WMV files on WIndows XP using Rev 2.8.1
Can anyone here play WMV files on WIndows XP using Rev 2.8.1? I made sure the Load QuickTime on startUp box in preferences is not ticked. I then built my 'Splash screen' as I have done many times on 2.6.1 with success. [tested builds made on OS X and Windows XP with Rev 2.8.1] I then used Rev 2.8.1 to make a Splash screen to open the application, as I have done many times with success on Rev 2.6.1 The first image/frame of the WMV video opens and is immediately followed by the Windows Please tell Microsoft about this problem window. No WMV played. This Windows XP machine plays the application's WMV video with a Rev 2.6.1 Splash with zero trouble. This WIndows XP machine will NOT play the application's WMV video with a Rev 2.8.1 Splash. Then... I made a small test stack and tried to play a WMV from a player object - first frame loads and then immediate crash dumps Rev 2.8.1 [Rev 2.8.1 Enterprise on WIndows XP]. This occurred after making sure of preferences, rebooting, being sure dontuseqt is used, etc. I then tried importing a WMV into the stack and playing it - no success. Surely Rev 2.8.1 should be able to play WMV files. Can anyone here play WMV files on WIndows XP using Rev 2.8.1? Jim Sims Custom Software Development www.EZPZapps.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Curious QT playback problem
Recently, J. Landman Gay wrote: This has been working fine on both Mac and Windows machines for several hundred customers over the last 3 years until today, when one customer says there is a playback problem. She's running XP Pro on a fast machine with lots of RAM. When she chooses to play a sequence, it loops through them all very fast, with no playback of any kind, until it hits the last one in the list which it then plays. It almost sounds like it isn't loading the .mov files. Does your app play files from the net or from the local machine? Are you setting the filename to empty before setting the filename to a new path? Could there be some issue with the user having their machine set to default to another multimedia playback mechanism besides QT? (I know this is unlikely since .MOV is pretty much Apple-only.) Not sure if this is related: The reason I recently posted my jukebox stack for testing was something similar -- it seemed that after several Web-based file accesses, Rev would get tired and report the duration of the player 0, for any valid file URL. I wound up adding a repeat loop that tries to access a problem file several times with a delay in between attempts, before giving up. The frustrating thing is it's difficult to tell whether the problem is Rev-based or server-based. If you're accessing local files, I'm sorry, I'm not sure where to start looking for the problem. Unless you wan to go through the trouble of sending the user a stripped down player stack that access just a few files. Regards, Scott Rossi Creative Director Tactile Media, Multimedia Design ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Problem with Browser Sampler Stack in Rev/Mac 2.8.1
On Tue, 5 Jun 2007 11:11:25 -0700 (PDT) Jan Schenkel wrote: I just opened the Browser Sampler stack on my iMac/G5 OSX 10.4.9 - the button on the first screen worked fine - when I tried to open the PDF example, Rev crashed I reopened Revolution - skipped the button on the first card - the PDF example opened fine now I can't make PDF example work on my configuration (Rev 2.8.1 on Mac OS 10.3.9). When I click Embed PDF document help file button, It asks me to locate Adobe Acrobat (I have Adobe Reader 7.0.9) but after pointing it to Acrobat Reader, Browser window stays blank. No crashes, no complains, just assessing and after a while finished in fld logField The one interesting fact I found today was that the externals of stack InetBrowser are still set to altBrowser2.dll altBrowser2.bundle which seems to be left over from stacks heritage, but it's not related to my issue. best regards Tariel ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Problem with Browser Sampler Stack in Rev/Mac 2.8.1
OK folks, here's the cure for the crash in the Browser Sampler.rev stack. It certainly cures it on my Mac Mini, and perhaps it will cure the fleeting problems that one or two of you have experienced. In stacks InetBrowser and FlashDemo, there is a card called browserTest. Go to the last line of the resizeStack handler and REMOVE the last line which looks like this: revBrowserSet the altBrowserId of this stack, rect, the rect of image browserimage The fact that it is in the resizeStack seems to support the idea I put forward in my last e-mail: probably a problem of timing. This might add up to something like: Don't muck about with the rects of the altBrowser when they're already being mucked about with during some process of re-sizing. I'll leave the elaborations, qualifications and more precise theories about this problem to those of you who are more technically qualified to do it. I've certainly found a cure for it on my machine, but my ideas about it might not be accurate. Bob ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Curious QT playback problem
On 7 Jun 2007, at 03:59, J. Landman Gay wrote: the script gets the currentTime, checks every 250 milliseconds, and when the currentTime remains unchanged, assumes the playback is done. Then it moves on to the next file. From what you describe, it sounds like either the currentTime isn't reported correctly, or there is some kind of delay at the start of play so the currenttime doesn't change (stuck at 0) in the first 250 milliseconds. Do you reset the timer at the start of each clip? I could imagine some over-enthuiastic virus-checker causing a delay as you switch files in the Player, and possibly when QuickTime tries to start playing the file. Or a very full hard drive. Off the top of my head, set the currentTime to 0 for each clip, then check that the currentTime hasn't changed AND that it is not 0. (Using the playStopped message would be easier. :-)) Dave ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Problem with Browser Sampler Stack in Rev/Mac 2.8.1
Now I've got another little problem with the Browser Sampler.rev stack on my Mac Mini: If I make a standalone out of the stack above, NOTHING works, including simple navigation from one page to another! OK, it's 12 minutes past 5 in the morning, and I'm going to bed.. Bob ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
AW: Curious QT playback problem
Perhaps, because it's a new and very fast machine, so that the check about the 250 msecs is done, before the mov is completely loaded? Tiemo -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von Dave Cragg Gesendet: Donnerstag, 7. Juni 2007 10:02 An: How to use Revolution Betreff: Re: Curious QT playback problem On 7 Jun 2007, at 03:59, J. Landman Gay wrote: the script gets the currentTime, checks every 250 milliseconds, and when the currentTime remains unchanged, assumes the playback is done. Then it moves on to the next file. From what you describe, it sounds like either the currentTime isn't reported correctly, or there is some kind of delay at the start of play so the currenttime doesn't change (stuck at 0) in the first 250 milliseconds. Do you reset the timer at the start of each clip? I could imagine some over-enthuiastic virus-checker causing a delay as you switch files in the Player, and possibly when QuickTime tries to start playing the file. Or a very full hard drive. Off the top of my head, set the currentTime to 0 for each clip, then check that the currentTime hasn't changed AND that it is not 0. (Using the playStopped message would be easier. :-)) Dave ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: WMV files on WIndows XP using Rev 2.8.1
On 7 Jun 2007, at 07:06, Jim Sims wrote: I made sure the Load QuickTime on startUp box in preferences is not ticked. You already reported this, didn't you? http://quality.runrev.com/qacenter/show_bug.cgi?id=3848 Ian ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: WMV files on WIndows XP using Rev 2.8.1
On Jun 7, 2007, at 11:08 AM, Ian Wood wrote: On 7 Jun 2007, at 07:06, Jim Sims wrote: I made sure the Load QuickTime on startUp box in preferences is not ticked. You already reported this, didn't you? http://quality.runrev.com/qacenter/show_bug.cgi?id=3848 Ian Yes, however I had an exchange with someone 'in the know' at Rev yesterday - he said: This was fixed in 2.8.1 specifically because of the conversation we had in Malta. There is a checkbox in the Preferences that lets you turn off “load QuickTime on startup”. You have to set dontUseQT to true before you load any movie. As Rev loaded QuickTime in the IDE this previously impossible, thus the bug. So I tested what they suggested and it still seems broken to me. I am trying to do 'due diligence' prior to 'seeking remedy'... once again. Perhaps a new bug needs listing if it isn't the dontuseqt that is preventing play of WMV files. ciao, sims ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
open source and the linux version
The reason for the economic power of the open source model is the possibility of derivative works. This is the underlying reason why, were one consulting to Rev, it would be one alternative one would advise exploring in depth. Not necessarily going down that route in the end. But certainly exploring at a deeper level than some of the reflex-reaction comments about Open Source seen here, and looking hard at how money can be made in that environment. Because how and whether it is possible to compete in an environment in which there are unlimited derivative works is the key issue facing the proprietary closed source software industry over the next ten years, for Rev just like anyone else. Its worse if you are, in Porter's phrase, potentially 'stuck in the middle' in terms of scale: not big enough to be a low cost producer, but getting too big to be a true niche only supplier. To understand the power of derivative works, look at what happened with PythonCard. The authors had a ready made scripting language in Python. Then they had a ready made widget set in wxPython. Their task in constructing PythonCard was fairly small scale. Look at MurgaLua as another example. The author had Lua, and he also had FLTK ready made and right there to hand. He just had to merge them. On the other hand, if you were wanting to develop a card-model language in the closed source environment, think what you would have to do. A scripting language, an IDE...it doesn't bear thinking about. But PythonCard was a manageable task because it is a derivative work. Exactly the kind of thing that the closed source model prevents and exists to prevent. Because this is just exploiting someone else's work. Yes, and the Open Source movement positively aims at an environment in which this will happen. When people get free markets, they do not necessarily do what you would like with them, or what Marx or Ayn Rand said they should or would do. They don't vote how you might like, either. When some of you say on this forum that you wish 'Linux' would standardize on one distribution, preferably Ubuntu, this is what you are missing. Ubuntu was a derivative work on Debian. One of ten or twenty. Debian in turn is derivative on thousands of independently done applications. This is why there are hundreds of distributions on DistroWatch. Some people react to this by condemning the existence of all this choice as confusing - but it only exists because the market has produced and sustained it. People may not like it, but this is the power of the model, and this is why it is not going away. It is, contrary to the muddled feelings some people have about it, a typically free market phenomenon. It is people responding to the needs and desires of users. It is just that they are not responding in quite the way, and with the restricted motivations, that you were used to from the fifties and sixties, and that you wrongly think of as characterising open market behaviour. We also need to look at the end user. The situation the Rev Linux user finds himself in right now is a typical example of why end users move to open source applications. We are currently on 2.6.1, when the rest of the world is on 2.8 and rising. That is, they are two releases ahead of us. Increasingly, we can't participate. We cannot open stacks written in 2.7 and on. And, there is absolutely nothing we can do about it. We cannot even find out when and whether a new version is coming out. What are we to do? Probably be patient, and hope, and console ourselves with the thought that the people involved in Rev are very pleasant, the product is great, and one day it will all work out. In fact, the Linux beta will be out any day now. But at some point, some of us will also quietly open up a browser, drift over to Amazon, and order Hetland's wonderful book on Python. And while there, notice a very fine introductory book on Lua by Jung and Brown. And think to ourselves, yes, I need a bit of insurance just around now. After all, Hypercard was wonderful, had very nice people involved with it, and it did get orphaned, and there was nothing any of us could do about that, either Peter ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: OT: Open Source (was Don't you just wish Rev would do this?)
Like I said, GPL is not the only choice. Cheers, Luis. On 7 Jun 2007, at 04:18, Chipp Walters wrote: On 6/6/07, Luis [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It does not mean that whatever changes are made are forced upon you, as for that same reason, you can change it. GPL has given us Linux, Firefox, etc. OOPS, not so fast...have you seen the stir GPL 3 is causing? Turns out if you plan on using GPL 3 code in a commercial product, there will be several pending restrictions-- which your customer/client may find not only objectable, but in TiVo's case, completely destructive. And I quote: *(The GPL 3) no longer works in the fairness sense. It's purely a firebrand, and only good for the extremist policies of the FSF. It's no longer a nice balance that a lot of people can accept, and that a lot of companies can stand behind once you explain it to them.* --Linus Torvalds, Linux founder See Torvalds critical of new GPL draft http://news.com.com/Torvalds+critical+of+new+GPL+draft/ 2100-7344_3-6099475.html?tag=item ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Open Source (was Don't you just wish Rev would do this?)
It puts the user directly in contact with the development process. In terms of open source software the user is (or has been) the developer - so you you get stability, quick bug fixes and security (if you are dealing with paranoid sys admins), or chaos, multiple forks and experiments (if you are dealing with younger hackers). Thats how it cuts out the cause of feature bloat by getting the marketing people out of the loop. Thats why the packaging, GUI and ease of use tend to suffer. What seems to be happening now (as Richard pointed out) is that the design and usability people are getting in on the act. This could not happen until the infrastructure was there now for open source style GUI work. MVC style design patterns allow the geeks to adore each other, and the wannabe designers to show their stuff without messing with the functional code. Thats not just CSS and skins, but also businesses providing web services such as mapping. I'd beg to differ with Lynn that this stuff is only for the big boys - like Adobe, IBM, Google or Yahoo. The developers of Base Camp have a good business, they build upon the developer community they created with Ruby on Rails. They get a lot of work. Nor did they need to raise heaps of cash to get there. If I had a vote - I'd at least be seriously exploring moving over to that sort of model - together with dual licensing for companies wanting closed source solutions for their customers. Business models are adapting to these new forces, and while they are not sorted out yet - where there is dirt there is money. On 07/06/07, Chipp Walters [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 6/6/07, Samuel M. Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The problem I have with runrev is not open source per se but that with a paid model the incentive is for the developer to release feature updates that sound good to justify paying upgrade fees but that for the most part are not nearly as valuable to a developer as maintaining stable quality code. Mature open source on the other hand has the opposite incentive, stable code and only add features that people are willing to invest time in to get so you get a different evolution of features over time. Brilliant. ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: strange (german) system date
I just discoverd strange things here on my PC: Rev 2.8.1, WIN XP Home SP2. In the msg: put the long date - Tuesday, June 5, 2007 which is correct. put the long system date - Mittwoch, 5. Juni 2007 which tells me it is wednesday (Mittwoch), NOT correct ? Any hints are very welcome. Thank you very much Klaus. I have had a few reports of my Calendar stack reporting the wrong date and I haven't been able to reproduce the problem, but the reports have been exactly what you describe with dates assigned to incorrect days of the week. I'm delighted to hear that it isn't just my calendar but a general bug :-) Now I can tell people just to wait for 2.8.2... Regards, Sarah P.S. Is this a Windows only problem? ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: XCode 2
--- -= JB =- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If I have some code written in C that was used in HyperCard and want to rewrite it for Revolution is the best program to use for the job Apple XCode 2. Where can I find the best examples of XCode 2 being used in Revolution. Are there versions of Codewarrior that work in OS X and will do the job. -=JB=- Hi John, You'll certainly be interested in the short series 'External Writing for the Uninitiated' by Mark Waddingham in the Revolution Newsletter: http://www.runrev.com/newsletter/november/issue13/newsletter5.php http://www.runrev.com/newsletter/november/issue14/newsletter3.php This gives information on how to build externals on MacOSX and Windows alike, using XCode and Visual Studio respectively. Hope this helped, Jan Schenkel. Quartam Reports PDF Library for Revolution http://www.quartam.com = As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time. (La Rochefoucauld) Park yourself in front of a world of choices in alternative vehicles. Visit the Yahoo! Auto Green Center. http://autos.yahoo.com/green_center/ ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: There's no place like Home
On 6/7/07, Richard Gaskin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If you had a Home stack in Rev like there was in HyperCard, what would you use it for? Keep in mind that Rev is a different beast than HC, so let your imagination run wild: What would you expect to see in a Rev Home stack? I use a couple of my own stacks: a stack launcher and a function key handler, to replace some of the Home stack's features. In HC, I used to have a lot of my own handlers in the Home stack's stack script, but in Rev, I prefer to have that sort of thing on a project-by-project basis and not as a permanent front or backScript. If you wanted to replace something from HC, I reckon a much better investment would be a provide a modern equivalent of the HC stacks that included a bunch of sample fields and buttons. Cheers, Sarah ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Imagine a world in which HyperCard had been open sourced 20 years ago?
How would the world of software languages that we know of now be different? Perhaps: 1. Visual Basic would not have had the success that it did as companies re-hacked HyperTalk to fit their business needs 2. We'd have got colour and video and object orientation well ahead of the competition 3. MetaCard would have been born as an Open Source company based around customising the engine for larger corporations 4. RunRev would have produced the RevIde and repackaged it for a new market - without the same start-up costs 5. Others Galaxies would have been produced 6. We'd have got these benefits cheaper, they would have got more customers 7. Businesses would be making money with the engine and there would be many many such businesses Have some fun and picture it - dream or nightmare? It's a serious question, for those thinking of investing their skills. ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Open Source (was Don't you just wish Rev would do this?)
Oh no, we agree on something... Cheers, Luis. On 7 Jun 2007, at 04:25, Chipp Walters wrote: On 6/6/07, Samuel M. Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The problem I have with runrev is not open source per se but that with a paid model the incentive is for the developer to release feature updates that sound good to justify paying upgrade fees but that for the most part are not nearly as valuable to a developer as maintaining stable quality code. Mature open source on the other hand has the opposite incentive, stable code and only add features that people are willing to invest time in to get so you get a different evolution of features over time. Brilliant. ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: OT: Open Source (was Don't you just wish Rev would do this?)
And if you are looking at restrictions on freedom - equally scary is future where hardware will not run software that is not copyright approved by a built in DRM chipp - pun intended :) Now if you were a company with a large library of software or digital content - that would be something worth lobbying for - which of course they are. ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: strange (german) system date
Hi Sarah, ... In the msg: put the long date - Tuesday, June 5, 2007 which is correct. put the long system date - Mittwoch, 5. Juni 2007 which tells me it is wednesday (Mittwoch), NOT correct ? Any hints are very welcome. Thank you very much Klaus. You're welcome :-) I have had a few reports of my Calendar stack reporting the wrong date and I haven't been able to reproduce the problem, but the reports have been exactly what you describe with dates assigned to incorrect days of the week. I'm delighted to hear that it isn't just my calendar but a general bug :-) Now I can tell people just to wait for 2.8.2... Regards, Sarah P.S. Is this a Windows only problem? Apparently yes. Best from germany Klaus Major ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Convert from Absolute to Relative Paths
Hi, Does anyone know of some RunRev code that will take two absolute file paths and return the relative path? e.g. Frm PathA = /documents/Folder1/Folder2 PathB = /documents/Folder3/Folder4 Produce PathB, which in this case would be: ../../Folder1/Folder4 Thanks a lot All the Best Dave ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: There's no place like Home
You could do a lot worse than look at the HyperCard Home stack as a starting point for drawing in 'hobbyist' users (like me). If your Home Stack is simply a launcher perhaps you could package different kinds of Home stacks for different kinds of users - something along the lines of the HC User level approach, or something that would work for different kinds of switchers e.g. a Home stack fro switchers from SuperCard - or whatever. James -- James J Richards [EMAIL PROTECTED] Tel. +44 (0)15394 43063 On 7 Jun, 2007, at 05:39, Richard Gaskin wrote: Joe Lewis Wilkins wrote: On Jun 6, 2007, at 8:23 PM, Chipp Walters wrote: Any stack which launches everytime Rev does, goes into the memory footprint and possibly adds frontscripts, backscripts providing more opportunity to mess with the fragile IDE. I agree completely with Chipp. Good readily and obviously available template stacks much as Judy outlined them would be far more useful and much less dangerous. I should clarify that I do too. The Home stack is currently a necessity in any IDE, so the impact in memory would not change. And in keeping with MetaCard's central mandate, Do No Harm, I can't imagine why any Home stack would need any frontScripts or backScripts. HC never supported either feature, and we needn't much up any new Home stack with them. It should be simple and self-contained, far simpler than RevOnline and, unlike RevOnline, open source for user modification. -- Richard Gaskin Managing Editor, revJournal ___ Rev tips, tutorials and more: http://www.revJournal.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: XCode 2
On Jun 7, 2007, at 3:33 AM, Jan Schenkel wrote: Hi John, You'll certainly be interested in the short series 'External Writing for the Uninitiated' by Mark Waddingham in the Revolution Newsletter: http://www.runrev.com/newsletter/november/issue13/newsletter5.php http://www.runrev.com/newsletter/november/issue14/newsletter3.php This gives information on how to build externals on MacOSX and Windows alike, using XCode and Visual Studio respectively. Hope this helped, Jan Schenkel. Quartam Reports PDF Library for Revolution http://www.quartam.com = As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time. (La Rochefoucauld) Thanks Jan, -=JB=- ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: WMV files on WIndows XP using Rev 2.8.1
On 7. Jun 2007, at 08:06, Jim Sims wrote: Can anyone here play WMV files on WIndows XP using Rev 2.8.1? Yes, as long as QuickTime is not installed. If it is installed one would have to set dontuseqt to true, but this leads to an error. I did tests with stacks in its most simple form and I saw the movie playing, but there was always the standard error message from the system ( app caused an error and needs to be closed, something like that). And that is the reason why I am getting into real trouble with my current project, because the ability to play WMV files on Win, even if QuickTime is installed, is essential for the functionality of this app. Ralf Bitter ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
[OT] NeoOffice
On 6/6/07, Bob Warren [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Kay, [Is that correct? You put your initials HTH at the end of your post.] Actually the HTH was meant to mean Hope That Helps. My signature block is automatically appended to my e-mails, but it's a gif file (in a successful attempt to stop webbots extracting my contact details) but this list doesn't accept attachments so you never see it. opted immediately for Open Office (which seems to include Word only for OSX at the moment). That was because there were so many warnings about potential bugs on account of the fact that NeoOffice is a test release. Actually I tend to believe all Open Source software should come with such a warning. Really it's just a beta release and it's pretty standard for betas to come with such a warning. This one just appears a little scarier. Have you tried it yourself? If so, and you tell me that it is reasonably stable, I'll certainly give it a go. Yes, and No. I use it almost daily, BUT only to read/access what the Windoz world has sent me. I never create anything with it. Typically these are .doc, .xls and .ppt files. As far as stability is concerned I would put it up there with the better bunch of Open Source software. Compared to Audacity, which I recommend to any Mac user who wants to dabble* with sound, I would say NeoOffice is more stable. As far as usability is concerned there is no question that the rendered files do NOT render 100%; particularly Excel spreadsheets don't seem to come out right. But 2.1 has made noticeable improvements on previous versions so I can only hope that things will continue to improve. In previous version there were occasions when actual data disappeared behind margins etc, making it possible to actually miss some important piece of information, but again I'm noticing that far less with 2.1 unabashed dig The one area where NeoOffice outperforms the Windoz equivalent is that you get more bloatware for your buck; but that has to be expected from any Java app :-( /unabashed dig For any Mac user who doesn't have a copy of MS Office/Word/Excel/PowerPoint and needs to occasionally view Windoz files I recommend giving NeoOffice a spin. Not having ever created anything with NeoOffice I can only suggest that if the creation side is anywhere near as good as the viewing side, then if I needed to create a Word/Excel/PowerPoint file then I'd give it a go. http://www.neooffice.org/neojava/en/index.php HTH :-) *If you occasionally need to open an odd sound file, or want to put some vinyl onto CD, then Audacity is the go. If you what to become a sound engineer and make money then there's much better out their; you'll just have to pay for it. ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: open source and the linux version
That's the feeling I get when I see the age of some of the bugs... Cheers, Luis. On 7 Jun 2007, at 10:39, Peter Alcibiades wrote: Snipped. But at some point, some of us will also quietly open up a browser, drift over to Amazon, and order Hetland's wonderful book on Python. And while there, notice a very fine introductory book on Lua by Jung and Brown. And think to ourselves, yes, I need a bit of insurance just around now. After all, Hypercard was wonderful, had very nice people involved with it, and it did get orphaned, and there was nothing any of us could do about that, either Peter ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: There's no place like Home
Hi Richard and all, Le 7 juin 07 à 02:23, Richard Gaskin a écrit : If you had a Home stack in Rev like there was in HyperCard, what would you use it for? Keep in mind that Rev is a different beast than HC, so let your imagination run wild: What would you expect to see in a Rev Home stack? In older times, I have provided to my readers in MacWorld French edition a 'replacement' home stack for HC: In color and working mostly with drag and drop, it added a lot of possibilities compared to the regular 'Home Stack'. But all this is a question of market: As for me, I don't need any home stack but I understand well that, in some fields (beginners, education, etc.), such a beast would be welcome. Actually it's easy to make one as a plugin loaded at startup anyone could put out or not :-) It could display different things according to a kind of user level from a simple stack launcher to a lib and plugin manager, environment info and much more. The stacks launcher would includes presentation stacks, videos and templates for beginners as well as more sophisticated stuff about plugins, building externals, etc. according to the user level chosen. In addition, and it did not existed in HC of course, internet links should be included. As for RevOnline, it would be accessible in all cases directly or from the home stack but contents showed should reflect the user level. Actually it could receive the 'Getting Started' and the user guide parts of the current help, the help stack being limited to the dictionary/glossary, i.e. all things directly related to the vocabulary. Just my two cents after two minutes thinking... PS1. Richard: actually the HC engine inserts the Home script as a back script :-) PS2. In the 'replacement' home stack for HC I mentioned above, a section was really appreciated by all users: Which vocabulary should I use for... Best regards from Paris, Eric Chatonet. Plugins and tutorials for Revolution: http://www.sosmartsoftware.com/ Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]/ ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
re: professor made software with runrev and sold for 2 million dollars
Hi folks, just came across an article here with a runrev connection: http://www.theunion.com/article/20070606/NEWS/106060142 Not a whole lot of detail, but this apparently relates to teachMac and teachIt being built with runrev. This may be old news to some, but I hadn't heard this before... Wayne ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: professor made software with runrev and sold for 2 milliondollars
wayne, how come did you come across that paper ? Did you type Runtime revolution and $2 million in google ? just kidding... JB Hi folks, just came across an article here with a runrev connection: http://www.theunion.com/article/20070606/NEWS/106060142 Not a whole lot of detail, but this apparently relates to teachMac and teachIt being built with runrev. This may be old news to some, but I hadn't heard this before... Wayne ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: professor made software with runrev and sold for 2 milliondollars
Hi JB! I have a google news filter set up to flag hypercard references and this article mentioned it so it showed up in the results. The filters work great for things that aren't making a lot of headlines anymore because you aren't inundated with too much stuff, but it catches lots of interesting things you wouldn't otherwise come across. Best regards! Wayne On 6/7/07, jbv [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: wayne, how come did you come across that paper ? Did you type Runtime revolution and $2 million in google ? just kidding... JB ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: There's no place like Home
The first thing I do upon launching Rev/MC is click the Tool btn on the Home stack to open the Tools menu, then close the Home stack. One thing I would not want is more front and back scripts added. I recently spent many hours trying to find out why my own frontscript mouseup handler wasn't occuring. In the end, I had to go thru every btn (and there were a lot) that called my frontscript, and do this: on mouseUp myMouseUp end mouseUp I renamed my frontscript mouseUp handler to myMouseUp, and it fixed the problem. But the problem shouldn't have existed in the first place. What was even more frustrating, was that my use of mouseUp in my own frontscript has worked fine for years, and I don't know what broke it, except to wonder if the newer versions of Rev/MC did it. We don't need more frontscripts interfering with our own! Vote = No. That said, ideally Home should be used to make a first time user's experience smoother. I have been using Rev/MC for years, but when I want to know how to do something new, finding the answer is never easy. It is not uncommon to resort to a list archive search and wade thru hundreds of postings hoping for a clue. If I've experienced difficulty finding an answer, being a long time user, I can't even imagine what it's like for a new person downloading the trial and making a decision to purchase. There should be docs of the same caliber as the old Hyertalk 2.2 book. That, and the Complete Hypercard Handbook, were the two best sources of documentation I've seen as far as a well-written how to. Every function and command should have detailed code examples for every scenario of use of that function/command, and the info should be easy to find. NEVER assume your user knows xyz when writing an example or answering a question. Shari -- Windows and Macintosh shareware games BIackjack Gold http://www.gypsyware.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: There's no place like Home
Eric Chatonet wrote: It could display different things according to a kind of user level from a simple stack launcher to a lib and plugin manager, environment info and much more. The stacks launcher would includes presentation stacks, videos and templates for beginners as well as more sophisticated stuff about plugins, building externals, etc. according to the user level chosen. In addition, and it did not existed in HC of course, internet links should be included. As for RevOnline, it would be accessible in all cases directly or from the home stack but contents showed should reflect the user level. Actually it could receive the 'Getting Started' and the user guide parts of the current help, the help stack being limited to the dictionary/glossary, i.e. all things directly related to the vocabulary. Good suggestions, thanks. Since the MC IDE will be incorporating RIP properties going forward, it does make sense to put a component manager/updater into the stack which makes smart use of those. Good idea. PS1. Richard: actually the HC engine inserts the Home script as a back script :-) While the Home stack is in the message path in both HyperCard and Rev, it isn't among the backScripts. BackScripts were introduced in SuperCard and later added to MetaCard/Revolution, but that specific mechanism was never supported in HyperCard. HyperCard did support libraries (start using...), but the Home stack isn't list among those either. It seems the Home stack is a special case, inserted into the message path automatically without either of those mechanisms. Given that the development engine requires it there's nothing we can do about that; whether we show it or not that required stack will still be in the message path during development in any IDE. That said, we can at least be as conscientious about it as possible and not add any other complexities to it, keeping its own handlers to a minimum and not adding any other frontScripts, backScripts, or libraries to it. With all the talk of open source here lately, anyone here want to take up the task of crafting an updated Home stack for the open source MetaCard IDE? -- Richard Gaskin Managing Editor, revJournal ___ Rev tips, tutorials and more: http://www.revJournal.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Legacy stack woes II
Hi All, New issue: Standalone settings for Legacy stacks are stored in separate Config stacks, while those settings are internal in the current stack format. If one is distributing a stack to be used by developers to build standalones (eg: SDB_Server, SDB_Utilities): * If saved in legacy format, standlone settings are lost regardless of stack format * If save in current format, the stack is unusable to Linux developers * If the config stack is included, Legacy developers can build standalones immediately, whereas developers working in current stack format must convert the stack to current format, open interpret the config file, and add the settings to the stack. * The best solution requires maintaining different download archives for each stack format, and including the config stack with the Legacy download (or providing both stack formats in the same archive for stacks that are standalone templates). Suggestions or comments? Any clue when Linux developers will be able to work in the current stack format? Rob Cozens CCW Serendipity Software Company And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three; Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee. from The Triple Foole by John Donne (1572-1631) ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Convert from Absolute to Relative Paths
function file_GetRelativePath someFileOrFolder, baseFolder, @commonPath put the itemdelimiter into originalDelim set the itemdelimiter to / put empty into commonPath put someFileOrFolder into relativePath put 0 into itemNum repeat with itemNum = 1 to the number of items of baseFolder put item itemNum of baseFolder into basePathComponent put item itemNum of someFileOrFolder into somePathComponent if somePathComponent is basePathComponent then next repeat else subtract 1 from itemNum exit repeat end if end repeat put item 1 to itemNum of someFileOrFolder into commonPath delete item 1 to itemNum of relativePath delete item 1 to itemNum of baseFolder put the number of items of baseFolder into upBits repeat upBits put ../ before relativePath end repeat set the itemdelimiter to originalDelim put / after commonpath return relativePath end file_GetRelativePath ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
[OT] REAL World 2007 keynote transcript
I did not attend the conference, but my friend did and brought back this transcript: http://truetech.org/pages/RW07Keynote.php Some interesting information can be gleaned from the transcript. It looks like RealBasic is claiming to have ~170 K users (Mac, Windows, Linux combined) and they are preparing to make a strong push into Europe etc. Regards Todd -- Todd Higgins [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
RE: There's no place like Home
There are a lot of people here who cut their teeth on HC. It would be facinating to see everyone's favorite design for a modern home stack. Anyone up for a design contest? Over the weekend I found a Mac SE/30 peaking sadly out of the back of a closet. It was an interesting experience firing it up given how (after the start up sequence) just how responsive those early applications were. Best regards, Lynn Fredricks Worldwide Business Operations Runtime Revolution Ltd http://www.runrev.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: There's no place like Home
Hi Richard, I think that a kind of brainstorming from different users and programmers (all have not the same needs) could be interesting to list features that would be nice to have according to three levels: 1. Beginners 2. Hobbyists 3. Pros * * Actually, pros don't need a home stack or are able to write their own tools (as you do and many among us) but this would help hobbyists to go to the next step. PS. As for the HC Home stack, I just wanted to point out it was a kind of automatic back script you can't remove :-) Le 7 juin 07 à 16:36, Richard Gaskin a écrit : Eric Chatonet wrote: It could display different things according to a kind of user level from a simple stack launcher to a lib and plugin manager, environment info and much more. The stacks launcher would includes presentation stacks, videos and templates for beginners as well as more sophisticated stuff about plugins, building externals, etc. according to the user level chosen. In addition, and it did not existed in HC of course, internet links should be included. As for RevOnline, it would be accessible in all cases directly or from the home stack but contents showed should reflect the user level. Actually it could receive the 'Getting Started' and the user guide parts of the current help, the help stack being limited to the dictionary/glossary, i.e. all things directly related to the vocabulary. Good suggestions, thanks. Since the MC IDE will be incorporating RIP properties going forward, it does make sense to put a component manager/updater into the stack which makes smart use of those. Good idea. PS1. Richard: actually the HC engine inserts the Home script as a back script :-) While the Home stack is in the message path in both HyperCard and Rev, it isn't among the backScripts. BackScripts were introduced in SuperCard and later added to MetaCard/Revolution, but that specific mechanism was never supported in HyperCard. HyperCard did support libraries (start using...), but the Home stack isn't list among those either. It seems the Home stack is a special case, inserted into the message path automatically without either of those mechanisms. Given that the development engine requires it there's nothing we can do about that; whether we show it or not that required stack will still be in the message path during development in any IDE. That said, we can at least be as conscientious about it as possible and not add any other complexities to it, keeping its own handlers to a minimum and not adding any other frontScripts, backScripts, or libraries to it. With all the talk of open source here lately, anyone here want to take up the task of crafting an updated Home stack for the open source MetaCard IDE? -- Richard Gaskin Managing Editor, revJournal Best regards from Paris, Eric Chatonet. Plugins and tutorials for Revolution: http://www.sosmartsoftware.com/ Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]/ ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Convert from Absolute to Relative Paths
Quick programming note: put the itemdelimiter into originalDelim ... set the itemdelimiter to originalDelim is not necessary the way you have structured your function. Rev will consider the itemDelimiter at the start of each handler to be the default itemDelimiter, which is usually a comma. set the itemdelimiter to / --is not a global setting that applies to all handlers and all scripts, only the current one. However, in Applescript,the text item delimiter is a global setting, so storing the old, and resetting is the best idea. Hope this helps. Jim Ault Las Vegas On 6/7/07 7:42 AM, David Bovill [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: function file_GetRelativePath someFileOrFolder, baseFolder, @commonPath put the itemdelimiter into originalDelim -- set the itemdelimiter to / put empty into commonPath put someFileOrFolder into relativePath put 0 into itemNum repeat with itemNum = 1 to the number of items of baseFolder put item itemNum of baseFolder into basePathComponent put item itemNum of someFileOrFolder into somePathComponent if somePathComponent is basePathComponent then next repeat else subtract 1 from itemNum exit repeat end if end repeat put item 1 to itemNum of someFileOrFolder into commonPath delete item 1 to itemNum of relativePath delete item 1 to itemNum of baseFolder put the number of items of baseFolder into upBits repeat upBits put ../ before relativePath end repeat set the itemdelimiter to originalDelim put / after commonpath return relativePath end file_GetRelativePath ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
RE: [OT] REAL World 2007 keynote transcript
I did not attend the conference, but my friend did and brought back this transcript: http://truetech.org/pages/RW07Keynote.php Some interesting information can be gleaned from the transcript. It looks like RealBasic is claiming to have ~170 K users (Mac, Windows, Linux combined) and they are preparing to make a strong push into Europe etc. There was a lot of discussion about numbers a few months ago - check it out in the archives. Best regards, Lynn Fredricks Worldwide Business Operations Runtime Revolution Ltd http://www.runrev.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: There's no place like Home
Eric Chatonet wrote: I think that a kind of brainstorming from different users and programmers (all have not the same needs) could be interesting to list features that would be nice to have according to three levels: 1. Beginners 2. Hobbyists 3. Pros * * Actually, pros don't need a home stack or are able to write their own tools (as you do and many among us) but this would help hobbyists to go to the next step. As a big fan of personnas in workflow analyis, I'm immediately attracted to your breakdown. I think there's a lot of merit to that, which is one more reason why any Home stack should have an option to not show it on launch. But thinking back to your earlier suggestions, there are some tools, like component management and updating, which might be helpful to pros in addition to links to any sample stacks geared for newcomers. I'm surprised no one here has mentioned Rebol yet. They had a nifty Internet-connected sort of Home-like window that was the starting point for their system. I think there may be some interesting aspects of that which might benefit MC. PS. As for the HC Home stack, I just wanted to point out it was a kind of automatic back script you can't remove :-) Eric, with the great work you do no sane person could doubt your knowledge. I merely wanted to clarify that any presence of the Home stack in MC's message path is limited to what the engine requires, and that I see no need to complicate that by adding more. On the contrary, one of the benefits that keeps MC fans using that IDE after all these years is that it uses a simpler messaging model with a much smaller footprint, minimizing as much as possible the differences between development and runtime. Any further enhancement to the MC IDE will continue to honor that mandate. -- Richard Gaskin Managing Editor, revJournal ___ Rev tips, tutorials and more: http://www.revJournal.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: There's no place like Home
Shari wrote: The first thing I do upon launching Rev/MC is click the Tool btn on the Home stack to open the Tools menu, then close the Home stack. Me too. One more reason to have any Home stack operate like RevOnline, with an option to let the user determine if it opens on launch or not. One thing I would not want is more front and back scripts added. I recently spent many hours trying to find out why my own frontscript mouseup handler wasn't occuring. In the end, I had to go thru every btn (and there were a lot) that called my frontscript, and do this: on mouseUp myMouseUp end mouseUp I renamed my frontscript mouseUp handler to myMouseUp, and it fixed the problem. But the problem shouldn't have existed in the first place. What was even more frustrating, was that my use of mouseUp in my own frontscript has worked fine for years, and I don't know what broke it, except to wonder if the newer versions of Rev/MC did it. We don't need more frontscripts interfering with our own! Vote = No. The MetaCard IDE uses only a single frontScript and backScript to drive itself, and to the best of my knowledge its mouse handlers haven't been modified since Scott Raney wrote them back in the day. Messages are arguably the most important category of tokens in the language, as they're our five senses that let our scripts know what's happening in the world. In the absence of pointer-tool-specific messages (requested at http://quality.runrev.com/qacenter/show_bug.cgi?id=2606), any IDE will need to trap mouseDown, mouseUp, etc. to update property inspectors and such, but this sensitivity to the critical role of messages keeps MC's handling of them as light as possible. So given all that, and the care RunRev puts into maintaining the integrity of messaging in the engine, I'm surprised you encountered a change in behavior between engine versions. If this remains an issue we should continue poking around with this on the MC list. There should be docs of the same caliber as the old Hyertalk 2.2 book. That, and the Complete Hypercard Handbook, were the two best sources of documentation I've seen as far as a well-written how to. Every function and command should have detailed code examples for every scenario of use of that function/command, and the info should be easy to find. Rev's documentation isn't too far off that mark, since the original docs were written by the same person who wrote most of HyperTalk 2.2: The Book, Jeanne DeVoto. But Rev 1.0 was a long time ago, and a lot it's been revised and a good many new tokens have been added since. And some of the most helpful stuff she wrote, like the Cookbook stack, have long since been removed from Rev, which is too bad because there was some darn useful stuff in there. FWIW, I've recommended Jeanne to a client to write the documentation for two products I develop, and we -- and our customers -- have been very pleased with the results. If anyone here needs a tech writer I would recommend her. NEVER assume your user knows xyz when writing an example or answering a question. I agree that all the IDEs could use some enhancement to the docs, perhaps MetaCard's even more so given its age and historic caudience focus. At a minimum I'd like to see what could be done to be able to call up Eric Chatonet's excellent Search tool within MC. It's probably the most comprehensive search around, able to pull in stuff from an amazing variety of sources. We don't currently have an owner for the documentation components in the MC IDE, and if one of the open source advocates here would like to take that one we'd love to have them on the team. -- Richard Gaskin Managing Editor, revJournal ___ Rev tips, tutorials and more: http://www.revJournal.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Convert from Absolute to Relative Paths
I look at this task differently and offer it as an example to study to see various ways Rev let's you accomplish the same thing. David's solution will make more sense to some and be easier to program, so they should follow that direction. My approach is to use the Rev chunk expressions to get to the same result rather than repeat loops. In this case, speed is not an issue unless you are operating on thousands of paths, and then you should probably take another sip of coffee to fill the time difference, if any. My style appears below, and David's original appears below that Jim Ault Las Vegas ---start copy code --correct for word wrap function file_GetRelativePath someFileOrFolder, baseFolder, @commonPath if baseFolder is not in someFileOrFolder then return Oooops, not going to work if char -1 of baseFolder is not / then put / after baseFolder --add if char -1 of someFileOrFolder is / then put after baseFolder --subtract replace baseFolder with empty in someFileOrFolder set the itemdelimiter to / put item 1 to -2 of someFileOrFolder / into commonPath put the number of items in someFileOrFolder into relativeLevels get item -1 of someFileOrFolder set the itemDelimiter to tab put it into item relativeLevels of relativePath replace tab with ../ in relativePath return (someFileOrFolder cr baseFolder cr relativeLevels cr relativePath) end file_GetRelativePath -- end of function -start of handler that calls the function --using literal strings, so correct for word wrap on testt put /Volumes/mainHDG5/Users/jault/Documents/wbArea/wbSubDomains/laurabydesign/v er01/page01/swfLoop01 into someFileOrFolder put /Volumes/mainHDG5/Users/jault/Documents/wbArea/wbSubDomains/ into baseFolder put empty into commonPath get file_GetRelativePath(someFileOrFolder, baseFolder, commonPath) put it cr commonPath end testt --end copy code == result of my version appears in message box == laurabydesign/ver01/page01/swfLoop01 someFileOrFolder /Volumes/mainHDG5/Users/jault/Documents/wbArea/wbSubDomains/ 4 relativeLevels ../../../swfLoop01 relativePath laurabydesign/ver01/page01/ commonPath - On 6/7/07 7:42 AM, David Bovill [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: function file_GetRelativePath someFileOrFolder, baseFolder, @commonPath put the itemdelimiter into originalDelim set the itemdelimiter to / put empty into commonPath put someFileOrFolder into relativePath put 0 into itemNum repeat with itemNum = 1 to the number of items of baseFolder put item itemNum of baseFolder into basePathComponent put item itemNum of someFileOrFolder into somePathComponent if somePathComponent is basePathComponent then next repeat else subtract 1 from itemNum exit repeat end if end repeat put item 1 to itemNum of someFileOrFolder into commonPath delete item 1 to itemNum of relativePath delete item 1 to itemNum of baseFolder put the number of items of baseFolder into upBits repeat upBits put ../ before relativePath end repeat set the itemdelimiter to originalDelim put / after commonpath return relativePath end file_GetRelativePath ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Legacy stack woes II
Rob Cozens wrote: Standalone settings for Legacy stacks are stored in separate Config stacks, while those settings are internal in the current stack format. If one is distributing a stack to be used by developers to build standalones (eg: SDB_Server, SDB_Utilities): * If saved in legacy format, standlone settings are lost regardless of stack format AFAIK the standalone settings are stored in custom properties, and do not rely on anything specific to the new format for storage. I believe the only difference is where they're stored: in earlier versions they were in a separate stack file, and in the newer versions they do what my standalone builder has been doing for years, storing them in custom properties directly in the stack. Custom props should not be affected regardless of which format the stack is in, so I would imagine the same 2.4-format stack could be used in either IDE version, no? -- Richard Gaskin Managing Editor, revJournal ___ Rev tips, tutorials and more: http://www.revJournal.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Imagine a world in which HyperCard had been open sourced 20 years ago?
Perhaps: 1. HyperTalk is never converted from an interpreted language to a compiled one - no one wants to commit the resources 2. Five different developers rewrite the HC engine to support five different ways of adding color 3. Businesses refuse to touch HC because there are 20 different versions (HC - Berkeley, HC - SD, etc.) 4. Of the 20 versions of HC, 15 are vaporware 5. HC spawns 30 incompatible clones 6. All of the clones combined have a 2% market share (compared to VB, the Standard RAD) 7. Since no one was making money on it, no serious development was done for the last 19 years Paul Looney -Original Message- From: David Bovill [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: How to use Revolution use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Sent: Thu, 7 Jun 2007 3:40 am Subject: Imagine a world in which HyperCard had been open sourced 20 years ago? How would the world of software languages that we know of now be different? Perhaps: 1. Visual Basic would not have had the success that it did as companies re-hacked HyperTalk to fit their business needs 2. We'd have got colour and video and object orientation well ahead of the competition 3. MetaCard would have been born as an Open Source company based around customising the engine for larger corporations 4. RunRev would have produced the RevIde and repackaged it for a new market - without the same start-up costs 5. Others Galaxies would have been produced 6. We'd have got these benefits cheaper, they would have got more customers 7. Businesses would be making money with the engine and there would be many many such businesses Have some fun and picture it - dream or nightmare? It's a serious question, for those thinking of investing their skills. ___ use-revolution mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free from AOL at AOL.com. =0 ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Center text within a field?
On Jun 6, 2007, at 5:09 PM, Joe Lewis Wilkins wrote: I realize it would take a lot of initial work, but you guys seem up for it: why not just use a lookup table with the exact values you need for each font condition listed? Hi Joe, I think the time to research all of the possible scenarios would take longer then it did to right the image analyzer handler (~1/2 hr) as I would have to do this for Mac/Win and even then I wouldn't know if it would work with fonts I don't have installed. The problem I kept running into is that different fonts at the same size can have very different heights. Of course, you can limit the amount of preparation by just limiting the acceptable fonts and perhaps some of the other ranges as well. This way the table of values could be expanded over time and by others if need be without coming up with any exact formulation at the outset. Just a thought! Limiting the text size ranges and fonts would have been an option and I almost went that route. But now that I have a handler to analyze the glyph I don't have to worry about it no matter what the user throws at it. Thanks, -- Trevor DeVore Blue Mango Learning Systems www.bluemangolearning.com-www.screensteps.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Center text within a field?
On Jun 6, 2007, at 4:47 PM, J. Landman Gay wrote: So it's font dependent and we're back where we started. :( You may be stuck with your images after all, since there is no good way to read the actual positioning of the glyph inside its text box. I think I will post a feature request for getting the actual height of the glyph. That would be handy. -- Trevor DeVore Blue Mango Learning Systems www.bluemangolearning.com-www.screensteps.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Center text within a field?
Congrats, Trevor. If you've come up with an acceptable handler that performs well, then my suggestion is entirely moot at this time. I'm surprised that you were able to come up with a good solution in the time frame you mention. Great! Joe Wilkins On Jun 7, 2007, at 9:24 AM, Trevor DeVore wrote: On Jun 6, 2007, at 5:09 PM, Joe Lewis Wilkins wrote: I realize it would take a lot of initial work, but you guys seem up for it: why not just use a lookup table with the exact values you need for each font condition listed? Hi Joe, I think the time to research all of the possible scenarios would take longer then it did to right the image analyzer handler (~1/2 hr) as I would have to do this for Mac/Win and even then I wouldn't know if it would work with fonts I don't have installed. The problem I kept running into is that different fonts at the same size can have very different heights. Of course, you can limit the amount of preparation by just limiting the acceptable fonts and perhaps some of the other ranges as well. This way the table of values could be expanded over time and by others if need be without coming up with any exact formulation at the outset. Just a thought! Limiting the text size ranges and fonts would have been an option and I almost went that route. But now that I have a handler to analyze the glyph I don't have to worry about it no matter what the user throws at it. Thanks, -- Trevor DeVore Blue Mango Learning Systems www.bluemangolearning.com-www.screensteps.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Toolbar Question
Hi Everyone, Is there a way to hide or relocate the toolbar in the IDE? Since I never leave the IDE the toolbar sometimes gets in the way. Joe ** See what's free at http://www.aol.com. ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Using the Gnome Theme in Revolution 2.6.1
I know there was some discussion regarding how to get Revolution 2.6.1 to adopt the current theme in Linux, and I did some research and I just couldn't seem to understand what I needed to do to make my program use the current theme of Gnome. I tried creating environmental variables to the path of GDK but as soon as I closed the program the variables were gone. Please help? I'm a Linux idiot! Derek Bump Dreamscape Software Compress photos easily with JPEGCompress www.dreamscapesoftware.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Imagine a world in which HyperCard had been open sourced 20 years ago?
As a team member of one of the longest-running Rev-based open source projects, the MC IDE, I share much of the enthusiasm for the benefits of the process and, with more than a dozen others, have translated that enthusiasm into action. But on balance, I believe a lot of that success is due to the limited scope of the project, since we're working only on the IDE stacks and the engine remains funded through sales. I think many elements in your list support that view, that for Rev we have a good balance between traditional and open source funding: David Bovill wrote: 1. Visual Basic would not have had the success that it did as companies re-hacked HyperTalk to fit their business needs Yet Visual Basic has enjoyed that success as a proprietary product. If Apple had remained as committed to HC as Microsoft has been with VB, HC could have continued to play as central a role in evangelizing the OS as VB has, whether or not it was open source (Note to Apple: the world is bigger than Widgets). 2. We'd have got colour and video and object orientation well ahead of the competition The competition was SuperCard and MetaCard. SuperCard introduced color in 1989, and video in 1990. MetaCard premiered in 1992. HyperCard was still in development at Apple when these competing products were introduced. While it may be politically incorrect to suggest this, I believe that Apple had the opportunity to integrate color directly into the product but simply dropped the ball. True object orientation is still absent from the xTalk world though, and I agree it would be a boon to see some of that in the language. 3. MetaCard would have been born as an Open Source company based around customising the engine for larger corporations Unlike IBM, Adobe, Apple, Sun, and others who fund open source projects of the level of complexity as the MetaCard virtual machine, MetaCard Corp. didn't have multiple larger revenue streams to allow the company to give away free software. Like Rev today, MC Corp. had the engine as its main product, and relied on that sales revenue to fund its development. Why doesn't Apple open source OS X? Or Adobe with Photoshop? It seems that companies open source products for strategic reasons, and only when they have sufficient revenue from non-open-source products to fund it. Even when we look at Mozilla and the various open source contributions from universities, ultimately most of the money driving that development comes from commercial sources. If anyone here can muster the cash to acquire Rev and open source it, at the right price I would imagine Kevin would go along with it. But software is expensive to develop, and thus far we haven't seen a funding source which would cover those expenses with Rev. 4. RunRev would have produced the RevIde and repackaged it for a new market - without the same start-up costs If this is a question of IDEs tailored for specific markets, remember that an IDE is just a collection of stacks so there's nothing stopping anyone from making an IDE for any niche they find. Rev licenses for the engine to drive it are cheap, and there's already one open source IDE available, MetaCard. The only limitation here seems to be finding folks who can afford to write IDEs for free. I'd like to do that myself, but I still have some retirement goals to meet before I can give away all of my work. 5. Others Galaxies would have been produced Yet the Galaxy we have is commercial. 6. We'd have got these benefits cheaper, they would have got more customers True, free is a price that can't be beat. :) 7. Businesses would be making money with the engine and there would be many many such businesses In my shop alone I assist more than a dozen business making money with Rev, and directly manage development in three of them. And I'm just a lone gunman; when we add up the hundreds of others developing commercial applications with Rev it's a reasonably strong number. Of course if Rev were free that number would be higher, but who pays the piper? The money I earn from development is affordable to businesses because I'm using a high-level virtual machine. If they also had to pay for the VM development those costs would skyrocket. As it is, under the current egalitarian funding model we get the VM development costs amortized by having everyone pay the same low upgrade fee. -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation ___ [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.FourthWorld.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Using the Gnome Theme in Revolution 2.6.1
Derek, Ken did a great job summarizing this issue at: http://www.sonsothunder.com/devres/revolution/tips/lin002.htm try this out and let us know if you have any problems. -- cb ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
RE: There's no place like Home
What's impressive is that it did it with very little ram and drive space. Tight code, little bloat. It had to be. I still cringe at the size of my 25mb application. But I NEED all that stuff in there Over the weekend I found a Mac SE/30 peaking sadly out of the back of a closet. It was an interesting experience firing it up given how (after the start up sequence) just how responsive those early applications were. Best regards, Lynn Fredricks -- stephen barncard s a n f r a n c i s c o - - - - - - - - - - - - ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Center text within a field?
On Jun 7, 2007, at 9:34 AM, Joe Lewis Wilkins wrote: Congrats, Trevor. If you've come up with an acceptable handler that performs well, then my suggestion is entirely moot at this time. I'm surprised that you were able to come up with a good solution in the time frame you mention. Great! Oh it took me much longer to get to the point that I realized I needed to write the image analyzer :-) I spent hours trying to figure out how to solve the problem using available properties. At one point I even thought I had it working pretty well until I ran the app on Windows. -- Trevor DeVore Blue Mango Learning Systems www.bluemangolearning.com-www.screensteps.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Open Source (was Don't you just wish Rev would do this?)
David, I think you may have answered the How do we pay the piper? question here: I'd beg to differ with Lynn that this stuff is only for the big boys - like Adobe, IBM, Google or Yahoo. The developers of Base Camp have a good business, they build upon the developer community they created with Ruby on Rails. They get a lot of work. Nor did they need to raise heaps of cash to get there. If I had a vote - I'd at least be seriously exploring moving over to that sort of model - together with dual licensing for companies wanting closed source solutions for their customers. Business models are adapting to these new forces, and while they are not sorted out yet - where there is dirt there is money. The folks at Base Camp have visibility, but do revenues match? It isn't hard for any services company to be booked to capacity, but the challenge with services is that revenue is capped by the number of hours in a day. The relative ROI for software products is much higher, with no human resources constraint on revenue. But your note reminds me of one overwhelming success: MySQL. I have to admit that it would have been inconceivable for a small organization like MySQL to get a larger installed base than Sybase and Oracle without their dual licensing. A very carefully chosen license (hopefully more clearly communicated than MySQL's) might well be the ticket for Rev. Enforcement is a difficult thing with dual licensing, and I'm not sure how one would go about it when the source is freely available without relying primarily on litigation. Litigation is perhaps the most costly form of license enforcement. :) Some open source projects only make the source available if you apply for it, which may be optimal since it introduces an accountability otherwise absent when sources are freely downloadable. But you may be onto something here. A dual license explodes the market for services, while protecting revenue with the market segment that's most profitable anyway, the commercial developer. With development tools like Rev support costs are disproportionately higher than with simpler consumer apps, and costs to support professionals tends to be much lower than for less experienced developers. This means that under the current model Media customers are the most expensive sale with the lowest ROI, making the segment worth addressing solely on the hope of numbers large enough to offset the costs. But under a dual license, those looking for free stuff simply don't get support from the company, and those who need support would pay for it directly. Low-end customers looking for support would turn to things like this list, where consultants are motivated to provide support for free for the visibility. So a dual license might well preserve the highest-ROI customers while trimming the lowest-ROI, all the while exploding market share beyond what even a million-dollar marketing budget could hope to accomplish for a purely proprietary product. H. Thanks for posting that, David. Much to think about -- Richard Gaskin Managing Editor, revJournal ___ Rev tips, tutorials and more: http://www.revJournal.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Using the Gnome Theme in Revolution 2.6.1
Chris, Thank you for letting me know about that article. Sometimes I completely forget about the excellent collection of tips and tricks that Ken Ray has compiled. And I have to agree with Ken, it would be so much better when the next linux version comes out and there is no need for the revolution.sh file. I now have Theme support! Derek Bump Dreamscape Software Compress photos easily with JPEGCompress www.dreamscapesoftware.com chris bohnert wrote: Derek, Ken did a great job summarizing this issue at: http://www.sonsothunder.com/devres/revolution/tips/lin002.htm try this out and let us know if you have any problems. -- cb ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Imagine a world in which HyperCard had been open sourced 20 years ago?
Look, I don't want to get us off into off-topic flame wars, and I don't think necessarily that going Open Source is the answer for Rev, or that it would have been for HC. Its worth serious consideration is all I would argue. But you have to say that these remarks really misrepresent the Open Source situation totally, and if you want the proof of it, just look around you. Start by looking at Python, Perl and Apache. Or look at the Gimp. Or look at such a massively complex undertaking as the Debian distribution (I mention it only because its distributed elected management, so its classic Open Source, and if it can work here, it can work anywhere). Or look at KDE and the suite of applications they have developed and integrated. Look at Gnome for that matter. Yes there are Debian derivatives. No they are not vapourware, no they are not incompatible, and they complement it. It is a different model, and it would be more productive to get used to it and understand its strengths and weaknesses than to misrepresent it wholesale. Open source packages and development environments can be at least as complex as Rev and have a continued history of development and enhancement, and be perfectly usable and stable. The world is just not the way you are suggesting it is, and it is so obviously not that way, that there is little point in asserting it is. Peter Perhaps: 1. HyperTalk is never converted from an interpreted language to a compiled one - no one wants to commit the resources 2. Five different developers rewrite the HC engine to support five different ways of adding color 3. Businesses refuse to touch HC because there are 20 different versions (HC - Berkeley, HC - SD, etc.) 4. Of the 20 versions of HC, 15 are vaporware 5. HC spawns 30 incompatible clones 6. All of the clones combined have a 2% market share (compared to VB, the Standard RAD) 7. Since no one was making money on it, no serious development was done for the last 19 years Paul Looney y ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Curious QT playback problem
Scott Rossi wrote: Recently, J. Landman Gay wrote: This has been working fine on both Mac and Windows machines for several hundred customers over the last 3 years until today, when one customer says there is a playback problem. She's running XP Pro on a fast machine with lots of RAM. When she chooses to play a sequence, it loops through them all very fast, with no playback of any kind, until it hits the last one in the list which it then plays. It almost sounds like it isn't loading the .mov files. Does your app play files from the net or from the local machine? Local machine only. Are you setting the filename to empty before setting the filename to a new path? Yes. Could there be some issue with the user having their machine set to default to another multimedia playback mechanism besides QT? (I know this is unlikely since .MOV is pretty much Apple-only.) I'm not sure, but on hundreds of Windows machines, this one is the only one that has a problem. :( Not sure if this is related: The reason I recently posted my jukebox stack for testing was something similar -- it seemed that after several Web-based file accesses, Rev would get tired and report the duration of the player 0, for any valid file URL. That's interesting...maybe it does the same thing occasionally for local files too. The deal is, it is only this one machine. Puzzle. That's why I'm stumped. The client did a very good job of testing before release, and the app ran fine even in Virtual PC on a slow Mac. So, very weird. -- Jacqueline Landman Gay | [EMAIL PROTECTED] HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: There's no place like Home
From: Lynn Fredricks [EMAIL PROTECTED] There are a lot of people here who cut their teeth on HC. It would be facinating to see everyone's favorite design for a modern home stack. Anyone up for a design contest? This facinates me as it appeals to the marketer in me. g I'd love for their to be a contest. It'd be interesting and IMHO quite productive. IMHO again, better than worrying about the merits or lack thereof of open souceing Rev. vbg Scott ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Curious QT playback problem
Dave Cragg wrote: On 7 Jun 2007, at 03:59, J. Landman Gay wrote: the script gets the currentTime, checks every 250 milliseconds, and when the currentTime remains unchanged, assumes the playback is done. Then it moves on to the next file. From what you describe, it sounds like either the currentTime isn't reported correctly, or there is some kind of delay at the start of play so the currenttime doesn't change (stuck at 0) in the first 250 milliseconds. Do you reset the timer at the start of each clip? Yes. I could imagine some over-enthuiastic virus-checker causing a delay as you switch files in the Player, and possibly when QuickTime tries to start playing the file. Or a very full hard drive. The virus checker problem occured to me. I asked my client to ask his customer if she has set the checker to examine files when they open. If so, we'll see what happens if she turns it off temporarily. The delay in opening the file would cause the problem; it was the only thing I could think of. I'm glad to hear you think it might cause the problem too. Off the top of my head, set the currentTime to 0 for each clip, then check that the currentTime hasn't changed AND that it is not 0. It didn't add the not 0 part, it's true. If we have to recompile I'll do that. (Using the playStopped message would be easier. :-)) Too true, and by the next iteration of the engine I could have...but I'm hoping not to have to rebuild then app. It's been 3 years, development is closed, and this is such an isolated incident. I'm hoping the virus checker is the problem. ;) -- Jacqueline Landman Gay | [EMAIL PROTECTED] HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: AW: Curious QT playback problem
Tiemo Hollmann TB wrote: Perhaps, because it's a new and very fast machine, so that the check about the 250 msecs is done, before the mov is completely loaded? Maybe, it's possible. But I thought the handler paused until the file was loaded, or the loading failed. -- Jacqueline Landman Gay | [EMAIL PROTECTED] HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: professor made software with runrev and sold for 2 million dollars
wayne durden wrote: Hi folks, just came across an article here with a runrev connection: http://www.theunion.com/article/20070606/NEWS/106060142 Not a whole lot of detail, but this apparently relates to teachMac and teachIt being built with runrev. This may be old news to some, but I hadn't heard this before... Shameless, immodest plug: I wrote that. ;) -- Jacqueline Landman Gay | [EMAIL PROTECTED] HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Problem with Browser Sampler Stack in Rev/Mac 2.8.1
OK, so I found a cure for the functioning of Rev's Browser Sampler Stack in Rev/Mac 2.8.1 using my Mac Mini. When I make a standalone, nothing works - even when trying to navigate from one page to another. But in relation to this, I am prepared to believe provisionally that this stack is too big and clumsy for the modest machine I am using. When physical memory is in short supply for example, all kinds of crazy things can happen. So I decide to make a simple stack to test the revBrowser. From RR Newletter Issue 26, I construct the following stack: --THIS IS IN THE CARD SCRIPT: local sBrowserId = # Opens the browser and sets initial url and position. command browserInit local tBrowserId put revBrowserOpen(the windowId of this stack, http://www.google.com;) into tBrowserId --(all one line) browserEnsure tBrowserId put tBrowserId into sBrowserId revBrowserset sBrowserId, rect, the rect of graphic Browser Rect of me revBrowserset sBrowserId, scrollbars, true end browserInit --THIS IS IN A BUTTON: on mouseUp call browserInit of this card end mouseUp --THIS IS THE ERROR MESSAGE I GET: Type Handler: can't find handler Object card id 1002 Line browserEnsure tBrowserId Hint browserEnsure - Please tell me theoretically whether there is anything wrong with the above. You might try making an identical stack yourself, especially if you have an Intel Mac Mini. Bob ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: professor made software with runrev and sold for 2 million dollars
Hi Jacque! You mean the article text or the underlying teachMac technology? I assume the latter...but not quite sure? Wayne On 6/7/07, J. Landman Gay [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: wayne durden wrote: Hi folks, just came across an article here with a runrev connection: http://www.theunion.com/article/20070606/NEWS/106060142 Not a whole lot of detail, but this apparently relates to teachMac and teachIt being built with runrev. This may be old news to some, but I hadn't heard this before... Shameless, immodest plug: I wrote that. ;) -- Jacqueline Landman Gay | [EMAIL PROTECTED] HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Legacy stack woes II
Hi Richard, AFAIK the standalone settings are stored in custom properties, and do not rely on anything specific to the new format for storage. First, let's make sure we're talking apples apples: by standalone settings, I am referring to the standalone build settings: platform(s) to build for, file type code, component stacks, version #, and other settings used by the Distribution Builder. In Legacy format versions of RunRev, Build Distribution saves the settings in [stack name] Config.rev, NOT in the source stack itself. So Build Distribution in Legacy format versions expects to find the distribution settings in a separate Config stack and the post-Legacy format versions expect to find it in the source stack itself...no? Rob ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Open Source (was Don't you just wish Rev would do this?)
On 07/06/07, Richard Gaskin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: David, I think you may have answered the How do we pay the piper? question here: I think it's along the right lines - I think there are opportunities regarding the Linux version etc. The folks at Base Camp have visibility, but do revenues match? Your guess is as good as mine. The real question is are 37Signals making more money than RunRev? Which company is in a better position with regard to future profits and investors? It's hard to quantify but my guess would be that RunRevs software is an order of magnitude more complex than Ruby on Rails, that there startup investment was lower, and their valuation an order of magnitude higher. I can not really see why RunRev could not have done this with the code base they own. Indeed it would be relatively easy to produce a Rails like web environment in Rev - plus some. Rails was never easy to install and there needed to be and now is an explosion of hosting companies setting up services - the same could have happened with Rev CGI I am not suggesting a pure Rails copy - but something that makes more use of Rev features. From my experience of the open source market - there would have been a very significant number of very talented coders that would have killed to have a go at the C++ code - if it were open - though I'd guess that there are commercial libraries used that would make this a little tricky. A very carefully chosen license (hopefully more clearly communicated than MySQL's) might well be the ticket for Rev. There is scope for creativity here - indeed you could even think of a new type of license if needed. Or simply start a process in which the core language - lets say for the CGI engine (plus) is open sourced, and there is a subscription based process where you get the latest commercial extensions, IDE, dual license and support for the current license fee. Over time there could be a two way flow, with older commercial features becoming part of the open source engine, and the best of some of the open source side being improved on and offered in the commercial package under a closed license. Enforcement is a difficult thing with dual licensing, and I'm not sure how one would go about it when the source is freely available without relying primarily on litigation. Litigation is perhaps the most costly form of license enforcement. :) Is it? I have no hard evidence on this - but my guess would be that there is significantly less fraudulent use of dual licensed software than there is of closed source applications (which is very very common). I also doubt that MySQL have had need to incur higher legal costs than any other comparable closed source database company. ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: There's no place like Home
Richard Gaskin wrote: While the Home stack is in the message path in both HyperCard and Rev, it isn't among the backScripts. BackScripts were introduced in SuperCard and later added to MetaCard/Revolution, but that specific mechanism was never supported in HyperCard. HyperCard did support libraries (start using...), but the Home stack isn't list among those either. It seems the Home stack is a special case, inserted into the message path automatically without either of those mechanisms. Given that the development engine requires it there's nothing we can do about that; whether we show it or not that required stack will still be in the message path during development in any IDE. Right. Trivia: When you start using a stack, its script is inserted ahead of the Home stack (for HC compatibility.) When you insert a backscript, the script is inserted behind the Home stack, closer to the engine. In the MC IDE (and also the Rev IDE I think, but I'm not positive) it doesn't matter since Home doesn't insert its own script in either way. But in a standalone, the main stack acts like the Home stack and it may make a difference which syntax you use. -- Jacqueline Landman Gay | [EMAIL PROTECTED] HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
RE: Open Source (was Don't you just wish Rev would do this?)
I'd beg to differ with Lynn that this stuff is only for the big boys - like Adobe, IBM, Google or Yahoo. The developers of Base Camp have a good business, they build upon the developer community they created with Ruby on Rails. They get a lot of work. Nor did they need to raise heaps of cash to get there. If I had a vote - I'd at least be seriously exploring moving over to that sort of model - together with dual licensing for companies wanting closed source solutions for their customers. Dave, this mispresents my point. These companies have achieved dominance in very highly profitable market segments. That is one major, characteristic difference. The devil is in the details. I don't know the inside story of 37 Signals, just what is available in the press. There are some winning moves they have made that have given them some prosperity in recent years - there are some similarities I can see between 37 Signals and Runtime, but a whole lot of differences too. That doesn't mean those moves are going to be equally successful for any other company. There is a lot to like in Open Source software (speaking of which - are you going to OSCON? I am! :-)) and there is a lot I like about it. But Id like to draw a funny comparision between Open Source and a phenomenon in business from the late 70's - 90's when the west started to become obsessed with business success of Japanese corporations. A number of western company strategists came up with the notion that if they emulated the superficial, observed behaviors of these companies and their employees that somehow they would achive greater productivity. Those few who *really* dug into various methodologies gleaned some benefit, like Just in Time manufacturing and Kaizen quality perspectives (or had to come up with competing strategies). Those who dug in further may have realized what absolutely is not transferable because of the connection between these methods, Japanese culture, and the international business climate of the time. But what struck me as hilarious were those companies that thought having an entire team soak in a onsen together and drink sake or have morning company workouts at your desk will somehow achieve some sort of gain. Now fast forward to 2007. Japan is achiving some economic rebound, but the machine that seemed unstoppable in the late '80s and early '90s is a shadow of its former self. I am very interested in open source. But the problem Ive had to date is that, there are a great number of companies stuck at that soaking in the onsen phase - most explanations of why open source is good have been superficial and unconvincing when it comes to general business practice, though Ive seen some specific, isolated instances where its made great sense. It isnt obvious that what's good for Adobe is good for Runtime, any more than soaking in an onsen will suddenly make me more competive with the Japanese. Best regards, Lynn Fredricks Worldwide Business Operations Runtime Revolution Ltd http://www.runrev.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: professor made software with runrev and sold for 2 million dollars
wayne durden wrote: Hi Jacque! You mean the article text or the underlying teachMac technology? I assume the latter...but not quite sure? Byron Turner is one of my clients and I wrote TeachMac/TeachIT for him. We will start the next version modifications soon. -- Jacqueline Landman Gay | [EMAIL PROTECTED] HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Problem with Browser Sampler Stack in Rev/Mac 2.8.1
What's browserEnsure..I don't see that in the documenation anywhere and I don't see it defined in the code you've shown. -- cb On 6/7/07, Bob Warren [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: OK, so I found a cure for the functioning of Rev's Browser Sampler Stack in Rev/Mac 2.8.1 using my Mac Mini. When I make a standalone, nothing works - even when trying to navigate from one page to another. But in relation to this, I am prepared to believe provisionally that this stack is too big and clumsy for the modest machine I am using. When physical memory is in short supply for example, all kinds of crazy things can happen. So I decide to make a simple stack to test the revBrowser. From RR Newletter Issue 26, I construct the following stack: --THIS IS IN THE CARD SCRIPT: local sBrowserId = # Opens the browser and sets initial url and position. command browserInit local tBrowserId put revBrowserOpen(the windowId of this stack, http://www.google.com;) into tBrowserId --(all one line) browserEnsure tBrowserId put tBrowserId into sBrowserId revBrowserset sBrowserId, rect, the rect of graphic Browser Rect of me revBrowserset sBrowserId, scrollbars, true end browserInit --THIS IS IN A BUTTON: on mouseUp call browserInit of this card end mouseUp --THIS IS THE ERROR MESSAGE I GET: Type Handler: can't find handler Object card id 1002 Line browserEnsure tBrowserId Hint browserEnsure - Please tell me theoretically whether there is anything wrong with the above. You might try making an identical stack yourself, especially if you have an Intel Mac Mini. Bob ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Legacy stack woes II
Rob Cozens wrote: In Legacy format versions of RunRev, Build Distribution saves the settings in [stack name] Config.rev, NOT in the source stack itself. So Build Distribution in Legacy format versions expects to find the distribution settings in a separate Config stack and the post-Legacy format versions expect to find it in the source stack itself...no? Sort of, but not quite. The stack file format doesn't matter; the way the settings are stored is related to the distribution and the way its standalone builder works. In Rev 2.7, the SB was rewritten to store standalone settings as custom properties. I routinely save stacks in legacy format and they still retain their custom property standalone settings. If users will be running stacks in Rev 2.6.1 then you need to provide the right support files. -- Jacqueline Landman Gay | [EMAIL PROTECTED] HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Using the Gnome Theme in Revolution 2.6.1
On Thu, 07 Jun 2007 12:13:35 -0500, Derek Bump wrote: Chris, Thank you for letting me know about that article. Sometimes I completely forget about the excellent collection of tips and tricks that Ken Ray has compiled. Thanks, Derek! And I have to agree with Ken, it would be so much better when the next linux version comes out and there is no need for the revolution.sh file. Amen, brother... :-) Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software, Inc. Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Problem with Browser Sampler Stack in Rev/Mac 2.8.1
Bob Warren wrote: So I decide to make a simple stack to test the revBrowser. From RR Newletter Issue 26, I construct the following stack: --THIS IS IN THE CARD SCRIPT: snip --THIS IS THE ERROR MESSAGE I GET: Type Handler: can't find handler Object card id 1002 Line browserEnsure tBrowserId Hint browserEnsure You've omitted the browerEnsure handler, which is a custom handler Marcus wrote for his article example. It isn't a native revBrowser command. -- Jacqueline Landman Gay | [EMAIL PROTECTED] HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Problem with Browser Sampler Stack in Rev/Mac 2.8.1
Bob Warren wrote: As a matter of fact, I wasn't aware of the fact that there is such a thing as a demo version. I thought that it was all the same piece of software that could be activated either by a demo unlocking code or a licensed unlocking code.** If that is simply another way of viewing what you are really talking about, then certainly I did not receive any kind of demo unlocking code from Technical Support at any stage. I meant the 30-day trial. We sometimes call it the demo version as a shorthand term. Users who download the trial version get the unlocking key in email, which allows 30 days of unrestricted use. -- Jacqueline Landman Gay | [EMAIL PROTECTED] HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Launching Visual C++ 2005 Applications
On Wed, 6 Jun 2007 20:48:35 -0800, Doug Heywood wrote: The only thing I wonder about would be some mysterious parameter I could include in my open process statement which would actually stimulate the program to run, but I obviously don't know. Doug, are you using open process app or open process app for neither? If you're not using the for neither form, give that a try. If that doesn't work, the only other thing I can think of is either (a) creating a .vbs file that launches the command-line app and then execute the VBS from Rev, or (b) write a launcher stub application with C++/VB/etc. and execute that from Rev, which in turn would launch your command line app. Am I correct that you actually want to *show* the black terminal window with your text? Or do you just want to execute the code in your command-line program? Because if you don't want to show the terminal window, couldn't you just use shell() to run your command-line app? Just curious, Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software, Inc. Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
wait for a process in OS X
This is probably a stupid question. And I swear I've done this in the past, but I can't for the life of me remember how I did it. I need to launch an application from within a script, but I need my script to wait for the application to close before continuing. I've tried launch, open process, and even the shell() function, but in each case the script just continues running. How can I do this? Is my only option to launch it, then wait in a loop and continually check the running processes using shell()? If so, I suppose that's fine. Just kind of a hassle. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks, Chris -- Chris Sheffield Read Naturally The Fluency Company http://www.readnaturally.com -- ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Open Source (was Don't you just wish Rev would do this?)
Richard Gaskin wrote: A lot of folks here used to cry out for free bug-fix upgrades, but last time Rev delivered one they complained it didn't address all of them and left out too many feature requests. ;) - The other day, I put forward a model under the thread A glimpse of the future which was totally ignored. I must therefore presume that in the opinion of all UR-List contributers, the suggestion is flawed. Except that nobody had the patience to tell me why it was flawed. Let me make the suggestion more explicit in the hope that either its merits will be discussed, or it will be torn to pieces: 1. RR should provide feature releases on a regular basis. We pay for them. 2. We do not pay for bugfixes. The manufacturer is just putting right what he has done wrong. Feature releases are not for the purpose of fixing bugs. In fact, they will unintentionally introduce them. But there is no such thing as a bug-fix release. Bug fixes are handled between feature releases, and here's how: RR take reported bugs one by one and fix them. After fixing a single bug, they test the shit out of the IDE in order to discover the unexpected consequences. Once they are satisfied, the bugfix is immediately made available to users, either in the form of a patch, or in the form of an entirely new IDE for download. When a single bugfix is available, the Rev Online icon at the top of the user's IDE window dances up and down. It tells the user that a bugfix is available for direct download in a way which is exactly parallel to the way it is done for whole operating systems such as Ubuntu or OSX. Too simple? Too naive? Economically unviable? You don't like the word single? PLEASE TELL ME. Bob ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Open Source (was Don't you just wish Rev would do this?)
First of all, Bob, We appreciate your efforts, but what you suggest just won't ever happen. Even if we expand the word single to be several hundred, the number of builds necessitated by that approach would be enormous, and we'd all be driven absolutely out of our minds. Right now, it's bad enough. I do agree that we should pay for features and not bug fixes, but sometimes the difference between the two is pretty vague; and, hopefully, that's what we ARE doing. But it is just more convenient for all of us to get a single new package, rather than a number of different ones of whose status we have to keep track. My feeling is: Keep dreaming! Joe Wilkins On Jun 7, 2007, at 12:12 PM, Bob Warren wrote: Richard Gaskin wrote: A lot of folks here used to cry out for free bug-fix upgrades, but last time Rev delivered one they complained it didn't address all of them and left out too many feature requests. ;) - The other day, I put forward a model under the thread A glimpse of the future which was totally ignored. I must therefore presume that in the opinion of all UR-List contributers, the suggestion is flawed. Except that nobody had the patience to tell me why it was flawed. Let me make the suggestion more explicit in the hope that either its merits will be discussed, or it will be torn to pieces: 1. RR should provide feature releases on a regular basis. We pay for them. 2. We do not pay for bugfixes. The manufacturer is just putting right what he has done wrong. Feature releases are not for the purpose of fixing bugs. In fact, they will unintentionally introduce them. But there is no such thing as a bug-fix release. Bug fixes are handled between feature releases, and here's how: RR take reported bugs one by one and fix them. After fixing a single bug, they test the shit out of the IDE in order to discover the unexpected consequences. Once they are satisfied, the bugfix is immediately made available to users, either in the form of a patch, or in the form of an entirely new IDE for download. When a single bugfix is available, the Rev Online icon at the top of the user's IDE window dances up and down. It tells the user that a bugfix is available for direct download in a way which is exactly parallel to the way it is done for whole operating systems such as Ubuntu or OSX. Too simple? Too naive? Economically unviable? You don't like the word single? PLEASE TELL ME. Bob ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Open Source (was Don't you just wish Rev would do this?)
On 07/06/07, Lynn Fredricks [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I can see between 37 Signals and Runtime, but a whole lot of differences too. That doesn't mean those moves are going to be equally successful for any other company. Agreed - it doesn't. The devil is in the detail. In an email I can only use examples / metaphors to make a point. The point is that small companies, can make it big by opening up the language or tool environment that is their core business. Its easy to say that RunRev is not Adobe, but I would be interested in your thinking as to why RunRev could not make as good a business out of open sourcing core parts of the C++ engine in a similar way to 37Signals or MySQL in its early days. There is a lot to like in Open Source software (speaking of which - are you going to OSCON? I am! :-)) I wish - but I don't even know where Oregon is :) It isnt obvious that what's good for Adobe is good for Runtime, any more than soaking in an onsen will suddenly make me more competive with the Japanese. I think we agree that a direct comparison with Adobe is not going to get us very far? And I'm sure the Japanese and the Germans will be back - on the general point open source is hardly a fad - for fads I'd look at AJAX / Web 2 etc in fact it is old and slowly and steadily growing. Business models move slowly, its hardly revolutionary to suggest that to incorporate some of the better elements of open source within a tool development business is sensible. For a Revolution you'd be looking at something bolder. ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Open Source (was Don't you just wish Rev would do this?)
A little hard Joe? On 07/06/07, Joe Lewis Wilkins [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: First of all, Bob, We appreciate your efforts, but what you suggest just won't ever happen But it is just more convenient for all of us to get a single new package, rather than a number of different ones of whose status we have to keep track. I for one really appreciate both the regularity of MacOX system / security updates, and those of FireFox. They are painless and a lot more regular than Revs updates. Scott and MetaCard had a similar strategy before RunRev started a more old-school approach - it worked for me - if I emailed in a bug - it would get fixed within weeks or a few months at most. Most of all since we have had everything in place for online stack / plugin updates - there really should be a supported way for IDE bugfixes and enhancements to get spotted,fixed and distributed much faster. Surely there is little doubt that OSX engineers are some of the best engineers out there - and they took a leaf out of the open source book (indeed many of them come from Mozilla, Gentoo and other open source projects). RunRev could do worse than learning the same lessons. ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Fixed stack IDs?
Do I remember reading that there is a recent feature / supported / unsupported for permanent stack ids (I know that the ids change as objects are added)? Can't find it anywhere - I'm looking to use a permanent id that will survive stack modifications and (file) name changes. ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: wait for a process in OS X
On Thu, 7 Jun 2007 13:11:10 -0600, Chris Sheffield wrote: This is probably a stupid question. And I swear I've done this in the past, but I can't for the life of me remember how I did it. I need to launch an application from within a script, but I need my script to wait for the application to close before continuing. I've tried launch, open process, and even the shell() function, but in each case the script just continues running. How can I do this? Is my only option to launch it, then wait in a loop and continually check the running processes using shell()? If so, I suppose that's fine. Just kind of a hassle. Well open process is probably better than the shell - open the process (*not* for neither), and then go into a loop where you check the openProcesses as soon as the app quits, the openProcesses will be empty and you can move on. I'd put in a small wait with messages in the loop just to make things a bit cleaner: open process MyApp repeat wait 100 milliseconds with messages if the openProcesses is empty then exit repeat end repeat of course, you may want to insert a bail out condition after a certain amount of time waiting - here's an example that waits for 2 minutes for the launched app to quit before reporting an error: put the milliseconds into tMS open process MyApp repeat wait 100 milliseconds with messages if the openProcesses is empty then put Success into tResult exit repeat end if if (the milliseconds - tMS) (2*60*1000) then put Bailed into tResult exit repeat end if end repeat if tResult is Bailed then answer warning Timed out waiting for the app to close. exit to top end if (or something like that...) Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software, Inc. Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Fixed stack IDs?
On Thu, 7 Jun 2007 21:06:44 +0100, David Bovill wrote: Do I remember reading that there is a recent feature / supported / unsupported for permanent stack ids (I know that the ids change as objects are added)? Can't find it anywhere - I'm looking to use a permanent id that will survive stack modifications and (file) name changes. You could always insert the stack id of the original stack (pre mods) into a custom prop and then check that from that point on... I don't know about permanent stack IDs, though - I remember we *talked* about it, but I don't know if it actually got implemented. Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software, Inc. Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Problem with Browser Sampler Stack in Rev/Mac 2.8.1
Huh! I'm not just getting old, I'm getting blind with it! Would somebody like to teach me how to read? :-[ I'll put the browserEnsure handler in and let you know how it runs. Thanks Jacque and Chris. Bob ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Open Source (was Don't you just wish Rev would do this?)
In my limited industrial experience, it is far better to fall short of an ideal future model that you slowly edging towards than it is to work in a mess. Bob ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Convert from Absolute to Relative Paths
Being redundantly lazy - I often copy scripts around - resetting the itemdelim ensures it woks when pasted into another handler. On 07/06/07, Jim Ault [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Quick programming note: put the itemdelimiter into originalDelim ... set the itemdelimiter to originalDelim is not necessary the way you have structured your function. Rev will consider the itemDelimiter at the start of each handler to be the default itemDelimiter, which is usually a comma. I have a question though... in a subroutine... ie a function that is called inside a handler - are these sort of things reset - or is it only on idle? ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Fixed stack IDs?
Ken Ray wrote: On Thu, 7 Jun 2007 21:06:44 +0100, David Bovill wrote: Do I remember reading that there is a recent feature / supported / unsupported for permanent stack ids (I know that the ids change as objects are added)? Can't find it anywhere - I'm looking to use a permanent id that will survive stack modifications and (file) name changes. You could always insert the stack id of the original stack (pre mods) into a custom prop and then check that from that point on... I don't know about permanent stack IDs, though - I remember we *talked* about it, but I don't know if it actually got implemented. I can't imagine it did. IDs in Rev are integers -- what would happen if I made a stack with an IDE and you made a stack which had the same ID and I gave you my stack to run? Rev might be able to adopt some sort of GUID function, but there's a far simpler solution in hand right now: Stack titles can differ from the stack name, so regardless of whatever I might display for the user, I tend to use the stack name as its ID. Since it need not be visible, it need never change. -- Richard Gaskin Managing Editor, revJournal ___ Rev tips, tutorials and more: http://www.revJournal.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: professor made software with runrev and sold for 2 million dollars
Jacque, you know that you're an inspiration for us all :-D Congratulations on that software! :-D Cheers andre On 6/7/07, J. Landman Gay [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: wayne durden wrote: Hi Jacque! You mean the article text or the underlying teachMac technology? I assume the latter...but not quite sure? Byron Turner is one of my clients and I wrote TeachMac/TeachIT for him. We will start the next version modifications soon. -- Jacqueline Landman Gay | [EMAIL PROTECTED] HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Toolbar Question
Is there a way to hide or relocate the toolbar in the IDE? Since I never leave the IDE the toolbar sometimes gets in the way. Check out the View menu. Toolbar Text Toolbar Icons are both checked by default. Unchecking both hides the Toolbar completely. Unchecking either one makes it smaller. Cheers, Sarah ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: OT: Open Source (was Don't you just wish Rev would do this?)
Chipp- OOPS, not so fast...have you seen the stir GPL 3 is causing? Luckily, GPL3 is still just a draft at this point. There's hope that the FSF folks will still come to their senses, or that folks will just avoid GPL3 and go with Creative Commons licensing instead. http://www.linspire.com/linspire_letter.php http://creativecommons.org/ -- Mark Wieder [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Open Source (was Don't you just wish Rev would do this?)
On Jun 7, 2007, at 12:49 PM, David Bovill wrote: Its easy to say that RunRev is not Adobe, but I would be interested in your thinking as to why RunRev could not make as good a business out of open sourcing core parts of the C++ engine in a similar way to 37Signals or MySQL in its early days. Just to clarify, Ruby on Rails (I assume that is what you are referring to when you mention 37Signals) is a framework built for an already existing development language. Someone could make an open source web application framework in Revolution and would be doing the same thing as 37Signals in this regard, though the underlying language would not be open source. Revolution could even be the folks to do that if they wanted. It appears to me (correct me if I'm wrong) that this would be similar to the Adobe solution. Adobe did not open source Flex Builder, Flex Data Services or Flash itself - just the Flex framework. At least that is what I've read in articles discussing the topic. But personally I don't think the Revolution language is mature enough yet to venture down this road. The language is not extensible so the beauty of the Revolution syntax breaks the moment you write functionality not included in the engine. I think the first step is an extensible language designed by a small group that does have to waste time doing design by committee. Make that available to everyone and then people can start building elegant open source frameworks that will catch on. -- Trevor DeVore Blue Mango Learning Systems www.bluemangolearning.com-www.screensteps.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Convert from Absolute to Relative Paths
Think of them as handler locals that one, are defined as the default at the start of the handler two, can be set/reset affecting only the current handler three, expire when the handler does. This makes calling a series of functions easier, such as set the itemDel to tab --does not matter outside of this handler set the defaultFolder to Volumes/user/Documents/ -- does matter put calcPercent(bytesToK(bytesLoaded(length of imgVar)), freeSpaceOnHD()) into spaceFileWillUse I don't know all the properties that do this, but it is easy to check. Maybe the local setting properties are listed somewhere, but I have not seen it. Jim Ault Las Vegas On 6/7/07 2:01 PM, David Bovill [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Being redundantly lazy - I often copy scripts around - resetting the itemdelim ensures it woks when pasted into another handler. On 07/06/07, Jim Ault [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Quick programming note: put the itemdelimiter into originalDelim ... set the itemdelimiter to originalDelim is not necessary the way you have structured your function. Rev will consider the itemDelimiter at the start of each handler to be the default itemDelimiter, which is usually a comma. I have a question though... in a subroutine... ie a function that is called inside a handler - are these sort of things reset - or is it only on idle? ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Toolbar Question
On 6/7/07 2:48 PM, Sarah Reichelt [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Is there a way to hide or relocate the toolbar in the IDE? Since I never leave the IDE the toolbar sometimes gets in the way. Check out the View menu. Toolbar Text Toolbar Icons are both checked by default. Unchecking both hides the Toolbar completely. Unchecking either one makes it smaller. Also, in the message box type hide menubar show menubar will give you a little more room if you need it. Jim Ault Las Vegas ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: OT: Open Source (was Don't you just wish Rev would do this?)
On 07/06/07, Mark Wieder [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: ttp://www.linspire.com/linspire_letter.php http://creativecommons.org/ I thought of using Creative Commons licenses for software a while back - some people do. But it is not recommended by the lawyers :) ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Open Source (was Don't you just wish Rev would do this?)
On 07/06/07, Trevor DeVore [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Adobe did not open source Flex Builder, Flex Data Services or Flash itself - just the Flex framework. At least that is what I've read in articles discussing the topic. Not sure - but whats missing from this: Adobe plans to release all of the components of the Flex SDK needed to create Flex applications, including the Java source code for the ActionScript and MXML compilers, the ActionScript debugger, and the ActionScript libraries that make up the core Flex framework. Adobe Flex Builder, the Eclipse-based IDE, is not part of the open source announcement. Sounds pretty comprehensive to me? I think the first step is an extensible language designed by a small group that does have to waste time doing design by committee. Make that available to everyone and then people can start building elegant open source frameworks that will catch on. What are you thinking of here Trevor - sounds intriguing - but you lost me :) ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Open Source (was Don't you just wish Rev would do this?)
Trevor DeVore wrote: On Jun 7, 2007, at 12:49 PM, David Bovill wrote: Its easy to say that RunRev is not Adobe, but I would be interested in your thinking as to why RunRev could not make as good a business out of open sourcing core parts of the C++ engine in a similar way to 37Signals or MySQL in its early days. Just to clarify, Ruby on Rails (I assume that is what you are referring to when you mention 37Signals) is a framework built for an already existing development language. I believe Ruby itself is also open source, governed by the LGPL. Someone could make an open source web application framework in Revolution and would be doing the same thing as 37Signals in this regard, though the underlying language would not be open source. Agreed; Andre's done some great work toward that end. And since the engine remains free for CGI use, the differences for most folks are pretty minor. Revolution could even be the folks to do that if they wanted. It appears to me (correct me if I'm wrong) that this would be similar to the Adobe solution. Adobe did not open source Flex Builder, Flex Data Services or Flash itself - just the Flex framework. At least that is what I've read in articles discussing the topic. But personally I don't think the Revolution language is mature enough yet to venture down this road. The language is not extensible so the beauty of the Revolution syntax breaks the moment you write functionality not included in the engine. On the one hand, we could ask whether we might get to that sort of seamless extensibility (SuperCard's Internals Toolbox had it in 1994) more quickly if we had multiple programmers working on it via an open source process. But then on the other hand I can't find two more volunteers to do some pretty lightweight scripting on the MC IDE, so maybe not. ;) -- Richard Gaskin Managing Editor, revJournal ___ Rev tips, tutorials and more: http://www.revJournal.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Open Source (was Don't you just wish Rev would do this?)
On Jun 7, 2007, at 3:34 PM, David Bovill wrote: Not sure - but whats missing from this: Adobe plans to release all of the components of the Flex SDK needed to create Flex applications, including the Java source code for the ActionScript and MXML compilers, the ActionScript debugger, and the ActionScript libraries that make up the core Flex framework. Adobe Flex Builder, the Eclipse-based IDE, is not part of the open source announcement. Sounds pretty comprehensive to me? That is quite a bit of stuff but it is missing Flex Builder (the development environment), Flex Data Services or Flash. As I understand it (again, correct me if I'm wrong) the development environment, a key component (data services) and the primary output (Flash movies) of Flex are closed. Plus the Flash player isn't open either. What I'm getting at here is that key parts are still closed which is what a Rev solution would be like if there was a widely available open source web development framework. I think the first step is an extensible language designed by a small group that does have to waste time doing design by committee. Make that available to everyone and then people can start building elegant open source frameworks that will catch on. What are you thinking of here Trevor - sounds intriguing - but you lost me Currently Revolution is primarily a desktop application environment. The combination of the syntax, how easy it is to create GUI elements and the cross-platform capabilities is a major plus and what draw me towards it. What Revolution lacks is the capability to create your own objects or extend the language in any way. When you start using Revolution on the web the cross-platform nature of the engine and the GUI elements no longer play a role in deciding whether or not Revolution adds value. As a web development tool all that matter are: 1) Language 2) Available frameworks and libraries The GUI is handled by the web browser so interacting with the browser is what your framework and libraries do. Really the language is the primary factor since all frameworks and libraries are built using the language. In Revolution I can interact with lines in a string very elegantly: repeat for each line theLine in thString put item 1 of theLine into theID put item 2 of theLine into theTitle end repeat The problem with the Revolution language now is that I can't create my own xml object and interact with it like I might lines in a string of text: repeat for each node theNode in xml document myXMLDocument put the id attribute of theNode into theID put the title attribute of theNode into theTitle end repeat What this means is that a developer cannot create elegant language based solutions for interacting with XML and databases (two key elements of web development). I think for Revolution to be appealing to web developers the language needs to support the ability to build up custom objects and define our own syntax. The english-like syntax is the beauty of the language but it needs to be made extensible by the developer. Does this make sense? -- Trevor DeVore Blue Mango Learning Systems www.bluemangolearning.com-www.screensteps.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Open Source (was Don't you just wish Rev would do this?)
On 08/06/07, Richard Gaskin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: And since the engine remains free for CGI use, the differences for most folks are pretty minor. Beg to differ :) If the cgi engine had been open - several years back I would have a crack at creating an Apache module. I had quite some difficulties talking sys admins into installing Metacard or Rev engines - so apart from the speed improvements - there was the trust and security factors - no amount of Scott Raney talking to people to the sys admins direct really reassured them - they simply did not trust closed source wierd stuff from a security point of view. I'd think there would be a number of possible routes that people would take up if the CGI engine was open - there is the fastcgi / lightHTTP thing and some nice fast HTTP servers written in C that could be looked at for Web application serving. Right now - its not on the cards for me - but a few years back the developers I new would have put a few months into that - open source style only. But then on the other hand I can't find two more volunteers to do some pretty lightweight scripting on the MC IDE, so maybe not. ;) I'd love to - though as I'm exploring the dual license possibilities I'm not sure how to mix it in with GPL code - any ideas? ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Open Source (was Don't you just wish Rev would do this?)
On Jun 7, 2007, at 4:19 PM, Richard Gaskin wrote: Just to clarify, Ruby on Rails (I assume that is what you are referring to when you mention 37Signals) is a framework built for an already existing development language. I believe Ruby itself is also open source, governed by the LGPL. Yes it is. Someone could make an open source web application framework in Revolution and would be doing the same thing as 37Signals in this regard, though the underlying language would not be open source. Agreed; Andre's done some great work toward that end. Yes he has. And since the engine remains free for CGI use, the differences for most folks are pretty minor. In it's current state I don't believe Revolution can be a major contender in the web space. See my remarks to David concerning the language. Now, if we had a more extensible language then I believe you could combine the Revolution development environment with a Revolution web framework to create some incredible solutions. But personally I don't think the Revolution language is mature enough yet to venture down this road. The language is not extensible so the beauty of the Revolution syntax breaks the moment you write functionality not included in the engine. On the one hand, we could ask whether we might get to that sort of seamless extensibility (SuperCard's Internals Toolbox had it in 1994) more quickly if we had multiple programmers working on it via an open source process. But then on the other hand I can't find two more volunteers to do some pretty lightweight scripting on the MC IDE, so maybe not. ;) My feeling is that the core language has to be designed first and then you can start getting community involvement. I think that individuals or small groups are more efficient at designing something that communities can then take and build upon. Give us an extensible language and lots of things can happen. -- Trevor DeVore Blue Mango Learning Systems www.bluemangolearning.com-www.screensteps.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Open Source (was Don't you just wish Rev would do this?)
On 08/06/07, Trevor DeVore [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Jun 7, 2007, at 3:34 PM, David Bovill wrote: Not sure - but whats missing from this: Adobe plans to release all of the components of the Flex SDK needed to create Flex applications, including the Java source code for the ActionScript and MXML compilers, the ActionScript debugger, and the ActionScript libraries that make up the core Flex framework. Adobe Flex Builder, the Eclipse-based IDE, is not part of the open source announcement. Sounds pretty comprehensive to me? That is quite a bit of stuff but it is missing Flex Builder (the development environment), Flex Builder is there and so are the compilers - I am not sure what the data services are... but in general I agree that they have carefully chosen to keep hold of some strategic parts of the picture while open sourcing enough to keep them in the good books of the community. I still don't quite get what is being held onto with the latest moves though. . Does this make sense? Yes it does and I totally agree. If the CGI engine were open you could look at that. RunRev could retain the copyright and dual licence it, and if they asked for the copyright on all the new submissions - then they could look to incorporate any bits that worked for them into the standalone engine. I remember Scott Raney saying that the engine was basically object oriented ages ago, and that he had to drop plans to take it further as there was no demand back then. One way of thinking about it is to have the ability to create language wrappers around otherwise obscure syntax of other langauges and frameworks? I've been trying to do that with web services by creating objects and referring to properties of the object. Having (global) objects that do not require GUI elements would help a lot and simplify the syntax too. Would there not be a path to do this which builds on Andres work and uses socket or pipes to existing frameworks in the short term - perhaps using the .NET DLR stuff to create a language parser in the longer term? ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Problem with Browser Sampler Stack in Rev/Mac 2.8.1
Just for the record, this displays beeootifully on my Mac Mini. The standalone works fine (not too heavy). Add a button and an image called Browser Rect ** to your stack first: -- CARD SCRIPT: local sBrowserId = # Opens the browser and sets initial url and position. command browserInit local tBrowserId put revBrowserOpen(the windowId of this stack, http://www.google.com;) into \ tBrowserId --browserEnsure tBrowserId --TEMP REMOVED put tBrowserId into sBrowserId --revBrowserset sBrowserId, rect, the rect of graphic Browser Rect of me revBrowserset sBrowserId, rect, the rect of image Browser Rect of me --** revBrowserset sBrowserId, scrollbars, true end browserInit - BUTTON: on mouseUp call browserInit of this card end mouseUp -- You might not believe it, but the word graphic had me foxed for a while. Bob ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: WAR ON BUGS [WAS Open Source (was Don't you just wish Rev would do this?)]
At 4:12 PM -0300 6/7/07, Bob Warren wrote: 1. RR should provide feature releases on a regular basis. We pay for them. And we'll be getting them. It's in the roadmap, and Kevin is sticking to it. 2. We do not pay for bugfixes. The manufacturer is just putting right what he has done wrong. We didn't pay for bug fixes. Runrev extended their free upgrade policy to customers for over a year while the WOB was going on. The other day, I put forward a model under the thread A glimpse of the future which was totally ignored. I must therefore presume that in the opinion of all I don't think we're ignoring you, we're just exhausted from the negative. I feel Rev has emerged from a dark buggy period into the light. We've had a few 'Rev outa do this' emails lately where the poster seemed to go on and on and complain that Rev isn't doing enough to please him, and he takes the stand of 'demanding customer'. Arguments about 'bug free is impossible' vs 'it must be bug free, screw the new features' ensues. These threads go on for weeks, then die down, then another person (who didn't read the ones before) takes over. (I won't name names...) I will mention Bill Marriot was once a big complainer (with good reason)... but the difference is that he joined the Rev team, started a 'War On Bugs!' and made a difference. I'm glad Rev exists, and if a few bumps along the road are there, I won't complain as long as I know there's work being done on my wishes. They are not Microsoft and cannot deliver the manpower in the same way. Actually they have enlisted many of us in their efforts to improve the product, and I think that's far better than Microsoft. How can you help? When you see a bug, take the time to describe it enough to repeat it, or make a movie, or demo stack and send all of it to Quality Control. It will get fixed. I've seen it happen in days. sqb -- stephen barncard s a n f r a n c i s c o - - - - - - - - - - - - ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
