Re: Moving to ... Github vs Bitbucket

2012-02-16 Thread zalew 
Just wanted to ask from curiosity if it were other factors besides broad 
popularity, as BB is a great alternative. Most dev probably use both 
services, at least passively, as lots of good code is here and there, and 
I'm not against GH in any way. Per-line comments are actually a very good 
point, I hope BB will implement it. 

I'm a user, not a dev, so I'll take what you give (as most of us), and 
contribute where it is hosted, be it GH or BB. Cheerz, keep up the good 
work.

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Re: Moving to ... Github vs Bitbucket

2012-02-16 Thread Markus Gattol 
I am not a Django contributor, just a user. Whether it's github or 
bitbucket or something else, the more important question is stick with the 
current system and workflow as well as policies or move the code and then 
of course also have a somewhat different workflow when you start using 
githubs/bitbuckets/etc ticket system.

Obviously the plan is to move the code to github but continue to use trac 
for issues. It's to time consuming and complicated (look at the 
current discussion among core devs on django-dev about how to better 
document policies for contributing because it's to confusing) already so 
this certainly would make it even worse.

Maybe it's a naive view of things but in the end Django is a Python lib, 
there are many such on github/bitbucket using the well integrated features 
of the platform so folks can actually spend their time developing the 
software itself rather than spending time on figuring out policies and 
maintaining infrastructure which gets so time consuming that the number of 
people who actually do stuff is quite small in the end.

I am not criticizing, it's just something that's a bit odd, I mean, what's 
so special about Django that it couldn't go with githubs/bitbuckets tickets 
as well? Current trac could be made read-only and tickets continued on 
gh/bb and simply link into trac for some time until all older tickets are 
resolved and trac can be shut down entirely.

But then again, I am no core dev, not even a contributor, just a user. 
Maybe all the bureaucracy and policies around contributing is needed in 
case of Django. If so then sorry for the noise :)

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Re: Moving to ... Github vs Bitbucket

2012-02-16 Thread Reinout van Rees 

On 16-02-12 16:42, Łukasz Rekucki wrote:

1) I can't argue about popularity, because I have no data, but most
Django applications I use come from github, so it's also quite
popular.


Last year's djangocon.eu was instructive for me. We were debating 
github/bitbucket at the office at the time.


But when every single source code link in a presentation (except for the 
talk by bitbucket itself) points at github, it is very difficult to 
argue for anything else than github. (So I stopped arguing for bitbucket 
at the office and we're using github now).



Reinout

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"If you're not sure what to do, make something. -- Paul Graham"

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Re: Moving to ... Github vs Bitbucket

2012-02-16 Thread Łukasz Rekucki 
On 16 February 2012 18:27, Jacob Kaplan-Moss  wrote:
> Hi folks --
>
> Please can we not have this argument? This is one of those holy wars
> that can get really, really ugly and I'd like to nip it in the bud.
>

Sorry for fueling this up. Should have think a few times more before
sending that. Also, it wasn't my intention to "bash bitbucket" or
anything like that so sorry for that too.

I'll just shut up now and let the silence hide this thread.

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Re: Moving to ... Github vs Bitbucket

2012-02-16 Thread Jacob Kaplan-Moss 
Hi folks --

Please can we not have this argument? This is one of those holy wars
that can get really, really ugly and I'd like to nip it in the bud.

There's no way we'll come to consensus here any more than we'd be able
to come to consensus on a choice of text editor, operating system, or
favorite color.

So it's BDFL territory. Adrian and I agree on GitHub, so if and when we
move, that's where it's going to be.

If you really feel so strongly about this decision that you need to
weigh in, please email us privately.

Thanks.

Jacob

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Re: Moving to ... Github vs Bitbucket

2012-02-16 Thread Mikhail Korobov 
A heavy bitbucket user here.

I personally prefer hg to git and bitbucket to github but I think github + 
git would be better for django because of much larger community.

Guys, but please stop bashing bitbucket. Bitbucket supports both hg and git 
(github don't), has nice bugtracker; bitbucket has hundreds of django 
packages on it (please don't call them unsignificant); it is in active 
development since Atlassian came, etc. Default repository landing page can 
be easily set to source browser in repository options. Hope this discussion 
won't become "github vs bitbucket" or "hg vs git" holywar.

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Re: Moving to ... Github vs Bitbucket

2012-02-16 Thread Henrique Bastos 
Here are my 2 cents.

IMHO, any developer that is currently contributing with Django can easily
work with both Bitbucket or Github.

AFAIK, the purpose o this big change is to enable more people to contribute
lowering the contribution barrier. With that in mind, I don't think the
decision should simply rely on a "feature comparison matrix" between the
options.

The point is to enable people to communicate more effectively towards the
code, and on that matter, I don't really see a competitor for Github.

All the best,
--
Henrique Bastos 
Twitter: @henriquebastos 
Skype: henriquebastos.net
+55 21 9618-6180



On Thu, Feb 16, 2012 at 2:48 PM, Adam "Cezar" Jenkins <
emperorce...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Github is just lightyears ahead of Bitbucket in design and usability.
> Beats it on features and community too. They only time I consider Bitbucket
> is only the circumstance that I need free private repos.
> That situation hasn't come up yet.
>
>
> On Thu, Feb 16, 2012 at 10:44 AM, Andrew Ingram wrote:
>
>> On 16 February 2012 15:42, Łukasz Rekucki  wrote:
>> > 1) I can't argue about popularity, because I have no data, but most
>> > Django applications I use come from github, so it's also quite
>> > popular.
>> >
>> > 2) I don't think Django should care if the collaboration tool runs
>> > python/django or java/grails as long as it's useful for developers.
>> > Anything beyond that is politics and that's what DSF might care about
>> > (I don't).
>> >
>> > 3) As for similar features... sometimes "similar" is not enough. I'm
>> > not a regular Bitbucket user, so I maybe just didn't discover that,
>> > but how can you add per line comments in patches on Bitbucket ?
>> > Without that, code reviews for non-trivial patches is a real PITA.
>>
>> Speaking from my own subjective tastes, I much prefer the experience
>> of using Github over Bitbucket. Simple things like showing the source
>> tree on a project's homepage make far more sense to me than showing
>> the latest commit messages. If I'm looking for how something works in
>> Django, the first thing I do is go to the github repo and browse the
>> source code.
>>
>> Additionally, almost every library I use as a dependency can be found
>> on Github, and familiarity is a very useful tool. South is the only
>> significant exception to this.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Andy
>>
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Re: Moving to ... Github vs Bitbucket

2012-02-16 Thread Adam "Cezar" Jenkins 
Github is just lightyears ahead of Bitbucket in design and usability. Beats
it on features and community too. They only time I consider Bitbucket is
only the circumstance that I need free private repos. That situation hasn't
come up yet.

On Thu, Feb 16, 2012 at 10:44 AM, Andrew Ingram wrote:

> On 16 February 2012 15:42, Łukasz Rekucki  wrote:
> > 1) I can't argue about popularity, because I have no data, but most
> > Django applications I use come from github, so it's also quite
> > popular.
> >
> > 2) I don't think Django should care if the collaboration tool runs
> > python/django or java/grails as long as it's useful for developers.
> > Anything beyond that is politics and that's what DSF might care about
> > (I don't).
> >
> > 3) As for similar features... sometimes "similar" is not enough. I'm
> > not a regular Bitbucket user, so I maybe just didn't discover that,
> > but how can you add per line comments in patches on Bitbucket ?
> > Without that, code reviews for non-trivial patches is a real PITA.
>
> Speaking from my own subjective tastes, I much prefer the experience
> of using Github over Bitbucket. Simple things like showing the source
> tree on a project's homepage make far more sense to me than showing
> the latest commit messages. If I'm looking for how something works in
> Django, the first thing I do is go to the github repo and browse the
> source code.
>
> Additionally, almost every library I use as a dependency can be found
> on Github, and familiarity is a very useful tool. South is the only
> significant exception to this.
>
> Regards,
> Andy
>
> --
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>
>

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Re: Moving to ... Github vs Bitbucket

2012-02-16 Thread Andrew Ingram 
On 16 February 2012 15:42, Łukasz Rekucki  wrote:
> 1) I can't argue about popularity, because I have no data, but most
> Django applications I use come from github, so it's also quite
> popular.
>
> 2) I don't think Django should care if the collaboration tool runs
> python/django or java/grails as long as it's useful for developers.
> Anything beyond that is politics and that's what DSF might care about
> (I don't).
>
> 3) As for similar features... sometimes "similar" is not enough. I'm
> not a regular Bitbucket user, so I maybe just didn't discover that,
> but how can you add per line comments in patches on Bitbucket ?
> Without that, code reviews for non-trivial patches is a real PITA.

Speaking from my own subjective tastes, I much prefer the experience
of using Github over Bitbucket. Simple things like showing the source
tree on a project's homepage make far more sense to me than showing
the latest commit messages. If I'm looking for how something works in
Django, the first thing I do is go to the github repo and browse the
source code.

Additionally, almost every library I use as a dependency can be found
on Github, and familiarity is a very useful tool. South is the only
significant exception to this.

Regards,
Andy

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Moving to ... Github vs Bitbucket

2012-02-16 Thread Łukasz Rekucki 
On 16 February 2012 16:02, Stan  wrote:
>
>
> On Feb 9, 1:49 pm, zalew  wrote:
>> > We're going
>> > to solve that with our move to Git/GitHub, which will make it much
>> > easier for people to fork and much easier for core developers to
>> > integrate contributions.
>>
>> a bit offtopic: why nothttp://bitbucket.org?similar features, it's on
>> python/django and already popular in django community.

1) I can't argue about popularity, because I have no data, but most
Django applications I use come from github, so it's also quite
popular.

2) I don't think Django should care if the collaboration tool runs
python/django or java/grails as long as it's useful for developers.
Anything beyond that is politics and that's what DSF might care about
(I don't).

3) As for similar features... sometimes "similar" is not enough. I'm
not a regular Bitbucket user, so I maybe just didn't discover that,
but how can you add per line comments in patches on Bitbucket ?
Without that, code reviews for non-trivial patches is a real PITA.

-- 
Łukasz Rekucki

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