Re: [ubuntu-uk] (Marketing) Royal Society asks you - why IT is boring?
Damnit that is similar to my idea, I was going to send him a shiny Windows disk full of viruses to blow up his pc... oh, it seems that's been coming as default since Windows 3.11 for crappy RM workstations. Sent from my Android powered HTC Hero. On 26 Aug 2010 23:08, Jacob Mansfield cyberja...@gmail.com wrote: I still could, I just need to run sudo apt-get nitroglycerine sudo apt-get install timer tar bomb package sendmail bomb b...@rm.shithead.iddiot from s...@google.xxx can't wait for it---^^^ On 26 August 2010 22:55, Grant Sewell dcg...@thymox.co.uk wrote: On Thu, 26 Aug 2010 22:31:3... -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/ -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] (Marketing) Royal Society asks you - why IT is boring?
hey I could always send them my MEMORY STICK OF DEATH On 27 August 2010 09:20, Kris Douglas krisdoug...@gmail.com wrote: Damnit that is similar to my idea, I was going to send him a shiny Windows disk full of viruses to blow up his pc... oh, it seems that's been coming as default since Windows 3.11 for crappy RM workstations. Sent from my Android powered HTC Hero. On 26 Aug 2010 23:08, Jacob Mansfield cyberja...@gmail.com wrote: I still could, I just need to run sudo apt-get nitroglycerine sudo apt-get install timer tar bomb package sendmail bomb b...@rm.shithead.iddiot from s...@google.xxx can't wait for it---^^^ On 26 August 2010 22:55, Grant Sewell dcg...@thymox.co.uk wrote: On Thu, 26 Aug 2010 22:31:3... -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/ -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/ -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] (Marketing) Royal Society asks you - why IT is boring?
Well, assuming that we are not seriously going to blow up any machines... I wonder how Research Machines managed to become nothing more than Windows enforcers? When I was at school we had the classic RML-380Z For those who are too young to remember, there's a contemporary review here... http://vt100.net/rm/380z_review Sean -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] (Marketing) Royal Society asks you - why IT is boring?
On 26/08/10 07:10, alan c wrote: Express your views to the Royal Society soon. http://royalsociety.org/Education-Policy/Projects/ I am a bit perplexed. There have been approximately 20 entries in this thread so far, and I do not recall any single one person saying they will contact the Royal Society (RS) in this issue, even though most posts contain relevant evidence. 1) The organisations and businesses which are likely to be contacted BY the RS are - you can probably guess. 2) The organisations and businesses who will be most likely to want to spend effort informing the RS are - you can also guess. Change CAN happen, but it may not happen just by itself. I contacted the Education Director in the RS and mentioned Ubuntu. He said he will look into it because he had not heard of it before. PLEASE make your own contact with the RS in this matter, after all they *are* asking! -- alan cocks Ubuntu user -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] (Marketing) Royal Society asks you - why IT is boring?
On 27/08/10 09:27, Sean Miller wrote: Well, assuming that we are not seriously going to blow up any machines... I wonder how Research Machines managed to become nothing more than Windows enforcers? When I was at school we had the classic RML-380Z For those who are too young to remember, there's a contemporary review here... http://vt100.net/rm/380z_review Cool - My Dad ran the entire London region BT Vehicle Fleet (~13,000) on one of these with a programme he wrote in BASIC. He had the FDS-2 Dual Floppy system! He used to bring it home at weekends. I'll send that link to him - That'll make him smile... Cheers Al -- The Open Learning Centre http://www.theopenlearningcentre.com -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] (Marketing) Royal Society asks you - why IT is boring?
thanks for this, I will pass it on to the http://opensourceschools.org.uk community and might have a go at responding myself. Alan. On 26/08/10 07:10, alan c wrote: or nearly that, anyway. Article: Royal Society opens inquiry into why kids hate tech Lessons that is, not games, mobiles, Facebook: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/08/25/royal_society_schools_computing/ 'exam results have shown computing subjects are failing to grab kids' attention' Could it be that a strong bias towards proprietary products is not inspiring students? Would more appreciation of Free Software in education enable better use of talents? Express your views to the Royal Society soon. http://royalsociety.org/Education-Policy/Projects/ -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] (Marketing) Royal Society asks you - why IT is boring?
will the RS rm -r rm? On 27 August 2010 09:32, alan c aecl...@candt.waitrose.com wrote: On 26/08/10 07:10, alan c wrote: Express your views to the Royal Society soon. http://royalsociety.org/Education-Policy/Projects/ I am a bit perplexed. There have been approximately 20 entries in this thread so far, and I do not recall any single one person saying they will contact the Royal Society (RS) in this issue, even though most posts contain relevant evidence. 1) The organisations and businesses which are likely to be contacted BY the RS are - you can probably guess. 2) The organisations and businesses who will be most likely to want to spend effort informing the RS are - you can also guess. Change CAN happen, but it may not happen just by itself. I contacted the Education Director in the RS and mentioned Ubuntu. He said he will look into it because he had not heard of it before. PLEASE make your own contact with the RS in this matter, after all they *are* asking! -- alan cocks Ubuntu user -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/ -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] (Marketing) Royal Society asks you - why IT is boring?
On Fri, 2010-08-27 at 09:32 +0100, alan c wrote: PLEASE make your own contact with the RS in this matter, after all they *are* asking! Done that! But considering some of the information I've gained from other replies (eg RM) I can't help wondering what a survey will accomplish. Do the RS have any input to the curriculum? Dianne -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
[ubuntu-uk] (Marketing) Royal Society asks you - why IT is boring?
or nearly that, anyway. Article: Royal Society opens inquiry into why kids hate tech Lessons that is, not games, mobiles, Facebook: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/08/25/royal_society_schools_computing/ 'exam results have shown computing subjects are failing to grab kids' attention' Could it be that a strong bias towards proprietary products is not inspiring students? Would more appreciation of Free Software in education enable better use of talents? Express your views to the Royal Society soon. http://royalsociety.org/Education-Policy/Projects/ -- alan cocks Ubuntu user -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] (Marketing) Royal Society asks you - why IT is boring?
Personally, I think that half the reason people find computers boring these days is that there isn't the mystique about them that there was when I was growing up (the 80s)... you had a BBC Micro, your mate had a Commodore 64... you argued about which was the better computer and you programmed small apps just to prove you could... you bought magazines with pages of code to type in to make a little cursor go along the bottom of the screen with strange pixellated things at top that were supposedly aliens... which, of course, would normally crash somewhere along the way Syntax error at line 34... ah, the joy!! Now computers are out of the box, I don't think people have the fire for programming them - they're more interested in just using them... - becoming a computer programmer is no more exciting (to your average teenager) than becoming a TV engineer or a washing-machine repairer... To make IT interesting again you would have to make being a programmer something special again... and it's not, really, anymore... Sean -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] (Marketing) Royal Society asks you - why IT is boring?
Perhaps they haven't looked at the GCSE curriculum - I've been a computer-holic for almost 40 years, and it sent me into a coma of boredom! Also, most experts or enthusiasts I think still prefer to do IT rather than teach it. My daughter had 5 IT teachers in one year - one took their coursework to Australia when he left, so she got very low marks. The next year I told her brother to email his coursework to me from school - needless to say, he didn't bother, the system crashed, no backup, no coursework, he too got very low marks. For my third child, it was very much a case of You've got a free period - go and teach GCSE IT! And this was in a school which is one of the very best in our town, and which I'd recommend to anyone - except for IT. And yet it can be exciting, school visits love looking at the old machines, looking at how components and machines work, putting pieces together, learning about the impact on business, on our social lives. Darn, this has turned into a rant. But I do find it so depressing! Dianne On Thu, 2010-08-26 at 07:10 +0100, alan c wrote: or nearly that, anyway. Article: Royal Society opens inquiry into why kids hate tech Lessons that is, not games, mobiles, Facebook: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/08/25/royal_society_schools_computing/ 'exam results have shown computing subjects are failing to grab kids' attention' -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] (Marketing) Royal Society asks you - why IT is boring?
On Thu, 2010-08-26 at 07:16 +0100, Sean Miller wrote: Personally, I think that half the reason people find computers boring these days is that there isn't the mystique about them that there was when I was growing up (the 80s)... you had a BBC Micro, your mate had a Commodore 64... you argued about which was the better computer and you programmed small apps just to prove you could... you bought magazines with pages of code to type in to make a little cursor go along the bottom of the screen with strange pixellated things at top that were supposedly aliens... which, of course, would normally crash somewhere along the way Syntax error at line 34... ah, the joy!! Now computers are out of the box, I don't think people have the fire for programming them - they're more interested in just using them... - becoming a computer programmer is no more exciting (to your average teenager) than becoming a TV engineer or a washing-machine repairer... To make IT interesting again you would have to make being a programmer something special again... and it's not, really, anymore... Sean Its interesting that you mention the BBC Micro (I was in the Vic 20 C64 camp at the time). There was an interesting article on the BBC website about the BBC Micro being given another lease of life by helping to educate (A Level) students in the art of rigorous programming. The full article is at http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-10951040 Dave Jones -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] (Marketing) Royal Society asks you - why IT is boring?
On Thu, 2010-08-26 at 07:10 +0100, alan c wrote: or nearly that, anyway. Article: Royal Society opens inquiry into why kids hate tech Lessons that is, not games, mobiles, Facebook: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/08/25/royal_society_schools_computing/ 'exam results have shown computing subjects are failing to grab kids' attention' Could it be that a strong bias towards proprietary products is not inspiring students? Would more appreciation of Free Software in education enable better use of talents? Express your views to the Royal Society soon. http://royalsociety.org/Education-Policy/Projects/ -- alan cocks Ubuntu user My experience of GCSE IT was that it was This is Microsoft Word, write a 2 page document including a table, a graphic and a footnote. which is _not_ what IT should be about. I lost _huge_ amounts of marks in one part because the project was Create 4 linked webpages in Microsoft Front Page blah blah blah which would have been a nightmare for any sane person to maintain, so I wrote it in PHP with a SQL backend and none of the markers understood it :( IT should be more about computers less about office work! -Matt Daubney -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] (Marketing) Royal Society asks you - why IT is boring?
On 26 August 2010 09:37, Matthew Daubney m...@daubers.co.uk wrote: On Thu, 2010-08-26 at 07:10 +0100, alan c wrote: or nearly that, anyway. Article: Royal Society opens inquiry into why kids hate tech Lessons that is, not games, mobiles, Facebook: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/08/25/royal_society_schools_computing/ 'exam results have shown computing subjects are failing to grab kids' attention' Could it be that a strong bias towards proprietary products is not inspiring students? Would more appreciation of Free Software in education enable better use of talents? Express your views to the Royal Society soon. http://royalsociety.org/Education-Policy/Projects/ -- alan cocks Ubuntu user My experience of GCSE IT was that it was This is Microsoft Word, write a 2 page document including a table, a graphic and a footnote. which is _not_ what IT should be about. I lost _huge_ amounts of marks in one part because the project was Create 4 linked webpages in Microsoft Front Page blah blah blah which would have been a nightmare for any sane person to maintain, so I wrote it in PHP with a SQL backend and none of the markers understood it :( IT should be more about computers less about office work! -Matt Daubney -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/ I attended an excellent school for GCSE/A-Level and had a very similar experience, and consequently had absolutely no interest in computing until after I had finished my degree. The thing that got me hooked was problem solving. Having an issue, researching it, and then fixing it is one of the most satisfying things for me, and I guess for a lot of you guys too. Furthermore it teaches you to take any problem (even problems IRL!), and break it down into manageable, logical steps, and I think that's a great skill to foster. I don't know, so I'm asking... Is there any time given to this in the current GCSE syllabus? In my mind teaching kids an attitude and approach towards solving a problem is what should be concentrated on. I think it could be difficult to assess and grade students on, and that is something that would need to be considered... and I guess there are plenty of other issues too, but I think it would be an excellent place to start. Matt -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] (Marketing) Royal Society asks you - why IT is boring?
IT should be more about computers less about office work! Increasingly the stance is that IT functional skill should be embedded across all lessons. Therefore part of say GCSE Biology would be to create a report using word with tables, footnotes for references etc. Hopefully this will free up more time in the computing syllabus to teach actual 'computing' dan -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] (Marketing) Royal Society asks you - why IT is boring?
GCSE IT must always be done the boring and monotonous way, instead of the fun and interesting way that the markers can't be bothered to learn it properly On 26 August 2010 09:37, Matthew Daubney m...@daubers.co.uk wrote: On Thu, 2010-08-26 at 07:10 +0100, alan c wrote: or nearly that, anyway. Article: Royal Society opens inquiry into why kids hate tech Lessons that is, not games, mobiles, Facebook: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/08/25/royal_society_schools_computing/ 'exam results have shown computing subjects are failing to grab kids' attention' Could it be that a strong bias towards proprietary products is not inspiring students? Would more appreciation of Free Software in education enable better use of talents? Express your views to the Royal Society soon. http://royalsociety.org/Education-Policy/Projects/ -- alan cocks Ubuntu user My experience of GCSE IT was that it was This is Microsoft Word, write a 2 page document including a table, a graphic and a footnote. which is _not_ what IT should be about. I lost _huge_ amounts of marks in one part because the project was Create 4 linked webpages in Microsoft Front Page blah blah blah which would have been a nightmare for any sane person to maintain, so I wrote it in PHP with a SQL backend and none of the markers understood it :( IT should be more about computers less about office work! -Matt Daubney -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/ -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] (Marketing) Royal Society asks you - why IT is boring?
Further to the other replies... I've had a look through the KS3 and the KS4 curricula and, in my opinion, there's nothing in there that is necessarily bad. So if it isn't the subject itself that's turning people away, perhaps it is the people who teach it. In my experience, all too often a school will get non-specialists to teach the IT subjects. I have seen math teachers, English teachers, music teachers and science teachers all actively timetabled for IT lessons - so I'm not talking about cover work. I do believe, as per another's comments, that having the using office products side of thing embedded into other subjects *should* free up the IT classes for more engaging topics, but these can only be made engaging and taught effectively if the teacher has a background to support the subject. I am not lambasting anybody here who may be an IT teacher at secondary level - if you are and your school is actively engaged in employing an IT specialist to teach IT, then I applaud you and your school... but please look around at your competition - the majority of them will, I have no doubt, fit my description above. As for the Alan's question: Could it be that a strong bias towards proprietary products is not inspiring students?. I doubt it. Much and all as I share everyone's passion for Free Software (with capital letters), I cannot bring myself to say that if it isn't Free Software it must be boring/uninspiring. There is a veritable tonne of really interesting and cool non-Free Software out there that could be used within secondary IT classes. I think we, as advocates and proponents of Free Software, should perhaps be taking a greater interest and should be actively trying to engage in discussion about what software *is* used, what non-Free Software *is available* and how it compares with the equivalent Free Software offerings. Incidentally, in case anybody here is interested, there is a project called Digitial Freedom in Education and Youth (DFEY.org) that looks really promising and could probably do with some more promotion and involvement from the likes of us lot. :) Wow! That was longer than I had thought it would be. Thanks for reading. :) Grant. -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] (Marketing) Royal Society asks you - why IT is boring?
** Matt Sturdy matt.stu...@gmail.com [2010-08-26 09:50]: On 26 August 2010 09:37, Matthew Daubney m...@daubers.co.uk wrote: snip My experience of GCSE IT was that it was This is Microsoft Word, write a 2 page document including a table, a graphic and a footnote. which is _not_ what IT should be about. I lost _huge_ amounts of marks in one part because the project was Create 4 linked webpages in Microsoft Front Page blah blah blah which would have been a nightmare for any sane person to maintain, so I wrote it in PHP with a SQL backend and none of the markers understood it :( IT should be more about computers less about office work! -Matt Daubney I attended an excellent school for GCSE/A-Level and had a very similar experience, and consequently had absolutely no interest in computing until after I had finished my degree. The thing that got me hooked was problem solving. Having an issue, researching it, and then fixing it is one of the most satisfying things for me, and I guess for a lot of you guys too. Furthermore it teaches you to take any problem (even problems IRL!), and break it down into manageable, logical steps, and I think that's a great skill to foster. I don't know, so I'm asking... Is there any time given to this in the current GCSE syllabus? In my mind teaching kids an attitude and approach towards solving a problem is what should be concentrated on. I think it could be difficult to assess and grade students on, and that is something that would need to be considered... and I guess there are plenty of other issues too, but I think it would be an excellent place to start. Matt ** end quote [Matt Sturdy] From what I've seen of current IT lessons (mainly from sitting at the back of a classroom working on the school server!!) it seems to be more the computer side of Business Studies than anything to do with the computers themselves. I mentioned Alan Turing to an IT teacher once and they didn't bat an eyelid that it was a name they'd heard or should have heard! Mind you, there must have been a fairly short period of proper IT education. Back when I was doing Computer Studies (as it was called) O Level - none of this new fangled GCSE stuff ;) - the teachers were learning only about a week ahead of what they were teaching. There were a couple of us in the class that knew far more on the practical side of things (not so much the history) and kept being roped in to help out since we'd done the work and they couldn't provide anything more because they hadn't learnt it yet! The fact that initially we only had one CBM Pet, and by the time I left that thad only grown to 2 CBM Pets and 3 BBC Micros (2 Mod A and one Mod B iirc) didn't help much, although coding on paper first did add some discipline. Thankfully they were pretty short programs, although my project failed to compile because I couldn't load it as the same time as the compiler in my 48k Spectrum - not that it needed to thankfully. I often say that if it wasn't for Linux I would no longer have any interest in computers. There's a massive amount of potential in education to make use of the flexibility and openness of Linux. -- Paul Tansom | Aptanet Ltd. | http://www.aptanet.com/ | 023 9238 0001 == Sponsor me in the Moonlit Memories Walk for Rowans Hospice A 12 mile walk along Southsea seafront starting midnight 19th June Visit: http://www.justgiving.com/MoonlitTansom2010 == Registered in England | Company No: 4905028 | Registered Office: Crawford House, Hambledon Road, Denmead, Waterlooville, Hants, PO7 6NU -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] (Marketing) Royal Society asks you - why IT is boring?
As a student in Scotland currently studying Computing, I can safely say that computing is well subscribed to up here. However, for personally there are some turn offs. When I am older I would like to be a programmer, but we are taught visual basic. I realise that it is an easy language but I want to learn something actually worthwhile. Also, the exam board's definitions of some things are out of date. For example, it states a web server allows a user to access the Internet. Whereas now I believe it is a server that hosts files for Internet users. I would say their definition is a proxy server. This sense that what I am learning will be of little use to me in the actual industry of computing is a bit of a downer after watching this releases' UDS. I still make small programs for the fun of it :) - Craig On 26 Aug 2010, at 07:16, Sean Miller s...@seanmiller.net wrote: Personally, I think that half the reason people find computers boring these days is that there isn't the mystique about them that there was when I was growing up (the 80s)... you had a BBC Micro, your mate had a Commodore 64... you argued about which was the better computer and you programmed small apps just to prove you could... you bought magazines with pages of code to type in to make a little cursor go along the bottom of the screen with strange pixellated things at top that were supposedly aliens... which, of course, would normally crash somewhere along the way Syntax error at line 34... ah, the joy!! Now computers are out of the box, I don't think people have the fire for programming them - they're more interested in just using them... - becoming a computer programmer is no more exciting (to your average teenager) than becoming a TV engineer or a washing-machine repairer... To make IT interesting again you would have to make being a programmer something special again... and it's not, really, anymore... Sean -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/ -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] (Marketing) Royal Society asks you - why IT is boring?
apparently A lever IT is better, I'll find out in a year On 26 August 2010 12:48, Paul Tansom p...@aptanet.com wrote: ** Matt Sturdy matt.stu...@gmail.com [2010-08-26 09:50]: On 26 August 2010 09:37, Matthew Daubney m...@daubers.co.uk wrote: snip My experience of GCSE IT was that it was This is Microsoft Word, write a 2 page document including a table, a graphic and a footnote. which is _not_ what IT should be about. I lost _huge_ amounts of marks in one part because the project was Create 4 linked webpages in Microsoft Front Page blah blah blah which would have been a nightmare for any sane person to maintain, so I wrote it in PHP with a SQL backend and none of the markers understood it :( IT should be more about computers less about office work! -Matt Daubney I attended an excellent school for GCSE/A-Level and had a very similar experience, and consequently had absolutely no interest in computing until after I had finished my degree. The thing that got me hooked was problem solving. Having an issue, researching it, and then fixing it is one of the most satisfying things for me, and I guess for a lot of you guys too. Furthermore it teaches you to take any problem (even problems IRL!), and break it down into manageable, logical steps, and I think that's a great skill to foster. I don't know, so I'm asking... Is there any time given to this in the current GCSE syllabus? In my mind teaching kids an attitude and approach towards solving a problem is what should be concentrated on. I think it could be difficult to assess and grade students on, and that is something that would need to be considered... and I guess there are plenty of other issues too, but I think it would be an excellent place to start. Matt ** end quote [Matt Sturdy] From what I've seen of current IT lessons (mainly from sitting at the back of a classroom working on the school server!!) it seems to be more the computer side of Business Studies than anything to do with the computers themselves. I mentioned Alan Turing to an IT teacher once and they didn't bat an eyelid that it was a name they'd heard or should have heard! Mind you, there must have been a fairly short period of proper IT education. Back when I was doing Computer Studies (as it was called) O Level - none of this new fangled GCSE stuff ;) - the teachers were learning only about a week ahead of what they were teaching. There were a couple of us in the class that knew far more on the practical side of things (not so much the history) and kept being roped in to help out since we'd done the work and they couldn't provide anything more because they hadn't learnt it yet! The fact that initially we only had one CBM Pet, and by the time I left that thad only grown to 2 CBM Pets and 3 BBC Micros (2 Mod A and one Mod B iirc) didn't help much, although coding on paper first did add some discipline. Thankfully they were pretty short programs, although my project failed to compile because I couldn't load it as the same time as the compiler in my 48k Spectrum - not that it needed to thankfully. I often say that if it wasn't for Linux I would no longer have any interest in computers. There's a massive amount of potential in education to make use of the flexibility and openness of Linux. -- Paul Tansom | Aptanet Ltd. | http://www.aptanet.com/ | 023 9238 0001 == Sponsor me in the Moonlit Memories Walk for Rowans Hospice A 12 mile walk along Southsea seafront starting midnight 19th June Visit: http://www.justgiving.com/MoonlitTansom2010 == Registered in England | Company No: 4905028 | Registered Office: Crawford House, Hambledon Road, Denmead, Waterlooville, Hants, PO7 6NU -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/ -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] (Marketing) Royal Society asks you - why IT is boring?
Dianne Your real experiences may be key to the Royal Society's investigation, I do hope you can seriously consider contributing. if nothing else, almost a straight copy and paste of what you are saying here is information which paints a valuable picture to them. And they may be getting very different stories from vested interests. best regards alan On 26/08/10 09:16, Dianne Reuby wrote: My daughter had 5 IT teachers in one year - one took their coursework to Australia when he left, so she got very low marks. The next year I told her brother to email his coursework to me from school - needless to say, he didn't bother, the system crashed, no backup, no coursework, he too got very low marks. For my third child, it was very much a case of You've got a free period - go and teach GCSE IT! And this was in a school which is one of the very best in our town, and which I'd recommend to anyone - except for IT. And yet it can be exciting, school visits love looking at the old machines, looking at how components and machines work, putting pieces together, learning about the impact on business, on our social lives. Darn, this has turned into a rant. But I do find it so depressing! Dianne On Thu, 2010-08-26 at 07:10 +0100, alan c wrote: or nearly that, anyway. Article: Royal Society opens inquiry into why kids hate tech Lessons that is, not games, mobiles, Facebook: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/08/25/royal_society_schools_computing/ 'exam results have shown computing subjects are failing to grab kids' attention' -- Ubuntu user #10391 Linux user #360648 -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] (Marketing) Royal Society asks you - why IT is boring?
On 26/08/10 07:10, alan c wrote: or nearly that, anyway. Article: Royal Society opens inquiry into why kids hate tech Lessons that is, not games, mobiles, Facebook: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/08/25/royal_society_schools_computing/ 'exam results have shown computing subjects are failing to grab kids' attention' Could it be that a strong bias towards proprietary products is not inspiring students? Would more appreciation of Free Software in education enable better use of talents? Express your views to the Royal Society soon. http://royalsociety.org/Education-Policy/Projects/ I earnestly implore all people with opinions on this subject to make contributions to the investigation. Thanks -- alan cocks Ubuntu user -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] (Marketing) Royal Society asks you - why IT is boring?
On 26 August 2010 18:33, alan c aecl...@candt.waitrose.com wrote: On 26/08/10 07:10, alan c wrote: or nearly that, anyway. Article: Royal Society opens inquiry into why kids hate tech Lessons that is, not games, mobiles, Facebook: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/08/25/royal_society_schools_computing/ 'exam results have shown computing subjects are failing to grab kids' attention' Could it be that a strong bias towards proprietary products is not inspiring students? Would more appreciation of Free Software in education enable better use of talents? Express your views to the Royal Society soon. http://royalsociety.org/Education-Policy/Projects/ I earnestly implore all people with opinions on this subject to make contributions to the investigation. Thanks After recently studying Computing and IT at A-Level, I have picked out a lot of problems with todays curricula. I found that, even my teacher accepted this, the curriculum was very out-dated. The book we had, dated 2009 or 2010 described a computer with 16kb RAM. My teacher went to a conference, and when she returned, she described the person, head of the Computing, and possibly IT curriculum, as a Long beard and sandals with socks man. She didn't mean any offense by this, she was implying that he was very old-hat when it came to computing, and seemed to lack any form of creativity. I also found that having Visual Basic shoved down my throat was actually choosing of the college, and reading some of the posts others have made, it seems that it is widely used. I was stuck with VB6, and the excuse for this was that other good languages cost too much money, what they meant to say, was other Microsoft languages (Where I say languages, I mean RAD suites, or programming environments - whatever you want to call them) cost too much money. I showed the male teacher, who is a self professed geek, Gambas, which is a basic RAD for GNU/Linux, and he really liked it, but said because of the computer contract with Research Machines, they could not install other operating systems on the PC's they paid £500 EACH for (Core2Duo 2.0GHz, 2GB RAM, 250GB HDD, Vista- but downgraded to XP by RM), they could not use it. I mumbled something about CodeGear Delphi and Virtualbox and dropped the conversation then. It just seems that schools are stuck with Windows, because of whatever reason, and the teaching staff, some of which are actually very qualified, just have to play along. I tried to get one of them to complain to the exam board about the definitions in some of the newest books, which were totally incorrect nowadays, and they couldn't be bothered. Shame, really. -- Regards, Kris Douglas. T. 0845 004 2066 | M. 07728574285 -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] (Marketing) Royal Society asks you - why IT is boring?
On 26/08/2010 19:25, Kris Douglas wrote: but said because of the computer contract with Research Machines, My wife works for the largest Educational Publisher in the world and RM is a TOTAL NIGHTMARE. They dictate to schools what software they can or can't use - any software has to be validated by RM in INDIA? They are not out to provide a service to schools - just to empire build and make a profit. -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] (Marketing) Royal Society asks you - why IT is boring?
On 26 August 2010 22:24, Gordon Burgess-Parker gbpli...@gmail.com wrote: On 26/08/2010 19:25, Kris Douglas wrote: but said because of the computer contract with Research Machines, My wife works for the largest Educational Publisher in the world and RM is a TOTAL NIGHTMARE. They dictate to schools what software they can or can't use - any software has to be validated by RM in INDIA? They are not out to provide a service to schools - just to empire build and make a profit. From what I have seen, I can do nothing else but agree with you there, it's not just the software, they enforce rules on it all, and if those rules aren't followed they just don't support you. (i.e goodbye Linux partition on our CPT machines, one was formatted with ubuntu, and the RM engineer removed it because he thought that was causing the poor windows performance. -failing to notice it was set to download the users documents off of the server for each user that logged in.) -- Regards, Kris Douglas. -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] (Marketing) Royal Society asks you - why IT is boring?
On 26/08/2010 22:27, Kris Douglas wrote: On 26 August 2010 22:24, Gordon Burgess-Parkergbpli...@gmail.com wrote: On 26/08/2010 19:25, Kris Douglas wrote: but said because of the computer contract with Research Machines, My wife works for the largest Educational Publisher in the world and RM is a TOTAL NIGHTMARE. They dictate to schools what software they can or can't use - any software has to be validated by RM in INDIA? They are not out to provide a service to schools - just to empire build and make a profit. From what I have seen, I can do nothing else but agree with you there, it's not just the software, they enforce rules on it all, and if those rules aren't followed they just don't support you. (i.e goodbye Linux partition on our CPT machines, one was formatted with ubuntu, and the RM engineer removed it because he thought that was causing the poor windows performance. -failing to notice it was set to download the users documents off of the server for each user that logged in.) It's about time that schools took a stand - unfortunately what RM do is to contract with the LEA not individual schools, so schools get RM foisted on them by the LEA and there's nothing they can do about it - no doubt with substantial backhanders to the LEA members. -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] (Marketing) Royal Society asks you - why IT is boring?
when I was in primary school I made plans to send a large bomb to RM On 26 August 2010 22:31, Gordon Burgess-Parker gbpli...@gmail.com wrote: On 26/08/2010 22:27, Kris Douglas wrote: On 26 August 2010 22:24, Gordon Burgess-Parkergbpli...@gmail.com wrote: On 26/08/2010 19:25, Kris Douglas wrote: but said because of the computer contract with Research Machines, My wife works for the largest Educational Publisher in the world and RM is a TOTAL NIGHTMARE. They dictate to schools what software they can or can't use - any software has to be validated by RM in INDIA? They are not out to provide a service to schools - just to empire build and make a profit. From what I have seen, I can do nothing else but agree with you there, it's not just the software, they enforce rules on it all, and if those rules aren't followed they just don't support you. (i.e goodbye Linux partition on our CPT machines, one was formatted with ubuntu, and the RM engineer removed it because he thought that was causing the poor windows performance. -failing to notice it was set to download the users documents off of the server for each user that logged in.) It's about time that schools took a stand - unfortunately what RM do is to contract with the LEA not individual schools, so schools get RM foisted on them by the LEA and there's nothing they can do about it - no doubt with substantial backhanders to the LEA members. -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/ -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] (Marketing) Royal Society asks you - why IT is boring?
On 26/08/2010 22:45, Jacob Mansfield wrote: when I was in primary school I made plans to send a large bomb to RM Pity you didn't do it - I'm sure that schools IT would be in a FAR better state if you had! -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] (Marketing) Royal Society asks you - why IT is boring?
On Thu, 26 Aug 2010 22:31:35 +0100 Gordon Burgess-Parker wrote: On 26/08/2010 22:27, Kris Douglas wrote: On 26 August 2010 22:24, Gordon Burgess-Parkergbpli...@gmail.com wrote: On 26/08/2010 19:25, Kris Douglas wrote: but said because of the computer contract with Research Machines, My wife works for the largest Educational Publisher in the world and RM is a TOTAL NIGHTMARE. They dictate to schools what software they can or can't use - any software has to be validated by RM in INDIA? They are not out to provide a service to schools - just to empire build and make a profit. From what I have seen, I can do nothing else but agree with you there, it's not just the software, they enforce rules on it all, and if those rules aren't followed they just don't support you. (i.e goodbye Linux partition on our CPT machines, one was formatted with ubuntu, and the RM engineer removed it because he thought that was causing the poor windows performance. -failing to notice it was set to download the users documents off of the server for each user that logged in.) It's about time that schools took a stand - unfortunately what RM do is to contract with the LEA not individual schools, so schools get RM foisted on them by the LEA and there's nothing they can do about it - no doubt with substantial backhanders to the LEA members. We have fun down our way - and the same may be true right across the country. It's not just the support and what's on the deskop/server that RM are into: ~$ whois swgfl.org.uk Domain name: swgfl.org.uk Registrant: South West Grid for Learning Registrar: RM Education PLC [Tag = RMPLC] URL: http://www.rm.com (South West Grid for Learning = ISP for pretty much all primary and secondary schools in the South West!) Grant. -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] (Marketing) Royal Society asks you - why IT is boring?
I still could, I just need to run sudo apt-get nitroglycerine sudo apt-get install timer tar bomb package sendmail bomb b...@rm.shithead.iddiot from s...@google.xxx can't wait for it---^^^ On 26 August 2010 22:55, Grant Sewell dcg...@thymox.co.uk wrote: On Thu, 26 Aug 2010 22:31:35 +0100 Gordon Burgess-Parker wrote: On 26/08/2010 22:27, Kris Douglas wrote: On 26 August 2010 22:24, Gordon Burgess-Parkergbpli...@gmail.com wrote: On 26/08/2010 19:25, Kris Douglas wrote: but said because of the computer contract with Research Machines, My wife works for the largest Educational Publisher in the world and RM is a TOTAL NIGHTMARE. They dictate to schools what software they can or can't use - any software has to be validated by RM in INDIA? They are not out to provide a service to schools - just to empire build and make a profit. From what I have seen, I can do nothing else but agree with you there, it's not just the software, they enforce rules on it all, and if those rules aren't followed they just don't support you. (i.e goodbye Linux partition on our CPT machines, one was formatted with ubuntu, and the RM engineer removed it because he thought that was causing the poor windows performance. -failing to notice it was set to download the users documents off of the server for each user that logged in.) It's about time that schools took a stand - unfortunately what RM do is to contract with the LEA not individual schools, so schools get RM foisted on them by the LEA and there's nothing they can do about it - no doubt with substantial backhanders to the LEA members. We have fun down our way - and the same may be true right across the country. It's not just the support and what's on the deskop/server that RM are into: ~$ whois swgfl.org.uk Domain name: swgfl.org.uk Registrant: South West Grid for Learning Registrar: RM Education PLC [Tag = RMPLC] URL: http://www.rm.com (South West Grid for Learning = ISP for pretty much all primary and secondary schools in the South West!) Grant. -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/ -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
