Re: [tdf-discuss] New name

[Varun Mittal]

Hello Galvin,

No need to hide anywhere. It is okay,everyone makes mistakes...that just
proves you are  human and not some BOT  ;)

Hope to have a fruitful discussion from hereon.

 Thank You

Best Regards
Varun Mittal 
Moderator, Mailing Lists(all)
Market Project
www.OpenOffice.org

Google 
Facebook
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Twitter

"Uncertainty is the only Certainty of LIFE"

On Tue, Oct 5, 2010 at 2:24 PM, Graham Lauder wrote:

> And now I have to eat humble pie and apologise profusely.  I did a search
> back
> over the marketing list and the announcement is there on the 28th posted by
> Varun.  I don't know how I missed it and now I feel like such an idiot
>
> Thorsten, Charles and Christoph, please accept abject apologies.  I shall
> now
> go hide in a hole somewheres.
>
>
> Cheers
> GL
>
> --
> Graham Lauder,
> OpenOffice.org MarCon (Marketing Contact) NZ
> http://marketing.openoffice.org/contacts.html
>
> OpenOffice.org Migration and training Consultant.
>
> INGOTs Assessor Trainer
> (International Grades in Open Technologies)
> www.theingots.org
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> deleted.
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> http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/
>
>

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Re: [tdf-discuss] New name

[Graham Lauder]

And now I have to eat humble pie and apologise profusely.  I did a search back 
over the marketing list and the announcement is there on the 28th posted by 
Varun.  I don't know how I missed it and now I feel like such an idiot

Thorsten, Charles and Christoph, please accept abject apologies.  I shall now 
go hide in a hole somewheres. 


Cheers
GL
 
-- 
Graham Lauder,
OpenOffice.org MarCon (Marketing Contact) NZ
http://marketing.openoffice.org/contacts.html

OpenOffice.org Migration and training Consultant.

INGOTs Assessor Trainer
(International Grades in Open Technologies)
www.theingots.org
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Re: [tdf-discuss] New name

[Ron House]

It's unfortunate that this thread has morphed into a criticism of the 
key workers to whom we all owe so much.


I posted earlier only in the spirit of contributing my opinion (which is 
based on thirty years of observation of project successes and failures) 
that the name chosen will be less effective than it might be in 
furthering the goals of the project. (Although, aside, the abbreviation 
"LibO" has a lot going for it!)


So I here express my thanks and appreciation to the project leaders and 
to everyone who has ever contributed to this project.


But back to the name... ;-)  How about a competition? Just have a go and 
see what suggestions the entire community of FLOSS supporters and users 
can dream up. Then, maybe, put the heavy on some of the corporate 
sponsors to buy whatever trademarks and domains are needed for a really 
good name that speaks, not only to those of us who are familiar with 
"free", "open source", FLOSS", etc., but also to the wide world of 
millions of folk to who we would love to have on board supporting the 
project.


I would like to forestall one objection I sometimes hear: This is free, 
so who cares about the great unwashed masses - let them eat Microsoft!


I think that is shortsighted. Microsoft is a malignant corporation and 
their monopolies in OSes and office suites have harmed and do harm all 
of us. Every game, every serious application, written only for windows 
is an application that might have run on a safer, more open OS if not 
for the monopolies. Even if I prefer open source, if someone has a 
commercial app. that I need, I would like to be able to buy it for 
Linux! So for our own benefit, even discounting the goal of improving 
the world of computing in general, bringing wonderful apps like this one 
to the world is important, and we should give ourselves the best chance 
of pulling it off.


--
Ron House
Building Peace: http://peacelegacy.org
Australian Birds: http://wingedhearts.org
Principle of Goodness academic site: http://principleofgoodness.net
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Re: [tdf-discuss] Libreoffice national domain name registrations

[Sankarshan Mukhopadhyay]

On Mon, Oct 4, 2010 at 11:07 PM, Florian Effenberger
 wrote:

> I'm working on it and collect all information. The plan is indeed to
> have the domain names registered to the foundation as soon as possible.

Thank you. I did not have the URL at hand when I composed the earlier
mail but I am looking forward to come guidelines similar to



-- 
sankarshan mukhopadhyay

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Re: [tdf-discuss] [WEBSITE] Improvements for the wiki?

[Benjamin Horst]

Any reason for that preference? What other wikis have you worked with, and what 
do you think are their particular strengths and weaknesses?

I probably should not have introduced the question of wiki platform at this 
stage, before we have discussed the higher level requirements and information 
architecture we'd like to build out. I don't want to sideline the conversation 
into specific platforms before we get a broad overview of requirements first.

-Ben

On Oct 4, 2010, at 8:53 PM, Jonathan Zacsh wrote:

> I'd like to see this project use mediawiki
> http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/MediaWiki
> 
> --
> Jonathan Zacsh
> 
> 
> 
> On Mon, Oct 4, 2010 at 19:52, Benjamin Horst  wrote:
>> Thanks, Christoph. I've long been interested in wikis and the capabilitie
> s they can provide, the data structures and usage patterns that tend to wor
> k well, and the various wiki platforms available. I've read "Wikipatterns,"
> which is a book I recommend to others interested in this subject. Much of
> its information is available on its website: http://www.wikipatterns.com/
>> 
>> I am a fan of MediaWiki, but I think we should consider other wiki platfo
> rms as well. My recommendation, in fact, is Foswiki (http://foswiki.org/),
> which forked from TWiki about a year ago, and is GPL 2.0-licensed. (Their e
> xperience was similar to what we're going through with LibreOffice's birth
> right now.)
>> 
>> Foswiki's got some advanced features that we could really use, including
> separate "webs" that isolate major logical sections from one another (and a
> llow different access permissions for each web, so that a Community Council
> group, for example, could maintain a private web for internal discussions)
> . It offers a good WYSIWYG text editor, allows dynamic pages for things lik
> e to-do lists, and has extensions that provide extra functionality. It also
> supports macros and forms that let you build applications within the wiki
> itself, which would let us do some really cool stuff.
>> 
>> I've got a lot more to say on the subject, but don't want to start off wi
> th too large a soliloquy. I'm looking forward to what others say on this su
> bject as well.
>> 
>> -Ben
>> 
>> On Oct 4, 2010, at 5:54 PM, Christoph Noack wrote:
>> 
>>> Good evening everyone,
>>> 
>>> the subject already tells you, this mail is about Wiki improvements.
>>> "What Wiki?" you might ask. Correct, there is none ... but if we want to
>>> change that, it'll be great to know what we require. Once it is set up,
>>> I'm confident that a reasonable structure will greatly help us.
>>> 
>>> I assume that our Wiki will be used by all kinds of community members -
>>> being it users, all kinds of contributors, the final foundation people.
>>> And it will be used for very different things, e.g. planning
>>> conferences, documenting best practices, providing documentation. Well,
>>> although there are still discussions whether we need team ABZ or XYZ ...
>>> some topics can't be avoided to shape a complex thing like LibreOffice.
>>> 
>>> As far as I understand, many of you have a great experience to work with
>>> tools like Wikis. Very good! And - also my hope - we will also hear some
>>> voices who are less experienced. Step forward, and share your thoughts,
>>> too, please! But how to get started ... I mean ... without a wiki to
>>> document the statements.
>>> 
>>> My proposal is to collect some experiences when working with Wiki
>>> content (not so much the Wiki system itself) ... what is good, what can
>>> be improved? It would be great if you could explain why, e.g. "I always
>>> find everything I need within a few clicks.", and stating what you
>>> usually do (e.g. QA work). And you may add what you expect from a
>>> website - being different from a wiki.
>>> 
>>> Just to give you an idea, I've picked some of the larger projects to
>>> state examples. A certain size is required, since we are complex too ...
>>> but we don't want to be complicated. Feel free to add any kind of
>>> project you like to refer to...
>>> 
>>>  * Fedora Project Wiki
>>>https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Fedora_Project
> _Wiki
>>> 
>>>  * Gnome Live!
>>>http://live.gnome.org/
>>> 
>>>  * KDE Wiki
>>>http://wiki.kde.org/
>>> 
>>>  * Apache General Wiki
>>>http://wiki.apache.org/general/
>>> 
>>> At the moment, it seems appropriate to use this mailing list. But, I'm
>>> sure we'll have a dedicated website list tomorrow or Wednesday latest.
>>> So please also decide what to do ... discuss it here, or wait for the
>>> list. It is up to us :-)
>>> 
>>> Thank you so much!
>>> 
>>> Cheers,
>>> Christoph
>>> 
>>> --
>>> To unsubscribe, send an empty e-mail to discuss+unsubscr...@documentfoun
> dation.org
>>> All messages you send to this list will be publicly archived and cannot
> be deleted.
>>> List archives are available at http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/d
> iscuss/
>>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Benjamin Horst
>> bho...@mac.com
>> 646-464-2314 

Re: [tdf-discuss] [WEBSITE] Improvements for the wiki?

[Jonathan Zacsh]

I'd like to see this project use mediawiki
http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/MediaWiki

--
Jonathan Zacsh



On Mon, Oct 4, 2010 at 19:52, Benjamin Horst  wrote:
> Thanks, Christoph. I've long been interested in wikis and the capabilitie
s they can provide, the data structures and usage patterns that tend to wor
k well, and the various wiki platforms available. I've read "Wikipatterns,"
 which is a book I recommend to others interested in this subject. Much of
its information is available on its website: http://www.wikipatterns.com/
>
> I am a fan of MediaWiki, but I think we should consider other wiki platfo
rms as well. My recommendation, in fact, is Foswiki (http://foswiki.org/),
which forked from TWiki about a year ago, and is GPL 2.0-licensed. (Their e
xperience was similar to what we're going through with LibreOffice's birth
right now.)
>
> Foswiki's got some advanced features that we could really use, including
separate "webs" that isolate major logical sections from one another (and a
llow different access permissions for each web, so that a Community Council
 group, for example, could maintain a private web for internal discussions)
. It offers a good WYSIWYG text editor, allows dynamic pages for things lik
e to-do lists, and has extensions that provide extra functionality. It also
 supports macros and forms that let you build applications within the wiki
itself, which would let us do some really cool stuff.
>
> I've got a lot more to say on the subject, but don't want to start off wi
th too large a soliloquy. I'm looking forward to what others say on this su
bject as well.
>
> -Ben
>
> On Oct 4, 2010, at 5:54 PM, Christoph Noack wrote:
>
>> Good evening everyone,
>>
>> the subject already tells you, this mail is about Wiki improvements.
>> "What Wiki?" you might ask. Correct, there is none ... but if we want to
>> change that, it'll be great to know what we require. Once it is set up,
>> I'm confident that a reasonable structure will greatly help us.
>>
>> I assume that our Wiki will be used by all kinds of community members -
>> being it users, all kinds of contributors, the final foundation people.
>> And it will be used for very different things, e.g. planning
>> conferences, documenting best practices, providing documentation. Well,
>> although there are still discussions whether we need team ABZ or XYZ ...
>> some topics can't be avoided to shape a complex thing like LibreOffice.
>>
>> As far as I understand, many of you have a great experience to work with
>> tools like Wikis. Very good! And - also my hope - we will also hear some
>> voices who are less experienced. Step forward, and share your thoughts,
>> too, please! But how to get started ... I mean ... without a wiki to
>> document the statements.
>>
>> My proposal is to collect some experiences when working with Wiki
>> content (not so much the Wiki system itself) ... what is good, what can
>> be improved? It would be great if you could explain why, e.g. "I always
>> find everything I need within a few clicks.", and stating what you
>> usually do (e.g. QA work). And you may add what you expect from a
>> website - being different from a wiki.
>>
>> Just to give you an idea, I've picked some of the larger projects to
>> state examples. A certain size is required, since we are complex too ...
>> but we don't want to be complicated. Feel free to add any kind of
>> project you like to refer to...
>>
>>      * Fedora Project Wiki
>>        https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Fedora_Project
_Wiki
>>
>>      * Gnome Live!
>>        http://live.gnome.org/
>>
>>      * KDE Wiki
>>        http://wiki.kde.org/
>>
>>      * Apache General Wiki
>>        http://wiki.apache.org/general/
>>
>> At the moment, it seems appropriate to use this mailing list. But, I'm
>> sure we'll have a dedicated website list tomorrow or Wednesday latest.
>> So please also decide what to do ... discuss it here, or wait for the
>> list. It is up to us :-)
>>
>> Thank you so much!
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Christoph
>>
>> --
>> To unsubscribe, send an empty e-mail to discuss+unsubscr...@documentfoun
dation.org
>> All messages you send to this list will be publicly archived and cannot
be deleted.
>> List archives are available at http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/d
iscuss/
>>
>
>
> Benjamin Horst
> bho...@mac.com
> 646-464-2314 (Eastern)
> www.solidoffice.com
>
> --
> To unsubscribe, send an empty e-mail to discuss+unsubscr...@documentfound
ation.org
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e deleted.
> List archives are available at http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/di
scuss/
>
>
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Re: [tdf-discuss] [GENERAL] New name

[paul . hermeneutic]

"Libre" is an excellent choice.  Most people in the world are not
native English speakers.

There will be few problems understanding "LibreOffice."  It is likely
to be more universally understood than "OpenOffice."
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Re: [tdf-discuss] [GENERAL] New name

[paul . hermeneutic]

"Libre" is an excellent choice.  It is much more than just free of
cost; it means free of restrictions.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gratis_versus_Libre
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Re: [tdf-discuss] New name

[Andy Brown]

Hi Christoph,

On Mon Oct 04 2010 16:29:37 GMT-0700 (PDT)  Christoph Noack wrote:

Hi Andy,

a last mail ... for me it is far past 1 am already, but since your mind
is eager to know :-)))



Well the message could have waited till morning.  That is the great 
thing, at least to me, about email.



Am Montag, den 04.10.2010, 16:10 -0700 schrieb Andy Brown:

On Mon Oct 04 2010 15:12:06 GMT-0700 (PDT)  Christoph Noack wrote:
Martin, from Oracle, was linking to this article: 
http://tinyurl.com/36u3ksn


Well, a person from Oracle referred to that article ... so they might
also know where they put that statement. :-)


It would be interesting to get a copy of the "comment".



It has already been cited by Kürti on this list:
http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/msg00282.html


A repeat of the "news article".



Good night,
Christoph



Good night.. :)

Andy
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Re: [tdf-discuss] [DOC] User docs: planning ahead

[jonathon]

On 10/04/2010 03:19 PM, James Wilde wrote:

> 1.  The very young.  Since LibO is free, they can get a first class pro
duct at a price they can afford,

Documentation that focuses on OOo4Kids would be the most useful for that
market segment.

> 2. The very old.

I suspect that documentation that focuses on OOoLight would be most
useful for that market segment.

Both of which come back to do we:
* Write that documentation from scratch;
* Modify existing OOo documentation for each of those specific programs;

jonathon
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Re: [tdf-discuss] [WEBSITE] Improvements for the wiki?

[Benjamin Horst]

Thanks, Christoph. I've long been interested in wikis and the capabilities they 
can provide, the data structures and usage patterns that tend to work well, and 
the various wiki platforms available. I've read "Wikipatterns," which is a book 
I recommend to others interested in this subject. Much of its information is 
available on its website: http://www.wikipatterns.com/

I am a fan of MediaWiki, but I think we should consider other wiki platforms as 
well. My recommendation, in fact, is Foswiki (http://foswiki.org/), which 
forked from TWiki about a year ago, and is GPL 2.0-licensed. (Their experience 
was similar to what we're going through with LibreOffice's birth right now.) 

Foswiki's got some advanced features that we could really use, including 
separate "webs" that isolate major logical sections from one another (and allow 
different access permissions for each web, so that a Community Council group, 
for example, could maintain a private web for internal discussions). It offers 
a good WYSIWYG text editor, allows dynamic pages for things like to-do lists, 
and has extensions that provide extra functionality. It also supports macros 
and forms that let you build applications within the wiki itself, which would 
let us do some really cool stuff.

I've got a lot more to say on the subject, but don't want to start off with too 
large a soliloquy. I'm looking forward to what others say on this subject as 
well.

-Ben

On Oct 4, 2010, at 5:54 PM, Christoph Noack wrote:

> Good evening everyone,
> 
> the subject already tells you, this mail is about Wiki improvements.
> "What Wiki?" you might ask. Correct, there is none ... but if we want to
> change that, it'll be great to know what we require. Once it is set up,
> I'm confident that a reasonable structure will greatly help us.
> 
> I assume that our Wiki will be used by all kinds of community members -
> being it users, all kinds of contributors, the final foundation people.
> And it will be used for very different things, e.g. planning
> conferences, documenting best practices, providing documentation. Well,
> although there are still discussions whether we need team ABZ or XYZ ...
> some topics can't be avoided to shape a complex thing like LibreOffice.
> 
> As far as I understand, many of you have a great experience to work with
> tools like Wikis. Very good! And - also my hope - we will also hear some
> voices who are less experienced. Step forward, and share your thoughts,
> too, please! But how to get started ... I mean ... without a wiki to
> document the statements.
> 
> My proposal is to collect some experiences when working with Wiki
> content (not so much the Wiki system itself) ... what is good, what can
> be improved? It would be great if you could explain why, e.g. "I always
> find everything I need within a few clicks.", and stating what you
> usually do (e.g. QA work). And you may add what you expect from a
> website - being different from a wiki.
> 
> Just to give you an idea, I've picked some of the larger projects to
> state examples. A certain size is required, since we are complex too ...
> but we don't want to be complicated. Feel free to add any kind of
> project you like to refer to...
> 
>  * Fedora Project Wiki
>https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Fedora_Project_Wiki
> 
>  * Gnome Live!
>http://live.gnome.org/
> 
>  * KDE Wiki
>http://wiki.kde.org/
> 
>  * Apache General Wiki
>http://wiki.apache.org/general/
> 
> At the moment, it seems appropriate to use this mailing list. But, I'm
> sure we'll have a dedicated website list tomorrow or Wednesday latest.
> So please also decide what to do ... discuss it here, or wait for the
> list. It is up to us :-)
> 
> Thank you so much!
> 
> Cheers,
> Christoph
> 
> -- 
> To unsubscribe, send an empty e-mail to 
> discuss+unsubscr...@documentfoundation.org
> All messages you send to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be 
> deleted.
> List archives are available at 
> http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/
> 


Benjamin Horst
bho...@mac.com
646-464-2314 (Eastern)
www.solidoffice.com

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Re: [tdf-discuss] New name

[Christoph Noack]

Hi Andy,

a last mail ... for me it is far past 1 am already, but since your mind
is eager to know :-)))

Am Montag, den 04.10.2010, 16:10 -0700 schrieb Andy Brown:
> On Mon Oct 04 2010 15:12:06 GMT-0700 (PDT)  Christoph Noack wrote:
> > 
> >>> Martin, from Oracle, was linking to this article: 
> >>> http://tinyurl.com/36u3ksn

Well, a person from Oracle referred to that article ... so they might
also know where they put that statement. :-)

> I have to agree with Jean.  Anyone can "make a statement" but that is 
> like listening to sound bits on tv.  What was the complete statement? 
> Where can it be found?

It has already been cited by Kürti on this list:
http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/msg00282.html

> Inquiring mind what to know..:)

Of course ... ;-)

Good night,
Christoph

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Re: [tdf-discuss] New name

[jonathon]

On 10/04/2010 03:43 PM, Carlos Rocha wrote:

>and the good, old, and beautiful OOo.

Oracle has named their product Oracle OpenOffice, with the abbreviation
of OOO. One consequence of that act is that Oracle has poisoned both the
OOo and OpenOffice.org brand names.

jonathon
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Re: [tdf-discuss] New name

[Andy Brown]

On Mon Oct 04 2010 15:12:06 GMT-0700 (PDT)  Christoph Noack wrote:

Hi Jean!

Thanks for pointing that out ...

Am Dienstag, den 05.10.2010, 08:02 +1000 schrieb Jean Hollis Weber:

On Mon, 2010-10-04 at 23:36 +0200, Thorsten Behrens wrote:

Graham Lauder wrote:

Oracle made an interim response, do we have link to that somewhere.

Martin, from Oracle, was linking to this article: 
http://tinyurl.com/36u3ksn

That article refers to a "statement" from Oracle. Where is that
statement? I don't consider a media report an authoritative source.


... please have a closer look. The statement has been divided in several
parts, so anytime "Oracle said" appears, this really is their statement.

Does that help?

Cheers,
Christoph



Christoph,

I have to agree with Jean.  Anyone can "make a statement" but that is 
like listening to sound bits on tv.  What was the complete statement? 
Where can it be found?


Inquiring mind what to know..:)

Andy
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Re: [tdf-discuss] New name

[jonathon]

On 10/04/2010 10:41 AM, Graham Lauder wrote:

> I'm sorry, if it's offlist, then for the majority of community members
it's secret.

Anybody who has paid attention to OOo Project issues over the last
decade, would have known that key developers, and other influential
people in the OOo community would declare independence from Oracle. The
only unknown answer was how soon.

> critical decisions made away from the community with a fait accompli ha
nded to us on a plate.

Given a choice between waking up one morning to discover that the
project had migrated elsewhere, and waking up discovering that the
project had been cancelled, I'd prefer the former eight days a week.

And yes, the odds were/are that Oracle will close (or has closed)  the
OOo program overnight, and only support Oracle OpenOffice. Whether or
not Oracle would make that announcement, either before or after the
fact, is a slightly different tissue.

>It seems there were some areas, like looking after the community, that
were ignored.

In declaring independence, things are always overlooked. Nobody has
written a check list of things to do when declaring Independence.

jonathon
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Re: [tdf-discuss] Website status?

[Christoph Noack]

Hi Jonathan!

Am Montag, den 04.10.2010, 14:31 +0200 schrieb Florian Effenberger:
> Hi Jonathan,
> 
> Am 04.10.2010 um 14:08 schrieb jzacsh:
> 
> > So I'm just looking for a definitive answer: Will anyone be giving us 
> access to any way we can help with the website? I'd hate to be pushy, 
> but I wake up with 70 emails a morning from the "discuss" list and I'd 
> like to help with what I'm knowledgeable in. There's no way I'm reading 
> through some kind of digest just to see if the website has been 
> addressed.

Well said ... true! And to be honest, each of us has some sort of
interest and therefore an idea how to help. So our interest is also in
having some better infrastructure / organization.

By the way, to me it seems that we should go on and separate the LibO
and the TDF page in some way. What's your perception, when to do that?

> sorry for the delay - we're working hard on the infrastructure, and will 
> see some news this week. There soon will also be news for the website. 
> Stay tuned ;)

Florian, I really know what you currently invest in terms of effort.
Thanks for that!

And also thanks to all on this list, especially since we ask you for
some patience at the moment. I think we are just overwhelmed by all your
kind and also critical feedback ...

Cheers,
Christoph

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Re: [tdf-discuss] New name

[Christoph Noack]

Hi Jean!

Thanks for pointing that out ...

Am Dienstag, den 05.10.2010, 08:02 +1000 schrieb Jean Hollis Weber:
> On Mon, 2010-10-04 at 23:36 +0200, Thorsten Behrens wrote:
> > Graham Lauder wrote:
> > > 
> > > Oracle made an interim response, do we have link to that somewhere.
> > > 
> > Martin, from Oracle, was linking to this article: 
> > http://tinyurl.com/36u3ksn
> 
> That article refers to a "statement" from Oracle. Where is that
> statement? I don't consider a media report an authoritative source.

... please have a closer look. The statement has been divided in several
parts, so anytime "Oracle said" appears, this really is their statement.

Does that help?

Cheers,
Christoph


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Re: [tdf-discuss] New name

[Jean Hollis Weber]

On Mon, 2010-10-04 at 23:36 +0200, Thorsten Behrens wrote:
> Graham Lauder wrote:
> > 
> > Oracle made an interim response, do we have link to that somewhere.
> > 
> Martin, from Oracle, was linking to this article: 
> http://tinyurl.com/36u3ksn

That article refers to a "statement" from Oracle. Where is that
statement? I don't consider a media report an authoritative source.

--Jean

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[tdf-discuss] [WEBSITE] Improvements for the wiki?

[Christoph Noack]

Good evening everyone,

the subject already tells you, this mail is about Wiki improvements.
"What Wiki?" you might ask. Correct, there is none ... but if we want to
change that, it'll be great to know what we require. Once it is set up,
I'm confident that a reasonable structure will greatly help us.

I assume that our Wiki will be used by all kinds of community members -
being it users, all kinds of contributors, the final foundation people.
And it will be used for very different things, e.g. planning
conferences, documenting best practices, providing documentation. Well,
although there are still discussions whether we need team ABZ or XYZ ...
some topics can't be avoided to shape a complex thing like LibreOffice.

As far as I understand, many of you have a great experience to work with
tools like Wikis. Very good! And - also my hope - we will also hear some
voices who are less experienced. Step forward, and share your thoughts,
too, please! But how to get started ... I mean ... without a wiki to
document the statements.

My proposal is to collect some experiences when working with Wiki
content (not so much the Wiki system itself) ... what is good, what can
be improved? It would be great if you could explain why, e.g. "I always
find everything I need within a few clicks.", and stating what you
usually do (e.g. QA work). And you may add what you expect from a
website - being different from a wiki.

Just to give you an idea, I've picked some of the larger projects to
state examples. A certain size is required, since we are complex too ...
but we don't want to be complicated. Feel free to add any kind of
project you like to refer to...

  * Fedora Project Wiki
https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Fedora_Project_Wiki

  * Gnome Live!
http://live.gnome.org/

  * KDE Wiki
http://wiki.kde.org/

  * Apache General Wiki
http://wiki.apache.org/general/

At the moment, it seems appropriate to use this mailing list. But, I'm
sure we'll have a dedicated website list tomorrow or Wednesday latest.
So please also decide what to do ... discuss it here, or wait for the
list. It is up to us :-)

Thank you so much!

Cheers,
Christoph

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Re: [tdf-discuss] New name

[Thorsten Behrens]

Graham Lauder wrote:
> > What info are you missing?
>
> Most I've probably worked out and that stuff I haven't, I made up using

> educated guesswork.
>
> Oracle made an interim response, do we have link to that somewhere.
>
Martin, from Oracle, was linking to this article:
http://tinyurl.com/36u3ksn

> Michael Meeks is in the heart of this, what's Novells role
>
One of the supporting companies, as listed on
http://www.documentfoundation.org/supporters/

>From the companies listed there, the shared intention is to fold
their respective OOo flavours into LibreOffice.

> Google has thrown it's oar in, in support, will there be any more than li
p
> service or will they front, maybe with server space.
>
Cannot speak for them - but surely even lip service from someone
with an outreach like Google is something to appreciate. ;)

> The response from the corporates seemed quick, were they brought in befor
e the
> announcement.
>
Well yes, we had the initial list of supporters on that page from
Day One (it grew since then). This, unfortunately, is one of the
things you only pull off by doing backroom talks ...

> Where does IBM and Symphony fit in, if at all.
>
We would be thrilled to have IBM on board, of course.

> When was the anticipated release date, has any been set.
>
For LibO 3.3? That'll be somewhat aligned with the OOo 3.3 release -
LibO will be based on OOo 3.3 sources (and no, there's no definitive
release date for OOo 3.3 either).

> Can I rewrite the Vision and Mission please, it really sucks right now.
:)
>
Please - constructive criticism is always appreciated! :)

Cheers,

-- Thorsten

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Re: [tdf-discuss] [GENERAL] New name

[Jon Hamkins]

Let me second that libreoffice is a really poor choice, for all the
reasons Graham enumerates.  Also, "libre" is not a word that means
anything to most English-only speakers, and its pronunciation is the
same as Libra, the astrology sign.  Libreoffice is difficult to
pronounce, and difficult to understand for anyone outside of the open
source community.

Furthermore, the connection of "libre" to open source software isn't
exactly a pea in a pod, either.  I have been an open source software
advocate since before Raymond coined the term, and I use "OSS",
sometimes "FOSS", and hardly -- if ever -- "FLOSS".  When I'm talking
about the reasons open source is great, I don't want to have to explain
gratis vs libre.  That's a foreign language lesson that causes eyes to
glaze over -- I've found that "free speech, not free beer" is a much
more direct and enlightening explanation.

Were I starting from scratch in coming up with a name, and I had to keep
"office" in it, off the top of my head I can think of:

Office Suite Office
Homer Office
Clean Office
Neat Office
Office Doctor
Dr. Office
Office Freedom
OpenOffice.org/index.html  (just kidding!)

No doubt, some of these have trademark issues.  Without "office" in the
name, there are many good possibilities, but the marketing problem gets
harder.

And really, the difficulty of the marketing problem to me suggests that
sticking with libreoffice may be the best solution.  It's already been
announced, the domains acquired, and changing it again seems unhelpful
to the cause.

 Jon

On 10/02/2010 06:04 PM, Graham Lauder wrote:
> On Sunday 03 Oct 2010 14:35:19 Ron House wrote:
>> On 02/10/10 23:41, Mirek M. wrote:
>>> Well, "Open Office" was usually the spoken term used to refer to
>>> OpenOffice.org, and I'd say that's much easier to pronounce than
>>> LibreOffice. And it flows much more nicely.
>>> "LibreOffice" is hard to pronounce the French way because there are two
>>> (written) vowels next to each other. That's one thing the French language
>>> tries to avoid, by having special forms for the few adjectives that come
>>> before nouns that start with a vowel, like "bel", "vieil", and "nouvel".
>>> So LibreOffice doesn't really fit in with French pronunciation either...
>>>
>>> But you don't need professionals to know if a name sounds good. I'd say
>>> "Firefox" and "Inkscape" are great names, but I'm sure those projects
>>> didn't spend millions of dollars on coming up with a name. And just look
>>> at how the name "Google" came about: it was made up by a daughter of a
>>> mathematician.
>>>
>>>
>>> I liked it, too, at first, but I'm afraid that pronunciation will be an
>>> issue...
>>>
>>> Anyway, if nobody else thinks it's an issue, then it should stay.
>> Hmm, I joined the list to find out about compiling the source, but this
>> discussion took my interest. Apologies for butting in late.
>>
>> Names are a hard thing, but one lesson I have learned in 30 years of
>> software development is: for widespread acceptance a good name matters
>> much more than good content. (Sad but true.)
>>
>> Examples: "Object-oriented programming" : All the ideas were there in
>> Simula 67 (yes, that's 1967), but until the cool name, OOP, was
>> invented, no one took any notice. Then "Extreme programming", "Open
>> Office", "relational database" (just a cool name for the bad idea of
>> busting up all the objects and losing the natural hierarchies). I could
>> think of dozens if I spent another ten minutes at it.
>>
>> Another key lesson: Insiders are very, VERY bad at picking good names
>> for their own 'children'.
>>
>> This is not meant as an insult, but the key movers and shakers here, to
>> whom we all owe the very existence of this wonderful project, are most
>> likely the least able to judge a good name.
>>
>> And "LibreOffice" is a very poor name.
>>
>> Reasons:
>>
>> 1/ "Libre" is an insider's term. Ask any but a romance language speaker
>> or a free software supporter what it means. Seriously, ask your mum,
>> your boss, your students, the guy serving at the local deli. The name is
>> doomed to misunderstanding and obscurity. Geeks will give you lots of
>> good feedback and you'll judge you got it right, but you haven't, and
>> you need to actually try the little experiment I just gave if you want
>> to see why.
>>
>> 2/ As Mirek explains, the pronunciation breaks the rules, and showing
>> disrespect for the rules of the linguistic source of a term doesn't seem
>> like a sensitive or a politically wise thing to do.
>>
>> 3/ Also as Mirek points out, the adjacent vowels make the word hard to
>> roll off the tongue by a speaker of any language. (It occurs to me as I
>> write this that (2) and (3) could be fixed by calling it "OfficeLibre".)
>>
>> Thus my only disagreement with Mirek's comments: "If nobody else thinks
>> it's an issue..." - the people here (again, with apologies) are all
>> self-selected for their in-depth knowledge of the field, love of the
>> software, l

Re: [tdf-discuss] [MAILING LIST] interim structuring - a proposal

[Thorsten Behrens]

Christoph Noack wrote:
> > > Ideally, I want QA folks to take notice if the Devs start debating
> > > details of specific features, and conversely, I want Devs to take
> > > notice of QA talking about specific "problem areas" in the product.
> > >
> > But you should also be aware that there are much qa-people which are
> > doing just testing.
> > These are not so "technical" and wouldn't like to read or even
> > understand the things on the dev-list. And there is much
> > organisational stuff around the testing which wouldn't interest the
> > developers.
>
> Interesting discussion ... I think I do understand all your reasons,
> although they aren't fundamentally different.
>
> Same is true for a topic like UX (User Experience). You have to collect
> material for UX, you have to discuss issues within UX, it is required to
> kick-off activities from UX (e.g. collect tiny usability issues). But on
> the other hand, it is extremely important to keep in touch with
> development - to be consulted, to understand the other persons'
> problems, ...
>
True - with the distinction that QA is affected by *every* bit of
development, whereas UX only comes into play for things UI-related.

I do see the "don't irritate non-technical QA people" argument - but
on the other hand I *do* want to get them technically savvy over
time, and pick up the 'smell' on were to invest time, if
Dev A starts to hack on the uno registry code
again.

Building two camps again, I fear, will not yield the kind of
collaborative athmosphere I so clearly envision for QA/Dev - case in
point is one Raphael Bircher, who loudly complains about perceived
problems doing QA in LibO - I want those concerns voiced on a list
were they can be discussed with the devs, not to echo unheard in
some zoo made up for QA. ;)

(I could probably live with a b...@tdf alias, where discussions is
purely about bugs, how to reproduce them, etc - but really, QA is
much more than that)

Cheers,

-- Thorsten

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Re: [tdf-discuss] [MAILING LIST] interim structuring - a proposal

[Christoph Noack]

Hi everyone!

Am Montag, den 04.10.2010, 22:00 +0200 schrieb Volker Merschmann:
> > Ideally, I want QA folks to take notice if the Devs start debating
> > details of specific features, and conversely, I want Devs to take
> > notice of QA talking about specific "problem areas" in the product.
> >
> But you should also be aware that there are much qa-people which are
> doing just testing.
> These are not so "technical" and wouldn't like to read or even
> understand the things on the dev-list. And there is much
> organisational stuff around the testing which wouldn't interest the
> developers.

Interesting discussion ... I think I do understand all your reasons,
although they aren't fundamentally different.

Same is true for a topic like UX (User Experience). You have to collect
material for UX, you have to discuss issues within UX, it is required to
kick-off activities from UX (e.g. collect tiny usability issues). But on
the other hand, it is extremely important to keep in touch with
development - to be consulted, to understand the other persons'
problems, ...

So I think we'll end up with different infrastructure bits for each of
the teams. But if it is about collaboration, we shouldn't be that far
away from each other - may it be working in small teams or being located
on the same mailing list.

Somehow, we have to bridge that gap ...

Cheers,
Christoph

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[tdf-discuss] Re: New name

[e-letter]

I like Staroffice (remember that? :))

A logo could be built around a star and a series of adjacent logos
indicative of an office document type (writer, calc, impress).

Not a serious idea; just a personal opinion.
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Re: [tdf-discuss] [MAILING LIST] interim structuring - a proposal

[Volker Merschmann]

Hi Thorsten,

2010/10/4 Thorsten Behrens :
> Cor Nouws wrote:
>> Also I think QA@ is a good thing.
>>
> I think I fundamentally disagree on this one - the interface between
> QA and Dev is incredibly huge, I'd even venture the proposition that
> ideally there's no difference (in core competencies - maybe there is
> one in attitude ;)) - at any rate, the chasm between the OpenOffice
> project's QA and Dev teams is something I *do not* want to
> transplant into our new project.
>
> Ideally, I want QA folks to take notice if the Devs start debating
> details of specific features, and conversely, I want Devs to take
> notice of QA talking about specific "problem areas" in the product.
>
But you should also be aware that there are much qa-people which are
doing just testing.
These are not so "technical" and wouldn't like to read or even
understand the things on the dev-list. And there is much
organisational stuff around the testing which wouldn't interest the
developers.

Just my 2c

Volker
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Re: [tdf-discuss] New name

[Graham Lauder]

On Tuesday 05 Oct 2010 03:27:04 Thorsten Behrens wrote:
> Graham Lauder wrote:
> > > We don't "own" anything. We have simply started the process, and we
> > > have tried to push it forward putting all our enthusiasm and energies
> > > behind
> 
>  i
> 
> > I'm sorry, if it's offlist, then for the majority of community members it
> 
> 's
> 
> > secret. That may not seem that way to you, but for the vast majority of t
> 
> he
> 
> > community it is.
> > You can see how this can give the impression that we have another Sun
> > situation going on, critical decisions made away from the community with
> > a fait accompli handed to us on a plate.  "Here you are, like it or lump
> > it
> 
> !"
> 
> Yes, we're aware of that danger. Please do remind us on our
> obligation to be open and transparent (see our mission statement)
> anytime you see a problem.
> 
> Our excuse is that we tried to involve at least one prominent
> representative from each group inside the large OOo family, and
> taking their suggestions seriously.
> 
> To paraphrase Italo - we basically drafted the train, laid the first
> ten meters of tracks - and now it's up to all of us to write the
> future. What generally works best for each of you individually is to
> actually do something - there's an abundance of stuff waiting to
> be done - and she who does, usually decides. That's why we called for
> a meritocracy.

Aah you see there you go being all reasonable, very hard to stay pissed in the 
face of such reasonableness 


> 
> > What would have been so hard about putting together something to
> > post to all the lists at the same time as the press release.
> > It seems there were some areas, like looking after the community,
> > that were ignored. (Odd since it says "open and transparent" in
> > the Vision Statement)
> 
> Hm, I thought we had quite some posts - most prominently the one on
> the announce list? If you personally felt left in the dark, please
> accept my apologies - there were no bad intentions, just that a few
> things got dropped apparently - we're a huge community by all kinds
> of measure.

And of course announce is probably the one I don't subscribe to, a mention on 
MarCon or PR would have been nice to alert those of us who, can't get to 
conferences and who were bound to get a barrage of questions that something 
was about to happen and help us with a response.  I really do hate being left 
hung out to dry

> 
> > How were we to know how long this had been going on, this secret
> > society, planning on the quiet.  Even now a week after the press
> > were told we're only getting some info in dribs and drabs because
> > some of the secret society seem to be getting a guilt attack.
> 
> What info are you missing?

Most I've probably worked out and that stuff I haven't, I made up using 
educated guesswork. 

Oracle made an interim response, do we have link to that somewhere.

Michael Meeks is in the heart of this, what's Novells role

Google has thrown it's oar in, in support, will there be any more than lip 
service or will they front, maybe with server space.

The response from the corporates seemed quick, were they brought in before the 
announcement.

Where does IBM and Symphony fit in, if at all.

When was the anticipated release date, has any been set.

Can I rewrite the Vision and Mission please, it really sucks right now.  :)

OK you've done the easy bit when can we start on the Hard stuff  ;)

Oh and by the way, I'm with Italo:  I Like LibO  the rest of the letters are 
extraneous.  

> 
> Cheers,
> 
> -- Thorsten


Cheers
GL

-- 
Graham Lauder,
OpenOffice.org MarCon (Marketing Contact) NZ
http://marketing.openoffice.org/contacts.html

OpenOffice.org Migration and training Consultant.

INGOTs Assessor Trainer
(International Grades in Open Technologies)
www.theingots.org
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Re: [tdf-discuss] [MAILING LIST] interim structuring - a proposal

[Thorsten Behrens]

Cor Nouws wrote:
> Also I think QA@ is a good thing.
>
I think I fundamentally disagree on this one - the interface between
QA and Dev is incredibly huge, I'd even venture the proposition that
ideally there's no difference (in core competencies - maybe there is
one in attitude ;)) - at any rate, the chasm between the OpenOffice
project's QA and Dev teams is something I *do not* want to
transplant into our new project.

Ideally, I want QA folks to take notice if the Devs start debating
details of specific features, and conversely, I want Devs to take
notice of QA talking about specific "problem areas" in the product.

Cheers,

-- Thorsten

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[tdf-discuss] Italian IRC Channels

[Italo Vignoli]

Hi,

The Italian IRC channels have been registered:

#documentfoundation-it

and

#libreoffice-it

Both are available on irc.freenode.net. The former one is for
discussions about The Document Foundation, and the latter one is for
discussions on LibreOffice and development.

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Email: italo.vign...@gmail.com - Skype: italovignoli
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Re: [tdf-discuss] Support For LibreOffice?

[Charles Marcus]

On 2010-10-04 2:21 PM, Harold Fuchs wrote:
> they are setting up all sorts of infrastructure including mailing
> lists for marketing, I18N etc. etc. and I was puzzled by what seems
> to be a glaring omission - support.

It is so obvious they probably just omitted to mention it... ;)

-- 

Best regards,

Charles
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Re: [tdf-discuss] Support For LibreOffice?

[Harold Fuchs]

On 4 October 2010 12:01, Charles Marcus  wrote:

> On 2010-10-04 4:35 AM, Harold Fuchs wrote:
> > Perhaps I've missed a thread somewhere but how do users of
> > LibreOffice get technical support?
> >
> > I noticed that someone called Sam (i...@libreofficeforum.org) set up
> > a forum at http://libreofficeforum.org/ but is that "the way"?
>
> I'm sure there will be multiple ways, but I would imagine that The
> Document Foundation site will ultimately house the 'official' support
> forums/discussion lists.
>
> I think we should all put on the brakes and give these guys a chance to
> get things settled. What they are doing is not easy, nor can it all be
> done in a day.
>
> --
>
> Best regards,
>
> Charles
>
>
I agree with that but they are setting up all sorts of infrastructure
including mailing lists for marketing, I18N etc. etc. and I was puzzled by
what seems to be a glaring omission - support.
-- 
Harold Fuchs
London, England
Please do *not* reply to my personal e-mail address

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[tdf-discuss] Installing LibreOffice Extensions

[Constantin Makshin]

Hi!

There are several extensions installed along with LibreOffice. Some of them 
depend on JRE and therefore cause errors when LibreOffice starts.

Wouldn't it be better to allow the user to select which extensions [s]he wants 
to install, adding a special [warning] note to ones that require JRE?

Thank you.
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Re: [tdf-discuss] OpenOffice and LibO user technical help requests

[Marc Paré]

 Le 2010-10-04 12:01, Christoph Noack a écrit :

Hi Marc,

thanks for pointing that out! To be honest, we weren't aware of so many
users ... so I'll ask our current "initial admin" to set up such a list
among the other ones that are currently planned.

See you!

Christoph

Thanks.  Once the mailist is up and running it may be a good idea to ask 
if we could all share the responsibility to help out with the 
trouble-shooting on the list. It is pretty exciting to participate in 
these discussions but we shouldn't forget those who need the immediate 
technical help. It would just be a case of dropping in the mailist and 
having a quick look around to see if we could help someone out. Not a 
big burden on all of us.


Cheers

Marc
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Re: [tdf-discuss] Libreoffice national domain name registrations

[Florian Effenberger]

Hi,

Am 04.10.2010 um 14:52 schrieb Sankarshan Mukhopadhyay:

> Can I also request that some form of guidelines be in place over the
> domain registrations ? Both in terms of checking whether the domains
> are being registered and handled properly and, infrequent sanity
> checks on the approved domains. For example, to begin with, would one
> desire to maintain a list of the domains and the period before their
> expiry so that renewal can happen without squatting ?
>
> I assume (and hope) that at some point the Foundation would perhaps
> want to take ownership in some form over the sub-domains and, ensuring
> that brand positioning does not get impacted. Having multiple country
> level domains pointing to the top level .org would require some bit of
> delicate coordination.

I'm working on it and collect all information. The plan is indeed to
have the domain names registered to the foundation as soon as possible.

Florian

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Re: [tdf-discuss] Libreoffice national domain name registrations

[Florian Effenberger]

Hi,

Am 04.10.2010 um 15:05 schrieb Danishka Navin:

> AFAIK, most of domains registered just after TDF announcement (28th
Sep) .
>
> We can schedule a mail to all TDF and LibO local domains holders on
> July or August of each year.
>
> But this wont required once TDF get full control on all regional
domains.
>
> I don't think this will be a big issue.

then plan is actually to transfer the domain names to the foundation
when possible ;)

Florian

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Re: [tdf-discuss] New Mailinglist: l...@libreoffice.org

[Sophie Gautier]

Hi Drew,

On Mon, Oct 4, 2010 at 7:09 PM, Drew Jensen  wrote:
> On Mon, 2010-10-04 at 18:40 +0200, André Schnabel wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> the mailing list for translation related work l...@libreoffice.org is up
>> and running.
>>
>> Subscription works as for the other lists:
>>    l10n+subscr...@libreoffice.org
>>    l10n+subscribe-dig...@libreoffice.org
>> Archives at http://www.libreoffice.org/lists/l10n/
>>
>> For all who are interested in translating LibO, workflows, setting up
>> the inital infrastructure ... please subscribe to the list.
>>
>> As we are translators and our workflow is related to the development,
>> please subscribe to libreoff...@lists.freedesktop.org as well. This
>> might help to get a common understanding of developer and translators :)
>>
>>
>
> Hello,
>
> The archive at http://documentfoundation.969070.n3.nabble.com/ has been
> updated with the new list.
>
> The direct link is:
> http://documentfoundation.969070.n3.nabble.com/L10n-f1630956.html

Great! Thanks :)
Kind regards
Sophie
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Re: [tdf-discuss] New Mailinglist: l...@libreoffice.org

[Drew Jensen]

On Mon, 2010-10-04 at 18:40 +0200, André Schnabel wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> the mailing list for translation related work l...@libreoffice.org is up 
> and running.
> 
> Subscription works as for the other lists:
>l10n+subscr...@libreoffice.org
>l10n+subscribe-dig...@libreoffice.org
> Archives at http://www.libreoffice.org/lists/l10n/
> 
> For all who are interested in translating LibO, workflows, setting up 
> the inital infrastructure ... please subscribe to the list.
> 
> As we are translators and our workflow is related to the development, 
> please subscribe to libreoff...@lists.freedesktop.org as well. This 
> might help to get a common understanding of developer and translators :)
> 
> 

Hello,

The archive at http://documentfoundation.969070.n3.nabble.com/ has been
updated with the new list.

The direct link is:
http://documentfoundation.969070.n3.nabble.com/L10n-f1630956.html

Drew

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[tdf-discuss] Unable to run LibreOffice from a normal account

[ApinderSingh]

OS:Fedora 13

Libreoffice is running fine if I use root account, but if I try to run it
from a normal user account, I am getting the following message

Fatal Error
The application cannot be started.
exceptionoccured raising singleton
"/singletons/com.sun.star.deployment.ExtensionManager":loading component
library failed:file:///opt/libreoffice3/program/../basis-link/program/
deploymentli.uno.so


Output of locate deploymentli.uno.so is
/opt/libreoffice3/basis3.3/program/deploymentli.uno.so


If I try from command line, the output is
/opt/libreoffice3/program/soffice.bin: /lib/libdb-4.7.so: no version
information available (required by
/opt/libreoffice3/program/../basis-link/program/libdeploymentmiscli.so)
followed by the above mentioned message.
Apinder Singh

Please avoid sending me Word or PowerPoint attachments.
See http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html

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[tdf-discuss] New Mailinglist: l...@libreoffice.org

[André Schnabel]

Hi,

the mailing list for translation related work l...@libreoffice.org is up 
and running.


Subscription works as for the other lists:
  l10n+subscr...@libreoffice.org
  l10n+subscribe-dig...@libreoffice.org
Archives at http://www.libreoffice.org/lists/l10n/

For all who are interested in translating LibO, workflows, setting up 
the inital infrastructure ... please subscribe to the list.


As we are translators and our workflow is related to the development, 
please subscribe to libreoff...@lists.freedesktop.org as well. This 
might help to get a common understanding of developer and translators :)



For people who are waiting for more lists: they will be created soon.

regards,

André
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[tdf-discuss] German IRC channels

[Florian Effenberger]

Hi,

I've just set up German IRC channels:

#documentfoundation-de
and
#libreoffice-de

Both are available on irc.freenode.net. The former one is for
discussions about The Document Foundation, and the latter one is for
discussions on LibreOffice and development.

Thanks,
Florian

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Re: [tdf-discuss] User participation - bugtracking

[Roman Gelbort]

El 02/10/10 17:07, Friedrich Strohmaier escribió:
> I heavily support this idea. I also saw different bugtracking systems.
> None of them can serve users, because all are developer tools to manage
> bugs and enhancement requests in a effective way. Thus each of them has
> to represent the complexity of that task. There always will be needed
> human filtering to avoid messed up bugtracking systems and
> developers. No problem with an enthusiastic Community ;o)).
>
>   
I agree 100% with this idea!

A team of comunity members can filtering the bugs and report them. How
to do, is subject of that team organization.

-- 
~~~
Prof. Román H. Gelbort
http://www.piensalibre.com.ar

10 años usando OpenOffice.org, libre, gratuito y seguro
~~~

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Re: [tdf-discuss] OpenOffice and LibO user technical help requests

[Christoph Noack]

Hi Marc,

thanks for pointing that out! To be honest, we weren't aware of so many
users ... so I'll ask our current "initial admin" to set up such a list
among the other ones that are currently planned.

See you!

Christoph

Am Montag, den 04.10.2010, 12:33 +0200 schrieb Italo Vignoli:
> Marc Paré wrote:
> >  There seems to be more and more open discussions on installing the LibO
> > software on the official Mandriva user-help discussion group
> > "us...@openoffice.org". As this is quite an active group, there is a lot
> > of trouble-shooting going as well as user support for the (now) official
> > Oracle OpenOffice Suite, there are a lot of questions re: the fate of
> > Oracle's OpenOffice.
> 
> People is working on mailing lists, there will be announcements very soon.
> 
> -- 
> Italo Vignoli
> Mobile: +39.348.5653829 - VoIP: +39.02.320621813
> Email: italo.vign...@gmail.com - Skype: italovignoli


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Re: [tdf-discuss] LibreOffice font typeset

[Christoph Noack]

Hi Alexandro!

Am Montag, den 04.10.2010, 04:11 -0500 schrieb Alexandro Colorado:
> > Vegur, is a free font easily available on the web
> >
> thanks 

Some of the community members made up an excellent page to show /
discuss different fonts. You may find further information and download
locations here:
http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Branding_Initiative/branding_guidelines_draft#Fonts

Cheers,
Christoph



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Re: [tdf-discuss] TDF spokespersons are here to help

[Charles Marcus]

On 2010-10-04 8:30 AM, Italo Vignoli wrote:
> If there are specific questions about the project, you can always get in
> touch with the Steering Committee members or with their deputies. We all
> have a TDF email: firstname.lastn...@documentfoundation.org. From the
> bio, it is easy to understand each one's areas of competence.

And if trying to figure out who to address a particular question/concern
to, here's the link to the only official whose-who I am aware of:

http://www.documentfoundation.org/contact/

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Re: [tdf-discuss] New name

[Carlos Rocha]

 Hi all,

I'm following this discussion with interest. As far I understood so far, 
the name "LibreOffice" was choosen by who decided to split with Oracle 
OpenOffice. They had the right to do so, no questions about that, and I 
appreciate their hard work for the sake of all of us. I thank them.



Also a very difficult thing is to find a good name that is not already
registered or trademarked as, unfortunately, most of the names are.



But if it was me I wouldn't think in anything else than 
OpenDocumentOffice.org. It says it all, and it could be easily be seen 
as OOffice, and the good, old, and beautiful OOo.
Go-oo would stand as it is now, OOForum.org could still exist as it is 
now, and so on.

A lot less painful IMHO.

Not 2 cents, just 1
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Re: [tdf-discuss] LibreOffice general ideas and suggestions

[Charles Marcus]

On 2010-10-04 9:45 AM, Nguyen Vu Hung wrote:
> On Mon, Oct 4, 2010 at 1:30 AM, Charles Marcus
>  wrote:
>> If a problem document contains information that cannot be shared, the
>> user either sanitizes it or doesn't share it.

> If we have to help MSO users migrating to ODT,
> I suggest that we need to focus on
> 
> MSO 2007, 2010 -> ODT conversion
> 
> and forget about the older MSO formats.
> The reasons are
> 
> 0. Basically the conversion works OK
> 1. We dont have to enough resoures.
> 3. MSO formats older than 2007 will fade out
> 4. Suggest them to keep the files as is, and using ODT when creating new
>files.

One of the things I started doing when Office 2007 was released was to
recommend that people configure their Office to save in the old formats.

That said, it made much more sense for me to do this back when MSO 2007
was first released than it does now, so I do see your point.

But, I disagree that we should totally ignore the older formats, for one
big reason: there are a *lot* of people still using Office 2000/XP/2003
that will not be upgrading anytime soon.

Also, if, as you say above, 'basically the conversion works ok', then
problems with older documents should be less frequent...

Of course it stands to reason that the developers should decide which
issues were to be fixed based on how much effort was required. This way
problems that were easy to fix could still be fixed.

Oh - and last - I'd really like to see the developers incorporate a
bounty system into the bug tracker, so that if a specific bug is near
and dear to someone's heart that wouldn't mind paying to have it fixed,
that could happen too.

-- 

Best regards,

Charles
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Re: [tdf-discuss] [DOC] User docs: planning ahead

[James Wilde]

On Oct 3, 2010, at 01:19 , Jean Hollis Weber wrote:

> I want to start developing a "wish list" for documentation for
ordinary
> users (things like user guides, howtos, FAQs, tutorials, training
> materials, and others). We won't have enough people to do everything
on
> the list, but it might encourage new people to contribute in areas
that
> most interest them.
>
> Some issues to consider are:
> * What audiences do we want to reach? What are their needs? Lots of
> overlap with training here.

If I may be allowed to suggest, there are three main markets to target.

1.  The very young.  Since LibO is free, they can get a first class
product at a price they can afford, and once they're hooked, they'll
stay with it.  People do.  And the very young are used to free things
from the Internet, but they are also more willing than older people to
actually send a donation for something that they use.  Young people do
that.  Old people buy licences and there is no LibO licence to buy.

2. The very old.  Often they've inherited a computer from someone else
in the family who has bought a new one, and they don't have the money to
buy pay-for products.

3. Corporations.  Who knows, if they get the equivalent of Microsoft's
product for nothing, maybe they'll donate something to the pool.

But I put my faith in 1 and 2.

//James

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OT: Evils of democracy - WAS: Re: [tdf-discuss] New name

[Charles Marcus]

On 2010-10-04 7:56 AM, Graham Lauder wrote:
>> There is a reason that the American Founders reviled democracies as one
>> > of the most evil creations man has ever come up with.
> The phrase was: "Democracy is the worst form of Government, except for all 
> the 
> others."

No, Winston Churchill said that, but it was:

"Democracy is the worst form of government except for all those others
that have been tried."

But he wasn't an American Founder, and that comment isn't what I was
referring to - I said what I meant and meant what I said.

Read any of the historical founding documents for America and you
quickly see the accuracy of my statement.

Democracy is 2 wolves and a sheep voting on whats for dinner. - always
has been, always will be. Once people discover that they can vote
themselves bread and circuses, a democracy is finished (witness what is
happening in America today).

America was originally created and is supposed to be a Constitutional
Republic - yes, incorporating certain democratic processes (ie, voting
for Representatives, etc), the difference being that in our
Constitutional republic, the power of Congress is strictly limited to
the delegated powers defined in the Constitution itself, and recognizing
that certain Rights are permanently outside the purview of said powers.

> There were errors made, fix the fallout, don't repeat

Voting for Ron Paul and other like minded citizens is about the only
shot we have of fixing it, but I don't hold out much hope, since most
people seem to think that stealing from one to give to someone else is ok.

-- 

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Charles
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Re: [tdf-discuss] New name

[Charles Marcus]

On 2010-10-04 12:18 AM, Drew Jensen wrote:
> It seems that people at the conference made decisions that affected
> all of us an with not so much as a by your leave to most of us.

Not sure who you mean by 'us', but the principles in the newly
established organization that will become the Foundation will have to
make a lot of decisions without consulting 'us'.

I think too much is being made of this.

There is a reason that the American Founders reviled democracies as one
of the most evil creations man has ever come up with.

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[tdf-discuss] Website status?

[jzacsh]

Hi,

What is the status of allowing volunteers to help improve the website? I signed 
up to discuss with this sole purpose.

The site as it is currently, with _out_ a new CMS, needs proper xhtml/CSS 
rendition of the image-based design its using.

I started rewriting the website in exact duplication to show that it really 
would be exactly the same visually, except it would be crawlable and 
standardized.

I stopped my rewrite, but stopped however because I thought, "this is an open 
source project, they'll at least share copies of the PHP files and let us do 
the work in a more direct/efficient manner".

If its a matter of security and the PHP files can't be distributed, might 
someone say so? I'll gladly send a patch of the html output and the CSS files 
(of course that would mean someone will have to figure out how to pull that 
back into the php, but at least the images currently used might get fixed).

So I'm just looking for a definitive answer: Will anyone be giving us access to 
any way we can help with the website? I'd hate to be pushy, but I wake up with 
70 emails a morning from the "discuss" list and I'd like to help with what I'm 
knowledgeable in. There's no way I'm reading through some kind of digest just 
to see if the website has been addressed.

Please let me know.  :P


Jonathan Zacsh
http://jzaksh.com/
732.660.8184

Re: [tdf-discuss] Support For LibreOffice?

[Charles Marcus]

On 2010-10-04 4:35 AM, Harold Fuchs wrote:
> Perhaps I've missed a thread somewhere but how do users of
> LibreOffice get technical support?
> 
> I noticed that someone called Sam (i...@libreofficeforum.org) set up 
> a forum at http://libreofficeforum.org/ but is that "the way"?

I'm sure there will be multiple ways, but I would imagine that The
Document Foundation site will ultimately house the 'official' support
forums/discussion lists.

I think we should all put on the brakes and give these guys a chance to
get things settled. What they are doing is not easy, nor can it all be
done in a day.

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Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Error compiling slideshow

[Friedrich Strohmaier]

Hi Thorsten, *,

Thorsten Behrens schrieb:

[..]

>Let's keep development/code-related discussions on the libreoffice
>list. :)

.. which is
libreoff...@lists.freedesktop.org

to subscribe go:
http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice

;o))

Gruß/regards
-- 
Friedrich

Ansprechpartner / contact person for the "PrOOo-Box"
german language OpenOffice.org and more on CD/DVD 
http://prooo-box.org 


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Re: [tdf-discuss] OpenOffice and LibO user technical help requests

[Italo Vignoli]

Marc Paré wrote:
>  There seems to be more and more open discussions on installing the LibO
> software on the official Mandriva user-help discussion group
> "us...@openoffice.org". As this is quite an active group, there is a lot
> of trouble-shooting going as well as user support for the (now) official
> Oracle OpenOffice Suite, there are a lot of questions re: the fate of
> Oracle's OpenOffice.

People is working on mailing lists, there will be announcements very soon.

-- 
Italo Vignoli
Mobile: +39.348.5653829 - VoIP: +39.02.320621813
Email: italo.vign...@gmail.com - Skype: italovignoli
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Re: [tdf-discuss] [GENERAL] New name

[Friedrich Strohmaier]

Hi Varun, *,

Varun Mittal schrieb:

>I have been reading the arguments and come to a simple suggestion.
>Lets create a poll( a lot of free sites, out there), and let everyone
> vote. We can list all the suggested names and whichever is preferred
> by community be acceptable

I'm not amused to see forces to be splitted, needed to bring up new
infrastructure. If You and others think no power is lost by going in
that discussion then do it.

>I personally feel, no sustainable product was made or lost because of
> its name. Name is important but not the most important :)

>How do you guys feel about the poll approach. meanwhile anyone
> supporting a name can give their reasons and try to convince others.

Considering the work already done to come up to where we are now [1],
I'm in doubt whether this approach gives any advantage to the project
and the communities work.

[1] 
http://luxate.blogspot.com/2010/10/agreeing-on-childs-name-simple-task.html

As mentioned earlier by others: There won't be a solution satisfying
every community member - at least not within any reasonable period of
time.

> This way none accuses anyone of anything and we focus our energy on
> more important things.

I doubt, that will be stopped that way. There will be winners an loosers
and who likes to loose? :o))

>If you guys agree, I am ready to take responsibility of creating and
>reporting the results of poll.

Start, if You don't have any idea to bring in your work on some other
place of LibO.

If once the community infrastructure and the production process is
put on its feet, I'll support a "name fork" which can show the power of
a more smooth name by "feet poll" - winner by download rates ;o)).

Just my 2¢(€) :o))

[.. recycled TOFU ..]

Gruß/regards
-- 
Friedrich

Ansprechpartner / contact person for the "PrOOo-Box"
german language OpenOffice.org and more on CD/DVD 
http://prooo-box.org 

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Re: [tdf-discuss] New name

[Thorsten Behrens]

Graham Lauder wrote:
> > We don't "own" anything. We have simply started the process, and we have
> > tried to push it forward putting all our enthusiasm and energies behind
 i
>
> I'm sorry, if it's offlist, then for the majority of community members it
's
> secret. That may not seem that way to you, but for the vast majority of t
he
> community it is.
> You can see how this can give the impression that we have another Sun
> situation going on, critical decisions made away from the community with a
> fait accompli handed to us on a plate.  "Here you are, like it or lump it
!"
>
Yes, we're aware of that danger. Please do remind us on our
obligation to be open and transparent (see our mission statement)
anytime you see a problem.

Our excuse is that we tried to involve at least one prominent
representative from each group inside the large OOo family, and
taking their suggestions seriously.

To paraphrase Italo - we basically drafted the train, laid the first
ten meters of tracks - and now it's up to all of us to write the
future. What generally works best for each of you individually is to
actually do something - there's an abundance of stuff waiting to
be done - and she who does, usually decides. That's why we called for
a meritocracy.

> What would have been so hard about putting together something to
> post to all the lists at the same time as the press release.
> It seems there were some areas, like looking after the community,
> that were ignored. (Odd since it says "open and transparent" in
> the Vision Statement)
>
Hm, I thought we had quite some posts - most prominently the one on
the announce list? If you personally felt left in the dark, please
accept my apologies - there were no bad intentions, just that a few
things got dropped apparently - we're a huge community by all kinds
of measure.

> How were we to know how long this had been going on, this secret
> society, planning on the quiet.  Even now a week after the press
> were told we're only getting some info in dribs and drabs because
> some of the secret society seem to be getting a guilt attack.
>
What info are you missing?

Cheers,

-- Thorsten

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[tdf-discuss] TechRepublic post about LibreOffice

[Alexandro Colorado]

Just to keep the media coverage, this is the article by Jack Wallen about
LibreOffice:

http://blogs.techrepublic.com.com/opensource/?p79&tag=nl.e101

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[tdf-discuss] OpenOffice and LibO user technical help requests

[Marc Paré]

 There seems to be more and more open discussions on installing the 
LibO software on the official Mandriva user-help discussion group 
"us...@openoffice.org". As this is quite an active group, there is a lot 
of trouble-shooting going as well as user support for the (now) official 
Oracle OpenOffice Suite, there are a lot of questions re: the fate of 
Oracle's OpenOffice.


I fear that if they end up on the LibO mailist, these users may find the 
threads too chaotic and wild for any of their request for support. Would 
it make sense then to open up a mailist similar to the 
"us...@openoffice.org" to help out with the support aspect of the suite? 
I think that collectively we could help out while they transition from 
the OpenOffice to LibO suite. They are mostly every day users who are 
not interested in helping out with the creation of the LibreOffice site.


We shouldn't lose sight of the fact that we will gain more users if we 
can help them without causing them too much concern. If we can create a 
"us...@libreoffice.org" mailist, then it would sit comfortably and 
familiar with them. Or even better if called 
"usersupp...@libreoffice.org" or something else that is specifically 
there for obvious user technical help. I have been on the 
us...@openoffice.org forever and the people who make use of it are quite 
a transient group. The majority of them are people just looking for 
immediate technical help that they need on a document or settings.


Is there anything that we could do for them? I believe that we have 
people here now who are/were regulars on that particular mailist. We 
could help them out with their problems. Maybe there is something here 
already for them?


The LibO user mailist would have to be well advertised and very visible 
on the main LibreOffice site to be useful. Most of these users have 
little experience on using the suite and just want a quick spot to ask 
for help.


Marc
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Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Error compiling slideshow

[Nguyen Vu Hung]

On Mon, Oct 4, 2010 at 1:49 PM, Thorsten Behrens
 wrote:
>> I haved  a line
>>
>> #undef GLX_VERSION_1_3 to the top of the following file
>>
>> source/engine/OGLTrans/OGLTrans_TransitionerImpl.cxx:#if defined(
>> GLX_VERSION_1_3 ) && defined( GLX_EXT_texture_from_pixmap )
>>
>> then re configure and make.
>>
>> Everything seems fine now.
>>
> Thanks for hunting this down - could you extract a proper patch from
> your sources, so we can fix this once and for all?
>
> Let's keep development/code-related discussions on the libreoffice
> list. :)
I tried to fix, but the compilation went for a while and bas stopped
with the same error.

So forget about what I said :)

# I am not a programmer.

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Re: [tdf-discuss] New name

[Graham Lauder]

On Monday 04 Oct 2010 23:54:43 Charles Marcus wrote:
> On 2010-10-04 12:18 AM, Drew Jensen wrote:
> > It seems that people at the conference made decisions that affected
> > all of us an with not so much as a by your leave to most of us.
> 
> Not sure who you mean by 'us', but the principles in the newly
> established organization that will become the Foundation will have to
> make a lot of decisions without consulting 'us'.
> 
> I think too much is being made of this.
> 
> There is a reason that the American Founders reviled democracies as one
> of the most evil creations man has ever come up with.

The phrase was: "Democracy is the worst form of Government, except for all the 
others."

There were errors made, fix the fallout, don't repeat

Cheers
GL 

-- 
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OpenOffice.org MarCon (Marketing Contact) NZ
http://marketing.openoffice.org/contacts.html

OpenOffice.org Migration and training Consultant.

INGOTs Assessor Trainer
(International Grades in Open Technologies)
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Re: [tdf-discuss] New name

[Graham Lauder]

On Monday 04 Oct 2010 23:06:39 Italo Vignoli wrote:
> James Wilde wrote:
> > As I understand it, most of the development team of OOo jumped ship to
> > set up LibO in anticipation of Oracle making unacceptable changes to the
> > OOo concept.  I don't know how many they are, but I'd be surprised if
> > they're over 30, and as far as I and most users are concerned, they
> > "own" the product.
>
> We don't "own" anything. We have simply started the process, and we have
> tried to push it forward putting all our enthusiasm and energies behind i
t.
>
> The process has started a long time before the conference in Budapest,
> where there have not been any "parallel" or "secret" sessions. We have
> been there as regular OOo community members.

I'm sorry, if it's offlist, then for the majority of community members it's

secret. That may not seem that way to you, but for the vast majority of the

community it is.
You can see how this can give the impression that we have another Sun
situation going on, critical decisions made away from the community with a

fait accompli handed to us on a plate.  "Here you are, like it or lump it!"


>
> As far as the process of creation of the group is concerned, I would say
> that has been very "natural": i.e. we have started discussing the
> problem over beers at OOo conferences, then we have started to write
> emails and sometimes discuss the subject over the phone or Skype.
>
> Those that were in the loop are part of the group of founding members:
> there has not been any deliberate process for bringing in "friends". We
> have all "earned" - if I can use this term - the right to belong to the
> group based on merit and contribution.
>
> > But the point is, the 30 or whatever developers have been planning this
> > for some time.  They didn't launch LibO after a beer last Friday, and
> > they, for better or worse, chose LibreOffice as the name.
>
> There is one single concept that has not been raised during the
> discussion about the name: the OOo (and now LibO) community is in the
> same marketplace as corporations with a turnover of tens of billions of
> dollars. Brand names and trademarks are key for protecting the software
> and the foundation, and our lawyers have suggested to come out with a
> name which was difficult or impossible to attack.
>
> I think that it is time to concentrate on the development of the
> community and the software. As far as I am concerned, LibreOffice is
> terrible for Italian speakers, but LibO is nice and cute, especially if
> you pronounce it with an accent on the last letter: Libò.
>
> In any case, thanks for the discussion. Your interest in the project
> shows that we are on the right track.

So perhaps what will come out of this is that we will get a conference out
of
Europe, so those of us on the other side of the world who have to spend
obscene amounts of money to get there, might just find ourselves "in the
loop".

The issue that I find frustrating is that no-one felt it necessary to infor
m
the community, I got an email from someone who knows me as the MarCon for N
Z
asking: "What's going on with this?"  I had to say I didn't know.

What would have been so hard about putting together something to post to al
l
the lists at the same time as the press release.  It seems there were some

areas, like looking after the community, that were ignored. (Odd since it s
ays
"open and transparent" in the Vision Statement)

How were we to know how long this had been going on, this secret society,
planning on the quiet.  Even now a week after the press were told we're onl
y
getting some info in dribs and drabs because some of the secret society see
m
to be getting a guilt attack.

This is not a good look.

GL
--
Graham Lauder,
OpenOffice.org MarCon (Marketing Contact) NZ
http://marketing.openoffice.org/contacts.html

OpenOffice.org Migration and training Consultant.

INGOTs Assessor Trainer
(International Grades in Open Technologies)
www.theingots.org
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Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: [Libreoffice] LibreOffice hacking / compiling

[Charles Marcus]

On 2010-10-04 2:49 AM, Norbert Thiebaud wrote:
>> let's move code-related discussions over to the libreoffice dev
>> list.

> I'm confused. What is this list for then ?

General discussions? It is named the 'discuss' list after all.

*All* projects have separate lists for strictly development/code related
discussions - they are confusing to non-developers.

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Re: [tdf-discuss] Libreoffice national domain name registrations

[Danishka Navin]

AFAIK, most of domains registered just after TDF announcement (28th Sep) .

We can schedule a mail to all TDF and LibO local domains holders on
July or August of each year.

But this wont required once TDF get full control on all regional domains.

I don't think this will be a big issue.


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Re: [tdf-discuss] User participation - bugtracking

[Nguyen Vu Hung]

On Mon, Oct 4, 2010 at 1:41 AM, Charles Marcus
 wrote:
>> So I read this correctly and you volunteer as bug-filter? :)
>
> Not sure what you mean by 'bug-filter', but I would absolutely volunteer
> to help in triaging (confirming it is a real bug/document formatting
> problem, making sure it isn't a known issue, etc) end user bug reports
> and problem documents.

You make the bug understandable and reproducable, get it assigned by develo
pers.

>
> 1. Making it simple for end users to report bugs means more bug reports
> will be made, and
>
> 2. Providing a way for non-developers to assist in triaging said bug
> reports means those bug reports will be filtered/confirmed before being
> reported to developers, so less developer time will be wasted
> non-developers can make meaningful contributions to the process.



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[tdf-discuss] Re: [Libreoffice] Compile problems

[Michael Meeks]

On Mon, 2010-10-04 at 08:26 -0500, Marco ''AlpVonKri'' Flores wrote:
> And now that you mention it, I'll try to do the compilation process
> without mono support, to see what happens, and yes it seems like I
> have a complete installation, but I want one "Error Free". n_n

Ah - but this is a warning, not an error - it just happens to happen
right at the end of the process ;-)

So - in fact you're good to go. We could improve the warning of course
- patches welcome :-)

ATB,

Michael.

-- 
 michael.me...@novell.com  <><, Pseudo Engineer, itinerant idiot


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Re: [tdf-discuss] OpenOffice and LibO user technical help requests

[Jesús Corrius]

> So far there is a forum for support  at http://libreofficeforum.org we
have
> locales for Spanish, English and German. Hope this will help, there are
> locale infrastructure being worked out right now.

I don't think an external page with Google ads in every page is the
best place to get support. I don't think this is the kind of image the
The Document Foundation should give.

Just my 5 cents.

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Re: [tdf-discuss] Libreoffice national domain name registrations

[Sankarshan Mukhopadhyay]

On Sun, Oct 3, 2010 at 2:22 AM, Florian Effenberger
 wrote:

> yep, I take care of it. ;)

Can I also request that some form of guidelines be in place over the
domain registrations ? Both in terms of checking whether the domains
are being registered and handled properly and, infrequent sanity
checks on the approved domains. For example, to begin with, would one
desire to maintain a list of the domains and the period before their
expiry so that renewal can happen without squatting ?

I assume (and hope) that at some point the Foundation would perhaps
want to take ownership in some form over the sub-domains and, ensuring
that brand positioning does not get impacted. Having multiple country
level domains pointing to the top level .org would require some bit of
delicate coordination.

-- 
sankarshan mukhopadhyay

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Re: [tdf-discuss] New name

[Italo Vignoli]

James Wilde wrote:

> As I understand it, most of the development team of OOo jumped ship to 
> set up LibO in anticipation of Oracle making unacceptable changes to the 
> OOo concept.  I don't know how many they are, but I'd be surprised if 
> they're over 30, and as far as I and most users are concerned, they 
> "own" the product.

We don't "own" anything. We have simply started the process, and we have
tried to push it forward putting all our enthusiasm and energies behind it.

The process has started a long time before the conference in Budapest,
where there have not been any "parallel" or "secret" sessions. We have
been there as regular OOo community members.

As far as the process of creation of the group is concerned, I would say
that has been very "natural": i.e. we have started discussing the
problem over beers at OOo conferences, then we have started to write
emails and sometimes discuss the subject over the phone or Skype.

Those that were in the loop are part of the group of founding members:
there has not been any deliberate process for bringing in "friends". We
have all "earned" - if I can use this term - the right to belong to the
group based on merit and contribution.

> But the point is, the 30 or whatever developers have been planning this 
> for some time.  They didn't launch LibO after a beer last Friday, and 
> they, for better or worse, chose LibreOffice as the name.

There is one single concept that has not been raised during the
discussion about the name: the OOo (and now LibO) community is in the
same marketplace as corporations with a turnover of tens of billions of
dollars. Brand names and trademarks are key for protecting the software
and the foundation, and our lawyers have suggested to come out with a
name which was difficult or impossible to attack.

I think that it is time to concentrate on the development of the
community and the software. As far as I am concerned, LibreOffice is
terrible for Italian speakers, but LibO is nice and cute, especially if
you pronounce it with an accent on the last letter: Libò.

In any case, thanks for the discussion. Your interest in the project
shows that we are on the right track.

-- 
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Mobile: +39.348.5653829 - VoIP: +39.02.320621813
Email: italo.vign...@gmail.com - Skype: italovignoli
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[tdf-discuss] Support For LibreOffice?

[Harold Fuchs]

Perhaps I've missed a thread somewhere but how do users of LibreOffice get
technical support?

I noticed that someone called Sam (i...@libreofficeforum.org) set up a forum
at http://libreofficeforum.org/ but is that "the way"?

-- 
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Re: [tdf-discuss] New name

[Jide Ogunmekan]

Jide Ogunmekan

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On Mon, Oct 4, 2010 at 11:59 AM, Charles Marcus
wrote:

> On 2010-10-04 3:45 AM, James Wilde wrote:
> > But the point is, the 30 or whatever developers have been planning this
> > for some time.  They didn't launch LibO after a beer last Friday, and
> > they, for better or worse, chose LibreOffice as the name.
> >
> > We're never going to get nearer than 10% agreement however many names w
e
> > suggest or polls we run, so let's live with their name, be grateful for
> > their enthusiasm and let them get on with turning 3.3 beta into 3.3
> > release instead of slagging them for being undemocratic or dictatorial.
>
> +10
>
> --
>
> Best regards,
>
> Charles
> --
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> deleted.
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>
> Hi all

nuff said. I think what needs to be done now is to proceed with the
application - deliver existing features and extend with new and exciting
stuff that will make it stand out. The name can be reviewed and presented
after some great features that distinguish is have been added.

By the way. The name may or may not make a difference. Here is how it works
.
In a virgin market it may not matter much. In a crowded and mature market,
it has competition and will matter sooner or later. But till then lets make
it the best office app there is out there.

Oh! I would suggest the name "Liberty" if and whenever the time is right.

M two cents

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Re: [tdf-discuss] OpenOffice and LibO user technical help requests

[Alexandro Colorado]

On Mon, Oct 4, 2010 at 5:29 AM, Marc Paré  wrote:

>  There seems to be more and more open discussions on installing the LibO
> software on the official Mandriva user-help discussion group "
> us...@openoffice.org". As this is quite an active group, there is a lot o
f
> trouble-shooting going as well as user support for the (now) official Ora
cle
> OpenOffice Suite, there are a lot of questions re: the fate of Oracle's
> OpenOffice.
>
> I fear that if they end up on the LibO mailist, these users may find the
> threads too chaotic and wild for any of their request for support. Would
it
> make sense then to open up a mailist similar to the "us...@openoffice.org
"
> to help out with the support aspect of the suite? I think that collective
ly
> we could help out while they transition from the OpenOffice to LibO suite
.
> They are mostly every day users who are not interested in helping out wit
h
> the creation of the LibreOffice site.
>

So far there is a forum for support  at http://libreofficeforum.org we have
locales for Spanish, English and German. Hope this will help, there are
locale infrastructure being worked out right now.

I think this mailing list is also a bit restricted (not many tools like a
majordomo one).


>
> We shouldn't lose sight of the fact that we will gain more users if we ca
n
> help them without causing them too much concern. If we can create a "
> us...@libreoffice.org" mailist, then it would sit comfortably and familia
r
> with them. Or even better if called "usersupp...@libreoffice.org" or
> something else that is specifically there for obvious user technical help
. I
> have been on the us...@openoffice.org forever and the people who make use
> of it are quite a transient group. The majority of them are people just
> looking for immediate technical help that they need on a document or
> settings.
>
> Is there anything that we could do for them? I believe that we have peopl
e
> here now who are/were regulars on that particular mailist. We could help
> them out with their problems. Maybe there is something here already for
> them?
>
> The LibO user mailist would have to be well advertised and very visible o
n
> the main LibreOffice site to be useful. Most of these users have little
> experience on using the suite and just want a quick spot to ask for help.
>
> Marc
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>


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Re: [tdf-discuss] LibreOffice font typeset

[Alexandro Colorado]

On Mon, Oct 4, 2010 at 3:57 AM, Italo Vignoli wrot
e:

> Alexandro Colorado wrote:
> > What font does LibreOffice use?
>
> Vegur, is a free font easily available on the web
>

thanks


>
> --
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>
>


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[tdf-discuss] Error compiling LibreOffice for Win32 (WinXP)

[robert.se...@roby.hr]

 Hello to all,

I have error in extraction source code.
Please can you see what is problem?

System: Windows XP
Compiling via Cygwin
User type: administrator
autogen parameters (taken from OOo 3.3):
./autogen.sh  --with-distro=LibreOfficeWin32 --with-git
--with-num-cpus=2 --disable-odk  --disable-build-mozilla
--with-lang="hr" --with-use-shell=bash --disable-activex --with-win32
--with-cl-home="/cygdrive/c/Program Files/Microsoft Visual Studio
9.0/VC"
--with-csc-path="/cygdrive/c/WINDOWS/Microsoft.NET/Framework/v3.5"
--with-midl-path="/cygdrive/c/Program Files/Microsoft
SDKs/Windows/v6.1/Bin" --with-frame-home="/cygdrive/c/Program
Files/Microsoft SDKs/Windows/v6.1" --with-ant-home=/apache-ant-1.7.1
--with-jdk-home="/cygdrive/c/Program Files/Java/jdk1.6.0_18"
--with-nsis-path="/cygdrive/c/Program Files/NSIS"
--with-psdk-home="/cygdrive/c/Program Files/Microsoft SDKs/Windows/v6.1"
--disable-atl --disable-nss-module --without-junit --disable-fetch-external


Error output:
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/grey-plus.png: Cannot change
ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/green-last-inactive.png: Cannot
change ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/green-last.png: Cannot change
ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/blue-left-inactive.png: Cannot
change ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/red-last.png: Cannot change
ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/green-right.png: Cannot change
ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/simple-left-inactive.png: Cannot
change ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/gorilla-right-inactive.png: Cannot
change ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/yellow-text.png: Cannot change
ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/gorilla-plus.png: Cannot change
ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/simple-last.png: Cannot change
ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/gorilla-last-inactive.png: Cannot
change ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/yellow-plus.png: Cannot change
ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/gorilla-first-inactive.png: Cannot
change ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/red-right-inactive.png: Cannot
change ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/simple-first-inactive.png: Cannot
change ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/yellow-right-inactive.png: Cannot
change ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/grey-first-inactive.png: Cannot
change ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/blue-left.png: Cannot change
ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/grey-last.png: Cannot change
ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/yellow-left-inactive.png: Cannot
change ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/red-nav.png: Cannot change ownership
to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/gorilla-right.png: Cannot change
ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/blue-right.png: Cannot change
ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/grey-nav.png: Cannot change
ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/simple-last-inactive.png: Cannot
change ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/green-left.png: Cannot change
ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/red-first.png: Cannot change
ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/green-right-inactive.png: Cannot
change ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/grey-last-inactive.png: Cannot
change ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/blue-first-inactive.png: Cannot
change ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/green-text.png: Cannot change
ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/grey-left.png: Cannot change
ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/yellow

[tdf-discuss] Re: Error compiling slideshow

[Thorsten Behrens]

Nguyen Vu Hung wrote:
> 2010/10/2 Jesús Corrius 
>
> > > [vuh...@www2 slideshow]$ rpm -qf /usr/include/GL/glxext.h
> > > mesa-libGL-devel-6.5.1-7.8.el5
> > >
> > > This is the standard rpm on CentOS 5.5 that I has installed with yum
in
> st
> > al
> >
> > This mesa version is more than 4 years old and the problem may be
> > related to that.
> >
> > I assume that CentOS 5.5 is technically indentical to Redhat 5.5. So
>
> Question: Does anyone gets the similar problem on Redhat?
>
> Looks like the following ifdef:
> >
> > #if defined( GLX_VERSION_1_3 ) && defined( GLX_EXT_texture_from_pixmap )
> >
> > doesn't work well with your version of the mesa package. The program
> > will probably compile if you undefine one of the constants above, but
> > I am unsure about the side effects.
> >
> > Ignore the side effects we may encounter,
>
> I haved  a line
>
> #undef GLX_VERSION_1_3 to the top of the following file
>
> source/engine/OGLTrans/OGLTrans_TransitionerImpl.cxx:#if defined(
> GLX_VERSION_1_3 ) && defined( GLX_EXT_texture_from_pixmap )
>
> then re configure and make.
>
> Everything seems fine now.
>
Thanks for hunting this down - could you extract a proper patch from
your sources, so we can fix this once and for all?

Let's keep development/code-related discussions on the libreoffice
list. :)

Cheers,

-- Thorsten

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[tdf-discuss] Re: LibreOffice hacking / compiling (was: Re: LibreOffice compile error)

[Thorsten Behrens]

Gökçen Eraslan wrote:
> 02 Ekim 2010 Cumartesi günü (saat 16:18:39) Gökçen Er
as
> lan şunları yazmıştı:
> > we
> > export LDFLAGS variable as:
> >
> > LDFLAGS="-Wl,-O1 -Wl,-z,relro -Wl,--hash-style=gnu
> > -Wl,--as-needed -Wl,
> > --sort-common"
> >
> > and all packages compiles fine with those flags, including ooo-build-3.
2.98.1.
> >
> > But with libreoffice I got:
> >
> > configure: error: unrecognized option: `-Wl,--hash-style=gnu'
> > Try `./configure --help' for more information
> >
> > Any ideas about that?
>
> I've fixed the other error that I've mentioned but this still continues.
>
Hi Gökçen,

let's move code-related discussions over to the libreoffice dev
list.

Cheers,

-- Thorsten

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Re: [tdf-discuss] The Document Foundation Sri Lankan Community

[Florian Effenberger]

Hi Danishka,

Am 04.10.2010 um 14:18 schrieb Danishka Navin:

> Highly appreciate if you could join with the local community [1] as well.
> 
> We are working as a local community of The Document Foundation.
> We will be support and organize awareness and release events
> for all products owned by The Document Foundation.
> 
> http://groups.google.com/group/tdf-lk

thank you very much for your engagement, that's truly appreciated!

Florian

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Mobile: +49 151 14424108
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[tdf-discuss] The Document Foundation Sri Lankan Community

[Danishka Navin]

Dear Sri Lankans,

Highly appreciate if you could join with the local community [1] as well.

We are working as a local community of The Document Foundation.
We will be support and organize awareness and release events
for all products owned by The Document Foundation.

http://groups.google.com/group/tdf-lk

Best Regards,
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Re: [tdf-discuss] OpenOffice and LibO user technical help requests

[Charles-H. Schulz]

Hi,

Le Mon, 4 Oct 2010 13:42:58 +0200,
Jesús Corrius  a écrit :

> > So far there is a forum for support  at http://libreofficeforum.org
> > we
> have
> > locales for Spanish, English and German. Hope this will help, there
> > are locale infrastructure being worked out right now.
>
> I don't think an external page with Google ads in every page is the
> best place to get support. I don't think this is the kind of image the
> The Document Foundation should give.
>
> Just my 5 cents.
>

well, this forum is not the official one anyway. We will open one or
cooperate with everyone interested, but no, no ads.

--
Charles-H. Schulz
Membre du Comité exécutif
The Document Foundation.
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Re: [tdf-discuss] [GENERAL] New name

[Christoph Noack]

Hi Graham, all!

Am Montag, den 04.10.2010, 13:55 +1300 schrieb Graham Lauder:
> On Monday 04 Oct 2010 10:10:41 Charles-H. Schulz wrote:
> > Folks,
> > 
> > Let me clear so that we can move on: Unless Oracle gives us the trademark o
> > f
> > OpenOffice.org, we're using LibreOffice, and some people love it, some
> > people hate it, but as a matter of fact, we're not changing it anymore, so
> > it's useless to request a change.
[...]
> 
> Tsk Charles, that's a rather dictatorial attitude for an Open Source project. 
>  
> Everything should be open for discussion at all times and given that 
> LibreOffice was selected as only an interim name and until Oracle says Yay or 
> Nay it remains interim or a draft concept, then I would suggest now is the 
> best time to discuss it.  
> 
> Document Foundation is obviously cast in stone because that is a legal entity 
> but the product name should be up for discussion right now when it's most 
> sensible.

Mmh, Charles, please don't overreact ... everybody on this list and
within this community has the right to question whether a name is
appropriate. Moreover, nobody knows if it simply came up when sipping on
a cocktail (slurp), or if somebody invested a lot of work. To all, I
think Charles is a bit stressed concerning names at the moment :-) Soon
you will know why.

However, until now I wasn't aware of Charles message. But yesterday,
I've noticed that there have been many questions and proposals
concerning the name. Maybe reasonable timing ... So I started to
summarize the "process" to agree on the "backup name" within our group
(in this case, group is the bunch of people who aim for the foundation).
I hope you will find it an interesting reading ... let me know (if not
*G*).

Here is the posting:
http://luxate.blogspot.com/2010/10/agreeing-on-childs-name-simple-task.html

And already on the new planet (yeah!):
http://planet.documentfoundation.org/

Does it sound reasonable?

Cheers,
Christoph

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Re: [tdf-discuss] New name

[James Wilde]

As I understand it, most of the development team of OOo jumped ship to
set up LibO in anticipation of Oracle making unacceptable changes to the
OOo concept.  I don't know how many they are, but I'd be surprised if
they're over 30, and as far as I and most users are concerned, they
"own" the product.  Many of those of us in here appear to be jumping on
the bandwagon after the event, and some of us will stay, and others will
relapse into being grateful users who understand that they don't
actually have much to offer.  I probably belong in this latter group.

But the point is, the 30 or whatever developers have been planning this
for some time.  They didn't launch LibO after a beer last Friday, and
they, for better or worse, chose LibreOffice as the name.

We're never going to get nearer than 10% agreement however many names we
suggest or polls we run, so let's live with their name, be grateful for
their enthusiasm and let them get on with turning 3.3 beta into 3.3
release instead of slagging them for being undemocratic or dictatorial.

Viva LibO

Just my $0.02

//James
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[tdf-discuss] Re: LibreOffice hacking / compiling (was: Re: LibreOffice compile error)

[Thorsten Behrens]

Norbert Thiebaud wrote:
> I'm confused. What is this list for then ?
>
Which one? ;)

discuss at tdf : general discussion
libreoffice at fd.o : actual LibreOffice development

Cheers,

-- Thorsten

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[tdf-discuss] my letter to Oracle

[Deniz Öğüt]

Dear Friends,

I sent a letter to Oracle via Oracle Turkey General Manager.

Here is a copy: http://marenostrum.blogsome.com/2010/10/04/oraclea-mektubum/

The letter is a little bit tricky to translate.

Mainly I stated what written in the Foundation's press release.

I asked them to donate the OpenOffice.org name.

I told that, we, Free Sotware supporters are not the serfs as told in
Gogol's  "Dead souls".

I told that -from our front-  what should be done will be done and its their
company's decision to decide what to do from their side.

I even told that we would be more than happy if Oracle supports the
Foundation in some way.

I was polite in sense of languange.

Just for your info.


Deniz

Istanbul, Turkey

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Re: [tdf-discuss] [General] DocumentFoundation US group

[Italo Vignoli]

Drew Jensen wrote:

> The group will also look at the possibility of setting up a US
> non-profit as a sister organization to the International organization.
> 
> So - if you are in the USA and would be interested in being part of this
> early working group please contact me directly.

Hi Drew, please keep me in the loop, as I would like to support any
local effort with some marketing and communication support. I am not
based in the US, but I know the importante of that country for the
success of the entire project.

I am the member of TDF Steering Committee coordinating marketing and
communications. Thanks for your efforts, Italo

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[tdf-discuss] Fwd: Error compiling LibreOffice for Win32 (WinXP)

[Robert Sedak]

 Hello to all,

I have error in extraction source code.
Please can you see what is problem?

System: Windows XP
Compiling via Cygwin
User type: administrator
autogen parameters (taken from OOo 3.3):
./autogen.sh  --with-distro=LibreOfficeWin32 --with-git
--with-num-cpus=2 --disable-odk  --disable-build-mozilla
--with-lang="hr" --with-use-shell=bash --disable-activex --with-win32
--with-cl-home="/cygdrive/c/Program Files/Microsoft Visual Studio
9.0/VC"
--with-csc-path="/cygdrive/c/WINDOWS/Microsoft.NET/Framework/v3.5"
--with-midl-path="/cygdrive/c/Program Files/Microsoft
SDKs/Windows/v6.1/Bin" --with-frame-home="/cygdrive/c/Program
Files/Microsoft SDKs/Windows/v6.1" --with-ant-home=/apache-ant-1.7.1
--with-jdk-home="/cygdrive/c/Program Files/Java/jdk1.6.0_18"
--with-nsis-path="/cygdrive/c/Program Files/NSIS"
--with-psdk-home="/cygdrive/c/Program Files/Microsoft SDKs/Windows/v6.1"
--disable-atl --disable-nss-module --without-junit --disable-fetch-external


Error output:
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/grey-plus.png: Cannot change
ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/green-last-inactive.png: Cannot
change ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/green-last.png: Cannot change
ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/blue-left-inactive.png: Cannot
change ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/red-last.png: Cannot change
ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/green-right.png: Cannot change
ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/simple-left-inactive.png: Cannot
change ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/gorilla-right-inactive.png: Cannot
change ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/yellow-text.png: Cannot change
ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/gorilla-plus.png: Cannot change
ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/simple-last.png: Cannot change
ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/gorilla-last-inactive.png: Cannot
change ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/yellow-plus.png: Cannot change
ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/gorilla-first-inactive.png: Cannot
change ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/red-right-inactive.png: Cannot
change ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/simple-first-inactive.png: Cannot
change ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/yellow-right-inactive.png: Cannot
change ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/grey-first-inactive.png: Cannot
change ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/blue-left.png: Cannot change
ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/grey-last.png: Cannot change
ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/yellow-left-inactive.png: Cannot
change ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/red-nav.png: Cannot change ownership
to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/gorilla-right.png: Cannot change
ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/blue-right.png: Cannot change
ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/grey-nav.png: Cannot change
ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/simple-last-inactive.png: Cannot
change ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/green-left.png: Cannot change
ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/red-first.png: Cannot change
ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/green-right-inactive.png: Cannot
change ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/grey-last-inactive.png: Cannot
change ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/blue-first-inactive.png: Cannot
change ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/green-text.png: Cannot change
ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/grey-left.png: Cannot change
ownership to uid 1000, gid 1000: Invalid argument
tar: extras/source/gallery/htmlexpo/yellow

[tdf-discuss] LibreOffice font typeset

[Alexandro Colorado]

What font does LibreOffice use?

--
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*OpenOffice.org* Español
http://es.openoffice.org

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Re: [tdf-discuss] [GENERAL] New name

[Italo Vignoli]

Christoph Noack wrote:

> Here is the posting:
> http://luxate.blogspot.com/2010/10/agreeing-on-childs-name-simple-task.html
> 
> And already on the new planet (yeah!):
> http://planet.documentfoundation.org/

Let me add just one small bit of information: the OOo (and now LibO)
community is in the same marketplace as corporations with a turnover of
tens of billions of dollars.

Brand names and trademarks are key for protecting the software and the
foundation, and the lawyers supporting us have suggested to come out
with a name which was difficult or impossible to attack.

As far as I am concerned LibreOffice is terrible for Italian speakers
but LibO is nice and cute, especially if you pronounce it with an accent
on the last letter: Libò.

Just my 2 small cent.

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Re: [tdf-discuss] OpenOffice and LibO user technical help requests

[Drew Jensen]

On Mon, 2010-10-04 at 05:35 -0500, Alexandro Colorado wrote:
> On Mon, Oct 4, 2010 at 5:29 AM, Marc Paré  wrote:
> 
> >  There seems to be more and more open discussions on installing the LibO
> > software on the official Mandriva user-help discussion group "
> > us...@openoffice.org". As this is quite an active group, there is a lot o
> f
> > trouble-shooting going as well as user support for the (now) official Ora
> cle
> > OpenOffice Suite, there are a lot of questions re: the fate of Oracle's
> > OpenOffice.
> >
> > I fear that if they end up on the LibO mailist, these users may find the
> > threads too chaotic and wild for any of their request for support. Would 
> it
> > make sense then to open up a mailist similar to the "us...@openoffice.org
> "
> > to help out with the support aspect of the suite? I think that collective
> ly
> > we could help out while they transition from the OpenOffice to LibO suite
> .
> > They are mostly every day users who are not interested in helping out wit
> h
> > the creation of the LibreOffice site.
> >
> 
> So far there is a forum for support  at http://libreofficeforum.org we have
> locales for Spanish, English and German. Hope this will help, there are
> locale infrastructure being worked out right now.
> 
> I think this mailing list is also a bit restricted (not many tools like a
> majordomo one).


For user support please refer people to user.services.openoffice.org or
oooforum.org.

At both forums folks have been fielding LibO users requests all week and
will continue to do so.

Thanks

Drew

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Re: [tdf-discuss] I want to contribute as a translator

[Jesús Corrius]

Hi Miguel Angel,

2010/10/4 Miguel Angel Frías Bonfil :
> Hi,
>
> My name is Miguel Angel Frías Bonfil, I want to contribute to the commu
ni
> ty
> of "LibreOffice" as a translator, my language is Spanish (México).

Thanks for your support.

We are working hard to have a good translation infrastructure in place
as soon as possible. I recommend you to subscribe to the announcements
list to get the news when it's ready.

Saludos,

--
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http://www.corrius.org
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Re: [tdf-discuss] LibreOffice font typeset

[Italo Vignoli]

Alexandro Colorado wrote:
> What font does LibreOffice use?

Vegur, is a free font easily available on the web

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Re: [tdf-discuss] [GENERAL] New name

[Varad Gupta]

On Mon, Oct 4, 2010 at 9:22 AM, Alexandro Colorado wrote:

> On Sun, Oct 3, 2010 at 8:55 PM, Charles Marcus  >w
> rote:
>
> I consider things are. So if such, we could have an open discussion on the
> list about what the community at large consider a first name. Remember that
> at the moment everything is Beta, the foundation, the community and
> eventually the product.
>
> Having a GPLv3-type discussion might not be beneficiary because of the time
> could be blury, but I think a public discussion should be encouraged. At th
> e
> end of the day, a friendly name might benefit all of us.
>

How does openWISDOM sound ?

*openW*rite*I*mpress*S*preadsheet*D*raw*O*fficeSuitewith*M*ath


Regards

Varad Gupta
www.FOSTERinglinux.com
www.keenable.in

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[tdf-discuss] Re: [Libreoffice] LibreOffice hacking / compiling (was: Re: LibreOffice compile error)

[Norbert Thiebaud]

On Mon, Oct 4, 2010 at 1:42 AM, Thorsten Behrens
 wrote:
> Gökçen Eraslan wrote:
>> 02 Ekim 2010 Cumartesi günü (saat 16:18:39) Gökçen E
ras
>> lan şunları yazmıştı:
>> > we
>> > export LDFLAGS variable as:
>> >
>> > LDFLAGS="-Wl,-O1 -Wl,-z,relro -Wl,--hash-style=gnu
>> > -Wl,--as-needed -Wl,
>> > --sort-common"
>> >
>> > and all packages compiles fine with those flags, including ooo-build-3
.2.98.1.
>> >
>> > But with libreoffice I got:
>> >
>> > configure: error: unrecognized option: `-Wl,--hash-style=gnu'
>> > Try `./configure --help' for more information
>> >
>> > Any ideas about that?
>>
>> I've fixed the other error that I've mentioned but this still continues.
>>
> Hi Gökçen,
>
> let's move code-related discussions over to the libreoffice dev
> list.

I'm confused. What is this list for then ?

>
> Cheers,
>
> -- Thorsten
>
> ___
> LibreOffice mailing list
> libreoff...@lists.freedesktop.org
> http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice
>
>
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Re: [tdf-discuss] Learn to quote

[Nguyen Vu Hung]

On Sun, Oct 3, 2010 at 10:35 PM, Stefan Weigel
 wrote:
> Hi,
>
> for the sake of usability of this list for all readers, please have a loo
k
> at:
>
> http://www.netmeister.org/news/learn2quote.html

@List masters:
We should add a warning:

Posting rules: http://www.netmeister.org/news/learn2quote.html

at the end of every emails sending to the list. Like this:

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 )
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Re: [tdf-discuss] The Document Foundation Sri Lankan Community

[Danishka Navin]

On Mon, Oct 4, 2010 at 6:02 PM, Florian Effenberger
 wrote:
> Hi Danishka,
>
> Am 04.10.2010 um 14:18 schrieb Danishka Navin:
>
>> Highly appreciate if you could join with the local community [1] as well.
>>
>> We are working as a local community of The Document Foundation.
>> We will be support and organize awareness and release events
>> for all products owned by The Document Foundation.
>>
>> http://groups.google.com/group/tdf-lk
>
> thank you very much for your engagement, that's truly appreciated!

you are welcome :)

>
> Florian
>
> --
> Florian Effenberger 
> Steering Committee and Founding Member of The Document Foundation
> Tel: +49 8341 99660880
> Fax: +49 8341 99660889
> Mobile: +49 151 14424108
> Skype: floeff | Twitter/Identi.ca: @floeff
>
>
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>



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http://twitter.com/danishkanavin
http://identi.ca/danishka
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Re: [tdf-discuss] LibreOffice general ideas and suggestions

[Nguyen Vu Hung]

On Mon, Oct 4, 2010 at 1:30 AM, Charles Marcus
 wrote:
> If a problem document contains information that cannot be shared, the
> user either sanitizes it or doesn't share it.

If we have to help MSO users migrating to ODT,
I suggest that we need to focus on

MSO 2007, 2010 -> ODT conversion

and forget about the older MSO formats.
The reasons are

0. Basically the conversion works OK
1. We dont have to enough resoures.
3. MSO formats older than 2007 will fade out
4. Suggest them to keep the files as is, and using ODT when creating new fi
les.


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 )
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[tdf-discuss] TDF spokespersons are here to help

[Italo Vignoli]

The announcement of The Document Foundation has generated a huge amount
of buzz, and there are many people who are commenting and speculating
about TDF and LibreOffice.

We are extremely happy for all the interest, but we would like to avoid
spreading inaccurate news and creating wrong expectations.

If there are specific questions about the project, you can always get in
touch with the Steering Committee members or with their deputies. We all
have a TDF email: firstname.lastn...@documentfoundation.org. From the
bio, it is easy to understand each one's areas of competence.

For instance, I cover marketing and communications, although I might be
able to answer on other issues. Unfortunately, there are many things to
manage in a short amount of time, and each one has limited bandwidth.

Sometimes, a personal message on a specific issue can help to clarify
the discussion on the mailing list, especially if you consider that for
the time being we are very busy with other tasks, and we might not have
the time necessary to follow each thread.

I hope this helps. Ciao, Italo

-- 
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Re: [tdf-discuss] New name

[Charles Marcus]

On 2010-10-04 3:45 AM, James Wilde wrote:
> But the point is, the 30 or whatever developers have been planning this 
> for some time.  They didn't launch LibO after a beer last Friday, and 
> they, for better or worse, chose LibreOffice as the name.
> 
> We're never going to get nearer than 10% agreement however many names we 
> suggest or polls we run, so let's live with their name, be grateful for 
> their enthusiasm and let them get on with turning 3.3 beta into 3.3 
> release instead of slagging them for being undemocratic or dictatorial.

+10

-- 

Best regards,

Charles
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Re: [tdf-discuss] Website status?

[Florian Effenberger]

Hi Jonathan,

Am 04.10.2010 um 14:08 schrieb jzacsh:

> So I'm just looking for a definitive answer: Will anyone be giving us
access to any way we can help with the website? I'd hate to be pushy,
but I wake up with 70 emails a morning from the "discuss" list and I'd
like to help with what I'm knowledgeable in. There's no way I'm reading
through some kind of digest just to see if the website has been
addressed.

sorry for the delay - we're working hard on the infrastructure, and will
see some news this week. There soon will also be news for the website.
Stay tuned ;)

Florian

--
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Steering Committee and Founding Member of The Document Foundation
Tel: +49 8341 99660880
Fax: +49 8341 99660889
Mobile: +49 151 14424108
Skype: floeff | Twitter/Identi.ca: @floeff


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[tdf-discuss] Re: [Libreoffice] Compile problems

[Marco ''AlpVonKri'' Flores]

Yes, I'm as root, and the problem persist, I skipped the
specification, but here is the correct sequence:

>  ./configure --with-distro=SUSE --disable-kde --enable-kde4
>  ./download
>  make
#  bin/ooinstall /opt/libreoffice

Note the # symbol, so I'm as root, but it gives me that error. U_U

And now that you mention it, I'll try to do the compilation process
without mono support, to see what happens, and yes it seems like I
have a complete installation, but I want one "Error Free". n_n


On Mon, Oct 4, 2010 at 5:27 AM, Michael Meeks  wr
ote:
> Hi MArco,
>
> On Sun, 2010-10-03 at 09:07 -0500, Marco ''AlpVonKri'' Flores wrote:
>> Thanks to all for your advices, I solved the problem thanks to your
>> help, I found that I was compiling for KDE 4 and KDE 3, so this is how
>> the problem was solved:
>
>        Ah - ok :-)
>
>> And now I have this other error after all previously mentioned:
>> Any ideas?
>
> Finishing the mono installation...
> Failure adding assembly /opt/libreoffice/ure/lib/cli_basetypes.dll to
> the cache: gac directories could not be create, possibly permission
> issues.
>
>        This looks like a message from bin/ooinstall ?
 after a full compile,
> and a functioning install :-)
>
>        If so - whoot ! it worked for you; the mono re
lated error is down to us
> not enabling mono support; and is just irrelevant.
>
>        You should have a functioning install you can
play with - great
> news :-)
>
>        HTH,
>
>                Michael.
>
> --
>  michael.me...@novell.com  <><, Pseudo Engineer, itinerant idio
t
>
>
>



--
Marco "AlpVonKri" Flores
Computer Systems Engineer
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http://www.alpvonkri.co.cc
alpvon...@alpvonkri.co.cc

openSUSE
Member ~ Ambassador ~ Weekly News
Miembro ~ Embajador ~ Noticias Semanales
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