Re: [Wikimedia-l] [Board-l] Fwd: WMF trustee Arnnon Geshuri and part in anticompetitive agreements in Google

[Tim Landscheidt]

Dariusz Jemielniak  wrote:

> […]

> The identified mistakes/shortcomings of the whole process:

> 1. In the background check performed by the HR and the legal department we
> have not had a specific PR check as an immanent part. While it sounds like
> common sense  (doh! I know, although many organizations don't actually do
> that), it seems that each department focused on their own turf mostly- HR
> confirmed the highest expertise, and the legal department confirmed no
> legal threats.

> How are we going to address this in the future? We have already prepared a
> modification to the process, including a PR subroutine into the larger
> background check process.

> […]

This makes it sound like a communications mishap, i. e. in
the hypothetical case that the board would not have had to
publish Arnnon's appointment, everything would be okay.

The question that has been raised here in the last few weeks
is different: Is someone who apparently in the past had a
major and costly difficulty to choose between right and
wrong suitable for serving on the Board of the Wikimedia
Foundation?  It was not addressed to HR or Legal, but to the
Board itself.

Tim


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Re: [Wikimedia-l] [Board-l] Fwd: WMF trustee Arnnon Geshuri and part in anticompetitive agreements in Google

[Nathan]

On Fri, Jan 22, 2016 at 1:21 PM, Dariusz Jemielniak 
wrote:
>
> The identified mistakes/shortcomings of the whole process:
>
> 1. In the background check performed by the HR and the legal department we
> have not had a specific PR check as an immanent part. While it sounds like
> common sense  (doh! I know, although many organizations don't actually do
> that), it seems that each department focused on their own turf mostly- HR
> confirmed the highest expertise, and the legal department confirmed no
> legal threats.
>
> How are we going to address this in the future? We have already prepared a
> modification to the process, including a PR subroutine into the larger
> background check process.
>
> 2. The BGC has failed individually as well, for a rather silly reason. An
> often returning argument has been that we must have known about the case,
> since it is high in google.com results.
> The initial screening was conducted by Alice, Frieda, and me. None of us is
> a native English speaker and our searches included google.de, google.it
> and
> google.pl - none of them included the information about the controversy in
> the top 10 results at the time (btw, the pando article is clearly trending
> up and is in the top 10 results in google.pl now, while it was not even a
> couple of weeks ago).
>


I think this is almost exactly wrong. The lesson here should not be that
the Board failed to take public relations into consideration when co-opting
a new member. The message is that the examination of candidates failed to
turn up really quite substantial allegations of a lack of integrity and
ethical leadership. If your background check process looks for expertise or
criminal history but doesn't examine work experience for serious failures,
then the background check process is broken. Adding a "what will people
think?" 'subroutine' is not a solution.

The question of in what language did BGC members search Google is bizarre
but really a distraction - the Board should ensure that a superior
background check process is in place, and neither the Board members nor the
community should have to rely on Board members Googling in their spare time
to turn up major defects in finalist candidates.
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] [Board-l] Fwd: WMF trustee Arnnon Geshuri and part in anticompetitive agreements in Google

[Dariusz Jemielniak]

On Fri, Jan 22, 2016 at 4:14 PM, Nathan  wrote:

> I think this is almost exactly wrong. The lesson here should not be that
>> the Board failed to take public relations into consideration when co-opting
>> a new member. The message is that the examination of candidates failed to
>> turn up really quite substantial allegations of a lack of integrity and
>> ethical leadership. If your background check process looks for expertise or
>> criminal history but doesn't examine work experience for serious failures,
>> then the background check process is broken. Adding a "what will people
>> think?" 'subroutine' is not a solution.
>>
>
it may be a language issue. We want to widen the background check process
so that it includes issues beyond just criminal activity, basically. I
called it a "PR check", but it is not just focusing on "what will people
think" for its sake, but rather paying particular attention to a wide array
of issues that could raise concerns, basically to be able to sensibly
discuss which of them are legitimate, and which are not.

dj
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] [Board-l] Fwd: WMF trustee Arnnon Geshuri and part in anticompetitive agreements in Google

[John Mark Vandenberg]

On Sat, Jan 23, 2016 at 5:21 AM, Dariusz Jemielniak  wrote:
>..
> The identified mistakes/shortcomings of the whole process:
>
> 1. In the background check performed by the HR and the legal department we
> have not had a specific PR check as an immanent part. While it sounds like
> common sense  (doh! I know, although many organizations don't actually do
> that), it seems that each department focused on their own turf mostly- HR
> confirmed the highest expertise, and the legal department confirmed no
> legal threats.
>
> How are we going to address this in the future? We have already prepared a
> modification to the process, including a PR subroutine into the larger
> background check process.
>
> 2. The BGC has failed individually as well, for a rather silly reason. An
> often returning argument has been that we must have known about the case,
> since it is high in google.com results.
> The initial screening was conducted by Alice, Frieda, and me. None of us is
> a native English speaker and our searches included google.de, google.it and
> google.pl - none of them included the information about the controversy in
> the top 10 results at the time (btw, the pando article is clearly trending
> up and is in the top 10 results in google.pl now, while it was not even a
> couple of weeks ago).

> How are we going to address this in the future? We are going to assume a
> global audience of our movement and conduct searches specifically taking
> that in mind.
>
> 3. We have not asked the candidates a very simple question: is there
> anything in your past that may be perceived as controversial, or require
> additional explanations?

There is also a fourth problem.

Every single board of trustee member is responsible for their vote,
and should have done their own due diligence, checking the dossier
they had been given.  It means that 10 people failed to find and/or
highlight this issue.  There were three native English speakers on the
board who would have been using English searches  (James, Jimmy &
Stu).

Jimmy has disclosed on January 8 that he did 'Google' Arnnon prior to
the appointment.

"
I cannot speak for the entire board. As for myself, I was aware (from
googling him and reading news reports) that he had a small part in the
overall situation when he was told by Eric Schmidt that Google had a
policy of not recruiting from Apple, and that a recruiter had done it,
and that the recruiter should be fired, and he agreed to do so. As for
your other allegations, that he "helped manage that collusion", the
part about some "ugly and humiliating" termination, and chastisement
by a Federal Judge, I don't (yet) know anything about
that.--[[User:Jimbo Wales|Jimbo Wales]] ([[User talk:Jimbo
Wales#top|talk]]) 09:41, 8 January 2016 (UTC)
"
https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?diff=prev=698802294

I would expect that a board member seeing that would raise it for all
other board members to consider if it wasnt part of the dossier
provided by HR and/or board committees.

fwiw, A few days ago Jimmy disclosed that "James voted in favor of Arnnon".
https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?diff=prev=700325768

-- 
John Vandenberg

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] [Board-l] Fwd: WMF trustee Arnnon Geshuri and part in anticompetitive agreements in Google

[Dariusz Jemielniak]

Hi Sarah,

On Thu, Jan 21, 2016 at 11:59 PM, SarahSV  wrote:

>
> You wrote to this list on 12 January that you were investigating with the
> Board Governance Committee what happened regarding the appointments process
> in this case – whether everyone was fully informed, and so on.
>
> Can you let us know what you've learned or when you'll publish your
> findings? I think the community is keen to know what happened.
>
> we've been working on it, discussing, and introducing improvements. I
guess that replying here quicker, rather than preparing an elaborate
document may be more sensible, since you're asking, and we may be perceived
as entirely inactive ;)

The identified mistakes/shortcomings of the whole process:

1. In the background check performed by the HR and the legal department we
have not had a specific PR check as an immanent part. While it sounds like
common sense  (doh! I know, although many organizations don't actually do
that), it seems that each department focused on their own turf mostly- HR
confirmed the highest expertise, and the legal department confirmed no
legal threats.

How are we going to address this in the future? We have already prepared a
modification to the process, including a PR subroutine into the larger
background check process.

2. The BGC has failed individually as well, for a rather silly reason. An
often returning argument has been that we must have known about the case,
since it is high in google.com results.
The initial screening was conducted by Alice, Frieda, and me. None of us is
a native English speaker and our searches included google.de, google.it and
google.pl - none of them included the information about the controversy in
the top 10 results at the time (btw, the pando article is clearly trending
up and is in the top 10 results in google.pl now, while it was not even a
couple of weeks ago).

How are we going to address this in the future? We are going to assume a
global audience of our movement and conduct searches specifically taking
that in mind.

3. We have not asked the candidates a very simple question: is there
anything in your past that may be perceived as controversial, or require
additional explanations?

How are we going to address this in the future? We will basically start
asking that.

best,

dj
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] [Board-l] Fwd: WMF trustee Arnnon Geshuri and part in anticompetitive agreements in Google

[Cristian Consonni]

Hi Dariusz,

2016-01-22 19:21 GMT+01:00 Dariusz Jemielniak :
> we've been working on it, discussing, and introducing improvements. I
> guess that replying here quicker, rather than preparing an elaborate
> document may be more sensible, since you're asking, and we may be perceived
> as entirely inactive ;)

I appreciate the update and the explanation of the changes that are
being made to the process.

However I would like to know if you are tackling the main issue at
hand, i.e. whether Arnnon Geshuri should remain a trustee or not.

Thank you.

Cristian

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] COI - was Re: [Board-l] Fwd: WMF etc.

[Austin Hair]

And just so everyone's clear, Florence's new subscription has already been
whitelisted.

Austin

On Fri, Jan 22, 2016 at 6:38 PM, Fæ  wrote:

> Sorry you've had to change email Florence.
>
> (Tangent) Could those who use *Yahoo email addresses* ask their
> friends to check if their emails regularly end up in spam boxes? I
> have found several Yahoo users who write to this list getting marked
> as potential trojans by Google and I only find their emails a month
> later, by accident, if ever.
>
> P.S. this is not a Google conspiracy theory.
>
> Thanks,
> Fae
>
> On 22 January 2016 at 14:41, Florence Devouard 
> wrote:
> > Le 21/01/16 20:05, Dariusz Jemielniak a écrit :
> >>
> >> hi Florence,
> >>
> >>
> >> Then I was astonished when I discovered that Dariusz, who has been a
> board
> >>>
> >>> member for over 6 months, was not aware of the existence of the
> Conflict
> >>> of
> >>> Interest Policy, which include a pledge of commitment and an obligation
> >>> to
> >>> disclose potential conflicts of interest. A policy voted by the board
> >>> several years ago and mandatory for all board members. It is apparently
> >>> not
> >>> enforced anymore, even though it is an approved policy and obviously a
> >>> good
> >>> governance practice. This makes me think the board is not operating
> >>> properly anymore on this serious matter.
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >> just to clarify this issue: I have been signing the COI
> >> pledges/disclosures
> >> over the last 4 years, as the FDC member, and later as a Board member.
> >> Apparently I did not make myself clear that I think it is worthwhile to
> >> consider PUBLIC statements (as proposed in the email I was replying to),
> >> and not statements in general (which we do have). It may have left you
> >> with
> >> a reading that I was unaware of the COI policy as a whole; I apologize
> for
> >> my clumsy phrasing.
> >>
> >> best,
> >>
> >> dariusz
> >
> >
> > My apologies Dariusz; This point was a misunderstanding on my part after
> > reading this msg from you :
> >
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikimedia-l/2016-January/080945.html
> >
> > I am really happy to read your clarification and see that this point is
> in
> > fact not an issue. Good :)
> >
> > I actually stayed in confusion because I commented it, but you never gave
> > any further feedback.
> > But some people warned me my emails got stuck in spambox...
> > I changed my email address for the lists this morning... sent a
> message...
> > and it got stuck in moderation !
> > Hopefully this one will work out...
> >
> >
> > Florence
> --
> fae...@gmail.com https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Fae
>
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] [Board-l] Fwd: WMF trustee Arnnon Geshuri and part in anticompetitive agreements in Google

[Dariusz Jemielniak]

On Fri, Jan 22, 2016 at 4:58 AM, Florence Devouard 
wrote:

>
>>>
> Misinterpretation on my part for what you wrote here :
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikimedia-l/2016-January/080945.html
>
>
> After reading it again, it actually referred to public statements rather
> than private ones. And since you did not comment on the list when I raised
> the issue, my misinterpretation was not corrected. My apologies.
>

no worries :) I'm glad it is clear now.

cheers,

dj
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] next Wikidata office hour on January 21st

[Anthony Cole]

Oops. Thanks Lydia.
On 22 Jan 2016 3:30 pm, "Lydia Pintscher" 
wrote:

> On Fri, Jan 22, 2016 at 3:00 AM, Anthony Cole  wrote:
> > Lydia, could you please link to a log of that discussion?
>
> I already did ;-) But here it is again:
> http://bots.wmflabs.org/~wm-bot/logs/%23wikimedia-office/20160121.txt
>
>
> Cheers
> Lydia
>
> --
> Lydia Pintscher - http://about.me/lydia.pintscher
> Product Manager for Wikidata
>
> Wikimedia Deutschland e.V.
> Tempelhofer Ufer 23-24
> 10963 Berlin
> www.wikimedia.de
>
> Wikimedia Deutschland - Gesellschaft zur Förderung Freien Wissens e. V.
>
> Eingetragen im Vereinsregister des Amtsgerichts Berlin-Charlottenburg
> unter der Nummer 23855 Nz. Als gemeinnützig anerkannt durch das
> Finanzamt für Körperschaften I Berlin, Steuernummer 27/029/42207.
>
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] How to disseminate free knowledge? Was: Profile of Magnus Manske

[Quim Gil]

First of all, I also think that we cannot expect us to fulfill our mission
by having all the world visiting our sites. A good percentage of that
mission probably needs to be fulfilled elsewhere thanks to our free
licenses and APIs.

On Tue, Jan 19, 2016 at 11:06 AM, Magnus Manske  wrote:

> We prefer people to read Wikipedia articles on Wikipedia, because a few of
> them will turn into editors, which they cannot do on any other site
> (without forking).


Even the idea of the remote contributors needs to be better explored. Our
APIs are not only GET, they are also POST. Editing the en.wiki article
about Cologne probably must happen in en.wiki itself, but there are many
types of contributions that allow for more flexibility and, in fact, might
be a lot more successful out of our Click-the-Edit-link paradigm.

https://tools.wmflabs.org/wikidata-game/ (oh, Magnus Manske was here as
well)  ;) might be the prehistory of this trend. Binary decisions become
useful Wikimedia contributions without the need of instructions or (in some
cases) specialized knowledge. Binary decisions and other very simple
interactions are at the core of massively successful mobile and/or social
games that many of our friends and their kids play.

Meanwhile, people are uploading all kinds of media, crowdsourced
translations sentence by sentence are not exotic anymore and, in general,
crowd efforts are becoming part of mainstream Internet. Wikipedia actually
inspired this trend, showing that even a goal as complex as an encyclopedia
could be achieved by us, the people, in our free time, with a pool of small
personal investments.

Who will make the connection between Wikimedia's pool of free knowledge and
hundreds of possible non-Wikimedia projects that could contribute more free
knowledge to Wikimedia? Certainly not us average Wikimedians busy with our
watchlists and routines, and certainly not us here discussing with
ourselves in wikimedia-l while the World keeps spinning. Hopefully the
connections will be made by hundreds of creative minds scratching their own
itches and satisfying their own curiosities. But if we don't pitch them the
idea of plugging Wikimedia to their experiments and products, who will?



PS: all these discussions are very relevant for
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/2016_Strategy and I encourage you to
influence the WMF strategy by leaving there your answers and choices about
Reach, Community, and Knowledge. Going through the questionnaire took me
about 15 minutes and I found the exercise interesting.

-- 
Quim Gil
Engineering Community Manager @ Wikimedia Foundation
http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/User:Qgil
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Profile of Magnus Manske

[Magnus Manske]

Ah, I see. I am the problem. Glad we cleared that up.

On Fri, Jan 22, 2016 at 6:56 AM Isarra Yos  wrote:

> You just don't get it, do you? Even from the start this was all about
> social issues with rollouts, and still you are contributing to the very
> same social problems you so blindly condemned.
>
> -I
>
> On 20/01/16 14:16, Magnus Manske wrote:
> > On Wed, Jan 20, 2016 at 12:58 AM Todd Allen 
> wrote:
> >
> >> Once the VisualEditor was fit for purpose and a good deployment strategy
> >> had been developed, the English Wikipedia community overwhelmingly
> >> supported rolling it out. (
> >>
> >>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Village_pump_(proposals)/Archive_125#Gradually_enabling_VisualEditor_for_new_accounts
> >> )
> >>
> > That is for new accounts only. Without an account, still no VE for you,
> > even if you are probably the one needing it most.
> >
> >> It's not Luddism, it's not "resistance to change", it's not "power
> users"
> >> grumpy about newbies having an easier time, it's not anything like that.
> >> It's that in the state it was initially released in, the thing did not
> >> work.
> >>
> > No one said "Luddism", except to defend against its use. Odd.
> >
> >
> >> So yes, by all means, let's try new things. But try:
> >>
> >> 1: Asking us what we actually want, before coding something up and
> feeling
> >> obligated to push it out. People are a lot more receptive to something
> they
> >> asked for than something being forced upon them. That's been an issue
> with
> >> Flow. It's not that it doesn't work well (though it doesn't), it's that
> it
> >> wasn't wanted to start with. So instead of "Here's the new discussion
> >> system", ask "What can we do to make our system of discussion better?"
> >>
> > Listening to what editors want is important. ONLY listening to wad
> editors
> > want is bad. People often don't know what they want or need, until they
> see
> > it. Compare the famous (possibly misattributed) Henry Ford quote:
> > “If I had asked people what they wanted, they would have said faster
> > horses.”
> >
> > Also, veteran editors do not represent the readers or casual/newbie
> > editors; their needs are often quite different.
> >
> >
> >> 2: Make sure it works. Have an opt-in beta phase. Doesn't have to be
> >> perfect, but certainly make sure it's not breaking page formatting all
> over
> >> the place. You'll notice, for example, that there wasn't really any
> >> resistance to HHVM. It worked well, it was desirable, it was clearly fit
> >> for purpose. So no, there isn't just a reflexive change aversion. Though
> >> the previous missteps and hamfisted followups have, rather ironically,
> >> created a lot of the reflexive change aversion that people said was
> there.
> >>
> > Wrong example. The HHMV switch was a back-end change that should have had
> > no visible effect. As long as the servers are fast, people don't really
> > care what's going on there. Did e.g. English Wikipedia actually vote on
> > HHMV?
> >
> >> 3: Be nice (but NOT condescending or patronizing) if an issue comes up.
> >> "Superprotect" alienated people right quickly, and turned what could
> have
> >> been a productive (if tense) conversation into a war. Same with refusal
> to
> >> budge on VE and the arrogant tone several people took. Yes, some people
> >> might be rude about objecting to the change. Don't sink to their level.
> If
> >> they call the new software a steaming pile, ask "Could you offer more
> >> concrete feedback?"
> >>
> > Superprotect was used to revert an admin action on de.wikipedia, an
> action
> > that might actually fall under U.S. or German computer sabotage laws.
> This
> > was hailed as some heroic action by that vocal group I keep mentioning,
> > when it can easily be seen as someone abusing the privileges given by the
> > Foundation (as owners of the servers) to deactivate functionality put in
> > place by the Foundation.
> > The creation and subsequent use of superprotect was not exactly the most
> > wise decision ever undertaken, but neither was the original sabotage
> > (literally so; using access to a machine to stop it from working, just
> not
> > using a wooden shoe).
> > And while it is always good to ask for more concrete feedback, it is even
> > better to offer it to begin with.
> >
> >
> >> 4: Don't surprise people. Not everyone follows the Village Pumps or what
> >> have you. If a major new feature is set to roll out, do banners, do
> >> watchlist notices, do whatever it takes, but make sure people know. When
> >> Mediaviewer was rolled out, all of a sudden, I was just having images
> act
> >> completely different. I had no idea what was going on. People are more
> >> amenable to change if you brace them for it. Even better, do that to
> >> develop a rollout strategy in advance with the community. (You already
> know
> >> they want it; they asked for it. Right?)
> >>
> > The Foundation appears to be doing this 

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Profile of Magnus Manske

[Lydia Pintscher]

On Tue, Jan 19, 2016 at 4:58 PM, Jens Best  wrote:
> I'm not sure where you get your impressions, Magnus. But when I discuss
> ideas for a better implementation of Wikidata into Wikipedia to improve
> automatisation of repetitive editing procedures, including the
> implementation of the possible use of structured data, I rarely hear "It Is
> Not Made Here" or "It's Bad Because Its New".
>
> When it comes to analyse the problems with Wikidata it isn't only about
> possible early-lifecycle issues(which can be fix), but about the blind spot
> when it comes to develope working social processes which keep everybody
> (especially the editors) in the picture.
>
> Community involvement (especially consultations) are often seem to be
> organized only out of necessity. They not in the middle of the
> decision-making process. Nobody said that doing things the way they are
> done in a crowdsourced, community-driven process are easy, but this is no
> excuse for any Foundation or other similiar entity to set up an
> intransparent, precendents creating process where community becomes
> accessories.

I have spent a huge part of my waking hours over the past 4 years
making sure that community always comes first in Wikidata. And I will
continue to do so. But that doesn't mean that everyone always gets
their way because that is simply impossible with the demands people
have for Wikidata. What I have been doing and will continue to do is
to engage with people on a rational and non-agitated level and hear
them out so we can find ways to make it happen or get a better
understanding of why something can't be done (yet). What we have
created through this is an amazingly friendly, hard working and
reasonable community on Wikidata that I am proud of every single day.


Cheers
Lydia

-- 
Lydia Pintscher - http://about.me/lydia.pintscher
Product Manager for Wikidata

Wikimedia Deutschland e.V.
Tempelhofer Ufer 23-24
10963 Berlin
www.wikimedia.de

Wikimedia Deutschland - Gesellschaft zur Förderung Freien Wissens e. V.

Eingetragen im Vereinsregister des Amtsgerichts Berlin-Charlottenburg
unter der Nummer 23855 Nz. Als gemeinnützig anerkannt durch das
Finanzamt für Körperschaften I Berlin, Steuernummer 27/029/42207.

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] A page about new editors in different projects

[Ravishankar Ayyakkannu]

Amir,

We feature community member profiles in Tamil Wikipedia homepage and
Wikimedia India chapter archives. It gives a brief intro about their
background and links to their significant Wikimedia related contributions.

Tamil Wikipedia archive - https://ta.wikipedia.org/s/7pi

Wikimedia India acrhive for 2015 -
http://wiki.wikimedia.in/Featured_Wikimedian/Archive/2015

We do not interview but let them write these short profiles. There is also
a nomination process. While only more seasoned contributors are featured
this way, it is definitely a motivation for newcomers to contribute more.

Whenever there is a community gathering, we also try to create video
interviews.

Indian community interviews -
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCs-r163EeuFFPIhJHorSttw/videos?sort=dd_id=0=0

Tamil community interviews -
https://www.youtube.com/user/TamilWikimedia/videos?shelf_id=0=dd=0

These interviews then help us create mashups for social media promotion -
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=05PoBbwsZV0

Ravi
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] [Board-l] Fwd: WMF trustee Arnnon Geshuri and part in anticompetitive agreements in Google

[Pete Forsyth]

On Fri, Jan 22, 2016 at 2:00 PM, John Mark Vandenberg 
wrote:

> fwiw, A few days ago Jimmy disclosed that "James voted in favor of Arnnon".
> https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?diff=prev=700325768
>

It's known that the decision was unanimous among the 10 (then-)Trustees:
https://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Resolution:Appointing_Arnnon_Geshuri_as_Board_Member

-Pete
[[User:Peteforsyth]]
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] [Board-l] Fwd: WMF trustee Arnnon Geshuri and part in anticompetitive agreements in Google

[Alex Monk]

On 22 January 2016 at 22:00, John Mark Vandenberg  wrote:

> fwiw, A few days ago Jimmy disclosed that "James voted in favor of Arnnon".
> https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?diff=prev=700325768

I'm not sure I'd call it a disclosure since it had already been made public
11 days earlier:
https://wikimediafoundation.org/w/index.php?title=Resolution:Appointing_Arnnon_Geshuri_as_Board_Member=104421
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] The documentary film of Wikimedia Argentina now available. Happy birthday Wikipedia!

[Yury Bulka]

Oops. That is a problem and needs to be fixed, otherwise the video
should be deleted from Commons and relicensed as cc by-sa-nc. In the
current state the video is doubtfully a cc by-sa work.

At 09:15 there is a list of four items licensed under the noncommercial
license, which is obviously incompatible with the cc by-sa license and
Commons policies.

Also there's an item without a license stated:
Mistake (Davide Rossi re-work instrumental mix) by Moby courtesy of
mobygratis.com, a site the terms of which do not seem to be compatible
with the creative commons attribution share-alike license:
http://www.mobygratis.com/faq

There's a (relatively) easy fix: ask the authors of these files,
including the sound track, to send an OTRS permission explicitly
allowing cc by-sa use of these materials.

Additionally, it would be very good to have the used files listed in the
video description (as the creative commons license recommend providing
URLs to works if possible).

[[User:Yuriy Bulka]]



Ricordisamoa  writes:

> I see a bunch of "ATTRIBUTION-NONCOMMERCIAL 3.0 INTERNATIONAL LICENSE"
> at the end :-(
>
> Il 15/01/2016 23:50, Anna Torres ha scritto:
>> Dear all,
>>
>> Wikimedia Argentina has been working the last 6 months on a documentary
>> film based on the community, the editors and their work.
>>
>> Some weeks ago I sent you the trailer and now, after the party for the 15th
>> anniversary has passed and the film has already been launched in Argentina,
>> we are pleased to be sharing with you the result.
>>
>> Please, find it on the following links (all with subtitles in english)
>>
>> Wikimedia Commons->
>> In spanish:  here
>> 
>> In english -> here
>> 
>>
>> Youtube->here 
>>
>> Vimeo:here 
>>
>> Hope you like it
>>
>
>
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] The documentary film of Wikimedia Argentina now available. Happy birthday Wikipedia!

[Anna Torres]

Hi!!

We are looking at it and we are trying to fix it :) Thanks to all!

Hugs

2016-01-22 9:01 GMT-03:00 Yury Bulka :

> Oops. That is a problem and needs to be fixed, otherwise the video
> should be deleted from Commons and relicensed as cc by-sa-nc. In the
> current state the video is doubtfully a cc by-sa work.
>
> At 09:15 there is a list of four items licensed under the noncommercial
> license, which is obviously incompatible with the cc by-sa license and
> Commons policies.
>
> Also there's an item without a license stated:
> Mistake (Davide Rossi re-work instrumental mix) by Moby courtesy of
> mobygratis.com, a site the terms of which do not seem to be compatible
> with the creative commons attribution share-alike license:
> http://www.mobygratis.com/faq
>
> There's a (relatively) easy fix: ask the authors of these files,
> including the sound track, to send an OTRS permission explicitly
> allowing cc by-sa use of these materials.
>
> Additionally, it would be very good to have the used files listed in the
> video description (as the creative commons license recommend providing
> URLs to works if possible).
>
> [[User:Yuriy Bulka]]
>
>
>
> Ricordisamoa  writes:
>
> > I see a bunch of "ATTRIBUTION-NONCOMMERCIAL 3.0 INTERNATIONAL LICENSE"
> > at the end :-(
> >
> > Il 15/01/2016 23:50, Anna Torres ha scritto:
> >> Dear all,
> >>
> >> Wikimedia Argentina has been working the last 6 months on a documentary
> >> film based on the community, the editors and their work.
> >>
> >> Some weeks ago I sent you the trailer and now, after the party for the
> 15th
> >> anniversary has passed and the film has already been launched in
> Argentina,
> >> we are pleased to be sharing with you the result.
> >>
> >> Please, find it on the following links (all with subtitles in english)
> >>
> >> Wikimedia Commons->
> >> In spanish:  here
> >> 
> >> In english -> here
> >> 
> >>
> >> Youtube->here <
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UXokeuQFJnM=youtu.be>
> >>
> >> Vimeo:here 
> >>
> >> Hope you like it
> >>
> >
> >
> > ___
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> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
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> > 
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> 
>



-- 
Anna Torres Adell
Directora Ejecutiva
*A.C. Wikimedia Argentina*
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] COI - was Re: [Board-l] Fwd: WMF etc.

[Josh Lim]

Hi Fae,

I’m subscribed to this mailing list using a Yahoo! e-mail address, and the 
problem also happens in reverse: some e-mails end up in my spam folder.  The 
problem is so bad that I’m contemplating switching my subscription to a 
different e-mail address, but hopefully I won’t need to do that for the 
foreseeable future.

Is there anyone else here who’s subscribed using a Yahoo! address and has spam 
problems, either with their or others’ e-mails?

Josh

> Wiadomość napisana przez Fæ  w dniu 23.01.2016, o godz. 
> 01:38:
> 
> Sorry you've had to change email Florence.
> 
> (Tangent) Could those who use *Yahoo email addresses* ask their
> friends to check if their emails regularly end up in spam boxes? I
> have found several Yahoo users who write to this list getting marked
> as potential trojans by Google and I only find their emails a month
> later, by accident, if ever.
> 
> P.S. this is not a Google conspiracy theory.
> 
> Thanks,
> Fae
> 
> On 22 January 2016 at 14:41, Florence Devouard  > wrote:
>> Le 21/01/16 20:05, Dariusz Jemielniak a écrit :
>>> 
>>> hi Florence,
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Then I was astonished when I discovered that Dariusz, who has been a board
 
 member for over 6 months, was not aware of the existence of the Conflict
 of
 Interest Policy, which include a pledge of commitment and an obligation
 to
 disclose potential conflicts of interest. A policy voted by the board
 several years ago and mandatory for all board members. It is apparently
 not
 enforced anymore, even though it is an approved policy and obviously a
 good
 governance practice. This makes me think the board is not operating
 properly anymore on this serious matter.
 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> just to clarify this issue: I have been signing the COI
>>> pledges/disclosures
>>> over the last 4 years, as the FDC member, and later as a Board member.
>>> Apparently I did not make myself clear that I think it is worthwhile to
>>> consider PUBLIC statements (as proposed in the email I was replying to),
>>> and not statements in general (which we do have). It may have left you
>>> with
>>> a reading that I was unaware of the COI policy as a whole; I apologize for
>>> my clumsy phrasing.
>>> 
>>> best,
>>> 
>>> dariusz
>> 
>> 
>> My apologies Dariusz; This point was a misunderstanding on my part after
>> reading this msg from you :
>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikimedia-l/2016-January/080945.html
>> 
>> I am really happy to read your clarification and see that this point is in
>> fact not an issue. Good :)
>> 
>> I actually stayed in confusion because I commented it, but you never gave
>> any further feedback.
>> But some people warned me my emails got stuck in spambox...
>> I changed my email address for the lists this morning... sent a message...
>> and it got stuck in moderation !
>> Hopefully this one will work out...
>> 
>> 
>> Florence
> -- 
> fae...@gmail.com  
> https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Fae 
> 
> 
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> , 
>  >

JAMES JOSHUA G. LIM
Bachelor of Arts in Political Science
Class of 2013, Ateneo de Manila University
Quezon City, Metro Manila, Philippines

jamesjoshua...@yahoo.com  | +63 (915) 321-7582
Facebook/Twitter: akiestar | Wikimedia: Sky Harbor
http://about.me/josh.lim 
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[Wikimedia-l] COI - was Re: [Board-l] Fwd: WMF etc.

[Florence Devouard]

Le 21/01/16 20:05, Dariusz Jemielniak a écrit :

hi Florence,


Then I was astonished when I discovered that Dariusz, who has been a board

member for over 6 months, was not aware of the existence of the Conflict of
Interest Policy, which include a pledge of commitment and an obligation to
disclose potential conflicts of interest. A policy voted by the board
several years ago and mandatory for all board members. It is apparently not
enforced anymore, even though it is an approved policy and obviously a good
governance practice. This makes me think the board is not operating
properly anymore on this serious matter.




just to clarify this issue: I have been signing the COI pledges/disclosures
over the last 4 years, as the FDC member, and later as a Board member.
Apparently I did not make myself clear that I think it is worthwhile to
consider PUBLIC statements (as proposed in the email I was replying to),
and not statements in general (which we do have). It may have left you with
a reading that I was unaware of the COI policy as a whole; I apologize for
my clumsy phrasing.

best,

dariusz


My apologies Dariusz; This point was a misunderstanding on my part after 
reading this msg from you : 
https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikimedia-l/2016-January/080945.html


I am really happy to read your clarification and see that this point is 
in fact not an issue. Good :)


I actually stayed in confusion because I commented it, but you never 
gave any further feedback.

But some people warned me my emails got stuck in spambox...
I changed my email address for the lists this morning... sent a 
message... and it got stuck in moderation !

Hopefully this one will work out...


Florence

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] The documentary film of Wikimedia Argentina now available. Happy birthday Wikipedia!

[Yury Bulka]

Anna Torres  writes:

> Hi!!
>
> We are looking at it and we are trying to fix it :) Thanks to all!
Thank you, glad to hear:)

Best,
Yury.

>
> 2016-01-22 9:01 GMT-03:00 Yury Bulka :
>
>> Oops. That is a problem and needs to be fixed, otherwise the video
>> should be deleted from Commons and relicensed as cc by-sa-nc. In the
>> current state the video is doubtfully a cc by-sa work.
>>
>> At 09:15 there is a list of four items licensed under the noncommercial
>> license, which is obviously incompatible with the cc by-sa license and
>> Commons policies.
>>
>> Also there's an item without a license stated:
>> Mistake (Davide Rossi re-work instrumental mix) by Moby courtesy of
>> mobygratis.com, a site the terms of which do not seem to be compatible
>> with the creative commons attribution share-alike license:
>> http://www.mobygratis.com/faq
>>
>> There's a (relatively) easy fix: ask the authors of these files,
>> including the sound track, to send an OTRS permission explicitly
>> allowing cc by-sa use of these materials.
>>
>> Additionally, it would be very good to have the used files listed in the
>> video description (as the creative commons license recommend providing
>> URLs to works if possible).
>>
>> [[User:Yuriy Bulka]]
>>
>>
>>
>> Ricordisamoa  writes:
>>
>> > I see a bunch of "ATTRIBUTION-NONCOMMERCIAL 3.0 INTERNATIONAL LICENSE"
>> > at the end :-(
>> >
>> > Il 15/01/2016 23:50, Anna Torres ha scritto:
>> >> Dear all,
>> >>
>> >> Wikimedia Argentina has been working the last 6 months on a documentary
>> >> film based on the community, the editors and their work.
>> >>
>> >> Some weeks ago I sent you the trailer and now, after the party for the
>> 15th
>> >> anniversary has passed and the film has already been launched in
>> Argentina,
>> >> we are pleased to be sharing with you the result.
>> >>
>> >> Please, find it on the following links (all with subtitles in english)
>> >>
>> >> Wikimedia Commons->
>> >> In spanish:  here
>> >> 
>> >> In english -> here
>> >> 
>> >>
>> >> Youtube->here <
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UXokeuQFJnM=youtu.be>
>> >>
>> >> Vimeo:here 
>> >>
>> >> Hope you like it
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>> > ___
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>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
>> > New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
>> > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
>> > 
>>
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>> 
>>

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] WMF trustee Arnnon Geshuri and part in anticompetitive agreements in Google

[Todd Allen]

We are not "seeing movement" by a vague statement of "we're working on it".

In the case of James Heilman, they said essentially the same thing. What
resulted was a vague statement that used a lot of words to say nothing at
all. There needs to be full disclosure and specifics, not a lot of waffle.

We need a commitment to give a fully detailed statement by a specific time,
or else this isn't "movement", just delaying and obfuscating like last time.

Todd

On Thu, Jan 21, 2016 at 10:39 PM, Matthew Flaschen <
matthew.flasc...@gatech.edu> wrote:

> On 01/13/2016 12:00 PM, Fæ wrote:
>
>> Please make your timetable public, so that the community is reassured
>> that formal communications such as this letter to the board are not a
>> waste of time, and that the WMF chair is not only aware of community
>> concerns but is taking these questions seriously.
>>
>
> Thank you.
>
> I don't know if the board is able to make the timetable public, but I also
> think it's important that we know whether the board is still working on
> this issue, or whether they consider it done.
>
> To that effect, I appreciated your update yesterday (
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=Requests_for_comment/Vote_of_no_confidence_on_Arnnon_Geshuri/sig=prev=15265066),
> where you relayed that (per Patricio) the board is still discussing the
> issue.
>
> I am glad to know the Board is working on this.  It needs to be handled
> properly, but we also need to see movement.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Matt Flaschen
>
>
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] The documentary film of Wikimedia Argentina now available. Happy birthday Wikipedia!

[Anthony Cole]

Anyway, it's gorgeous. Well done all.

Anthony Cole


On Fri, Jan 22, 2016 at 9:15 PM, Yury Bulka  wrote:

>
> Anna Torres  writes:
>
> > Hi!!
> >
> > We are looking at it and we are trying to fix it :) Thanks to all!
> Thank you, glad to hear:)
>
> Best,
> Yury.
>
> >
> > 2016-01-22 9:01 GMT-03:00 Yury Bulka :
> >
> >> Oops. That is a problem and needs to be fixed, otherwise the video
> >> should be deleted from Commons and relicensed as cc by-sa-nc. In the
> >> current state the video is doubtfully a cc by-sa work.
> >>
> >> At 09:15 there is a list of four items licensed under the noncommercial
> >> license, which is obviously incompatible with the cc by-sa license and
> >> Commons policies.
> >>
> >> Also there's an item without a license stated:
> >> Mistake (Davide Rossi re-work instrumental mix) by Moby courtesy of
> >> mobygratis.com, a site the terms of which do not seem to be compatible
> >> with the creative commons attribution share-alike license:
> >> http://www.mobygratis.com/faq
> >>
> >> There's a (relatively) easy fix: ask the authors of these files,
> >> including the sound track, to send an OTRS permission explicitly
> >> allowing cc by-sa use of these materials.
> >>
> >> Additionally, it would be very good to have the used files listed in the
> >> video description (as the creative commons license recommend providing
> >> URLs to works if possible).
> >>
> >> [[User:Yuriy Bulka]]
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Ricordisamoa  writes:
> >>
> >> > I see a bunch of "ATTRIBUTION-NONCOMMERCIAL 3.0 INTERNATIONAL LICENSE"
> >> > at the end :-(
> >> >
> >> > Il 15/01/2016 23:50, Anna Torres ha scritto:
> >> >> Dear all,
> >> >>
> >> >> Wikimedia Argentina has been working the last 6 months on a
> documentary
> >> >> film based on the community, the editors and their work.
> >> >>
> >> >> Some weeks ago I sent you the trailer and now, after the party for
> the
> >> 15th
> >> >> anniversary has passed and the film has already been launched in
> >> Argentina,
> >> >> we are pleased to be sharing with you the result.
> >> >>
> >> >> Please, find it on the following links (all with subtitles in
> english)
> >> >>
> >> >> Wikimedia Commons->
> >> >> In spanish:  here
> >> >> 
> >> >> In english -> here
> >> >> 
> >> >>
> >> >> Youtube->here <
> >> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UXokeuQFJnM=youtu.be>
> >> >>
> >> >> Vimeo:here 
> >> >>
> >> >> Hope you like it
> >> >>
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > ___
> >> > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> >> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
> >> > New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> >> > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l
> ,
> >> > 
> >>
> >> ___
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> >> 
> >>
>
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] WMF trustee Arnnon Geshuri and part in anticompetitive agreements in Google

[Marc A. Pelletier]

On 2016-01-21 7:08 AM, Florence Devouard wrote:
Either the board is completely paralyzed and no more able to make any 
decision as to what they should do. Or the board has decided not to 
provide any feedback, which I consider completely disrespectful to the 
community and unhealthy generally.


It would seem to me, Florence, that the board has fallen into a very 
unhealthy pattern: when it becomes evident they have made a mistake, 
rather than own up to it and correct it they dig trenches and try to 
pretend nothing is wrong - letting things degenerate.  Ego?  Fear of 
appearing fallible?  Regardless of /why/, the effect is that they stick 
by a decision (I really hope) they know was bad.


And now they're doing it again with Arnnon, it seems.

-- Marc


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Re: [Wikimedia-l] WMF trustee Arnnon Geshuri and part in anticompetitive agreements in Google

[MZMcBride]

Florence Devouard wrote:
>I hesitate between two interpretations. Either the board is completely
>paralyzed and no more able to make any decision as to what they should
>do. Or the board has decided not to provide any feedback, which I
>consider completely disrespectful to the community and unhealthy
>generally. Either way, I consider this lack of responsiveness from the
>board an even WORSE consideration than Arnnon being a board member.
>
>I love you guys... Patricio, Alice, Frieda, Dariusz, Denny, and Jimbo
>(*). I love you very much. I know each of you. I value every one of you.
>You guys rock in most of what you do and I know it is hard. It is a big
>commitment, it is a lot of pressure, it is time-consuming. And I thank
>every one of you for your gardianship as well as boldness in taking some
>tough decisions.
>
>But here... I do not understand what you are doing. Please take my vote
>as a respectful record of my perplexity.
>
>(*)Citing community-born members only. Appointed members bring great
>perspective, but I do not expect them to know it all about Wikimedia
>community.

Very well put. Thank you for writing this e-mail.

MZMcBride



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Re: [Wikimedia-l] [Board-l] Fwd: WMF trustee Arnnon Geshuri and part in anticompetitive agreements in Google

[Florence Devouard]

Le 21/01/16 20:05, Dariusz Jemielniak a écrit :

hi Florence,


Then I was astonished when I discovered that Dariusz, who has been a board

member for over 6 months, was not aware of the existence of the Conflict of
Interest Policy, which include a pledge of commitment and an obligation to
disclose potential conflicts of interest. A policy voted by the board
several years ago and mandatory for all board members. It is apparently not
enforced anymore, even though it is an approved policy and obviously a good
governance practice. This makes me think the board is not operating
properly anymore on this serious matter.




just to clarify this issue: I have been signing the COI pledges/disclosures
over the last 4 years, as the FDC member, and later as a Board member.
Apparently I did not make myself clear that I think it is worthwhile to
consider PUBLIC statements (as proposed in the email I was replying to),
and not statements in general (which we do have). It may have left you with
a reading that I was unaware of the COI policy as a whole; I apologize for
my clumsy phrasing.

best,

dariusz


Thank you for that clarification Dariusz. I am happy to read that !

Misinterpretation on my part for what you wrote here : 
https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikimedia-l/2016-January/080945.html
After reading it again, it actually referred to public statements rather 
than private ones. And since you did not comment on the list when I 
raised the issue, my misinterpretation was not corrected. My apologies.


Flo




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Re: [Wikimedia-l] COI - was Re: [Board-l] Fwd: WMF etc.

[Fæ]

Sorry you've had to change email Florence.

(Tangent) Could those who use *Yahoo email addresses* ask their
friends to check if their emails regularly end up in spam boxes? I
have found several Yahoo users who write to this list getting marked
as potential trojans by Google and I only find their emails a month
later, by accident, if ever.

P.S. this is not a Google conspiracy theory.

Thanks,
Fae

On 22 January 2016 at 14:41, Florence Devouard  wrote:
> Le 21/01/16 20:05, Dariusz Jemielniak a écrit :
>>
>> hi Florence,
>>
>>
>> Then I was astonished when I discovered that Dariusz, who has been a board
>>>
>>> member for over 6 months, was not aware of the existence of the Conflict
>>> of
>>> Interest Policy, which include a pledge of commitment and an obligation
>>> to
>>> disclose potential conflicts of interest. A policy voted by the board
>>> several years ago and mandatory for all board members. It is apparently
>>> not
>>> enforced anymore, even though it is an approved policy and obviously a
>>> good
>>> governance practice. This makes me think the board is not operating
>>> properly anymore on this serious matter.
>>>
>>
>>
>> just to clarify this issue: I have been signing the COI
>> pledges/disclosures
>> over the last 4 years, as the FDC member, and later as a Board member.
>> Apparently I did not make myself clear that I think it is worthwhile to
>> consider PUBLIC statements (as proposed in the email I was replying to),
>> and not statements in general (which we do have). It may have left you
>> with
>> a reading that I was unaware of the COI policy as a whole; I apologize for
>> my clumsy phrasing.
>>
>> best,
>>
>> dariusz
>
>
> My apologies Dariusz; This point was a misunderstanding on my part after
> reading this msg from you :
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikimedia-l/2016-January/080945.html
>
> I am really happy to read your clarification and see that this point is in
> fact not an issue. Good :)
>
> I actually stayed in confusion because I commented it, but you never gave
> any further feedback.
> But some people warned me my emails got stuck in spambox...
> I changed my email address for the lists this morning... sent a message...
> and it got stuck in moderation !
> Hopefully this one will work out...
>
>
> Florence
-- 
fae...@gmail.com https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Fae

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