Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
Agreed. I don't intend on buying anything Cisco. Over priced, under performing, and their we will screw you whether you like it or not policies. No thanks, someone else, please. Thankfully all I had to purchase was a couple of VoIP phones to encounter that problem vs. routing equipment. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: jp j...@saucer.midcoast.com Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 4:21 PM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards? Cisco isn't going to provide legal advice or legal fact. That's what our own lawyers are for. It's easier to use something else than to try to legally challenge cisco. If they have a policy for it, it means it's likely a common problem and they want a uniform response to it from their company and distributors. Just like we have an AUP that we expect our users to be to comply with. I haven't bought any cisco routers for a long time because of this, new or used. On Wed, Jun 03, 2009 at 05:09:05PM -0400, Matt Liotta wrote: That is a policy statement. It is not legal fact. -Matt On Jun 3, 2009, at 4:31 PM, Jeff Broadwick wrote: From Cisco's own website: Policy: Cisco's current policy is that Software is not transferable without Cisco's prior written consent and payment of any license fee (License Fee) unless one of the exceptions below in the Exceptions section applies. Regardless of whether a License Fee is payable under this Policy, the transferee may be required to pay Service inspection or reinstatement fees in accordance with Cisco policies located here. http://www.cisco.com/en/US/prod/cisco_software_transfer_relicensing_policy.h tml Jeff ImageStream -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Matt Liotta Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 4:20 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards? That was worthless... don't take your word, take some some blogger's word. -Matt On Jun 3, 2009, at 4:03 PM, Jeff Broadwick wrote: It's not FUD Matt. It's real. I have a pricelist from them with the fees required to relicense gear...might as well buy the new ones. Don't take my word: http://www.networkworld.com/community/node/14756 Jeff ImageStream -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Matt Liotta Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 3:53 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards? On Jun 3, 2009, at 3:49 PM, David E. Smith wrote: Did Cisco ever come to their senses on IOS licensing? Used to be, the software on a Cisco router was licensed to an entity separate from the purchase of the hardware. Thus, if you bought a router used, its (already-installed) copy of IOS was unlicensed and you'd have to buy a new software license to use the router. That is FUD from competing vendors. -Matt WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org
Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
Mike Hammett wrote: Agreed. I don't intend on buying anything Cisco. Over priced, under performing, and their we will screw you whether you like it or not policies. No thanks, someone else, please. One of my clients (a big cable company) just bought hundreds of thousands of dollars of Cisco gear, only to find that it's going to be end of life in just a few months. Their Cisco rep royally screwed them on that one, and when they complained, they got nowhere and have since started to move to other vendors. Another client of mine in the City of San Jose is really careful about buying anything Cisco-related after a big Cisco scandal a few years ago. Apparently they tried to move some Cisco gear at the 11th hour into some big proposal, and it went over like a fart in church when people found out (it was a VoIP install, if I remember right). Now they use Nortel, NOT Cisco. It is my experience that Cisco reps are pretty brazen about their antics. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
Cisco 2960G-24's are an option too. John Jon Auer wrote: I second that. We use 7200s trunked to, variously, 3500XLs, 3550s, and Zyxel switches. For gig ports go with a NPE-G1/G2 for routing and a 3560 as a port expander. Dot1q subinterfaces are your friend. On Wed, Jun 3, 2009 at 1:16 PM, Gino Villarini g...@aeronetpr.com wrote: Switch and vlan Gino A. Villarini g...@aeronetpr.com Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp. tel 787.273.4143 fax 787.273.4145 -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Matt Jenkins Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 2:06 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards? Even if I go to a NPE-G1 or G2 I still need a total of 5 ports. 1 for inbound connection. 2 for outbound to radios that serve different towers 1 for local network of servers etc. 1 for colo customer. How do I add those other two ports? Randy Cosby wrote: Which NPE are you using? Randy Matt Jenkins wrote: I have a 7204VXR router as my core. I am looking at upgrading from a 100mb ethernet to a gigE. I am having a really hard time find out how I can add gigabit ethernet (via RJ-45 connectors) to this router. I have two spare slots of expansion cards but I cannot find a card that does gig. Can anyone point me in the right direction? Thanks, - Matt - --- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ - --- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
If you guys want to bash Cisco, that's your perogative, but my experience has been somewhat different. We recently took on a new client that has some Cisco switches that their old VAR sols them 5 YEARs of Smartnets on. Since we are looking at them upgrading to some new equipment, we asked Cisco if they would be willing to do something for the client, and they said yes, they are willing to credit them for existing Smartnets to the new equipment. John Rogelio wrote: Mike Hammett wrote: Agreed. I don't intend on buying anything Cisco. Over priced, under performing, and their we will screw you whether you like it or not policies. No thanks, someone else, please. One of my clients (a big cable company) just bought hundreds of thousands of dollars of Cisco gear, only to find that it's going to be end of life in just a few months. Their Cisco rep royally screwed them on that one, and when they complained, they got nowhere and have since started to move to other vendors. Another client of mine in the City of San Jose is really careful about buying anything Cisco-related after a big Cisco scandal a few years ago. Apparently they tried to move some Cisco gear at the 11th hour into some big proposal, and it went over like a fart in church when people found out (it was a VoIP install, if I remember right). Now they use Nortel, NOT Cisco. It is my experience that Cisco reps are pretty brazen about their antics. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
Bash or no bash - personal experiences are being told here. I have had great experiences with Cisco products but that doesnt mean others have not. As a buyer of equipment, it is good to hear the good, the bad, and the ugly so an educated decision can be made on the next purchase. Thanks guys! -RickG On Thu, Jun 4, 2009 at 10:23 PM, John Thomasjtho...@quarnet.com wrote: If you guys want to bash Cisco, that's your perogative, but my experience has been somewhat different. We recently took on a new client that has some Cisco switches that their old VAR sols them 5 YEARs of Smartnets on. Since we are looking at them upgrading to some new equipment, we asked Cisco if they would be willing to do something for the client, and they said yes, they are willing to credit them for existing Smartnets to the new equipment. John Rogelio wrote: Mike Hammett wrote: Agreed. I don't intend on buying anything Cisco. Over priced, under performing, and their we will screw you whether you like it or not policies. No thanks, someone else, please. One of my clients (a big cable company) just bought hundreds of thousands of dollars of Cisco gear, only to find that it's going to be end of life in just a few months. Their Cisco rep royally screwed them on that one, and when they complained, they got nowhere and have since started to move to other vendors. Another client of mine in the City of San Jose is really careful about buying anything Cisco-related after a big Cisco scandal a few years ago. Apparently they tried to move some Cisco gear at the 11th hour into some big proposal, and it went over like a fart in church when people found out (it was a VoIP install, if I remember right). Now they use Nortel, NOT Cisco. It is my experience that Cisco reps are pretty brazen about their antics. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
I have about 80 Cisco 2900 and 3500 switches servicing our fiber ring. Most of them are 5+ years old and were purchased used on ebay for $400, and some are older. Some of these have "uptimes" of over 4 years right now. :) Cisco hardware just works. It's expensive, and the software can be buggy... but the hardware works. Travis Microserv RickG wrote: "Bash" or no bash - personal experiences are being told here. I have had great experiences with Cisco products but that doesnt mean others have not. As a buyer of equipment, it is good to hear the good, the bad, and the ugly so an educated decision can be made on the next purchase. Thanks guys! -RickG On Thu, Jun 4, 2009 at 10:23 PM, John Thomasjtho...@quarnet.com wrote: If you guys want to bash Cisco, that's your perogative, but my experience has been somewhat different. We recently took on a new client that has some Cisco switches that their old VAR sols them 5 YEARs of Smartnets on. Since we are looking at them upgrading to some new equipment, we asked Cisco if they would be willing to do something for the client, and they said yes, they are willing to credit them for existing Smartnets to the new equipment. John Rogelio wrote: Mike Hammett wrote: Agreed. I don't intend on buying anything Cisco. Over priced, under performing, and their "we will screw you whether you like it or not" policies. No thanks, someone else, please. One of my clients (a big cable company) just bought hundreds of thousands of dollars of Cisco gear, only to find that it's going to be end of life in just a few months. Their Cisco rep royally screwed them on that one, and when they complained, they got nowhere and have since started to move to other vendors. Another client of mine in the City of San Jose is really careful about buying anything Cisco-related after a big Cisco scandal a few years ago. Apparently they tried to move some Cisco gear at the 11th hour into some big proposal, and it went over like a fart in church when people found out (it was a VoIP install, if I remember right). Now they use Nortel, NOT Cisco. It is my experience that Cisco reps are pretty brazen about their antics. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
Travis Johnson wrote: I have about 80 Cisco 2900 and 3500 switches servicing our fiber ring. Most of them are 5+ years old and were purchased used on ebay for $400, and some are older. Some of these have uptimes of over 4 years right now. :) Cisco hardware just works. It's expensive, and the software can be buggy... but the hardware works. A lot depends on the company that originally made the hardware. In some cases, Cisco bought a great hardware manufacturer, in which case that hardware lasted a long time. In other cases, they acquired a crap company, painted Cisco on it, and then kludged in their shell environment. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
I agree - I have heard and seen a lot of Cisco equipment last many years, others only a few months. Both ends had expensive options (in the thousands). On 6/4/09, Rogelio scubac...@gmail.com wrote: Travis Johnson wrote: I have about 80 Cisco 2900 and 3500 switches servicing our fiber ring. Most of them are 5+ years old and were purchased used on ebay for $400, and some are older. Some of these have uptimes of over 4 years right now. :) Cisco hardware just works. It's expensive, and the software can be buggy... but the hardware works. A lot depends on the company that originally made the hardware. In some cases, Cisco bought a great hardware manufacturer, in which case that hardware lasted a long time. In other cases, they acquired a crap company, painted Cisco on it, and then kludged in their shell environment. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
[WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
I have a 7204VXR router as my core. I am looking at upgrading from a 100mb ethernet to a gigE. I am having a really hard time find out how I can add gigabit ethernet (via RJ-45 connectors) to this router. I have two spare slots of expansion cards but I cannot find a card that does gig. Can anyone point me in the right direction? Thanks, - Matt WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
Which NPE are you using? Randy Matt Jenkins wrote: I have a 7204VXR router as my core. I am looking at upgrading from a 100mb ethernet to a gigE. I am having a really hard time find out how I can add gigabit ethernet (via RJ-45 connectors) to this router. I have two spare slots of expansion cards but I cannot find a card that does gig. Can anyone point me in the right direction? Thanks, - Matt WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Randy Cosby Vice President InfoWest, Inc work: 435-773-6071 email: rco...@infowest.com http://www.linkedin.com/in/randycosby WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
NPE400 Randy Cosby wrote: Which NPE are you using? Randy Matt Jenkins wrote: I have a 7204VXR router as my core. I am looking at upgrading from a 100mb ethernet to a gigE. I am having a really hard time find out how I can add gigabit ethernet (via RJ-45 connectors) to this router. I have two spare slots of expansion cards but I cannot find a card that does gig. Can anyone point me in the right direction? Thanks, - Matt WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
Even if I go to a NPE-G1 or G2 I still need a total of 5 ports. 1 for inbound connection. 2 for outbound to radios that serve different towers 1 for local network of servers etc. 1 for colo customer. How do I add those other two ports? Randy Cosby wrote: Which NPE are you using? Randy Matt Jenkins wrote: I have a 7204VXR router as my core. I am looking at upgrading from a 100mb ethernet to a gigE. I am having a really hard time find out how I can add gigabit ethernet (via RJ-45 connectors) to this router. I have two spare slots of expansion cards but I cannot find a card that does gig. Can anyone point me in the right direction? Thanks, - Matt WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
I've found Cisco ports are more expensive than a Mikrotik distribution router. We currently have a Cisco handling BGP and upstream connections, then we distribute it using a switch to multiple Mikrotik boxes that distribute and route(OSPF) to our various backhauls. I'd cringe to think what it would cost for us to run all of our radios at our NOC into a cisco. -Kevin On Wed, Jun 3, 2009 at 12:05 PM, Matt Jenkins m...@smarterbroadband.netwrote: Even if I go to a NPE-G1 or G2 I still need a total of 5 ports. 1 for inbound connection. 2 for outbound to radios that serve different towers 1 for local network of servers etc. 1 for colo customer. How do I add those other two ports? Randy Cosby wrote: Which NPE are you using? Randy Matt Jenkins wrote: I have a 7204VXR router as my core. I am looking at upgrading from a 100mb ethernet to a gigE. I am having a really hard time find out how I can add gigabit ethernet (via RJ-45 connectors) to this router. I have two spare slots of expansion cards but I cannot find a card that does gig. Can anyone point me in the right direction? Thanks, - Matt WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
Switch and vlan Gino A. Villarini g...@aeronetpr.com Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp. tel 787.273.4143 fax 787.273.4145 -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Matt Jenkins Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 2:06 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards? Even if I go to a NPE-G1 or G2 I still need a total of 5 ports. 1 for inbound connection. 2 for outbound to radios that serve different towers 1 for local network of servers etc. 1 for colo customer. How do I add those other two ports? Randy Cosby wrote: Which NPE are you using? Randy Matt Jenkins wrote: I have a 7204VXR router as my core. I am looking at upgrading from a 100mb ethernet to a gigE. I am having a really hard time find out how I can add gigabit ethernet (via RJ-45 connectors) to this router. I have two spare slots of expansion cards but I cannot find a card that does gig. Can anyone point me in the right direction? Thanks, - Matt - --- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ - --- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
I'm checking with our NE here for recommendations. We've had great luck / price per port on the cisco 6500 series switches if you can have the 740x do routing. Kevin Neal wrote: I've found Cisco ports are more expensive than a Mikrotik distribution router. We currently have a Cisco handling BGP and upstream connections, then we distribute it using a switch to multiple Mikrotik boxes that distribute and route(OSPF) to our various backhauls. I'd cringe to think what it would cost for us to run all of our radios at our NOC into a cisco. -Kevin On Wed, Jun 3, 2009 at 12:05 PM, Matt Jenkins m...@smarterbroadband.netwrote: Even if I go to a NPE-G1 or G2 I still need a total of 5 ports. 1 for inbound connection. 2 for outbound to radios that serve different towers 1 for local network of servers etc. 1 for colo customer. How do I add those other two ports? Randy Cosby wrote: Which NPE are you using? Randy Matt Jenkins wrote: I have a 7204VXR router as my core. I am looking at upgrading from a 100mb ethernet to a gigE. I am having a really hard time find out how I can add gigabit ethernet (via RJ-45 connectors) to this router. I have two spare slots of expansion cards but I cannot find a card that does gig. Can anyone point me in the right direction? Thanks, - Matt WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Randy Cosby Vice President InfoWest, Inc work: 435-773-6071 email: rco...@infowest.com http://www.linkedin.com/in/randycosby WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
I second that. We use 7200s trunked to, variously, 3500XLs, 3550s, and Zyxel switches. For gig ports go with a NPE-G1/G2 for routing and a 3560 as a port expander. Dot1q subinterfaces are your friend. On Wed, Jun 3, 2009 at 1:16 PM, Gino Villarini g...@aeronetpr.com wrote: Switch and vlan Gino A. Villarini g...@aeronetpr.com Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp. tel 787.273.4143 fax 787.273.4145 -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Matt Jenkins Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 2:06 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards? Even if I go to a NPE-G1 or G2 I still need a total of 5 ports. 1 for inbound connection. 2 for outbound to radios that serve different towers 1 for local network of servers etc. 1 for colo customer. How do I add those other two ports? Randy Cosby wrote: Which NPE are you using? Randy Matt Jenkins wrote: I have a 7204VXR router as my core. I am looking at upgrading from a 100mb ethernet to a gigE. I am having a really hard time find out how I can add gigabit ethernet (via RJ-45 connectors) to this router. I have two spare slots of expansion cards but I cannot find a card that does gig. Can anyone point me in the right direction? Thanks, - Matt - --- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ - --- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
Yeah I have a Zyxel ES-2024A right below the 7200. I was just trying to simplify the whole setup. Since each is a router network anyways it was less layers to deal with if I could just add cards to the router. Jon Auer wrote: I second that. We use 7200s trunked to, variously, 3500XLs, 3550s, and Zyxel switches. For gig ports go with a NPE-G1/G2 for routing and a 3560 as a port expander. Dot1q subinterfaces are your friend. On Wed, Jun 3, 2009 at 1:16 PM, Gino Villarini g...@aeronetpr.com wrote: Switch and vlan Gino A. Villarini g...@aeronetpr.com Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp. tel 787.273.4143 fax 787.273.4145 -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Matt Jenkins Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 2:06 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards? Even if I go to a NPE-G1 or G2 I still need a total of 5 ports. 1 for inbound connection. 2 for outbound to radios that serve different towers 1 for local network of servers etc. 1 for colo customer. How do I add those other two ports? Randy Cosby wrote: Which NPE are you using? Randy Matt Jenkins wrote: I have a 7204VXR router as my core. I am looking at upgrading from a 100mb ethernet to a gigE. I am having a really hard time find out how I can add gigabit ethernet (via RJ-45 connectors) to this router. I have two spare slots of expansion cards but I cannot find a card that does gig. Can anyone point me in the right direction? Thanks, - Matt - --- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ - --- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
There is only one PA that can support GigE, which is the PA-GE. Unfortunately, the slot can't support the full capacity of the interface. Depending on what engine you have you will not likely exceed 200Mbps with that interface. The only way to really handle GigE with a 7200 is to get at least an NPE-G1, which has GigE interfaces on board. The NPE-G2 also has GigE interfaces on board. -Matt On Jun 3, 2009, at 1:57 PM, Matt Jenkins wrote: I have a 7204VXR router as my core. I am looking at upgrading from a 100mb ethernet to a gigE. I am having a really hard time find out how I can add gigabit ethernet (via RJ-45 connectors) to this router. I have two spare slots of expansion cards but I cannot find a card that does gig. Can anyone point me in the right direction? Thanks, - Matt WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
A lot less than you would think. We run Cisco for our entire network. Costs have come way down on new equipment and there is a ton of used equipment for pennies on dollar. -Matt On Jun 3, 2009, at 2:10 PM, Kevin Neal wrote: I've found Cisco ports are more expensive than a Mikrotik distribution router. We currently have a Cisco handling BGP and upstream connections, then we distribute it using a switch to multiple Mikrotik boxes that distribute and route(OSPF) to our various backhauls. I'd cringe to think what it would cost for us to run all of our radios at our NOC into a cisco. -Kevin On Wed, Jun 3, 2009 at 12:05 PM, Matt Jenkins m...@smarterbroadband.net wrote: Even if I go to a NPE-G1 or G2 I still need a total of 5 ports. 1 for inbound connection. 2 for outbound to radios that serve different towers 1 for local network of servers etc. 1 for colo customer. How do I add those other two ports? Randy Cosby wrote: Which NPE are you using? Randy Matt Jenkins wrote: I have a 7204VXR router as my core. I am looking at upgrading from a 100mb ethernet to a gigE. I am having a really hard time find out how I can add gigabit ethernet (via RJ-45 connectors) to this router. I have two spare slots of expansion cards but I cannot find a card that does gig. Can anyone point me in the right direction? Thanks, - Matt WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
Matt, The Cards are called PA-GE (they have a GBIC Slot, single port) You can use a Fiber GBIC or a Copper GBIC WS-G5483. (just check the docs of each item to make sure that they are compatible... I understand that the Copper GBIC is not support on all cards, it take too much power ?. Plus keep an eye on how much 'load' on the NPE Regards Faisal Imtiaz Computer Office Solutions Inc. /SnappyDSL.net Ph: (305) 663-5518 x 232 -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Matt Jenkins Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 1:58 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards? I have a 7204VXR router as my core. I am looking at upgrading from a 100mb ethernet to a gigE. I am having a really hard time find out how I can add gigabit ethernet (via RJ-45 connectors) to this router. I have two spare slots of expansion cards but I cannot find a card that does gig. Can anyone point me in the right direction? Thanks, - Matt WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
Matt Liotta wrote: A lot less than you would think. We run Cisco for our entire network. Costs have come way down on new equipment and there is a ton of used equipment for pennies on dollar. Did Cisco ever come to their senses on IOS licensing? Used to be, the software on a Cisco router was licensed to an entity separate from the purchase of the hardware. Thus, if you bought a router used, its (already-installed) copy of IOS was unlicensed and you'd have to buy a new software license to use the router. David Smith MVN.net WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
It's not FUD Matt. It's real. I have a pricelist from them with the fees required to relicense gear...might as well buy the new ones. Don't take my word: http://www.networkworld.com/community/node/14756 Jeff ImageStream -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Matt Liotta Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 3:53 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards? On Jun 3, 2009, at 3:49 PM, David E. Smith wrote: Did Cisco ever come to their senses on IOS licensing? Used to be, the software on a Cisco router was licensed to an entity separate from the purchase of the hardware. Thus, if you bought a router used, its (already-installed) copy of IOS was unlicensed and you'd have to buy a new software license to use the router. That is FUD from competing vendors. -Matt WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
Matt Liotta wrote: Did Cisco ever come to their senses on IOS licensing? That is FUD from competing vendors. http://www.infoworld.com/t/hardware/hidden-cost-hardware-729 This is six years old - but that's kinda my point. At least in the past, Cisco was insistent on relicensing IOS fees, which were sold separately from SmartNet support contracts. Cisco itself still seems to think this is the case: http://www.cisco.com/en/US/prod/iosswrel/prod_gen_ios_licensing.html Do not transfer Cisco IOS software licenses from one company to another except in special circumstances, such as company mergers. And the license itself: http://www.cisco.com/public/sw-license-agreement.html uses the word nontransferable in a couple places, though that could be boilerplate. I'd love to be wrong on this, so if you've got documentation supporting your assertion that IOS licenses are attached to hardware (and thus can be transferred with the hardware itself), please post it. David Smith MVN.net WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
That was worthless... don't take your word, take some some blogger's word. -Matt On Jun 3, 2009, at 4:03 PM, Jeff Broadwick wrote: It's not FUD Matt. It's real. I have a pricelist from them with the fees required to relicense gear...might as well buy the new ones. Don't take my word: http://www.networkworld.com/community/node/14756 Jeff ImageStream -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Matt Liotta Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 3:53 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards? On Jun 3, 2009, at 3:49 PM, David E. Smith wrote: Did Cisco ever come to their senses on IOS licensing? Used to be, the software on a Cisco router was licensed to an entity separate from the purchase of the hardware. Thus, if you bought a router used, its (already-installed) copy of IOS was unlicensed and you'd have to buy a new software license to use the router. That is FUD from competing vendors. -Matt WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
From your own article reference... Legal experts have varied opinions on the enforceability of some transfer restrictions, but they agree on one point: If anyone is to be found guilty of violating the software license, it would be the original purchaser who resold the equipment. The first buyer, after all, is the one who had a chance to see the license agreement and know about the software transfer restriction. Think about it... if the FUD was correct then leasing Cisco hardware would not work. This is because title to the hardware is in the hands of the leaser and is generally transfered at the end with a buy out. The amount of leased Cisco hardware is astounding. -Matt On Jun 3, 2009, at 4:09 PM, David E. Smith wrote: Matt Liotta wrote: Did Cisco ever come to their senses on IOS licensing? That is FUD from competing vendors. http://www.infoworld.com/t/hardware/hidden-cost-hardware-729 This is six years old - but that's kinda my point. At least in the past, Cisco was insistent on relicensing IOS fees, which were sold separately from SmartNet support contracts. Cisco itself still seems to think this is the case: http://www.cisco.com/en/US/prod/iosswrel/prod_gen_ios_licensing.html Do not transfer Cisco IOS software licenses from one company to another except in special circumstances, such as company mergers. And the license itself: http://www.cisco.com/public/sw-license-agreement.html uses the word nontransferable in a couple places, though that could be boilerplate. I'd love to be wrong on this, so if you've got documentation supporting your assertion that IOS licenses are attached to hardware (and thus can be transferred with the hardware itself), please post it. David Smith MVN.net WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
Matt, That was just the first article I found. There are plenty of others. When this first came out, I was on the ISP-Equipment List and it was a huge subject of conversation. Many of the resellers of used Cisco gear put a note on their front web pages that software relicensing is the responsibility of the buyer. Cisco was clearly trying to get rid of the used market at that time. I have a Cisco pricelist with the relicense fees. Jeff ImageStream -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Matt Liotta Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 4:20 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards? That was worthless... don't take your word, take some some blogger's word. -Matt On Jun 3, 2009, at 4:03 PM, Jeff Broadwick wrote: It's not FUD Matt. It's real. I have a pricelist from them with the fees required to relicense gear...might as well buy the new ones. Don't take my word: http://www.networkworld.com/community/node/14756 Jeff ImageStream -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Matt Liotta Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 3:53 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards? On Jun 3, 2009, at 3:49 PM, David E. Smith wrote: Did Cisco ever come to their senses on IOS licensing? Used to be, the software on a Cisco router was licensed to an entity separate from the purchase of the hardware. Thus, if you bought a router used, its (already-installed) copy of IOS was unlicensed and you'd have to buy a new software license to use the router. That is FUD from competing vendors. -Matt WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
Also, your opinion on this subject seems to have changed. This is from your post on 3-18-2008. The first part is David Smith's question to you: As an aside, a serious question for those who buy/use used Cisco gear. My understanding is that IOS licenses are tied not just to the hardware, but also to the purchaser thereof, and are non-transferable. Thus, if you buy a used Cisco (anything) you aren't supposed to use it without contacting Cisco and paying for IOS. (Not just for access to updates, but to even boot your chosen device, you're technically required to give Cisco some money.) Did this ever change? That is a complicated question. The simplest answer I can give you is that we don't use the IOS that comes with the used gear. I would say in general that if your shop doesn't have significant experience with Cisco in general you can likely get burned buying used Cisco gear. There is even the whole counterfeit problem you have to watch out for. -Matt -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Matt Liotta Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 4:22 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards? From your own article reference... Legal experts have varied opinions on the enforceability of some transfer restrictions, but they agree on one point: If anyone is to be found guilty of violating the software license, it would be the original purchaser who resold the equipment. The first buyer, after all, is the one who had a chance to see the license agreement and know about the software transfer restriction. Think about it... if the FUD was correct then leasing Cisco hardware would not work. This is because title to the hardware is in the hands of the leaser and is generally transfered at the end with a buy out. The amount of leased Cisco hardware is astounding. -Matt On Jun 3, 2009, at 4:09 PM, David E. Smith wrote: Matt Liotta wrote: Did Cisco ever come to their senses on IOS licensing? That is FUD from competing vendors. http://www.infoworld.com/t/hardware/hidden-cost-hardware-729 This is six years old - but that's kinda my point. At least in the past, Cisco was insistent on relicensing IOS fees, which were sold separately from SmartNet support contracts. Cisco itself still seems to think this is the case: http://www.cisco.com/en/US/prod/iosswrel/prod_gen_ios_licensing.html Do not transfer Cisco IOS software licenses from one company to another except in special circumstances, such as company mergers. And the license itself: http://www.cisco.com/public/sw-license-agreement.html uses the word nontransferable in a couple places, though that could be boilerplate. I'd love to be wrong on this, so if you've got documentation supporting your assertion that IOS licenses are attached to hardware (and thus can be transferred with the hardware itself), please post it. David Smith MVN.net -- -- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ -- -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
On Jun 3, 2009, at 4:29 PM, Jeff Broadwick wrote: Matt, That was just the first article I found. There are plenty of others. When this first came out, I was on the ISP-Equipment List and it was a huge subject of conversation. Many of the resellers of used Cisco gear put a note on their front web pages that software relicensing is the responsibility of the buyer. Cisco was clearly trying to get rid of the used market at that time. I have a Cisco pricelist with the relicense fees. I am sure you do. The question is who is subject to them and in what case do they apply. I doubt you will provide answers. -Matt WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
That is a policy statement. It is not legal fact. -Matt On Jun 3, 2009, at 4:31 PM, Jeff Broadwick wrote: From Cisco's own website: Policy: Cisco's current policy is that Software is not transferable without Cisco's prior written consent and payment of any license fee (License Fee) unless one of the exceptions below in the Exceptions section applies. Regardless of whether a License Fee is payable under this Policy, the transferee may be required to pay Service inspection or reinstatement fees in accordance with Cisco policies located here. http://www.cisco.com/en/US/prod/cisco_software_transfer_relicensing_policy.h tml Jeff ImageStream -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Matt Liotta Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 4:20 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards? That was worthless... don't take your word, take some some blogger's word. -Matt On Jun 3, 2009, at 4:03 PM, Jeff Broadwick wrote: It's not FUD Matt. It's real. I have a pricelist from them with the fees required to relicense gear...might as well buy the new ones. Don't take my word: http://www.networkworld.com/community/node/14756 Jeff ImageStream -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Matt Liotta Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 3:53 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards? On Jun 3, 2009, at 3:49 PM, David E. Smith wrote: Did Cisco ever come to their senses on IOS licensing? Used to be, the software on a Cisco router was licensed to an entity separate from the purchase of the hardware. Thus, if you bought a router used, its (already-installed) copy of IOS was unlicensed and you'd have to buy a new software license to use the router. That is FUD from competing vendors. -Matt WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
On Jun 3, 2009, at 4:44 PM, Jeff Broadwick wrote: Also, your opinion on this subject seems to have changed. This is from your post on 3-18-2008. The first part is David Smith's question to you: How so? The IOS software issue continues to be complicated, which was my original point. Meanwhile, competing vendors like yourself continue to spread FUD. -Matt WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
Before he was bribed by Cisco, the CEO of Peer1 in Canada wrote a piece about this. He bought 2 10K series routers and wanted smartnet. Cisco told him that he would need to buy new software to get it. For what they were asking, he bought 2 more for cold spares. ryan Jeff Broadwick wrote: It's not FUD Matt. It's real. I have a pricelist from them with the fees required to relicense gear...might as well buy the new ones. Don't take my word: http://www.networkworld.com/community/node/14756 Jeff ImageStream -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Matt Liotta Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 3:53 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards? On Jun 3, 2009, at 3:49 PM, David E. Smith wrote: Did Cisco ever come to their senses on IOS licensing? Used to be, the software on a Cisco router was licensed to an entity separate from the purchase of the hardware. Thus, if you bought a router used, its (already-installed) copy of IOS was unlicensed and you'd have to buy a new software license to use the router. That is FUD from competing vendors. -Matt WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
I wish to thank you both for filling my inbox with your personal disagreement. Off-list Please. Steve Barnes -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Matt Liotta Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 5:06 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards? On Jun 3, 2009, at 4:29 PM, Jeff Broadwick wrote: Matt, That was just the first article I found. There are plenty of others. When this first came out, I was on the ISP-Equipment List and it was a huge subject of conversation. Many of the resellers of used Cisco gear put a note on their front web pages that software relicensing is the responsibility of the buyer. Cisco was clearly trying to get rid of the used market at that time. I have a Cisco pricelist with the relicense fees. I am sure you do. The question is who is subject to them and in what case do they apply. I doubt you will provide answers. -Matt WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
It's not FUD Matt, it's on their own website. By your definition, Cisco is spreading FUD about their own product! Can't you just say, I was wrong? Jeff -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Matt Liotta Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 5:11 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards? On Jun 3, 2009, at 4:44 PM, Jeff Broadwick wrote: Also, your opinion on this subject seems to have changed. This is from your post on 3-18-2008. The first part is David Smith's question to you: How so? The IOS software issue continues to be complicated, which was my original point. Meanwhile, competing vendors like yourself continue to spread FUD. -Matt WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
Cisco isn't going to provide legal advice or legal fact. That's what our own lawyers are for. It's easier to use something else than to try to legally challenge cisco. If they have a policy for it, it means it's likely a common problem and they want a uniform response to it from their company and distributors. Just like we have an AUP that we expect our users to be to comply with. I haven't bought any cisco routers for a long time because of this, new or used. On Wed, Jun 03, 2009 at 05:09:05PM -0400, Matt Liotta wrote: That is a policy statement. It is not legal fact. -Matt On Jun 3, 2009, at 4:31 PM, Jeff Broadwick wrote: From Cisco's own website: Policy: Cisco's current policy is that Software is not transferable without Cisco's prior written consent and payment of any license fee (License Fee) unless one of the exceptions below in the Exceptions section applies. Regardless of whether a License Fee is payable under this Policy, the transferee may be required to pay Service inspection or reinstatement fees in accordance with Cisco policies located here. http://www.cisco.com/en/US/prod/cisco_software_transfer_relicensing_policy.h tml Jeff ImageStream -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Matt Liotta Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 4:20 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards? That was worthless... don't take your word, take some some blogger's word. -Matt On Jun 3, 2009, at 4:03 PM, Jeff Broadwick wrote: It's not FUD Matt. It's real. I have a pricelist from them with the fees required to relicense gear...might as well buy the new ones. Don't take my word: http://www.networkworld.com/community/node/14756 Jeff ImageStream -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Matt Liotta Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 3:53 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards? On Jun 3, 2009, at 3:49 PM, David E. Smith wrote: Did Cisco ever come to their senses on IOS licensing? Used to be, the software on a Cisco router was licensed to an entity separate from the purchase of the hardware. Thus, if you bought a router used, its (already-installed) copy of IOS was unlicensed and you'd have to buy a new software license to use the router. That is FUD from competing vendors. -Matt WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http
Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
Matt Liotta wrote: [ more stuff about Cisco IOS licensing ] Apologies for the wall of legalese. From the Cisco EULA at : http://www.cisco.com/en/US/docs/general/warranty/English/EU1KEN_.html Customer shall have no right, and Customer specifically agrees not to: transfer, assign or sublicense its license rights to any other person or entity (other than in compliance with any Cisco relicensing/transfer policy then in force), or use the Software on unauthorized or secondhand Cisco equipment Cisco's terms of sale incorporate by reference the EULA, which incoprorates the software resale policy (as shown above), so the original buyer would definitely be in trouble. The second-hand buyer could be liable for use of Cisco IP (intellectual property, not the other IP) without a proper license; I don't know if there's any case law on this, but I'm in no hurry to set a precedent. Matt: Unless you have evidence to the contrary, I'm gonna have to stick with original assertion, that random second-hand Cisco gear can't legally be used. I wish I were wrong, but I'm afraid I'm right. David Smith MVN.net WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
We buy and sell used Cisco routers and switches on a daily basis. It is totally legal and hundreds of companies do what we do and thousands of companies (including large multi-nationals) buy and use used Cisco gear. The IOS is included in the purchase price of the router or switch since it was already paid for from Cisco when the unit was new (it's like buying a pc with Windows on it and reselling the pc). What you need to be aware of when buying used Cisco is: 1. Make sure the used unit you are buying has an IOS on it that will fit your needs and requirements. If you need an IOS upgrade, you will need to purchase it. 2. You can not put all used Cisco on Smartnet. Cisco does have certain requirements for putting Smartnet on used gear but it can be done and is done often. If buying and selling used Cisco WAS illegal in anyway, you would not see any on Ebay. -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of David E. Smith Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 4:39 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards? Matt Liotta wrote: [ more stuff about Cisco IOS licensing ] Apologies for the wall of legalese. From the Cisco EULA at : http://www.cisco.com/en/US/docs/general/warranty/English/EU1KEN_.html Customer shall have no right, and Customer specifically agrees not to: transfer, assign or sublicense its license rights to any other person or entity (other than in compliance with any Cisco relicensing/transfer policy then in force), or use the Software on unauthorized or secondhand Cisco equipment Cisco's terms of sale incorporate by reference the EULA, which incoprorates the software resale policy (as shown above), so the original buyer would definitely be in trouble. The second-hand buyer could be liable for use of Cisco IP (intellectual property, not the other IP) without a proper license; I don't know if there's any case law on this, but I'm in no hurry to set a precedent. Matt: Unless you have evidence to the contrary, I'm gonna have to stick with original assertion, that random second-hand Cisco gear can't legally be used. I wish I were wrong, but I'm afraid I'm right. David Smith MVN.net WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
Jesse Preiner wrote: We buy and sell used Cisco routers and switches on a daily basis. It is totally legal and hundreds of companies do what we do and thousands of companies (including large multi-nationals) buy and use used Cisco gear. Then how do you reconcile all this documentation from Cisco itself that says, in as many words, not to do that? Like I said, if you've got documentation (preferably from Cisco) that supports the legality of this, I'd LOVE to be proven wrong on this point. David Smith MVN.net WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
I don't think Cisco is ever going to encourage their products to be sold on the secondary market. I am sure GM would prefer you buy a brand new car every 4 years as well. I just know that we and many companies like us would have been sued by Cisco and other manufactures long ago and a secondary market would not exist. -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of David E. Smith Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 5:00 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards? Jesse Preiner wrote: We buy and sell used Cisco routers and switches on a daily basis. It is totally legal and hundreds of companies do what we do and thousands of companies (including large multi-nationals) buy and use used Cisco gear. Then how do you reconcile all this documentation from Cisco itself that says, in as many words, not to do that? Like I said, if you've got documentation (preferably from Cisco) that supports the legality of this, I'd LOVE to be proven wrong on this point. David Smith MVN.net WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
Matt Liotta wrote: On Jun 3, 2009, at 3:49 PM, David E. Smith wrote: Did Cisco ever come to their senses on IOS licensing? Used to be, the software on a Cisco router was licensed to an entity separate from the purchase of the hardware. Thus, if you bought a router used, its (already-installed) copy of IOS was unlicensed and you'd have to buy a new software license to use the router. That is FUD from competing vendors. Uh. No. It's not. It's been stated to me by Cisco personnel. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
I have a Cisco pricelist with the relicense fees. I am sure you do. The question is who is subject to them and in what case do they apply. I doubt you will provide answers. Wow. What's your problem? You treat customers like that as well? WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
Stop digging the hole you're in man. Matt Liotta wrote: That is a policy statement. It is not legal fact. -Matt WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
No one said buying/selling used gear is illegal. They said operation of the gear is illegal without a separate license from Cisco. Jesse Preiner wrote: We buy and sell used Cisco routers and switches on a daily basis. It is totally legal and hundreds of companies do what we do and thousands of companies (including large multi-nationals) buy and use used Cisco gear. The IOS is included in the purchase price of the router or switch since it was already paid for from Cisco when the unit was new (it's like buying a pc with Windows on it and reselling the pc). What you need to be aware of when buying used Cisco is: 1. Make sure the used unit you are buying has an IOS on it that will fit your needs and requirements. If you need an IOS upgrade, you will need to purchase it. 2. You can not put all used Cisco on Smartnet. Cisco does have certain requirements for putting Smartnet on used gear but it can be done and is done often. If buying and selling used Cisco WAS illegal in anyway, you would not see any on Ebay. -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of David E. Smith Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 4:39 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards? Matt Liotta wrote: [ more stuff about Cisco IOS licensing ] Apologies for the wall of legalese. From the Cisco EULA at : http://www.cisco.com/en/US/docs/general/warranty/English/EU1KEN_.html Customer shall have no right, and Customer specifically agrees not to: transfer, assign or sublicense its license rights to any other person or entity (other than in compliance with any Cisco relicensing/transfer policy then in force), or use the Software on unauthorized or secondhand Cisco equipment Cisco's terms of sale incorporate by reference the EULA, which incoprorates the software resale policy (as shown above), so the original buyer would definitely be in trouble. The second-hand buyer could be liable for use of Cisco IP (intellectual property, not the other IP) without a proper license; I don't know if there's any case law on this, but I'm in no hurry to set a precedent. Matt: Unless you have evidence to the contrary, I'm gonna have to stick with original assertion, that random second-hand Cisco gear can't legally be used. I wish I were wrong, but I'm afraid I'm right. David Smith MVN.net WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
The think here just to throw my 2 cents in. If you have a policy and you constantly let slide no judge will let you reinforce it. We know there are 100's of used cisco resellers out there that don't pay any transfer license fees or make customer pay for such a one. I am sure Cisco is well aware of this to and case in point is if they do not go after then and not done for years their policy is mute because all the defendant have to do is show that this been going on publicly for years and the judge will dismiss the case. That is the danger of creating a policy and in a timely manner reinforcing it. However now if they been reinforcing it then it's another story. But as said would hate to have to be the first one to try to defend myself if it came to it. /Eje Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile -Original Message- From: David E. Smith d...@mvn.net Date: Wed, 03 Jun 2009 16:38:58 To: WISPA General Listwireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards? Matt Liotta wrote: [ more stuff about Cisco IOS licensing ] Apologies for the wall of legalese. From the Cisco EULA at : http://www.cisco.com/en/US/docs/general/warranty/English/EU1KEN_.html Customer shall have no right, and Customer specifically agrees not to: transfer, assign or sublicense its license rights to any other person or entity (other than in compliance with any Cisco relicensing/transfer policy then in force), or use the Software on unauthorized or secondhand Cisco equipment Cisco's terms of sale incorporate by reference the EULA, which incoprorates the software resale policy (as shown above), so the original buyer would definitely be in trouble. The second-hand buyer could be liable for use of Cisco IP (intellectual property, not the other IP) without a proper license; I don't know if there's any case law on this, but I'm in no hurry to set a precedent. Matt: Unless you have evidence to the contrary, I'm gonna have to stick with original assertion, that random second-hand Cisco gear can't legally be used. I wish I were wrong, but I'm afraid I'm right. David Smith MVN.net WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
Charles Wyble wrote: Uh. No. It's not. It's been stated to me by Cisco personnel. To everyone who believes what Cisco has told them, I have some land to sell you in Florida! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
Matt Liotta wrote: That is FUD from competing vendors. Or possibly it's FUD from Cisco (my favorite kind of FUD, next to FUD from Microsoft, Red Hat, SCO, and IBM). WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Cisco 7200 Gigabit Ethernet Cards?
Charles Wyble wrote: That is FUD from competing vendors. Uh. No. It's not. It's been stated to me by Cisco personnel. I've understood the same, Charles. Cisco people have told me (something like), You gotta buy new software and/or SmartNET for that used gear you just got used or donated. I just laughed and said, Now why would I wanna do that, when I can get all the software free from all the CCIEs I know? Needless to say, they were not amused. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
