Re: [Vo]:Quality control in cold fusion.
Rossi has stated his catalyst is not homogeneous, so it must be heterogeneous where the nuclear process happens between the contact surface of the iron oxide nano-particle and the nickel oxide nano-particle. The crystal structure of the nickel oxide is too dense and perfect for hydrogen to penetrate the surface of the NiO nano-particle. Any interaction with hydrogen is at the surface. On the other hand, the iron oxide (Fe2O3) nano-particle is very porous and allows hydrogen to enter to great depth. In the many crystal defects therein, cold plasma is formed. At the surface interface between the iron and nickel nano-particle, the conditions are right for a nuclear process to occur. I speculate that the large electrostatic attractive forces at the surface of the NiO nano-particle and the magnetic orientation character of the iron oxide nano-particle (Fe2O3) interact in some way to precipitate a situation where nuclear fission of the cold plasma happens. The key to this process is atomic defects in condensed matter where highly dense cold plasma of hydrogen can accumulate. This is the role that Fe2O3 serves. Remember that nickel is not critical to the Rossi process. Many other metals can serve almost as well including copper. On Thu, Apr 14, 2011 at 3:46 PM, Peter Gluck wrote: > i would not ask the secrets of a good friend. But about his performances > yes! And therefore I knew that Ni-H works, therefore Rossi's E-Cat is real > and..works. > > Catalitically active oxides work at the interface with the real catalyst in > heterogeneous catalysis. > > Do you say NiO is not reduced to Ni and water in the conditions > of the E-cat? > My guess is that Rossi has a very good method of activation of Ni , this > can-as I already said comprise an additive. But this additive is a > promoter, not the catalyst per se. > Despite the fact that I was one of the first to say that cold fusion is > similar to catalysis and has to learn from catalysis- > http://www.lenr-canr.org/acrobat/GluckPunderstand.pdf > I don't think that Rossi has a non-nickel catalyst. Catalysing what? > For the time given showing that you are original and different, even more > than you really are. Vederemo! > > Peter > > On Thu, Apr 14, 2011 at 10:12 PM, Axil Axil wrote: > >> Piantelii stated he will hide the secret of Ni-H reaction, even from a >> good friend. >> >> >> >> Rossi has denied every mode of Ni catalytic activity except oxides. >> >> >> >> NiO-H has a role in many hydrogen based catalytic reactions with a highly >> reactive nano-particle surface. And oxide based nano-particle catalysts are >> the next big thing in chemistry. >> >> >> >> NiO provides a possible evolutionary transition between what Piantelii did >> and what Rossi is doing; from a Ni bar surface treatment to nano-particles. >> Lipid based fabrication and production of Fe2O3 is indicated in Rossi’s >> patent; Ni2O3 is compatible with Fe2O3. This is consistent and compatible >> with Ni2O3 formation in Piantelii’s annealing process. >> >> >> >> Piantelii surface treatment of his nickel bar suggests Ni2O3 oxide >> formation where annealing is important. Ni2O3 formation on NiO can be judged >> by a color shift from green to black/green on the surface of a Nickel bar. >> Piantelii stated that he can tell if a bar will work by looking at it. >> >> On Thu, Apr 14, 2011 at 2:14 PM, Peter Gluck wrote: >> >>> Piantelii is my good friend but I do not remember that he has worked with >>> nickel oxide. >>> The problem with NiO is that it will be reduced with H2 and the formed >>> water will build a great pressure in the cell. Not a problem that cannot be >>> solved- e.g. the Cincinnati zircoanium group cell I have worked with was >>> also at a high pressure and we had no accidents. >>> But why NiO? >>> peter >>> >>> >>> On Thu, Apr 14, 2011 at 7:31 PM, Axil Axil wrote: >>> On Thu, Apr 14, 2011 at 12:16 PM, Peter Gluck wrote: > Perhaps you are right regarding Rossi's quality control efforts, > but I want to ask you- on what basis are you speaking > about NiO and not Ni? > > As regarding Pd based clasical LENR/CF a total characterization > of say Pd cathodes is much too complex- beyond what is called > usually quality controll. Terrible difficulties of describing > metallurgy, morphology, granularity etc.We have to appreciate the heroic > efforts > and work of so many good scientists, I think > > peter > > > > On Thu, Apr 14, 2011 at 7:03 PM, Axil Axil wrote: > >> Quality control in cold fusion. >> >> Cold fusion has suffered from little or no quality control on the >> materials used in its reactions. >> >> >> >> I believe that Rossi’s big accomplishment is bringing quality control >> to the fabrication of his materials. >> >> >> >> After Rossi finally discovered what factors made his catalyst work, he >> established a
RE: [Vo]:Quality control in cold fusion.
Horace's comments indicate that a lot of overlapping R&D from many sources can be relevant to LENR, even without Arata's work being specifically featured. BTW - Takahashi made a presentation on his Arata replications at the American Chemical Society meeting in Anaheim CA recently (last month). The paper is not yet up on the LENR-CANR site, but it probably will be - since others are there . but anyway he stated explicitly in his presentation that Brian Ahern's nanopowders outperformed anything they had tested. These are based on oxidized glassy metals, as in the Arata formula. I doubt seriously that Rossi did this unless it too was inadvertent - which means that his results may be less than optimum - if that is remotely possible. . not to mention that Rossi may indeed be the luckiest man on earth . or else he is the real John Titor, from the year 2036 :-) Na-Nu Na-Nu and Warm Regards, JB From: Horace Heffner Subject: Re: [Vo]:Quality control in cold fusion. I should have noted some of my comments on metallic glasses can be found here: http://www.mail-archive.com/vortex-l@eskimo.com/msg41599.html http://www.mail-archive.com/vortex-l@eskimo.com/msg43171.html http://www.mail-archive.com/vortex-l@eskimo.com/msg29520.html http://www.mail-archive.com/vortex-l@eskimo.com/msg33409.html http://www.mail-archive.com/vortex-l@eskimo.com/msg33409.html http://www.mail-archive.com/vortex-l@eskimo.com/msg41982.html http://www.mail-archive.com/vortex-l@eskimo.com/msg38428.html Best regards, Horace Heffner http://www.mtaonline.net/~hheffner/
Re: [Vo]:Quality control in cold fusion.
I should have noted some of my comments on metallic glasses can be found here: http://www.mail-archive.com/vortex-l@eskimo.com/msg41599.html http://www.mail-archive.com/vortex-l@eskimo.com/msg43171.html http://www.mail-archive.com/vortex-l@eskimo.com/msg29520.html http://www.mail-archive.com/vortex-l@eskimo.com/msg33409.html http://www.mail-archive.com/vortex-l@eskimo.com/msg33409.html http://www.mail-archive.com/vortex-l@eskimo.com/msg41982.html http://www.mail-archive.com/vortex-l@eskimo.com/msg38428.html Best regards, Horace Heffner http://www.mtaonline.net/~hheffner/
Re: [Vo]:Quality control in cold fusion.
Horace sez: ... > As to Rossi, his quality control rested with the only person with the skills > to produce his nickel catalyst mix, an old man in his 80's working away on > an old machine. My imagination sees this happening in a poorly lit room > somewhere in a decaying rustic European building. That's the way it should > be in the film version anyway. 8^) ...a decaying rustic European building out in the country. A barn. With an occasional pigeon dropping added to the mixture. Ah! The catalyst! Regards Steven Vincent Johnson www.OrionWorks.com www.zazzle.com/orionworks
Re: [Vo]:Quality control in cold fusion.
On Apr 14, 2011, at 8:16 AM, Peter Gluck wrote: As regarding Pd based clasical LENR/CF a total characterization of say Pd cathodes is much too complex- beyond what is called usually quality controll. Terrible difficulties of describing metallurgy, morphology, granularity etc.We have to appreciate the heroic efforts and work of so many good scientists, I think peter Yes, the the efforts by many were heroic and admirable. Some of the best electrochemists in the world have worked on LENR, including Bockris and Fleischmann himself. Extremely clean sealed experiments have been performed. I recall experiments with single crystals of pure Pd. Despite rigorously clean experiments, no practical method was found. On the other hand, comparatively dirty open cell codeposition experiments produced more reliable results. I think this is due to the variability of the lattice conditions required to create some small amount of effective environments. For this reason, I think impurities are probably key, and the highly variable internal conditions of metallic glasses should be useful. As to Rossi, his quality control rested with the only person with the skills to produce his nickel catalyst mix, an old man in his 80's working away on an old machine. My imagination sees this happening in a poorly lit room somewhere in a decaying rustic European building. That's the way it should be in the film version anyway. 8^) Best regards, Horace Heffner http://www.mtaonline.net/~hheffner/
Re: [Vo]:Quality control in cold fusion.
i would not ask the secrets of a good friend. But about his performances yes! And therefore I knew that Ni-H works, therefore Rossi's E-Cat is real and..works. Catalitically active oxides work at the interface with the real catalyst in heterogeneous catalysis. Do you say NiO is not reduced to Ni and water in the conditions of the E-cat? My guess is that Rossi has a very good method of activation of Ni , this can-as I already said comprise an additive. But this additive is a promoter, not the catalyst per se. Despite the fact that I was one of the first to say that cold fusion is similar to catalysis and has to learn from catalysis- http://www.lenr-canr.org/acrobat/GluckPunderstand.pdf I don't think that Rossi has a non-nickel catalyst. Catalysing what? For the time given showing that you are original and different, even more than you really are. Vederemo! Peter On Thu, Apr 14, 2011 at 10:12 PM, Axil Axil wrote: > Piantelii stated he will hide the secret of Ni-H reaction, even from a good > friend. > > > > Rossi has denied every mode of Ni catalytic activity except oxides. > > > > NiO-H has a role in many hydrogen based catalytic reactions with a highly > reactive nano-particle surface. And oxide based nano-particle catalysts are > the next big thing in chemistry. > > > > NiO provides a possible evolutionary transition between what Piantelii did > and what Rossi is doing; from a Ni bar surface treatment to nano-particles. > Lipid based fabrication and production of Fe2O3 is indicated in Rossi’s > patent; Ni2O3 is compatible with Fe2O3. This is consistent and compatible > with Ni2O3 formation in Piantelii’s annealing process. > > > > Piantelii surface treatment of his nickel bar suggests Ni2O3 oxide > formation where annealing is important. Ni2O3 formation on NiO can be judged > by a color shift from green to black/green on the surface of a Nickel bar. > Piantelii stated that he can tell if a bar will work by looking at it. > > On Thu, Apr 14, 2011 at 2:14 PM, Peter Gluck wrote: > >> Piantelii is my good friend but I do not remember that he has worked with >> nickel oxide. >> The problem with NiO is that it will be reduced with H2 and the formed >> water will build a great pressure in the cell. Not a problem that cannot be >> solved- e.g. the Cincinnati zircoanium group cell I have worked with was >> also at a high pressure and we had no accidents. >> But why NiO? >> peter >> >> >> On Thu, Apr 14, 2011 at 7:31 PM, Axil Axil wrote: >> >>> >>> >>> On Thu, Apr 14, 2011 at 12:16 PM, Peter Gluck wrote: >>> Perhaps you are right regarding Rossi's quality control efforts, but I want to ask you- on what basis are you speaking about NiO and not Ni? As regarding Pd based clasical LENR/CF a total characterization of say Pd cathodes is much too complex- beyond what is called usually quality controll. Terrible difficulties of describing metallurgy, morphology, granularity etc.We have to appreciate the heroic efforts and work of so many good scientists, I think peter On Thu, Apr 14, 2011 at 7:03 PM, Axil Axil wrote: > Quality control in cold fusion. > > Cold fusion has suffered from little or no quality control on the > materials used in its reactions. > > > > I believe that Rossi’s big accomplishment is bringing quality control > to the fabrication of his materials. > > > > After Rossi finally discovered what factors made his catalyst work, he > established a specification that optimized those factors in the production > of all subsequent materials. > > > > Nanoparticle characterization is the mechanism that he would have used > to meet this quality control specification. > > > > Nanoparticle characterization is required to establish quality control > over nanoparticle synthesis and to insure each separate nanoparticle meets > performance specifications. > > > > The surface coating of nanoparticles is crucial to determining their > properties. In particular, the surface coating can regulate stability and > dictate reaction performance. > > For example, when NiO Nanoparticles are fabricated in their billions > some are functional, some don’t work and some are great. > > This find granularity is not possible in the manufacturing of rods or > plates that have be the standard in cold fusion material formats. > > When Rossi moved his product to a nano-technology format, he gained the > advantage of being able to impose a rigid quality discipline. > > Fully automated nanoparticle characterization is the process that > looks at the size shape and surface characteristics of each individual NiO > Nanoparticle to determine if that particle is optimized for catalytic > operation. > > In this process, each nanoparticle is individually tested for >
Re: [Vo]:Quality control in cold fusion.
Piantelii stated he will hide the secret of Ni-H reaction, even from a good friend. Rossi has denied every mode of Ni catalytic activity except oxides. NiO-H has a role in many hydrogen based catalytic reactions with a highly reactive nano-particle surface. And oxide based nano-particle catalysts are the next big thing in chemistry. NiO provides a possible evolutionary transition between what Piantelii did and what Rossi is doing; from a Ni bar surface treatment to nano-particles. Lipid based fabrication and production of Fe2O3 is indicated in Rossi’s patent; Ni2O3 is compatible with Fe2O3. This is consistent and compatible with Ni2O3 formation in Piantelii’s annealing process. Piantelii surface treatment of his nickel bar suggests Ni2O3 oxide formation where annealing is important. Ni2O3 formation on NiO can be judged by a color shift from green to black/green on the surface of a Nickel bar. Piantelii stated that he can tell if a bar will work by looking at it. On Thu, Apr 14, 2011 at 2:14 PM, Peter Gluck wrote: > Piantelii is my good friend but I do not remember that he has worked with > nickel oxide. > The problem with NiO is that it will be reduced with H2 and the formed > water will build a great pressure in the cell. Not a problem that cannot be > solved- e.g. the Cincinnati zircoanium group cell I have worked with was > also at a high pressure and we had no accidents. > But why NiO? > peter > > > On Thu, Apr 14, 2011 at 7:31 PM, Axil Axil wrote: > >> >> >> On Thu, Apr 14, 2011 at 12:16 PM, Peter Gluck wrote: >> >>> Perhaps you are right regarding Rossi's quality control efforts, >>> but I want to ask you- on what basis are you speaking >>> about NiO and not Ni? >>> >>> As regarding Pd based clasical LENR/CF a total characterization >>> of say Pd cathodes is much too complex- beyond what is called >>> usually quality controll. Terrible difficulties of describing metallurgy, >>> morphology, granularity etc.We have to appreciate the heroic efforts >>> and work of so many good scientists, I think >>> >>> peter >>> >>> >>> >>> On Thu, Apr 14, 2011 at 7:03 PM, Axil Axil wrote: >>> Quality control in cold fusion. Cold fusion has suffered from little or no quality control on the materials used in its reactions. I believe that Rossi’s big accomplishment is bringing quality control to the fabrication of his materials. After Rossi finally discovered what factors made his catalyst work, he established a specification that optimized those factors in the production of all subsequent materials. Nanoparticle characterization is the mechanism that he would have used to meet this quality control specification. Nanoparticle characterization is required to establish quality control over nanoparticle synthesis and to insure each separate nanoparticle meets performance specifications. The surface coating of nanoparticles is crucial to determining their properties. In particular, the surface coating can regulate stability and dictate reaction performance. For example, when NiO Nanoparticles are fabricated in their billions some are functional, some don’t work and some are great. This find granularity is not possible in the manufacturing of rods or plates that have be the standard in cold fusion material formats. When Rossi moved his product to a nano-technology format, he gained the advantage of being able to impose a rigid quality discipline. Fully automated nanoparticle characterization is the process that looks at the size shape and surface characteristics of each individual NiO Nanoparticle to determine if that particle is optimized for catalytic operation. In this process, each nanoparticle is individually tested for activity, and if acceptable is then selected. All below grade material is rejected and recycled back for refabrication where it restarts at the beginning of the processing cycle. This precise control of quality of the Rossi catalyst is what makes the Cat-E stand out above its competition. >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Dr. Peter Gluck >>> Cluj, Romania >>> http://egooutpeters.blogspot.com >>> >>> >> I posted basis for NiO in the "spculations" thread as per Piantelli's >> work. >> >> >> >> http://www.mail-archive.com/vortex-l@eskimo.com/msg44574.html >> >> >> >> Regards >> >> >> > > > > -- > Dr. Peter Gluck > Cluj, Romania > http://egooutpeters.blogspot.com > >
RE: [Vo]:Quality control in cold fusion.
Not sure if this helps or not, but many metal oxide surfaces present a "Lawandy-type" dielectric for accumulation of ultra dense hydrogen IRH. This has been seen on zirconia, iron-oxide and nickel-oxide. This paper by Miley is very important. www.lenr-canr.org/acrobat/MileyGHclusterswi.pdf From: Peter Gluck Pianteli is my good friend but I do not remember that he has worked with nickel oxide. The problem with NiO is that it will be reduced with H2 and the formed water will build a great pressure in the cell. Not a problem that cannot be solved- e.g. the Cincinnati zirconium group cell I have worked with was also at a high pressure and we had no accidents. But why NiO?
Re: [Vo]:Quality control in cold fusion.
Piantelii is my good friend but I do not remember that he has worked with nickel oxide. The problem with NiO is that it will be reduced with H2 and the formed water will build a great pressure in the cell. Not a problem that cannot be solved- e.g. the Cincinnati zircoanium group cell I have worked with was also at a high pressure and we had no accidents. But why NiO? peter On Thu, Apr 14, 2011 at 7:31 PM, Axil Axil wrote: > > > On Thu, Apr 14, 2011 at 12:16 PM, Peter Gluck wrote: > >> Perhaps you are right regarding Rossi's quality control efforts, >> but I want to ask you- on what basis are you speaking >> about NiO and not Ni? >> >> As regarding Pd based clasical LENR/CF a total characterization >> of say Pd cathodes is much too complex- beyond what is called >> usually quality controll. Terrible difficulties of describing metallurgy, >> morphology, granularity etc.We have to appreciate the heroic efforts >> and work of so many good scientists, I think >> >> peter >> >> >> >> On Thu, Apr 14, 2011 at 7:03 PM, Axil Axil wrote: >> >>> Quality control in cold fusion. >>> >>> Cold fusion has suffered from little or no quality control on the >>> materials used in its reactions. >>> >>> >>> >>> I believe that Rossi’s big accomplishment is bringing quality control to >>> the fabrication of his materials. >>> >>> >>> >>> After Rossi finally discovered what factors made his catalyst work, he >>> established a specification that optimized those factors in the production >>> of all subsequent materials. >>> >>> >>> >>> Nanoparticle characterization is the mechanism that he would have used to >>> meet this quality control specification. >>> >>> >>> >>> Nanoparticle characterization is required to establish quality control >>> over nanoparticle synthesis and to insure each separate nanoparticle meets >>> performance specifications. >>> >>> >>> >>> The surface coating of nanoparticles is crucial to determining their >>> properties. In particular, the surface coating can regulate stability and >>> dictate reaction performance. >>> >>> For example, when NiO Nanoparticles are fabricated in their billions some >>> are functional, some don’t work and some are great. >>> >>> This find granularity is not possible in the manufacturing of rods or >>> plates that have be the standard in cold fusion material formats. >>> >>> When Rossi moved his product to a nano-technology format, he gained the >>> advantage of being able to impose a rigid quality discipline. >>> >>> Fully automated nanoparticle characterization is the process that looks >>> at the size shape and surface characteristics of each individual NiO >>> Nanoparticle to determine if that particle is optimized for catalytic >>> operation. >>> >>> In this process, each nanoparticle is individually tested for activity, >>> and if acceptable is then selected. All below grade material is rejected and >>> recycled back for refabrication where it restarts at the beginning of the >>> processing cycle. >>> >>> This precise control of quality of the Rossi catalyst is what makes the >>> Cat-E stand out above its competition. >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> Dr. Peter Gluck >> Cluj, Romania >> http://egooutpeters.blogspot.com >> >> > I posted basis for NiO in the "spculations" thread as per Piantelli's work. > > > > http://www.mail-archive.com/vortex-l@eskimo.com/msg44574.html > > > > Regards > > > -- Dr. Peter Gluck Cluj, Romania http://egooutpeters.blogspot.com
Re: [Vo]:Quality control in cold fusion.
On Thu, Apr 14, 2011 at 12:16 PM, Peter Gluck wrote: > Perhaps you are right regarding Rossi's quality control efforts, > but I want to ask you- on what basis are you speaking > about NiO and not Ni? > > As regarding Pd based clasical LENR/CF a total characterization > of say Pd cathodes is much too complex- beyond what is called > usually quality controll. Terrible difficulties of describing metallurgy, > morphology, granularity etc.We have to appreciate the heroic efforts > and work of so many good scientists, I think > > peter > > > > On Thu, Apr 14, 2011 at 7:03 PM, Axil Axil wrote: > >> Quality control in cold fusion. >> >> Cold fusion has suffered from little or no quality control on the >> materials used in its reactions. >> >> >> >> I believe that Rossi’s big accomplishment is bringing quality control to >> the fabrication of his materials. >> >> >> >> After Rossi finally discovered what factors made his catalyst work, he >> established a specification that optimized those factors in the production >> of all subsequent materials. >> >> >> >> Nanoparticle characterization is the mechanism that he would have used to >> meet this quality control specification. >> >> >> >> Nanoparticle characterization is required to establish quality control >> over nanoparticle synthesis and to insure each separate nanoparticle meets >> performance specifications. >> >> >> >> The surface coating of nanoparticles is crucial to determining their >> properties. In particular, the surface coating can regulate stability and >> dictate reaction performance. >> >> For example, when NiO Nanoparticles are fabricated in their billions some >> are functional, some don’t work and some are great. >> >> This find granularity is not possible in the manufacturing of rods or >> plates that have be the standard in cold fusion material formats. >> >> When Rossi moved his product to a nano-technology format, he gained the >> advantage of being able to impose a rigid quality discipline. >> >> Fully automated nanoparticle characterization is the process that looks >> at the size shape and surface characteristics of each individual NiO >> Nanoparticle to determine if that particle is optimized for catalytic >> operation. >> >> In this process, each nanoparticle is individually tested for activity, >> and if acceptable is then selected. All below grade material is rejected and >> recycled back for refabrication where it restarts at the beginning of the >> processing cycle. >> >> This precise control of quality of the Rossi catalyst is what makes the >> Cat-E stand out above its competition. >> >> >> > > > > -- > Dr. Peter Gluck > Cluj, Romania > http://egooutpeters.blogspot.com > > I posted basis for NiO in the "spculations" thread as per Piantelli's work. http://www.mail-archive.com/vortex-l@eskimo.com/msg44574.html Regards
Re: [Vo]:Quality control in cold fusion.
Perhaps you are right regarding Rossi's quality control efforts, but I want to ask you- on what basis are you speaking about NiO and not Ni? As regarding Pd based clasical LENR/CF a total characterization of say Pd cathodes is much too complex- beyond what is called usually quality controll. Terrible difficulties of describing metallurgy, morphology, granularity etc.We have to appreciate the heroic efforts and work of so many good scientists, I think peter On Thu, Apr 14, 2011 at 7:03 PM, Axil Axil wrote: > Quality control in cold fusion. > > Cold fusion has suffered from little or no quality control on the materials > used in its reactions. > > > > I believe that Rossi’s big accomplishment is bringing quality control to > the fabrication of his materials. > > > > After Rossi finally discovered what factors made his catalyst work, he > established a specification that optimized those factors in the production > of all subsequent materials. > > > > Nanoparticle characterization is the mechanism that he would have used to > meet this quality control specification. > > > > Nanoparticle characterization is required to establish quality control over > nanoparticle synthesis and to insure each separate nanoparticle meets > performance specifications. > > > > The surface coating of nanoparticles is crucial to determining their > properties. In particular, the surface coating can regulate stability and > dictate reaction performance. > > For example, when NiO Nanoparticles are fabricated in their billions some > are functional, some don’t work and some are great. > > This find granularity is not possible in the manufacturing of rods or > plates that have be the standard in cold fusion material formats. > > When Rossi moved his product to a nano-technology format, he gained the > advantage of being able to impose a rigid quality discipline. > > Fully automated nanoparticle characterization is the process that looks > at the size shape and surface characteristics of each individual NiO > Nanoparticle to determine if that particle is optimized for catalytic > operation. > > In this process, each nanoparticle is individually tested for activity, > and if acceptable is then selected. All below grade material is rejected and > recycled back for refabrication where it restarts at the beginning of the > processing cycle. > > This precise control of quality of the Rossi catalyst is what makes the > Cat-E stand out above its competition. > > > -- Dr. Peter Gluck Cluj, Romania http://egooutpeters.blogspot.com
