tom
thanks for the kind words but NO THANKS!!!
Im giving relivent information to the coversation that is relivent to MY
life that just HAPPENS to relate to this thread
like dale said this is a SECURITY issue its some thing I have seen
10s of times on lists and
...that sound you hear is neil breaking his foot off in tom cox's tomcox
Neil Wiernik [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
tom
thanks for the kind words but NO THANKS!!!
Im giving relivent information to the coversation that is relivent to MY
life that just HAPPENS to relate to this thread
LMAO
On Tue, 5 Sep 2006, /0 wrote:
...that sound you hear is neil breaking his foot off in tom cox's tomcox
Neil Wiernik [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
tom
thanks for the kind words but NO THANKS!!!
Im giving relivent information to the coversation that is relivent to MY
life that just
On 9/5/06, /0 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
...that sound you hear is neil breaking his foot off in tom cox's tomcox
it sounded to me like more blatant self promotion. but then again i
guess its all subjective, right? suckers.
tom
about audio detail
/12
- Original Message -
From: Neil Wiernik [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: 313@hyperreal.org
Sent: Sunday, September 03, 2006 11:43 PM
Subject: Re: (313) The Laptop Debate.
you under estimate my knowlege sir get off dial up and listen to what Im
talking about once your out
Sent: Sunday, September 03, 2006 5:18 PM
Subject: Re: (313) The Laptop Debate.
fair enough
go here
http://www.myspace.com/nawmusic
the tracks from the green nights orange days record are prime examples
of
my music mastered BY twerk sounding warm so first listen to mid winter
sailboat ride
kent williams [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Honestly, what matters besides the actual compositions?
maybe i'm taking this one line too much out of context, but that
sounds like a frighteningly traditionalist rhetorical question.
in one sense i do agree, hence my bringing up that there's
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Self-appointed golden ears dismiss feeling and creativity, because
anyone can appreciate those qualities in music (though not always at first
blush, since some tastes are acquired), whereas it takes a genuine
superior class of lonely douche to prioritize the production
sound i mentioned
earlier?
i'll pretend i havent heard anyone saying boiling hot today ..
/12
- Original Message -
From: Neil Wiernik [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: 313@hyperreal.org
Sent: Sunday, September 03, 2006 5:18 PM
Subject: Re: (313) The Laptop Debate.
fair enough
go here
http
Well, don't be too frightened. All I'm saying is ... well it's right
there in the Bible Matthew 7:16: By their fruits ye shall know them.
It's been a long way around through a sometimes interesting debate,
but the bottom line for me is that it's an argument that pretty silly.
I make tracks, so
Why is it that when I make a good solid argument it somehow becomes
pointless... and then the reason isn't even backed up with anything
else that is solid? It's like the decision was made long ago, and
when the logic is at point blank range it still isn't acknowledged.
There are a bunch of
Because arguments aren't fair. If you make a point that refutes
something someone says, they can always say that wasn't actually what
they said. Or they can take one thing out of your statement and
provide what they think is a counter-example, and then use that to
think they've refuted
) The Laptop Debate.
He's in Poland, give him a break. The whole world isn't like Canada or
the US.
On 9/3/06, Neil Wiernik [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
you under estimate my knowlege sir get off dial up and listen to what Im
talking about once your out of the internet dark ages we can
: Re: (313) The Laptop Debate.
oh ok then he can get my stuff at the local shop in polan cargo services
poland
On Sun, 3 Sep 2006, kent williams wrote:
He's in Poland, give him a break. The whole world isn't like Canada or
the
US.
On 9/3/06, Neil Wiernik [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote
to accept reality as it is.
/12
- Original Message -
From: Dale Lawrence [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: 313 313@hyperreal.org
Sent: Monday, September 04, 2006 2:21 AM
Subject: Re: (313) The Laptop Debate.
It's myspace... those are mp3's... low quality mp3's at that because
that is all that myspace
?
congrats kid, now you got my nearly fallen off my chair :)
and dont forget to update your myspace pics, kiddies
/12
- Original Message -
From: Neil Wiernik [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: 313@hyperreal.org
Sent: Monday, September 04, 2006 1:40 AM
Subject: Re: (313) The Laptop Debate.
ok now your
:18 PM
Subject: Re: (313) The Laptop Debate.
fair enough
go here
http://www.myspace.com/nawmusic
the tracks from the green nights orange days record are prime examples of
my music mastered BY twerk sounding warm so first listen to mid winter
sailboat ride, and penny fishing north of main
to know..
/12
- Original Message -
From: Neil Wiernik [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: 313@hyperreal.org
Sent: Monday, September 04, 2006 1:40 AM
Subject: Re: (313) The Laptop Debate.
oh ok then he can get my stuff at the local shop in polan cargo services
poland
On Sun, 3 Sep 2006, kent
fallen off my chair :)
and dont forget to update your myspace pics, kiddies
/12
- Original Message -
From: Neil Wiernik [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: 313@hyperreal.org
Sent: Monday, September 04, 2006 1:40 AM
Subject: Re: (313) The Laptop Debate.
ok now your being a twat
my stuff is released
Ok, now we have come to the point were we are insulting people, this
threat is now officially dead (Godwin law's maybe?). Lets stop this,
don't reply to this anymore and think it never happened.
KJ
On 4-sep-2006, at 6:43, v12 wrote:
what for? quality toilet paper is widely available and
: Monday, September 04, 2006 11:04 AM
Subject: Re: (313) The Laptop Debate.
Ok, now we have come to the point were we are insulting people, this
threat is now officially dead (Godwin law's maybe?). Lets stop this,
don't reply to this anymore and think it never happened.
KJ
On 4-sep-2006, at 6:43
march 2007, i'll send someone for it..
remind me a week before if you could...
/12
- Original Message -
From: Neil Wiernik [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: 313@hyperreal.org
Sent: Monday, September 04, 2006 7:30 AM
Subject: Re: (313) The Laptop Debate.
dont bother you wont like it regardless
-Original Message-
From: chthonic streams [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: 03 September 2006 15:00
To: 313@hyperreal.org
Subject: Re: (313) The Laptop Debate.
still trying to get this one through...did some edits so we'll see.
For your info (if you don't already realise) I'm
I don't presume to know how people live their lives; the most one can
address is what people actually write to the list.
It sure must be a slow month for new releases.
On 9/2/06, Dale Lawrence [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
You live your life based on oversimplified stereotypes.
Not to stir the pot,
stir please, what else are email discussion lists for?
That being a lot of my favorite Detroit and Chicago tracks were made
in a certain way that I think made them more exciting. Specifically,
it's setting up a bunch of gear and recording it live to two track,
with one
I acctually also want to my view that supports what I said as a seasoned
producer and that goes along with autecher's view is that not only is it
the person whos making the tack A LARGE and let me repeat A LARGE amount
of creit for warmth goes to the person who is matering the final product
but maybe we
haven't seen the Ron Hardy or Derrick May of the laptop yet. But it's
silly to argue that computers, in and of themselves, are the problem.
no, true.
it's the lifeless,stiff, ear-scratching bright sound that is the problem..
it's like a plastic doll,with or without make-up it's
Not to stir the pot,
stir please, what else are email discussion lists for?
That being a lot of my favorite Detroit and Chicago tracks were made
in a certain way that I think made them more exciting. Specifically,
it's setting up a bunch of gear and recording it live to two track,
with one
bizz WRONG jelinek uses live instrumentation for the most part hes
only used samples for a small amount of recordings and acctually they are
samples of his own music playing
On Sat, 2 Sep 2006, v12 wrote:
someone mentioned jelinek,ok he can sound really sweet sometimes, but it's
acctually let me explain a little better about what I emant below...
reuses live instrumentation that he plays as sound source material for his
music... its not just him sampleing from records...
how how he samples this stuff and gets it on to his machines are all up to
him from my discussions
Ive had tracks mastered by twerk
that suddenly went from luck warm to boiling hot.. simply because he knows
what he is doing ...
^honestly, i gave you examples/titles as i know what i am saying.
if you say the opposite -pls stop the general statements about some ghost
recordings and give
At 10:25 PM 9/2/2006, you wrote:
I don't presume to know how people live their lives; the most one can
address is what people actually write to the list.
It sure must be a slow month for new releases.
On 9/2/06, Dale Lawrence [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
You live your life based on
Analog vs. Digital, PC vs. Mac, Richie vs. Jeff
Please stop discussing this, there is no point, there will be no
winner. It is all about whether you like digital sounding productions
or not. It is not about good or bad it is about like it or not.
On 3-sep-2006, at 8:15, v12 wrote:
Ive
, September 03, 2006 12:46 AM
Subject: Re: (313) The Laptop Debate.
I acctually also want to my view that supports what I said as a seasoned
producer and that goes along with autecher's view is that not only is it
the person whos making the tack A LARGE and let me repeat A LARGE amount
of creit
@hyperreal.org
Sent: Sunday, September 03, 2006 12:57 AM
Subject: Re: (313) The Laptop Debate.
bizz WRONG jelinek uses live instrumentation for the most part hes
only used samples for a small amount of recordings and acctually they are
samples of his own music playing
On Sat, 2 Sep 2006
that have
played live with him
most of his samples are from old jazz records (ie loop finding jazz
records)
- Original Message -
From: Neil Wiernik [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: 313@hyperreal.org
Sent: Sunday, September 03, 2006 12:57 AM
Subject: Re: (313) The Laptop Debate
To me, James Holden is a good example of good (and deep) music made with
computers...
One of the funny thing is that he uses a free software taht i also use
at home, and that everybody who has seen that working say hey with that
kindof soft, nobody will ever produce any good track.
--
PROTECTED]
To: /0 [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Neil Wiernik [EMAIL PROTECTED];
313@hyperreal.org
Sent: Sunday, September 03, 2006 2:56 PM
Subject: Re: (313) The Laptop Debate.
loop finding jazz records sounded nice as far as i remember but the
traks
were too long
(a matter of taste though)
i liked
still trying to get this one through...did some edits so we'll see.
Not to stir the pot,
stir please, what else are email discussion lists for?
That being a lot of my favorite Detroit and Chicago tracks were made
in a certain way that I think made them more exciting. Specifically,
it's
certain plugins go a long way toward warming and fattening up music -
but if whatever it's affecting just isn't there in the first place,
it's not going to be the same. in recorded sound, the most important
element is the source, followed by the initial capturing of that
source, and then by
fair enough
go here
http://www.myspace.com/nawmusic
the tracks from the green nights orange days record are prime examples of
my music mastered BY twerk sounding warm so first listen to mid winter
sailboat ride, and penny fishing north of main
the 2 tracks there as part of the unrelease titled
]
To: 313@hyperreal.org
Sent: Sunday, September 03, 2006 7:07 AM
Subject: Re: (313) The Laptop Debate.
acctually let me explain a little better about what I emant below...
reuses live instrumentation that he plays as sound source material for his
music... its not just him sampleing from records
12:57 AM
Subject: Re: (313) The Laptop Debate.
bizz WRONG jelinek uses live instrumentation for the most part hes only
used samples for a small amount of recordings and acctually they are
samples of his own music playing
On Sat, 2 Sep 2006, v12 wrote:
someone mentioned jelinek
I honestly think the same thing is possible with Laptops, but maybe we
haven't seen the Ron Hardy or Derrick May of the laptop yet. But it's
silly to argue that computers, in and of themselves, are the problem.
agreed. a big problem when switching over to computer, just like
from analog to
Subject: Re: (313) The Laptop Debate.
and why does he not fit??? becasue you say so?
his a digital artist samples or not he fits...
On Sun, 3 Sep 2006, v12 wrote:
did i say samples from records?
and what did i ask for?
he doesnt fit if you read carefully...
- Original
crap, just
unripe.
time will tell.
f.
- Original Message -
From: chthonic streams [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: 313@hyperreal.org
Sent: Sunday, September 03, 2006 5:40 PM
Subject: *SPAM* Re: (313) The Laptop Debate - the imitation of sound
Spam detection software, running
so what you are saying basically is that laptop and computer
music are still in relative infancy so the majority (or at least a
large number) of the users/musicians still haven't progressed much
beyond the discovery stage.
philosophically speaking therefore, this music is not inherently
Real world synthesizers always come with presets, and those presets
are usually the most awful sounds you'll ever hear coming out of a
keyboard. They're overdone and geared toward a mainstream audience
of bells and whistles. Good artists don't use these presets but
harness their gear back
doesnt fit.
if it wasnt for his analog sources he wouldnt get anywhere.
- Original Message -
From: Neil Wiernik [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: 313@hyperreal.org
Sent: Sunday, September 03, 2006 5:19 PM
Subject: Re: (313) The Laptop Debate.
and why does he not fit??? becasue you say so?
his
yeah maybe after you're done signing autographs you could grill him about
his technique ;p
- Original Message -
From: Neil Wiernik [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: 313@hyperreal.org
Sent: Sunday, September 03, 2006 11:24 AM
Subject: Re: (313) The Laptop Debate.
I know loop finding
: Neil Wiernik [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: 313@hyperreal.org
Sent: Sunday, September 03, 2006 11:24 AM
Subject: Re: (313) The Laptop Debate.
I know loop finding was samples from old jazz records but his other
material is all live instrumentation sampled and manipulated...
from what hes told me maybe hes
Honestly, what matters besides the actual compositions? I'm enough of
a studio rat to care about things are produced, but the actual method
that someone uses is irrelevant, except as it facilitates the result.
It's not like you can't make sh*t tracks with analog gear.
I program computers for a
At 01:31 PM 9/3/2006, you wrote:
On 9/3/06, Dale Lawrence [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
...but its really just irrelevant nonsense.
when did we start talking about your music?
tmo
I speak from my own experience.
Should I pretend I don't make music? Would that make my opinions
more valid?
On 9/3/06, Dale Lawrence [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Do I intimidate you?
not a chance.
Neil is having dinner with Jan Jelinek... and he can ask a question
pertinent to a discussion about him personally. Should he pretend
he'll never meet the guy and that he himself works at McDonalds?...
kent williams wrote:
Honestly, what matters besides the actual compositions? I'm enough of
a studio rat to care about things are produced, but the actual method
that someone uses is irrelevant, except as it facilitates the result.
It's not like you can't make sh*t tracks with analog gear.
I'm confused now. Can someone summarise or conclude this thread for me.
Is analogue better than digital or vice versa???
-Original Message-
From: Brian Prince [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Monday, 4 September 2006 6:35 a.m.
To: kent williams
Cc: list 313
Subject: Re: (313) The Laptop
Ralf Gill \(healthAlliance\) wrote:
I'm confused now. Can someone summarise or conclude this thread for me.
Is analogue better than digital or vice versa???
Good music is better than bad music.
- bp
thanks dale you took the words right out of my mouth!!!
:)
On Sun, 3 Sep 2006, Dale Lawrence wrote:
At 01:31 PM 9/3/2006, you wrote:
On 9/3/06, Dale Lawrence [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
...but its really just irrelevant nonsense.
when did we start talking about your music?
tmo
I speak
sweet fng jesus ;/
In a computer it is the same thing, there are a lot of elements that
are geared to that same mainstream audience, as well as all of those
garbage loop and prefab rhythm programs/plug-ins, and you have to get
past that just like with real world synths and make your own
-
From: Neil Wiernik [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: 313@hyperreal.org
Sent: Sunday, September 03, 2006 5:18 PM
Subject: Re: (313) The Laptop Debate.
fair enough
go here
http://www.myspace.com/nawmusic
the tracks from the green nights orange days record are prime examples of
my music mastered BY twerk
PROTECTED]
To: 313@hyperreal.org
Sent: Sunday, September 03, 2006 5:18 PM
Subject: Re: (313) The Laptop Debate.
fair enough
go here
http://www.myspace.com/nawmusic
the tracks from the green nights orange days record are prime examples of
my music mastered BY twerk sounding warm so first listen
?
i'll pretend i havent heard anyone saying boiling hot today ..
/12
- Original Message -
From: Neil Wiernik [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: 313@hyperreal.org
Sent: Sunday, September 03, 2006 5:18 PM
Subject: Re: (313) The Laptop Debate.
fair enough
go here
http://www.myspace.com
Not to stir the pot, but I've been practicing making tracks with a
computer for 12 years. In that time I've come up with 3 tracks I felt
confident about putting on vinyl, and I've had 3 or 4 tracks on
Internet comps. Terrence Parker took one of my tracks for his
'Maximum Ice' CD, for which I
but maybe we
haven't seen the Ron Hardy or Derrick May of the laptop yet. But it's
silly to argue that computers, in and of themselves, are the problem.
no, true.
it's the lifeless,stiff, ear-scratching bright sound that is the problem..
it's like a plastic doll,with or without make-up it's
Record your mixdowns to a reel to reel. Or better yet, cut it to a 78
lacquer. Fetishing old gear is ultimately as irrelevant as fetishing
new gear.
It sounds like you've been listening to the wrong records. You don't
have to convince me that analog recordings sound nice, but anyone who
makes
Is it an analogue or a digital laptop?
-Original Message-
From: kent williams [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Saturday, 2 September 2006 1:30 p.m.
To: list 313
Subject: (313) The Laptop Debate.
Not to stir the pot, but I've been practicing making tracks with a
computer for 12 years
snip
And they were doing it before there was anyone telling them how to do
it. They had to master an unwieldy, complicated instrument, and make
it sing. And there was always that moments of excitement in the track
that would be irretrievable if the DA30 ate the DAT.
You can still get the
I agree with martin this whole laptop or computer music is not as warm
sounding as analogue gear is a compleatly irrellivent argument.
I have ehard tracks made using all sorts of tools and its not the tools
that make some thing warm or cool soundings its the maker ... the person
behind the
show me a 100% pc-made trak that would sound even close to rod modell's
deepchord 14
or rhythm n sound's carrier.
speaking of rod - any of his traks on ecchocord.
or afx's blue calx or laricheard
or mike parker's caesura 1
or andres' LP on mahogani/ kdj 29
either you're all joking..or you
and i dont say digital is bad - not at all - i.e. look at
convextion..much of his stuff sounds really good.
i dont know about his whole audio signal circuitry but i remember he was
using a digital jd800 as sound source for many of his track..
it aint deepchord,but still much more ear pleasing
This laptop debate is very boring - it's too cold and emotionless - it
doesn't have enough warmth and crackle :P
-Original Message-
From: v12 [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: 02 September 2006 17:30
To: 313@hyperreal.org
Subject: Re: (313) The Laptop Debate/other digital devices.
and i
it's the lifeless,stiff, ear-scratching bright sound that is the problem..
It's possible to make a digital track sound convincingly analog in any
decent software package. Soft saturation on the EQ, tape compression, add
a little hiss ... nobody will know the difference. Record an analog track
to
v12 wrote:
the stuff i got on warp cassettes [tri repetae/chiastic slide]
appeared
to sound miserable on cd
and so on blablabla
That's because you're listenting to two different mastering pipelines, dude.
Record the tapes to CD and they'll sound identical.
Otherwise, I've got a $6000 power
I'd cite some of Lusine's work, and Jan Jellinek, and Fennesz Endless
Summer, but you might not like them, or hear the musicality and
warmth I do in them.
I love the way cassettes sound too -- but then I end up digitizing that sound.
Sad fact is everything goes through a computer at some point.
17:30
To: 313@hyperreal.org
Subject: Re: (313) The Laptop Debate/other digital devices.
and i dont say digital is bad - not at all - i.e. look at
convextion..much of his stuff sounds really good.
i dont know about his whole audio signal circuitry but i remember he was
using a digital jd800
Don't try too hard to fight the tool you are using. Keyboards came
out and people did try to use them to make 'real' sounds, and as the
technology progressed they were able to achieve that to some degree--
that's when old-school analog came back into fashion People
started to celebrate
You should print the thread and read it on paper, that will add some
warmth to it :) or even transcribe it down to paper and than read it :))
^guess what - if a post is longer than say 15-20 lines i do print it.
unless it's some pointless nonsense by someone i know he couldnt come up
with
Not to stir the pot,
stir please, what else are email discussion lists for?
That being a lot of my favorite Detroit and Chicago tracks were made
in a certain way that I think made them more exciting. Specifically,
it's setting up a bunch of gear and recording it live to two track,
with one
It's possible to make a digital track sound convincingly analog in any
decent software package. Soft saturation on the EQ, tape compression, add
a little hiss ... nobody will know the difference.
nobody?
it's all futile attempt - analog devices lacked stability,that meant
milions
un-copyable
Not to stir the pot,
stir please, what else are email discussion lists for?
That being a lot of my favorite Detroit and Chicago tracks were made
in a certain way that I think made them more exciting. Specifically,
it's setting up a bunch of gear and recording it live to two track,
with one
^guess what - if a post is longer than say 15-20 lines i do print it.
unless it's some pointless nonsense by someone i know he couldnt come up
with anything relevant)
I hate that. Just delete that sewage.
Not to stir the pot,
stir please, what else are email discussion lists for?
That being a lot of my favorite Detroit and Chicago tracks were made
in a certain way that I think made them more exciting. Specifically,
it's setting up a bunch of gear and recording it live to two track,
with one
On 9/2/06, Dale Lawrence [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
^guess what - if a post is longer than say 15-20 lines i do print it.
unless it's some pointless nonsense by someone i know he couldnt come up
with anything relevant)
I hate that. Just delete that sewage.
i think he might have been referring
At 05:25 PM 9/2/2006, you wrote:
On 9/2/06, Dale Lawrence [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
^guess what - if a post is longer than say 15-20 lines i do print it.
unless it's some pointless nonsense by someone i know he couldnt come up
with anything relevant)
I hate that. Just delete that sewage.
i
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