On 2 Feb 2012, at 15:36, cliveb wrote:
cunobelinus;688073 Wrote:
You can transfer a 45 minute LP in 15 minutes? That's a neat trick.
Surely TheLastMan means that it takes an extra 15 mins on top of the
time to do the actual recording.
Clearly, in which case by setting his figure of 15
On 2 Feb 2012, at 18:33, TheLastMan wrote:
cunobelinus;688073 Wrote:
Automatic track division tends to be very dodgy indeed with classical -
the bulk of my music. I'll try VinylStudio again and see if it works
now, but it certainly didn't last time.
You are right, track breaks tend to be
cunobelinus;688319 Wrote:
On 2 Feb 2012, at 15:36, cliveb wrote:
Assuming you're using a decent modern soundcard its noise floor will
be
so far below that of the vinyl that you have heaps of headroom
available. Therefore you can afford to be very conservative when
setting levels and
On 3 Feb 2012, at 12:22, cliveb wrote:
Well, just because the music is well-recorded classical does not alter
the fact that vinyl LPs have a maximum dynamic range around the 60dB
mark - perhaps 70dB for a pristine audiophile pressing with a
following wind.
Modern soundcards routinely
cliveb;688331 Wrote:
Well, just because the music is well-recorded classical does not alter
the fact that vinyl LPs have a maximum dynamic range around the 60dB
mark - perhaps 70dB for a pristine audiophile pressing with a
following wind.
Modern soundcards routinely achieve noise floors
TheLastMan;688345 Wrote:
One of the facilities of VinylStudio is that it counts clips in your
recording as you go along.
Of course once the signal is digitised, there is no way to know for
sure if it has been clipped - all you can do is apply some kind of rule
such as 4 or more consecutive
cliveb;688379 Wrote:
Of course once the signal is digitised, there is no way to know for sure
if it has been clippedTrue. However I am usually aware of when the clipping
takes place and a
pretty good idea where in the track it is.
I have never let a recording go grossly into clipping. If
cunobelinus;687552 Wrote:
The process is a chore - times about 20 compared with ripping CDs, not
least because of the manual entry, without the aid of any online
database, of all the tags, and because it's not a process you can leave
to itself, like CD rips.You can make it shorter if you
TheLastMan;688020 Wrote:
I find a few minor crackles between tracks strangely comforting in a
nostalgic kind of way.
As long as there are no loud pops I rarely notice surface noise when
playing the music through speakers (at least with pop, rock and jazz).
If there is enough to be
On 2 Feb 2012, at 10:52, TheLastMan wrote:
You can make it shorter if you are prepared to use simpler software that
finds track breaks and tag information automatically.
Audacity and Amadeus Pro are about as simple as it gets! I suspect that you
mean more complex software that makes the
Vinyl noise annoys the crap out of me. I manually clean everything that
I care about. I have a few bootleg LPs that are only worth an automatic
declicking.
What annoys me more is when you hear clicks and noises on modern
accurately ripped CDs, where is the quality control? It's not often
but
cliveb;687573 Wrote:
Vinyl surface noise (apart from big clicks) didn't bother me either back
then, but once I started using CD it did begin to annoy me.I find a few minor
crackles between tracks strangely comforting in a
nostalgic kind of way.
As long as there are no loud pops I rarely
cunobelinus;688073 Wrote:
Automatic track division tends to be very dodgy indeed with classical -
the bulk of my music. I'll try VinylStudio again and see if it works
now, but it certainly didn't last time.
You are right, track breaks tend to be a lot less obvious in classical
music. As I
TheLastMan;688120 Wrote:
If this does not make you drool you are not a true audiophile ;)
http://www.sme.ltd.uk/content/Model-203a-Review-hifi-news-1587.shtml
nah..
I like my SOTA Sapphire much better.
[image:
Interesting opinions on cleaning. I've always used a discwasher and D3
after the zerostat gun. A quick google just now shows they still sell
these guns though they are considerably more expensive than my
antique.
By always I mean even before CD's. The zerostat de-statics TV's and
monitors as
cunobelinus;688073 Wrote:
You can transfer a 45 minute LP in 15 minutes? That's a neat trick.
Surely TheLastMan means that it takes an extra 15 mins on top of the
time to do the actual recording.
cunobelinus;688073 Wrote:
It tends to take me 45 minutes, plus the time it takes to clean, set
On 2 Feb 2012, at 14:49, pski wrote:
the zerostat gun.
By always I mean even before CD's. The zerostat de-statics TV's and
monitors as well.
Probably my father's coolest gadget (circa 1968?) applied liberally before
placement on the Garrard 301. I'm looking at the very one right now.
TheOctavist;688136 Wrote:
nah..
I like my SOTA Sapphire much better.
Yeah, somehow network music players (or even CD players) don't look so
purposeful do they?
--
TheLastMan
Matt
http://www.last.fm/user/MJL-UK
*SqueezeBoxes:* SB Duet (Controller + two receivers)
*Server:* Synology DS107+
I use ClickRepair for removing ticks and pops that a cleaning can't
remove. It works extremely well (well, better at ticks than pops). I
use it on a low setting (10).
For track splitting, I do it by hand in audacity. If it's not obvious
where the breaks go, then hopefully the record jacket
TheLastMan;688200 Wrote:
Yeah, somehow network music players (or even CD players) don't look so
purposeful do they?
not at all! its another reason i like having my tt here...just not for
listening most of the time!
--
TheOctavist
VortexboxSBT(stock(TT failed dbt)Forssell MDAC-2Klein and
I'm seeing REAPER mentioned in a lot of places recently - here and in
pro audio forums. It's appealing not only for it's feature set but
it's cost. For a personal license, it $60. The software is the same
whether you purchase a professional or personal license.
I may check it out just for
On 1 Feb 2012, at 13:48, maggior wrote:
Cubase 5 is the most counter intuitive software I've
ever used. Unless I can find something it will do that I can't do in
Audition, I don't think I'll be using it.
My feeling precisely. A copy (of the Lite version, I think) came with my
use REAPER.
Thank me later. it is a heavyweight professional audio tool. audacity,
cool.edit, vinyl whatever are all mickey mouse in comparison.
i am well versed in reaper, pro.tools, samplitude and sequoia(my daw of
choice)and am happy to help anyone.
sound card wise..the esi juli@ is a
Hi-
The Bellari vp530 is a good unit. I don't remember their models
exactly, but they make phono preamps with USB and tube output. At least
one with both.
As far as the RIAA curve: if you are going digital, there is a lot of
software around that will apply the RIAA curve for you to your file,
TheOctavist;686590 Wrote:
vinyl at its best is about 12 bit resolution.
16 bit is plenty. everytime i see someone touting a 24.bit
vinyl.ripi laugh...because it is an epic waste.
sure, space is cheap..but why waste it? water is cheap too but i dont
fill up.a cooling tower to haveva
maggior;686501 Wrote:
I've used the ART USBPhonoPlus v2. I think it's a great little device.
It supports both line level and phono level signals, with built in RIAA
eq. You can plug headphones directly into it, and it has a line out.
Thanks very much for your detailed post.
On the ART
I use the ART USB V.2 with a Sony belt drive and an Audio Technica
cart.
I don't diddle with output from a equalization basis so I use a simple
program called spin-it-again.
It presents a cassette recorder analogy: start play-hit record-play
side-pause-flip and repeat.
At that point the
guidof;686694 Wrote:
Thanks very much for your detailed post.
On the ART Website there is no information about bitrate output.
One of the reviews on Amazon states: A/D D/A: 16 bit, 44.1kHz or
48kHz, USB selectable.
Although I tend to agree that 16 bits is overkill for listening to
Just a few comments on the conversion process. Over the past 10 years
I've converted about 2,000 LPs and open reels to digital, so have my
process down fairly pat.
I see no big need to comment on the vinyl playback end of things - if
you've been happy with your rig for playing records, it'll be
guidof;686694 Wrote:
Thanks very much for your detailed post.
You're welcome!
guidof;686694 Wrote:
Do you know if 16 bits is max. with the ART unit?
As pski pointed out, yes, it does 16 bit only. If you want to do 24
bit and/or higher sampling rates, you are likely moving into the
As it happens, I've been researching USB audio interface devices to a
little home studio recording. There are some devices in this category
support 24 bit with 96 kHz sampling. The only problem with devices
like this are:
1) The inputs are typically designed for a studio environment, using
Well personally I do feel the A/D converters are important. I started
with the internal sound card on my motherboard, went to a Presonus
Firestudio Mobile and then settled on a RME Fireface UC.
Each was a notable improvement in sound quality.
If you can afford it I'd recommend the RME
I'm considering ripping at least some of my LPs to my Vortexbox
Appliance for use with my SBTs. Here is Phil Leigh's reply to an
earlier post.
Phil Leigh;686417 Wrote:
Well, it was a while ago. I used my Linn LP12/Ittok/Troika into a Linn
phono stage then an Apogee ADC into a Digital Audio
I go about it the hard way.
VPI 16.5 Record Cleaner
Rega P3-24/Power supply, with other upgrades. Sumiko Blue MC
cartridge.
Jolida Tube Phono Preamp
RME Fireface UC audio interface
Presonus Studio One software
Click Repair Software (Manual mode click repair, no auto, it messes
with too many
I have the NAD PP2 (fully analog), i -almost- wish I'd bought the PP3
instead, but as I later bought a Steinberg CI-1 sound card it's no
longer a problem. The PP2 is good, and the PP3i ought to be easy to use
as well, so I can -almost- recommend it without even having used one.
Software-wise I
Soulkeeper;686487 Wrote:
I have the NAD PP2 (fully analog), i -almost- wish I'd bought the PP3
instead, but as I later bought a Steinberg CI-1 sound card it's no
longer a problem. The PP2 is good, and the PP3i ought to be easy to use
as well, so I can -almost- recommend it without even
guidof;686481 Wrote:
...
Also, VinylStudio has been suggested as one of the best software
solutions for this purpose. Your experience with this or others?
I've been using Wave Corrector. ( http://www.wavecor.co.uk/ )
It doesn't download track information, but it can save processed files
guidof;686481 Wrote:
I'm considering ripping at least some of my LPs to my Vortexbox
Appliance for use with my SBTs. Here is Phil Leigh's reply to an
earlier post.
I would probably prefer using some sort of USB phono preamp with
internal ADC rather than a system similar to the one
I've used the ART USBPhonoPlus v2. I think it's a great little device.
It supports both line level and phono level signals, with built in RIAA
eq. You can plug headphones directly into it, and it has a line out.
The one odd thing (if I remember correctly) was that you couldn't play
back on
krochat;686496 Wrote:
I've been using Wave Corrector. ( http://www.wavecor.co.uk/ )
It doesn't download track information, but it can save processed files
as tagged FLAC files.
I don't see in the VinylStudio help file that it will save as tagged
FLAC. Will it?
(I'm using my
the pros use
www.cockos.com/reaper
does all and more
full feature professional daw
--
TheOctavist
VortexboxSBT(TT 3.0)Forssell MDAC-2Klein and Hummell 0300D
Sota Sapphire/Lyra KleosBespoke Valve Phono StageMastersound Due
VentiLink Audio K100
www.stereophile.com/content/my-first-needle-drop-lessons-learnt-1
also...saving vinyl rips at 24 bits is utterly absurd and offers no
benefit.over redbook
--
TheOctavist
VortexboxSBT(TT 3.0)Forssell MDAC-2Klein and Hummell 0300D
Sota Sapphire/Lyra KleosBespoke Valve Phono StageMastersound
I haven't tried to be scientific about it, but my 24-bit rips do seem to
sound notably better than 16-bit. I'm using Audacity for recording, so
maybe it's an issue with the way it does the conversion. I've beein
doing rips at 24/96 lately. Disk space is cheap, and I don't do that
many rips
To all prior posters:
Thank you very much for your informative replies.
Lots of input to mull over . . .
Any further thoughts will also be welcome.
Best regards,
Guido F.
--
guidof
MUSIC ROOM:
Marantz TT 15S1 Turntable, Virtuoso Wood Cartridge-Conrad Johnson
Motif preamp
Oppo BDP-83
guidof;686564 Wrote:
To all prior posters:
Thank you very much for your informative replies.
Lots of input to mull over . . .
Any further thoughts will also be welcome.
Best regards,
Guido F.
I would like to second that as well. Great idea starting this thread.
It seems I may
Daverz;686562 Wrote:
I haven't tried to be scientific about it, but my 24-bit rips do seem to
sound notably better than 16-bit. I'm using Audacity for recording, so
maybe it's an issue with the way it does the conversion. I've beein
doing rips at 24/96 lately. Disk space is cheap, and I
Mnyb;686581 Wrote:
The idea is to always record at for example 24/96/88.2 do all post
processing you feel it need
Second that.
I listen to vinyl not very often but only for the reason of not
excessive usage of stylus and record itself ;-)
Got recently some valuable records which needed to
for heavy editing, etc 32.bit float or 24 bit is good..only if doing
a lot of processing.
but leaving at.24 bits to listen is a huge waste...there are no sonic
gains16 bits capture the full bandwidth of lp
perfectly.abolutely NOTHING gained from leaving in high res...
so
vinyl at its best is about 12 bit resolution.
16 bit is plenty. everytime i see someone touting a 24.bit
vinyl.ripi laugh...because it is an epic waste.
sure, space is cheap..but why waste it? water is cheap too but i dont
fill up.a cooling tower to haveva drink. :-)
--
TheOctavist
also..the noise involved from the preamp, medium, etc renders the extra
bit depth for any processing in the editor meaningless and futile...
processing a lot of tracks heavily in a daw...yes.
for this? absolutely not. not required or useful.
--
TheOctavist
VortexboxSBT(TT 3.0)Forssell
Eric Seaberg;273529 Wrote:
The way they're configured, one is around $700k and the other @ $500k.
We're expecting an 'end-of-quarter' discount from SSL if we can commit
before the end of March. I spent all day in LA at SSL as well as some
visiting time with Ed Cherney in his room at The
eiret;274550 Wrote:
Is it right to say: When a analog wave, from for example a microphone is
discovered by the ADC(analog to digital converter) the wave is first
sampled/discovered as a 1bit audio. Then up sampled to for example
24bit??
No. :)
Long answer: DSD is a totally different way of
bigfool1956;273081 Wrote:
I've been thinking about digitising my singles. I haven't quite decided
to what hardware to use as yet, but never mind.
I think when I get to that point I will digitise a few selected album
tracks and do some spectral analysis. Might be quite interesting.
Eric Seaberg;273203 Wrote:
I don't understand why everyone is recommending digitizing vinyl at
96k!! 24-bit, yes, but don't waste the disk space doing 96k! There's
nothing on the vinyl worthy of that!
If you'll pardon the paraphrasing: I don't understand why people are
recommending digitizing
True, I was just thinking of any vinyl I've recorded, knowing I'd use
some sort of de-click/de-scratch/de-crackle plug-in to help out a bit.
As cliveb has suggested, if you're not doing any manipulation to the
original file, 44.1/16 is fine.
-
So cliveb, what do you do? Anywhere
Moving quickly OT:
Eric Seaberg wrote:
We're purchasing two SSL C-200s for our facility and I'll probably fly to the
factory for training.
Wow, those are nice consoles. In round numbers, are the half million a
piece?
--
Pat Farrell PRC recording studio
http://www.pfarrell.com/PRC
The way they're configured, one is around $700k and the other @ $500k.
We're expecting an 'end-of-quarter' discount from SSL if we can commit
before the end of March. I spent all day in LA at SSL as well as some
visiting time with Ed Cherney in his room at The Village. A great
trip,
Doesn't one of the differences in sound between LP and CD have to do
with the filtering of high frequences by CD? Musical information - in
the form of harmonics - extends way beyond the 20KHz barrier of a CD,
and even if you can't identify the sound at high frequencies they must
(surely?)
morris_minor;272991 Wrote:
Doesn't one of the differences in sound between LP and CD have to do
with the filtering of high frequences by CD? Musical information - in
the form of harmonics - extends way beyond the 20KHz barrier of a CD,
and even if you can't identify the sound at high
morris_minor wrote:
Doesn't one of the differences in sound between LP and CD have to do
with the filtering of high frequences by CD? Musical information - in
the form of harmonics - extends way beyond the 20KHz barrier of a CD,
and even if you can't identify the sound at high frequencies they
An LP has the potential to contain ultrasonic frequencies. Remember
quadrophonics?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quadrophonic
--
bigfool1956
David Ayers
Music is what counts, hifi just helps us enjoy it more
bigfool1956;273068 Wrote:
An LP has the potential to contain ultrasonic frequencies. Remember
quadrophonics?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quadrophonic
Yeah - I remember CD-4...
The point is that (apart from CD-4 and a smattering of direct cut
disks) nobody has put much over 18-20Khz onto
I've been thinking about digitising my singles. I haven't quite decided
to what hardware to use as yet, but never mind.
I think when I get to that point I will digitise a few selected album
tracks and do some spectral analysis. Might be quite interesting.
Obviously to do that I would need to
bigfool1956;273081 Wrote:
I've been thinking about digitising my singles. I haven't quite decided
to what hardware to use as yet, but never mind.
I have a ton of old 12 singles from the 80's, well perhaps not a ton,
but more like 100 or so. Luckily I still have my old Pink Triangle
turntable
I've been looking at the ikey plus, which digitises direct to a USB
device, so it doesn't involve trucking my PC over to my hifi.
Anyone had any experience of this device?
http://www.ikey-audio.com/ikeyplus.htm
--
bigfool1956
David Ayers
Music is what counts, hifi just helps us enjoy it
The difference with much of the vinyl gear is that it has a gentle roll
off and not a brick-wall filter as most CD players or DAC's have.
The brick-wall filter may create severe phase aberrations way down into
the midrange... perhaps aslow as 1KHz, Which I believe may be quite
significant. If
I don't understand why everyone is recommending digitizing vinyl at
96k!! 24-bit, yes, but don't waste the disk space doing 96k! There's
nothing on the vinyl worthy of that! Most cutting lathes couldn't
handle to heat created on the cutter head putting on that much HF
information, unless you
As hinted earlier in this thread ripping LPs is a tedious task. Apart
from the analog equipment which should be prestine it is worth
mentioning that most of the real time goes in cleaning up and
processing the resulting audio files. A couple of year back I did a
little research of the (free)
This is a professional solution
I can't see that it's mentioned in the thread, I believe the Alesis
masterlink may easily digitize Vinyl at pretty high quality at 96/24
http://www.alesis.com/masterlink
May work better than a PC based recording solution.
Should go well with the
Phew - what a thread !
Not sure if I followed it all and I'm still a little fuzzy about the
differences between normalisation, amplification, replay gain (et
al).
Anyway, I've ripped a couple of hundred vinyl LPs now with very varying
results. Kit used is Linn LP12/ Helius Arm / Goldring MC into
liffy99;224762 Wrote:
Make sure the record is clean ! Many of mine had been in storage for
years and came out riddled with static and then attracted dust, so lots
of clicks and pops. I tried a professional record cleaning service for a
couple of LPs with good results, but at £2 a go it is
I still have quite a large collection of black vinyl discs that have
lots of gems on them but I play them less and less these days. I am
looking for way to rip copy them onto my hard drive in the best quality
way possible.
What recommendations can anyone give. I would even consider using a
RalphO wrote:
I still have quite a large collection of black vinyl discs that have
lots of gems on them but I play them less and less these days. I am
looking for way to rip copy them onto my hard drive in the best quality
way possible.
What recommendations can anyone give. I would even
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