On 06/20/2011 07:22 PM, Paul Wouters wrote:
On Fri, 17 Jun 2011, Rahul Sundaram wrote:
GNOME 3 menu has categories in the right as well but in any case, the
common apps are in the dash and using a keyboard with a search as you
type interface isn't the same as using bash. Let us not be
On Mon, Jun 20, 2011 at 01:22:25PM -0400, Paul Wouters wrote:
gnome3 was not driven by user feedbak. It was driven by getting vendors
to install it on factory shipped netbooks.
Latter is not true.
--
Regards,
Olav
--
devel mailing list
devel@lists.fedoraproject.org
On Fri, 17 Jun 2011, Evandro Giovanini wrote:
I'm not really sure I get what you're asking for here. GNOME 3 does have
the classic (Win95-like) design installed by default and all you have
to do is enable fallback mode in order to use it.
1) I was not aware of classic mode, it was clearly not
On Fri, 17 Jun 2011, Rahul Sundaram wrote:
GNOME 3 menu has categories in the right as well but in any case, the
common apps are in the dash and using a keyboard with a search as you
type interface isn't the same as using bash. Let us not be dramatic.
With Everything missing, most of it
On 06/20/2011 01:22 PM, Paul Wouters wrote:
...
gnome3 was not driven by user feedbak. It was driven by getting vendors
to install it on factory shipped netbooks.
Perhaps, tho I suspect Android won that market already ... but perhaps
its worth a shot, things can change.
Again, I'm
On Sat, Jun 18, 2011 at 9:51 PM, Adam Williamson awill...@redhat.com wrote:
Probably not, but I wouldn't say they're equivalent. I don't think many
people expect their desktop to have a screen recorder built in. I can't
think of any other desktop that _does_. When I said Shell was fully
mouse
On Mon, 2011-06-20 at 11:40 +1000, Peter Hutterer wrote:
Remember how long it took for git to get from hated, complicated,
I-dont-know-how-to-use-it thingamagic to best thing since sliced bread?
I'll let you know when I finally figure out how to use it ;)
--
Adam Williamson
Fedora QA
On Mon, 2011-06-20 at 13:22 -0400, Paul Wouters wrote:
gnome3 was not driven by user feedbak. It was driven by getting vendors
to install it on factory shipped netbooks.
ooh! another conspiracy theory for the collection! (takes note)
--
Adam Williamson
Fedora QA Community Monkey
IRC: adamw |
On Fri, Jun 17, 2011 at 11:55:52AM +0200, Ralf Corsepius wrote:
On 06/17/2011 11:36 AM, Vít Ondruch wrote:
Dne 17.6.2011 11:14, Ralf Corsepius napsal(a):
On 06/17/2011 10:56 AM, Kevin Kofler wrote:
Adam Williamson wrote:
This is a common misapprehension, but it's not true. The reason for
On 06/17/2011 11:36 PM, Evandro Giovanini wrote:
those who are want to rewrite/modify GNOME3.
No, I'm not. There are several working extensions *today*, I'm simply
suggesting that people not 100% satisfied with the default GNOME 3
experience go out there and experiment with them.
It's
On Fri, Jun 17, 2011 at 8:29 AM, Adam Williamson awill...@redhat.com wrote:
For more 'advanced' users, the keyboard shortcuts are there, and you're
probably going to want to use them if you don't want to gnaw your own
legs off out of boredom. No, they're not particularly discoverable: it's
On Sat, 2011-06-18 at 08:42 -0800, Jeff Spaleta wrote:
On Fri, Jun 17, 2011 at 8:29 AM, Adam Williamson awill...@redhat.com wrote:
For more 'advanced' users, the keyboard shortcuts are there, and you're
probably going to want to use them if you don't want to gnaw your own
legs off out of
On Sat, Jun 18, 2011 at 9:55 AM, Adam Williamson awill...@redhat.com wrote:
That's a pretty unique example. It's really not core desktop
functionality; it's an easter egg, really. I think it was initially put
in purely for the use of GNOME PR / documentation people, and left in
because it
On Sat, 2011-06-18 at 10:00 -0800, Jeff Spaleta wrote:
Just to be clear, eould you also consider the binding the Prnt Scrn
labeled keyboard key to the screenshot took as non-core easter egg
functionality?
Probably not, but I wouldn't say they're equivalent. I don't think many
people expect
Adam Williamson wrote:
This is a common misapprehension, but it's not true. The reason for the
large icon grid is actually that the developers did real world user
research (yes, really!) and found that many people had significant
trouble navigating the typical Windows / GNOME 2 nested menu
Am 17.06.2011 03:59, schrieb Adam Williamson:
On Tue, 2011-06-14 at 01:19 +0200, Henrik Wejdmark wrote:
My impression is that GNOME3 is trying to compete with Android and FrontRow,
but have forgotten all of us who still uses desktops/laptops. We don't have
touch screens yet
The
On 06/17/2011 10:56 AM, Kevin Kofler wrote:
Adam Williamson wrote:
This is a common misapprehension, but it's not true. The reason for the
large icon grid is actually that the developers did real world user
research (yes, really!) and found that many people had significant
trouble navigating
Dne 17.6.2011 11:14, Ralf Corsepius napsal(a):
On 06/17/2011 10:56 AM, Kevin Kofler wrote:
Adam Williamson wrote:
This is a common misapprehension, but it's not true. The reason for the
large icon grid is actually that the developers did real world user
research (yes, really!) and found that
On 06/17/2011 11:36 AM, Vít Ondruch wrote:
Dne 17.6.2011 11:14, Ralf Corsepius napsal(a):
On 06/17/2011 10:56 AM, Kevin Kofler wrote:
Adam Williamson wrote:
This is a common misapprehension, but it's not true. The reason for the
large icon grid is actually that the developers did real world
The workflow is:
1) Move the mouse to the to left corner (move is enough, you don't have to
click. You even can drag and drop through activities, so learn to not
click
there.)
2) Type on the keyboard few character of the application name you want to
run, e.g. cal and on your screen will be
On 06/17/2011 02:26 PM, Kevin Kofler wrote:
Adam Williamson wrote:
This is a common misapprehension, but it's not true. The reason for the
large icon grid is actually that the developers did real world user
research (yes, really!) and found that many people had significant
trouble navigating
Dne 17.6.2011 11:57, Henrik Wejdmark napsal(a):
The workflow is:
1) Move the mouse to the to left corner (move is enough, you don't have to
click. You even can drag and drop through activities, so learn to not
click
there.)
2) Type on the keyboard few character of the application name you
Since you recommend not using the application menu, in other words,
you agree that the application menu is useless?
It is useful when you are looking for something and you don't know what
exactly it is. In that case, it is much much better then the previous
menus,
because you have nice
On 06/17/2011 03:50 PM, Henrik Wejdmark wrote:
On my desktop it's not on one page, it's a mile long listing so you get no
overview at all. In Gnome2 at least all the apps are categorized. If the
graphical user interface _requires_ you to use the keyboard to type the
command it has failed it's
On 06/17/2011 12:16 PM, Vít Ondruch wrote:
Dne 17.6.2011 11:57, Henrik Wejdmark napsal(a):
It is useful when you are looking for something and you don't know what
exactly it is. In that case, it is much much better then the previous
menus, because you have nice overview on one page and
GNOME 3 menu has categories in the right as well but in any case, the
common apps are in the dash and using a keyboard with a search as you type
interface isn't the same as using bash. Let us not be dramatic.
Rahul
As has been stated earlier in this thread, having the hot spot in the top
Em Sex, 2011-06-17 às 11:55 +0200, Ralf Corsepius escreveu:
On 06/17/2011 11:36 AM, Vít Ondruch wrote:
Dne 17.6.2011 11:14, Ralf Corsepius napsal(a):
On 06/17/2011 10:56 AM, Kevin Kofler wrote:
Adam Williamson wrote:
This is a common misapprehension, but it's not true. The reason for the
On Fri, 2011-06-17 at 15:50 +0530, Rahul Sundaram wrote:
On 06/17/2011 03:50 PM, Henrik Wejdmark wrote:
On my desktop it's not on one page, it's a mile long listing so you get no
overview at all. In Gnome2 at least all the apps are categorized. If the
graphical user interface _requires_ you
On Fri, 2011-06-17 at 12:20 +0200, Henrik Wejdmark wrote:
Since you recommend not using the application menu, in other words,
you agree that the application menu is useless?
It is useful when you are looking for something and you don't know what
exactly it is. In that case, it is
On 06/17/2011 03:59 PM, Henrik Wejdmark wrote:
As has been stated earlier in this thread, having the hot spot in the top
left corner and categories far right causes a lot of mouse movements. Common
apps in the dash only opens the first instance, after that it switches to
the existing instance,
On Fri, Jun 17, 2011 at 06:48:14PM +0800, Mathieu Bridon wrote:
On Fri, 2011-06-17 at 12:20 +0200, Henrik Wejdmark wrote:
Since you recommend not using the application menu, in other words,
you agree that the application menu is useless?
It is useful when you are looking for
Dne 17.6.2011 12:29, Ralf Corsepius napsal(a):
On 06/17/2011 12:16 PM, Vít Ondruch wrote:
Dne 17.6.2011 11:57, Henrik Wejdmark napsal(a):
It is useful when you are looking for something and you don't know what
exactly it is. In that case, it is much much better then the previous
menus,
On 06/17/2011 01:02 PM, Richard W.M. Jones wrote:
On Fri, Jun 17, 2011 at 06:48:14PM +0800, Mathieu Bridon wrote:
On Fri, 2011-06-17 at 12:20 +0200, Henrik Wejdmark wrote:
Since you recommend not using the application menu, in other words,
you agree that the application menu is useless?
It
On 06/17/2011 12:48 PM, Mathieu Bridon wrote:
On Fri, 2011-06-17 at 12:20 +0200, Henrik Wejdmark wrote:
You can search for bro and among the results will be Nautilus and
Firefox (hint: Gnome Shell also searches in the application description,
and both are browsers).
A keyword search is
On 17/06/11 12:17, Dennis Jacobfeuerborn wrote:
On 06/17/2011 01:02 PM, Richard W.M. Jones wrote:
I can't believe real usability testing was done on the final version
of GNOME 3. I keep hearing about all these completely undiscoverable
keyboard shortcuts that appear to be necessary to use
2011/6/17 Rahul Sundaram methe...@gmail.com:
On 06/17/2011 03:59 PM, Henrik Wejdmark wrote:
As has been stated earlier in this thread, having the hot spot in the top
left corner and categories far right causes a lot of mouse movements. Common
apps in the dash only opens the first instance,
Em Sex, 2011-06-17 às 13:43 +0200, Ralf Corsepius escreveu:
On 06/17/2011 12:48 PM, Mathieu Bridon wrote:
On Fri, 2011-06-17 at 12:20 +0200, Henrik Wejdmark wrote:
You can search for bro and among the results will be Nautilus and
Firefox (hint: Gnome Shell also searches in the application
* Domingo Becker [17/06/2011 14:21] :
Access through keyboard was something missing in previous GNOME. End
users go faster if they only use keyboard (of course, the program and
the desktop environment should be prepared for that).
Agreed. Before installing F15, I was sceptic about having to
On Fri, Jun 17, 2011 at 5:14 AM, Ralf Corsepius rc040...@freenet.de wrote:
With Gnome3 you 1stly have to tick on Applications (located left top
on the screen), then hit this tiny scroll bar located ca. 1 in/2cm left
of the right screen (not an easy task - Requires travelling almost the
whole
On Fri, Jun 17, 2011 at 09:01:57AM -0300, Evandro Giovanini wrote:
I would argue that simply typing a keyword related to the task you're
trying to perform is far more effective and easier to use than manually
browsing a long list of applications artificially categorized, specially
in this age
On 06/17/2011 02:53 PM, Jared K. Smith wrote:
On Fri, Jun 17, 2011 at 5:14 AM, Ralf Corsepiusrc040...@freenet.de wrote:
With Gnome3 you 1stly have to tick on Applications (located left top
on the screen), then hit this tiny scroll bar located ca. 1 in/2cm left
of the right screen (not an easy
On 06/17/2011 06:51 PM, Ralf Corsepius wrote:
... you mean by holy ghost intuition, feel tempted to press a key to
access a hidden feature, where once was a simple feature?
Alt+F1 which was the shortcut for accessing the menu still works. For
GUI users, they just hit the hot corner. For
On 06/17/2011 03:28 PM, Rahul Sundaram wrote:
On 06/17/2011 06:51 PM, Ralf Corsepius wrote:
... you mean by holy ghost intuition, feel tempted to press a key to
access a hidden feature, where once was a simple feature?
Alt+F1 which was the shortcut for accessing the menu still works. For
On 06/17/2011 07:08 PM, Ralf Corsepius wrote:
On 06/17/2011 03:28 PM, Rahul Sundaram wrote:
On 06/17/2011 06:51 PM, Ralf Corsepius wrote:
... you mean by holy ghost intuition, feel tempted to press a key to
access a hidden feature, where once was a simple feature?
Alt+F1 which was the
On Fri, Jun 17, 2011 at 5:21 AM, Ralf Corsepius rc040...@freenet.de wrote:
... you mean by holy ghost intuition, feel tempted to press a key to
access a hidden feature, where once was a simple feature?
The question really isn't whether or not to make use of the newer
keys. The real question is
On Fri, 17 Jun 2011 11:36:21 +0200
Vít Ondruch vondr...@redhat.com wrote:
So in conclusion it is not that surprising at the end, that W7 and G3
are pretty similar.
Tha's no excuse.
Also the icons are getting bigger on both
platforms.
Yes and the text labels are tiny. Most icons are
On Fri, 17 Jun 2011 19:33:18 +0900
夜神 岩男 supergiantpot...@yahoo.co.jp wrote:
Considering the frequent calls of Gnome 3 has failed at its task or
the GUI has failed if the user must makes me wonder: Where is
the task definition or specification against which the implementation
has
On Fri, Jun 17, 2011 at 3:59 AM, Adam Williamson awill...@redhat.com wrote:
On Tue, 2011-06-14 at 01:19 +0200, Henrik Wejdmark wrote:
My impression is that GNOME3 is trying to compete with Android and FrontRow,
but have forgotten all of us who still uses desktops/laptops. We don't have
touch
On Fri, 2011-06-17 at 10:04 -0400, Bernd Stramm wrote:
On Fri, 17 Jun 2011 19:33:18 +0900
夜神 岩男 supergiantpot...@yahoo.co.jp wrote:
Considering the frequent calls of Gnome 3 has failed at its task or
the GUI has failed if the user must makes me wonder: Where is
the task definition
On Fri, 2011-06-17 at 11:14 +0200, Ralf Corsepius wrote:
On 06/17/2011 10:56 AM, Kevin Kofler wrote:
Adam Williamson wrote:
This is a common misapprehension, but it's not true. The reason for the
large icon grid is actually that the developers did real world user
research (yes, really!)
On Fri, 2011-06-17 at 12:02 +0100, Richard W.M. Jones wrote:
You can search for bro and among the results will be Nautilus and
Firefox (hint: Gnome Shell also searches in the application description,
and both are browsers).
I can't believe real usability testing was done on the final
On Sat, 2011-06-18 at 00:30 +0900, 夜神 岩男 wrote:
On Fri, 2011-06-17 at 10:04 -0400, Bernd Stramm wrote:
On Fri, 17 Jun 2011 19:33:18 +0900
夜神 岩男 supergiantpot...@yahoo.co.jp wrote:
Considering the frequent calls of Gnome 3 has failed at its task or
the GUI has failed if the user
On Fri, 17 Jun 2011 09:44:45 -0700
Adam Williamson awill...@redhat.com wrote:
On Sat, 2011-06-18 at 00:30 +0900, 夜神 岩男 wrote:
On Fri, 2011-06-17 at 10:04 -0400, Bernd Stramm wrote:
On Fri, 17 Jun 2011 19:33:18 +0900
夜神 岩男 supergiantpot...@yahoo.co.jp wrote:
Considering the
On Fri, Jun 17, 2011 at 7:53 AM, Domingo Becker domingobec...@gmail.com wrote:
The shortest way is by using keyboard, as Rahul says:
1. Press the key between Ctrl and Alt.
2. Type in what you search, at least the first letters. After that,
some icons are shown and you may use up and down
On 06/17/2011 06:21 PM, Adam Williamson wrote:
On Fri, 2011-06-17 at 11:14 +0200, Ralf Corsepius wrote:
On 06/17/2011 10:56 AM, Kevin Kofler wrote:
Adam Williamson wrote:
This is a common misapprehension, but it's not true. The reason for the
large icon grid is actually that the developers
On Fri, Jun 17, 2011 at 11:43, Adam Williamson awill...@redhat.com wrote:
Currently, when I open the giant application grid, I get oversized
meaningless pictures (yes, oversized - to even see the grid I had to
click on the Applications label, which is much smaller than the
icons),
Yeah, I
On Fri, 2011-06-17 at 19:09 +0200, Ralf Corsepius wrote:
You can also of course use wheel scroll, or the trackpad
equivalent.
My netbook doesn't have any such device - Just a simple touchpad and 2
buttons. No mouse, no wheel, no fancy buttons.
The 'trackpad equivalent' is usually either
Rahul Sundaram wrote:
I wonder why you recommend solutions you can't even get used to. In
terms of usability, it is not clear to me kickoff is doing a better job
at all. It is a rather convoluted way of organizing menu items and I
had to switch it off and use the classic menu instead. I
On Fri, Jun 17, 2011 at 01:05:08PM -0400, Bernd Stramm wrote:
I think it fails on #1:
Makes it easy for users to focus on their current task and reduces
distraction and interruption
First, this point assumes that there is *one* current task. That is not
how I work. I have one main
On Fri, 2011-06-17 at 13:05 -0400, Bernd Stramm wrote:
It all looks very pretty though.
Maybe someone can answer this...
All of the fade and animation effects that a lot of the
toolkits/desktops are using these days seem like they're making the
responsiveness substantially worse. I'm not
On Fri, 17 Jun 2011 14:02:14 -0400
Casey Dahlin cdah...@redhat.com wrote:
On Fri, Jun 17, 2011 at 01:05:08PM -0400, Bernd Stramm wrote:
I think it fails on #1:
Makes it easy for users to focus on their current task and reduces
distraction and interruption
First, this point
On Fri, Jun 17, 2011 at 12:02, Casey Dahlin cdah...@redhat.com wrote:
On Fri, Jun 17, 2011 at 01:05:08PM -0400, Bernd Stramm wrote:
I think it fails on #1:
Makes it easy for users to focus on their current task and reduces
distraction and interruption
First, this point assumes that there
Em Sex, 2011-06-17 às 19:33 +0200, Kevin Kofler escreveu:
Rahul Sundaram wrote:
I wonder why you recommend solutions you can't even get used to. In
terms of usability, it is not clear to me kickoff is doing a better job
at all. It is a rather convoluted way of organizing menu items and I
On Fri, Jun 17, 2011 at 02:12:54PM -0400, Bernd Stramm wrote:
One could do that, but that would be an idiotic thing to do. So one
doesn't.
Its what you said. You explicitly want to divide your attention between
multiple tasks. GNOME shell is for people who don't want to do that.
--CJD
--
On Fri, 17 Jun 2011 14:25:53 -0400
Casey Dahlin cdah...@redhat.com wrote:
On Fri, Jun 17, 2011 at 02:12:54PM -0400, Bernd Stramm wrote:
One could do that, but that would be an idiotic thing to do. So one
doesn't.
Its what you said. You explicitly want to divide your attention
between
On Fri, 17 Jun 2011 12:16:46 -0600
Stephen John Smoogen smo...@gmail.com wrote:
On Fri, Jun 17, 2011 at 12:02, Casey Dahlin cdah...@redhat.com
wrote:
On Fri, Jun 17, 2011 at 01:05:08PM -0400, Bernd Stramm wrote:
I think it fails on #1:
Makes it easy for users to focus on their
On Fri, Jun 17, 2011 at 12:34, Bernd Stramm bernd.str...@gmail.com wrote:
On Fri, 17 Jun 2011 12:16:46 -0600
Stephen John Smoogen smo...@gmail.com wrote:
On Fri, Jun 17, 2011 at 12:02, Casey Dahlin cdah...@redhat.com
wrote:
On Fri, Jun 17, 2011 at 01:05:08PM -0400, Bernd Stramm wrote:
I
On Fri, Jun 17, 2011 at 02:32:12PM -0400, Bernd Stramm wrote:
So Gnome Shell is not for a good many of the people who had been using
Gnome before that.
YES! I don't know why more people don't realize this: GNOME 2 was a
mediocre interface for a lot of people. It COULD NOT be a good interface
On Fri, 17 Jun 2011 12:41:21 -0600
Stephen John Smoogen smo...@gmail.com wrote:
On Fri, Jun 17, 2011 at 12:34, Bernd Stramm bernd.str...@gmail.com
wrote:
On Fri, 17 Jun 2011 12:16:46 -0600
Stephen John Smoogen smo...@gmail.com wrote:
On Fri, Jun 17, 2011 at 12:02, Casey Dahlin
On Fri, 2011-06-17 at 09:44 -0700, Adam Williamson wrote:
On Sat, 2011-06-18 at 00:30 +0900, 夜神 岩男 wrote:
On Fri, 2011-06-17 at 10:04 -0400, Bernd Stramm wrote:
On Fri, 17 Jun 2011 19:33:18 +0900
夜神 岩男 supergiantpot...@yahoo.co.jp wrote:
Considering the frequent calls of Gnome
On Fri, 17 Jun 2011 14:47:38 -0400
Casey Dahlin cdah...@redhat.com wrote:
On Fri, Jun 17, 2011 at 02:32:12PM -0400, Bernd Stramm wrote:
So Gnome Shell is not for a good many of the people who had been
using Gnome before that.
YES! I don't know why more people don't realize this: GNOME
Evandro Giovanini wrote:
Just curious, did you try any extensions when you played with GNOME 3?
No. I gave it 2 minutes at most, so no time to try any extensions. ;-)
Kevin Kofler
--
devel mailing list
devel@lists.fedoraproject.org
Em Sex, 2011-06-17 às 15:21 -0400, Bernd Stramm escreveu:
On Fri, 17 Jun 2011 14:47:38 -0400
Casey Dahlin cdah...@redhat.com wrote:
On Fri, Jun 17, 2011 at 02:32:12PM -0400, Bernd Stramm wrote:
So Gnome Shell is not for a good many of the people who had been
using Gnome before that.
Perhaps the Gnome3 way of thinking is that calling up an additional
application constitutes starting a new task in the work flow, so that
the big interruption happens anyway. I don't think that is a good
assumption for the design of a DE.
This is the sort of criticism that grants a clear
On Fri, 17 Jun 2011 19:46:46 -0300
Evandro Giovanini efgiovan...@gmail.com wrote:
Em Sex, 2011-06-17 às 15:21 -0400, Bernd Stramm escreveu:
On Fri, 17 Jun 2011 14:47:38 -0400
Casey Dahlin cdah...@redhat.com wrote:
On Fri, Jun 17, 2011 at 02:32:12PM -0400, Bernd Stramm wrote:
So
On Fri, Jun 17, 2011 at 07:31:43AM -0300, Evandro Giovanini wrote:
Em Sex, 2011-06-17 às 11:55 +0200, Ralf Corsepius escreveu:
Well, it's obvious to me Gnome 3 is trying to immitate W7, OS X and iOS,
but ... may-be you may want to think about why users are not using these
and are using
Em Sex, 2011-06-17 às 22:47 -0400, Scott Schmit escreveu:
On Fri, Jun 17, 2011 at 07:31:43AM -0300, Evandro Giovanini wrote:
Em Sex, 2011-06-17 às 11:55 +0200, Ralf Corsepius escreveu:
Well, it's obvious to me Gnome 3 is trying to immitate W7, OS X and iOS,
but ... may-be you may want to
On Mon, 2011-06-13 at 15:27 +0200, Denys Vlasenko wrote:
plymouth_running()? Plymouth? Systemd knows about plymouth? Why?
Because it has implications for the correct handoff of tty1, I believe.
This was one of the trickier things to get right in systemd.
--
Adam Williamson
Fedora QA Community
On Thu, Jun 16, 2011 at 21:35, John Reiser jrei...@bitwagon.com wrote:
This is because clicking [Button1 down up] does not temporarily pin the
clicked sub-menu. ... The current behavior
does not match the expectations of users.
Have you seen GNOME 3's Network Manager menu? When a large number
On Thu, Jun 16, 2011 at 22:15, seth vidal skvi...@fedoraproject.org wrote:
On Thu, 2011-06-16 at 18:59 -0700, Adam Williamson wrote:
On Tue, 2011-06-14 at 01:19 +0200, Henrik Wejdmark wrote:
My impression is that GNOME3 is trying to compete with Android and
FrontRow,
but have forgotten
On Tue, 2011-06-14 at 21:23 -0500, Dan Williams wrote:
systemd might be happy if you change it later, but other stuff is not.
The canonical example is X, where the hostname was used as the xauth key
to allow you to actually talk to the X server. When the hostname
changed, there was no
On Tue, 2011-06-14 at 08:53 -0400, Daniel J Walsh wrote:
The memory problem is just the share number of file context that we are
loading, each line of the file_context file is a regex. Currently the
file_context file on my Rawhide machine is 4209 lines. If we can
determine the only file
On Tue, 2011-06-14 at 21:23 -0500, Dan Williams wrote:
The next example is apps that try to find out your IP address by
looking
up your hostname. That's completely broken too. Do you have multiple
interfaces? Multiple IP addresses? Are you behind NAT? Yeah, all
that
will torpedo
On Tue, 2011-06-14 at 10:03 +0200, Lennart Poettering wrote:
On Mon, 13.06.11 18:18, Denys Vlasenko (dvlas...@redhat.com) wrote:
On Sat, 2011-06-11 at 10:17 +0200, drago01 wrote:
On Fri, Jun 10, 2011 at 3:07 PM, Denys Vlasenko dvlas...@redhat.com
wrote:
Hi Lennart,
On Wed, Jun 15, 2011 at 4:44 PM, Stephen Smalley s...@tycho.nsa.gov wrote:
Ways to improve the situation for systemd would include:
- Only load a subset of file_contexts entries, similar to udev.
- Only load the file contexts entries temporarily, using selabel_open +
selabel_close to bracket
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1
On 06/15/2011 11:03 AM, Miloslav Trma? wrote:
On Wed, Jun 15, 2011 at 4:44 PM, Stephen Smalley s...@tycho.nsa.gov wrote:
Ways to improve the situation for systemd would include:
- Only load a subset of file_contexts entries, similar to udev.
-
On Wed, Jun 15, 2011 at 11:12:35AM -0400, Daniel J Walsh wrote:
On 06/15/2011 11:03 AM, Miloslav Trma? wrote:
On Wed, Jun 15, 2011 at 4:44 PM, Stephen Smalley s...@tycho.nsa.gov wrote:
Ways to improve the situation for systemd would include:
- Only load a subset of file_contexts entries,
On Wed, 2011-06-15 at 09:40 -0400, Adam Jackson wrote:
On Tue, 2011-06-14 at 21:23 -0500, Dan Williams wrote:
systemd might be happy if you change it later, but other stuff is not.
The canonical example is X, where the hostname was used as the xauth key
to allow you to actually talk to
On Tuesday, June 14, 2011 06:51:18 AM Genes MailLists wrote:
On 06/13/2011 08:14 PM, Kevin Kofler wrote:
Henrik Wejdmark wrote:
I have been with this distro since RH4 and have had a great time doing
so. Almost every upgrade has been really smooth with only a few minor
setbacks like an odd
On Mon, 2011-06-13 at 21:44 -0400, Simo Sorce wrote:
I wouldn't bother much if it would be just one tiny bit of strange code
in systemd, but it is FAR from being the only such code. There are lots
of similar stuff, and it's not accidental.
It is definitely not accidental, but unless you
On 06/14/2011 12:50 PM, Denys Vlasenko wrote:
On Mon, 2011-06-13 at 21:44 -0400, Simo Sorce wrote:
I wouldn't bother much if it would be just one tiny bit of strange code
in systemd, but it is FAR from being the only such code. There are lots
of similar stuff, and it's not accidental.
It is
On Mon, 13.06.11 18:01, Denys Vlasenko (dvlas...@redhat.com) wrote:
On Mon, 2011-06-13 at 17:29 +0200, Lennart Poettering wrote:
On Mon, 13.06.11 15:27, Denys Vlasenko (dvlas...@redhat.com) wrote:
kmod_setup(); === ???
We load a couple of kernel modules which
On Mon, 13.06.11 17:19, Matthew Garrett (mj...@srcf.ucam.org) wrote:
On Mon, Jun 13, 2011 at 05:13:39PM +0100, Peter Robinson wrote:
On Mon, Jun 13, 2011 at 5:05 PM, Matthew Garrett mj...@srcf.ucam.org
wrote:
The point of providing a platform is that developers can make
On Tue, Jun 14, 2011 at 01:13:01AM +0200, Kevin Kofler wrote:
Denys Vlasenko wrote:
Try rm /usr/sbin/console-kit-daemon. Works like a charm.
Randomly removing pieces of installed packages has never been supported.
I think the console-kit-daemon service can be disabled, but xinit
prefixes
On Mon, 13.06.11 18:01, Miloslav Trmač (m...@volny.cz) wrote:
On Mon, Jun 13, 2011 at 5:29 PM, Lennart Poettering
mzerq...@0pointer.de wrote:
plymouth_running()? Plymouth? Systemd knows about plymouth? Why?
Because we need to constantly send updates to it. It's a trivial socket
On Mon, 13.06.11 18:18, Denys Vlasenko (dvlas...@redhat.com) wrote:
On Sat, 2011-06-11 at 10:17 +0200, drago01 wrote:
On Fri, Jun 10, 2011 at 3:07 PM, Denys Vlasenko dvlas...@redhat.com wrote:
Hi Lennart,
systemd is eating a lot more memory than any other init process
I ever
On Mon, 13.06.11 18:18, Denys Vlasenko (dvlas...@redhat.com) wrote:
On Sat, 2011-06-11 at 10:17 +0200, drago01 wrote:
On Fri, Jun 10, 2011 at 3:07 PM, Denys Vlasenko dvlas...@redhat.com wrote:
Hi Lennart,
systemd is eating a lot more memory than any other init process
I ever
On Mon, 13.06.11 19:02, Denys Vlasenko (dvlas...@redhat.com) wrote:
On Mon, 2011-06-13 at 12:37 -0400, Simo Sorce wrote:
On Mon, 2011-06-13 at 18:01 +0200, Denys Vlasenko wrote:
We invoke sethostname() from inside systemd since that is one of the
most trivial system calls known to
On Mon, 13.06.11 22:46, Denys Vlasenko (dvlas...@redhat.com) wrote:
In this case you are not better/worse than before, once the network will
come up you'll add a script to change the hostname.
Setting it earlier in systemd makes no difference.
You continue to avoid answering my question:
On Tue, 14.06.11 09:20, Denys Vlasenko (dvlas...@redhat.com) wrote:
On Mon, 2011-06-13 at 21:44 -0400, Simo Sorce wrote:
I wouldn't bother much if it would be just one tiny bit of strange code
in systemd, but it is FAR from being the only such code. There are lots
of similar stuff,
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