4.0.1_release_blocker granted: [Bug 123184] Serbian (sr) translation update for OpenOffice 4.0.1

[bugzilla]

j...@apache.org has granted Andrea Pescetti 's request for
4.0.1_release_blocker:
Bug 123184: Serbian (sr) translation update for OpenOffice 4.0.1
https://issues.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=123184


--- Additional Comments from j...@apache.org
approve showstopper request

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org

4.0.1_release_blocker granted: [Bug 123182] Update galician - GL - localization to latest Pootle statement

[bugzilla]

j...@apache.org has granted rgb 's request for
4.0.1_release_blocker:
Bug 123182: Update galician - GL - localization to latest Pootle statement
https://issues.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=123182


--- Additional Comments from j...@apache.org
approve showstopper request

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org

Re: requirements for vm-admins of forum/translate/wiki

[Jürgen Schmidt]

On 9/4/13 10:17 PM, Rob Weir wrote:
> On Wed, Sep 4, 2013 at 12:36 PM, janI  wrote:
>> Hi.
>>
>> We have had some longer discussions on different ML/IRC about how a
>> vm-admin should behave and which level of service we expect for our servers.
>>
>> We need new admins, so this is also a request for anyone interested to chip
>> in.
>>
>> We have had some unfortunate incidents on all 3 vm, of different nature,
>> which made me question if we as a community:
> 
> I assume we have vms for Forums and for Wiki.  But what is the 3rd one?
> 
>> a) want servers, that are cared for professionally or by happening.
>> b) want to (are capable to) maintain the servers ourself.
>> c) are prepared to support a change that make a), b) possible.
>>
> 
> I assume we want well-maintained servers that help us get our
> project-related tasks done, and also help serve our users. 

+1 that is the main goal, a working reliable infra structure that helps
to run our project.

 In the
> past, before you got involved, we were not very "proactive".  It
> seemed like we just waited for something to break, and then tried to
> fix it.

Exactly and doing it proactive is much better and in the end probably
less work.

> 
> I assume another goal is that we have several people helping with the
> admin, to share the work, avoid burnouts, cover for vacation, etc.

And that is a very important goal, we need an environment where we can
at any time step in if somebody is not available. I now very well in the
same way as Jan how it is to be a bottleneck. Well it#s true for many
others of us in different areas. But if the servers are not running or
the services not available more people are affected faster


> 
>> I have formulated some thoughts on how admins could work, but in general I
>> believe we should convince infra to take over the vm responsibility and
>> keep our well functioning forum/wiki admins.
>>
>> We have a vm-team in place, that was created with the purpose of not having
>> a single person as admin. I my opinion the team have not lived up to that
>> purpose but I am still thankful for the help I have received.
>>
>> Remarks the ideas below are my personal thought, which I have used during
>> the time where I maintained the servers:
>>
>> ===
>> The server should at all times be maintained with the following priority:
>> 1) security (the backside of being popular is to have the attention of
>> people who want to gain merit by breaking our servers)
>> 2) stability (we have limited cpu/ram/disk so we must optimize)
>> 3) add user wishes (we already have stable systems, 1,2 are far  more
>> important that enhancing the systems).
>>
> 
> and maybe
> 
> 3b) Try to evolve systems so users can implement their own wishes, in
> a way compatible with 1) and 2).  For example, if routine logos and
> footers are synched to resources in the project's SVN tree, then any
> committer can update things.
> 
>> Being an admin on a vm is a job that does not take soo much time, but
>> requires a lot of monitoring and communication (especially with infra).
>>
>> A good setup would be, 3 types of admin:
>> Each server will have an appointed "owner" (anchor-admin)
>> A number of persons have full sudo on a server (admin)
>> A number of persons can reboot/restart/work on po files (help-admin)
>>
>> === Anchor-admin responsibilities ===
>> Anchor-admin is the "owner" of the vm and the prime contact to infra.
>>
>> Anchor-admin has the overall responsibility of the vm.
>> 1) help when receiving alerts
>> 2) keep informed on available patches, especial security related patches
>> 3) create/keep a maintenance plan
>> 4) coordinate changes external to vm (like dns) with infra
>> 5) participate in infra discussions relevant for the vm (e.g. certificates)
>> 6) monitor the vm regularly for resource usage
>> 7) secure that appl changes are implemented with relevant consensus
>> 8) discuss work with admin, with the goal that they should be able to take
>> over one day.
>>
>> These activities are expected to take 3-4 hours pr week, more in the
>> beginning and less later. The hour usage highly depend on the number and
>> level of admins.
>>
>> === Admin responsibilities ===
>> Admins help the anchor admin with ongoing maintenance and have full sudo.
>>
>> All changes must be discussed and agreed with the anchor admin, no change
>> is so important that it cannot wait until discussed !
>>
> 
> We might also want an admin-...@openoffice.apache.org list and perhaps
> a private one as well to coordinate.
> 
>> Admins are expected to:
>> 1) help when receiving alerts
>> 2) stay informed with the vm configuration
>> including but not limited to:
>> - where are which configuration done, and stored (svn/backup)
>> - how are the apps. configured
>> - read and update runbook, if something is unclear
>> 3) participate in the regular maintenance
>> 4) coordinate all non-scheduled work with anchor-admin
>>
>> These activities are expected to take 1-2 hours pr week, more in

Re: Latest update fucked my spread sheets

[Alexandro Colorado]

Is technically impossible to mess all your spreadhseets unless they were
conciously saved like that. I have dealt with corrupt files, and usually
the files are usually at fault of other external things like incomplete
downloads/transfers.
Also OpenOffice has a backup path that saves all documentes saved on a
specialize internal path in case you get to loose any of it.
Finally just as regular computing practice you should always hold backups
of everything, regardless of the software you use.


On Wed, Sep 4, 2013 at 7:49 PM, Krynock Construction
wrote:

> Just to let you dicks know, I updated the program with the latest update
> and all my text documents are fine.  However, ALL my spread sheets that I
> use to estimate my jobs, track profit and expenses, track accounting
> expenses etc were blown all out of scale and proportion.  I have to
> completely redo all my worksheets.  Right when I have tons of  physical job
> work, job-related paper work and school work to get done now I have to redo
> all of my spreadsheets.  Thanks.  Fuck you, I'm going over to Microsoft
> Office even if I have to pay.  Better than redoing all my work and then
> having this shit happen again.  Can you tell I'm pissed?  I used to love an
> outside the box program that was competition to Microsoft. I'm beside
> myself.
> -
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
>
>


-- 
Alexandro Colorado
Apache OpenOffice Contributor
http://www.openoffice.org

Re: AOO 4.0 Release notes problem in numbering

[Oliver-Rainer Wittmann]

Hi,

On 05.09.2013 05:20, Shenfeng Liu wrote:
> Yohey,
>I wonder if you can send the your sample file to me and Steve in private
> mail? So that we can check the issue you meet.
>Thanks!
> 

It would be even better to submit a public available Bugzilla issue [1]
with the sample file attached to it. Then everybody in the community can
work on it.

[1] http://www.openoffice.org/qa/issue_handling/pre_submission.html


Best regards, Oliver.

> - Shenfeng (Simon)
> 
> 
> 
> 2013/9/4 Steve Yin 
> 
>> Hi Yohey,
>>
>> My MSO version is 2010 64bit. The numbering "一、二、三、" was inserted from the
>> popup menu ->numbering library. Then the document was saved into the doc
>> and docx format.
>>
>> Please make sure that the language settings of the AOO is correct. My
>> locale setting and the Asian language setting for document are "Chinese
>> (Simplified)".
>>
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Sep 4, 2013 at 11:58 AM, ��仁瀚  wrote:
>>
>>> Hello Steve,
>>>
>>> well, what's your version of MS office? I use the version 2010. But in
>> fact
>>> the problem still existed as I tested it. Only the number "一二三" cannot be
>>> transformed correctly.
>>> I would like to know how you test it in detail. Just like how you enter
>> or
>>> insert your numbers.
>>> Thanks for your help, this really disturbed me a lot.
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>>Yohey.
>>>
>>>
>>> 2013/9/3 Steve Yin 
>>>
 Hi Yohey,

 I got the same wrong result on MS doc format. But using MS docx is OK.
>>> That
 is consistent with the AOO 4.0 release notes "Support more
>>> Numbering&bullet
 types in docx". Please check it.


 On Mon, Sep 2, 2013 at 1:02 PM, ��仁瀚  wrote:

> Hello everyone,
>
> Recent days I have tried some improvement in the version 4.0 from
>>> release
> notes [1] . But I got a problem in my implementation.
> The item "Support more Numbering&bullet types in docx"  is under the
 index
> "OOXML general". And that is where my question is.
>
> I use the function which is "numbering" to enter the following words
>> in
 MS
> office:
>
> 一. some words
>
> 二.  some words
>
> 三.  some words
>
>
>
> 壹、some words
>
> �E、some words
>
> ��、some words
>
>
>
> 甲、some words
>
> 乙、some words
>
> 丙、some words
>
>
> And I saved it as docx. In fact, whatever I used doc or docx, I got
>> the
> same result as I opened the doc or docx file with AOO:
>
> 1. some words
>
> 2.  some words
>
> 3.  some words
>
>
>
> 壹、some words
>
> �E、some words
>
> ��、some words
>
>
>
> 甲、some words
>
> 乙、some words
>
> 丙、some words
>
> The problem is that Chinese number (一二三 is equal to 123) cannot be
 convert
> completely in AOO.
> Does I got wrong understanding in this improvement or there is
>>> something
> wrong?
>
> Also, if this improvement is not talking about what I did above, how
>>> can
 I
> contribute and improve my problem?
>
>
> [1]
>

>>>
>> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OOOUSERS/AOO+4.0+Release+Notes
>
>
> Thanks.
> Yohey.
>



 --
 Best Regards,

 Steve Yin

>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Best Regards,
>>
>> Steve Yin
>>
> 

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org

Re: Latest update fucked my spread sheets

[Oliver-Rainer Wittmann]

Hi,

On 05.09.2013 02:49, Krynock Construction wrote:

Just to let you dicks know, I updated the program with the latest
update and all my text documents are fine.  However, ALL my spread
sheets that I use to estimate my jobs, track profit and expenses,
track accounting expenses etc were blown all out of scale and
proportion.  I have to completely redo all my worksheets.  Right when
I have tons of  physical job work, job-related paper work and school
work to get done now I have to redo all of my spreadsheets.  Thanks.
Fuck you, I'm going over to Microsoft Office even if I have to pay.
Better than redoing all my work and then having this shit happen
again.  Can you tell I'm pissed?  I used to love an outside the box
program that was competition to Microsoft. I'm beside myself.


Ok.

Let us be constructive:
If you want to help to get the defect fixed, then please provide a 
sample spreadsheet document (or more if needed) together with a 
description of want is broken in these spreadsheet documents when using 
them in AOO 4.0.0.



Best regards, Oliver.

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org

Re: svn commit: r1519953 - in /openoffice/branches/l10n40/main/languages/source: af/ ar/ as/ ast/ be-BY/ bg/ bn/ bo/ br/ brx/ bs/ ca-XV/ ca/ cs/ cy/ da/ de/ dgo/ dz/ el/ en-AU/ en-GB/ en-ZA/ eo/ es/ e

[Jürgen Schmidt]

On 9/4/13 6:53 PM, janI wrote:
> On 4 September 2013 18:13, Jürgen Schmidt  wrote:
> 
>> On 9/4/13 5:56 PM, janI wrote:
>>> On 4 September 2013 17:10, Herbert Duerr  wrote:
>>>
 On 04.09.2013 16:13, janI wrote:

> On 4 September 2013 13:59, Herbert Duerr  wrote:
>
>  On 04.09.2013 11:15, j...@apache.org wrote:
>>
>>  Author: jani
>>> Date: Wed Sep  4 09:13:51 2013
>>> New Revision: 1519953
>>>
>>> URL: http://svn.apache.org/r1519953
>>> Log:
>>> update to UTF-8
>>>
>>>
>> Great, thanks! And kudos to Tsutomu too!
>>
>> But I noticed that in the l10n40 branch the *.po files of all
>> languages
>> are checked in amidst the main source code in the main/languages
>> directory.
>> Wouldn't it be better to keep all these 600 megabytes of localization
>> data
>> separate, e.g. in extras/ where it used to be?
>>
>>
> In my opinion po files are just as much source as any other part of
>> main,
> and not something extra.
>
> When using the argument "extra", we should move quit a lot of modules
>> away
> from main, since they are not compiled into our release (at least as
>> far
> as
> what I can see).
>

 Yes, I agree. A lot of modules belong into ext_libraries for example
 avmedia, beanshell, curl, epm, graphite, hyphen, jpeg, libpng, libxml2,
 libxmlsec, libxslt, lucene, moz, nss, openssl, python, redland, rhino,
 saxon, tomcat, vigra, zlib, ...


  main/languages and main/l10ntools forms together with a couple of other
> modules (like i18n( our integrated international part, The intention of
> the
> new toolset is to make a deeper integration and not push it further
>> away.
>

 In the example above with all the external modules we already have such
>> a
 tight integration that simply moving them into ext_libraries is a
 non-trivial task. Our goal should not be to tighter integrate them into
>> our
 codebase but to work towards using the off-the-shelf releases of them.
 Using them better with their published interfaces is a worthwhile goal.

 The localizations have a clearly defined tasks and they are huge. When
 major UI changes are underway they create heavy commit traffic. When
 researching the code history or when bisecting for regressions these
 commits cost extra time. And since we are considering to commit directly
 into the l10n repository from pootle this commit rate could increase by
 orders of magnitude.
>>>
>>>
>>> I just wonder what would happen if we had as many developers equally
>> active
>>> as our translators, then the problem would be very much the same.
>>>
>>> I have to ask very clearly; is the opinion of the community, that .po
>> files
>>> is not to be considered a vital/integrated part of our source tree and
>>> should be moved away ? While at the same time accepting (at least for
>> now),
>>> that modules as mentioned above remain in our source tree and disturb
>>> developers.
>>
>> this question is obsolete and we all agree that the translations are
>> essential as everything else in the code. We just gave you an example of
>> a typical workflow and it becomes potentially better with smaller po
>> files compared to 1 big sdf file per language.
>>
>> And the modules you have mentioned are completely different and we can
>> of course discuss to remove them or store them in a different place. As
>> always somebody has to do the work and it is often not only a simple
>> remove.
>>
>>>
>>> If the .po files are considered inferior, and disturbing, I will of
>> course
>>> not try to make an automated workflow that depend on integration.
>>
>> We just discuss what's better and we have at the moment different
>> opinions. It's not an either or it's just seeking for the best approach
>> to make all happy and to find the best solution.
>>
>>
> I was not aware that we have different options (I as the developer do not
> see these options), its really very late for that discussion. The workflow
> is not up for discussion, we had that discussion based on my wiki pages
> before I started programming and after several changes due to comments we
> had lazy consensus.

I remember at least one chat with you where I mentioned that I would not
move the po files in main directly. But because the fact that it is only
an implementation detail  (for me) where these files are I don't spent
further time on it.



> 
> 
> 
>> If we can define and ensure an automated workflow with continue
>> integration of translation I am fine and happy with it. But if it breaks
>> the build on a regular basis I am not.
>>
> 
> Changes in the .po will not be able to break a en-US build, but might break
> a language build. I do however not see the difference between:

if that will be the final result and workflow we will be all happy.
Maybe we don't see it yet because our build process today is far away
fr

Fwd: AOO numbering problem

[Steve Yin]

Hi all,

We found an issue in AOO numbering support when opening OOXML format.
Please help to look at it and welcome to provide more detail information or
technical support. Thanks.


-- Forwarded message --
From: Steve Yin 
Date: Thu, Sep 5, 2013 at 1:51 PM
Subject: Re: AOO numbering problem
To: 張仁瀚 


Hi Yohey,

You are Welcome.
I am from China. We are compatriots. : )
I tested your sample file and got the same wrong result. But I found that
the numbering type of "一、二、三" in your sample file is from document number
formats, not from numbering library. There must be some differences between
these two categories in MSO. So I think it should be an incomplete support
issue for the OOXML in the current AOO version. You can file a bug for this
issue here. https://issues.apache.org/ooo/

I sent this mail to the AOO dev mail list for more help. So I kept to reply
you in English. And I think we can contact each other in Chinese from now
on.

My sample file is in the attachment. It can be read by AOO correctly.
Please try it.

On Thu, Sep 5, 2013 at 1:43 AM, 張仁瀚  wrote:

> Hello Steve.
>
> Thanks for your help and sorry for that disturbing you in privacy.
> In fact, I cannot transform the numbers "一二三" successfully, but the others
> like "壹貳參" or "甲乙丙" is okay. About the language settings, I have done it
> completely by modifying every queer way into Chinese (Simplified). I also
> tried AOO English version and  Chinese (Simplified) version. But I got the
> same result just like what I described above.
>
> The attachment is my test file. It seems nothing wrong but maybe you could
> check whether the numbers also be transformed completely on your PC.  .
> Also maybe I can try your file to see if I will get the same error.
>
> By the way, I come from Taiwan. It seems that your might know Chinese. If
> you do, maybe we can send mail in Chinese next time. I think I could
> express much well :) .
>
> Thanks.
>
>   Yohey
>



-- 
Best Regards,

Steve Yin



-- 
Best Regards,

Steve Yin


Numbering issue.docx
Description: application/vnd.openxmlformats-officedocument.wordprocessingml.document

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org

Re: AOO 4.0 Release notes problem in numbering

[Shenfeng Liu]

Yohey,
  I wonder if you can send the your sample file to me and Steve in private
mail? So that we can check the issue you meet.
  Thanks!

- Shenfeng (Simon)



2013/9/4 Steve Yin 

> Hi Yohey,
>
> My MSO version is 2010 64bit. The numbering "一、二、三、" was inserted from the
> popup menu ->numbering library. Then the document was saved into the doc
> and docx format.
>
> Please make sure that the language settings of the AOO is correct. My
> locale setting and the Asian language setting for document are "Chinese
> (Simplified)".
>
>
>
> On Wed, Sep 4, 2013 at 11:58 AM, ��仁瀚  wrote:
>
> > Hello Steve,
> >
> > well, what's your version of MS office? I use the version 2010. But in
> fact
> > the problem still existed as I tested it. Only the number "一二三" cannot be
> > transformed correctly.
> > I would like to know how you test it in detail. Just like how you enter
> or
> > insert your numbers.
> > Thanks for your help, this really disturbed me a lot.
> >
> > Regards,
> >   Yohey.
> >
> >
> > 2013/9/3 Steve Yin 
> >
> > > Hi Yohey,
> > >
> > > I got the same wrong result on MS doc format. But using MS docx is OK.
> > That
> > > is consistent with the AOO 4.0 release notes "Support more
> > Numbering&bullet
> > > types in docx". Please check it.
> > >
> > >
> > > On Mon, Sep 2, 2013 at 1:02 PM, ��仁瀚  wrote:
> > >
> > > > Hello everyone,
> > > >
> > > > Recent days I have tried some improvement in the version 4.0 from
> > release
> > > > notes [1] . But I got a problem in my implementation.
> > > > The item "Support more Numbering&bullet types in docx"  is under the
> > > index
> > > > "OOXML general". And that is where my question is.
> > > >
> > > > I use the function which is "numbering" to enter the following words
> in
> > > MS
> > > > office:
> > > >
> > > > 一. some words
> > > >
> > > > 二.  some words
> > > >
> > > > 三.  some words
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > 壹、some words
> > > >
> > > > �E、some words
> > > >
> > > > ��、some words
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > 甲、some words
> > > >
> > > > 乙、some words
> > > >
> > > > 丙、some words
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > And I saved it as docx. In fact, whatever I used doc or docx, I got
> the
> > > > same result as I opened the doc or docx file with AOO:
> > > >
> > > > 1. some words
> > > >
> > > > 2.  some words
> > > >
> > > > 3.  some words
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > 壹、some words
> > > >
> > > > �E、some words
> > > >
> > > > ��、some words
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > 甲、some words
> > > >
> > > > 乙、some words
> > > >
> > > > 丙、some words
> > > >
> > > > The problem is that Chinese number (一二三 is equal to 123) cannot be
> > > convert
> > > > completely in AOO.
> > > > Does I got wrong understanding in this improvement or there is
> > something
> > > > wrong?
> > > >
> > > > Also, if this improvement is not talking about what I did above, how
> > can
> > > I
> > > > contribute and improve my problem?
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > [1]
> > > >
> > >
> >
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OOOUSERS/AOO+4.0+Release+Notes
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Thanks.
> > > >Yohey.
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Best Regards,
> > >
> > > Steve Yin
> > >
> >
>
>
>
> --
> Best Regards,
>
> Steve Yin
>

Latest update fucked my spread sheets

[Krynock Construction]

Just to let you dicks know, I updated the program with the latest update and 
all my text documents are fine.  However, ALL my spread sheets that I use to 
estimate my jobs, track profit and expenses, track accounting expenses etc were 
blown all out of scale and proportion.  I have to completely redo all my 
worksheets.  Right when I have tons of  physical job work, job-related paper 
work and school work to get done now I have to redo all of my spreadsheets.  
Thanks.  Fuck you, I'm going over to Microsoft Office even if I have to pay.  
Better than redoing all my work and then having this shit happen again.  Can 
you tell I'm pissed?  I used to love an outside the box program that was 
competition to Microsoft. I'm beside myself.  
-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org

Re: Component "shs" in Bugzilla (Native-Lang)

[Rob Weir]

On Wed, Sep 4, 2013 at 7:02 PM, Andrea Pescetti  wrote:
> Rob Weir wrote:
>>
>> I'm reading the "sh" is deprecated and "sr" is for Serbian  IANA
>> recommends sr-Latn for Serbian with Latin script. ...
>>
>> Are we not able to use subtags like this in Pootle?
>
>
> No: the problem is explained in
> https://issues.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=122910 and is related to the
> OpenOffice code, not to the tools.
>
> So: we need to use the deprecated "sh" code due to still existing technical
> constraints in OpenOffice.
>

OK. I've added "sh" to Bugzilla.

-Rob

> Note if someone cares to fix it: in
> http://www.openoffice.org/download/legacy/other.html
> Serbian Cyrillic and Latin are swapped (sr must be Cyrillic, sh Latin).
>
>
> Regards,
>   Andrea.
>
> -
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
>

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org

Re: I would like to get notified when the korean language pack is ready. thank you :D eom

[Donald Whytock]

Hi Brooke...

You may want to subscribe to the AOO announce list:

announce-subscr...@openoffice.apache.org

It's fairly low volume, and tends to include announcements of languages
becoming available.

Don



On Wed, Sep 4, 2013 at 6:37 PM, Brooke White wrote:

>
>

Re: Component "shs" in Bugzilla (Native-Lang)

[Andrea Pescetti]

Rob Weir wrote:

I'm reading the "sh" is deprecated and "sr" is for Serbian  IANA
recommends sr-Latn for Serbian with Latin script. ...
Are we not able to use subtags like this in Pootle?


No: the problem is explained in 
https://issues.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=122910 and is related to 
the OpenOffice code, not to the tools.


So: we need to use the deprecated "sh" code due to still existing 
technical constraints in OpenOffice.


Note if someone cares to fix it: in
http://www.openoffice.org/download/legacy/other.html
Serbian Cyrillic and Latin are swapped (sr must be Cyrillic, sh Latin).

Regards,
  Andrea.

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org

Re: Component "shs" in Bugzilla (Native-Lang)

[Rob Weir]

On Wed, Sep 4, 2013 at 6:29 PM, Andrea Pescetti  wrote:
> Marcus (OOo) wrote:
>>
>> The following is maybe a good indication that it is indeed belonging to
>> the language:
>> http://www.openoffice.org/shs/
>> Maybe already available in Bugzilla but not yet (or for a point of time
>> in the past) available in the source code?
>
>
> OK, no problems is keeping "shs" even if we don't have a single word in that
> language in OpenOffice so far.
>
> What's important is that "sh" is added: we have volunteers who are just
> waiting for "sh" to be available in Pootle, we have a stable "sh" 3.3.0
> version, we even have complete 3.4 "sh" translations in Bugzilla that were
> probably not integrated due to wrong assignments, so let's get the
> infrastructure in place.
>

I'm reading the "sh" is deprecated and "sr" is for Serbian  IANA
recommends sr-Latn for Serbian with Latin script.

See:  
http://www.iana.org/assignments/language-subtag-registry/language-subtag-registry

Are we not able to use subtags like this in Pootle?  (Bugzilla
obviously doesn't care).

-Rob

>
> Regards,
>   Andrea.
>
> -
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
>

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org

Re: Removing JavaScript from other.html

[Andrea Pescetti]

On 02/09/2013 Marcus (OOo) wrote:

Right, at the moment only the following has to be done to change the
content of the "other.html":
- change the version number
- change the languages - and if needed its order
- change the platforms - and if needed its order


But this wouldn't change. I managed to express myself very badly.

In practice, what I propose is this:

This is "other_js.html" (a copy of your current "other.html")
http://people.apache.org/~pescetti/tmp/2013-09-otherhtml/other_js.html

This is the new "other.html"
http://people.apache.org/~pescetti/tmp/2013-09-otherhtml/other.html

See the difference? No? Good. "other.html" is obtained by opening in 
Firebug other_js.html and copy/pasting the table from there (from the 
document's DOM, not the HTML source that would have the write_table() 
function there). A few seconds' work.


other_js.html is an internal convenience page, never shown to users or 
linked: it is a "generator".


So the workflow is unchanged, with the addition of a step that takes a 
few seconds: load "other_js.html" in Firefox and with Firebug copy the 
table to "other.html". (you can use dozens of tools and techniques, I 
just picked one; if you want to script it you can use phantomjs or 
whatever, but everything is overkill for this).


Then other.html will work for everybody and we can avoid dealing with 
broken browsers so long as they render HTML tables properly.


I didn't clean up the  and other parts of other.html that 
would then be removed, but would be a simple one-time edit.


All concerns about Google visibility are addressed too: actually, the 
new other.html would be more visibile to search engines that in general 
have difficulties in parsing JavaScript.


Regards,
  Andrea.

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org

Re: Another test of the download page on Browsershots.com

[Marcus (OOo)]

Am 09/05/2013 12:20 AM, schrieb Rob Weir:

On Wed, Sep 4, 2013 at 5:37 PM, Marcus (OOo)  wrote:

Am 09/04/2013 10:47 PM, schrieb Rob Weir:


http://browsershots.org/http://www.openoffice.org/download/

I'm not sure anyone else can read that.  It might be tied to a cookie.
   But I ran a test to render the download page on 135 browser/os
combinations.  It returns a PNG screenshot for each rendering.  I
looked for which combinations did not render the green download box.

There were 5 failures.  Two I don't think we care about:

Dillo 3.0.2 / Debian 6.0 (squeeze)

and

Kazehakase 0.5.8 / Debian 6.0 (squeeze)

And 3 that we should care about:

MSIE 5.5 / Windows 2008 R2 (Server)

MSIE 6.0 / Windows 2008 R2 (Server)

MSIE 7.0 / Windows 2008 R2 (Server)



I don't agree here. Why do we have to support stone-old browsers? Because
they are available on a browser testing website? Come on. ;-)



I'm concerned with the error, since it it impacts the more modern IE 6 and 7.

Looking at visits to our website over the past month I see this many users:

IE 10 -- 857,499
IE 9 -- 250,591
IE 8 -- 420,215
IE 7 -- 69,914
IE 6 -- 27,172
IE 5.5 -- 69

So we're still getting nearly 100K visits/month from these older IE versions.


The 69 are not really impressive. But 27,000+ for MSIE 6 is surprising.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_Explorer_5

It's old, MS is no longer supporting it, so IMHO it's done. Nearly the same
for 6.0.



Right.  But here is a common scenario.  You need to reinstall Windows
on a machine.  Say it is XP or Vista.  Both are supported today, but
both have older browsers by default.  Of course, the first thing you
do on a new machine is run the Windows Updates.  But in parallel with
that you are downloading other software you need, Acrobat Reader, anti
virus, 7-Zip, Notepad++, etc.,  and Apache OpenOffice.   So you might
end up with IE 8 in the end, after all the patches are applied.  But
you start your work with an earlier version,


I would expect that these people first get the basics up-to-date, then 
other applications.



The IE versions all give the same script error:



However, if all browsers show the same error then a fix could get back all 3
into life at the same time.



That makes sense.


Yes, let's concentrate on the error.


Line 330, Char 1, Code 0, Expected identifier, string or number

This is an odd place for an error, since that appears to be in the
middle of the commented out block for beta releases.

Any ideas?



Yes, if you search in the "index.html" which indeed doesn't make sense.

When looking into "download.js" then you are in the middle of the
"getFilesize()" function. But I've no idea what the problematic point could
be there.



I wonder if it could be
http://www.openoffice.org/download/release_matrix.js?  Could it be a
coincidence that that file is exactly 329 lines long and the error is
claimed to be in line 330?  Maybe that unnecessary comma at the end of
line 328 is the issue?


Hm, and what about "languages.js"? It has also a semicolon at the end 
but the file has only 108 lines. In the "index.html" it will be imported 
before the "release_matrix.js" (I don't know if this really the case) 
but there is no hint for error.


Anyway, let's try. In the test area:

http://ooo-site.staging.apache.org/download/test/index.html
http://ooo-site.staging.apache.org/download/test/other.html

I've committed the deletion of the characters in both files. I think we 
need to wait another 24h until we are allowed to use Browsershots.org 
again, right? - At least this is my experience.


Marcus

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org

Re: Component "shs" in Bugzilla (Native-Lang)

[Andrea Pescetti]

Marcus (OOo) wrote:

The following is maybe a good indication that it is indeed belonging to
the language:
http://www.openoffice.org/shs/
Maybe already available in Bugzilla but not yet (or for a point of time
in the past) available in the source code?


OK, no problems is keeping "shs" even if we don't have a single word in 
that language in OpenOffice so far.


What's important is that "sh" is added: we have volunteers who are just 
waiting for "sh" to be available in Pootle, we have a stable "sh" 3.3.0 
version, we even have complete 3.4 "sh" translations in Bugzilla that 
were probably not integrated due to wrong assignments, so let's get the 
infrastructure in place.


Regards,
  Andrea.

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org

Re: Another test of the download page on Browsershots.com

[Rob Weir]

On Wed, Sep 4, 2013 at 5:37 PM, Marcus (OOo)  wrote:
> Am 09/04/2013 10:47 PM, schrieb Rob Weir:
>
>> http://browsershots.org/http://www.openoffice.org/download/
>>
>> I'm not sure anyone else can read that.  It might be tied to a cookie.
>>   But I ran a test to render the download page on 135 browser/os
>> combinations.  It returns a PNG screenshot for each rendering.  I
>> looked for which combinations did not render the green download box.
>>
>> There were 5 failures.  Two I don't think we care about:
>>
>> Dillo 3.0.2 / Debian 6.0 (squeeze)
>>
>> and
>>
>> Kazehakase 0.5.8 / Debian 6.0 (squeeze)
>>
>> And 3 that we should care about:
>>
>> MSIE 5.5 / Windows 2008 R2 (Server)
>>
>> MSIE 6.0 / Windows 2008 R2 (Server)
>>
>> MSIE 7.0 / Windows 2008 R2 (Server)
>
>
> I don't agree here. Why do we have to support stone-old browsers? Because
> they are available on a browser testing website? Come on. ;-)
>

I'm concerned with the error, since it it impacts the more modern IE 6 and 7.

Looking at visits to our website over the past month I see this many users:

IE 10 -- 857,499
IE 9 -- 250,591
IE 8 -- 420,215
IE 7 -- 69,914
IE 6 -- 27,172
IE 5.5 -- 69

So we're still getting nearly 100K visits/month from these older IE versions.

> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_Explorer_5
>
> It's old, MS is no longer supporting it, so IMHO it's done. Nearly the same
> for 6.0.
>

Right.  But here is a common scenario.  You need to reinstall Windows
on a machine.  Say it is XP or Vista.  Both are supported today, but
both have older browsers by default.  Of course, the first thing you
do on a new machine is run the Windows Updates.  But in parallel with
that you are downloading other software you need, Acrobat Reader, anti
virus, 7-Zip, Notepad++, etc.,  and Apache OpenOffice.   So you might
end up with IE 8 in the end, after all the patches are applied.  But
you start your work with an earlier version,


>
>> The IE versions all give the same script error:
>
>
> However, if all browsers show the same error then a fix could get back all 3
> into life at the same time.
>

That makes sense.

>
>> Line 330, Char 1, Code 0, Expected identifier, string or number
>>
>> This is an odd place for an error, since that appears to be in the
>> middle of the commented out block for beta releases.
>>
>> Any ideas?
>
>
> Yes, if you search in the "index.html" which indeed doesn't make sense.
>
> When looking into "download.js" then you are in the middle of the
> "getFilesize()" function. But I've no idea what the problematic point could
> be there.
>

I wonder if it could be
http://www.openoffice.org/download/release_matrix.js?  Could it be a
coincidence that that file is exactly 329 lines long and the error is
claimed to be in line 330?  Maybe that unnecessary comma at the end of
line 328 is the issue?

-Rob


> Marcus
>
>
> -
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
>

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org

Re: Another test of the download page on Browsershots.com

[Marcus (OOo)]

Am 09/04/2013 10:47 PM, schrieb Rob Weir:

http://browsershots.org/http://www.openoffice.org/download/

I'm not sure anyone else can read that.  It might be tied to a cookie.
  But I ran a test to render the download page on 135 browser/os
combinations.  It returns a PNG screenshot for each rendering.  I
looked for which combinations did not render the green download box.

There were 5 failures.  Two I don't think we care about:

Dillo 3.0.2 / Debian 6.0 (squeeze)

and

Kazehakase 0.5.8 / Debian 6.0 (squeeze)

And 3 that we should care about:

MSIE 5.5 / Windows 2008 R2 (Server)

MSIE 6.0 / Windows 2008 R2 (Server)

MSIE 7.0 / Windows 2008 R2 (Server)


I don't agree here. Why do we have to support stone-old browsers? 
Because they are available on a browser testing website? Come on. ;-)


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_Explorer_5

It's old, MS is no longer supporting it, so IMHO it's done. Nearly the 
same for 6.0.



The IE versions all give the same script error:


However, if all browsers show the same error then a fix could get back 
all 3 into life at the same time.



Line 330, Char 1, Code 0, Expected identifier, string or number

This is an odd place for an error, since that appears to be in the
middle of the commented out block for beta releases.

Any ideas?


Yes, if you search in the "index.html" which indeed doesn't make sense.

When looking into "download.js" then you are in the middle of the 
"getFilesize()" function. But I've no idea what the problematic point 
could be there.


Marcus


-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org

Re: Component "shs" in Bugzilla (Native-Lang)

[Marcus (OOo)]

Am 09/04/2013 11:18 PM, schrieb Andrea Pescetti:

What is component "shs" in Bugzilla?

https://issues.apache.org/ooo/enter_bug.cgi?product=Native-Lang

There you find "shs - Secwepemc Language" but this is likely wrong since
we don't even have that language at
http://svn.apache.org/viewvc/openoffice/trunk/extras/l10n/source/


I found 2 interesting things:
https://www.google.de/search?q=shs++openoffice

1.
The following is maybe a good indication that it is indeed belonging to 
the language:


http://www.openoffice.org/shs/

Maybe already available in Bugzilla but not yet (or for a point of time 
in the past) available in the source code?


2.
Or it belongs to a file format and was the start of a new document filter:

http://code.google.com/p/scrap2rtf/

HTH

Marcus




The right one is probably "sh", which we use to denote "Serbian Latin".
This is improper naming due to political changes, but due to technical
constraints we are keeping the now deprecated "sh" code. At least, this
one must be added.

Regards,
Andrea.


-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org

Re: Possible broken link: from other.html

[Marcus (OOo)]

Thanks for the data. I'll investigate if the real error could be located 
and fixed.


Marcus



Am 09/03/2013 12:54 PM, schrieb Reinhard Richter:

Hello Marcus,

the error message is attached.

Translation:

This website contains errors and does not function properly.

...

Details concerning the error on this Webseite

User-Agent: Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 8.0; Windows NT 5.1;
Trident/4.0; .NET CLR 2.0.50727; .NET CLR 3.0.04506.648; .NET CLR
3.0.4506.2152; .NET CLR 3.5.30729; .NET4.0C; .NET4.0E; FDM)
Timestamp: Tue, 3 Sep 2013 10:51:20 UTC


Message: The object does not support this property or method.
Line: 96
Sign: 2
Code: 0
URI: http://www.openoffice.org/download/download_other.js


With best regards

Reinhard Richter
B¨¹ro- & Datentechnik
Tel.: 0371/27809970
Fax: 0371/27809971
www.datentechnik-richter.de

USt.-ID: DE140896853


Wenn Du es eilig hast, dann gehe langsam.

Laotse (chinesischer Gelehrter)

"Marcus (OOo)" 
> schrieb:
 > Thanks for your additional data. Please can you give me the detailed
 > error message that your browser is indicating at the bottom left (with
 > the yellow "!")? Maybe it would help to see the message.
 >
 > Thanks
 >
 > Marcus
 >
 >
 >
 > Am 09/02/2013 01:24 PM, schrieb Marcus (OOo):
 > > Thanks for your data. From the values all is fine and the green box
 > > should be visible with a link to download the file.
 > >
 > > Do you have another browser to check if the problem is maybe browser
 > > related?
 > >
 > > Marcus
 > >
 > >
 > >
 > > Am 09/01/2013 06:03 PM, schrieb Marcus (OOo):
 > >> Normally there should a table visible with all possible languages and
 > >> platforms. If not, it's maybe a problem with the browser. Please
try to
 > >> reload the webpage - also with deleted cache.
 > >>
 > >> To see if there is something to improve please give me the output of
 > >> this webapge (just copy&paste the table data):
 > >>
 > >> http://www.openoffice.org/download/test/analyze.html
 > >>
 > >> Thanks in advance for your help.
 > >>
 > >> Marcus
 > >>
 > >>
 > >>
 > >> Am 09/01/2013 04:54 PM, schrieb Reinhard Richter:
 > >>> Apache OpenOffice Downloads - Official Site - All Builds
 > >>>
 > >>> There is no table with different versions and languages.
 > >>> Cannot download Windows-version zh-cn as required.
 > >>> Coming with a german system and a german Internet Explorer I am
 > >>> offered version de-de only.
 > >>> Need to collect different versions for installation on different PC's
 > >>> in my network. My Internet connection is slow, so I cannot
download on
 > >>> each individual PC.


-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org

4.0.1_release_blocker requested: [Bug 123184] Serbian (sr) translation update for OpenOffice 4.0.1

[bugzilla]

Andrea Pescetti  has asked  for 4.0.1_release_blocker:
Bug 123184: Serbian (sr) translation update for OpenOffice 4.0.1
https://issues.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=123184


--- Additional Comments from Andrea Pescetti 
Serbian (sr) is a new language that will be added to OpenOffice 4.0.

Volunteers have completed the UI translation in Pootle:
https://translate.apache.org/sr/aoo40/

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org

Component "shs" in Bugzilla (Native-Lang)

[Andrea Pescetti]

What is component "shs" in Bugzilla?

https://issues.apache.org/ooo/enter_bug.cgi?product=Native-Lang

There you find "shs - Secwepemc Language" but this is likely wrong since 
we don't even have that language at

http://svn.apache.org/viewvc/openoffice/trunk/extras/l10n/source/

The right one is probably "sh", which we use to denote "Serbian Latin". 
This is improper naming due to political changes, but due to technical 
constraints we are keeping the now deprecated "sh" code. At least, this 
one must be added.


Regards,
  Andrea.

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org

Another test of the download page on Browsershots.com

[Rob Weir]

http://browsershots.org/http://www.openoffice.org/download/

I'm not sure anyone else can read that.  It might be tied to a cookie.
 But I ran a test to render the download page on 135 browser/os
combinations.  It returns a PNG screenshot for each rendering.  I
looked for which combinations did not render the green download box.

There were 5 failures.  Two I don't think we care about:

Dillo 3.0.2 / Debian 6.0 (squeeze)

and

Kazehakase 0.5.8 / Debian 6.0 (squeeze)

And 3 that we should care about:

MSIE 5.5 / Windows 2008 R2 (Server)

MSIE 6.0 / Windows 2008 R2 (Server)

MSIE 7.0 / Windows 2008 R2 (Server)

The IE versions all give the same script error:

Line 330, Char 1, Code 0, Expected identifier, string or number

This is an odd place for an error, since that appears to be in the
middle of the commented out block for beta releases.

Any ideas?

-Rob

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org

Re: requirements for vm-admins of forum/translate/wiki

[Rob Weir]

On Wed, Sep 4, 2013 at 12:36 PM, janI  wrote:
> Hi.
>
> We have had some longer discussions on different ML/IRC about how a
> vm-admin should behave and which level of service we expect for our servers.
>
> We need new admins, so this is also a request for anyone interested to chip
> in.
>
> We have had some unfortunate incidents on all 3 vm, of different nature,
> which made me question if we as a community:

I assume we have vms for Forums and for Wiki.  But what is the 3rd one?

> a) want servers, that are cared for professionally or by happening.
> b) want to (are capable to) maintain the servers ourself.
> c) are prepared to support a change that make a), b) possible.
>

I assume we want well-maintained servers that help us get our
project-related tasks done, and also help serve our users.  In the
past, before you got involved, we were not very "proactive".  It
seemed like we just waited for something to break, and then tried to
fix it.

I assume another goal is that we have several people helping with the
admin, to share the work, avoid burnouts, cover for vacation, etc.

> I have formulated some thoughts on how admins could work, but in general I
> believe we should convince infra to take over the vm responsibility and
> keep our well functioning forum/wiki admins.
>
> We have a vm-team in place, that was created with the purpose of not having
> a single person as admin. I my opinion the team have not lived up to that
> purpose but I am still thankful for the help I have received.
>
> Remarks the ideas below are my personal thought, which I have used during
> the time where I maintained the servers:
>
> ===
> The server should at all times be maintained with the following priority:
> 1) security (the backside of being popular is to have the attention of
> people who want to gain merit by breaking our servers)
> 2) stability (we have limited cpu/ram/disk so we must optimize)
> 3) add user wishes (we already have stable systems, 1,2 are far  more
> important that enhancing the systems).
>

and maybe

3b) Try to evolve systems so users can implement their own wishes, in
a way compatible with 1) and 2).  For example, if routine logos and
footers are synched to resources in the project's SVN tree, then any
committer can update things.

> Being an admin on a vm is a job that does not take soo much time, but
> requires a lot of monitoring and communication (especially with infra).
>
> A good setup would be, 3 types of admin:
> Each server will have an appointed "owner" (anchor-admin)
> A number of persons have full sudo on a server (admin)
> A number of persons can reboot/restart/work on po files (help-admin)
>
> === Anchor-admin responsibilities ===
> Anchor-admin is the "owner" of the vm and the prime contact to infra.
>
> Anchor-admin has the overall responsibility of the vm.
> 1) help when receiving alerts
> 2) keep informed on available patches, especial security related patches
> 3) create/keep a maintenance plan
> 4) coordinate changes external to vm (like dns) with infra
> 5) participate in infra discussions relevant for the vm (e.g. certificates)
> 6) monitor the vm regularly for resource usage
> 7) secure that appl changes are implemented with relevant consensus
> 8) discuss work with admin, with the goal that they should be able to take
> over one day.
>
> These activities are expected to take 3-4 hours pr week, more in the
> beginning and less later. The hour usage highly depend on the number and
> level of admins.
>
> === Admin responsibilities ===
> Admins help the anchor admin with ongoing maintenance and have full sudo.
>
> All changes must be discussed and agreed with the anchor admin, no change
> is so important that it cannot wait until discussed !
>

We might also want an admin-...@openoffice.apache.org list and perhaps
a private one as well to coordinate.

> Admins are expected to:
> 1) help when receiving alerts
> 2) stay informed with the vm configuration
> including but not limited to:
> - where are which configuration done, and stored (svn/backup)
> - how are the apps. configured
> - read and update runbook, if something is unclear
> 3) participate in the regular maintenance
> 4) coordinate all non-scheduled work with anchor-admin
>
> These activities are expected to take 1-2 hours pr week, more in the
> beginning and less later.
>
> Admin does not need to be specialists, we all learn, but it is important
> that the admin have motivation and time to learn.
>
>
> === Help-admin responsibilities ===
> Help-admins are located in different timezones, so we have 24/7 coverage
> and have limited sudo (only restart/reboot/handle po files).
>
> When a help-admin receives an alert mail, actions should be taken
> 1) is the vm reachable via ssh, then login else escalate to admin/infra
> 2) is the vm overloaded, or is apache/mysql not running
> 3) restart the needed processes
> 4) mail at least anchor-admin about with obervations and what was done.
>
>
> ===
> remark the above are just

4.0.1_release_blocker requested: [Bug 123182] Update galician - GL - localization to latest Pootle statement

[bugzilla]

rgb  has asked  for 4.0.1_release_blocker:
Bug 123182: Update galician - GL - localization to latest Pootle statement
https://issues.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=123182


--- Additional Comments from rgb 
Assigning to Jürgen and asking for release blocker flag.
-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org

OO4

[Doug]

I uninstalled OO4 this morning, and installed a copy of OO3.4, instead. 
4Calc locks up, copies multiple images of portions of spreadsheets onto 
the screen, changes formulas, and is generally non-dependable. I have 
reported problems on the forum, but do not have time to follow up.
How will I know when it is safe to return to the latest version of OO; 
or, given my non-techie nature, should I stick with 3.4?


Doug W. Johnson

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org

Re: svn commit: r1519953 - in /openoffice/branches/l10n40/main/languages/source: af/ ar/ as/ ast/ be-BY/ bg/ bn/ bo/ br/ brx/ bs/ ca-XV/ ca/ cs/ cy/ da/ de/ dgo/ dz/ el/ en-AU/ en-GB/ en-ZA/ eo/ es/ e

[janI]

On 4 September 2013 18:13, Jürgen Schmidt  wrote:

> On 9/4/13 5:56 PM, janI wrote:
> > On 4 September 2013 17:10, Herbert Duerr  wrote:
> >
> >> On 04.09.2013 16:13, janI wrote:
> >>
> >>> On 4 September 2013 13:59, Herbert Duerr  wrote:
> >>>
> >>>  On 04.09.2013 11:15, j...@apache.org wrote:
> 
>   Author: jani
> > Date: Wed Sep  4 09:13:51 2013
> > New Revision: 1519953
> >
> > URL: http://svn.apache.org/r1519953
> > Log:
> > update to UTF-8
> >
> >
>  Great, thanks! And kudos to Tsutomu too!
> 
>  But I noticed that in the l10n40 branch the *.po files of all
> languages
>  are checked in amidst the main source code in the main/languages
>  directory.
>  Wouldn't it be better to keep all these 600 megabytes of localization
>  data
>  separate, e.g. in extras/ where it used to be?
> 
> 
> >>> In my opinion po files are just as much source as any other part of
> main,
> >>> and not something extra.
> >>>
> >>> When using the argument "extra", we should move quit a lot of modules
> away
> >>> from main, since they are not compiled into our release (at least as
> far
> >>> as
> >>> what I can see).
> >>>
> >>
> >> Yes, I agree. A lot of modules belong into ext_libraries for example
> >> avmedia, beanshell, curl, epm, graphite, hyphen, jpeg, libpng, libxml2,
> >> libxmlsec, libxslt, lucene, moz, nss, openssl, python, redland, rhino,
> >> saxon, tomcat, vigra, zlib, ...
> >>
> >>
> >>  main/languages and main/l10ntools forms together with a couple of other
> >>> modules (like i18n( our integrated international part, The intention of
> >>> the
> >>> new toolset is to make a deeper integration and not push it further
> away.
> >>>
> >>
> >> In the example above with all the external modules we already have such
> a
> >> tight integration that simply moving them into ext_libraries is a
> >> non-trivial task. Our goal should not be to tighter integrate them into
> our
> >> codebase but to work towards using the off-the-shelf releases of them.
> >> Using them better with their published interfaces is a worthwhile goal.
> >>
> >> The localizations have a clearly defined tasks and they are huge. When
> >> major UI changes are underway they create heavy commit traffic. When
> >> researching the code history or when bisecting for regressions these
> >> commits cost extra time. And since we are considering to commit directly
> >> into the l10n repository from pootle this commit rate could increase by
> >> orders of magnitude.
> >
> >
> > I just wonder what would happen if we had as many developers equally
> active
> > as our translators, then the problem would be very much the same.
> >
> > I have to ask very clearly; is the opinion of the community, that .po
> files
> > is not to be considered a vital/integrated part of our source tree and
> > should be moved away ? While at the same time accepting (at least for
> now),
> > that modules as mentioned above remain in our source tree and disturb
> > developers.
>
> this question is obsolete and we all agree that the translations are
> essential as everything else in the code. We just gave you an example of
> a typical workflow and it becomes potentially better with smaller po
> files compared to 1 big sdf file per language.
>
> And the modules you have mentioned are completely different and we can
> of course discuss to remove them or store them in a different place. As
> always somebody has to do the work and it is often not only a simple
> remove.
>
> >
> > If the .po files are considered inferior, and disturbing, I will of
> course
> > not try to make an automated workflow that depend on integration.
>
> We just discuss what's better and we have at the moment different
> opinions. It's not an either or it's just seeking for the best approach
> to make all happy and to find the best solution.
>
>
I was not aware that we have different options (I as the developer do not
see these options), its really very late for that discussion. The workflow
is not up for discussion, we had that discussion based on my wiki pages
before I started programming and after several changes due to comments we
had lazy consensus.



> If we can define and ensure an automated workflow with continue
> integration of translation I am fine and happy with it. But if it breaks
> the build on a regular basis I am not.
>

Changes in the .po will not be able to break a en-US build, but might break
a language build. I do however not see the difference between:
a) I as a developer introduces a build-breaker in the source (will most
likely also hit en-US build)
or
b) I as a translator introduces a translation that is a build breaker for
that language (not en-US, nor other languages)

In my mindset, translator==developer, just with different tools. I sense
you see it differently.

And by the way I believe an automated workflow can be achieved in
> different ways. And having the po files not in main but for example in
> extras 

RE: EXTERNAL: Re: Building comphelper

[Steele, Raymond]

Herbert, 

You are right, I completely missed your post. I am updating my compiler 
(SolarisStudio 12.3) now.  As far as I can see now, I do not have isfinite is 
not a member of std on my system. Although, Netbeans allows me to choose C++ 
Standard C++11. What do you mean by " experiment with the different 
SAL_MATH_FINITE definitions"?

Raymond

-Original Message-
From: Herbert Duerr [mailto:h...@apache.org] 
Sent: Wednesday, September 04, 2013 12:14 AM
To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
Cc: Steele, Raymond
Subject: EXTERNAL: Re: Building comphelper

On 03.09.2013 18:10, Steele, Raymond wrote:
> Anyone?  This seems to pertain to the GNU bug described here since mathconf.h 
> included in the AOO source has a comment about it.
>
> http://gcc.gnu.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=14608

In case you missed my replies to your questions please see 
http://markmail.org/thread/5gnsk7hmehxfdthx

Herbert

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org

requirements for vm-admins of forum/translate/wiki

[janI]

Hi.

We have had some longer discussions on different ML/IRC about how a
vm-admin should behave and which level of service we expect for our servers.

We need new admins, so this is also a request for anyone interested to chip
in.

We have had some unfortunate incidents on all 3 vm, of different nature,
which made me question if we as a community:
a) want servers, that are cared for professionally or by happening.
b) want to (are capable to) maintain the servers ourself.
c) are prepared to support a change that make a), b) possible.

I have formulated some thoughts on how admins could work, but in general I
believe we should convince infra to take over the vm responsibility and
keep our well functioning forum/wiki admins.

We have a vm-team in place, that was created with the purpose of not having
a single person as admin. I my opinion the team have not lived up to that
purpose but I am still thankful for the help I have received.

Remarks the ideas below are my personal thought, which I have used during
the time where I maintained the servers:

===
The server should at all times be maintained with the following priority:
1) security (the backside of being popular is to have the attention of
people who want to gain merit by breaking our servers)
2) stability (we have limited cpu/ram/disk so we must optimize)
3) add user wishes (we already have stable systems, 1,2 are far  more
important that enhancing the systems).

Being an admin on a vm is a job that does not take soo much time, but
requires a lot of monitoring and communication (especially with infra).

A good setup would be, 3 types of admin:
Each server will have an appointed "owner" (anchor-admin)
A number of persons have full sudo on a server (admin)
A number of persons can reboot/restart/work on po files (help-admin)

=== Anchor-admin responsibilities ===
Anchor-admin is the "owner" of the vm and the prime contact to infra.

Anchor-admin has the overall responsibility of the vm.
1) help when receiving alerts
2) keep informed on available patches, especial security related patches
3) create/keep a maintenance plan
4) coordinate changes external to vm (like dns) with infra
5) participate in infra discussions relevant for the vm (e.g. certificates)
6) monitor the vm regularly for resource usage
7) secure that appl changes are implemented with relevant consensus
8) discuss work with admin, with the goal that they should be able to take
over one day.

These activities are expected to take 3-4 hours pr week, more in the
beginning and less later. The hour usage highly depend on the number and
level of admins.

=== Admin responsibilities ===
Admins help the anchor admin with ongoing maintenance and have full sudo.

All changes must be discussed and agreed with the anchor admin, no change
is so important that it cannot wait until discussed !

Admins are expected to:
1) help when receiving alerts
2) stay informed with the vm configuration
including but not limited to:
- where are which configuration done, and stored (svn/backup)
- how are the apps. configured
- read and update runbook, if something is unclear
3) participate in the regular maintenance
4) coordinate all non-scheduled work with anchor-admin

These activities are expected to take 1-2 hours pr week, more in the
beginning and less later.

Admin does not need to be specialists, we all learn, but it is important
that the admin have motivation and time to learn.


=== Help-admin responsibilities ===
Help-admins are located in different timezones, so we have 24/7 coverage
and have limited sudo (only restart/reboot/handle po files).

When a help-admin receives an alert mail, actions should be taken
1) is the vm reachable via ssh, then login else escalate to admin/infra
2) is the vm overloaded, or is apache/mysql not running
3) restart the needed processes
4) mail at least anchor-admin about with obervations and what was done.


===
remark the above are just my thoughts, there are a lot of other
possibilities.

Lets hear your opinion?

rgds
jan I.

4.0.1_release_blocker requested: [Bug 123181] Rhombus are reflected

[bugzilla]

Armin Le Grand  has asked  for 4.0.1_release_blocker:
Bug 123181: Rhombus are reflected
https://issues.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=123181


--- Additional Comments from Armin Le Grand 
ALG: Comitted fix for trunk, set regression flag for AOO401, done for AOO410

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org

University Student Promotional Flyer ( was: Re: Yet another flyer)

[Drew Jensen]

Howdy,

Alright, I wanted to focus on specific users or scenarios regarding this
printed promo material - the earlier flyer skewed towards large user count
scenarios, so went towards the other end of the spectrum.

Started with the persona of an individual student, decided that was too
broad also - College students, also thought this too broad - so, settled my
focus on an Individual university student / teaching aid / professor,
likely not in the CS field (not looking for developers here, it is for all
intent a sales/marketing piece), is at the point in the academic career
where the power features of the tools are being needed and I would think
they are (or want to believe they are)  socially responsible.

Anyway, as you can see I'm in long winded mode - short of it
Here is the PDF of what I think is the first finished piece/ First Draft -
I tried to put this on confluence BTW, but am having problems logging on,
I'll try again later on that - for now here it is on google again:
 PDF
https://docs.google.com/file/d/0Bx7ZNEXlmR0INm5IZzQwQXRodGM
ODT
https://docs.google.com/file/d/0Bx7ZNEXlmR0IVmJ3QzVDNjQyaHc

So - If someone wants to move it to the cwiki, please do, hmmm Apache
license of couse [suppose I should add that in the properties, huh?]
otherwise I'll try reseting my password there again, later.

As for content - well, what do you think? I know you all can help make it
better.

Next up SME...

//drew

On Tue, Sep 3, 2013 at 7:38 PM, Drew Jensen wrote:

> Howdy Juergen,
>
> Well, would that be the icons on the wiki - though I suppose those are
> just an idea.
>
> Anyway - the flyer - actually, the flyers -  What I would like to do is
> have a few flyers, targeted to types of users - for example Students,
> something along the lines of Rob's last blog post but different ;) sorry,
> it really is not just about being free is it?  or is it?
>
> College students, at least in the US, are a problem of course and it can
> be summed up in one word GOOGLE. But they don't have 100% of the market yet
> (well, in public universities they might)
>
> Anyway - I started a student version and a SME version ( there will be a
> presentation of AOO on the 17th and the presenter would like flyers and
> that would be for an SME kind of audience, more later on that)
>
> I won't put up the student and sme versions today - they are identical to
> what I already posted, changing only the 1st column and the little icon
> person on the second page..
>
> Darn- I have to run, I'll try to finish this on the morrow...
>
>
> On Mon, Sep 2, 2013 at 6:00 AM, Jürgen Schmidt wrote:
>
>> On 9/1/13 2:58 AM, Drew Jensen wrote:
>> > Yes - that is exactly what it is, an update to that flyer.
>> >
>> > Ok - Thanks much to Everyone - particularly for the reminder not to be
>> too
>> > loose with trademarks - it prompted me to re-work the short flyer and
>> what
>> > I ended up with can be fond here:
>> > https://docs.google.com/file/d/0Bx7ZNEXlmR0IQjZiZnFkS2dnUnM
>> > (odd, that PDF picked up some verdana fonts when I added the frames..hmm
>> > ;-/)
>> >
>> > Kay mentioned Why AOO items - that is the section I was looking for most
>> > guidance on.
>> >
>> > So, I'll look at Don's suggestions and Kay's tomorrow - BTW the odt file
>> > for todays pdf is at:
>> > https://docs.google.com/file/d/0Bx7ZNEXlmR0IaW1XcURJa20xQU0
>> >
>> > I'll, hopefully, be on-line again Tuesday
>>
>> nice and it reminds me that we should pick up the work on the
>> application icons in time for AOO 4.1 ...
>>
>>
>> Juergen
>>
>>
>> >
>> >
>> > On Sat, Aug 31, 2013 at 12:57 PM, Kay Schenk 
>> wrote:
>> >
>> >> On Fri, Aug 30, 2013 at 10:46 AM, Drew Jensen <
>> drewjensen.in...@gmail.com
>> >>> wrote:
>> >>
>> >>> Howdy,
>> >>>
>> >>> I needed to get my head back into thinking AOO look and feel, so
>> decided
>> >>> why not work on a flyer or two - likely this is superfluous to what
>> you
>> >>> already have however
>> >>> https://docs.google.com/file/d/0Bx7ZNEXlmR0IT3JTSWZZSktzODQ
>> >>>
>> >>> The ODT file is at
>> >>> https://docs.google.com/file/d/0Bx7ZNEXlmR0INHdmVUc4cXR0Q1k
>> >>>
>> >>> I believe that flyer is pretty much finished, but any
>> checks/suggestions
>> >>> would be appreciated.
>> >>>
>> >>> For an A3 layout (sorry US Enlgish, so folks will want to change the
>> >>> spelling to, you know - the wrong spelling ;-/ - for other places)
>> >>> https://docs.google.com/file/d/0Bx7ZNEXlmR0IcmRha0tGeFVHc0U
>> >>>
>> >>> and the ODG file is at:
>> >>> https://docs.google.com/file/d/0Bx7ZNEXlmR0IajF0UVRtcHIxczg
>> >>>
>> >>> Some will recognize the second flyer as an update to the original
>> piece
>> >>> that came out with OO.o 2.0. That file is not finished, as you will
>> see
>> >> and
>> >>> anyone wanting to grab it and edit the information on any part of it -
>> >>> please, please. do, just point me back to an updated version when you
>> are
>> >>> done.
>> >>>
>> >>> Caution - if you want to successfully edit those you will need the
>> MPlus
>> >>> font, a

Re: OO4

[Rory O'Farrell]

On Wed, 04 Sep 2013 09:54:44 -0500
Doug  wrote:

> I uninstalled OO4 this morning, and installed a copy of OO3.4, instead. 
> 4Calc locks up, copies multiple images of portions of spreadsheets onto 
> the screen, changes formulas, and is generally non-dependable. I have 
> reported problems on the forum, but do not have time to follow up.
> How will I know when it is safe to return to the latest version of OO; 
> or, given my non-techie nature, should I stick with 3.4?
> 
> Doug W. Johnson
> 

No one can tell you for certain that any given revision of any program will run 
on _your_ computer, as _your_ computer is customised in a unique way to other 
computers and has a unique user (_you_). 

There will be a minor revision of OO4 (4.0.1) about the end of September 2013, 
which incorporates many fixes (including for Calc) and new laguages. If you 
want, download and try it when released, but it may well be that it will not 
run reliably on _your_ computer; in which case you should be prepared to revert 
to 3.4.1


-- 
Rory O'Farrell 

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org

Re: svn commit: r1519953 - in /openoffice/branches/l10n40/main/languages/source: af/ ar/ as/ ast/ be-BY/ bg/ bn/ bo/ br/ brx/ bs/ ca-XV/ ca/ cs/ cy/ da/ de/ dgo/ dz/ el/ en-AU/ en-GB/ en-ZA/ eo/ es/ e

[janI]

On 4 September 2013 17:10, Herbert Duerr  wrote:

> On 04.09.2013 16:13, janI wrote:
>
>> On 4 September 2013 13:59, Herbert Duerr  wrote:
>>
>>  On 04.09.2013 11:15, j...@apache.org wrote:
>>>
>>>  Author: jani
 Date: Wed Sep  4 09:13:51 2013
 New Revision: 1519953

 URL: http://svn.apache.org/r1519953
 Log:
 update to UTF-8


>>> Great, thanks! And kudos to Tsutomu too!
>>>
>>> But I noticed that in the l10n40 branch the *.po files of all languages
>>> are checked in amidst the main source code in the main/languages
>>> directory.
>>> Wouldn't it be better to keep all these 600 megabytes of localization
>>> data
>>> separate, e.g. in extras/ where it used to be?
>>>
>>>
>> In my opinion po files are just as much source as any other part of main,
>> and not something extra.
>>
>> When using the argument "extra", we should move quit a lot of modules away
>> from main, since they are not compiled into our release (at least as far
>> as
>> what I can see).
>>
>
> Yes, I agree. A lot of modules belong into ext_libraries for example
> avmedia, beanshell, curl, epm, graphite, hyphen, jpeg, libpng, libxml2,
> libxmlsec, libxslt, lucene, moz, nss, openssl, python, redland, rhino,
> saxon, tomcat, vigra, zlib, ...
>
>
>  main/languages and main/l10ntools forms together with a couple of other
>> modules (like i18n( our integrated international part, The intention of
>> the
>> new toolset is to make a deeper integration and not push it further away.
>>
>
> In the example above with all the external modules we already have such a
> tight integration that simply moving them into ext_libraries is a
> non-trivial task. Our goal should not be to tighter integrate them into our
> codebase but to work towards using the off-the-shelf releases of them.
> Using them better with their published interfaces is a worthwhile goal.
>
> The localizations have a clearly defined tasks and they are huge. When
> major UI changes are underway they create heavy commit traffic. When
> researching the code history or when bisecting for regressions these
> commits cost extra time. And since we are considering to commit directly
> into the l10n repository from pootle this commit rate could increase by
> orders of magnitude.


I just wonder what would happen if we had as many developers equally active
as our translators, then the problem would be very much the same.

I have to ask very clearly; is the opinion of the community, that .po files
is not to be considered a vital/integrated part of our source tree and
should be moved away ? While at the same time accepting (at least for now),
that modules as mentioned above remain in our source tree and disturb
developers.

If the .po files are considered inferior, and disturbing, I will of course
not try to make an automated workflow that depend on integration.

rgds
jan I.

>
>
> Herbert
>
> --**--**-
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: 
> dev-unsubscribe@openoffice.**apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
>
>

Re: svn commit: r1519953 - in /openoffice/branches/l10n40/main/languages/source: af/ ar/ as/ ast/ be-BY/ bg/ bn/ bo/ br/ brx/ bs/ ca-XV/ ca/ cs/ cy/ da/ de/ dgo/ dz/ el/ en-AU/ en-GB/ en-ZA/ eo/ es/ e

[Jürgen Schmidt]

On 9/4/13 5:56 PM, janI wrote:
> On 4 September 2013 17:10, Herbert Duerr  wrote:
> 
>> On 04.09.2013 16:13, janI wrote:
>>
>>> On 4 September 2013 13:59, Herbert Duerr  wrote:
>>>
>>>  On 04.09.2013 11:15, j...@apache.org wrote:

  Author: jani
> Date: Wed Sep  4 09:13:51 2013
> New Revision: 1519953
>
> URL: http://svn.apache.org/r1519953
> Log:
> update to UTF-8
>
>
 Great, thanks! And kudos to Tsutomu too!

 But I noticed that in the l10n40 branch the *.po files of all languages
 are checked in amidst the main source code in the main/languages
 directory.
 Wouldn't it be better to keep all these 600 megabytes of localization
 data
 separate, e.g. in extras/ where it used to be?


>>> In my opinion po files are just as much source as any other part of main,
>>> and not something extra.
>>>
>>> When using the argument "extra", we should move quit a lot of modules away
>>> from main, since they are not compiled into our release (at least as far
>>> as
>>> what I can see).
>>>
>>
>> Yes, I agree. A lot of modules belong into ext_libraries for example
>> avmedia, beanshell, curl, epm, graphite, hyphen, jpeg, libpng, libxml2,
>> libxmlsec, libxslt, lucene, moz, nss, openssl, python, redland, rhino,
>> saxon, tomcat, vigra, zlib, ...
>>
>>
>>  main/languages and main/l10ntools forms together with a couple of other
>>> modules (like i18n( our integrated international part, The intention of
>>> the
>>> new toolset is to make a deeper integration and not push it further away.
>>>
>>
>> In the example above with all the external modules we already have such a
>> tight integration that simply moving them into ext_libraries is a
>> non-trivial task. Our goal should not be to tighter integrate them into our
>> codebase but to work towards using the off-the-shelf releases of them.
>> Using them better with their published interfaces is a worthwhile goal.
>>
>> The localizations have a clearly defined tasks and they are huge. When
>> major UI changes are underway they create heavy commit traffic. When
>> researching the code history or when bisecting for regressions these
>> commits cost extra time. And since we are considering to commit directly
>> into the l10n repository from pootle this commit rate could increase by
>> orders of magnitude.
> 
> 
> I just wonder what would happen if we had as many developers equally active
> as our translators, then the problem would be very much the same.
> 
> I have to ask very clearly; is the opinion of the community, that .po files
> is not to be considered a vital/integrated part of our source tree and
> should be moved away ? While at the same time accepting (at least for now),
> that modules as mentioned above remain in our source tree and disturb
> developers.

this question is obsolete and we all agree that the translations are
essential as everything else in the code. We just gave you an example of
a typical workflow and it becomes potentially better with smaller po
files compared to 1 big sdf file per language.

And the modules you have mentioned are completely different and we can
of course discuss to remove them or store them in a different place. As
always somebody has to do the work and it is often not only a simple remove.

> 
> If the .po files are considered inferior, and disturbing, I will of course
> not try to make an automated workflow that depend on integration.

We just discuss what's better and we have at the moment different
opinions. It's not an either or it's just seeking for the best approach
to make all happy and to find the best solution.

If we can define and ensure an automated workflow with continue
integration of translation I am fine and happy with it. But if it breaks
the build on a regular basis I am not.

And by the way I believe an automated workflow can be achieved in
different ways. And having the po files not in main but for example in
extras don't change this. Or maybe you have something in mind that we
don't see or understand at the moment. But we are interested to learn
and hear more ...

Juergen

> 
> rgds
> jan I.
> 
>>
>>
>> Herbert
>>
>> --**--**-
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: 
>> dev-unsubscribe@openoffice.**apache.org
>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
>>
>>
> 


-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org

Re: svn commit: r1519953 - in /openoffice/branches/l10n40/main/languages/source: af/ ar/ as/ ast/ be-BY/ bg/ bn/ bo/ br/ brx/ bs/ ca-XV/ ca/ cs/ cy/ da/ de/ dgo/ dz/ el/ en-AU/ en-GB/ en-ZA/ eo/ es/ e

[janI]

On 4 September 2013 16:21, Jürgen Schmidt  wrote:

> On 9/4/13 4:13 PM, janI wrote:
> > On 4 September 2013 13:59, Herbert Duerr  wrote:
> >
> >> On 04.09.2013 11:15, j...@apache.org wrote:
> >>
> >>> Author: jani
> >>> Date: Wed Sep  4 09:13:51 2013
> >>> New Revision: 1519953
> >>>
> >>> URL: http://svn.apache.org/r1519953
> >>> Log:
> >>> update to UTF-8
> >>>
> >>
> >> Great, thanks! And kudos to Tsutomu too!
> >>
> >> But I noticed that in the l10n40 branch the *.po files of all languages
> >> are checked in amidst the main source code in the main/languages
> directory.
> >> Wouldn't it be better to keep all these 600 megabytes of localization
> data
> >> separate, e.g. in extras/ where it used to be?
> >>
> >
> > In my opinion po files are just as much source as any other part of main,
> > and not something extra.
> >
> > When using the argument "extra", we should move quit a lot of modules
> away
> > from main, since they are not compiled into our release (at least as far
> as
> > what I can see).
> >
> > main/languages and main/l10ntools forms together with a couple of other
> > modules (like i18n( our integrated international part, The intention of
> the
> > new toolset is to make a deeper integration and not push it further away.
> >
>
> That's fine but po files can be seen nevertheless a little bit different
> because they contain the translated data.
>
> I believe the main argument is that you can better split the source and
> the default for developers is to build en-US only. Why checking out 600
> MB if I don't build it at all? But this is probably an implementation
> detail only and can be changed at any time n demand.
>

If people dont want to do a checkout both svn and git offers ignore
possibilities.

But I cannot see a stable build enviroment, that detect if "extras" is
downloaded and at same revision as the sources, thats an interesting
challenge.

dont forget that our sources (at least .src, .xhp etc) are tightly
connected to the .pot files in templates, which again are tightly connected
to our .po files. To me this a lot more than an implementation detail, its
a matter of how the build system works. Even a en-US developer, should run
"build --genPO" to verify that the strings marked for translation are valid
for translation.

I dont have a apple macbook, so I dont like to check out the modules for
apple and we can continue like that. It boils down to one simple question
"Do we have 1 product, or a main product (en-US, with/without apple) with a
number of inferior parts" "

My opinion is clear, we have 1 product, and all our sources needed to build
a release (excluding third party, since its not our sources) should be kept
within main. For that reason I continue integrating genLang with languages
in main in the l10n40 branch.

We will of course sometime in the future discuss it l10n40 is something we
want in trunk and if not it will not be merged.



>
> And if we have many more things that are not used at all we should think
> about removing them.
>

mwiki extension, Crashrep, reportbuilder, javainstaller2 are the ones I
remember, when I integrated --genPO in build.pl, I found about 15 modules
that are not build in either windows/ubuntu releases.

rgds
jan I.


> Juergen
>
>
>
> > rgds
> > jan I.
> >
> >
> >> Herbert
> >>
> >>
> --**--**-
> >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@openoffice.**apache.org<
> dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org>
> >> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
> >>
> >>
> >
>
>
> -
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
>
>

Re: svn commit: r1519953 - in /openoffice/branches/l10n40/main/languages/source: af/ ar/ as/ ast/ be-BY/ bg/ bn/ bo/ br/ brx/ bs/ ca-XV/ ca/ cs/ cy/ da/ de/ dgo/ dz/ el/ en-AU/ en-GB/ en-ZA/ eo/ es/ e

[Herbert Duerr]

On 04.09.2013 16:13, janI wrote:

On 4 September 2013 13:59, Herbert Duerr  wrote:


On 04.09.2013 11:15, j...@apache.org wrote:


Author: jani
Date: Wed Sep  4 09:13:51 2013
New Revision: 1519953

URL: http://svn.apache.org/r1519953
Log:
update to UTF-8



Great, thanks! And kudos to Tsutomu too!

But I noticed that in the l10n40 branch the *.po files of all languages
are checked in amidst the main source code in the main/languages directory.
Wouldn't it be better to keep all these 600 megabytes of localization data
separate, e.g. in extras/ where it used to be?



In my opinion po files are just as much source as any other part of main,
and not something extra.

When using the argument "extra", we should move quit a lot of modules away
from main, since they are not compiled into our release (at least as far as
what I can see).


Yes, I agree. A lot of modules belong into ext_libraries for example
avmedia, beanshell, curl, epm, graphite, hyphen, jpeg, libpng, libxml2, 
libxmlsec, libxslt, lucene, moz, nss, openssl, python, redland, rhino, 
saxon, tomcat, vigra, zlib, ...



main/languages and main/l10ntools forms together with a couple of other
modules (like i18n( our integrated international part, The intention of the
new toolset is to make a deeper integration and not push it further away.


In the example above with all the external modules we already have such 
a tight integration that simply moving them into ext_libraries is a 
non-trivial task. Our goal should not be to tighter integrate them into 
our codebase but to work towards using the off-the-shelf releases of 
them. Using them better with their published interfaces is a worthwhile 
goal.


The localizations have a clearly defined tasks and they are huge. When 
major UI changes are underway they create heavy commit traffic. When 
researching the code history or when bisecting for regressions these 
commits cost extra time. And since we are considering to commit directly 
into the l10n repository from pootle this commit rate could increase by 
orders of magnitude.


Herbert

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org

Re: svn commit: r1519953 - in /openoffice/branches/l10n40/main/languages/source: af/ ar/ as/ ast/ be-BY/ bg/ bn/ bo/ br/ brx/ bs/ ca-XV/ ca/ cs/ cy/ da/ de/ dgo/ dz/ el/ en-AU/ en-GB/ en-ZA/ eo/ es/ e

[Jürgen Schmidt]

On 9/4/13 4:13 PM, janI wrote:
> On 4 September 2013 13:59, Herbert Duerr  wrote:
> 
>> On 04.09.2013 11:15, j...@apache.org wrote:
>>
>>> Author: jani
>>> Date: Wed Sep  4 09:13:51 2013
>>> New Revision: 1519953
>>>
>>> URL: http://svn.apache.org/r1519953
>>> Log:
>>> update to UTF-8
>>>
>>
>> Great, thanks! And kudos to Tsutomu too!
>>
>> But I noticed that in the l10n40 branch the *.po files of all languages
>> are checked in amidst the main source code in the main/languages directory.
>> Wouldn't it be better to keep all these 600 megabytes of localization data
>> separate, e.g. in extras/ where it used to be?
>>
> 
> In my opinion po files are just as much source as any other part of main,
> and not something extra.
> 
> When using the argument "extra", we should move quit a lot of modules away
> from main, since they are not compiled into our release (at least as far as
> what I can see).
> 
> main/languages and main/l10ntools forms together with a couple of other
> modules (like i18n( our integrated international part, The intention of the
> new toolset is to make a deeper integration and not push it further away.
> 

That's fine but po files can be seen nevertheless a little bit different
because they contain the translated data.

I believe the main argument is that you can better split the source and
the default for developers is to build en-US only. Why checking out 600
MB if I don't build it at all? But this is probably an implementation
detail only and can be changed at any time n demand.

And if we have many more things that are not used at all we should think
about removing them.

Juergen



> rgds
> jan I.
> 
> 
>> Herbert
>>
>> --**--**-
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: 
>> dev-unsubscribe@openoffice.**apache.org
>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
>>
>>
> 


-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org

Re: svn commit: r1519953 - in /openoffice/branches/l10n40/main/languages/source: af/ ar/ as/ ast/ be-BY/ bg/ bn/ bo/ br/ brx/ bs/ ca-XV/ ca/ cs/ cy/ da/ de/ dgo/ dz/ el/ en-AU/ en-GB/ en-ZA/ eo/ es/ e

[janI]

On 4 September 2013 13:59, Herbert Duerr  wrote:

> On 04.09.2013 11:15, j...@apache.org wrote:
>
>> Author: jani
>> Date: Wed Sep  4 09:13:51 2013
>> New Revision: 1519953
>>
>> URL: http://svn.apache.org/r1519953
>> Log:
>> update to UTF-8
>>
>
> Great, thanks! And kudos to Tsutomu too!
>
> But I noticed that in the l10n40 branch the *.po files of all languages
> are checked in amidst the main source code in the main/languages directory.
> Wouldn't it be better to keep all these 600 megabytes of localization data
> separate, e.g. in extras/ where it used to be?
>

In my opinion po files are just as much source as any other part of main,
and not something extra.

When using the argument "extra", we should move quit a lot of modules away
from main, since they are not compiled into our release (at least as far as
what I can see).

main/languages and main/l10ntools forms together with a couple of other
modules (like i18n( our integrated international part, The intention of the
new toolset is to make a deeper integration and not push it further away.

rgds
jan I.


> Herbert
>
> --**--**-
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: 
> dev-unsubscribe@openoffice.**apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
>
>

Re: svn commit: r1519953 - in /openoffice/branches/l10n40/main/languages/source: af/ ar/ as/ ast/ be-BY/ bg/ bn/ bo/ br/ brx/ bs/ ca-XV/ ca/ cs/ cy/ da/ de/ dgo/ dz/ el/ en-AU/ en-GB/ en-ZA/ eo/ es/ e

[Herbert Duerr]

On 04.09.2013 11:15, j...@apache.org wrote:

Author: jani
Date: Wed Sep  4 09:13:51 2013
New Revision: 1519953

URL: http://svn.apache.org/r1519953
Log:
update to UTF-8


Great, thanks! And kudos to Tsutomu too!

But I noticed that in the l10n40 branch the *.po files of all languages 
are checked in amidst the main source code in the main/languages 
directory. Wouldn't it be better to keep all these 600 megabytes of 
localization data separate, e.g. in extras/ where it used to be?


Herbert

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org

Re: Archives FTP: missing versions

[FR web forum]

>(so they are still there, but in the "files" directory)
>I know it's a mess. Suggestions on how to further improve
Not possible to move files/.../3.4.x to previous location?


-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org

Re: Reporting a problem with the OpenOffice website

[Alexandro Colorado]

Which browser and version of it are you using?


On Wed, Sep 4, 2013 at 2:17 AM, Ömer Erduran wrote:

> Dear Sir/Madame;
>
> I am trying to download openoffice but there is a problem in website. When
> i click download it redirects me to new website ( but still name is same )
> and i can not start download.
>
> Best Regards
>
> --
> ÖMER ERDURAN
>
>
> RAN MATBAACILIK
> AMB.SAN.TİC.LTD.ŞTİ
> 100 Yıl Mah. Matbaacılar ve Ambalajcılar San. Sit.
> 3. Cadde No:191/1 Bağcılar / İstanbul - TÜRKİYE
> +90 212 237 26 45
> +90 535 350 14 23
>
>
> --**--**-
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: 
> dev-unsubscribe@openoffice.**apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
>
>


-- 
Alexandro Colorado
Apache OpenOffice Contributor
http://www.openoffice.org

Re: Reporting a problem with the OpenOffice website

[Rory O'Farrell]

On Wed, 4 Sep 2013 10:17:49 +0300
Ömer Erduran  wrote:

> Dear Sir/Madame;
> 
> I am trying to download openoffice but there is a problem in website. 
> When i click download it redirects me to new website ( but still name is 
> same ) and i can not start download.
> 
> Best Regards
> 
> -- 
> ÖMER ERDURAN
> 
There is a Java problem with some browsers, in process of being fixed. Try this 
direct link instead 
http://www.openoffice.org/download/other.html


-- 
Rory O'Farrell 

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org

Reporting a problem with the OpenOffice website

[Ömer Erduran]

Dear Sir/Madame;

I am trying to download openoffice but there is a problem in website. 
When i click download it redirects me to new website ( but still name is 
same ) and i can not start download.


Best Regards

--
ÖMER ERDURAN


RAN MATBAACILIK
AMB.SAN.TİC.LTD.ŞTİ
100 Yıl Mah. Matbaacılar ve Ambalajcılar San. Sit.
3. Cadde No:191/1 Bağcılar / İstanbul - TÜRKİYE
+90 212 237 26 45
+90 535 350 14 23


-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org

Re: Archives FTP: missing versions

[Andrea Pescetti]

FR web forum wrote:

http://www.openoffice.org/download/archive.html

OK but I still not found 3.4 in:
http://archive.apache.org/dist/incubator/ooo/localized/fr/


Due to the layout change, you find the French 3.4.x versions under
http://archive.apache.org/dist/incubator/ooo/files/localized/fr/
(so they are still there, but in the "files" directory)

I know it's a mess. Suggestions on how to further improve
http://www.openoffice.org/download/archive.html
are welcome; for the other resources, like the mirrors, we don't have 
direct access, so adding notices there is more difficult.


Regards,
  Andrea.

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org

Re: Archives FTP: missing versions

[Max Merbald]

Hello Andrea,

what about putting a link to the latter page into the first? How would 
people otherwise know where to look with a variation of possible 
locations? The whole system seems to be very difficult and cramped. Best 
would be to put all into one place.


Max


Am 04.09.2013 09:25, schrieb Andrea Pescetti:

FR web forum wrote:

ftp://archive.services.openoffice.org/pub/openoffice-archive/
Latest versions 3.3 and 3.4 are missing
Is it possible to add it?


Not there. We have them in the Apache archive. Always use
http://www.openoffice.org/download/archive.html
as a reference. This will send you to the right archive for your needs.

Regards,
  Andrea.

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org





-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org

Re: Archives FTP: missing versions

[FR web forum]

>Not there. We have them in the Apache archive. Always use
>http://www.openoffice.org/download/archive.html
>as a reference. This will send you to the right archive for your needs.
OK but I still not found 3.4 in:
http://archive.apache.org/dist/incubator/ooo/localized/fr/

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org

Re: Archives FTP: missing versions

[Andrea Pescetti]

FR web forum wrote:

ftp://archive.services.openoffice.org/pub/openoffice-archive/
Latest versions 3.3 and 3.4 are missing
Is it possible to add it?


Not there. We have them in the Apache archive. Always use
http://www.openoffice.org/download/archive.html
as a reference. This will send you to the right archive for your needs.

Regards,
  Andrea.

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org

Re: Building comphelper

[Herbert Duerr]

On 03.09.2013 18:10, Steele, Raymond wrote:

Anyone?  This seems to pertain to the GNU bug described here since mathconf.h 
included in the AOO source has a comment about it.

http://gcc.gnu.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=14608


In case you missed my replies to your questions please see 
http://markmail.org/thread/5gnsk7hmehxfdthx


Herbert

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org