Re: [WSG] KHTML ??
Am 10.06.2004 um 15:10 schrieb Jad Madi: guys what is KHTML ? please use google before you post to the list (http://www.google.com/search?q=khtmlie=UTF-8oe=UTF-8). it's the rendering engine from konqueror (http://www.konqueror.org/features/browser.php) which is also used in apples rendering engine WebCore (http://developer.apple.com/darwin/projects/webcore/) and their browser safari (http://www.apple.com/safari/). konqueror had very bad css support but apple cleaned khtml quite well it up so konquerors support is better now as well. at least afaik :) however i haven't tested/tried it in the last few months. regards, michael -- Michael Zeltner Netalley Networks LLP http://www.netalleynetworks.com/ * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help *
Re: [WSG] IE 7 Promo Images
Am 08.06.2004 um 05:39 schrieb Sean M. Hall (Dante): http://www.geocities.com/seanmhall2003/ie7.html I'd like your opinion on these two images (please remember that I'm a beginner at design). it crashes my safari for some reason? regards, michael PS: it would be nice if you'd use plain text emails. -- Michael Zeltner Netalley Networks LLP http://www.netalleynetworks.com/ * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help *
Re: [WSG] Tables are bad because...
Am 15.05.2004 um 08:52 schrieb Peter A. Shevtsov: I do not agree about image maps. For example, you have the image of geographical map, and you have to make so, if you click on the certain country area, the page with information related to this country would open. How can you provide this without image maps? agreed - the nice thing on imagemaps is you aren't forced to use squares. if someone would make that with block a /s without visual content he'd have to put loads of these to get every edge of the country linked. but hey, you could do that with accessible flash, that would be cleaner :) regards, michael -- Michael Zeltner Netalley Networks LLP http://www.netalleynetworks.com/ * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help *
Re: [WSG] Tables are bad because...
Am 15.05.2004 um 20:36 schrieb Peter A. Shevtsov: Michael Zeltner wrote: but hey, you could do that with accessible flash, that would be cleaner :) Hey! You force visitors to install Flash player. But someone can't do that because their internal company policy, or they just don't know how to do it. i don't force anybody to do anything: accessible flash means, alternative content *and* (in case you didn't know they exists) using flashs accessibility features (http://www.macromedia.com/macromedia/accessibility/features/flash/). I think that image maps are more accessible. they are, but i didn't say more accessible. clean (as in semantically correct) was what i meant. the problem is, if someone has an old screenreader and flash installed, he won't get the flash features, and no alternative content. What do you mean by accessibe flash apropos? see above. regards, michael -- Michael Zeltner Netalley Networks LLP http://www.netalleynetworks.com/ * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help *
[WSG] CSS Debugger in JS
hey guys i'm not sure anyone posted that in the list yet: http://www.codepoetry.net/archives/2004/02/07/css_debugger_redux.php very very handy crossbrowser tool - works in safari and firefox for me - macie and the latest opera 7.5 beta/release candidate for mac don't support it (yet - for opera) - can't test winie right now but i'm sure someone will answer :) regards, michael -- Michael Zeltner Netalley Networks LLP http://www.netalleynetworks.com/ * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help *
Re: [WSG] Sickening - CSS Theft
Mark Stanton wrote: In a startling turn of events, Dave Shea has noted that Douglas Bowman has redesigned his website today. Dave, the creator of CSS Zen Garden, has been concerned, indeed outspoken, about CSS theft for some time. It seems that his worst fear were well founded. Read more here: http://www.mezzoblue.com/archives/covers/apr01-04/. Douglas' shameful new creative can been seen here: http://www.stopdesign.com/. april fool. ;) -- /gro.jiin//:ptth °jiin * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help *
Re: [WSG] Lists weird br / requirement
Frank wrote: I've also noticed that in order to get all the items in the record to display properly in the DIV, I have to add br clear=all / just before closing the DIV, otherwise, the content overlaps the bottom border of the DIV. give the last item in the div a clear: both; - or add a div instead of the break tag (avoiding presentational markup) and you should actually use tables or definition lists here, because thats what these things were made for. regards, michael -- /gro.jiin//:ptth jiin * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
Re: [WSG] IE7 fixes CSS glitches for IE
Lindsay Evans wrote: Certainly interesting, pity it doesn't validate though: http://jigsaw.w3.org/css-validator/validator?uri=http%3A%2F%2Fdean.edwards. name%2Fmy%2Fbehaviors%2Fie7-xml.csswarning=2profile=css2usermedium=all of course it isn't but it uses evil technologies to create good things. just put conditional comments around it and you're done. the only bad thing about it is: depending on it is almost impossible. if you turn off normal scripting you'll get a *blank* page. if you still want to use it, np, but if active x stuff is turned off then you haven't got *any* functionality of the script (but at least the page shows up). so we're back in reality: depending on it makes the page inaccessible for some crazy ie users. it would've been too nice. so much markup could've been cleaned up, all around the web... regards, michael -- /gro.jiin//:ptth jiin * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
Re: [WSG] SimpleBits ripped - is this for real?
report it to simplebits, put it on http://www.pirated-sites.com/ regards, michael -- /gro.jiin//:ptth jiin * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
Re: [WSG] SimpleBits ripped - is this for real?
oops, it has already been reported... too late... -- /gro.jiin//:ptth jiin * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
Re: [WSG] CSS and PhpNuke
i'd recommend plone (http://plone.org/), but probably because i'm one of the guys at the ui team ;) we're really focusing on accessibility, semantic markup, and flexibility through css. if you have any questions: there are plone irc channels (#plone and #plonedesign (the ui channel) on freenode) and mailinglists (http://plone.org/documentation/lists). regards, michael -- /gro.jiin//:ptth jiin * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
Re: [WSG] Semantic vs Accessibile markup
Tonico Strasser wrote: Who benefits from more semantic /navigation/? Maybe a XSLT designer? the only benefits are: you have the data in it's natural form and semantic markup is automatically perfectly accessible (the only problem would be a stupid (sorry) ua like jaws, but even that is easily solvable). the w3c defined functions for tags. a navigation is naturally a list. so it should be a list, even in the markup and not only visually. they just give you enough freedom to do what you think is better ;) regards, michael -- /gro.jiin//:ptth jiin * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
Re: [WSG] Semantic vs Accessibile markup
Tonico Strasser wrote: Please, can you tell me more about the problem with Jaws and how it can be fixed? floats instead of inline elements for navigation. jaws uses ie, and ie renders it as inline element so jaws will read it as inline element. floated blocks (btw, can one float list elements?) will be read differently (afaik. i don't have jaws yet). lets hope new versions will support the new screenreader (just heard of it) media type. regards, michael -- /gro.jiin//:ptth jiin * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
Re: Opening pages in new windows... was Re: [WSG] XHTML (OT??)
i think it depends on how you see it. the customer (i presume this is your job) wants the user to stay on the site as long as possible. if a site opens in a new window, the possibility that user will browse his site again, is much higher than if he has just the back button. from the usability/information architecture point, the target=_blank is rather bad imho. just my 0.02 euro ;) regards, michael -- niij http://niij.org/ * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
Re: [WSG] Print Media
Taco Fleur wrote: With a print media style sheet is it like possible to say hide everything but this one ID? Example; I have a page with many elements, but I want to only print the form elements when printing. no you can't: http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-CSS2/visuren.html#display-prop the display property none This value causes an element to generate no boxes in the formatting structure (i.e., the element has no effect on layout). Descendant elements do not generate any boxes either; this behavior *cannot* be overridden by setting the 'display' property on the descendants. i don't know how this would look in real life use but i suggest violating the specs is bad. regards, Michael -- niij http://niij.org/ * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
Re: [WSG] OT: damn I feel old
A couple of 'youngsters' posted today, one 17 (from Plone.org) and one 16, both must be pretty competent web designers from the links they've posted, especially Plone, i love what they do! thanks :) Made me feel a bit long in the tooth at 27, so I started wondering how old you gurus are? Would be good to get an idea of where we sit demographically... honestly, css guru is not a word combination i like. basically css is very easy. so everyone can become a guru quite fast. no matter how old you are. regards, michael -- niij http://niij.org/ * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
Re: [WSG] Maestro site : nearly xhtml
James Ellis wrote: I know this may have been said before, but this list is too cool. how do you mean? Michael, wikis are always going to be trouble - just because it is a wiki, if you know what I mean. yes i do, i don't like wikis but *sometimes* they can be useful. I think it'd be great if one of the plone group could present something to WSG about how they put plone together with the focus you mention below. you mean make a presentation on one of the meetings? we're already working on documentation and presentations aswell as on examples (like maestro). we hope to finish all that soon. like the 2.0 release ;) Cheers James regards, michael -- niij http://niij.org/ * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
Re: [WSG] Maestro site : nearly xhtml
hey james i was/am involved in the development of that site and thanks for telling me/us that the content wasn't valid ;) the important pages are repaired now. to clean up the forum markup is almost impossible (it's not a good piece of software imo), we just used it as it was. and the wiki is just a mess ;) i hope i can clean up the table stuff too - maybe next week or sunday. so this is my first post (just heard about this mailinglist), maybe i should introduce myself: i'm Michael Zeltner, 17 years old, from austria/vienna, part of the Plone (http://plone.org/) ui team. we focus on webstandards, semantic xhtml coding, accessibility, and heavy nonhackish css ;) plone has still a long way to go, but it's quite okay what we did until now, i think. best regards -- niij http://niij.org/ * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
