Re: [CGUYS] iPhone 4, Engineering thoughts

2010-06-30 Thread mike
http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/droid-x-ad-pokes-fun-at-iphone-4-antenna-troubles/ Now Moto is going after Apple... *It comes with a double antenna design. The kind that allows you to hold the phone any way you like and use it just about anywhere to make crystal clear calls.* On Tue, Jun 29,

Re: [CGUYS] iPhone 4, Engineering thoughts

2010-06-30 Thread phartz...@gmail.com
On Wed, Jun 30, 2010 at 6:54 PM, mike xha...@gmail.com wrote: *It comes with a double antenna design. The kind that allows you to hold the phone any way you like and use it just about anywhere to make crystal clear calls.* Crystal clear calls? I have not as yet heard a crystal clear call

Re: [CGUYS] iPhone 4, Engineering thoughts

2010-06-29 Thread TJPA
Because it doesn't matter in normal use. It appears that it may matter in some extreme cases. You are insisting that they must design their product for the extreme case and make the rest of us suffer the consequences. You have not explained why they must do such a silly thing. You just insist

Re: [CGUYS] iPhone 4, Engineering thoughts

2010-06-29 Thread phartz...@gmail.com
On Tue, Jun 29, 2010 at 2:17 AM, TJPA t...@tjpa.com wrote: Because it doesn't matter in normal use. It appears that it may matter in some extreme cases. You are insisting that they must design their product for the extreme case and make the rest of us suffer the consequences. You have not

Re: [CGUYS] iPhone 4, Engineering thoughts

2010-06-29 Thread tjpa
On Jun 29, 2010, at 8:10 AM, phartz...@gmail.com wrote: By extreme cases are you perhaps referring to emergency situations where life or death or serious injury or even just a great inconvenience may be the outcome? Yep, your mommy can't be with you all the time. On Jun 29, 2010, at 8:10 AM,

Re: [CGUYS] iPhone 4, Engineering thoughts

2010-06-29 Thread Rev. Stewart Marshall
With ATT those extreme cases seem to matter much more than with another carrier. Stewart At 01:17 AM 6/29/2010, you wrote: Because it doesn't matter in normal use. It appears that it may matter in some extreme cases. You are insisting that they must design their product for the extreme case

Re: [CGUYS] iPhone 4, Engineering thoughts

2010-06-29 Thread phartz...@gmail.com
On Tue, Jun 29, 2010 at 9:11 AM, tjpa t...@tjpa.com wrote: Well you have a silly notion. It is amazing how you fixate on a tiny 1/8-inch of its surface that causes a problem when the phone is operated at the edge of its range. Your supposition is so extreme that it strongly suggests you have

Re: [CGUYS] iPhone 4, Engineering thoughts

2010-06-29 Thread tjpa
I suggest duct tape. Duct tape cures all ills. On Jun 29, 2010, at 9:45 AM, phartz...@gmail.com wrote: Apple could have easily eliminated that 1/8 inch of problematic area by applying an insulating material over it. * **

Re: [CGUYS] iPhone 4, Engineering thoughts

2010-06-29 Thread mike
Saw the first of waht will probably be many iphone 4 case ads with the tagline 'get better reception, buy an iphone 4 case!' On Tue, Jun 29, 2010 at 7:40 AM, tjpa t...@tjpa.com wrote: I suggest duct tape. Duct tape cures all ills. On Jun 29, 2010, at 9:45 AM, phartz...@gmail.com wrote:

Re: [CGUYS] iPhone 4, Engineering thoughts

2010-06-29 Thread phartz...@gmail.com
On Tue, Jun 29, 2010 at 5:18 PM, mike xha...@gmail.com wrote: Saw the first of waht will probably be many iphone 4 case ads with the tagline 'get better reception, buy an iphone 4 case!' This new iPhone will most likely be the first and last phone made by Apple that uses an antenna of which

Re: [CGUYS] iPhone 4, Engineering thoughts

2010-06-28 Thread tjpa
Good analysis and later confirmed by one of the commentators. It is also interesting to note how many of the other commentators just won't let go of the original story. On Jun 28, 2010, at 1:26 PM, John DeCarlo wrote: From Steve Gibson (and his recommendation of a reply to read): The

Re: [CGUYS] iPhone 4, Engineering thoughts

2010-06-28 Thread phartz...@gmail.com
On Mon, Jun 28, 2010 at 4:07 PM, tjpa t...@tjpa.com wrote: Good analysis and later confirmed by one of the commentators. It is also interesting to note how many of the other commentators just won't let go of the original story. So, what is the original story? I only saw stories about how

Re: [CGUYS] iPhone 4, Engineering thoughts

2010-06-28 Thread mike
Also troublesome was that Apple admitted the problem... Spin that, Tom. On Mon, Jun 28, 2010 at 1:07 PM, tjpa t...@tjpa.com wrote: Good analysis and later confirmed by one of the commentators. It is also interesting to note how many of the other commentators just won't let go of the

Re: [CGUYS] iPhone 4, Engineering thoughts

2010-06-28 Thread phartz...@gmail.com
On Mon, Jun 28, 2010 at 4:26 PM, mike xha...@gmail.com wrote: Also troublesome was that Apple admitted the problem... Did Apple admit to a problem? What was the problem that Apple Corp. admitted to? I only know of Mr, Jobs mentioning the problem of purchasers of the device not knowing how

Re: [CGUYS] iPhone 4, Engineering thoughts

2010-06-28 Thread mike
Gripping any mobile phone will result in some attenuation of its antenna performance, with certain places being worse than others depending on the placement of the antennas. This is a fact of life for every wireless phone. If you ever experience this on your iPhone 4, avoid gripping it in the

Re: [CGUYS] iPhone 4, Engineering thoughts

2010-06-28 Thread phartz...@gmail.com
On Mon, Jun 28, 2010 at 5:04 PM, mike xha...@gmail.com wrote: Gripping any mobile phone will result in some attenuation of its antenna performance, with certain places being worse than others depending on the placement of the antennas. This is a fact of life for every wireless phone. If you

Re: [CGUYS] iPhone 4, Engineering thoughts

2010-06-28 Thread tjpa
Read Gibson's analysis and you will understand that this is really a very marginal problem. If one has good signal strength it won't matter how you hold the phone. If your signal strength is about to go over a cliff, anything you do can potentially push you over. One of those things is

Re: [CGUYS] iPhone 4, Engineering thoughts

2010-06-28 Thread mike
I say tongue and cheek. Half of what Jobs says is spin or disingenuous. At his heart, he's just a car salesman...good cars though. On Mon, Jun 28, 2010 at 3:06 PM, phartz...@gmail.com phartz...@gmail.comwrote: You say spin, I'll offer disingenuous. Steve

Re: [CGUYS] iPhone 4, Engineering thoughts

2010-06-28 Thread mike
You are right, and for whatever reason Apple ignored the physics. I say it was for form over function, you can deny all you want, but Apple has admitted the problem. On Mon, Jun 28, 2010 at 3:24 PM, tjpa t...@tjpa.com wrote: It is not magic, it is physics. On Jun 28, 2010, at 6:06 PM,

Re: [CGUYS] iPhone 4, Engineering thoughts

2010-06-28 Thread phartz...@gmail.com
On Mon, Jun 28, 2010 at 6:24 PM, tjpa t...@tjpa.com wrote: It is not magic, it is physics. Well, then let us sum this thing up. In your view, is there anything whatsoever that is problematic, in terms of the end user of these phones, about how Apple decided to use an antenna system that is

Re: [CGUYS] iPhone 4, Engineering thoughts

2010-06-28 Thread tjpa
On Jun 28, 2010, at 8:13 PM, phartz...@gmail.com wrote: Well, then let us sum this thing up. In your view, is there anything whatsoever that is problematic, in terms of the end user of these phones, about how Apple decided to use an antenna system that is highly exposed to direct contact with

Re: [CGUYS] iPhone 4, Engineering thoughts

2010-06-28 Thread phartz...@gmail.com
On Mon, Jun 28, 2010 at 8:36 PM, tjpa t...@tjpa.com wrote: On Jun 28, 2010, at 8:13 PM, phartz...@gmail.com wrote: Well, then let us sum this thing up.  In your view, is there anything whatsoever that is problematic, in terms of the end user of these phones, about how Apple decided to use an

Re: [CGUYS] iPhone 4, Engineering thoughts

2010-06-28 Thread t.piwowar
On Jun 28, 2010, at 8:45 PM, phartz...@gmail.com wrote: A complete non-answer of the question as posed. You just won't accept any answer except the one you are promoting. You don't want reality to get in the way. Experiences

Re: [CGUYS] iPhone 4, Engineering thoughts

2010-06-28 Thread phartz...@gmail.com
On Mon, Jun 28, 2010 at 10:02 PM, t.piwowar t...@tjpa.com wrote: ...why is this just being noticed on the 4th generation iPhone, and seems to have not been noticed by users of any other cell phone? Good question! The issue exists for many, if not most, cellphones to varying degrees. This

Re: [CGUYS] iPhone 4, Engineering thoughts

2010-06-28 Thread phartz...@gmail.com
On Tue, Jun 29, 2010 at 1:09 AM, t.piwowar t...@tjpa.com wrote: You clearly did not read 2/3s of my last post. Here is another quote... I read it, the whole thing. I think that you understand the point about why it is best not to have an antenna of any sort or for any use coming into direct