Re: [WISPA] 3.65 needs more lobbying (was Re: One Ring Networks ToRollout New WiMAX Service)
Ping me offlist for any pricing on Airspan. David Peterson WirelessGuys Inc. 'On 1/25/08 12:10 PM, Eric Muehleisen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm sorry guys. Price was not discussed. A quote will be delivered to me shortly. I will post cost as soon as I see it. I'm hoping early next week. I do have a sales order for one Redline RedMAX base station with outdoor CPE if anyone is interested...offlist. FYI...I'm not in any shape or form affiliated with Airspan or Redline. We are an Internet Service Provider serving the greater Midwestern Kansas. Eric Muehleisen Sr. Internet Technology Specialist Nex-Tech - Lightning Jack 785.625.7070 office 785.621.2980 voip George Rogato wrote: Only thing I want to know is the price range, offlist if you must. But I'm sure everyone is curious. Thanks George Eric Muehleisen wrote: We just completed a demo of Airspan's Hipermax in Emporia, Kansas yesterday. Stutler Technologies hosted us as they are one of the largest systems integrators for Airspan. I must say that I was very impressed with it's NLOS performance. We tested both the indoor self install and the outdoor ST Pro CPE. We achieve 6mb/s indoor at 2 miles NLOS. The base station was a 1 sector install using diversity at approximately. 50ft up on tower using 120 degree sectors. Email me offlist if you'd like more info and whitepapers from our testing. -Eric jeffrey thomas wrote: All, Aperto actually has a really killer product launching next month in 3.65. I would state its a lot more stable than Redline's product due to their secret sauce. Its the same platform that is winning carriers overseas. Airspan- yes absolutely can give you up to 10w EIRP legal- so your coverage area for fixed is literally insane- 15km NLOS @ bpsk is possible, according to their calculator tool. outdoor cpe is around 600 or so in single piece qty- talk to wireless guys to buy or other resellers. BTW, I believe they just joined Wispa as a vendor member, for those that sent me private mails asking them to join. - Jeff On Sat, 12 Jan 2008 16:19:44 -0600, Mike Hammett [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: So then Airspan can go further (more applicable to rural markets)? If Redline's 15 mbit throughput per 7.5 MHz is correct and is similar to other products in this band, a 10 MHz product would have 20 mbit throughput. I'm working on an Enterprise level service, so it seems like Redline's AN-80 is the only high quality product that actually has throughput capabilities. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Gino Villarini [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Saturday, January 12, 2008 11:26 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] 3.65 needs more lobbying (was Re: One Ring Networks ToRollout New WiMAX Service) IIRC, 3.65 ghz rules allow 1 watt EIRP per each mhz of bandwidth, thus a 7.5 Mhz Radio would be allowed 7.5 Watts of EIRP, 10 Mhz radio would be 10 Watts EIRP ... Redline cert does not reflect this... don't know why Airspan certification does get really close to it Mind me but 10 Watts EIRP if allot (about 40 db) Vendors should seek maybe 15 or 20 mhz channels Gino A. Villarini [EMAIL PROTECTED] Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp. tel 787.273.4143 fax 787.273.4145 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Matt Liotta Sent: Saturday, January 12, 2008 1:12 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] 3.65 needs more lobbying (was Re: One Ring Networks To Rollout New WiMAX Service) As much as I like seeing One Ring's name over and over I figured I switch the subject line to match the tread. Mike's comments below are accurate with regard to Redline's equipment. However, it should be noted that Redline was not able to get their gear certified at the full power output allowable for 3.65. It is for this reason that Redline does not believe its gear will work in rural markets. Remember, 3.65 was originally supposed to be for the rural market, which means either Redline went wrong somewhere or the FCC did. Additionally, Redline has not sought to get its indoor CPE certified for 3.65 because of the power issue. That means urban operators are not able to offer self-install options that would greater speed up the rollout process. I believe WISPA should be working with the 3.65 radio vendors and the FCC to get things fixed such that there will be a greater opportunity for operators to provide services using 3.65. -Matt Mike Hammett wrote: The guys at Redline said their equipment is power limited due to FCC limitations. My point of view is based on Redline's statement of what their gear can do coupled with the documents filed with the FCC
Re: [WISPA] 3.65 needs more lobbying (was Re: One Ring Networks ToRollout New WiMAX Service)
hipermax = super damn expensive- George I can send you a quote from a reseller off list- micromax= cheaper than VL. On Fri, 25 Jan 2008 08:38:01 -0800, George Rogato [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: Only thing I want to know is the price range, offlist if you must. But I'm sure everyone is curious. Thanks George Eric Muehleisen wrote: We just completed a demo of Airspan's Hipermax in Emporia, Kansas yesterday. Stutler Technologies hosted us as they are one of the largest systems integrators for Airspan. I must say that I was very impressed with it's NLOS performance. We tested both the indoor self install and the outdoor ST Pro CPE. We achieve 6mb/s indoor at 2 miles NLOS. The base station was a 1 sector install using diversity at approximately. 50ft up on tower using 120 degree sectors. Email me offlist if you'd like more info and whitepapers from our testing. -Eric jeffrey thomas wrote: All, Aperto actually has a really killer product launching next month in 3.65. I would state its a lot more stable than Redline's product due to their secret sauce. Its the same platform that is winning carriers overseas. Airspan- yes absolutely can give you up to 10w EIRP legal- so your coverage area for fixed is literally insane- 15km NLOS @ bpsk is possible, according to their calculator tool. outdoor cpe is around 600 or so in single piece qty- talk to wireless guys to buy or other resellers. BTW, I believe they just joined Wispa as a vendor member, for those that sent me private mails asking them to join. - Jeff On Sat, 12 Jan 2008 16:19:44 -0600, Mike Hammett [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: So then Airspan can go further (more applicable to rural markets)? If Redline's 15 mbit throughput per 7.5 MHz is correct and is similar to other products in this band, a 10 MHz product would have 20 mbit throughput. I'm working on an Enterprise level service, so it seems like Redline's AN-80 is the only high quality product that actually has throughput capabilities. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Gino Villarini [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Saturday, January 12, 2008 11:26 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] 3.65 needs more lobbying (was Re: One Ring Networks ToRollout New WiMAX Service) IIRC, 3.65 ghz rules allow 1 watt EIRP per each mhz of bandwidth, thus a 7.5 Mhz Radio would be allowed 7.5 Watts of EIRP, 10 Mhz radio would be 10 Watts EIRP ... Redline cert does not reflect this... don't know why Airspan certification does get really close to it Mind me but 10 Watts EIRP if allot (about 40 db) Vendors should seek maybe 15 or 20 mhz channels Gino A. Villarini [EMAIL PROTECTED] Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp. tel 787.273.4143 fax 787.273.4145 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Matt Liotta Sent: Saturday, January 12, 2008 1:12 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] 3.65 needs more lobbying (was Re: One Ring Networks To Rollout New WiMAX Service) As much as I like seeing One Ring's name over and over I figured I switch the subject line to match the tread. Mike's comments below are accurate with regard to Redline's equipment. However, it should be noted that Redline was not able to get their gear certified at the full power output allowable for 3.65. It is for this reason that Redline does not believe its gear will work in rural markets. Remember, 3.65 was originally supposed to be for the rural market, which means either Redline went wrong somewhere or the FCC did. Additionally, Redline has not sought to get its indoor CPE certified for 3.65 because of the power issue. That means urban operators are not able to offer self-install options that would greater speed up the rollout process. I believe WISPA should be working with the 3.65 radio vendors and the FCC to get things fixed such that there will be a greater opportunity for operators to provide services using 3.65. -Matt Mike Hammett wrote: The guys at Redline said their equipment is power limited due to FCC limitations. My point of view is based on Redline's statement of what their gear can do coupled with the documents filed with the FCC for their certification. The most I could get out of a PtP link was about 7 miles. With a 90* sector, only about 5 miles. I agree that all else the same 3.65 is better than 5.x GHz, only it isn't because the power isn't there. The throughput isn't there for WiMax compliant equipment due to small channels. If there were larger channel sizes, yes, it would support higher throughput applications. According
Re: [WISPA] 3.65 needs more lobbying (was Re: One Ring Networks ToRollout New WiMAX Service)
and actually Aperto has 21 mb throughput on a 7mhz channel On Sat, 12 Jan 2008 16:19:44 -0600, Mike Hammett [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: So then Airspan can go further (more applicable to rural markets)? If Redline's 15 mbit throughput per 7.5 MHz is correct and is similar to other products in this band, a 10 MHz product would have 20 mbit throughput. I'm working on an Enterprise level service, so it seems like Redline's AN-80 is the only high quality product that actually has throughput capabilities. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Gino Villarini [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Saturday, January 12, 2008 11:26 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] 3.65 needs more lobbying (was Re: One Ring Networks ToRollout New WiMAX Service) IIRC, 3.65 ghz rules allow 1 watt EIRP per each mhz of bandwidth, thus a 7.5 Mhz Radio would be allowed 7.5 Watts of EIRP, 10 Mhz radio would be 10 Watts EIRP ... Redline cert does not reflect this... don't know why Airspan certification does get really close to it Mind me but 10 Watts EIRP if allot (about 40 db) Vendors should seek maybe 15 or 20 mhz channels Gino A. Villarini [EMAIL PROTECTED] Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp. tel 787.273.4143 fax 787.273.4145 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Matt Liotta Sent: Saturday, January 12, 2008 1:12 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] 3.65 needs more lobbying (was Re: One Ring Networks To Rollout New WiMAX Service) As much as I like seeing One Ring's name over and over I figured I switch the subject line to match the tread. Mike's comments below are accurate with regard to Redline's equipment. However, it should be noted that Redline was not able to get their gear certified at the full power output allowable for 3.65. It is for this reason that Redline does not believe its gear will work in rural markets. Remember, 3.65 was originally supposed to be for the rural market, which means either Redline went wrong somewhere or the FCC did. Additionally, Redline has not sought to get its indoor CPE certified for 3.65 because of the power issue. That means urban operators are not able to offer self-install options that would greater speed up the rollout process. I believe WISPA should be working with the 3.65 radio vendors and the FCC to get things fixed such that there will be a greater opportunity for operators to provide services using 3.65. -Matt Mike Hammett wrote: The guys at Redline said their equipment is power limited due to FCC limitations. My point of view is based on Redline's statement of what their gear can do coupled with the documents filed with the FCC for their certification. The most I could get out of a PtP link was about 7 miles. With a 90* sector, only about 5 miles. I agree that all else the same 3.65 is better than 5.x GHz, only it isn't because the power isn't there. The throughput isn't there for WiMax compliant equipment due to small channels. If there were larger channel sizes, yes, it would support higher throughput applications. According to Redline, 7.5 MHz only gets about 15 megs of throughput with WiMax. Redline explicitly said 3.65 GHz isn't for rural applications due to the power. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe
Re: [WISPA] 3.65 needs more lobbying (was Re: One Ring Networks ToRollout New WiMAX Service)
They later corrected me that it does 23 mbit throughput max... the 15 was a real world example with clients of varying signal strengths and modulations. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: jeffrey thomas [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org; WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Friday, January 25, 2008 10:13 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] 3.65 needs more lobbying (was Re: One Ring Networks ToRollout New WiMAX Service) and actually Aperto has 21 mb throughput on a 7mhz channel On Sat, 12 Jan 2008 16:19:44 -0600, Mike Hammett [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: So then Airspan can go further (more applicable to rural markets)? If Redline's 15 mbit throughput per 7.5 MHz is correct and is similar to other products in this band, a 10 MHz product would have 20 mbit throughput. I'm working on an Enterprise level service, so it seems like Redline's AN-80 is the only high quality product that actually has throughput capabilities. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Gino Villarini [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Saturday, January 12, 2008 11:26 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] 3.65 needs more lobbying (was Re: One Ring Networks ToRollout New WiMAX Service) IIRC, 3.65 ghz rules allow 1 watt EIRP per each mhz of bandwidth, thus a 7.5 Mhz Radio would be allowed 7.5 Watts of EIRP, 10 Mhz radio would be 10 Watts EIRP ... Redline cert does not reflect this... don't know why Airspan certification does get really close to it Mind me but 10 Watts EIRP if allot (about 40 db) Vendors should seek maybe 15 or 20 mhz channels Gino A. Villarini [EMAIL PROTECTED] Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp. tel 787.273.4143 fax 787.273.4145 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Matt Liotta Sent: Saturday, January 12, 2008 1:12 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] 3.65 needs more lobbying (was Re: One Ring Networks To Rollout New WiMAX Service) As much as I like seeing One Ring's name over and over I figured I switch the subject line to match the tread. Mike's comments below are accurate with regard to Redline's equipment. However, it should be noted that Redline was not able to get their gear certified at the full power output allowable for 3.65. It is for this reason that Redline does not believe its gear will work in rural markets. Remember, 3.65 was originally supposed to be for the rural market, which means either Redline went wrong somewhere or the FCC did. Additionally, Redline has not sought to get its indoor CPE certified for 3.65 because of the power issue. That means urban operators are not able to offer self-install options that would greater speed up the rollout process. I believe WISPA should be working with the 3.65 radio vendors and the FCC to get things fixed such that there will be a greater opportunity for operators to provide services using 3.65. -Matt Mike Hammett wrote: The guys at Redline said their equipment is power limited due to FCC limitations. My point of view is based on Redline's statement of what their gear can do coupled with the documents filed with the FCC for their certification. The most I could get out of a PtP link was about 7 miles. With a 90* sector, only about 5 miles. I agree that all else the same 3.65 is better than 5.x GHz, only it isn't because the power isn't there. The throughput isn't there for WiMax compliant equipment due to small channels. If there were larger channel sizes, yes, it would support higher throughput applications. According to Redline, 7.5 MHz only gets about 15 megs of throughput with WiMax. Redline explicitly said 3.65 GHz isn't for rural applications due to the power. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org
Re: [WISPA] 3.65 needs more lobbying (was Re: One Ring Networks ToRollout New WiMAX Service)
Jeff, This is incorrect about Airspan joining as a vendor member. I do however invite their participation in WISPA and I hope that they do join. I have not even seen a request for membership or an invoice sent to them yet. If they are interested in joining, have the person in the know contact me or go on the WISPA homepage and fill out the form at http://signup.wispa.org/wispa-newacct.html. Thanks, Rick -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of jeffrey thomas Sent: Friday, January 25, 2008 11:13 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] 3.65 needs more lobbying (was Re: One Ring Networks ToRollout New WiMAX Service) All, Aperto actually has a really killer product launching next month in 3.65. I would state its a lot more stable than Redline's product due to their secret sauce. Its the same platform that is winning carriers overseas. Airspan- yes absolutely can give you up to 10w EIRP legal- so your coverage area for fixed is literally insane- 15km NLOS @ bpsk is possible, according to their calculator tool. outdoor cpe is around 600 or so in single piece qty- talk to wireless guys to buy or other resellers. BTW, I believe they just joined Wispa as a vendor member, for those that sent me private mails asking them to join. - Jeff On Sat, 12 Jan 2008 16:19:44 -0600, Mike Hammett [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: So then Airspan can go further (more applicable to rural markets)? If Redline's 15 mbit throughput per 7.5 MHz is correct and is similar to other products in this band, a 10 MHz product would have 20 mbit throughput. I'm working on an Enterprise level service, so it seems like Redline's AN-80 is the only high quality product that actually has throughput capabilities. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Gino Villarini [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Saturday, January 12, 2008 11:26 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] 3.65 needs more lobbying (was Re: One Ring Networks ToRollout New WiMAX Service) IIRC, 3.65 ghz rules allow 1 watt EIRP per each mhz of bandwidth, thus a 7.5 Mhz Radio would be allowed 7.5 Watts of EIRP, 10 Mhz radio would be 10 Watts EIRP ... Redline cert does not reflect this... don't know why Airspan certification does get really close to it Mind me but 10 Watts EIRP if allot (about 40 db) Vendors should seek maybe 15 or 20 mhz channels Gino A. Villarini [EMAIL PROTECTED] Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp. tel 787.273.4143 fax 787.273.4145 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Matt Liotta Sent: Saturday, January 12, 2008 1:12 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] 3.65 needs more lobbying (was Re: One Ring Networks To Rollout New WiMAX Service) As much as I like seeing One Ring's name over and over I figured I switch the subject line to match the tread. Mike's comments below are accurate with regard to Redline's equipment. However, it should be noted that Redline was not able to get their gear certified at the full power output allowable for 3.65. It is for this reason that Redline does not believe its gear will work in rural markets. Remember, 3.65 was originally supposed to be for the rural market, which means either Redline went wrong somewhere or the FCC did. Additionally, Redline has not sought to get its indoor CPE certified for 3.65 because of the power issue. That means urban operators are not able to offer self-install options that would greater speed up the rollout process. I believe WISPA should be working with the 3.65 radio vendors and the FCC to get things fixed such that there will be a greater opportunity for operators to provide services using 3.65. -Matt Mike Hammett wrote: The guys at Redline said their equipment is power limited due to FCC limitations. My point of view is based on Redline's statement of what their gear can do coupled with the documents filed with the FCC for their certification. The most I could get out of a PtP link was about 7 miles. With a 90* sector, only about 5 miles. I agree that all else the same 3.65 is better than 5.x GHz, only it isn't because the power isn't there. The throughput isn't there for WiMax compliant equipment due to small channels. If there were larger channel sizes, yes, it would support higher throughput applications. According to Redline, 7.5 MHz only gets about 15 megs of throughput with WiMax. Redline explicitly said 3.65 GHz isn't for rural applications due to the power. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA
Re: [WISPA] 3.65 needs more lobbying (was Re: One Ring Networks ToRollout New WiMAX Service)
I'm sorry guys. Price was not discussed. A quote will be delivered to me shortly. I will post cost as soon as I see it. I'm hoping early next week. I do have a sales order for one Redline RedMAX base station with outdoor CPE if anyone is interested...offlist. FYI...I'm not in any shape or form affiliated with Airspan or Redline. We are an Internet Service Provider serving the greater Midwestern Kansas. Eric Muehleisen Sr. Internet Technology Specialist Nex-Tech - Lightning Jack 785.625.7070 office 785.621.2980 voip George Rogato wrote: Only thing I want to know is the price range, offlist if you must. But I'm sure everyone is curious. Thanks George Eric Muehleisen wrote: We just completed a demo of Airspan's Hipermax in Emporia, Kansas yesterday. Stutler Technologies hosted us as they are one of the largest systems integrators for Airspan. I must say that I was very impressed with it's NLOS performance. We tested both the indoor self install and the outdoor ST Pro CPE. We achieve 6mb/s indoor at 2 miles NLOS. The base station was a 1 sector install using diversity at approximately. 50ft up on tower using 120 degree sectors. Email me offlist if you'd like more info and whitepapers from our testing. -Eric jeffrey thomas wrote: All, Aperto actually has a really killer product launching next month in 3.65. I would state its a lot more stable than Redline's product due to their secret sauce. Its the same platform that is winning carriers overseas. Airspan- yes absolutely can give you up to 10w EIRP legal- so your coverage area for fixed is literally insane- 15km NLOS @ bpsk is possible, according to their calculator tool. outdoor cpe is around 600 or so in single piece qty- talk to wireless guys to buy or other resellers. BTW, I believe they just joined Wispa as a vendor member, for those that sent me private mails asking them to join. - Jeff On Sat, 12 Jan 2008 16:19:44 -0600, Mike Hammett [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: So then Airspan can go further (more applicable to rural markets)? If Redline's 15 mbit throughput per 7.5 MHz is correct and is similar to other products in this band, a 10 MHz product would have 20 mbit throughput. I'm working on an Enterprise level service, so it seems like Redline's AN-80 is the only high quality product that actually has throughput capabilities. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Gino Villarini [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Saturday, January 12, 2008 11:26 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] 3.65 needs more lobbying (was Re: One Ring Networks ToRollout New WiMAX Service) IIRC, 3.65 ghz rules allow 1 watt EIRP per each mhz of bandwidth, thus a 7.5 Mhz Radio would be allowed 7.5 Watts of EIRP, 10 Mhz radio would be 10 Watts EIRP ... Redline cert does not reflect this... don't know why Airspan certification does get really close to it Mind me but 10 Watts EIRP if allot (about 40 db) Vendors should seek maybe 15 or 20 mhz channels Gino A. Villarini [EMAIL PROTECTED] Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp. tel 787.273.4143 fax 787.273.4145 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Matt Liotta Sent: Saturday, January 12, 2008 1:12 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] 3.65 needs more lobbying (was Re: One Ring Networks To Rollout New WiMAX Service) As much as I like seeing One Ring's name over and over I figured I switch the subject line to match the tread. Mike's comments below are accurate with regard to Redline's equipment. However, it should be noted that Redline was not able to get their gear certified at the full power output allowable for 3.65. It is for this reason that Redline does not believe its gear will work in rural markets. Remember, 3.65 was originally supposed to be for the rural market, which means either Redline went wrong somewhere or the FCC did. Additionally, Redline has not sought to get its indoor CPE certified for 3.65 because of the power issue. That means urban operators are not able to offer self-install options that would greater speed up the rollout process. I believe WISPA should be working with the 3.65 radio vendors and the FCC to get things fixed such that there will be a greater opportunity for operators to provide services using 3.65. -Matt Mike Hammett wrote: The guys at Redline said their equipment is power limited due to FCC limitations. My point of view is based on Redline's statement of what their gear can do coupled with the documents filed with the FCC for their certification. The most I could get out of a PtP link was about 7 miles. With a 90* sector, only about 5 miles. I agree that all else the same 3.65 is better than 5.x GHz, only
Re: [WISPA] 3.65 needs more lobbying (was Re: One Ring Networks ToRollout New WiMAX Service)
We just completed a demo of Airspan's Hipermax in Emporia, Kansas yesterday. Stutler Technologies hosted us as they are one of the largest systems integrators for Airspan. I must say that I was very impressed with it's NLOS performance. We tested both the indoor self install and the outdoor ST Pro CPE. We achieve 6mb/s indoor at 2 miles NLOS. The base station was a 1 sector install using diversity at approximately. 50ft up on tower using 120 degree sectors. Email me offlist if you'd like more info and whitepapers from our testing. -Eric jeffrey thomas wrote: All, Aperto actually has a really killer product launching next month in 3.65. I would state its a lot more stable than Redline's product due to their secret sauce. Its the same platform that is winning carriers overseas. Airspan- yes absolutely can give you up to 10w EIRP legal- so your coverage area for fixed is literally insane- 15km NLOS @ bpsk is possible, according to their calculator tool. outdoor cpe is around 600 or so in single piece qty- talk to wireless guys to buy or other resellers. BTW, I believe they just joined Wispa as a vendor member, for those that sent me private mails asking them to join. - Jeff On Sat, 12 Jan 2008 16:19:44 -0600, Mike Hammett [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: So then Airspan can go further (more applicable to rural markets)? If Redline's 15 mbit throughput per 7.5 MHz is correct and is similar to other products in this band, a 10 MHz product would have 20 mbit throughput. I'm working on an Enterprise level service, so it seems like Redline's AN-80 is the only high quality product that actually has throughput capabilities. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Gino Villarini [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Saturday, January 12, 2008 11:26 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] 3.65 needs more lobbying (was Re: One Ring Networks ToRollout New WiMAX Service) IIRC, 3.65 ghz rules allow 1 watt EIRP per each mhz of bandwidth, thus a 7.5 Mhz Radio would be allowed 7.5 Watts of EIRP, 10 Mhz radio would be 10 Watts EIRP ... Redline cert does not reflect this... don't know why Airspan certification does get really close to it Mind me but 10 Watts EIRP if allot (about 40 db) Vendors should seek maybe 15 or 20 mhz channels Gino A. Villarini [EMAIL PROTECTED] Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp. tel 787.273.4143 fax 787.273.4145 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Matt Liotta Sent: Saturday, January 12, 2008 1:12 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] 3.65 needs more lobbying (was Re: One Ring Networks To Rollout New WiMAX Service) As much as I like seeing One Ring's name over and over I figured I switch the subject line to match the tread. Mike's comments below are accurate with regard to Redline's equipment. However, it should be noted that Redline was not able to get their gear certified at the full power output allowable for 3.65. It is for this reason that Redline does not believe its gear will work in rural markets. Remember, 3.65 was originally supposed to be for the rural market, which means either Redline went wrong somewhere or the FCC did. Additionally, Redline has not sought to get its indoor CPE certified for 3.65 because of the power issue. That means urban operators are not able to offer self-install options that would greater speed up the rollout process. I believe WISPA should be working with the 3.65 radio vendors and the FCC to get things fixed such that there will be a greater opportunity for operators to provide services using 3.65. -Matt Mike Hammett wrote: The guys at Redline said their equipment is power limited due to FCC limitations. My point of view is based on Redline's statement of what their gear can do coupled with the documents filed with the FCC for their certification. The most I could get out of a PtP link was about 7 miles. With a 90* sector, only about 5 miles. I agree that all else the same 3.65 is better than 5.x GHz, only it isn't because the power isn't there. The throughput isn't there for WiMax compliant equipment due to small channels. If there were larger channel sizes, yes, it would support higher throughput applications. According to Redline, 7.5 MHz only gets about 15 megs of throughput with WiMax. Redline explicitly said 3.65 GHz isn't for rural applications due to the power. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http
Re: [WISPA] 3.65 needs more lobbying (was Re: One Ring Networks ToRollout New WiMAX Service)
So then Airspan can go further (more applicable to rural markets)? If Redline's 15 mbit throughput per 7.5 MHz is correct and is similar to other products in this band, a 10 MHz product would have 20 mbit throughput. I'm working on an Enterprise level service, so it seems like Redline's AN-80 is the only high quality product that actually has throughput capabilities. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Gino Villarini [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Saturday, January 12, 2008 11:26 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] 3.65 needs more lobbying (was Re: One Ring Networks ToRollout New WiMAX Service) IIRC, 3.65 ghz rules allow 1 watt EIRP per each mhz of bandwidth, thus a 7.5 Mhz Radio would be allowed 7.5 Watts of EIRP, 10 Mhz radio would be 10 Watts EIRP ... Redline cert does not reflect this... don't know why Airspan certification does get really close to it Mind me but 10 Watts EIRP if allot (about 40 db) Vendors should seek maybe 15 or 20 mhz channels Gino A. Villarini [EMAIL PROTECTED] Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp. tel 787.273.4143 fax 787.273.4145 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Matt Liotta Sent: Saturday, January 12, 2008 1:12 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] 3.65 needs more lobbying (was Re: One Ring Networks To Rollout New WiMAX Service) As much as I like seeing One Ring's name over and over I figured I switch the subject line to match the tread. Mike's comments below are accurate with regard to Redline's equipment. However, it should be noted that Redline was not able to get their gear certified at the full power output allowable for 3.65. It is for this reason that Redline does not believe its gear will work in rural markets. Remember, 3.65 was originally supposed to be for the rural market, which means either Redline went wrong somewhere or the FCC did. Additionally, Redline has not sought to get its indoor CPE certified for 3.65 because of the power issue. That means urban operators are not able to offer self-install options that would greater speed up the rollout process. I believe WISPA should be working with the 3.65 radio vendors and the FCC to get things fixed such that there will be a greater opportunity for operators to provide services using 3.65. -Matt Mike Hammett wrote: The guys at Redline said their equipment is power limited due to FCC limitations. My point of view is based on Redline's statement of what their gear can do coupled with the documents filed with the FCC for their certification. The most I could get out of a PtP link was about 7 miles. With a 90* sector, only about 5 miles. I agree that all else the same 3.65 is better than 5.x GHz, only it isn't because the power isn't there. The throughput isn't there for WiMax compliant equipment due to small channels. If there were larger channel sizes, yes, it would support higher throughput applications. According to Redline, 7.5 MHz only gets about 15 megs of throughput with WiMax. Redline explicitly said 3.65 GHz isn't for rural applications due to the power. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
