'+1' vs 'I agree'
This may seem like a peanut issue compared to other things we have to discuss these days, but since so many things are coming up, I thought I toss it in and maybe it will get overlooked... It bugs me that every time I see a +1 in a normal conversation I find myself crawling back up the mail thread to check if I missed a vote call somewhere. I suspect it is common usus in apache land or maybe just an established habit, but I think it's a bad habit and potentially confusing as it's often not clear what the +1 refers to. Isn't it reasonable to expect that people use proper language like a simple 'Yes' or 'I agree' if they just want to express their support for a point or statement, and to reserve numerical expressions for formal vote threads? thanks, -Lukas (*sigh*, glad I got that off my chest...) - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@maven.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@maven.apache.org
Re: '+1' vs 'I agree'
I agree :-) Arnaud On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 12:44 PM, Lukas Theussl ltheu...@apache.org wrote: This may seem like a peanut issue compared to other things we have to discuss these days, but since so many things are coming up, I thought I toss it in and maybe it will get overlooked... It bugs me that every time I see a +1 in a normal conversation I find myself crawling back up the mail thread to check if I missed a vote call somewhere. I suspect it is common usus in apache land or maybe just an established habit, but I think it's a bad habit and potentially confusing as it's often not clear what the +1 refers to. Isn't it reasonable to expect that people use proper language like a simple 'Yes' or 'I agree' if they just want to express their support for a point or statement, and to reserve numerical expressions for formal vote threads? thanks, -Lukas (*sigh*, glad I got that off my chest...) - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@maven.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@maven.apache.org
Re: '+1' vs 'I agree'
Arnaud, what do you agree with? :) Thanks, ~t~ 2011/1/26 Arnaud Héritier arnaud.herit...@exoplatform.com: I agree :-) - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@maven.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@maven.apache.org
Re: '+1' vs 'I agree'
I agree to say I agree when I agree with something instead of using +1 :-) Do you agree ? Arnaud 2011/1/26 Tamás Cservenák ta...@cservenak.net Arnaud, what do you agree with? :) Thanks, ~t~ 2011/1/26 Arnaud Héritier arnaud.herit...@exoplatform.com: I agree :-) - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@maven.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@maven.apache.org
Re: '+1' vs 'I agree'
I Agree :) 2011/1/26 Arnaud Héritier arnaud.herit...@exoplatform.com: I agree to say I agree when I agree with something instead of using +1 :-) Do you agree ? Arnaud - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@maven.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@maven.apache.org
Re: '+1' vs 'I agree'
-1 or: I do not agree ;) seriously, a +1 and -1 just states agreement/disagreement. Imo a vote is a vote is a vote only if the subject says [VOTE] or [DISCUSS] [1]. A +1 in all other threads are just the expression of a ack/nack which makes it easier/quicker to read, because the +1 or -1 just visually jumps out of the text. If people start expressing their gut feeling with long sentences, then this might slow down the process/overview on the mailing lists. LieGrue, strub [1] http://wiki.apache.org/incubator/DocumentationPlan --- On Wed, 1/26/11, Arnaud Héritier arnaud.herit...@exoplatform.com wrote: From: Arnaud Héritier arnaud.herit...@exoplatform.com Subject: Re: '+1' vs 'I agree' To: Maven Developers List dev@maven.apache.org Date: Wednesday, January 26, 2011, 12:03 PM I agree :-) Arnaud On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 12:44 PM, Lukas Theussl ltheu...@apache.org wrote: This may seem like a peanut issue compared to other things we have to discuss these days, but since so many things are coming up, I thought I toss it in and maybe it will get overlooked... It bugs me that every time I see a +1 in a normal conversation I find myself crawling back up the mail thread to check if I missed a vote call somewhere. I suspect it is common usus in apache land or maybe just an established habit, but I think it's a bad habit and potentially confusing as it's often not clear what the +1 refers to. Isn't it reasonable to expect that people use proper language like a simple 'Yes' or 'I agree' if they just want to express their support for a point or statement, and to reserve numerical expressions for formal vote threads? thanks, -Lukas (*sigh*, glad I got that off my chest...) - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@maven.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@maven.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@maven.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@maven.apache.org
Re: '+1' vs 'I agree'
No problem if it's clear in the context. As I said, it's not a big issue and I'm not going to tell anybody how to lead a conversation. That said, I believe it shows good form and education if you use normal language in a normal conversation. :) -Lukas Mark Struberg wrote: -1 or: I do not agree ;) seriously, a +1 and -1 just states agreement/disagreement. Imo a vote is a vote is a vote only if the subject says [VOTE] or [DISCUSS] [1]. A +1 in all other threads are just the expression of a ack/nack which makes it easier/quicker to read, because the +1 or -1 just visually jumps out of the text. If people start expressing their gut feeling with long sentences, then this might slow down the process/overview on the mailing lists. LieGrue, strub [1] http://wiki.apache.org/incubator/DocumentationPlan --- On Wed, 1/26/11, Arnaud Héritierarnaud.herit...@exoplatform.com wrote: From: Arnaud Héritierarnaud.herit...@exoplatform.com Subject: Re: '+1' vs 'I agree' To: Maven Developers Listdev@maven.apache.org Date: Wednesday, January 26, 2011, 12:03 PM I agree :-) Arnaud On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 12:44 PM, Lukas Theusslltheu...@apache.org wrote: This may seem like a peanut issue compared to other things we have to discuss these days, but since so many things are coming up, I thought I toss it in and maybe it will get overlooked... It bugs me that every time I see a +1 in a normal conversation I find myself crawling back up the mail thread to check if I missed a vote call somewhere. I suspect it is common usus in apache land or maybe just an established habit, but I think it's a bad habit and potentially confusing as it's often not clear what the +1 refers to. Isn't it reasonable to expect that people use proper language like a simple 'Yes' or 'I agree' if they just want to express their support for a point or statement, and to reserve numerical expressions for formal vote threads? thanks, -Lukas (*sigh*, glad I got that off my chest...) - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@maven.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@maven.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@maven.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@maven.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@maven.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@maven.apache.org
RE: EXTERNAL: Re: '+1' vs 'I agree'
+1 Sorry, couldn't resist. -Original Message- From: Lukas Theussl [mailto:ltheu...@apache.org] Sent: Wednesday, January 26, 2011 7:37 AM To: Maven Developers List Subject: EXTERNAL: Re: '+1' vs 'I agree' No problem if it's clear in the context. As I said, it's not a big issue and I'm not going to tell anybody how to lead a conversation. That said, I believe it shows good form and education if you use normal language in a normal conversation. :) -Lukas Mark Struberg wrote: -1 or: I do not agree ;) seriously, a +1 and -1 just states agreement/disagreement. Imo a vote is a vote is a vote only if the subject says [VOTE] or [DISCUSS] [1]. A +1 in all other threads are just the expression of a ack/nack which makes it easier/quicker to read, because the +1 or -1 just visually jumps out of the text. If people start expressing their gut feeling with long sentences, then this might slow down the process/overview on the mailing lists. LieGrue, strub [1] http://wiki.apache.org/incubator/DocumentationPlan --- On Wed, 1/26/11, Arnaud Héritierarnaud.herit...@exoplatform.com wrote: From: Arnaud Héritierarnaud.herit...@exoplatform.com Subject: Re: '+1' vs 'I agree' To: Maven Developers Listdev@maven.apache.org Date: Wednesday, January 26, 2011, 12:03 PM I agree :-) Arnaud On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 12:44 PM, Lukas Theusslltheu...@apache.org wrote: This may seem like a peanut issue compared to other things we have to discuss these days, but since so many things are coming up, I thought I toss it in and maybe it will get overlooked... It bugs me that every time I see a +1 in a normal conversation I find myself crawling back up the mail thread to check if I missed a vote call somewhere. I suspect it is common usus in apache land or maybe just an established habit, but I think it's a bad habit and potentially confusing as it's often not clear what the +1 refers to. Isn't it reasonable to expect that people use proper language like a simple 'Yes' or 'I agree' if they just want to express their support for a point or statement, and to reserve numerical expressions for formal vote threads? thanks, -Lukas (*sigh*, glad I got that off my chest...) - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@maven.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@maven.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@maven.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@maven.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@maven.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@maven.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@maven.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@maven.apache.org
Re: '+1' vs 'I agree'
On 1/26/11 7:36 AM, Lukas Theussl wrote: No problem if it's clear in the context. As I said, it's not a big issue and I'm not going to tell anybody how to lead a conversation. That said, I believe it shows good form and education if you use normal language in a normal conversation. :) Apologies if my addition to the veto thread was what touched this off. :-) It was a combination of using a phone for email for the first time (yes, I know, I must be some kind of Luddite), and being in the habit of expressing agreement via +1 which happens all over the place in the open-source world, and not just for votes. Again, apologies if I confused anyone. -Lukas Mark Struberg wrote: -1 or: I do not agree ;) seriously, a +1 and -1 just states agreement/disagreement. Imo a vote is a vote is a vote only if the subject says [VOTE] or [DISCUSS] [1]. A +1 in all other threads are just the expression of a ack/nack which makes it easier/quicker to read, because the +1 or -1 just visually jumps out of the text. If people start expressing their gut feeling with long sentences, then this might slow down the process/overview on the mailing lists. LieGrue, strub [1] http://wiki.apache.org/incubator/DocumentationPlan --- On Wed, 1/26/11, Arnaud Héritierarnaud.herit...@exoplatform.com wrote: From: Arnaud Héritierarnaud.herit...@exoplatform.com Subject: Re: '+1' vs 'I agree' To: Maven Developers Listdev@maven.apache.org Date: Wednesday, January 26, 2011, 12:03 PM I agree :-) Arnaud On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 12:44 PM, Lukas Theusslltheu...@apache.org wrote: This may seem like a peanut issue compared to other things we have to discuss these days, but since so many things are coming up, I thought I toss it in and maybe it will get overlooked... It bugs me that every time I see a +1 in a normal conversation I find myself crawling back up the mail thread to check if I missed a vote call somewhere. I suspect it is common usus in apache land or maybe just an established habit, but I think it's a bad habit and potentially confusing as it's often not clear what the +1 refers to. Isn't it reasonable to expect that people use proper language like a simple 'Yes' or 'I agree' if they just want to express their support for a point or statement, and to reserve numerical expressions for formal vote threads? thanks, -Lukas (*sigh*, glad I got that off my chest...) - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@maven.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@maven.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@maven.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@maven.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@maven.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@maven.apache.org -- John Casey Developer, PMC Member - Apache Maven (http://maven.apache.org) Blog: http://www.johnofalltrades.name/ - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@maven.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@maven.apache.org
Re: '+1' vs 'I agree'
2011/1/26 John Casey jdca...@commonjava.org Apologies if my addition to the veto thread was what touched this off. :-) It was a combination of using a phone for email for the first time (yes, I know, I must be some kind of Luddite), I also sent my first mail from my first web-enabled mobile phone yesterday - shall we create a group page on linkedIn ? :P Nicolas
Re: '+1' vs 'I agree'
You should publish a fax number for people who wish to join the group. From my phone, Kristian Den 26. jan. 2011 kl. 15:59 skrev nicolas de loof nicolas.del...@gmail.com: 2011/1/26 John Casey jdca...@commonjava.org Apologies if my addition to the veto thread was what touched this off. :-) It was a combination of using a phone for email for the first time (yes, I know, I must be some kind of Luddite), I also sent my first mail from my first web-enabled mobile phone yesterday - shall we create a group page on linkedIn ? :P Nicolas - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@maven.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@maven.apache.org
Re: '+1' vs 'I agree'
+ 1 also it's good to set a footer so that people understand that young on a phone can sometimes give incorrect words (though with swype things are usually only one mistake pet surrender) - Stephen --- Sent from my Android phone, so random spelling mistakes, random nonsense words and other nonsense are a direct result of using swype to type on the screen On 26 Jan 2011 14:59, nicolas de loof nicolas.del...@gmail.com wrote: 2011/1/26 John Casey jdca...@commonjava.org Apologies if my addition to the veto thread was what touched this off. :-) It was a combination of using a phone for email for the first time (yes, I know, I must be some kind of Luddite), I also sent my first mail from my first web-enabled mobile phone yesterday - shall we create a group page on linkedIn ? :P Nicolas
Re: '+1' vs 'I agree'
I would even go further and say that if it's not a vote, a +1 or I agree by themselves don't really add to the conversation. In general, no response means either I agree or I don't care enough to respond, so do what you want. If a proposal or discussion item is put forward, it's normally safe to assume that unless someone speaks up, people are ok with it. So at a minimum for non-vote items, I would prefer I agree because..., or I disagree because On 01/26/2011 05:44 AM, Lukas Theussl wrote: This may seem like a peanut issue compared to other things we have to discuss these days, but since so many things are coming up, I thought I toss it in and maybe it will get overlooked... It bugs me that every time I see a +1 in a normal conversation I find myself crawling back up the mail thread to check if I missed a vote call somewhere. I suspect it is common usus in apache land or maybe just an established habit, but I think it's a bad habit and potentially confusing as it's often not clear what the +1 refers to. Isn't it reasonable to expect that people use proper language like a simple 'Yes' or 'I agree' if they just want to express their support for a point or statement, and to reserve numerical expressions for formal vote threads? thanks, -Lukas (*sigh*, glad I got that off my chest...) - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@maven.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@maven.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@maven.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@maven.apache.org
Re: '+1' vs 'I agree'
On 1/26/11 10:09 AM, Kristian Rosenvold wrote: You should publish a fax number for people who wish to join the group. You shouldn't joke...my mother gets tech-support questions about her website via fax. ;-) From my phone, Kristian Den 26. jan. 2011 kl. 15:59 skrev nicolas de loofnicolas.del...@gmail.com: 2011/1/26 John Caseyjdca...@commonjava.org Apologies if my addition to the veto thread was what touched this off. :-) It was a combination of using a phone for email for the first time (yes, I know, I must be some kind of Luddite), I also sent my first mail from my first web-enabled mobile phone yesterday - shall we create a group page on linkedIn ? :P Nicolas - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@maven.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@maven.apache.org -- John Casey Developer, PMC Member - Apache Maven (http://maven.apache.org) Blog: http://www.johnofalltrades.name/ - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@maven.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@maven.apache.org
Re: '+1' vs 'I agree'
So you can use her fax machine and ppl can page your beeper when they've sent a fax! Kristian Den 26. jan. 2011 kl. 16:25 skrev John Casey jdca...@commonjava.org: On 1/26/11 10:09 AM, Kristian Rosenvold wrote: You should publish a fax number for people who wish to join the group. You shouldn't joke...my mother gets tech-support questions about her website via fax. ;-) From my phone, Kristian Den 26. jan. 2011 kl. 15:59 skrev nicolas de loofnicolas.del...@gmail.com: 2011/1/26 John Caseyjdca...@commonjava.org Apologies if my addition to the veto thread was what touched this off. :-) It was a combination of using a phone for email for the first time (yes, I know, I must be some kind of Luddite), I also sent my first mail from my first web-enabled mobile phone yesterday - shall we create a group page on linkedIn ? :P Nicolas - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@maven.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@maven.apache.org -- John Casey Developer, PMC Member - Apache Maven (http://maven.apache.org) Blog: http://www.johnofalltrades.name/ - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@maven.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@maven.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@maven.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@maven.apache.org
Re: '+1' vs 'I agree'
-1 I'm all for keeping it short, it works well with IRC, and other forums, +1 / -1 are easy to pick out in threads by just scanning them quickly. On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 10:31 AM, Kristian Rosenvold kristian.rosenv...@gmail.com wrote: So you can use her fax machine and ppl can page your beeper when they've sent a fax! Kristian Den 26. jan. 2011 kl. 16:25 skrev John Casey jdca...@commonjava.org: On 1/26/11 10:09 AM, Kristian Rosenvold wrote: You should publish a fax number for people who wish to join the group. You shouldn't joke...my mother gets tech-support questions about her website via fax. ;-) From my phone, Kristian Den 26. jan. 2011 kl. 15:59 skrev nicolas de loofnicolas.del...@gmail.com: 2011/1/26 John Caseyjdca...@commonjava.org Apologies if my addition to the veto thread was what touched this off. :-) It was a combination of using a phone for email for the first time (yes, I know, I must be some kind of Luddite), I also sent my first mail from my first web-enabled mobile phone yesterday - shall we create a group page on linkedIn ? :P Nicolas - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@maven.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@maven.apache.org -- John Casey Developer, PMC Member - Apache Maven (http://maven.apache.org) Blog: http://www.johnofalltrades.name/ - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@maven.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@maven.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@maven.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@maven.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@maven.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@maven.apache.org
Re: '+1' vs 'I agree'
For me the difference between +1 I agree and +0 I don't care is relevant. Especially if you're fixing a problem, but your solution isn't 100% perfect, it's interesting to know if people are daily annoyed by this problem or don't care. If you see many +1's, there might be even just cause to ignore a single -1 :) Op 26-01-11 16:23, Paul Gier schreef: I would even go further and say that if it's not a vote, a +1 or I agree by themselves don't really add to the conversation. In general, no response means either I agree or I don't care enough to respond, so do what you want. If a proposal or discussion item is put forward, it's normally safe to assume that unless someone speaks up, people are ok with it. So at a minimum for non-vote items, I would prefer I agree because..., or I disagree because On 01/26/2011 05:44 AM, Lukas Theussl wrote: This may seem like a peanut issue compared to other things we have to discuss these days, but since so many things are coming up, I thought I toss it in and maybe it will get overlooked... It bugs me that every time I see a +1 in a normal conversation I find myself crawling back up the mail thread to check if I missed a vote call somewhere. I suspect it is common usus in apache land or maybe just an established habit, but I think it's a bad habit and potentially confusing as it's often not clear what the +1 refers to. Isn't it reasonable to expect that people use proper language like a simple 'Yes' or 'I agree' if they just want to express their support for a point or statement, and to reserve numerical expressions for formal vote threads? thanks, -Lukas (*sigh*, glad I got that off my chest...) - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@maven.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@maven.apache.org -- With kind regards, Geoffrey De Smet - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@maven.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@maven.apache.org
