Re: [Vo]:Another Defkalion statement on PESN
What do you think the catalyst is at this time? From: Axil Axil janap...@gmail.com To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2011 1:46 AM Subject: Re: [Vo]:Another Defkalion statement on PESN Ever since one of our number “noone noone” posted this http://www.mail-archive.com/vortex-l@eskimo.com/msg49026.html I have been concerned that I have let Rossi’s secret out of the bag to his detriment and that secret has been used by Defkalion Green Technologies to reverse engineer Rossi’s reactor core. Rossi just can’t keep his mouth shut and his loose lips has had many opportunities to let hints about his technology out during working conversations with highly knowledgeable and competent Defkalion engineering personnel to a point where reverse engineering his system is possible. I know his many disclosures have comforted me greatly in my curiosity about the most intimate inner workings of his system Rossi’s intellectual property rights are also weak at best and there is a strong possibility that someone else might well claim payment from Defkalion for intellectual property associated with Rossi’s system. For a company in Defkalions position, it is good due diligence business practice to attempt to reverse engineer Rossi’s system in lieu of paying a large royalty for his secret. Defkalion may have gotten their own homegrown version of Rossi’s core working well enough to encourage them into a delaying strategy to string out the payment of Rossi’s royalty disbursement as long as progress in their reverse engineering efforts showed promise. This payment delay reached a point where eventually Rossi through in the towel in frustration over doing business with Defkalion. With the passage of time and concerted effort to understand Rossi’s technology, Defkalion may come up with a competitive alternative to Rossi’s system; only time will tell. Best regards, Axil On Wed, Aug 10, 2011 at 2:05 PM, Alan J Fletcher a...@well.com wrote: http://pesn.com/2011/08/10/9501891_Defkalion_Responds_in_Support_of_Rossi/ Sorry if it's already here ... I looked for it. Hard to well if it's actually conflicting with what Rossi as said (technically). They say it's built AROUND the core (not that they have one), AND that they have (are?) set up a production line to make the cores if and when Rossi reveals the secret ingredient.
[Vo]:How to present arguments against cold fusion critics
Hallo! I have discussed on other forum about cold fusion. I have, however some problems with arguments, because those critics used very powerful sounding, but probably false argument, that if cold fusion is real, why it is published on B-rate scientific journals? I tried to explain, that they are not necessary B-rate journals, but respectful and normal scientific publications, where the basic research is published. However presenting this argument is rather difficult, because opposition thinks that only Science and Nature are A-rate journals, and I do not have extensive knowledge on cold fusion research. Therefore if someone knows some high impact factor journals that has published recent could fusion findings, I would appreciate to have some examples. Also I would like to have some advice how to deal with this kind of arguments. Certainly discussing on the sociology of science is rather difficult approach, because sociological arguments require lots of text and they still remain vague and difficult to understand. Although, I think that it is unavoidable, because Science and Nature does not like cold fusion much. Also Science Magazine blundered with bubble fusion, therefore I think that it is extra alerted to publish anything controversial on the field. On the other hand as they make money from scientific breakthroughs, they are eagerly waiting final cold fusion breakthrough. Because cold fusion will sell, a lot! In summary, how do I disproof claim that all cold fusion researchers are crackpotters and all magazines that publish cold fusion are B-rate or less journals? –Jouni
[Vo]:Musical Open Letter to Andrea Rossi
Not to be missed! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MNwOpSHNIQ4 T
RE: [Vo]:On a Quixotic mission
I accidentally hit the send button before I was complexly finished composing the original post. Let me follow up my take on sam. As far as I can tell Sam presents no actual evidence in his post as to why he thinks BLP Mills is a scam operation. What he does state, and this is quite revealing, is that he is upset over the fact that three of his own science articles posted out to Wikipedia had been removed whereas Dr. Mills posts were not. IOW, Sam sounds like a crank extraordinaire to me, and a rather spiteful one at that. From Daniel: I guess Witch Doctor is right about BLP. ;) In regards to prior Witch Doctor commentary on BLP, I don't believe they have ever stated anything that implies Mills Co. is a scam operation. Far from it. As I understand it, in all prior critiques their main concern has always been that from their perspective BLP's CQM theory was inaccurate, and that when those inaccuracies presumably become more obvious to all involved it may cause a lot of internal turmoil. (This perspective has also been speculated within Vortex as well.) This combined with that fact that from the WD perspective the company has not made sufficient progress in capitalizing on the phenomenon they have detected, especially considering the number of years BLP has been working in the field. That does not in any way constitute statements that imply that BLP is a scam operation, nor that they haven't detected excess heat. I would suspect that BLP has most certainly detected excess heat. It's more a matter that they have yet to find a way to engineer a process that can commercialize on their findings. The implication I take from their commentary is that perhaps inaccuracies within the CQM theory itself may be directly/indirectly responsible in hampering commercial progress, but that is only speculation on my part. Disclaimer: All of WD commentary is unsubstantiated in traditional scientific terms. Regards, Steven Vincent Johnson www.OrionWorks.com www.zazzle.com/orionworks
Re: [Vo]:How to present arguments against cold fusion critics
This is a reasonable question, from my point of view as a cold fusion fan, serving as a unqualified scientific layman who has been offering painstaking, objective reviews of cold fusion papers since December, 1996 -- specializing in looking at all the common sense, nitty gritty details in the papers. Publication in any journal is not the issue now, but publication in a blog with full details and sharing of all public feedback without editing or censorship on the same blog, of any experiment that always finds some anomaly of excess heat, radiations, transmutations, and large isotopic shifts, however humble the finding, that is independently reproduced by at least one other lab and reported fully on the same blog, would be enough to lead to more replications by other labs, and accelerating progress from the fully shared public feedback. Any such blog would be a scientific journal. It is time to stop the biased, self-defeating practice of labeling and excluding participation of critics by calling them pathological -- if anyone who chooses to be a prominent player in public discussions wants to encourage participation by a wide spectrum of motivated, qualified other players. It is up to each player to maintain a high level of courtesy and clarity, for the huge mutual benefit for humanity. Within mutual service, Rich Murray rmfor...@gmail.com 505-819-7388
[Vo]:Re: [H-Ni_Fusion] Where's That Smoking Gun?
Better to invite Rossi to make a complete public confession -- then he can start making the runs of blogs, TV talk shows, lectures, videos, books, feature movies -- this is a potential bonanza, a ton of fun, while setting a good example for all humanity -- would add to public interest in and openness to cold fusion and other challenging frontiers of research. Shaming, blaiming, and punishing people for mistakes increases the fear level in society and thus increases the level of defensiveness, impairing communication and collaboration, and increasing secrecy, confusion, deception, and selfishness. We are free to exercise out inborn right to the glory of infinite creativity, for each is all of single entire unified creative fractal hyperinfinity. Within mutual service, Rich Murray rmfor...@gmail.com 505-819-7388 On Thu, Aug 11, 2011 at 2:14 AM, Craig Dec decrai...@yahoo.com wrote: ** In the who-done-it forensics of placing the smoking gun of fraud, deliberate or unintentional, in Rossi's hands it seems every attempt has come up one gram shy. We've got blood spatter evidence all over the place, powder burns on his hands and the place is piled high with corpses. But where's that smoking gun?? __._,_.___ Reply to senderdecrai...@yahoo.com?subject=Re%3A%20Where%27s%20That%20Smoking%20Gun%3F| Reply to grouph-ni_fus...@yahoogroups.com?subject=Re%3A%20Where%27s%20That%20Smoking%20Gun%3F| Reply via web posthttp://groups.yahoo.com/group/H-Ni_Fusion/post;_ylc=X3oDMTJwbXJzaTVkBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzczMzY0NDQwBGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTA4MzI2OQRtc2dJZAM1OTUEc2VjA2Z0cgRzbGsDcnBseQRzdGltZQMxMzEzMDU0MDUy?act=replymessageNum=595| Start a New Topichttp://groups.yahoo.com/group/H-Ni_Fusion/post;_ylc=X3oDMTJmN2djaWFlBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzczMzY0NDQwBGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTA4MzI2OQRzZWMDZnRyBHNsawNudHBjBHN0aW1lAzEzMTMwNTQwNTI- Messages in this topichttp://groups.yahoo.com/group/H-Ni_Fusion/message/595;_ylc=X3oDMTMzY3Mwb2kzBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzczMzY0NDQwBGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTA4MzI2OQRtc2dJZAM1OTUEc2VjA2Z0cgRzbGsDdnRwYwRzdGltZQMxMzEzMDU0MDUyBHRwY0lkAzU5NQ--( 1) Recent Activity: - New Membershttp://groups.yahoo.com/group/H-Ni_Fusion/members;_ylc=X3oDMTJndjhyYmY3BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzczMzY0NDQwBGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTA4MzI2OQRzZWMDdnRsBHNsawN2bWJycwRzdGltZQMxMzEzMDU0MDUy?o=6 4 - New Fileshttp://groups.yahoo.com/group/H-Ni_Fusion/files;_ylc=X3oDMTJoZjlnMHFxBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzczMzY0NDQwBGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTA4MzI2OQRzZWMDdnRsBHNsawN2ZmlsZXMEc3RpbWUDMTMxMzA1NDA1Mg-- 1 Visit Your Grouphttp://groups.yahoo.com/group/H-Ni_Fusion;_ylc=X3oDMTJmb2JvODN0BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzczMzY0NDQwBGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTA4MzI2OQRzZWMDdnRsBHNsawN2Z2hwBHN0aW1lAzEzMTMwNTQwNTI- === http://peswiki.com/index.php/Directory:Andrea_A._Rossi_Cold_Fusion_Generator [image: Yahoo! Groups]http://groups.yahoo.com/;_ylc=X3oDMTJldWo1ZTNwBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzczMzY0NDQwBGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTA4MzI2OQRzZWMDZnRyBHNsawNnZnAEc3RpbWUDMTMxMzA1NDA1Mg-- Switch to: Text-Onlyh-ni_fusion-traditio...@yahoogroups.com?subject=Change+Delivery+Format:+Traditional, Daily Digesth-ni_fusion-dig...@yahoogroups.com?subject=Email+Delivery:+Digest• Unsubscribe h-ni_fusion-unsubscr...@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe• Terms of Use http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ . __,_._,___
Re: [Vo]:Musical Open Letter to Andrea Rossi
I like it! - Jed
Re: [Vo]:On a Quixotic mission
OrionWorks - Steven Vincent Johnson wrote: As far as I can tell Sam presents no actual evidence in his post as to why he thinks BLP Mills is a scam operation. What he does state, and this is quite revealing, is that he is upset over the fact that three of his own science articles posted out to Wikipedia had been removed whereas Dr. Mills posts were not. In that case, he should campaign against Wikipedia. Now _that_ would be a quixotic mission! - Jed
Re: [Vo]:How to present arguments against cold fusion critics
Jouni Valkonen wrote: In summary, how do I disproof claim that all cold fusion researchers are crackpotters and all magazines that publish cold fusion are B-rate or less journals? If those are the best arguments your opponent can come up with, they have lost the debate. There is no point to arguing with someone who thinks Julian Schwinger or Martin Fleischmann are crackpots, or J. Electroanal. Chem. is a B-rate journal for a paper on electrochemistry. Anyway, some responses to such such arguments are compiled here: http://pages.csam.montclair.edu/~kowalski/cf/293wikipedia.html http://pages.csam.montclair.edu/%7Ekowalski/cf/293wikipedia.html - Jed
Re: [Vo]:On a Quixotic mission
I think with so much money invested and nothing delivered, no independent tests whatsoever, it is hard to think this is not a scam. They would easily have money to test all other theories of LENR and come with something useful.
Re: [Vo]:On a Quixotic mission
From Daniel I think with so much money invested and nothing delivered, no independent tests whatsoever, it is hard to think this is not a scam. I disagree. There is also some disagreement on the aspect of how one determines an independent test. BLP would say yes independent tests have been performed. Skeptics, OTOH, would cry foul. IMO, BLP is an honorable company. They believe in their product. What remains to be seen is whether BLP can deliver on their vision. I would speculate that the BLP process, whatever that process might be, is largely defined by perceptions laid out in Randy's grandiose CQM theory. Personally, my perception of CQM is that it probably does reveal certain secrets (extraordinarily so) as to what's happening on the atomic scale. However, that does not necessarily mean that ALL the secrets as revealed in the CQM book are accurate. ... They would easily have money to test all other theories of LENR and come with something useful. It is not in BLP's invested interest to test other theories. As far as BLP is concerned CQM is the only way to go. From their perspective, why bother giving lip service to false prophets. Nevertheless, it remains to be seen who the false prophets are. Often, it's the prophets themselves who turn out to be the last to discover the falseness of their claims. In the end, BLP may still surprise us. They may still pull something interesting out of the hat. Regards Steven Vincent Johnson www.OrionWorks.com www.zazzle.com/orionworks
Re: [Vo]:On a Quixotic mission
Do you really think the scarcity of experimental results justifies the investment of 60mil$? It is easier to think that they just bribed a few other researchers just to fake results. This amount of money is enough to come with a proff of concept for any form of fusion, even tokamak.
Re: [Vo]:On a Quixotic mission
From Daniel Do you really think the scarcity of experimental results justifies the investment of 60mil$? It is easier to think that they just bribed a few other researchers just to fake results. This amount of money is enough to come with a proff of concept for any form of fusion, even tokamak. Well, you obviously seem to believe it would be easy for BLP to simply bribe a couple of people in order to fake results. Really? I beg to differ. Also, your claim that there exist a scarcity of experimental results does not strike me as an accurate statement either. Granted, experiments published so far may be open to interpretation, including as to who ran them, that does not mean there exist a scarcity. Regards Steven Vincent Johnson www.OrionWorks.com www.zazzle.com/orionworks
Re: [Vo]:On a Quixotic mission
Daniel Rocha danieldi...@gmail.com wrote: Do you really think the scarcity of experimental results justifies the investment of 60mil$? You are not privy to the results, so you have no idea whether there is a scarcity or a plethora of results. You have not read the contract so you have no idea whether BLP ever promised experimental results, or an actual product delivery of some sort. You do no know, and you cannot judge. Yes, it might be a scam, but until one of the investors files suit, you have no way of knowing this. Many scientific research and RD projects cost large sums and come to nothing. Hundreds of millions are spent on cancer drugs that do not work. The Japanese NEDO cold fusion project, and the 60-year-long $100 billion plasma fusion program were abject failures and a waste of money. But not scams. (There is some evidence that the NEDO program actually produced positive results which they covered up. That would be a scam in the other direction. Assuming that is not true, it was not a scam.) It is easier to think that they just bribed a few other researchers just to fake results. This is out of the question. The people making the investments are highly knowledgeable experts in energy and research. They could spot fake results easily. This amount of money is enough to come with a proff of concept for any form of fusion, even tokamak. No. A tokamak costs billions, even for one that does not produce useful levels of energy. You can't buy one that produces useful energy at any price. Even the ITER will not do this. It is presently estimated to cost $12 billion, and who knows how much it will really cost. All tokamaks produce some excess energy. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:On a Quixotic mission
On Thu, Aug 11, 2011 at 10:38 AM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.comwrote: All tokamaks produce some excess energy. As do skeptics. T
[Vo]:RE: Everyone is overlooking Thermacore
http://nextbigfuture.com/2011/08/defkalion-claims-they-have-energy.html _ It is a mystery why nobody seems to be giving DGT (or PDGT) enough credit for being able to enlist credible scientific expertise, and then to replicate a 17 year old experiment in the public domain. These are intelligent people, and they are wealthy. Unless this drama is about stupidity or poverty, then they easily could have retained all rights to E-Cat technology (or resold their position to many companies). But consider that when the truth is finally known - DGT may not have wanted the contract at the original price. IOW, this could be a bargaining strategy since they had discovered that the Thermacore reactor works as well, or almost as well. Of course, if it is all about having no money, then that is another way to look at it. Everyone seems to have backed off of that possibility for now. And most of the people involved are reputed to be very wealthy. Anyone with a few million can hire good scientists in the USA and top scientists over there. Why would they not have hired good scientists if they have both the capital and the inspiration (from having seen E-Cat first hand)? All that DGT needed to do in this instance - assuming that all of the parties are honest is to present to the Greek government with a working reactor that proved to be safe while producing substantial heat and which they CAN and Will take into production if they have to. The testing agency would likely not have even tested the claim of excess heat, but there could easily have been excess, if they had looked for it. The testers must know the identity of all the ingredients which are in there, so DGT can tell them every detail, if this is based on Thermacore's work. It does not matter if it worked extremely well or moderately well. The testing was for safety- not performance. Thus the Greek Officials could have verified the safety of a Hyperion reactor that is marketable, even if not the E-Cat. Apparently they did verify something, but has anyone actually seen the translated report? And most of all - DGT could be willing to go to market with a Thermacore knock-off, even if the E-Cat is better. That is their bargaining chip. Even without knowing the precise ingredients of the E-Cat design, DGT could very easily have read and replicated the following paper from 1994, submitted to the US agency DARPA by one the most respected high-tech companies in the World: Thermacore (they actually invented the 'heat pipe' for instance). http://free-energy.xf.cz/H2/papers/Anomalous-Heat-from-Atomic-Hydrogen.pdf We have referred to this paper dozens of times over the years, so it is no secret. If DGT do not tune into vortex of course, then there is no hope for them :-) While it is true that such an old reactor design, which came along before the advent of nano anything - might not have been as robust as E-Cat, this old design produced many watts of excess energy for a long time (Thermacore later was able to run it over a year in continuous OU mode - up to 100,000 excess watt-hrs has been mentioned) and best of all for the purposes of this official testing: zero radioactivity. But simply going 'nano' in 2011 would probably have improved it significantly. This 1994 episode is the greatest missed opportunity in all of alternative energy. Shortly after this report, the company was sold to Modine, many of the participants took early retirement - and the new owners dropped the project for unknown reasons. At any rate, this 17 year old design could have been built in a few weeks and have passed the Greek Gov'm't tests with flying colors. Rossi may not have even known about it. It might sell like hotcakes if the price comes in at much less than E-Cat. Thus, everyone is as honest as they can be about what they have said, given that they did not know the machinations taking place behind the scenes. It is even possible, as we have been saying, that by simply going to 'nano' with the old Thermacore design, DGT would have greatly exceeded the old 1994 results, and that breakthrough is what led them to pursue a strategy of renegotiating the original contract to get a better deal, or to delay the large sum further into the future. The more one thinks about the alternatives, the suggestion of this episode being little more than a bargaining chip in a larger financial drama, is likely to be at least partly accurate. Nothing else makes as much sense. Jones From: Daniel Rocha Or that both Rossi and Defkalion have proprietary cores but only Rossi has the catalyzer. Alan J Fletcher wrote: Rossi could have hand-carried a core to Defkalion, run tests, and then taken it way with him. attachment: winmail.dat
Re: [Vo]:On a Quixotic mission
I talked about proof of concept, not a working device. Even FP fit in this description. But BLP didn't show anything that already worked. For example, look at this tokamak: http://www.toodlepip.com/tokamak/pictures/tm1.jpg And it was not even one of the first.
Re: [Vo]:On a Quixotic mission
How can you justify 60mil? Even this: http://www.generalfusion.com/ Didn't require all those millions and it is a massive device.
Re: [Vo]:Another Defkalion statement on PESN
At 10:13 PM 8/10/2011, Daniel Rocha wrote: Alright, so Defkalion has a Kernel for a limited time, while the catalyzer lasts. And it seems to me that catalyzer is something they apply to nickel powder. Anyway, since they once they tested a thousand devices simultaneously and Defkalion is still a young company, it is likely they still have a lot leftover for research, at least of small devices and for governmental tests. If they have catalyzer and Rossi breaks the contract, they may, as self-help (to avoid increased loss), reverse engineer it. Rossi may try to stop them, but I would not predict that he will prevail. It does depend on the exact nature of the contract.
Re: [Vo]:The Galantini report examined in detail
I'm asserting that there are defects in the Galantini report, of two kinds. 1. He does not provide data to substantiate what he claims, which includes specifying exactly what equipment he used. He makes a point that he measured pressure, but he did not report the result as an instrumental reading. 2. He makes major errors in interpretation and explanation. He takes, in fact, a very odd tack, not what I'd have expected at all. He takes readings of g/m^3 that are lower than those for pure vapor, and then considers them to represent missing vapor, i.e., as if the readings are telling us how much water is present as vapor in a cubic meter, with the implication that the meter can measure this. Instead, the meter simply ignores whatever might be present as liquid water, measures the vapor phase, only, as a percentage of water vapor in air, in that phase, then extrapolates this as a calculated value of water mass per cubic meter. In fact, total water per cubic meter increases with decreasing steam quality. Think about it, Jed. He's clearly misunderstood what the meter is telling him. He's confused meter error, which is 3.5% at the RH involved, i.e., over 95%, with missing mass of water vapor. Galantini's description provides no basis for estimation of steam quality. None. The interpretation of no overflow water, considering all that is known or reasonably assumed about the E-cat, is shallow and shaky. Further, this could even be true at the moment of measurement. The entire approach to measuring enthalpy is corrupt and fraught with hazards. You know how to do it right. Rossi deliberately avoided that. At 10:56 PM 8/10/2011, Jed Rothwell wrote: I wrote: Maybe he forgot which probe he used. Again, this is like what you said above: maybe he did not calibrate. Yes, we all agree that if you don't calibrate or you use the wrong probe, it does not work. Yes, people do make mistakes. To summarize Abd's assertions: If Galantini made a mistake, then he got the wrong answer. OR If he did it wrong, then it wasn't right. Unless you have evidence that he made these mistakes, these assertions seem pointless. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:On a Quixotic mission
In this new Mills patent, you can see where some of the investment capital went in the blacklight power venture: http://www.faqs.org/patents/app/20110114075 It looks to me like Mills and associates must have gone through all possible hydride reactions with every possible transition metal. Mills must have spent a ton of money and a huge amount of time to experimentally verify the contents of this patent. The Rossi secret sauce hydride reaction must be somewhere included in this encyclopedic list of hydride reactions. It also looks to me that Mills has secured the intellectual property rights to the catalyst used in the Rossi reactor just by patenting every possible exothermic hydride catalyst combination. On Thu, Aug 11, 2011 at 10:24 AM, Daniel Rocha danieldi...@gmail.comwrote: Do you really think the scarcity of experimental results justifies the investment of 60mil$? It is easier to think that they just bribed a few other researchers just to fake results. This amount of money is enough to come with a proff of concept for any form of fusion, even tokamak.
Re: [Vo]:RE: Everyone is overlooking Thermacore
On Thu, Aug 11, 2011 at 11:04 AM, Jones Beene jone...@pacbell.net wrote: http://nextbigfuture.com/2011/08/defkalion-claims-they-have-energy.html This is referencing the PESN article that Fletcher posted yesterday. http://pesn.com/2011/08/10/9501891_Defkalion_Responds_in_http://pesn.com/2011/08/10/9501891_Defkalion_Responds_in_Support_of_Rossi/ Support_of_Rossi/http://pesn.com/2011/08/10/9501891_Defkalion_Responds_in_Support_of_Rossi/ I do not interpret it the same way as NBF does. T
Re: [Vo]:The Galantini report examined in detail
By the way, I have been assuming that Galantini was watching the thermocouple display on the screen, and he took measurements when it hit 100.1°C or above. I do not suppose he used the temperature function in his instrument. The screen display has 4 digits and I think at least one is significant, assuming they calibrated or they have good quality thermocouples or RTDs. I don't know that's what he did. It is what I would do. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:Black Triangles?
On Thu, Aug 11, 2011 at 12:44 PM, OrionWorks - Steven V Johnson svj.orionwo...@gmail.com wrote: Is Aurora finally out of the closet? Can it hover? T
Re: [Vo]:Black Triangles?
Terry sez: Can it hover? Well... no, but it can disappear! Excerpts: Update 12:29pET- DARPA says it could not regain contact with HTV2 but the hypersonic wedge can terminate its flight autonomously. Update 11:23aET – DARPA has lost contact with the HTV2 Jeez! Are you picky! ;-) Regards Steven Vincent Johnson www.OrionWorks.com www.zazzle.com/orionworks
Re: [Vo]:On a Quixotic mission
So, Mills is trying the same approach as farma companies do, massively parallel testing substances. But I don't think Rossi's catalyzer is about substance, but rather in how the lattice of the substance is arranged spatially.
Re: [Vo]:The Galantini report examined in detail
Abd ul-Rahman Lomax wrote: The entire approach to measuring enthalpy is corrupt and fraught with hazards. You know how to do it right. Rossi deliberately avoided that. Even assuming you are right and this method does not work, I do not know of any reason to think Rossi deliberately avoided doing it right. He just used a tried-and-true, simple textbook method. He is not aiming for accuracy. He doesn't care how wet the steam is, because it can't be wet enough to affect the conclusion. Along the same lines he uses the nominal voltage of 220 V even though we all know it is likely to be different. You make a big deal about this but Rossi and I don't care about a 2% error, especially when causes an underestimation in the excess heat. He would only be guilty of deliberately avoiding the right method if he secretly agreed with you that this method is flawed. I am sure he does not agree with you. Neither do I, and neither does any expert or any textbook I have consulted. We think you are wrong. That does not make us guilty of deliberately avoiding the truth. At worst, it means the experts and the textbooks are wrong, and you deserve a Nobel prize. Don't confuse your opinion with irrefutable truth. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:On a Quixotic mission
Daniel Rocha wrote: So, Mills is trying the same approach as farma companies do, massively parallel testing substances. But I don't think Rossi's catalyzer is about substance, but rather in how the lattice of the substance is arranged spatially. These remarkable instruments described at ICCF16 can do a three-dimensional analysis of substances on the scale of an SEM. They can micro-section materials and produce both a SEM photo with a spacial analysis while also recording the elements in each location. I believe they can characterize a lattice as fcc, bcc and so on. As I said, I was astounded at the capabilities. Something like this would be a big help to reverse engineering a product. The SEM alone cannot do the whole job. Even if you know how the lattice is shaped and what elements and compounds it includes, you still may not know how to fabricate a similar arrangement. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:On a Quixotic mission
That's the Rossi's secret sauce! 2011/8/11 Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com The SEM alone cannot do the whole job. Even if you know how the lattice is shaped and what elements and compounds it includes, you still may not know how to fabricate a similar arrangement. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:On a Quixotic mission
Daniel Rocha wrote: That's the Rossi's secret sauce! The SEM alone cannot do the whole job. Even if you know how the lattice is shaped and what elements and compounds it includes, you still may not know how to fabricate a similar arrangement. Right! If he has a secret sauce (a viable trade secret) it would be how he fabricates the material, not the content of the material. He might not have a viable trade secret. Perhaps expert in materials will look at the powder and quickly determine how it is made. They might even improve on it easily. In the past, when new discoveries were revealed to the public, they were often rendered obsolete quickly because experts not only saw how to replicate, they saw how to improve on the original. - Jed
[Vo]:Animation of events which caused the Gulf Oil disaster...
This is an interesting and detailed animation of the sequence of events that eventually led to the failure of the Blow-Out Preventer (BOP) and subsequent flow of crude into the Gulf... They include pictures of the actual failed components which provided the clues to piece together what happened. The BOP is a 6-story tall, 300 ton assembly designed to handle pressures up to 15,000 psi. It has redundant computer systems which did trigger and attempted to seal off the well pipe after losing comms with the surface drilling platform. http://www.deepwater.com/fw/main/Blow-Out-Preventer-(BOP)-1079.html -Mark N. Iverson markiver...@charter.net
[Vo]:Greek TV report says Rossi and Defkalion are back together
If this is true . . . it does not surprise me in the least. Rossi is mercurial. See: http://kanali6.gr/?p=8013 An improved translation is here in the comments section: http://pesn.com/2011/08/10/9501891_Defkalion_Responds_in_Support_of_Rossi/ QUOTED in its entirety: The process of establishing a power plant in Xanthi that uses hydrogen-nickel fusion continues, as the problems that seemed to exist between the inventor and the company undertaking the building of this plant have been overcome, and everything will now continue as originally planned. Clouds have been seen in recent days in relations between the inventor of the device producing energy from hydrogen-nickel fusion, Andrea Rossi, and Defkalion Green Technologies, the company which is planning to install the relevant equipment for the power plant in Xanthi. Andrea Rossi, in his recent statement, talked about suspending cooperation with the Greek company Defkalion, and of turning to a big company in the U.S. instead. But as in all dramas, the crisis in relations between the inventor and the company has been overcome, and arrangements are now progressing normally. Channel 6 contacted the the CEO of Defkalion, Mr Ksanthoulis, who makes it clear that Mr. Rossi has every right to cooperate with the US company since their agreement does not prohibit it. However, what is important is that any problems are overcome and the investment proceeds as originally planned. In closing Mr. Xanthoulis attributed all this disruption to the pressures on both Defkalion and on Mr Rossi, who according to Mr. Xanthoulis, was more vulnerable to such pressure. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:On a Quixotic mission
I am going from memory here, but Rossi said early on that the secret additive is absolutely required to get useful energy out of his core. Using the nickel powder alone does not produce heat. The Rossi process is the amalgamation of multiple mechanisms each of which when taken separately fail to produce meaningful results. Only when properly combined and taken together does the set of mechanisms produce results. On Thu, Aug 11, 2011 at 1:59 PM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com wrote: Daniel Rocha wrote: That's the Rossi's secret sauce! The SEM alone cannot do the whole job. Even if you know how the lattice is shaped and what elements and compounds it includes, you still may not know how to fabricate a similar arrangement. Right! If he has a secret sauce (a viable trade secret) it would be how he fabricates the material, not the content of the material. He might not have a viable trade secret. Perhaps expert in materials will look at the powder and quickly determine how it is made. They might even improve on it easily. In the past, when new discoveries were revealed to the public, they were often rendered obsolete quickly because experts not only saw how to replicate, they saw how to improve on the original. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:Animation of events which caused the Gulf Oil disaster...
Wow. That is a good video. What a nightmare. Fukushima is even worse. I am sorry to say the Japanese government's response in the early days is now coming to light and it is even more appalling than originally reported. There were civilians including children within 10 km of the reactor for several days who were not evacuated or even warned they were in danger. What the government has been saying were the total emissions turned out to include only emissions from the first 5 days or so. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:Revisiting The Whipmag All-Magnet Motor, saga
- Original Message - From: mix...@bigpond.com mix...@bigpond.com To: vortex-l@eskimo.com vortex-l@eskimo.com Cc: Sent: Saturday, August 6, 2011 6:19:54 PM Subject: Re: [Vo]:Revisiting The Whipmag All-Magnet Motor, saga In reply to Harry Veeder's message of Mon, 1 Aug 2011 19:22:34 -0700 (PDT): Hi, [snip] This reminds me of a pre 17th century argument that the Earth cannot be turning. As everyone knows if the Earth was turning then the ground would move away from you whenever you jumped in the air. However from our experience we know it does not, theorefore the Earth is not turning. Actually the old argument is correct, in concept, but wrong in magnitude. In order to come down in exactly the same spot (assuming a perfectly vertical jump), one would have to maintain the same angular velocity (degrees of arc / second) in the air that one had on the ground (and, due to the larger radius, travel a larger distance at a higher linear velocity parallel to the surface). Since one's linear velocity is not going to increase (conservation laws), one always comes down a tiny distance West of where one started. Regards, According to the old the argument if you were jumping at the equator and stayed in the air for a second in that time the ground would be expected to move about 1500 hundred feet. If you are wondering why people thought like this, it is because in aristotelian physics lateral motion could not happen without an applied force, whereas downward or falling motion was considered natural or unforced. It was thought a thrown stone would continue to move laterally because the air would continually rush in behind it and keep pushing it forward. Harry
[Vo]:Defkalion clearly states that Rossi showed them how to make the powder
There have been several comments here wondering if Defkalion has the catalyzer powder or whether they have reverse engineer it. For example, Axil Axil wrote: Ever since one of our number “noone noone” posted this http://www.mail-archive.com/vortex-l@eskimo.com/msg49026.html I have been concerned that I have let Rossi’s secret out of the bag to his detriment and that secret has been used by Defkalion Green Technologies to reverse engineer Rossi’s reactor core. Please read Defkalion's statement carefully: http://pesn.com/2011/08/10/9501891_Defkalion_Responds_in_Support_of_Rossi/ It says: Defkalion is preparing all of its labs, the industrial production lines and support systems needed for the Hyperion kW range and MW range of products as designed, following all Andrea Rossi's specs on instruments and production machinery, including specialized systems necessary for the preparation, on an industrial scale, of the ingredients placed within the reactor. These are built by Defkalion's scientists and technicians, following the standards, specifications and designs provided and approved by Andrea Rossi himself. I think that is a clear statement that yes, they are making the powder, and Rossi himself told them how to do it. It says ingredients placed within the reactor. That would be the finely divided Ni powder. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:Defkalion clearly states that Rossi showed them how to make the powder
Ni powder is not the catalyzer. It is something you can buy in specialized stores online.
Re: [Vo]:Defkalion clearly states that Rossi showed them how to make the powder
On 8/11/2011 3:05 PM, Daniel Rocha wrote: Ni powder is not the catalyzer. It is something you can buy in specialized stores online. When I say Ni powder I mean the catalyzer: the ingredients placed within the reactor. I gather it is mostly nickel. The point is, Defkalion says clearly that they have the secret, and they are making the stuff. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:Defkalion clearly states that Rossi showed them how to make the powder
On Thu, Aug 11, 2011 at 2:59 PM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com wrote: Please read Defkalion's statement carefully: http://pesn.com/2011/08/10/9501891_Defkalion_Responds_in_Support_of_Rossi/ It says: Defkalion is preparing all of its labs, the industrial production lines and support systems needed for the Hyperion kW range and MW range of products as designed, following all Andrea Rossi's specs on instruments and production machinery, including specialized systems necessary for the preparation, on an industrial scale, of the ingredients placed within the reactor. These are built by Defkalion's scientists and technicians, following the standards, specifications and designs provided and approved by Andrea Rossi himself. I think that is a clear statement that yes, they are making the powder, and Rossi himself told them how to do it. It says ingredients placed within the reactor. That would be the finely divided Ni powder. I, too, thought that until I read even more carefully . . . specialized systems necessary for the preparation . . . Which means the machines to make the powder. Doesn't mean they don't know the sauce. T
Re: [Vo]:Defkalion clearly states that Rossi showed them how to make the powder
Terry Blanton wrote: Defkalion is preparing all of its labs, the industrial production lines and support systems needed for the Hyperion kW range and MW range of products as designed, following all Andrea Rossi's specs on instruments and production machinery, including specialized systems necessary for the preparation, on an industrial scale, of the ingredients placed within the reactor. These are built by Defkalion's scientists and technicians, following the standards, specifications and designs provided and approved by Andrea Rossi himself. I, too, thought that until I read even more carefully . . . specialized systems necessary for the preparation . . . Which means the machines to make the powder. Do you mean, they might be making a distinction between preparing the powder and fabricating it from scratch? I don't think so. I think this is a matter of English. I am pretty sure they mean they can make the stuff from scratch and Rossi showed them how. As a practical matter, I can't imagine setting up a factory to makes these things without controlling the key component in-house. Doesn't mean they don't know the sauce. I think it does mean they do know the sauce. Proactively. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:Defkalion clearly states that Rossi showed them how to make the powder
At 12:13 PM 8/11/2011, Terry Blanton wrote: Doesn't mean they don't know the sauce. I'm with Terry on this one. They've could just have designed the correct hoppers, feeds, mixers etc etc to add the sauce, They can do this from a technical specification without knowing the secret. If and when Rossi finally gives them the information they can just fill the hopper and press thestart button.
Re: [Vo]:Defkalion clearly states that Rossi showed them how to make the powder
You can have a great kitchen and collect all the things you need to make bread, but unless your given instructions, or better still shown how to make bread you won't be able to make bread. Harry From: Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2011 3:29:32 PM Subject: Re: [Vo]:Defkalion clearly states that Rossi showed them how to make the powder Terry Blanton wrote: Defkalion is preparing all of its labs, the industrial production lines and support systems needed for the Hyperion kW range and MW range of products as designed, following all Andrea Rossi's specs on instruments and production machinery, including specialized systems necessary for the preparation, on an industrial scale, of the ingredients placed within the reactor. These are built by Defkalion's scientists and technicians, following the standards, specifications and designs provided and approved by Andrea Rossi himself. I, too, thought that until I read even more carefully . . . specialized systems necessary for the preparation . . . Which means the machines to make the powder. Do you mean, they might be making a distinction between preparing the powder and fabricating it from scratch? I don't think so. I think this is a matter of English. I am pretty sure they mean they can make the stuff from scratch and Rossi showed them how. As a practical matter, I can't imagine setting up a factory to makes these things without controlling the key component in-house. Doesn't mean they don't know the sauce. I think it does mean they do know the sauce. Proactively. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:Defkalion clearly states that Rossi showed them how to make the powder
On Thu, Aug 11, 2011 at 3:43 PM, Alan J Fletcher a...@well.com wrote: At 12:13 PM 8/11/2011, Terry Blanton wrote: Doesn't mean they don't know the sauce. I'm with Terry on this one. They've could just have designed the correct hoppers, feeds, mixers etc etc to add the sauce, They can do this from a technical specification without knowing the secret. If and when Rossi finally gives them the information they can just fill the hopper and press thestart button. But, at the same time, nowhere in their statement do they deny possessing nor having constructed reactor kernels. They may have no eCats; but, they could have eMbryos! T
Re: [Vo]:Defkalion clearly states that Rossi showed them how to make the powder
Very probably the problem is simpler than it seems, the core is actually a Sphynx without a Secret. The core is nanostructured Ni (please consider then particle size and nanostructure are two different characteristics- from a certain manufacturer and certain sortiment. Fora specialist in Competive Intelligence (specialists from SCIP or Fuld and Co, for example) is a relatively easy task to find out both the provenience and the specification of the nanoNi.. They will start probably at the customs- evidence who has imported Ni powder in Florida. This nanostructured Ni is probably treated. annealed degassed as described in the patent WO 2010/058288. I know thta Rossi says his catalyst is not inactivated by air, but he is speaking both the truth nd the untruth and the two cases are indistinguishable. He has delivered even a few absolute lies (definition- even the opposite of it is not true) The catalyst is fairy tales for adults I think. On Thu, Aug 11, 2011 at 10:13 PM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.comwrote: On 8/11/2011 3:05 PM, Daniel Rocha wrote: Ni powder is not the catalyzer. It is something you can buy in specialized stores online. When I say Ni powder I mean the catalyzer: the ingredients placed within the reactor. I gather it is mostly nickel. The point is, Defkalion says clearly that they have the secret, and they are making the stuff. - Jed -- Dr. Peter Gluck Cluj, Romania http://egooutpeters.blogspot.com
[Vo]:Speaking of finely divided nickel
Nano is the key to many anomalies, and the follow numbers tend to support a surprising conclusion, to wit: Rossi's industrial secret catalyst is NOT nearly as good as the original . In 1994 in a series of experiments lasting over a year, but before nickel nanopowder was available, Thermacore was able to get ~50 watts of continuous excess energy - output over the input - from what works out to 143 cm^2 surface area of nickel. This is based on the surface area of polished capillary tubing, which was in contact with a catalyst (one of several alkali metals, as specified in CQM theory based on Rydberg's constant). If the surface area had been etched and pitted, as would be expected, then the true surface area could be a multiple of that, but probably not over 400 cm^2. BTW Rydberg was a Swede, and his constant was found experimentally - since it predated the development of quantum theory. But nowadays, it can be derived from quantum mechanics, which gives it extra credence. Perhaps this is a detail which has attracted the Swedes to the recent incarnation of this early experiment. http://free-energy.xf.cz/H2/papers/Anomalous-Heat-from-Atomic-Hydrogen.pdf Now fast-forward 17 years. The spec sheets from nano-nickel suppliers say that 400,000 cm^2/gm of surface area is available from this geometry as opposed to the ~400 cm^2/gm of the older tubing. Therefore, only one gram of nano nickel should give an increase of (400,000/400) or about 3 orders of magnitude more surface area. If surface area correlates well to excess energy, and this is almost a given - then this incredible increase should easily push the 50 watts seen in 1994 above the heat level now claimed by AR. Is there a surprising conclusion that one draw from this set of circumstances ? Guess what, sports fans: this could indicates that Rossi's catalyst may NOT be as good as the potassium carbonate used initially ! But even if it is exactly the same catalyst (or one the other alkali metals mentioned in the CQM theory) - then this fact, plus the old experiment, may also indicate why the present inventor has been reluctant to disclose its true identity. Jones
Re: [Vo]:Everyone is overlooking Thermacore
In reply to Jones Beene's message of Wed, 10 Aug 2011 15:50:06 -0700: Hi, [snip] It does not matter if it worked extremely well or moderately well. The testing was for safety- not performance. [snip] Actually it might. If there is a small amount of radioactivity associated with operation, it might not show up until the device outputs a lot of power. Regards, Robin van Spaandonk http://rvanspaa.freehostia.com/project.html
[Vo]:PhysOrg reports on Krivit's latest article...
You can get the gist of it just by the hyperlink... http://www.physorg.com/news/2011-08-controversial-energy-generating-lacking-credibility-video.html -Mark
[Vo]:Inexpensive catalyst makes hydrogen 10 times faster than natural enzyme
FYI: Inexpensive catalyst that makes hydrogen gas 10 times faster than natural enzyme http://www.physorg.com/news/2011-08-inexpensive-catalyst-hydrogen-gas-faster.html Looking to nature for their muse, researchers have used a common protein to guide the design of a material that can make energy-storing hydrogen gas. The synthetic material works 10 times faster than the original protein found in water-dwelling microbes, the researchers report in the August 12 issue of the journal Science, clocking in at 100,000 molecules of hydrogen gas every second. http://www.sciencemag.org/content/333/6044/863 Abstract Reduction of acids to molecular hydrogen as a means of storing energy is catalyzed by platinum, but its low abundance and high cost are problematic. Precisely controlled delivery of protons is critical in hydrogenase enzymes in nature that catalyze hydrogen (H2) production using earth-abundant metals (iron and nickel). Here, we report that a synthetic nickel complex, [Ni(PPh2NPh)2](BF4)2, (PPh2NPh = 1,3,6-triphenyl-1-aza-3,6-diphosphacycloheptane), catalyzes the production of H2 using protonated dimethylformamide as the proton source, with turnover frequencies of 33,000 per second (s−1) in dry acetonitrile and 106,000 s−1 in the presence of 1.2 M of water, at a potential of –1.13 volt (versus the ferrocenium/ferrocene couple). The mechanistic implications of these remarkably fast catalysts point to a key role of pendant amines that function as proton relays. -Mark
[Vo]: Polarizable quantum vacuum could explain illusion of dark matter
Just an FYI: CERN physicist Dragan Slavkov Hajdukovic has proposed that the illusion of dark matter may be caused by the gravitational polarization of the quantum vacuum. We can consider our universe as a union of two mutually interacting entities, Hajdukovic said. The first entity is our 'normal' matter (hence we do not assume the existence of dark matter and dark energy), immersed in the second entity, the quantum vacuum, considered as a sea of different kinds of virtual dipoles, including gravitational dipoles. He goes on to explain that the virtual gravitational dipoles in the quantum vacuum can be gravitationally polarized by the baryonic matter in nearby massive stars and galaxies. When the virtual dipoles align, they produce an additional gravitational field that can combine with the gravitational field produced by stars and galaxies. As such, the gravitationally polarized quantum vacuum could produce the same speeding up effect on the rotational curves of galaxies as either hypothetical dark matter or a modified law of gravity. Abstract Assuming that a particle and its antiparticle have the gravitational charge of the opposite sign, the physical vacuum may be considered as a fluid of virtual gravitational dipoles. Following this hypothesis, we present the first indications that dark matter may not exist and that the phenomena for which it was invoked might be explained by the gravitational polarization of the quantum vacuum by the known baryonic matter. -Mark
Re: [Vo]: Polarizable quantum vacuum could explain illusion of dark matter
Thanks for this post. I have bet 100 euros that there is no such thing as dark matter, that has significant effect on rotation curves of galaxies. Therefore it is specially good to hear such news! –Jouni 2011/8/12 Mark Iverson markiver...@charter.net: Just an FYI: CERN physicist Dragan Slavkov Hajdukovic has proposed that the illusion of dark matter may be caused by the gravitational polarization of the quantum vacuum. “We can consider our universe as a union of two mutually interacting entities,” Hajdukovic said. “The first entity is our ‘normal’ matter (hence we do not assume the existence of dark matter and dark energy), immersed in the second entity, the quantum vacuum, considered as a sea of different kinds of virtual dipoles, including gravitational dipoles.” He goes on to explain that the virtual gravitational dipoles in the quantum vacuum can be gravitationally polarized by the baryonic matter in nearby massive stars and galaxies. When the virtual dipoles align, they produce an additional gravitational field that can combine with the gravitational field produced by stars and galaxies. As such, the gravitationally polarized quantum vacuum could produce the same “speeding up” effect on the rotational curves of galaxies as either hypothetical dark matter or a modified law of gravity. Abstract Assuming that a particle and its antiparticle have the gravitational charge of the opposite sign, the physical vacuum may be considered as a fluid of virtual gravitational dipoles. Following this hypothesis, we present the first indications that dark matter may not exist and that the phenomena for which it was invoked might be explained by the gravitational polarization of the quantum vacuum by the known baryonic matter. -Mark
Re: [Vo]:PhysOrg reports on Krivit's latest article...
Can somebody explain me how, it is likely a weak interaction involving neutrons, without fusion could possibly gain energy? And where do these neutrons come from? It looks like people are more skeptical on the claim 'cold fusion' than on the claim that 'abra-ca-dabra' can actually do something. On Thu, Aug 11, 2011 at 3:26 PM, Mark Iverson zeropo...@charter.net wrote: You can get the gist of it just by the hyperlink... http://www.physorg.com/news/2011-08-controversial-energy-generating-lacking-credibility-video.html -Mark
Re: [Vo]:PhysOrg reports on Krivit's latest article...
Bastiaan Bergman bastiaan.berg...@gmail.com wrote: Can somebody explain me how, it is likely a weak interaction involving neutrons, without fusion could possibly gain energy? And where do these neutrons come from? It looks like people are more skeptical on the claim 'cold fusion' than on the claim that 'abra-ca-dabra' can actually do something. See the Widom Larsen theory, which Krivit champions. For example: http://lenr-canr.org/acrobat/Srivastavaaprimerfor.pdf - Jed
RE: [Vo]:On a Quixotic mission
From: OrionWorks - Steven Vincent Johnson ... What tends to happen under these kinds of circumstances where someone appears to be on a self-righteous kamikaze mission to destroy the reputation of an individual and his company. Hmm... Funny thing this question came up as I had been reading the wisdom of Dilbert: Never argue with an idiot. They drag you down to their level and beat you with experience. attachment: winmail.dat
RE: [Vo]:PhysOrg reports on Krivit's latest article...
From Bergman Can somebody explain me how, it is likely a weak interaction involving neutrons, without fusion could possibly gain energy? And where do these neutrons come from? It looks like people are more skeptical on the claim 'cold fusion' than on the claim that 'abra-ca-dabra' can actually do something. What piqued my interest was reading the phrase ...a weak interaction involving neutrons, without fusion. Sure sounds like Widom-Larsen speak to me. My my my! What's going on under the bed sheets here? Regards, Steven Vincent Johnson www.OrionWorks.com www.zazzle.com/orionworks
Re: [Vo]:PhysOrg reports on Krivit's latest article...
The thing is Widom Larsen theory (which I do not think is valid) does produce nuclear fusion. When a proton and electron pretending to be a neutron enter an atom's nucleus releasing energy and causing transmutations, it is FUSION!!! The Widom Larsen folks are absolutely out of their minds trying to claim the theory does not produce fusion. From: OrionWorks - Steven Vincent Johnson orionwo...@charter.net To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2011 9:11 PM Subject: RE: [Vo]:PhysOrg reports on Krivit's latest article... From Bergman Can somebody explain me how, it is likely a weak interaction involving neutrons, without fusion could possibly gain energy? And where do these neutrons come from? It looks like people are more skeptical on the claim 'cold fusion' than on the claim that 'abra-ca-dabra' can actually do something. What piqued my interest was reading the phrase ...a weak interaction involving neutrons, without fusion. Sure sounds like Widom-Larsen speak to me. My my my! What's going on under the bed sheets here? Regards, Steven Vincent Johnson www.OrionWorks.com www.zazzle.com/orionworks
Re: [Vo]:PhysOrg reports on Krivit's latest article...
Krivit and other worshippers of Widom Larsen theory do not make any sense. The reaction is not a weak interaction, but a fusion reaction. The neutrons are supposed to be protons and electrons that become virtual neutrons. Basically, Widom Larsen worshippers want people to believe if a proton and electron put on a mask, they are no longer a proton and neutron. From: Bastiaan Bergman bastiaan.berg...@gmail.com To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2011 7:25 PM Subject: Re: [Vo]:PhysOrg reports on Krivit's latest article... Can somebody explain me how, it is likely a weak interaction involving neutrons, without fusion could possibly gain energy? And where do these neutrons come from? It looks like people are more skeptical on the claim 'cold fusion' than on the claim that 'abra-ca-dabra' can actually do something. On Thu, Aug 11, 2011 at 3:26 PM, Mark Iverson zeropo...@charter.net wrote: You can get the gist of it just by the hyperlink... http://www.physorg.com/news/2011-08-controversial-energy-generating-lacking-credibility-video.html -Mark
Re: [Vo]:PhysOrg reports on Krivit's latest article...
Inspired by Krivit's nonsense. Krivit has been out to try and discredit Rossi for a long time. He truly is a snake. From: Mark Iverson zeropo...@charter.net To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2011 6:26 PM Subject: [Vo]:PhysOrg reports on Krivit's latest article... You can get the gist of it just by the hyperlink... http://www.physorg.com/news/2011-08-controversial-energy-generating-lacking-credibility-video.html -Mark
