know if 
 you're adjusting closer to 10 MHz or further away.

 Good luck,

 Ed


 On 2/8/2013 6:12 PM, Garren Davis wrote:
 Been lurking on the list for a while and finally started playing with a 
 FRK-L  rubidium frequency standard. I've had this thing for a while and 
 decided to power it up and see what it would do. I do not get a lock. What 
 I see is the lamp voltage at 8.54 volts which I think is good but the xtal 
 control voltage swings from 2 volts to 15 volts and back to 2 volts and 
 keeps cycling like that. I don't have a good frequency counter but I have 
 a 3 Ghz 40 G/sample scope and it shows that the 10 MHz signal is there. I 
 just don't know how accurate it is. Has anyone seen a problem like this? 
 Can anyone point me to a place to start debugging this? I have the 
 schematics and test tools. I am a test engineer so I'm not afraid to poke 
 around in the guts of this thing. Hopefully I can get this thing running. 
 I also have a thunderbolt that I'll get running this weekend. I don't know 
 how deep I'll get into this time-nuts thing but I have this nice scope and 
 a Wavecrest sitting in my garage a
 n
 d
 I'd lik
 e to put them to use. Any help would be appreciated.

 Garren

 ___
 time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
 To unsubscribe, go to 
 https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
 and follow the instructions there.


 

 This message and any attached documents contain information from QLogic 
 Corporation or its wholly-owned subsidiaries that may be confidential. If 
 you are not the intended recipient, you may not read, copy, distribute, or 
 use this information. If you have received this transmission in error, 
 please notify the sender immediately by reply e-mail and then delete this 
 message.

 ___
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 To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
 and follow the instructions there.

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 To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
 and follow the instructions there.




This 

Re: [time-nuts] FRK-L Rubidium

[Bob Camp]

Hi

The +12 V supply at 60 ma likely means that the heater in the OCXO is not 
working. If you have 60 ma on the -12 V supply, it's pulling about 10X more 
than it should. 

Bob

On Feb 9, 2013, at 10:01 AM, Garren Davis garren.da...@qlogic.com wrote:

 Thanks for the reply.
 I found that the 12v current is only 60ma. I suppose that means the Osc. 
 heater is not working. I'm not having much luck with this time nuts stuff. 
 First the FRK and now the thunderbolt. Guess I'll start looking for another 
 one.
 
 Garren
 
 
 
 
 On Feb 9, 2013, at 6:01 AM, Bob Camp li...@rtty.us wrote:
 
 Hi
 
 DAC clamped at -5 volts suggests that the TBolt has issues. First thing to 
 check is the -12 volt supply. If it's missing, the DAC will indicate -5 on 
 the screen and be sitting at 0 in real life. There are a couple other things 
 in the DAC circuit that can make it malfunction.
 
 Bob
 
 On Feb 9, 2013, at 1:09 AM, Garren Davis garren.da...@qlogic.com wrote:
 
 
 Well for some reason the 10 Mhz stopped working on the FRK. Don't know why. 
 Started up the thunderbolt. It acquired satellites but then the DAC voltage 
 went to -5 volts. It's been there for an hour. Will this change after the 
 unit stabilizes? Going to bed. Will check it tomorrow.
 
 Garren
 
 
 
 
 On Feb 8, 2013, at 8:25 PM, Ed Palmer ed_pal...@sasktel.net wrote:
 
 Hi Garren,
 
 I suggest that you get the Thunderbolt working first.  Without a known 10 
 MHz source to compare to, you're flying blind.  Once the Tbolt is running, 
 you should be able to check the frequency of the FRK by feeding both into 
 your scope.  Trigger on the Tbolt and watch what the FRK does.  You should 
 see the trace scrolling in one direction, then slow down, then stop, then 
 scroll the other direction.  The 'stop' point is at 10 MHz.  The frequency 
 sweeps a total of 20-30 Hz so it's easy to see.  If you don't see the 
 'stop' point, the FRK isn't getting to 10 MHz.  Now use the best frequency 
 counter you've got to measure the Tbolt.  Regardless of the calibration of 
 your counter, the number your counter gives you becomes your 'new' 10 MHz. 
  Now measure the FRK to see if it's running fast or slow.
 
 You should check the temperature of the lamp.  It's easy to get at by 
 removing the cover in the center of the heat sink.  Probably best to 
 remove the cover and then power down before you go poking around inside!  
 The temperature of the cavity is also important, but getting to it is more 
 of a hassle - don't go there if you don't have to.
 
 Of course, check for the normal things like internal power supply 
 voltages, ripple, current drain (both initial and steady-state), etc.
 
 Regarding your second message, yes, the adjustment under the heat sink 
 near the edge is the C-field.  That won't help you at this point.  The 
 adjustment in the center of one side is the VCO.  You could try adjusting 
 it, but like I said, you're flying blind at this point.  You won't know if 
 you're adjusting closer to 10 MHz or further away.
 
 Good luck,
 
 Ed
 
 
 On 2/8/2013 6:12 PM, Garren Davis wrote:
 Been lurking on the list for a while and finally started playing with a 
 FRK-L  rubidium frequency standard. I've had this thing for a while and 
 decided to power it up and see what it would do. I do not get a lock. 
 What I see is the lamp voltage at 8.54 volts which I think is good but 
 the xtal control voltage swings from 2 volts to 15 volts and back to 2 
 volts and keeps cycling like that. I don't have a good frequency counter 
 but I have a 3 Ghz 40 G/sample scope and it shows that the 10 MHz signal 
 is there. I just don't know how accurate it is. Has anyone seen a problem 
 like this? Can anyone point me to a place to start debugging this? I have 
 the schematics and test tools. I am a test engineer so I'm not afraid to 
 poke around in the guts of this thing. Hopefully I can get this thing 
 running. I also have a thunderbolt that I'll get running this weekend. I 
 don't know how deep I'll get into this time-nuts thing but I have this 
 nice scope and a Wavecrest sitting in my garage 
 a
 n
 d
 I'd lik
 e to put them to use. Any help would be appreciated.
 
 Garren
 
 ___
 time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
 To unsubscribe, go to 
 https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
 and follow the instructions there.
 
 
 
 
 This message and any attached documents contain information from QLogic 
 Corporation or its wholly-owned subsidiaries that may be confidential. If 
 you are not the intended recipient, you may not read, copy, distribute, or 
 use this information. If you have received this transmission in error, 
 please notify the sender immediately by reply e-mail and then delete this 
 message.
 
 ___
 time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
 To unsubscribe, go to 
 

Re: [time-nuts] FRK-L Rubidium

[Garren Davis]

Found my problem with the FRK. R31 on the Osc board was burned and open. This 
was caused by a shorted C16. Replaced and it is now locked. The lock voltage is 
12.7v. Is this good or should it be lower?

Garren




On Feb 9, 2013, at 6:10 AM, Bob Camp li...@rtty.us wrote:

 Hi

 How old is the FRK? Does it look like it's been run without a heat sink for 
 very long? They tend to get flaky if run for a while (many months) without 
 heat sinking. There's nothing mysterious about it. The MTBF of the parts gets 
 noticeably worse as the unit heats up.

 Bob

 On Feb 9, 2013, at 1:09 AM, Garren Davis garren.da...@qlogic.com wrote:


 Well for some reason the 10 Mhz stopped working on the FRK. Don't know why. 
 Started up the thunderbolt. It acquired satellites but then the DAC voltage 
 went to -5 volts. It's been there for an hour. Will this change after the 
 unit stabilizes? Going to bed. Will check it tomorrow.

 Garren




 On Feb 8, 2013, at 8:25 PM, Ed Palmer ed_pal...@sasktel.net wrote:

 Hi Garren,

 I suggest that you get the Thunderbolt working first.  Without a known 10 
 MHz source to compare to, you're flying blind.  Once the Tbolt is running, 
 you should be able to check the frequency of the FRK by feeding both into 
 your scope.  Trigger on the Tbolt and watch what the FRK does.  You should 
 see the trace scrolling in one direction, then slow down, then stop, then 
 scroll the other direction.  The 'stop' point is at 10 MHz.  The frequency 
 sweeps a total of 20-30 Hz so it's easy to see.  If you don't see the 
 'stop' point, the FRK isn't getting to 10 MHz.  Now use the best frequency 
 counter you've got to measure the Tbolt.  Regardless of the calibration of 
 your counter, the number your counter gives you becomes your 'new' 10 MHz.  
 Now measure the FRK to see if it's running fast or slow.

 You should check the temperature of the lamp.  It's easy to get at by 
 removing the cover in the center of the heat sink.  Probably best to remove 
 the cover and then power down before you go poking around inside!  The 
 temperature of the cavity is also important, but getting to it is more of a 
 hassle - don't go there if you don't have to.

 Of course, check for the normal things like internal power supply voltages, 
 ripple, current drain (both initial and steady-state), etc.

 Regarding your second message, yes, the adjustment under the heat sink near 
 the edge is the C-field.  That won't help you at this point.  The 
 adjustment in the center of one side is the VCO.  You could try adjusting 
 it, but like I said, you're flying blind at this point.  You won't know if 
 you're adjusting closer to 10 MHz or further away.

 Good luck,

 Ed


 On 2/8/2013 6:12 PM, Garren Davis wrote:
 Been lurking on the list for a while and finally started playing with a 
 FRK-L  rubidium frequency standard. I've had this thing for a while and 
 decided to power it up and see what it would do. I do not get a lock. What 
 I see is the lamp voltage at 8.54 volts which I think is good but the xtal 
 control voltage swings from 2 volts to 15 volts and back to 2 volts and 
 keeps cycling like that. I don't have a good frequency counter but I have 
 a 3 Ghz 40 G/sample scope and it shows that the 10 MHz signal is there. I 
 just don't know how accurate it is. Has anyone seen a problem like this? 
 Can anyone point me to a place to start debugging this? I have the 
 schematics and test tools. I am a test engineer so I'm not afraid to poke 
 around in the guts of this thing. Hopefully I can get this thing running. 
 I also have a thunderbolt that I'll get running this weekend. I don't know 
 how deep I'll get into this time-nuts thing but I have this nice scope and 
 a Wavecrest sitting in my garage a
 n
 d
 I'd lik
 e to put them to use. Any help would be appreciated.

 Garren

 ___
 time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
 To unsubscribe, go to 
 https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
 and follow the instructions there.


 

 This message and any attached documents contain information from QLogic 
 Corporation or its wholly-owned subsidiaries that may be confidential. If 
 you are not the intended recipient, you may not read, copy, distribute, or 
 use this information. If you have received this transmission in error, 
 please notify the sender immediately by reply e-mail and then delete this 
 message.

 ___
 time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
 To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
 and follow the instructions there.

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 To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
 and follow the instructions there.




This message and any attached documents contain information from 

Re: [time-nuts] FRK-L Rubidium

[Bob Camp]

Hi

Let it run for a couple of days. If it's still up at   11V, I'd tweak it down 
a bit.

Bob

On Feb 9, 2013, at 12:38 PM, Garren Davis garren.da...@qlogic.com wrote:

 Found my problem with the FRK. R31 on the Osc board was burned and open. This 
 was caused by a shorted C16. Replaced and it is now locked. The lock voltage 
 is 12.7v. Is this good or should it be lower?
 
 Garren
 
 
 
 
 On Feb 9, 2013, at 6:10 AM, Bob Camp li...@rtty.us wrote:
 
 Hi
 
 How old is the FRK? Does it look like it's been run without a heat sink for 
 very long? They tend to get flaky if run for a while (many months) without 
 heat sinking. There's nothing mysterious about it. The MTBF of the parts 
 gets noticeably worse as the unit heats up.
 
 Bob
 
 On Feb 9, 2013, at 1:09 AM, Garren Davis garren.da...@qlogic.com wrote:
 
 
 Well for some reason the 10 Mhz stopped working on the FRK. Don't know why. 
 Started up the thunderbolt. It acquired satellites but then the DAC voltage 
 went to -5 volts. It's been there for an hour. Will this change after the 
 unit stabilizes? Going to bed. Will check it tomorrow.
 
 Garren
 
 
 
 
 On Feb 8, 2013, at 8:25 PM, Ed Palmer ed_pal...@sasktel.net wrote:
 
 Hi Garren,
 
 I suggest that you get the Thunderbolt working first.  Without a known 10 
 MHz source to compare to, you're flying blind.  Once the Tbolt is running, 
 you should be able to check the frequency of the FRK by feeding both into 
 your scope.  Trigger on the Tbolt and watch what the FRK does.  You should 
 see the trace scrolling in one direction, then slow down, then stop, then 
 scroll the other direction.  The 'stop' point is at 10 MHz.  The frequency 
 sweeps a total of 20-30 Hz so it's easy to see.  If you don't see the 
 'stop' point, the FRK isn't getting to 10 MHz.  Now use the best frequency 
 counter you've got to measure the Tbolt.  Regardless of the calibration of 
 your counter, the number your counter gives you becomes your 'new' 10 MHz. 
  Now measure the FRK to see if it's running fast or slow.
 
 You should check the temperature of the lamp.  It's easy to get at by 
 removing the cover in the center of the heat sink.  Probably best to 
 remove the cover and then power down before you go poking around inside!  
 The temperature of the cavity is also important, but getting to it is more 
 of a hassle - don't go there if you don't have to.
 
 Of course, check for the normal things like internal power supply 
 voltages, ripple, current drain (both initial and steady-state), etc.
 
 Regarding your second message, yes, the adjustment under the heat sink 
 near the edge is the C-field.  That won't help you at this point.  The 
 adjustment in the center of one side is the VCO.  You could try adjusting 
 it, but like I said, you're flying blind at this point.  You won't know if 
 you're adjusting closer to 10 MHz or further away.
 
 Good luck,
 
 Ed
 
 
 On 2/8/2013 6:12 PM, Garren Davis wrote:
 Been lurking on the list for a while and finally started playing with a 
 FRK-L  rubidium frequency standard. I've had this thing for a while and 
 decided to power it up and see what it would do. I do not get a lock. 
 What I see is the lamp voltage at 8.54 volts which I think is good but 
 the xtal control voltage swings from 2 volts to 15 volts and back to 2 
 volts and keeps cycling like that. I don't have a good frequency counter 
 but I have a 3 Ghz 40 G/sample scope and it shows that the 10 MHz signal 
 is there. I just don't know how accurate it is. Has anyone seen a problem 
 like this? Can anyone point me to a place to start debugging this? I have 
 the schematics and test tools. I am a test engineer so I'm not afraid to 
 poke around in the guts of this thing. Hopefully I can get this thing 
 running. I also have a thunderbolt that I'll get running this weekend. I 
 don't know how deep I'll get into this time-nuts thing but I have this 
 nice scope and a Wavecrest sitting in my garage 
 a
 n
 d
 I'd lik
 e to put them to use. Any help would be appreciated.
 
 Garren
 
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 Corporation or its wholly-owned subsidiaries that may be confidential. If 
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 please notify the sender immediately by reply e-mail and then delete this 
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 To 

Re: [time-nuts] FRK-L Rubidium

[Dan Rae]

Since we're offering up faults for the FRK, I'll add one that I've 
found: there's a CMOS 4060 oscillator that should go off at 8.128 kHz, 
set by an adjust on test R.  If this drifts off enough the lock will 
never happen.  It provides the FM frequency for the synth.


Dan
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Re: [time-nuts] FRK-L Rubidium

[Tom Curlee]

I'll add my own FRK-L failure story.  I have a FRK that suddenly stopped 
locking.  The 10 MHz was there, but off frequency so much that I couldn't 
adjust it to sweep over 10 MHz.  It suddenly occurred to me that the crystal 
oven housing should be hotter than just barely warm to the touch (it's usually 
too hot to touch).  I found that the Darlington transistor that is used as a 
oven heater was bad.  Replacing the transistor fixed the problem.

Tom

--- On Sat, 2/9/13, Dan Rae dan...@verizon.net wrote:

From: Dan Rae dan...@verizon.net
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] FRK-L Rubidium
To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com
Date: Saturday, February 9, 2013, 10:31 AM

Since we're offering up faults for the FRK, I'll add one that I've found: 
there's a CMOS 4060 oscillator that should go off at 8.128 kHz, set by an 
adjust on test R.  If this drifts off enough the lock will never happen.  It 
provides the FM frequency for the synth.

Dan
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Re: [time-nuts] FRK-L Rubidium

[Ed Palmer]

Hi Garren,

Congrats on your repair.  Since the crystal control voltage is spec'd as 
~1 to 12 Vdc, you're apparently holding onto lock by the narrowest of 
margins.  You definitely want to adjust the oscillator to bring that 
voltage closer to the middle of it's range.


Ed

On 2/9/2013 11:38 AM, Garren Davis wrote:

Found my problem with the FRK. R31 on the Osc board was burned and open. This 
was caused by a shorted C16. Replaced and it is now locked. The lock voltage is 
12.7v. Is this good or should it be lower?

Garren

On Feb 9, 2013, at 6:10 AM, Bob Camp li...@rtty.us wrote:


Hi

How old is the FRK? Does it look like it's been run without a heat sink for 
very long? They tend to get flaky if run for a while (many months) without heat 
sinking. There's nothing mysterious about it. The MTBF of the parts gets 
noticeably worse as the unit heats up.

Bob

On Feb 9, 2013, at 1:09 AM, Garren Davis garren.da...@qlogic.com wrote:


Well for some reason the 10 Mhz stopped working on the FRK. Don't know why. 
Started up the thunderbolt. It acquired satellites but then the DAC voltage 
went to -5 volts. It's been there for an hour. Will this change after the unit 
stabilizes? Going to bed. Will check it tomorrow.

Garren


On Feb 8, 2013, at 8:25 PM, Ed Palmer ed_pal...@sasktel.net wrote:


Hi Garren,

I suggest that you get the Thunderbolt working first.  Without a known 10 MHz 
source to compare to, you're flying blind.  Once the Tbolt is running, you 
should be able to check the frequency of the FRK by feeding both into your 
scope.  Trigger on the Tbolt and watch what the FRK does.  You should see the 
trace scrolling in one direction, then slow down, then stop, then scroll the 
other direction.  The 'stop' point is at 10 MHz.  The frequency sweeps a total 
of 20-30 Hz so it's easy to see.  If you don't see the 'stop' point, the FRK 
isn't getting to 10 MHz.  Now use the best frequency counter you've got to 
measure the Tbolt.  Regardless of the calibration of your counter, the number 
your counter gives you becomes your 'new' 10 MHz.  Now measure the FRK to see 
if it's running fast or slow.

You should check the temperature of the lamp.  It's easy to get at by removing 
the cover in the center of the heat sink.  Probably best to remove the cover 
and then power down before you go poking around inside!  The temperature of the 
cavity is also important, but getting to it is more of a hassle - don't go 
there if you don't have to.

Of course, check for the normal things like internal power supply voltages, 
ripple, current drain (both initial and steady-state), etc.

Regarding your second message, yes, the adjustment under the heat sink near the 
edge is the C-field.  That won't help you at this point.  The adjustment in the 
center of one side is the VCO.  You could try adjusting it, but like I said, 
you're flying blind at this point.  You won't know if you're adjusting closer 
to 10 MHz or further away.

Good luck,

Ed


On 2/8/2013 6:12 PM, Garren Davis wrote:

Been lurking on the list for a while and finally started playing with a FRK-L  
rubidium frequency standard. I've had this thing for a while and decided to 
power it up and see what it would do. I do not get a lock. What I see is the 
lamp voltage at 8.54 volts which I think is good but the xtal control voltage 
swings from 2 volts to 15 volts and back to 2 volts and keeps cycling like 
that. I don't have a good frequency counter but I have a 3 Ghz 40 G/sample 
scope and it shows that the 10 MHz signal is there. I just don't know how 
accurate it is. Has anyone seen a problem like this? Can anyone point me to a 
place to start debugging this? I have the schematics and test tools. I am a 
test engineer so I'm not afraid to poke around in the guts of this thing. 
Hopefully I can get this thing running. I also have a thunderbolt that I'll get 
running this weekend. I don't know how deep I'll get into this time-nuts thing 
but I have this nice scope and a Wavecrest sitting in my garage and I'd

 like to put them to use. Any help would be appreciated.

Garren




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and follow the instructions there.

[time-nuts] FRK-L Rubidium

[Garren Davis]

Been lurking on the list for a while and finally started playing with a FRK-L  
rubidium frequency standard. I've had
this thing for a while and decided to power it up and see what it would do. I 
do not get a lock. What I see is the
lamp voltage at 8.54 volts which I think is good but the xtal control voltage 
swings from 2 volts to 15 volts and back
to 2 volts and keeps cycling like that. I don't have a good frequency counter 
but I have a 3 Ghz 40 G/sample scope
and it shows that the 10 MHz signal is there. I just don't know how accurate it 
is. Has anyone seen a problem like
this? Can anyone point me to a place to start debugging this? I have the 
schematics and test tools. I am a test
engineer so I'm not afraid to poke around in the guts of this thing. Hopefully 
I can get this thing running. I also
have a thunderbolt that I'll get running this weekend. I don't know how deep 
I'll get into this time-nuts thing but
I have this nice scope and a Wavecrest sitting in my garage and I'd like to put 
them to use. Any help would be appreciated.

Garren



This message and any attached documents contain information from QLogic 
Corporation or its wholly-owned subsidiaries that may be confidential. If you 
are not the intended recipient, you may not read, copy, distribute, or use this 
information. If you have received this transmission in error, please notify the 
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Re: [time-nuts] FRK-L Rubidium

[jmfranke]

How long do you let it run? Does the crystal oscillator oven get warm? If 
you let it run more than 15 minutes, and the oven gets hot, the next thing 
to check is the output frequency range as the tuning voltage sweeps. Not 
having a frequency counter hurts but there are other methods. One is to use 
WWV on 10 MHz. You should hear the output slowly sweep through WWV, first on 
one side of zero beat and then through zero beat to the other side. If the 
beat stays on one side, the VCO needs tweaking to get the sweep somewhat 
symmetrical about the 10 MHz WWV signal.


John  WA4WDL

--
From: Garren Davis garren.da...@qlogic.com
Sent: Friday, February 08, 2013 7:12 PM
To: time-nuts@febo.com
Subject: [time-nuts] FRK-L Rubidium



Been lurking on the list for a while and finally started playing with a 
FRK-L  rubidium frequency standard. I've had
this thing for a while and decided to power it up and see what it would 
do. I do not get a lock. What I see is the
lamp voltage at 8.54 volts which I think is good but the xtal control 
voltage swings from 2 volts to 15 volts and back
to 2 volts and keeps cycling like that. I don't have a good frequency 
counter but I have a 3 Ghz 40 G/sample scope
and it shows that the 10 MHz signal is there. I just don't know how 
accurate it is. Has anyone seen a problem like
this? Can anyone point me to a place to start debugging this? I have the 
schematics and test tools. I am a test
engineer so I'm not afraid to poke around in the guts of this thing. 
Hopefully I can get this thing running. I also
have a thunderbolt that I'll get running this weekend. I don't know how 
deep I'll get into this time-nuts thing but
I have this nice scope and a Wavecrest sitting in my garage and I'd like 
to put them to use. Any help would be appreciated.


Garren



This message and any attached documents contain information from QLogic 
Corporation or its wholly-owned subsidiaries that may be confidential. If 
you are not the intended recipient, you may not read, copy, distribute, or 
use this information. If you have received this transmission in error, 
please notify the sender immediately by reply e-mail and then delete this 
message.

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Re: [time-nuts] FRK-L Rubidium

[Bob Camp]

Hi

First thing to check is indeed the frequency of the 10 MHz oscillator. There's 
a good chance it's simply aged far enough that it will no longer lock up. If 
the drift isn't super far, the oscillator can be adjusted. The TBolt and a good 
counter will tell you everything you need to know about the 10 MHz.

If the oscillator is sweeping past the correct frequency, the next thing to 
check is the output of the SRD assembly. Your scope should be able to see 
that signal. If it's missing, then track it back down the multiplier chain. 

Bob

On Feb 8, 2013, at 7:12 PM, Garren Davis garren.da...@qlogic.com wrote:

 
 Been lurking on the list for a while and finally started playing with a FRK-L 
  rubidium frequency standard. I've had
 this thing for a while and decided to power it up and see what it would do. I 
 do not get a lock. What I see is the
 lamp voltage at 8.54 volts which I think is good but the xtal control voltage 
 swings from 2 volts to 15 volts and back
 to 2 volts and keeps cycling like that. I don't have a good frequency counter 
 but I have a 3 Ghz 40 G/sample scope
 and it shows that the 10 MHz signal is there. I just don't know how accurate 
 it is. Has anyone seen a problem like
 this? Can anyone point me to a place to start debugging this? I have the 
 schematics and test tools. I am a test
 engineer so I'm not afraid to poke around in the guts of this thing. 
 Hopefully I can get this thing running. I also
 have a thunderbolt that I'll get running this weekend. I don't know how deep 
 I'll get into this time-nuts thing but
 I have this nice scope and a Wavecrest sitting in my garage and I'd like to 
 put them to use. Any help would be appreciated.
 
 Garren
 
 
 
 This message and any attached documents contain information from QLogic 
 Corporation or its wholly-owned subsidiaries that may be confidential. If you 
 are not the intended recipient, you may not read, copy, distribute, or use 
 this information. If you have received this transmission in error, please 
 notify the sender immediately by reply e-mail and then delete this message.
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Re: [time-nuts] FRK-L Rubidium

[Garren Davis]

I've let it run for hours and it gets warm. It has a heat sink and it all gets 
warm. There are two adjustment screws. One under the heat sink and one on the 
side of the unit. Is one for the vco and the other for the C-field?



On Feb 8, 2013, at 4:53 PM, jmfranke jmfra...@cox.net wrote:

 How long do you let it run? Does the crystal oscillator oven get warm? If you 
 let it run more than 15 minutes, and the oven gets hot, the next thing to 
 check is the output frequency range as the tuning voltage sweeps. Not having 
 a frequency counter hurts but there are other methods. One is to use WWV on 
 10 MHz. You should hear the output slowly sweep through WWV, first on one 
 side of zero beat and then through zero beat to the other side. If the beat 
 stays on one side, the VCO needs tweaking to get the sweep somewhat 
 symmetrical about the 10 MHz WWV signal.

 John  WA4WDL

 --
 From: Garren Davis garren.da...@qlogic.com
 Sent: Friday, February 08, 2013 7:12 PM
 To: time-nuts@febo.com
 Subject: [time-nuts] FRK-L Rubidium


 Been lurking on the list for a while and finally started playing with a 
 FRK-L  rubidium frequency standard. I've had
 this thing for a while and decided to power it up and see what it would do. 
 I do not get a lock. What I see is the
 lamp voltage at 8.54 volts which I think is good but the xtal control 
 voltage swings from 2 volts to 15 volts and back
 to 2 volts and keeps cycling like that. I don't have a good frequency 
 counter but I have a 3 Ghz 40 G/sample scope
 and it shows that the 10 MHz signal is there. I just don't know how accurate 
 it is. Has anyone seen a problem like
 this? Can anyone point me to a place to start debugging this? I have the 
 schematics and test tools. I am a test
 engineer so I'm not afraid to poke around in the guts of this thing. 
 Hopefully I can get this thing running. I also
 have a thunderbolt that I'll get running this weekend. I don't know how deep 
 I'll get into this time-nuts thing but
 I have this nice scope and a Wavecrest sitting in my garage and I'd like to 
 put them to use. Any help would be appreciated.

 Garren

 

 This message and any attached documents contain information from QLogic 
 Corporation or its wholly-owned subsidiaries that may be confidential. If 
 you are not the intended recipient, you may not read, copy, distribute, or 
 use this information. If you have received this transmission in error, 
 please notify the sender immediately by reply e-mail and then delete this 
 message.
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are not the intended recipient, you may not read, copy, distribute, or use this 
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Re: [time-nuts] FRK-L Rubidium

[Ed Palmer]

Hi Garren,

I suggest that you get the Thunderbolt working first.  Without a known 
10 MHz source to compare to, you're flying blind.  Once the Tbolt is 
running, you should be able to check the frequency of the FRK by feeding 
both into your scope.  Trigger on the Tbolt and watch what the FRK 
does.  You should see the trace scrolling in one direction, then slow 
down, then stop, then scroll the other direction.  The 'stop' point is 
at 10 MHz.  The frequency sweeps a total of 20-30 Hz so it's easy to 
see.  If you don't see the 'stop' point, the FRK isn't getting to 10 
MHz.  Now use the best frequency counter you've got to measure the 
Tbolt.  Regardless of the calibration of your counter, the number your 
counter gives you becomes your 'new' 10 MHz.  Now measure the FRK to see 
if it's running fast or slow.


You should check the temperature of the lamp.  It's easy to get at by 
removing the cover in the center of the heat sink.  Probably best to 
remove the cover and then power down before you go poking around 
inside!  The temperature of the cavity is also important, but getting to 
it is more of a hassle - don't go there if you don't have to.


Of course, check for the normal things like internal power supply 
voltages, ripple, current drain (both initial and steady-state), etc.


Regarding your second message, yes, the adjustment under the heat sink 
near the edge is the C-field.  That won't help you at this point.  The 
adjustment in the center of one side is the VCO.  You could try 
adjusting it, but like I said, you're flying blind at this point.  You 
won't know if you're adjusting closer to 10 MHz or further away.


Good luck,

Ed


On 2/8/2013 6:12 PM, Garren Davis wrote:

Been lurking on the list for a while and finally started playing with a FRK-L  
rubidium frequency standard. I've had this thing for a while and decided to 
power it up and see what it would do. I do not get a lock. What I see is the 
lamp voltage at 8.54 volts which I think is good but the xtal control voltage 
swings from 2 volts to 15 volts and back to 2 volts and keeps cycling like 
that. I don't have a good frequency counter but I have a 3 Ghz 40 G/sample 
scope and it shows that the 10 MHz signal is there. I just don't know how 
accurate it is. Has anyone seen a problem like this? Can anyone point me to a 
place to start debugging this? I have the schematics and test tools. I am a 
test engineer so I'm not afraid to poke around in the guts of this thing. 
Hopefully I can get this thing running. I also have a thunderbolt that I'll get 
running this weekend. I don't know how deep I'll get into this time-nuts thing 
but I have this nice scope and a Wavecrest sitting in my garage and I'd lik

e to put them to use. Any help would be appreciated.


Garren


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Re: [time-nuts] FRK-L Rubidium

[Garren Davis]

Well for some reason the 10 Mhz stopped working on the FRK. Don't know why. 
Started up the thunderbolt. It acquired satellites but then the DAC voltage 
went to -5 volts. It's been there for an hour. Will this change after the unit 
stabilizes? Going to bed. Will check it tomorrow.

Garren




On Feb 8, 2013, at 8:25 PM, Ed Palmer ed_pal...@sasktel.net wrote:

 Hi Garren,

 I suggest that you get the Thunderbolt working first.  Without a known 10 MHz 
 source to compare to, you're flying blind.  Once the Tbolt is running, you 
 should be able to check the frequency of the FRK by feeding both into your 
 scope.  Trigger on the Tbolt and watch what the FRK does.  You should see the 
 trace scrolling in one direction, then slow down, then stop, then scroll the 
 other direction.  The 'stop' point is at 10 MHz.  The frequency sweeps a 
 total of 20-30 Hz so it's easy to see.  If you don't see the 'stop' point, 
 the FRK isn't getting to 10 MHz.  Now use the best frequency counter you've 
 got to measure the Tbolt.  Regardless of the calibration of your counter, the 
 number your counter gives you becomes your 'new' 10 MHz.  Now measure the FRK 
 to see if it's running fast or slow.

 You should check the temperature of the lamp.  It's easy to get at by 
 removing the cover in the center of the heat sink.  Probably best to remove 
 the cover and then power down before you go poking around inside!  The 
 temperature of the cavity is also important, but getting to it is more of a 
 hassle - don't go there if you don't have to.

 Of course, check for the normal things like internal power supply voltages, 
 ripple, current drain (both initial and steady-state), etc.

 Regarding your second message, yes, the adjustment under the heat sink near 
 the edge is the C-field.  That won't help you at this point.  The adjustment 
 in the center of one side is the VCO.  You could try adjusting it, but like I 
 said, you're flying blind at this point.  You won't know if you're adjusting 
 closer to 10 MHz or further away.

 Good luck,

 Ed


 On 2/8/2013 6:12 PM, Garren Davis wrote:
 Been lurking on the list for a while and finally started playing with a 
 FRK-L  rubidium frequency standard. I've had this thing for a while and 
 decided to power it up and see what it would do. I do not get a lock. What I 
 see is the lamp voltage at 8.54 volts which I think is good but the xtal 
 control voltage swings from 2 volts to 15 volts and back to 2 volts and 
 keeps cycling like that. I don't have a good frequency counter but I have a 
 3 Ghz 40 G/sample scope and it shows that the 10 MHz signal is there. I just 
 don't know how accurate it is. Has anyone seen a problem like this? Can 
 anyone point me to a place to start debugging this? I have the schematics 
 and test tools. I am a test engineer so I'm not afraid to poke around in the 
 guts of this thing. Hopefully I can get this thing running. I also have a 
 thunderbolt that I'll get running this weekend. I don't know how deep I'll 
 get into this time-nuts thing but I have this nice scope and a Wavecrest 
 sitting in my garage and
 I'd lik
 e to put them to use. Any help would be appreciated.

 Garren

 ___
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 To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
 and follow the instructions there.




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Corporation or its wholly-owned subsidiaries that may be confidential. If you 
are not the intended recipient, you may not read, copy, distribute, or use this 
information. If you have received this transmission in error, please notify the 
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Re: [time-nuts] FRK-L Rubidium

[Rex]

Do you have the service manual? If not, get it here...
http://www.ko4bb.com/manuals/index.php?dir=05%29_GPS_Timing/Efratom

As I recall there's pretty good trouble shooting in the manual. Several 
years ago I fixed an FRK-H that wouldn't lock. The crystal osc had 
drifted enough that the trimmer didn't have enough range to tune to the 
lock freq. Fix was to pull one small cap that was in parallel with the 
trimmer. (C-11 on Osc schematic A21.)


If you have a counter that you trust, it should be easy to see if tuning 
is reasonable. The manual will show where the trimmer is. I think I 
recall looking at the modulation signal as shown in fig 3-2 in the 
manual as I didn't have an accurately calibrated counter at the time. (I 
wasn't able to get to a balanced 2fm output signal until I modified the 
circuit.)




On 2/8/2013 6:50 PM, Garren Davis wrote:

I've let it run for hours and it gets warm. It has a heat sink and it all gets 
warm. There are two adjustment screws. One under the heat sink and one on the 
side of the unit. Is one for the vco and the other for the C-field?



On Feb 8, 2013, at 4:53 PM, jmfrankejmfra...@cox.net  wrote:


How long do you let it run? Does the crystal oscillator oven get warm? If you 
let it run more than 15 minutes, and the oven gets hot, the next thing to check 
is the output frequency range as the tuning voltage sweeps. Not having a 
frequency counter hurts but there are other methods. One is to use WWV on 10 
MHz. You should hear the output slowly sweep through WWV, first on one side of 
zero beat and then through zero beat to the other side. If the beat stays on 
one side, the VCO needs tweaking to get the sweep somewhat symmetrical about 
the 10 MHz WWV signal.

John  WA4WDL

--
From: Garren Davisgarren.da...@qlogic.com
Sent: Friday, February 08, 2013 7:12 PM
To:time-nuts@febo.com
Subject: [time-nuts] FRK-L Rubidium


Been lurking on the list for a while and finally started playing with a FRK-L  
rubidium frequency standard. I've had
this thing for a while and decided to power it up and see what it would do. I 
do not get a lock. What I see is the
lamp voltage at 8.54 volts which I think is good but the xtal control voltage 
swings from 2 volts to 15 volts and back
to 2 volts and keeps cycling like that. I don't have a good frequency counter 
but I have a 3 Ghz 40 G/sample scope
and it shows that the 10 MHz signal is there. I just don't know how accurate it 
is. Has anyone seen a problem like
this? Can anyone point me to a place to start debugging this? I have the 
schematics and test tools. I am a test
engineer so I'm not afraid to poke around in the guts of this thing. Hopefully 
I can get this thing running. I also
have a thunderbolt that I'll get running this weekend. I don't know how deep 
I'll get into this time-nuts thing but
I have this nice scope and a Wavecrest sitting in my garage and I'd like to put 
them to use. Any help would be appreciated.

Garren


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Re: [time-nuts] FRK specs.....

[Tom Knox]

Hi Brian;
There are a few decent rubidium oscillators short term like the SRS but none 
are great, in my humble opinion you are much better off disciplining a good 
quartz oscillator off your LPRO.
Best Wishes;
Thomas Knox



 From: wa1...@att.net
 Date: Sat, 11 Aug 2012 21:56:13 -0700
 To: time-nuts@febo.com
 Subject: [time-nuts] FRK specs.
 
 I used to be of the opinion that the Efratom FRK-H was the best of the models 
 of FRK Rb standards for both short-term stability and overall performance.
 
 Is that still true today?
 
 I know there are better solutions for short-term (BVA OCXO) and long term
 (Cs  MASERS). But where to things stack up today?
 
 I'm looking to buy an Rb that's better than my LPROs and other models.
 But I do not own an FRK-H.
 
 Looking for comments, please.
 
 Thanks in advance,
 -Brian, WA1ZMS
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Re: [time-nuts] FRK specs.....

[Brian, WA1ZMS]

Thanks Tom.  

I agree, the SRS seems to be the best
overall Rb except maybe on old HP if one is willing to spend about the same 
price on a 20 year old unit.  The SRS units I bought for work were only $2700 
with chassis, rack ears and multiple outputs.



-Brian, WA1ZMS

On Aug 12, 2012, at 3:17 AM, Tom Knox act...@hotmail.com wrote:

 
 Hi Brian;
 There are a few decent rubidium oscillators short term like the SRS but none 
 are great, in my humble opinion you are much better off disciplining a good 
 quartz oscillator off your LPRO.
 Best Wishes;
 Thomas Knox
 
 
 
 From: wa1...@att.net
 Date: Sat, 11 Aug 2012 21:56:13 -0700
 To: time-nuts@febo.com
 Subject: [time-nuts] FRK specs.
 
 I used to be of the opinion that the Efratom FRK-H was the best of the 
 models of FRK Rb standards for both short-term stability and overall 
 performance.
 
 Is that still true today?
 
 I know there are better solutions for short-term (BVA OCXO) and long term
 (Cs  MASERS). But where to things stack up today?
 
 I'm looking to buy an Rb that's better than my LPROs and other models.
 But I do not own an FRK-H.
 
 Looking for comments, please.
 
 Thanks in advance,
 -Brian, WA1ZMS
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Re: [time-nuts] FRK specs.....

[EWKehren]

In the commercial world a PRS10  is most likely the best but for  time nuts 
even at the surplus price in my opinion it is all hype and a waste of  
money. Have you looked closely at the specification and the design. Frequency  
accuracy can not be better than 1 E-12 since the OCXO is driven strictly by a 
 DAC and the A/V is for time nuts nothing to write home about. Any digital 
loop  controlling a Rb  in tern with an analog loop controlling a selected 
HP  10811 or for that matter a Morion will outperform a PRS 10.
I have a FRK-H controlling a HP 10811 that has an A/V below 1 E-12 from 1  
to 100 seconds, I modified the FRK loop and the 10811. On the 10811 it is 
easy  to get to the bottom PCB and without un soldering any component or 
further  disassembly cutting two traces and two jumpers you end up with a 2 to 
12 
Volt  tuning voltage, perfect for a FRK or M100.. A second option is to use 
a separate  analog loop with a time constant suitable for your OCXO.
By the way the FRK-H is not lower noise but factor 2 lower aging with the  
proper OCXO not an issue, since hopefully you discipline it with GPS.
For 12 years I have used Shera in that application recently switching the  
DAC to a  LTC1655. Has served me well over the years.
Other Rb's will do also a very credible job. On one extreme a FEI 5680 is  
waiting to be integrated with a MV180 on the other extreme a HP5065 RVFR  
assembly will be integrated with a M1000 OCXO along with state of the art  
circuitry.  
Bert Kehren
 
 
 
In a message dated 8/12/2012 8:09:54 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  
wa1...@att.net writes:

Thanks  Tom.  

I agree, the SRS seems to be the best
overall Rb except  maybe on old HP if one is willing to spend about the 
same price on a 20 year  old unit.  The SRS units I bought for work were only 
$2700 with chassis,  rack ears and multiple outputs.



-Brian, WA1ZMS

On Aug  12, 2012, at 3:17 AM, Tom Knox act...@hotmail.com wrote:

  
 Hi Brian;
 There are a few decent rubidium oscillators short  term like the SRS but 
none are great, in my humble opinion you are much better  off disciplining a 
good quartz oscillator off your LPRO.
 Best  Wishes;
 Thomas Knox
 
 
 
 From:  wa1...@att.net
 Date: Sat, 11 Aug 2012 21:56:13 -0700
  To: time-nuts@febo.com
 Subject: [time-nuts] FRK  specs.
 
 I used to be of the opinion that the  Efratom FRK-H was the best of the 
models of FRK Rb standards for both  short-term stability and overall 
performance.
 
 Is that  still true today?
 
 I know there are better solutions  for short-term (BVA OCXO) and long 
term
 (Cs  MASERS). But  where to things stack up today?
 
 I'm looking to buy an  Rb that's better than my LPROs and other models.
 But I do not own  an FRK-H.
 
 Looking for comments, please.
  
 Thanks in advance,
 -Brian, WA1ZMS
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Re: [time-nuts] FRK specs.....

[dlewis6767]

Bert:
Interesting.

I, too, have a couple of the HP 10811 oven-oscillators sitting on the shelf for 
several years, waiting for a project. I want to 'discipline' them, but 
really do not know how.

Could you kindly mark up the HP 10811 schematic and/or please tell me what to 
cut, ... what to jumper???

Thanks a lot!

Don Lewis
Austin, TX



--





==

 ewkeh...@aol.com wrote:
 In the commercial world a PRS10 is most likely the best but for time nuts
 even at the surplus price in my opinion it is all hype and a waste of
 money. Have you looked closely at the specification and the design. Frequency
 accuracy can not be better than 1 E-12 since the OCXO is driven strictly by a
 DAC and the A/V is for time nuts nothing to write home about. Any digital
 loop controlling a Rb in tern with an analog loop controlling a selected
 HP 10811 or for that matter a Morion will outperform a PRS 10.
 I have a FRK-H controlling a HP 10811 that has an A/V below 1 E-12 from 1
 to 100 seconds, I modified the FRK loop and the 10811. On the 10811 it is
 easy to get to the bottom PCB and without un soldering any component or
 further disassembly cutting two traces and two jumpers you end up with a 2 to 
 12
 Volt tuning voltage, perfect for a FRK or M100.. A second option is to use
 a separate analog loop with a time constant suitable for your OCXO.
 By the way the FRK-H is not lower noise but factor 2 lower aging with the
 proper OCXO not an issue, since hopefully you discipline it with GPS.
 For 12 years I have used Shera in that application recently switching the
 DAC to a LTC1655. Has served me well over the years.
 Other Rb's will do also a very credible job. On one extreme a FEI 5680 is
 waiting to be integrated with a MV180 on the other extreme a HP5065 RVFR
 assembly will be integrated with a M1000 OCXO along with state of the art
 circuitry.
 Bert Kehren



 In a message dated 8/12/2012 8:09:54 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
 wa1...@att.net writes:

 Thanks Tom.

 I agree, the SRS seems to be the best
 overall Rb except maybe on old HP if one is willing to spend about the
 same price on a 20 year old unit. The SRS units I bought for work were only
 $2700 with chassis, rack ears and multiple outputs.



 -Brian, WA1ZMS

 On Aug 12, 2012, at 3:17 AM, Tom Knox act...@hotmail.com wrote:

 
  Hi Brian;
  There are a few decent rubidium oscillators short term like the SRS but
 none are great, in my humble opinion you are much better off disciplining a
 good quartz oscillator off your LPRO.
  Best Wishes;
  Thomas Knox
 
 
 
  From: wa1...@att.net
  Date: Sat, 11 Aug 2012 21:56:13 -0700
  To: time-nuts@febo.com
  Subject: [time-nuts] FRK specs.
 
  I used to be of the opinion that the Efratom FRK-H was the best of the
 models of FRK Rb standards for both short-term stability and overall
 performance.
 
  Is that still true today?
 
  I know there are better solutions for short-term (BVA OCXO) and long
 term
  (Cs  MASERS). But where to things stack up today?
 
  I'm looking to buy an Rb that's better than my LPROs and other models.
  But I do not own an FRK-H.
 
  Looking for comments, please.
 
  Thanks in advance,
  -Brian, WA1ZMS
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  To unsubscribe, go to
 https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
  and follow the instructions there.
 
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Re: [time-nuts] FRK specs.....

[Brian, WA1ZMS]

Me too, please.


-Brian, WA1ZMS

-Original Message-
From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On
Behalf Of dlewis6...@austin.rr.com
Sent: Sunday, August 12, 2012 2:55 PM
To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] FRK specs.


Bert:
Interesting.

I, too, have a couple of the HP 10811 oven-oscillators sitting on the shelf
for several years, waiting for a project. I want to 'discipline' them,
but really do not know how.

Could you kindly mark up the HP 10811 schematic and/or please tell me what
to cut, ... what to jumper???

Thanks a lot!

Don Lewis
Austin, TX




--





==

 ewkeh...@aol.com wrote:
 In the commercial world a PRS10 is most likely the best but for time 
 nuts even at the surplus price in my opinion it is all hype and a 
 waste of money. Have you looked closely at the specification and the 
 design. Frequency accuracy can not be better than 1 E-12 since the 
 OCXO is driven strictly by a DAC and the A/V is for time nuts nothing 
 to write home about. Any digital loop controlling a Rb in tern with an 
 analog loop controlling a selected HP 10811 or for that matter a Morion
will outperform a PRS 10.
 I have a FRK-H controlling a HP 10811 that has an A/V below 1 E-12 
 from 1 to 100 seconds, I modified the FRK loop and the 10811. On the 
 10811 it is easy to get to the bottom PCB and without un soldering any 
 component or further disassembly cutting two traces and two jumpers 
 you end up with a 2 to 12 Volt tuning voltage, perfect for a FRK or 
 M100.. A second option is to use a separate analog loop with a time
constant suitable for your OCXO.
 By the way the FRK-H is not lower noise but factor 2 lower aging with 
 the proper OCXO not an issue, since hopefully you discipline it with GPS.
 For 12 years I have used Shera in that application recently switching 
 the DAC to a LTC1655. Has served me well over the years.
 Other Rb's will do also a very credible job. On one extreme a FEI 5680 
 is waiting to be integrated with a MV180 on the other extreme a HP5065 
 RVFR assembly will be integrated with a M1000 OCXO along with state of 
 the art circuitry.
 Bert Kehren



 In a message dated 8/12/2012 8:09:54 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, 
 wa1...@att.net writes:

 Thanks Tom.

 I agree, the SRS seems to be the best
 overall Rb except maybe on old HP if one is willing to spend about the 
 same price on a 20 year old unit. The SRS units I bought for work were 
 only
 $2700 with chassis, rack ears and multiple outputs.



 -Brian, WA1ZMS

 On Aug 12, 2012, at 3:17 AM, Tom Knox act...@hotmail.com wrote:

 
  Hi Brian;
  There are a few decent rubidium oscillators short term like the SRS 
  but
 none are great, in my humble opinion you are much better off 
 disciplining a good quartz oscillator off your LPRO.
  Best Wishes;
  Thomas Knox
 
 
 
  From: wa1...@att.net
  Date: Sat, 11 Aug 2012 21:56:13 -0700
  To: time-nuts@febo.com
  Subject: [time-nuts] FRK specs.
 
  I used to be of the opinion that the Efratom FRK-H was the best of 
  the
 models of FRK Rb standards for both short-term stability and overall 
 performance.
 
  Is that still true today?
 
  I know there are better solutions for short-term (BVA OCXO) and 
  long
 term
  (Cs  MASERS). But where to things stack up today?
 
  I'm looking to buy an Rb that's better than my LPROs and other models.
  But I do not own an FRK-H.
 
  Looking for comments, please.
 
  Thanks in advance,
  -Brian, WA1ZMS
  ___
  time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to
 https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
  and follow the instructions there.
 
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Re: [time-nuts] FRK specs.....

[bg]

Hi Don,


 Bert:
 Interesting.

 I, too, have a couple of the HP 10811 oven-oscillators sitting on the
 shelf for several years, waiting for a project. I want to 'discipline'
 them, but really do not know how.

Also look at John's modification of a Thunderbolt.

http://www.ke5fx.com/tbolt.htm


--

   Björn


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[time-nuts] FRK specs.....

[Brian, WA1ZMS]

I used to be of the opinion that the Efratom FRK-H was the best of the models 
of FRK Rb standards for both short-term stability and overall performance.

Is that still true today?

I know there are better solutions for short-term (BVA OCXO) and long term
(Cs  MASERS). But where to things stack up today?

I'm looking to buy an Rb that's better than my LPROs and other models.
But I do not own an FRK-H.

Looking for comments, please.

Thanks in advance,
-Brian, WA1ZMS
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[time-nuts] FRK and TS-105A

[Magnus Danielson]

Hi!

Could somebody from the top of their head give me the most useful 
pointers on FRK rubidiums? I now have one as part of a box, and 
naturally I want to stash up on the information.


The rubidium locks nicely, if just patiently sitting there and waiting, 
and the designers of the box was nice enough to dedicate a status view 
to the rubidium monitoring voltages and lock status.


The box itself is a Ball Efratom TS-105A measurement box, which crunches 
out frequency offsets and allan variances for 100 ms, 1 s, 10 s and 100 
s directly on the screen. All under the control of the awsome CPU powers 
of 6502.


The box works, but I am trying to collect info on it.

The box will run in either single mixer or double-mixer mode. It accepts 
5 MHz and 10 MHz. Each counter channel receives a signal conditioned 
input and 10,1 MHz from the Rubidium. It hits the mixer after an ECL 
driver and is then amplified in LM108 and comparator LM111.
From there will a cascade of TTL chips count it, presumably in the 10 
MHz from the rubidium. For 1 s this gives a resolution of 1E-7/1E6 = 
1E-13 which isn't too shabby. The only SMD component seen so far is the 
cap sitting directly on the mixers terminals. I have not retraced the 
card in detail so far, just looked at it breefly (out of curiosity 
naturally).


If someone has manuals for the TS-105A I will be happy, TvB has promised 
to locate his..


This box is from 1985, so it is not cutting edge, but it is functional, 
direct and a bit fun, so why not. :)


It would be fun if it could crank out the observables directly on serial 
port or so...


My beast doesn't have the GPIB interface. It may be a matter of hooking 
up a cable, but in that case it is undocumented.


Cheers,
Magnus

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Re: [time-nuts] FRK and TS-105A

[Rob Kimberley]

Nice acquisition!

Rob K

-Original Message-
From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On
Behalf Of Magnus Danielson
Sent: 06 July 2010 09:41
To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement
Subject: [time-nuts] FRK and TS-105A

Hi!

Could somebody from the top of their head give me the most useful pointers
on FRK rubidiums? I now have one as part of a box, and naturally I want to
stash up on the information.

The rubidium locks nicely, if just patiently sitting there and waiting, and
the designers of the box was nice enough to dedicate a status view to the
rubidium monitoring voltages and lock status.

The box itself is a Ball Efratom TS-105A measurement box, which crunches out
frequency offsets and allan variances for 100 ms, 1 s, 10 s and 100 s
directly on the screen. All under the control of the awsome CPU powers of
6502.

The box works, but I am trying to collect info on it.

The box will run in either single mixer or double-mixer mode. It accepts
5 MHz and 10 MHz. Each counter channel receives a signal conditioned input
and 10,1 MHz from the Rubidium. It hits the mixer after an ECL driver
and is then amplified in LM108 and comparator LM111.
 From there will a cascade of TTL chips count it, presumably in the 10 MHz
from the rubidium. For 1 s this gives a resolution of 1E-7/1E6 =
1E-13 which isn't too shabby. The only SMD component seen so far is the cap
sitting directly on the mixers terminals. I have not retraced the card in
detail so far, just looked at it breefly (out of curiosity naturally).

If someone has manuals for the TS-105A I will be happy, TvB has promised to
locate his..

This box is from 1985, so it is not cutting edge, but it is functional,
direct and a bit fun, so why not. :)

It would be fun if it could crank out the observables directly on serial
port or so...

My beast doesn't have the GPIB interface. It may be a matter of hooking up a
cable, but in that case it is undocumented.

Cheers,
Magnus

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Re: [time-nuts] FRK and TS-105A

[Magnus Danielson]

On 07/06/2010 10:51 AM, Rob Kimberley wrote:

Nice acquisition!


Yes, indeed. Now the curious mind wants to dig in. :)

It set me back 159 USD, which I can handle and then naturally shipping 
and customs. Ah well.


For an As is condition, it is working modulus operator inexperience 
with the particular box. However, it is cranking out numbers and fairly 
easy to operate. Three push-buttons as user interface. To start a new 
measurement - press Reset. :)


It is clear that it used the non-overlapping ADEV, which gives it a 
drawback for the larger taus.


Cheers,
Magnus

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Re: [time-nuts] FRK and TS-105A

[Rob Kimberley]

I assume you found manual for FRK, available at
http://www.to-way.com/tf/frk.pdf

I probably have one lurking in a box somewhere in my store. If I can find
it, it's yours for the postage.

Rob

-Original Message-
From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On
Behalf Of Magnus Danielson
Sent: 06 July 2010 10:07 AM
To: time-nuts@febo.com
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] FRK and TS-105A

On 07/06/2010 10:51 AM, Rob Kimberley wrote:
 Nice acquisition!

Yes, indeed. Now the curious mind wants to dig in. :)

It set me back 159 USD, which I can handle and then naturally shipping and
customs. Ah well.

For an As is condition, it is working modulus operator inexperience with
the particular box. However, it is cranking out numbers and fairly easy to
operate. Three push-buttons as user interface. To start a new measurement -
press Reset. :)

It is clear that it used the non-overlapping ADEV, which gives it a drawback
for the larger taus.

Cheers,
Magnus

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Re: [time-nuts] FRK and TS-105A

[Magnus Danielson]

On 07/06/2010 06:45 PM, Rob Kimberley wrote:

I assume you found manual for FRK, available at
http://www.to-way.com/tf/frk.pdf


It was hinted to me from Björn, thanks to your both.

It has a FRK-HO, which is the low-noise variant, but offset outside the 
normal trimming range.



I probably have one lurking in a box somewhere in my store. If I can find
it, it's yours for the postage.


Deal. I have a flair for hardcopy manuals. I guess I am old-fashioned.

Cheers,
Magnus

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[time-nuts] FRK-H question

[corby d dawson]

Tim,

It sound like your unit is locked.

Power it off for 15 minutes and then monitor the Xtal control when
powering back up.

It should sweep from about 2 volts to 15 volts.

Within 10 minutes it should stop sweeping indicating a lock.

After being locked for a few hours adjust the Xtal trim cap for around
8.5 VDC on the Xtal control pin.

It may lose lock while making the adjustment, just wait till it locks
again and continue until done.

Then after 24 hours you can adjust the C-field adjustment to set the
frequency against GPS or other known good 1X10-11th standard.

There are several options for the lock pin but try this:

Take a DVM (set on the ohms range that will source enough voltage to read
a diodes voltage drop) from the return to the lock pin. (+ volts from
ohmeter to lock pin) 

With the unit out of lock you should read an open, once locked it should
read a low value.

This is if your unit has the open collector output. If so an LED through
a dropping resistor to the +24VDC supply will give you a lock light!

Hope this helps!

Corby Dawson

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Re: [time-nuts] FRK-L OK or too tired?

[Brian Kirby]

If the unit does not have external EFC, you can bring out the existing 
potentiometer circuit to the outside world , via un-used I/O pins..  
Most are 1 kilo-ohm 10 to 20 turn trim pots.   Replace it with a low 
tempco wire wound pot and use a turns counter. 

My unit was fairly close on frequency when I received it and the pot was 
set close to 500 ohms.  I replaced it with a 0.1 percent 460 some ohms 
precision resistor, which was mounted inside the case and a 100 ohm - 10 
turn pot was put in series with it , outside of the case - this combo 
gives about +/- 1E-10 control of the frequency.

Brian - N4FMN


Marco Bruno wrote:
 At 23.31 07/09/2006, you wrote:
   
 James and Brooke,

 Thanks for the informative replies. I have done pretty much what you
 suggested. The result is a nice sloped line in the positive direction,
 indicating that the FRK-L Rb source is running fast at a rate of about
 1e-9.

 I checked the lamp and crystal osc monitors and both are within spec.
 The crystal mon was 5V (2-16V is the suggested range), so I adjusted it
 up to 10V with the range adjust trimmer.

 I don't know if an FRK-L running for 13 years is expected to be 1E-9
 high in frequency or if the unit could use some maintenance. The
 suggested drift of 1e-11 per month would add up to 1.5 e-9 over 13
 years, so it may well be within spec and need some C-field adjustment.

 Unfortunately, when it was mounted in its box, the C-field adjust hole
 was covered up. I'll need to power it down and do some disassembly and
 drilling to make that adjustment accessible.

 Suggestions? Comments?
 

 David,

 drill an hole, turn the trimmer and zero it. It's a perfectly 
 legitimate offset,
 and since you see a straight line it's working well. Only it needs to 
 be zeroed.

 Do it after a few hours of warm up, then check it for a week and zero again.
 It will stay in the usual +/- 1E-11 per day.

 If it has the EFC option, may be that the external voltage was used to correct
 the drift, so it may have had even a smaller drift over it's life.

 Marco IK1ODO


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Re: [time-nuts] FRK-L OK or too tired?

[Marco Bruno]

At 23.31 07/09/2006, you wrote:
James and Brooke,

Thanks for the informative replies. I have done pretty much what you
suggested. The result is a nice sloped line in the positive direction,
indicating that the FRK-L Rb source is running fast at a rate of about
1e-9.

I checked the lamp and crystal osc monitors and both are within spec.
The crystal mon was 5V (2-16V is the suggested range), so I adjusted it
up to 10V with the range adjust trimmer.

I don't know if an FRK-L running for 13 years is expected to be 1E-9
high in frequency or if the unit could use some maintenance. The
suggested drift of 1e-11 per month would add up to 1.5 e-9 over 13
years, so it may well be within spec and need some C-field adjustment.

Unfortunately, when it was mounted in its box, the C-field adjust hole
was covered up. I'll need to power it down and do some disassembly and
drilling to make that adjustment accessible.

Suggestions? Comments?

David,

drill an hole, turn the trimmer and zero it. It's a perfectly 
legitimate offset,
and since you see a straight line it's working well. Only it needs to 
be zeroed.

Do it after a few hours of warm up, then check it for a week and zero again.
It will stay in the usual +/- 1E-11 per day.

If it has the EFC option, may be that the external voltage was used to correct
the drift, so it may have had even a smaller drift over it's life.

Marco IK1ODO


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Re: [time-nuts] FRK-L Manual

[Peter Lacey]

I do, post your email address and I can send it to you.

Peter Lacey - AA1ZU

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Brian Kirby
Sent: Monday, July 10, 2006 11:42 PM
To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement
Subject: [time-nuts] FRK-L Manual

Does anybody have a scanned copy of the FRK-L manual ?

Brian - N4FMN



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Re: [time-nuts] FRK-L Manual

[Ulrich Bangert]

Brian,

i just sent you the 80 page FRK (H OR L) Operating and Maintainance
Manual. It is abt. 5 MB

73 Ulli

 -Ursprüngliche Nachricht-
 Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von Brian Kirby
 Gesendet: Dienstag, 11. Juli 2006 05:42
 An: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement
 Betreff: [time-nuts] FRK-L Manual
 
 
 Does anybody have a scanned copy of the FRK-L manual ?
 
 Brian - N4FMN
 
 
 
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[time-nuts] FRK-L Manual

[Brian Kirby]

Does anybody have a scanned copy of the FRK-L manual ?

Brian - N4FMN



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