Re: [WSG] rationalising my refusal to support IE/NS4
Thanks for your ideas everyone, I'll definitely add some of those things. I have also pointed out that their existing site doesn't work too well in Netscape 4 (or with Flash disabled, for that matter). On Tue, 21 Dec 2004 15:46:30 +0800, Nick Cowie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If it is a WA gov site they are quoting four year old state government guidelines which have not been updated and are unlikely in the near future. It's a WA school, so I'm betting that's where they got it from. Is that document online or can someone email me a copy off list? Sorry if it's getting a bit off-topic, I was really searching for words that would say your requirements are bad for web standards and accessibility and therefore bad for your site which I think is mostly on-topic. Cheers! -- Kay Smoljak http://kay.smoljak.com/ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] HOW DO I KNOW THAT MY HTML FILE HEADER IS BEING SENT CORRECTLY?
Hi, This is probably a really easy one. I am just setting myself up to tryPerl scripting. My first job is to set the Character Set and MIME Typeto besent in the header. What test should I carry out to make sure that the header is correct? Regards, Charlie
[ADMIN] Thread Closed - Re: [WSG] HOW DO I KNOW THAT MY HTML FILE HEADER IS BEING SENT CORRECTLY?
PERL questions should be directed to a PERL list as PERL is a scripting language and NOT a web standard. This is in accordance with the guidelines of the WSG email list. If you have the answer to this question, please reply OFF LIST to the sender. Regards, Gary Menzel (for WSG CORE) On Tue, 21 Dec 2004 08:38:55 -, Charles Slack [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, This is probably a really easy one. I am just setting myself up to try Perl scripting. My first job is to set the Character Set and MIME Type to be sent in the header. What test should I carry out to make sure that the header is correct? Regards, Charlie ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] HOW DO I KNOW THAT MY HTML FILE HEADER IS BEING SENT CORRECTLY?
Hi Charles Download Firefox (if you haven't already) and then install the LiveHTTPHeaders plug in (http://livehttpheaders.mozdev.org/). Restart Firefox and LiveHTTPHeaders will then be under the tools menu and all your headers will be revealed. -- Mark Stanton Gruden Pty Ltd http://www.gruden.com ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] HOW DO I KNOW THAT MY HTML FILE HEADER IS BEING SENT CORRECTLY?
On 12/21/04 12:38 AM Charles Slack [EMAIL PROTECTED] sent this out: I am just setting myself up to try Perl scripting. My first job is to set the Character Set and MIME Type to be sent in the header. What test should I carry out to make sure that the header is correct? Shouldn't your query be sent to a Perl discussion list? Thanks Rick Faaberg ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] HOW DO I KNOW THAT MY HTML FILE HEADER IS BEING SENT CORRECTLY?
Sorry - I did not think I was asking a Perl question - just asking how I see an HTML header. Thanks Mark for your rapid response. Sorry everyone else. Charlie - Original Message - From: Mark Stanton [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, December 21, 2004 8:54 AM Subject: Re: [WSG] HOW DO I KNOW THAT MY HTML FILE HEADER IS BEING SENT CORRECTLY? Hi Charles Download Firefox (if you haven't already) and then install the LiveHTTPHeaders plug in (http://livehttpheaders.mozdev.org/). Restart Firefox and LiveHTTPHeaders will then be under the tools menu and all your headers will be revealed. -- Mark Stanton Gruden Pty Ltd http://www.gruden.com ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] HOW DO I KNOW THAT MY HTML FILE HEADER IS BEING SENT CORRECTLY?
From: Gary Menzel PERL questions should be directed to a PERL list as PERL is a scripting language and NOT a web standard. The question was about HTTP and MIME, which - in my mind - do fall under web standards... Patrick Patrick H. Lauke Webmaster / University of Salford http://www.salford.ac.uk ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Template StyleSheet
Trying to find examples, resources that define how StyleSheets should be organised. There's been dicussion of how to arrange your classes and IDs and I'm just wondering, what about base generic styles that don't need to be referenced by class or ID... Does anyone out there start with a template they use for all their sites and modify it? Not that I've used personally, but there's two css template systems of which I'm aware: - CSS Sandwich http://www.opinios.com/archives/73.php - Style from the tigris repository http://style.tigris.org/ -- Manuel a veces :) a veces :( pero siempre trabajando duro para Simplelógica: apariencia, experiencia y comunicación en la web. http://simplelogica.net # (+34) 985 22 12 65 ¡Ah! y escribiendo en Logicola: http://simplelogica.net/logicola/ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] Tables inside a div
Hi I've a page with div layouts but inside a div I need to show some data inside a table. How could I set table width to be a 90% of div width size ? If I set a table width=90% it takes a 90% of whole page instead of div... Thanks in advance jl ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] rationalising my refusal to support IE/NS4
Kay Smoljak wrote: I'm feeling like this whole week is one big Friday afternoon, and that somehow sounds rather lame. Can anyone recommend any other reasons or throw in some kick-arse buzzwords to make me look good? Quote the pointy hairded boss: Lets improve our existing services by re-engineering our core competancies to align ourselves within the quality vector, this new way of working is a whole new paradgym One can easily re-interpret that for your cause (or for those that lack abstract thinking:) Lets recreate our website services, by re-coding our pages to align them with today's development practices, its a whole new look at the world of web-desgin) -- -DavidR ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] Some links for light reading (21/12/04)
Web design world cool-down: http://www.molly.com/2004/12/18/web-design-world-cool-down/ Don¹t Care About Market Share: http://www.meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2004/12/20/market-share-dont-care/ HTML tags: http://lachy.id.au/blogs/log/2004/12/html-tags ALT attribute (ALT tag, ALT tooltip) http://annevankesteren.nl/archives/2004/12/alt-attribute Sizing Fonts on the Web: http://usabletype.com/styles/sizes/ And... http://usabletype.com/articles/2004/default-font-size-the-battle-is-won/ Digital asset management http://veerle.duoh.com/index.php?id=P276 Targeting small screens: http://www.stopdesign.com/log/2004/12/16/small-screens.html .mobi versus device independence http://web-graphics.com/mtarchive/001474.php Programs vs. markup or why HTML authoring is not programming http://www.cs.tut.fi/%7Ejkorpela/prog.html What Are Your Top 5 Standards Based Sites and Why? http://www.andybudd.com/archives/2004/12/what_are_your_top_5_standards_based _sites_and_why/index.php The webucator CSS reference: http://www.webucator.com/resources/css/reference.html Print out HREFs on Links for Print StyleSheet (posted to the list last week but for those who may have missed it amongst lots of posts): http://www.drunkmonkey.com.au/printLinkURLs.html Thanks Russ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] WSG S5
About a month ago, Lachlan Hardy produced a slide show template (based on Eric Meyers S5) for the WSG. It is now online for all WSG members to use as they wish: http://webstandardsgroup.org/go/resource367.cfm More on S5: http://meyerweb.com/eric/tools/s5/ Rather than clog the list, if you have comments, suggestions or abuse on this topic - email me offlist. Thanks to Lachlan for taking the time to develop this resource (and apologies for the delay in getting it online!). Russ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Tables inside a div
On 21 Dec 2004, at 9:11 PM, Javier Leyba wrote:
How could I set table width to be a 90% of div width size ?
If I set a table width=90% it takes a 90% of whole page instead of
div...
How about
div#whatever table { margin: 0 10% ;}
But beware... some browsers (IE5Mac comes to mind) need the longhand
version
div#whatever table {
margin-top: 0 ;
margin-right: 10% ;
margin-bottom: 0 ;
margin-left: 10% ;
}
HTH
N
___
Omnivision. Websight.
http://www.omnivision.com.au/
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Re: [WSG] Tables inside a div
Just remember - as far as I have found - if you dont set the width on the DIV then the DIV will size to whatever the content is. If you dont have a width on the DIV and say the TABLE is 90% - what will it be 90% of? The closest bounding ancestor area that has a width - which will be the body tag (actually the window object - which is where the body tag gets it dimensions from).. . or something close to that. It you make the DIV 400px wide - then the TABLE will be 90% of that. Or if the DIV is wedged between two other DIVs (like a three column layout) the TABLE will be 90% of whatever is available in that area. Unless the right and left columns are also somehow sizing automatically. There are some dodgy exceptions to this that often mean that if you want a table to fill the available area you use 99% instead of 100% (browser bugs). Regards, Gary ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Tables inside a div
On Tue, Dec 21, 2004 at 09:50:28PM +1000, Gary Menzel wrote: Just remember - as far as I have found - if you dont set the width on the DIV then the DIV will size to whatever the content is. Not unless floated - if you don't set a width on a non-floated non-replaced block, it will have the width of it's container (-margin,padding,border) - so a div with no width set, will have 100% width - whatever it's content... -- Christian Sonne Stud. scient. math-phys at University of Copenhagen -BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK- Version: 3.12 GM/S/CS/O d? s: a---? C++ UL++$ P+ L++ E--- W++ N o@ K? w !O M-- V? PS++(+) PE@ Y-- PGP-@ t+ 5? X++ R@ tv++ b+(++) DI+++ D G@ e+ h! r-(--) y? --END GEEK CODE BLOCK-- http://geeksbynature.dk ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] Float Issue (I think)
Hello all this is my first post so bear with me. (if that 1st sentence didn't put you off please read on) I have, what I think is a Float related issue, which is causing me some layout problems. The URL to the page is: http://www.euromediatraffic.com/~daniel/pt/index.html and the stylesheet is: http://www.euromediatraffic.com/~daniel/pt/css/style.css But to get a fair Idea of what i'm trying to achieve maybe you can take a look at this mockup : http://www.euromediatraffic.com/~daniel/pt/site_mockup.jpg 1. As you will see the divs, inside the main left Column div, wont position up flush against each other. I have tried removing top and bottom padding, margins and borders but with no joy. The answer is probably staring me in the face but I can't seem to find it. Could it be something to do with the right floated GlobalNav div? 2. Also, in my main content area you will see that the div (qLaunch) has been given a specific height but seems to extend down to the end of it's containg div, which seems to affect the following div (#content)(with the horrible blue background). I figure this is to do with the left floated objects inside the qLaunch div but really can't figure it out. If anyone can shed a little light on these problems, for me or point me in the right direction I would greatly appreciate it. Thanks Dan ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] Hover psuedo-class issues
'lo guys
After experimenting with the IE7 javascript library for IE, I've noticed
some shortcomings with the scripts, that whilst solving one issue...
create another. (In this case, resolving the img:hover{} issue, but
messing up paddings for a:link/a:link:hover/a:hover)
Does anyone know of any existing (and much simpler) JavaScript libraries
that enable :hover, :focus, and :active for non anchor tags for IE?
Regards,
David R
--
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Re: [WSG] Hover psuedo-class issues
Does anyone know of any existing (and much simpler) JavaScript libraries that enable :hover, :focus, and :active for non anchor tags for IE? http://www.xs4all.nl/~peterned/csshover.html -- regards, Kornel Lesiski ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Float Issue (I think)
Hi Dan Had a quick look at your page. Upon trying to validate found a few errors including a couple of unclosed tags and a missing closing /div. This is probably what is causing your problems. Fix those HTML errors first and then come back to me if you've still got problems. Merry Christmas Bryan www.BryanDavis.info ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] My Site
My site is http://www.dotradio.uni.cc. What can I do to improve my site? Is there anything wrong with it? Thanks for your help. -- Anthony Timberlake Owner - StaticHost Internet Services http://www.statichost.co.uk ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] My Site
The color scheme is what I do not like. Can someone help me find a better color scheme? On Tue, 21 Dec 2004 09:46:27 -0500, Anthony Timberlake [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: My site is http://www.dotradio.uni.cc. What can I do to improve my site? Is there anything wrong with it? Thanks for your help. -- Anthony Timberlake Owner - StaticHost Internet Services http://www.statichost.co.uk ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** -- Anthony Timberlake DJ on Dot Radio http://www.dotradio.uni.cc ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] My Site
Try http://colorschemer.com/ Great tool, I think there's a 15 day trial. Regards, Hanni On Tue, 21 Dec 2004 10:00:00 -0500, Anthony Timberlake [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The color scheme is what I do not like. Can someone help me find a better color scheme? On Tue, 21 Dec 2004 09:46:27 -0500, Anthony Timberlake [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: My site is http://www.dotradio.uni.cc. What can I do to improve my site? Is there anything wrong with it? Thanks for your help. -- Anthony Timberlake Owner - StaticHost Internet Services http://www.statichost.co.uk ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** -- Anthony Timberlake DJ on Dot Radio http://www.dotradio.uni.cc ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] My Site
My site is http://www.dotradio.uni.cc. What can I do to improve my site? Is there anything wrong with it? Thanks for your help. -- Anthony Timberlake Owner - StaticHost Internet Services http://www.statichost.co.uk hmmm... eg. you can validate it, esp. change the to / (XHTML) than you have twice head .../head, one in the body-tag... greetings johannes ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] My Site
G'day My site is http://www.dotradio.uni.cc. What can I do to improve my site? Is there anything wrong with it? Thanks for your help. Validate, fix, validate, fix, validate, ... You might start by changing the Doctype to HTML 4.01 Transitional and fix the 19 errors (as opposed to 154 with the XHTML1.0 strict DTD you currently use on the home page). Once you've fixed those 19 errors, look at updating the site to HTML 4.01 Strict by removing all presentational attributes and making more use of CSS (but don't specify font sizes in pixels like you have - cannot be enlarged on MSIE). Beyond that, replace the nested tables with more structural markup and (optionally) update it to XHTML1.0 Strict. Regards -- Bert Doorn, Better Web Design http://www.betterwebdesign.com.au/ Fast-loading, user-friendly websites ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] My Site
http://www.paletteman.com/ Tom Livingston Senior Multimedia Artist mlinc.com On Dec 21, 2004, at 10:34 AM, Hanni Ross wrote: Try http://colorschemer.com/ Great tool, I think there's a 15 day trial. Regards, Hanni On Tue, 21 Dec 2004 10:00:00 -0500, Anthony Timberlake [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The color scheme is what I do not like. Can someone help me find a better color scheme? On Tue, 21 Dec 2004 09:46:27 -0500, Anthony Timberlake [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: My site is http://www.dotradio.uni.cc. What can I do to improve my site? Is there anything wrong with it? Thanks for your help. -- Anthony Timberlake Owner - StaticHost Internet Services http://www.statichost.co.uk ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** -- Anthony Timberlake DJ on Dot Radio http://www.dotradio.uni.cc ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] My Site
Anthony Timberlake wrote: My site is http://www.dotradio.uni.cc. What can I do to improve my site? Is there anything wrong with it? I don't mean to be rude but a token attempt at validation is probably in order before asking for suggestions. You may want to start by limiting yourself to one set of head, body and html tags :) -- Al Sessions http://fultonchain.net They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. -- B. Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Hover psuedo-class issues
Kornel Lesinski wrote: http://www.xs4all.nl/~peterned/csshover.html Thanks :) -- -David ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Template StyleSheet
The W3 Spec for CSS2 has one for HTML4 but I don't see any ryhme or reason in the way it's laid it out. They're recommending that all developers use this stylesheet as a template. Can someone explain it to me? Well, I will at least try to... This generic stylesheet is provided by W3C to unify all the default settings of browsers to avoid eg. unexpected margins or different heading size in various ones. -- Jan Brasna :: alphanumeric.cz | webcore.cz | designlab.cz | janbrasna.com ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] My Site
I do have one set of head, body and html tags. I have validated my CSS and HTML. On Tue, 21 Dec 2004 10:51:36 -0500, Al Sessions [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Anthony Timberlake wrote: My site is http://www.dotradio.uni.cc. What can I do to improve my site? Is there anything wrong with it? I don't mean to be rude but a token attempt at validation is probably in order before asking for suggestions. You may want to start by limiting yourself to one set of head, body and html tags :) -- Al Sessions http://fultonchain.net They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. -- B. Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** -- Anthony Timberlake DJ on Dot Radio http://www.dotradio.uni.cc ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] My Site
have validated my CSS and HTML. This generally means you have fixed the errors the validator displays. The page you linked to still has 130+ errors. Johannes' suggestion hmmm... eg. you can validate it, esp. change the to / (XHTML) would fix quite a few. Matt Hampel On Tue, 21 Dec 2004 16:10:35 -0500, Anthony Timberlake [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I do have one set of head, body and html tags. I have validated my CSS and HTML. On Tue, 21 Dec 2004 10:51:36 -0500, Al Sessions [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Anthony Timberlake wrote: My site is http://www.dotradio.uni.cc. What can I do to improve my site? Is there anything wrong with it? I don't mean to be rude but a token attempt at validation is probably in order before asking for suggestions. You may want to start by limiting yourself to one set of head, body and html tags :) -- Al Sessions http://fultonchain.net They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. -- B. Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** -- Anthony Timberlake DJ on Dot Radio http://www.dotradio.uni.cc ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] e-Government Implementation Guidelines
Morning list, *Please respond to this request off-list ([EMAIL PROTECTED]), once we've compiled the results we'll get Russ to add a link to the Resources section of the WSG website.* E-GOVERNMENT IMPLEMENTATION GUIDELINES We're attempting to compile a list of international e-government web guidelines. (In NZ these standards have had a significant impact upon the acceptance and perceived legitimacy of web standards.) Implementation guidelines typically include reference to: -navigation -coding/language standards (HTML. XHTML, CSS1, etc.) -technical considerations -markup requirements -accessibility and usability aka: web-authoring requirements. GUIDELINE INFO The list we're compiling will include: - Country - Guideline Title (as link to webpage) - Coverage (e.g. Western Austrailian Government Agencies: Australia seems to have a new permutation for each state!) - Publication date, revision dates (Other info dimension suggestions welcome). PLEA Those of you who are conversant with your country's forays into this area, please send me a URL (the more specific, the better). Webpage/permalink please (no PDF links). We'll explore the links provided but feel free to provide any of the Guideline Info along with the link (see above). Disclaimer: My command of languages other than English is not great, but I'll endeavour to add all guidelines received. Best regards, -- Andy Kirkwood | Creative Director MOTIVE | web.design.integrity http://www.motive.co.nz/ ph: +64 4 3 800 800 fx: +64 4 970 9693 mob: 021 369 693 93 Rintoul St, Newtown PO Box 7150, Wellington South, New Zealand ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] My Site
I went back and re-checked for CSS and HTML validation: You still have some problems to fix. The CSS validator shows an error page. The HTML validator clearly states your code is not valid XHTML 1.0 Strict, with 136 errors. You'll have to fix those first. It looks to me like you'll have to go back to the drawing board. One thing I suggest is reviewing not only HTML/XHTML/CSS validation and document types, but also learning a bit more about using CSS for positioning rather than putting all your content into tables and laying them out that way. Start by looking at http://www.positioniseverything.net and go from there. Once you start using those techniques, you'll have a much cleaner site, codewise, that is vastly easier to maintain. As far as the colors, there's definitely room for improvement - I see a couple of people have posted some links to color scheme selectors you can use, so hopefully you find those helpful. Leslie Riggs I do have one set of head, body and html tags. I have validated my CSS and HTML. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] My Site
On 22 Dec 2004, at 8:10 AM, Anthony Timberlake wrote: I do have one set of head, body and html tags. I have validated my CSS and HTML. Don't see how your HTML can validate. Adding a DOCTYPE of XHTML Strict will not magically convert an HTML document to XHTML. The syntax of your code is entirely wrong - you need, at least, to end the 'unclosed' tags (meta, img, br, etc) in your markup with / instead of just if you want to use an XHTML DOCTYPE. You use tables for purely presentational purposes - eg to place your 'Online' header info at right centre of its containing block - unnecessary, and deprecated. You even use a center tag within a centered p for that header. You have broken code - your subheading 'News' is rendering as 'bNews'. Your markup is totally lacking any semantic approach at all. It's just a stream-of-consciousness procession of divs, tables and ps used to lay out the page in what looks like - to you - a meaningful way. Your css is inline - one of the aims of modern code, and the ethos of Web Standards, is to separate presentation from content by removing css to an external file. You even use font tags! Sorry, but I don't think you get what this discussion list, or Web Standards, is about. If you're serious about your 'website design buisness' (sic) you'll do some serious research into how to do this stuff properly. This list exists to help with problems that you can't readily solve, not to write your code for you. Oh, and regardless of the choice of colours, I'm not sure if you're 'DJ Bullseye', but Didn't Anyone Ever Tell You That Capitalising Every Word In A Sentence Makes The Content Really Hard To Read? Call me harsh, but I just find these 'please fix my site for me' posts just plain annoying. Normally I'd ignore them; just so happens I had a little time to make what I hope are constructive criticisms. N ___ Omnivision. Websight. http://www.omnivision.com.au/ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] e-Government Implementation Guidelines
Andy Kirkwood | MOTIVE wrote: E-GOVERNMENT IMPLEMENTATION GUIDELINES We're attempting to compile a list of international e-government web guidelines. (In NZ these standards have had a significant impact upon the acceptance and perceived legitimacy of web standards.) Andy something along the same lines has already been compiled here: http://www.webaim.org/coordination/law/ Might be a good starting point in and of itself, and also to avoid duplication. Regards Mike Brown SIGNIFY LTD :: the logic behind ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] My Site
I am not new at this, just haven't done it for a while now. I thought by being on this list, I could get the help I needed. I appologize if I offended you. On Wed, 22 Dec 2004 08:53:26 +1100, Nick Gleitzman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 22 Dec 2004, at 8:10 AM, Anthony Timberlake wrote: I do have one set of head, body and html tags. I have validated my CSS and HTML. Don't see how your HTML can validate. Adding a DOCTYPE of XHTML Strict will not magically convert an HTML document to XHTML. The syntax of your code is entirely wrong - you need, at least, to end the 'unclosed' tags (meta, img, br, etc) in your markup with / instead of just if you want to use an XHTML DOCTYPE. You use tables for purely presentational purposes - eg to place your 'Online' header info at right centre of its containing block - unnecessary, and deprecated. You even use a center tag within a centered p for that header. You have broken code - your subheading 'News' is rendering as 'bNews'. Your markup is totally lacking any semantic approach at all. It's just a stream-of-consciousness procession of divs, tables and ps used to lay out the page in what looks like - to you - a meaningful way. Your css is inline - one of the aims of modern code, and the ethos of Web Standards, is to separate presentation from content by removing css to an external file. You even use font tags! Sorry, but I don't think you get what this discussion list, or Web Standards, is about. If you're serious about your 'website design buisness' (sic) you'll do some serious research into how to do this stuff properly. This list exists to help with problems that you can't readily solve, not to write your code for you. Oh, and regardless of the choice of colours, I'm not sure if you're 'DJ Bullseye', but Didn't Anyone Ever Tell You That Capitalising Every Word In A Sentence Makes The Content Really Hard To Read? Call me harsh, but I just find these 'please fix my site for me' posts just plain annoying. Normally I'd ignore them; just so happens I had a little time to make what I hope are constructive criticisms. N ___ Omnivision. Websight. http://www.omnivision.com.au/ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** -- Anthony Timberlake DJ on Dot Radio http://www.dotradio.uni.cc ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] My Site
Hello; I see now that you have changed the doctype to 4.01 transitional which still gives up 2 errors and in the css there are still 8 errors and 1 warning. In the html you are using self closing tags img src= blah blah blah / you don't need that in 4.01 transitional. Plus you have td tags closed that are not open, however, I also notice that it is changing with each refresh so you must be working on it ... good for you ! ... :o) HTH's ... B. William Haggerty VWH Web Services http://vwh.ca - Original Message - From: Anthony Timberlake [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, December 21, 2004 1:10 PM Subject: Re: [WSG] My Site I do have one set of head, body and html tags. I have validated my CSS and HTML. On Tue, 21 Dec 2004 10:51:36 -0500, Al Sessions [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Anthony Timberlake wrote: My site is http://www.dotradio.uni.cc. What can I do to improve my site? Is there anything wrong with it? I don't mean to be rude but a token attempt at validation is probably in order before asking for suggestions. You may want to start by limiting yourself to one set of head, body and html tags :) -- Al Sessions http://fultonchain.net They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. -- B. Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** -- Anthony Timberlake DJ on Dot Radio http://www.dotradio.uni.cc ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] My Site
It is now validated with HTML and CSS. Does anyone have anything else that I can do to improve my site? Sites to read and gain more knowledge, scripts? On Tue, 21 Dec 2004 14:32:14 -0800, haggis [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello; I see now that you have changed the doctype to 4.01 transitional which still gives up 2 errors and in the css there are still 8 errors and 1 warning. In the html you are using self closing tags img src= blah blah blah / you don't need that in 4.01 transitional. Plus you have td tags closed that are not open, however, I also notice that it is changing with each refresh so you must be working on it ... good for you ! ... :o) HTH's ... B. William Haggerty VWH Web Services http://vwh.ca - Original Message - From: Anthony Timberlake [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, December 21, 2004 1:10 PM Subject: Re: [WSG] My Site I do have one set of head, body and html tags. I have validated my CSS and HTML. On Tue, 21 Dec 2004 10:51:36 -0500, Al Sessions [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Anthony Timberlake wrote: My site is http://www.dotradio.uni.cc. What can I do to improve my site? Is there anything wrong with it? I don't mean to be rude but a token attempt at validation is probably in order before asking for suggestions. You may want to start by limiting yourself to one set of head, body and html tags :) -- Al Sessions http://fultonchain.net They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. -- B. Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** -- Anthony Timberlake DJ on Dot Radio http://www.dotradio.uni.cc ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** -- Anthony Timberlake DJ on Dot Radio http://www.dotradio.uni.cc ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] My Site
On 22 Dec 2004, at 9:04 AM, Anthony Timberlake wrote: I am not new at this, just haven't done it for a while now. I thought by being on this list, I could get the help I needed. I appologize if I offended you. I'm not in the least offended. But if you'd like help from this list (and this advice is for all new members) it helps to read the guidelines, and at least try and fix the basic problems yourself. Validate your code. Research what Web Standards is about. After an honest attempt to reach a minimum level of conformance to Standards, we're happy to help with those perplexing details. But requests for help with a site that has *so many* fundamental errors is, as I said, just annoying. I'll reintroduce an acronym for the list to use: HUTHY. Help us to help you. Good luck. N ___ Omnivision. Websight. http://www.omnivision.com.au/ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] Please explain use of html#____
Hi
I just read the brilliant article on font sizing at Usable type that Russ
pointed us to (http://usabletype.com/styles/sizes/) and had a look at the
style sheet in use and was wondering what this meant.
#wrap {
padding:0;
text-align:left;
margin:10px auto 0 auto;
width:700px;
color:#333;
font: x-small/1.4 arial, verdana, georgia, sans-serif;
voice-family:\}\;
voice-family:inherit;
font: small/1.4 arial, verdana, georgia, sans-serif;
}
html#wrap {
font-size:small;
}
the html# is used a bit eg and I was wondering what it meant...
#sideinfo {
float:right;
width:160px;
border-left:1px solid #ccc;
margin:0;
padding:0;
font-size:xx-small;
voice-family:\}\;
voice-family:inherit;
font-size:x-small;
}
html#sideinfo {
font-size:x-small;
}
Thanks
Helen
***
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Web Designer, Teaching Learning Development
Charles Darwin University, Northern Territory 0909
Tel: 8946 7779 Mobile: 0403 290 842
mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
www.cdu.edu.au
CRICOS Provider No: 00300K
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Re: [WSG] Please explain use of html#____
On Wed, 22 Dec 2004 08:31:27 +0930, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
is a child selector:
http://www.w3.org/TR/2004/CR-CSS21-20040225/selector.html#child-selectors
html#wrap means element with id=wrap inside html (but not inside other
element inside html).
If its not body id=wrap (or head) then it doesn't match anything in
html.
So, in this case it's CSS hack. AFAIK IE5/win ignores and + selectors
and iterprets it as html #wrap.
There are other variations:
Such code:
* selector {}
hides CSS from IE6, and:
* html selector {}
hides code from everything except IE.
--
regards, Kornel Lesiski
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Re: [WSG] Please explain use of html#____
' ' is CSS for 'child of'. In this instance - html#wrap - it means any element with an id of 'wrap' that is a child of the html element. The reason they've used it here is probably because IE does not understand that selector, so it will ignore the rule. Hope that cleared it up a bit for you :) Andrew. http://leftjustified.net/ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Please explain use of html#____
' ' is CSS for 'child of'. In this instance - html#wrap - it means any element with an id of 'wrap' that is a child of the html element. The reason they've used it here is probably because IE does not understand that selector, so it will ignore the rule. Hope that cleared it up a bit for you :) Andrew. http://leftjustified.net/ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] My Site
Hello; You have said . --- It is now validated with HTML and CSS. Does anyone have anything else that I can do to improve my site? Sites to read and gain more knowledge, scripts? --- And I must nowsay ... Sorry but it still doesn't validate, it still has 6 errors.. see this link ... http://validator.w3.org/check?verbose=1uri=http%3A//www.dotradio.uni.cc/ and neither does the css validate these are the errors there ... Errors URI : http://www.dotradio.uni.cc/ Line: 97 Invalid number : paddingUnknown dimension : 4x (must be px or em or %) Line: 113 Invalid number : font-sizeonly 0 can be a length. You must put an unit after your number : 14 (must have px or em or ex or %) Line: 121 Invalid number : font-sizeonly 0 can be a length. You must put an unit after your number : 11 Line: 122 Invalid number : font-sizeonly 0 can be a length. You must put an unit after your number : 11 Line: 143 Invalid number : font-sizeonly 0 can be a length. You must put an unit after your number : 14 Line: 151 Invalid number : font-sizeonly 0 can be a length. You must put an unit after your number : 11 Line: 152 Invalid number : font-sizeonly 0 can be a length. You must put an unit after your number : 11 Warnings URI : http://www.dotradio.uni.cc/styles/1.css Line : 10 font-family: You are encouraged to offer a generic family as a last alternative Line : 19 font-family: You are encouraged to offer a generic family as a last alternative Line : 26 font-family: You are encouraged to offer a generic family as a last alternative (this usually means having a generic font such as serif as the last font choice) Still, it's a lot better than the original 130 errors ... :o) What validator are you using that misses these errors? If I may suggest here, a visit to this particular website would be very enlightening ... http://www.meyerweb.com/eric/css/ and down at the bottom there are links to books he has written which are very useful in understanding CSS and it's implementation... HTH's ... B. William HaggertyVWH Web Serviceshttp://vwh.ca - Original Message - From: "Anthony Timberlake" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, December 21, 2004 2:47 PM Subject: Re: [WSG] My Site It is now validated with HTML and CSS. Does anyone have anything else that I can do to improve my site? Sites to read and gain more knowledge, scripts? On Tue, 21 Dec 2004 14:32:14 -0800, haggis [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello; I see now that you have changed the "doctype" to 4.01 transitional which still gives up 2 errors and in the css there are still 8 errors and 1 warning. In the html you are using self closing tags img src="" / you don't need that in 4.01 transitional. Plus you have td tags closed that are not open, however, I also notice that it is changing with each refresh so you must be working on it ... good for you ! ... :o) HTH's ... B. William Haggerty VWH Web Services http://vwh.ca - Original Message - From: "Anthony Timberlake" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, December 21, 2004 1:10 PM Subject: Re: [WSG] My Site I do have one set of head, body and html tags. I have validated my CSS and HTML.On Tue, 21 Dec 2004 10:51:36 -0500, Al Sessions [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Anthony Timberlake wrote: My site is http://www.dotradio.uni.cc. What can I do to improve my site? Is there anything wrong with it? I don't mean to be rude but a token attempt at validation is probably in order before asking for suggestions. You may want to start by limiting yourself to one set of head, body and html tags :) -- Al Sessions http://fultonchain.net "They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. " -- B. Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** -- Anthony Timberlake DJ on Dot Radio http://www.dotradio.uni.cc ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** --
[WSG] Including modules
Hey I'm still trying to figure out how to add modules Is there any tutorial on what you need to do with the .dtd, .mod, etc... documents and files? Or, morerather... How do I insert this module: http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml-modularization/dtd_module_defs.html#a_module_Iframe Into an XHTML1.1 page? Regards -David R ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] e-Government Implementation Guidelines
Hi The webstandardsgroup.org is able to be updated by all members. Feel free to add relevant resources as you like! Regards James ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Please explain use of html#____
Kornel Lesinski wrote: So, in this case it's CSS hack. AFAIK IE5/win ignores and + selectors and iterprets it as html #wrap. Still trying to find out which browsers mistakenly apply this. IE5/5.5/6 seem to rightly ignore the rule. The closest I came was the star-7 hack http://centricle.com/ref/css/filters/tests/star-7/ but haven't found any reference to html#blah type hack. Could it be a hack that was misspelt? -- Patrick H. Lauke _ redux (adj.): brought back; returned. used postpositively [latin : re-, re- + dux, leader; see duke.] www.splintered.co.uk | www.photographia.co.uk http://redux.deviantart.com ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] My Site
Anthony Timberlake wrote: My site is http://www.dotradio.uni.cc. What can I do to improve my site? Is there anything wrong with it? Thanks for your help. To me, the #3 stylesheet provides the least bothersome color combination, but that produces a section of virtually invisible text at the top of the page. Black on dark blue is hard to read anyway, but your subatomic font-size: 11px makes it wholly useless viewed in IE, except for the very few users astute enough to trudge into settings and disable author font sizes entirely. Only after zooming 200% does that black on blue text begin to become legible. Even the main content text is uncomfortable to read at 200% zoom due to insufficient contrast. By the time I zoom enough for comfort, 300%, the page looks rather strange. There's way too much whitespace. The web is chock full of helpful links on page design. Maybe you'd do well to pick a few links off http://members.ij.net/mrmazda/auth/wauth2.html to start with. -- I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.John 14:6 NIV Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 Felix Miata *** http://members.ij.net/mrmazda/auth/ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Please explain use of html#____
Kornel Lesinski wrote:
So, in this case it's CSS hack. AFAIK IE5/win ignores and
+ selectors and iterprets it as html #wrap.
Still trying to find out which browsers mistakenly apply this. IE5/5.5/6
seem to rightly ignore the rule. The closest I came was the star-7 hack
http://centricle.com/ref/css/filters/tests/star-7/
but haven't found any reference to html#blah type hack. Could it be a
hack that was misspelt?
Today I've ran into problems with IE5.01/win:
dt.active + dd {}
was applied to all dd elements, even changing to:
* dt.active + dd {}
didn't help - IE5 still stubbornly saw the rule.
I have standalone IE5 on WinXP, so maybe this was the cause. Anyway - its
weird.
http://browsehappy.pl/style.css
--
regards, Kornel Lesiski
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Re: [WSG] expand divs height with content
Gunlaug Sørtun wrote: Jeffery Fernandez wrote: I am trying to get a Div to expand its height when the content grows. Site development url is http://www.hotshot.com.au/dev/fpaa/ This: http://www.positioniseverything.net/easyclearing.html , or any other clearing-method, should fix that problem. BTW: IE6 won't display the two center-columns at all. Try a HasLayout trick like height: 0; or position: relative; for IE/win only, to fix that. Georg Thanks everyone, I realised it wasn't the best solution to make the middle 2 columns with div's so I resorted to a table layout for the middle two columns. cheers, Jeffery ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** . ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Hover psuedo-class issues
Does anyone know of any existing (and much simpler) JavaScript libraries that enable :hover, :focus, and :active for non anchor tags for IE? Look it up in http://alistapart.com/articles/dropdowns -- Jan Brasna :: alphanumeric.cz | webcore.cz | designlab.cz | janbrasna.com ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] My Site
Try http://colorschemer.com/ Have a look at http://wellstyled.com/tools/colorscheme2/index-en.html -- Jan Brasna :: alphanumeric.cz | webcore.cz | designlab.cz | janbrasna.com ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] My Site
I think that I have done a nice job with the new stylesheets. On Wed, 22 Dec 2004 01:58:20 +0100, JohnyB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Try http://colorschemer.com/ Have a look at http://wellstyled.com/tools/colorscheme2/index-en.html -- Jan Brasna :: alphanumeric.cz | webcore.cz | designlab.cz | janbrasna.com ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** -- Anthony Timberlake DJ on Dot Radio http://www.dotradio.uni.cc ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] My Site
I think that I have done a nice job with the new stylesheets. On Wed, 22 Dec 2004 01:58:20 +0100, JohnyB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Try http://colorschemer.com/ Have a look at http://wellstyled.com/tools/colorscheme2/index-en.html -- Jan Brasna :: alphanumeric.cz | webcore.cz | designlab.cz | janbrasna.com ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** -- Anthony Timberlake DJ on Dot Radio http://www.dotradio.uni.cc ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] My Site
dude that site bites ! Anthony Timberlake wrote: I think that I have done a nice job with the new stylesheets. On Wed, 22 Dec 2004 01:58:20 +0100, JohnyB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Try http://colorschemer.com/ Have a look at http://wellstyled.com/tools/colorscheme2/index-en.html -- Jan Brasna :: alphanumeric.cz | webcore.cz | designlab.cz | janbrasna.com ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] Color Scheme Tools (Was: My Site)
On Wed, 22 Dec 2004 01:58:20 +0100, JohnyB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Try http://colorschemer.com/ Have a look at http://wellstyled.com/tools/colorscheme2/index-en.html A while back I had compiled a list of some good Color Scheme Tools here: http://www.krassycandoit.com/blah/2004/06/color-scheme-tools.html My 2 cents, Krassy = Krassy Lyakov web.developer web: http://www.krassy.com/ blog: http://www.krassycandoit.com/blah/ __ Do you Yahoo!? Dress up your holiday email, Hollywood style. Learn more. http://celebrity.mail.yahoo.com ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] My Site
Excuse me? On Wed, 22 Dec 2004 11:19:31 +1000, simon dodson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: dude that site bites ! -- Anthony Timberlake DJ on Dot Radio http://www.dotradio.uni.cc ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] My Site
Well, it's getting there the html now validates but the css still does not. It has the same errors as before only now they are on all three stylesheets. You cannot list sizes or dimensions without the unit in other words padding: 2; is not valid however, padding: 2px (or em or %) is. and the same goes for font-size: 14px; is how it should read and NOT font-size: 14; You still need to specify a generic font as well Fix those and it'll be fine ... B. William Haggerty VWH Web Services http://vwh.ca - Original Message - From: Anthony Timberlake [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, December 21, 2004 5:05 PM Subject: Re: [WSG] My Site I think that I have done a nice job with the new stylesheets. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Color Scheme Tools (Was: My Site)
Back in July I made a very small experiment that calculates tints and their respective complementaries based on hex values. To my surprise, even Eric Meyer liked it enough to link to it at the time (ah, my 15 seconds of fame). It's basic, but it just arose out of an immediate need I had at the time. Give it a whirl, you never know... http://www.splintered.co.uk/experiments/43/ -- Patrick H. Lauke _ re·dux (adj.): brought back; returned. used postpositively [latin : re-, re- + dux, leader; see duke.] www.splintered.co.uk | www.photographia.co.uk http://redux.deviantart.com ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] My Site
How are you getting errors? http://jigsaw.w3.org/css-validator/validator?uri=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.dotradio.uni.cc%2Fstyles%2F1.cssusermedium=all http://jigsaw.w3.org/css-validator/validator?uri=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.dotradio.uni.cc%2Fstyles%2F2.cssusermedium=all http://jigsaw.w3.org/css-validator/validator?uri=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.dotradio.uni.cc%2Fstyles%2F3.cssusermedium=all http://jigsaw.w3.org/css-validator/validator?uri=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.dotradio.uni.cc%2Fstyles%2F4.cssusermedium=all That is the validator for the CSS. On Tue, 21 Dec 2004 17:33:59 -0800, haggis [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Well, it's getting there the html now validates but the css still does not. It has the same errors as before only now they are on all three stylesheets. You cannot list sizes or dimensions without the unit in other words padding: 2; is not valid however, padding: 2px (or em or %) is. and the same goes for font-size: 14px; is how it should read and NOT font-size: 14; You still need to specify a generic font as well Fix those and it'll be fine ... B. William Haggerty VWH Web Services http://vwh.ca - Original Message - From: Anthony Timberlake [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, December 21, 2004 5:05 PM Subject: Re: [WSG] My Site I think that I have done a nice job with the new stylesheets. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** -- Anthony Timberlake DJ on Dot Radio http://www.dotradio.uni.cc ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] rationalising my refusal to support IE/NS4
Nick Cowie wrote: Get hold of their web logs or from a similar site, you should find the combined IE4/NS4 and earlier browsers account for less than 0.5% of all vistors (it is with our sites) and seeing a sizeable chunk ( a least a third) of those are using NS3, IE3 or NS4.04 (bad javascript) or earlier. Regarding the and earlier browsers, I often wonder whenever I see them listed how many of hem are real? How many are spoofed user agents? How many are people planing games and normally browse with Firefox, et al? And how many really are the best the person has available, for whatever the ration may be? I suppose if you can examine which OS they're using, you may get a big clue. For example, am I suppose to accept as ligitamate Netscape 2 running on an XP machine? ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] My Site
Anthony - you are validating the individual css files. Your inline styles still leave a bit to be desired... When you validate css using a site url it takes the css that page accesses and runs . You are validating each file in isolation from inline styles. For example: div style=height:100%;width:100%;border:1px solid #000;padding:2x div style=float:right;width:80%;border:1px solid #000;padding:4x class=main Throw up errors when you validate your page, but not when you check an individual css file. You are on the right track using external style sheets - so why not move inline styles as well? http://jigsaw.w3.org/css-validator/validator?profile=css2warning=2uri=http%3A//www.dotradio.uni.cc/ Marc. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] My Site--Sorry
On Tue, 21 Dec 2004 20:40:50 -0500, Anthony Timberlake [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Sorry, see correction below--- sans-serif *not* serif How are you getting errors? http://jigsaw.w3.org/css-validator/validator?uri=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.dotradio.uni.cc%2Fstyles%2F1.cssusermedium=all http://jigsaw.w3.org/css-validator/validator?uri=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.dotradio.uni.cc%2Fstyles%2F2.cssusermedium=all http://jigsaw.w3.org/css-validator/validator?uri=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.dotradio.uni.cc%2Fstyles%2F3.cssusermedium=all http://jigsaw.w3.org/css-validator/validator?uri=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.dotradio.uni.cc%2Fstyles%2F4.cssusermedium=all That is the validator for the CSS. When you scroll those links you'll see the warnings. Change this: font-family : Tahoma, Verdana, Arial; to read this: font-family : Tahoma, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif; each and every time it appears, on each and every style sheet. David -- http://www.dlaakso.com/ Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] My Site
Anthony; You asked . - How are you getting errors? - I open your site in FF and use the developers toolbar to validate your html and your css at the W3C ... when I did it before it was for the html 4.01 transitional page, now when I click on your link http://www.dotradio.uni.cc/?act=homestyle=4style=4 it's back to an xhtml document with 154 errors and the stylesheet (all 4 of them have the same error .. an unclosed link tag . So, just how the heck are you getting a valid stylesheet? And what page are you using, the html 4.01 or the xhtml one ??? It seems we're checking against two different sites, so which one is it? Bill. William Haggerty VWH Web Services http://vwh.ca - Original Message - From: Anthony Timberlake [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, December 21, 2004 5:40 PM Subject: Re: [WSG] My Site How are you getting errors? http://jigsaw.w3.org/css-validator/validator?uri=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.dotradio.uni.cc%2Fstyles%2F1.cssusermedium=all http://jigsaw.w3.org/css-validator/validator?uri=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.dotradio.uni.cc%2Fstyles%2F2.cssusermedium=all http://jigsaw.w3.org/css-validator/validator?uri=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.dotradio.uni.cc%2Fstyles%2F3.cssusermedium=all http://jigsaw.w3.org/css-validator/validator?uri=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.dotradio.uni.cc%2Fstyles%2F4.cssusermedium=all That is the validator for the CSS. On Tue, 21 Dec 2004 17:33:59 -0800, haggis [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Well, it's getting there the html now validates but the css still does not. It has the same errors as before only now they are on all three stylesheets. You cannot list sizes or dimensions without the unit in other words padding: 2; is not valid however, padding: 2px (or em or %) is. and the same goes for font-size: 14px; is how it should read and NOT font-size: 14; You still need to specify a generic font as well Fix those and it'll be fine ... B. William Haggerty VWH Web Services http://vwh.ca - Original Message - From: Anthony Timberlake [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, December 21, 2004 5:05 PM Subject: Re: [WSG] My Site I think that I have done a nice job with the new stylesheets. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** -- Anthony Timberlake DJ on Dot Radio http://www.dotradio.uni.cc ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Please explain use of html#____
On 22 Dec 2004, at 9:25 am, Kornel Lesinski wrote:
Today I've ran into problems with IE5.01/win:
dt.active + dd {}
was applied to all dd elements, even changing to:
* dt.active + dd {}
didn't help - IE5 still stubbornly saw the rule.
If there is white-space around the '+', than IE5.0 applies the
rule. (IE5.5 is OK, it ignores the whole thing). Similarly, there
are problems (again, IE5.0) with *selector {}.
IE ignores the * and the direct-child selector. Go figure...
And Patrick wrote
Still trying to find out which browsers mistakenly apply this.
IE5/5.5/6
seem to rightly ignore the rule. The closest I came was the star-7 hack
http://centricle.com/ref/css/filters/tests/star-7/
but haven't found any reference to html#blah type hack. Could it be a
hack that was misspelt?
I wouldn't know which UA selects html#blah.
The closest filter I can think of is
* htmlbody #foo {}
which can be used to serve a style rule to IE Mac *only*.
Given the context mentioned by Helen, it might have been one of those
'be nice to Opera' hacks associated with the Tantek voice-family
filter.
Philippe
---/---
Philippe Wittenbergh
now live : http://emps.l-c-n.com/
code | design | web projects : http://www.l-c-n.com/
IE5 Mac bugs and oddities : http://www.l-c-n.com/IE5tests/
**
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See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
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[WSG] W3C what are they doing ?
I am anxious about the changements which is coming with the new standard. Most of us have developped application using DOM which maybe will not be valid with the new standard especially with XHTML 2.0 and DOM3. I think standard doesn't take in consideration some attribute which was being used by the browsers and which are not standard like the innerHTML (DOM). I real don't understand why they don't want to support it. It is so helpfull and it is quicker than using the w3c way. How are we going to convert site which using iframe and all the javascript coming with like the designmode wich is support now by bought IE and FireFox ? Is the browser are going to follow all the recommandation of the standard ? I don't think so I presume they are going for the DOM, developping plus the standard their own module. Even we don't agree with Microsoft some of their DOM function is very interesting so interesting that other Browsers adopted them. Why the standard is not open for other function developped by other group when the function are effective and usefull? My last email Changing Standard part2 !!! I tryed to discuss about the standard and the future of the web but no one seems to be interested to discuss about that. Maybe it was not so signifiant (my english is not that good and this makes it difficult to explain all my ideas) or maybe people are more and more afraid of changements and prefer to follow the rules with-out asking if we are taking the right way. Berry ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] rationalising my refusal to support IE/NS4
Hi Nick, We successfully moved NN4 off our primary support list a couple of years ago, despite the lingering in-house installs due to NN4 once upon a time being the standard browser. My thoughts on your situation I have a requirements document here that I'm quoting for, that mentions that the web site should be optimised for IE4 and Netscape 4. Does it actually say optimised? I'm guessing yes. We convinced people that you should optimise for browsers which are current market leaders. Note that doesn't say most common, just market leaders :) I would like to educate them on why supporting these dinosaurs is not a good idea. To be honest, don't get too hung up on actually getting them to Believe In Better Browsers, since the people who make decisions and hold the purse strings generally don't really care. They might like to feel good, but they'll skip that if they have to. Wording is your friend here. We used phrases like legacy browsers will be supported through graceful degradation. Meaning you are still supporting NN4 - just in a particular way. This is like car companies who stock parts for old models for decades, since there are still a few people out there driving the vehicles. Semantics are your friend - you're not saying anything about NN4 being good or bad, just that it's a legacy browser. Most managers understand that means it might even have been shit-hot once, but now it's behind the times and we're just letting it run out its life. Meanwhile you've used two very positive words - supported and graceful. Avoid using negative words since managers might latch on to them. If questioned you can talk about different browsers offering more efficient protype and development paths but be very careful going down that path - you might get caught supporting the *most popular* browser. A potentially winning argument is quoting two prices: one to build a site which works normally in NN4/IE4; and one which supports those browsers via graceful degradation. Since the graceful degradation price is likely to be quite significantly lower, they might vote with their budget. If the site has any form of secure content you can also talk about the encryption support, or lack of it, in old browsers. This argument alone can send IE4/5.0 flying off the support list faster than you can say privacy breach and litigation. None of this is foolproof though and you can get caught out playing this game - there is always the risk that they'll misinterpret what you're saying and tell you to just support the most common browser and you're in IE6 hell. So... I hope this helps; and I feel your pain :) cheers, h -- --- http://cheshrkat.blogspot.com/ --- The future has arrived; it's just not --- evenly distributed. - William Gibson ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] W3C what are they doing ?
Hi Berry A few points here: - I doubt XHTML 2/DOM 3 will hit the main stream for a number of years (at least 5). So I wouldn't start worrying about it now. - I don't think XHTML 2/DOM 3 have be designed with developers in mind. These guys are not thinking about our immediate needs - they are thinking about the direction of the web in the future. - HTML4 works and will continue to work - why upgrade sites for the sake of it if there is no specific benefit that you want? - No tool (browser) will ever follow a specification exactly. - The W3C is a fairly open organisation and if you are interested in the direction of the standards they are producing, sign up to the relevant mailing lists and watch it happen in real time. - There is the spec, there are the various browser implementations and then there is the real world. These three things are all pulling in slightly different directions, but they do also influence each other and help each other along. Lastly I'd say that nothing much has changed - this situation has been around for ages. Standards get written by very smart academics in lab coats, browser companies implement the specs to a greater or lesser extent and we go on using the web. its not perfect, but it has got us where we are today and I certainly don't think there is some crisis looming. -- Mark Stanton Gruden Pty Ltd http://www.gruden.com ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] W3C what are they doing ?
Hi Berry, I wouldn't be so anxious about the new xhtml standards for now. I really don't think it'll be around in the next 4 to 5 years (if ever). If browsers will follow standards... I think there is a hole new awareness about standards and I think new browsers will follow standards. Even IE I think when taking their new beta search into consideration. But then again... if I knew I would be doing something different and get a much better paid :) Kim berry wrote: I am anxious about the changements which is coming with the new standard. Most of us have developped application using DOM which maybe will not be valid with the new standard especially with XHTML 2.0 and DOM3. I think standard doesn't take in consideration some attribute which was being used by the browsers and which are not standard like the innerHTML (DOM). I real don't understand why they don't want to support it. It is so helpfull and it is quicker than using the w3c way. How are we going to convert site which using iframe and all the javascript coming with like the designmode wich is support now by bought IE and FireFox ? Is the browser are going to follow all the recommandation of the standard ? I don't think so I presume they are going for the DOM, developping plus the standard their own module. Even we don't agree with Microsoft some of their DOM function is very interesting so interesting that other Browsers adopted them. Why the standard is not open for other function developped by other group when the function are effective and usefull? My last email Changing Standard part2 !!! I tryed to discuss about the standard and the future of the web but no one seems to be interested to discuss about that. Maybe it was not so signifiant (my english is not that good and this makes it difficult to explain all my ideas) or maybe people are more and more afraid of changements and prefer to follow the rules with-out asking if we are taking the right way. Berry ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
