Re: [IxDA Discuss] Joe the Plumber as Persona

2008-10-27 Thread Erik van de Wiel
Great point made by Lane Halley on
http://www.cooper.com/journal/2008/10/joe_six_pack_is_not_a_persona.html

Quote:
When someone hears the name %u201CNora the newbie%u201D or
%u201CJoe Helpdesk%u201D they draw on past experience to imagine
someone they know, or project the context of other times they%u2019ve
used the term into your persona. As a result, when a group work
together to design something for such a persona (whether it's a Web
site or tax policy), they each have different (often unvoiced)
assumptions about who this person is and what their needs are. By
using a more realistic persona name, and describing the behavioral
characteristics you want to emphasize, you make it easier for
everyone in the group to imagine the same person.


. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
Posted from the new ixda.org
http://www.ixda.org/discuss?post=34398



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Re: [IxDA Discuss] Joe the Plumber as Persona

2008-10-24 Thread Jordan, Courtney
Just to build on this discussion which I think is an excellent idea and
something that should have been done a long time ago...perhaps we could
have come up with economic stimulus concepts that worked better and had
the desired effect. The majority of the last stimulus checks went to
paying down debts and bills, rather than to boost consumer spending, as
the government had hoped. A more throrough development of the personas
that needed to be helped would have undoubtedly had a more positive
economic impact. 
___
Persona 2:
Susan, the hard-working married high-school educated woman with 4 kids
who just lost both her jobs due to economic cutbacks and a poor economy
in a poor (northern) state and is now worried how they'll survive the
harsh winter and about her children's future. 

She's an actual person and her concerns are more real and urgent and
desperate than whether this plumber can afford to buy the company he
works for and the amount of taxes he might have to pay. 
__

In developing personas, we also need to consider lower-income families,
as these are the people who are hurting the worst from this economic
crisis. 

It's interesting what Australia's doing - helping the people who need it
most. 

article excerpt
The surprise package primarily targets pensioners, low and middle-income
families, carers and first-home buyers, and is aimed at boosting
consumer spending./exerpt

http://www1.timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Business/Australia_unveils_massi
ve_economic_stimulus_package/articleshow/3592920.cms


Courtney Jordan


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of
Michael Micheletti
Sent: Thursday, October 16, 2008 11:37 AM
To: IxDA list
Subject: [IxDA Discuss] Joe the Plumber as Persona

In the US Presidential debate last night, there was considerable
discussion
about Joe the Plumber. Turns out he's a real person, but nevertheless
I
heard him used as a sort of proxy or persona. Anybody else flash on this
too? Is he the right persona to be designing an economic turnaround for?
Other secondary personas to consider? Just wondering what you wise and
witty
folks will come up with...



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Re: [IxDA Discuss] Joe the Plumber as Persona

2008-10-24 Thread Steve Baty
Courtney,

Australia's stimulus package will work if those low- and middle-income
households don't do the exact same thing as the US and use it to pay down
their credit card debt (which is high in Australia per capita) or save it
instead. This is, as you say, the piece missing from the public personas
that might make them work in they way we need them: enough detail about the
characteristics that will actually help predict behaviour.

And this, I think, is at the heart of personas and their use(less)fulness:
do they contain attributes and details about the audience segment that helps
us design for them *in order to achieve a change in behaviour*. In the cases
of these various stimulus packages, the *relevant* details are thin on the
ground.

Steve

2008/10/25 Jordan, Courtney [EMAIL PROTECTED]

 Just to build on this discussion which I think is an excellent idea and
 something that should have been done a long time ago...perhaps we could
 have come up with economic stimulus concepts that worked better and had
 the desired effect. The majority of the last stimulus checks went to
 paying down debts and bills, rather than to boost consumer spending, as
 the government had hoped. A more throrough development of the personas
 that needed to be helped would have undoubtedly had a more positive
 economic impact.
 ___

 It's interesting what Australia's doing - helping the people who need it
 most.

 article excerpt
 The surprise package primarily targets pensioners, low and middle-income
 families, carers and first-home buyers, and is aimed at boosting
 consumer spending./exerpt

 http://www1.timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Business/Australia_unveils_massi
 ve_economic_stimulus_package/articleshow/3592920.cmshttp://www1.timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Business/Australia_unveils_massive_economic_stimulus_package/articleshow/3592920.cms


 Courtney Jordan




-- 
--
Steve 'Doc' Baty B.Sc (Maths), M.EC, MBA
Principal Consultant
Meld Consulting
M: +61 417 061 292
E: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Re: [IxDA Discuss] Joe the Plumber as Persona

2008-10-21 Thread Carol Smith
Here's another way voters are being categorized:

The Christian Science Monitor identified 11 places across the US that
represent distinct types of voter communities.

http://www.csmonitor.com/patchworknation/

They are Monied 'Burbs, Minority Central, Evangelical Epicenters, Tractor
Country, Campus and Careers, Immigration Nation, Industrial Metropolis, Boom
Towns, Service Worker Centers, Emptying Nests, and Military Bastions.

---
Carol J. Smith
Principal Consultant, Midwest Research, LLC
http://www.mw-research.com

Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
LinkedIn: http://www.linkedin.com/pub/0/167/781

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Re: [IxDA Discuss] Joe the Plumber as Persona

2008-10-21 Thread Will Evans
That sounds eerily similar to the old marketing
lifestyle/behavioral/psychographics that main stream marketers have been
using Claritas for - http://www.claritas.com and as some smart person, think
it might have been in the book Groundswell, mentioned - that's for folks
that want to shout into the cave and listen for the ecco, in otherwords,
agencies that are good at defining a message, broadcasting (media
placement), and then measuring results, which is the old politics - the new
politics is represented by things like Obama's iPhone app (I am not stumping
for him - just giving an example) - a platform of tools to empower people to
talk with people - and that means less marketing, and more social media
strategy - creating a platform that is Built for Conversation (the title of
my upcoming talk).


On Tue, Oct 21, 2008 at 11:07 AM, Carol Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Here's another way voters are being categorized:

 The Christian Science Monitor identified 11 places across the US that
 represent distinct types of voter communities.

 http://www.csmonitor.com/patchworknation/

 They are Monied 'Burbs, Minority Central, Evangelical Epicenters, Tractor
 Country, Campus and Careers, Immigration Nation, Industrial Metropolis,
 Boom
 Towns, Service Worker Centers, Emptying Nests, and Military Bastions.

 ---
 Carol J. Smith
 Principal Consultant, Midwest Research, LLC
 http://www.mw-research.com

 Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 LinkedIn: http://www.linkedin.com/pub/0/167/781
 
 Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)!
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~ will

Where you innovate, how you innovate,
and what you innovate are design problems

-
Will Evans | User Experience Architect
tel: +1.617.281.1281 | [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Re: [IxDA Discuss] Joe the Plumber as Persona

2008-10-21 Thread Carol Smith
Exactly - I don't think any of us would be successful using a method like
this.

Luckily most products don't have an audience of 300 million, but this is
interesting regardless. :)

Carol

On Tue, Oct 21, 2008 at 11:42 AM, mark schraad [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Will is correct, these are clusters. Clustering is what companies like
 USAinfo and others offer as prepackaged market segments. The problem with
 these market segments is that they are generic and are typically generated
 by statistical analysis of socio, psycho and demo graphics. These three
 groups of behaviors are excellent for understanding the how, when and where
 of contact and communications with customers. They are not however suitable
 as a substitute for design research. They are also not personae. In fact
 they do not even make for very good archetypes. The first problem is that
 they are aggregate. The best approach for a persona is a deep understanding
 of one person that is similar to one of a larger market segments for your
 product. The second is the complete lack of depth needed.

 We have had some good luck using cluster analysis (prizm and others) of our
 user base within specific channels. Basically it helps us look at the
 differences between different user groups. This is a far cry from having
 deep understanding of user needs and wants.

 In general, clusters will give you good information for marketing to
 specific customers groups. For designing products, you need different
 groupings. You need user segments generated through analysis of 'desired
 attributes'. Your product manager will call these features - the user
 experience group will likely call these functionality of capabilities.

 Don't be fooled into thinking that 'marketing' data and clusters will give
 you what you need to effectively design for users. The wrong research, used
 for the wrong purpose can be worse than the lack of information.

 Mark





 On Oct 21, 2008, at 11:25 AM, Will Evans wrote:

  That sounds eerily similar to the old marketing
 lifestyle/behavioral/psychographics that main stream marketers have been
 using Claritas for - http://www.claritas.com and as some smart person,
 think
 it might have been in the book Groundswell, mentioned - that's for folks
 that want to shout into the cave and listen for the ecco, in otherwords,
 agencies that are good at defining a message, broadcasting (media
 placement), and then measuring results, which is the old politics - the
 new
 politics is represented by things like Obama's iPhone app (I am not
 stumping
 for him - just giving an example) - a platform of tools to empower people
 to
 talk with people - and that means less marketing, and more social media
 strategy - creating a platform that is Built for Conversation (the title
 of
 my upcoming talk).


 On Tue, Oct 21, 2008 at 11:07 AM, Carol Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 wrote:

  Here's another way voters are being categorized:

 The Christian Science Monitor identified 11 places across the US that
 represent distinct types of voter communities.

 http://www.csmonitor.com/patchworknation/

 They are Monied 'Burbs, Minority Central, Evangelical Epicenters, Tractor
 Country, Campus and Careers, Immigration Nation, Industrial Metropolis,
 Boom
 Towns, Service Worker Centers, Emptying Nests, and Military Bastions.

 ---
 Carol J. Smith
 Principal Consultant, Midwest Research, LLC
 http://www.mw-research.com

 Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 LinkedIn: http://www.linkedin.com/pub/0/167/781
 
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 ~ will

 Where you innovate, how you innovate,
 and what you innovate are design problems


 -
 Will Evans | User Experience Architect
 tel: +1.617.281.1281 | [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 aim: semanticwill |  gtalk: wkevans4
 twitter: semanticwill | skype: semanticwill

 -
 
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Re: [IxDA Discuss] Joe the Plumber as Persona

2008-10-20 Thread Eva Kaniasty
I think that the Joe the Plumber incident nicely illustrated the danger of
using a real person as a persona.  Joe went from the little guy striving for
the American dream to a guy who doesn't even have his plumbing license and
owes back taxes.

Eva Kaniasty
http://www.linkedin.com/in/kaniasty


On Thu, Oct 16, 2008 at 6:20 PM, Steve Baty [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 This notion of voter archetypes is used a lot as a rhetorical device in
 politics. Even if politicians sometimes drill in a specific individual -
 like this case - and we see the same thing occurring frequently in
 Australian politics A pensioner living on $xx/wk and receiving healthcare
 etc etc will be affected in the following way by this policy change.

 Like personas, these voter archetypes are intended to make a more concrete
 connection between the policy and the 'real people' of the electorate.

 This is the first time I've seen archetypes used so frequently and
 prominantly in US politics, although that may reflect me more than
 anything.
 Joe Six-pack, Joe the Plumber and the people on Main St, small-town,
 USA are all intended to evoke a particular image of 'real Americans' which
 is exactly the purpose of personas - common understanding of an audience
 (electoral) segment.

 Steve

 2008/10/17 Will Evans [EMAIL PROTECTED]

 
  Really good point you bring up though. I know when Steve Mulder was
 writing
  The User is Always Right - he really hoped it would gain traction outside
  the arena of UX people and be adopted by marketing and advertising folks
 as
  well
 
  On Thu, Oct 16, 2008 at 11:37 AM, Michael Micheletti 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
 


 --
 --
 Steve 'Doc' Baty B.Sc (Maths), M.EC, MBA
 Principal Consultant
 Meld Consulting
 M: +61 417 061 292
 E: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

 UX Statistics: http://uxstats.blogspot.com

 Member, UPA - www.upassoc.org
 Member, IA Institute - www.iainstitute.org
 Member, IxDA - www.ixda.org
 Contributor - UXMatters - www.uxmatters.com
 
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Re: [IxDA Discuss] Joe the Plumber as Persona

2008-10-20 Thread Will Evans
It is also clearly a cautionary tail in NOT using real user research before
making a persona. If you are pulling persona's out of the air, not doing
qualitative and quantitative research to derive your personas - you'll end
up like the McCain camp - with a toxic persona that lacks credibility
doesn't help you make your case either strategically or tactically.
Bootstrap your personas all you want, but when push comes to shove (and the
VP of marketing wants to turn your buttons pink), you need real personas
built on real research to validate your arguments.

On Mon, Oct 20, 2008 at 10:37 AM, Eva Kaniasty [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 I think that the Joe the Plumber incident nicely illustrated the danger of
 using a real person as a persona.  Joe went from the little guy striving
 for
 the American dream to a guy who doesn't even have his plumbing license and
 owes back taxes.

 Eva Kaniasty
 http://www.linkedin.com/in/kaniasty


 On Thu, Oct 16, 2008 at 6:20 PM, Steve Baty [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

  This notion of voter archetypes is used a lot as a rhetorical device in
  politics. Even if politicians sometimes drill in a specific individual -
  like this case - and we see the same thing occurring frequently in
  Australian politics A pensioner living on $xx/wk and receiving
 healthcare
  etc etc will be affected in the following way by this policy change.
 
  Like personas, these voter archetypes are intended to make a more
 concrete
  connection between the policy and the 'real people' of the electorate.
 
  This is the first time I've seen archetypes used so frequently and
  prominantly in US politics, although that may reflect me more than
  anything.
  Joe Six-pack, Joe the Plumber and the people on Main St, small-town,
  USA are all intended to evoke a particular image of 'real Americans'
 which
  is exactly the purpose of personas - common understanding of an audience
  (electoral) segment.
 
  Steve
 
  2008/10/17 Will Evans [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 
  
   Really good point you bring up though. I know when Steve Mulder was
  writing
   The User is Always Right - he really hoped it would gain traction
 outside
   the arena of UX people and be adopted by marketing and advertising
 folks
  as
   well
  
   On Thu, Oct 16, 2008 at 11:37 AM, Michael Micheletti 
   [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  
  
 
 
  --
  --
  Steve 'Doc' Baty B.Sc (Maths), M.EC, MBA
  Principal Consultant
  Meld Consulting
  M: +61 417 061 292
  E: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 
  UX Statistics: http://uxstats.blogspot.com
 
  Member, UPA - www.upassoc.org
  Member, IA Institute - www.iainstitute.org
  Member, IxDA - www.ixda.org
  Contributor - UXMatters - www.uxmatters.com
  
  Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)!
  To post to this list ... [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  Unsubscribe  http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe
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-- 
~ will

Where you innovate, how you innovate,
and what you innovate are design problems

-
Will Evans | User Experience Architect
tel: +1.617.281.1281 | [EMAIL PROTECTED]
aim: semanticwill |  gtalk: wkevans4
twitter: semanticwill | skype: semanticwill
-

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Re: [IxDA Discuss] Joe the Plumber as Persona

2008-10-20 Thread Will Evans
it might even be a cautionary tale.

On Mon, Oct 20, 2008 at 11:04 AM, Will Evans [EMAIL PROTECTED]wrote:

 It is also clearly a cautionary tail in NOT using real user research before
 making a persona. If you are pulling persona's out of the air, not doing
 qualitative and quantitative research to derive your personas - you'll end
 up like the McCain camp - with a toxic persona that lacks credibility
 doesn't help you make your case either strategically or tactically.
 Bootstrap your personas all you want, but when push comes to shove (and the
 VP of marketing wants to turn your buttons pink), you need real personas
 built on real research to validate your arguments.


 On Mon, Oct 20, 2008 at 10:37 AM, Eva Kaniasty [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 I think that the Joe the Plumber incident nicely illustrated the danger of
 using a real person as a persona.  Joe went from the little guy striving
 for
 the American dream to a guy who doesn't even have his plumbing license and
 owes back taxes.

 Eva Kaniasty
 http://www.linkedin.com/in/kaniasty


 On Thu, Oct 16, 2008 at 6:20 PM, Steve Baty [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

  This notion of voter archetypes is used a lot as a rhetorical device in
  politics. Even if politicians sometimes drill in a specific individual -
  like this case - and we see the same thing occurring frequently in
  Australian politics A pensioner living on $xx/wk and receiving
 healthcare
  etc etc will be affected in the following way by this policy change.
 
  Like personas, these voter archetypes are intended to make a more
 concrete
  connection between the policy and the 'real people' of the electorate.
 
  This is the first time I've seen archetypes used so frequently and
  prominantly in US politics, although that may reflect me more than
  anything.
  Joe Six-pack, Joe the Plumber and the people on Main St,
 small-town,
  USA are all intended to evoke a particular image of 'real Americans'
 which
  is exactly the purpose of personas - common understanding of an audience
  (electoral) segment.
 
  Steve
 
  2008/10/17 Will Evans [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 
  
   Really good point you bring up though. I know when Steve Mulder was
  writing
   The User is Always Right - he really hoped it would gain traction
 outside
   the arena of UX people and be adopted by marketing and advertising
 folks
  as
   well
  
   On Thu, Oct 16, 2008 at 11:37 AM, Michael Micheletti 
   [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  
  
 
 
  --
  --
  Steve 'Doc' Baty B.Sc (Maths), M.EC, MBA
  Principal Consultant
  Meld Consulting
  M: +61 417 061 292
  E: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 
  UX Statistics: http://uxstats.blogspot.com
 
  Member, UPA - www.upassoc.org
  Member, IA Institute - www.iainstitute.org
  Member, IxDA - www.ixda.org
  Contributor - UXMatters - www.uxmatters.com
  
  Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)!
  To post to this list ... [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  Unsubscribe  http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe
  List Guidelines  http://www.ixda.org/guidelines
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 Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)!
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 --
 ~ will

 Where you innovate, how you innovate,
 and what you innovate are design problems


 -
 Will Evans | User Experience Architect
 tel: +1.617.281.1281 | [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 aim: semanticwill |  gtalk: wkevans4
 twitter: semanticwill | skype: semanticwill

 -




-- 
~ will

Where you innovate, how you innovate,
and what you innovate are design problems

-
Will Evans | User Experience Architect
tel: +1.617.281.1281 | [EMAIL PROTECTED]
aim: semanticwill |  gtalk: wkevans4
twitter: semanticwill | skype: semanticwill
-

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[IxDA Discuss] Joe the Plumber as Persona

2008-10-16 Thread Michael Micheletti
In the US Presidential debate last night, there was considerable discussion
about Joe the Plumber. Turns out he's a real person, but nevertheless I
heard him used as a sort of proxy or persona. Anybody else flash on this
too? Is he the right persona to be designing an economic turnaround for?
Other secondary personas to consider? Just wondering what you wise and witty
folks will come up with...

Michael Micheletti

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Re: [IxDA Discuss] Joe the Plumber as Persona

2008-10-16 Thread Catriona Lohan-conway
Yeah Joe Sixpack went from just being a worker bee with Palin to being the self 
employed Queen Bee with McCain. I think I'd like a job that promoted me that 
quickly - 2 weeks? ;-)


On Thursday, October 16, 2008, at 08:37AM, Michael Micheletti [EMAIL 
PROTECTED] wrote:
In the US Presidential debate last night, there was considerable discussion
about Joe the Plumber. Turns out he's a real person, but nevertheless I
heard him used as a sort of proxy or persona. Anybody else flash on this
too? Is he the right persona to be designing an economic turnaround for?
Other secondary personas to consider? Just wondering what you wise and witty
folks will come up with...

Michael Micheletti

Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)!
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Re: [IxDA Discuss] Joe the Plumber as Persona

2008-10-16 Thread Terry Fitzgerald
Joe the Plumber persona

Looks like the McCain campaign wrote this. They should have spent a little
more time on it. According to Joe who was interviewed by CNN he is not
feeling quite so victimized by Obama's tax ideas as the Maverick would have
us believe.

Terry F


 
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-- 
Regards

Terry
http://www.linkedin.com/myprofile?trk=hb_side_pro

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Re: [IxDA Discuss] Joe the Plumber as Persona

2008-10-16 Thread Will Evans
Well:
1. I think it's better than using Joe-Six-Pack b/c it implies that working
class men have drinking problems
2. The particular person they chose as an achetype was not your averaging
working class guy - he would have been better suited as a representative
persona for a small business owner
3. The focus on demographic stereotypes and not qualitative or quantitative
data means that even if that Joe they used was more accurate - it was more
of a stereotype than a real persona
4. Using a real persona for addressing real political and economic issues
might actually make a lot of sence - imagine political campaigns using
personas and user research in designing their campaigns, messaging, and
white papers - instead of constantly changing their message based on the
latest polls which don't give an accurate picture of the electorate

Really good point you bring up though. I know when Steve Mulder was writing
The User is Always Right - he really hoped it would gain traction outside
the arena of UX people and be adopted by marketing and advertising folks as
well

On Thu, Oct 16, 2008 at 11:37 AM, Michael Micheletti 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 In the US Presidential debate last night, there was considerable discussion
 about Joe the Plumber. Turns out he's a real person, but nevertheless I
 heard him used as a sort of proxy or persona. Anybody else flash on this
 too? Is he the right persona to be designing an economic turnaround for?
 Other secondary personas to consider? Just wondering what you wise and
 witty
 folks will come up with...

 Michael Micheletti
 
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Re: [IxDA Discuss] Joe the Plumber as Persona

2008-10-16 Thread Steve Baty
This notion of voter archetypes is used a lot as a rhetorical device in
politics. Even if politicians sometimes drill in a specific individual -
like this case - and we see the same thing occurring frequently in
Australian politics A pensioner living on $xx/wk and receiving healthcare
etc etc will be affected in the following way by this policy change.

Like personas, these voter archetypes are intended to make a more concrete
connection between the policy and the 'real people' of the electorate.

This is the first time I've seen archetypes used so frequently and
prominantly in US politics, although that may reflect me more than anything.
Joe Six-pack, Joe the Plumber and the people on Main St, small-town,
USA are all intended to evoke a particular image of 'real Americans' which
is exactly the purpose of personas - common understanding of an audience
(electoral) segment.

Steve

2008/10/17 Will Evans [EMAIL PROTECTED]


 Really good point you bring up though. I know when Steve Mulder was writing
 The User is Always Right - he really hoped it would gain traction outside
 the arena of UX people and be adopted by marketing and advertising folks as
 well

 On Thu, Oct 16, 2008 at 11:37 AM, Michael Micheletti 
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:




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