Re: [dwm] [OT] frequency scaling and power consumption

2009-05-09 Thread hiro
On Sat, May 9, 2009 at 7:29 AM, Kurt H Maier karmaf...@gmail.com wrote:
 From a physics standpoint if you're generating less heat you're
 consuming less power.

 # Kurt H Maier



And you generate less heat when you allow the cpu to take advantage of
it's high frequencies at high loads, because you can put it back into
a lower power state early.

It didn't use to be this way though with older cpus, so you should
definitely subscribe to the powertop mailinglist if that is of real
concern to you.



Re: [dwm] [idea] mwm - minimal/minimun/monocle window manager

2009-04-27 Thread hiro
 But here is the URL to wikipedia if you prefer that:
 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/C_(programming_language)

He probably means this page: http://cm.bell-labs.com/cm/cs/cbook/

But I guess his point was that you should have provided that standard
information (copied from above web page):

The C Programming Language, Second Edition
by Brian W. Kernighan and Dennis M. Ritchie.
Prentice Hall, Inc., 1988.
ISBN 0-13-110362-8 (paperback), 0-13-110370-9 (hardback).

Forums are a disease, but they are successful, because people are
always glad about the neat, animated smiley's, there are proudly
occupied moderators, and a lot of cool features for the administrator
to play with. Mathml support, flash games and reading private messages
comes to mind. These people definitely have too much time, and
probably patience, and are thus more friendly to newbies. They almost
always like what they are doing and seldom get upset about their new
and only friends.
Does that make sense?



Re: [dwm] [idea] mwm - minimal/minimun/monocle window manager

2009-04-27 Thread hiro
I'm sorry, this was related to Szabolcs' comment:

why would one post ideas, questions,.. to some random web forum when
there is a dedicated mailing list (and irc channel) for the given
topic?

On Mon, Apr 27, 2009 at 7:07 PM, Preben Randhol rand...@pvv.org wrote:
 On Mon, 27 Apr 2009 15:12:12 +0200
 hiro 23h...@googlemail.com wrote:

 Forums are a disease, but they are successful, because people are
 always glad about the neat, animated smiley's, there are proudly
 occupied moderators, and a lot of cool features for the administrator
 to play with. Mathml support, flash games and reading private messages
 comes to mind. These people definitely have too much time, and
 probably patience, and are thus more friendly to newbies. They almost
 always like what they are doing and seldom get upset about their new
 and only friends.
 Does that make sense?

 Sorry, I don't get the relevance.





Re: [dwm] uzbl. A browser that adheres to the unix philosophy.

2009-04-23 Thread hiro
Thanks, that sounds great!
Now we only need a working flash replacement:(
But I'm eager to try this out at home this evening.

On Thu, Apr 23, 2009 at 5:21 PM, Dusan ef_...@yahoo.com wrote:
 Just to notify community:

 http://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=70700p=1

 Web kit minimal browser, you will find it very interesting.






Re: [dwm] autoconf

2009-03-19 Thread hiro
 hm probably (c) would be better there (and in the license)

utf-8 is great *especially* in the license:)



Re: [dwm] autoconf

2009-03-19 Thread hiro
Discuss this on the autoconf mailinglist, please...
We're all users and thus don't want to waste our time on this stuff from hell.



Re: [dwm] suckless.org stylesheet glitch

2009-03-13 Thread hiro
Me neither.

Here with opera I see that it will only be fast if it has already
resolved the host name. After clearing the cache every single
subdomain of suckless.org takes several seconds to load up at the
first time, whereas cat-v.org will always show up instantly.
I have no idea how to debug this, but perhaps someone can reproduce?

On Fri, Mar 13, 2009 at 11:05 AM, Uriel urie...@gmail.com wrote:
 Nope.

 uriel

 On Fri, Mar 13, 2009 at 10:15 AM, Anselm R Garbe garb...@gmail.com wrote:
 2009/3/13 Uriel urie...@gmail.com:
 I run http://cat-v.org on xen, and even really long pages like
 http://ninetimes.cat-v.org take a couple of seconds to load.

 Something was wrong with suckless.org, sometimes a small page could
 take ten seconds, it is better now but still on the slow side of
 things.

 I guess you use ipv6?

 Kind regards,
 --Anselm







Re: [dwm] Suckess Code Management

2009-03-12 Thread hiro
 8. music - turntables and mpd/sonata

Do you have multiple instances of mpd and control them with your turntables?



Re: [dwm] Suckess Code Management

2009-03-12 Thread hiro
 but there is a very good (and suckless!) digital vinyl emulation software
 for Unix: http://www.xwax.co.uk/

Thanks. So far I've been playing only with analog vinyl and this
evercrashing windows stuff;)

I found some other comments, which sound really promising, so I think
I will give this a try:

This is just the first version, but man the makers of this software really 
need to get down with some better skinning. The interface looks like po.



Re: [dwm] suckless.org stylesheet glitch

2009-03-11 Thread hiro
On 3/11/09, twfb twf...@googlemail.com wrote:
 On 00:59 Wed 11 Mar , Uriel wrote:
  Also, www.suckless.org is *SLOW* to the point of being unusable

 Slight exaggeration perhaps... but it is a little bit slow and was
 indeed slow even before the switch to werc. Nothing dramatic but
 noticable slow for such a low graphic website.

 --
 TWFB  -  PGP: D7A420B3



I experienced up to 10 seconds to connect, but now everything is ok again here.
Could be that there have been some temporary dns issues.



Re: [dwm] [OT] Personal Website and CSS

2009-02-18 Thread hiro
Well, you should use flash, it looks the same on all browsers.
My favourite HTML tag is pre.

You will need great luck.

On Wed, Feb 18, 2009 at 10:10 PM, Matthias-Christian Ott o...@mirix.org wrote:
 Hi,
 since several years I have been planed to launch a personal website. I
 used to do quite aesthetical web design before I have subscribed to
 minimalism. What annoyed me then and now was CSS and its implementations
 in modern browsers.

 When I tried to design a minimalist website (just some typographic
 enhancements to make texts more read- and printable), I realised that
 there seems to be no agreed standard for a default CSS stylesheet merely a
 recommendation from the CSS standard [1] (which is incomplete) and a lot
 of people seem to be concerned about resetting the browser CSS defaults -
 even the W3C does so in their stylesheets [2]. Most people seems to have
 installed nearly all popular browsers, test with those and incorporate
 workarounds if necessary.

 All in all this seems very absurd to me and I would like to know how
 you approached this problem.

 At the moment I'm just aware of The Anti-web Manifesto [3] that someone
 linked to on this mailing list. Although I mainly subscribe to it,
 browsers like Mozilla Firefox have terrible default typographic style
 and using text-mode browsers like links often seems to be only solution
 when reading longer texts.

 Any ideas?

 Regards,
 Matthias-Christian

 [1] http://www.w3.org/TR/CSS21/sample.html
 [2] http://www.w3.org/StyleSheets/Core/Steely
 [3] http://port70.net/webless/antiweb.html





Re: [dwm] [OT] Personal Website and CSS

2009-02-18 Thread hiro
 I think the only way is dropping HTML and CSS altogether and going
 with something new. I'd be very interested in contributing. I think
 the replacement should not only focus on presentation but equally on
 forming a base for less suckish applications which are highly network
 transparent.

 Kind regards,
 --Anselm



Not sure if OP really wanted to do this, but such alternatives have
always existed. Look at gopher for example.

I would export 9p filetrees and mount them in acme. You can use text
files and plumbing if you want hyperlinks.
I very much enjoy reading 9fans that way.

But I admit this not being beauty typesetting.

 browsers like Mozilla Firefox have terrible default typographic style
 and using text-mode browsers like links often seems to be only solution
 when reading longer texts.

I don't really get this: Where can we find real typographic style in links?

Perhaps we need a combination of Troff's beauty and web browser's dynamics.



[OT] OFFTOPIC (was: Re: [dwm] Bottom-posting and reply trimming (was: Bottom Stack Patch))

2009-02-10 Thread hiro
how about that?

On 2/10/09, markus schnalke mei...@marmaro.de wrote:
 [2009-02-10 06:51] Kurt H Maier karmaf...@gmail.com

 Please mark mailing-list etiquette posts as off-topic, so my mail
 client and filter them appropriately.  Thanks.

 Can you please tell me how to do so.

 I know people who use offtopic ... /offtopic. Do you mean that?


 meillo




Re: [OT] OFFTOPIC (was: Re: [dwm] Bottom-posting and reply trimming (was: Bottom Stack Patch))

2009-02-10 Thread hiro
yeah thank you too. Next time I will include the [sarcasm] tag for you...

On 2/10/09, Enno Gottox Boland got...@gmail.com wrote:
 don't introduce totally senseless rules noone respects.

 btw stfu. :)

 thanks.

 Gottox

 2009/2/10, hiro 23h...@googlemail.com:
 how about that?

  On 2/10/09, markus schnalke mei...@marmaro.de wrote:
   [2009-02-10 06:51] Kurt H Maier karmaf...@gmail.com
  
   Please mark mailing-list etiquette posts as off-topic, so my mail
   client and filter them appropriately.  Thanks.
  
   Can you please tell me how to do so.
  
   I know people who use offtopic ... /offtopic. Do you mean that?
  
  
   meillo
  




 --
 http://www.gnuffy.org - Real Community Distro
 http://www.gnuffy.org/index.php/GnuEm - Gnuffy on Ipaq (Codename Peggy)





Re: [dwm] Re: What happened here?

2009-01-25 Thread hiro
On Sun, Jan 25, 2009 at 6:28 PM, Christian Garbs mi...@cgarbs.de wrote:
 On Tue, Jan 20, 2009 at 01:42:32PM +0100, hiro wrote:
 On Tue, Jan 20, 2009 at 11:22 AM, Yoshi Rokuko yoshi.rok...@yokuts.org 
 wrote:
  On Tue, Jan 20, 2009 at 10:37:58AM +0100, hiro wrote:

  Still, dwm somehow seems very much not unix alike for me.

  what do you mean, or what would be a more nix'isch WM?

 Could be, that X doesn't allow it to be more unixy, and like I said,
 if you don't want to change the configuration, you could say dwm is
 just a simple window manager.

 But as the task for most people on this list is configuring it like
 crazy, I don't think one should consider dwm unixy in this use case,
 it's not flexible enough.

 In my understanding, the unix way is do just one thing and do it
 good.  A single program does not need to be flexible, but instead you
 are flexible by stacking simple programs together as you like (shell
 scripts, pipes etc.)


I agree and I was specifically thinking about the possibility of
splitting dwm's functionality into multiple single programs.
A simple library for hiding X could be an other great way...

And right, flexibility is rather just an effect of well behaving,
simple apps used together.

 dwm arranges the windows on the screen, nothing more, nothing less.
 No program icons, no desktop environment, no notification services.

Dwm is arranging windows dynamically, listens to multiple X events
and, as far as I know, provides a status bar.
It's doing quite some stuff in my view...



Re: [dwm] Re: What happened here?

2009-01-25 Thread hiro
 Dwm is also philosophically transformational if you've not previously
 absorbed the concept of Simplicity as a Virtue.

I don't understand a word, sorry.
And yeah, I understand what simplicity is about...



Re: [dwm] Re: What happened here?

2009-01-20 Thread hiro
I think andrew's point is about dwm's very own style.
You can, though, use dwm without any problems out of the box, and thus
I don't fully agree with him.
Still, dwm somehow seems very much not unix alike for me.



Re: [dwm] Re: What happened here?

2009-01-20 Thread hiro
On Tue, Jan 20, 2009 at 11:22 AM, Yoshi Rokuko yoshi.rok...@yokuts.org wrote:
 On Tue, Jan 20, 2009 at 10:37:58AM +0100, hiro wrote:
 Still, dwm somehow seems very much not unix alike for me.

 what do you mean, or what would be a more nix'isch WM?

 regards, y0shi



Could be, that X doesn't allow it to be more unixy, and like I said,
if you don't want to change the configuration, you could say dwm is
just a simple window manager.

But as the task for most people on this list is configuring it like
crazy, I don't think one should consider dwm unixy in this use case,
it's not flexible enough. Perhaps someone should write a window
manager consisting of some very simple and small binaries. But I
admit, I would not know where to start (I will stick to wmii and it's
9p server approach).

just my 2 euros



Re: [dwm] Re: What happened here?

2009-01-20 Thread hiro
On Tue, Jan 20, 2009 at 2:33 PM, markus schnalke mei...@marmaro.de wrote:
 [2009-01-20 13:42] hiro 23h...@googlemail.com
 On Tue, Jan 20, 2009 at 11:22 AM, Yoshi Rokuko yoshi.rok...@yokuts.org 
 wrote:
  On Tue, Jan 20, 2009 at 10:37:58AM +0100, hiro wrote:
  Still, dwm somehow seems very much not unix alike for me.
 
  what do you mean, or what would be a more nix'isch WM?

 Could be, that X doesn't allow it to be more unixy, and like I said,
 if you don't want to change the configuration, you could say dwm is
 just a simple window manager.

 [...] I don't think one should consider dwm unixy in this use case,
 it's not flexible enough.

 Isn't ``unixy'' at first simplicity?

 ``flexible'' however is a difficult term ... remember sendmail which
 _is_ flexible but in no way ``unixy''.


 But as the task for most people on this list is configuring it like
 crazy [...]

 I don't share this view. I think most people have their flavor or dwm
 keep this quite stable.

 Of course, here is a lot of discussion ... but the reason therefore is
 primary the ``experimental'' approach of dwm.

well, that's why it's not unixy.
of course they have to be simple, but being unixy is also about
simple, consistent apps and never changing interfaces.
But since a display manager is kind of an interface...
I don't even have anything against experimenting, just please don't
call it unixy...



Re: [dwm] Asustek EEE PC 1000 Atom 1GB 40G SSD Linux Black

2008-09-05 Thread hiro
On Fri, Sep 5, 2008 at 2:50 PM, Anselm R Garbe [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 2008/9/5 Matthias-Christian Ott [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
 Anselm R Garbe wrote:
 What do people think about such an EEE PC as low budget option to run
 dwm on? Any experiences already if the screen is big enough for daily
 work? I had an opportunity yesterday to try one, and I must admit I'm
 keen to order one. The keyboard and keys have surprisingly proper
 size.

 The previous EEE PC models were unusable with dwm (well, pretty much
 unusable with everything), except maybe monocle.
 I don't have one (I think these mini-notebooks are just toys and wasted
 money), but my 17 CRT runs at 1024x768. As far as I know the EEE PC
 has a resolution of 1024x600, so it's compareable.
 Working with 1024x768 makes tiling unusable (except maybe with multiple
 horizontal masters and no stacking area (there were some patches for
 this some time ago)) and you are forced to use tags as workspaces or use
 monocle and floating.

 Well, I used 1024x768 most of my life and it was very usable for me.
 All you need to do is using some 10pt font to get some terminals on
 the screen.

 So as far as I can tell, running dwm on everything 19 or 1600x1200 is
 painful and does only have some smaller advantages (like code size,
 keyboard usage, performance) over other WIMP window managers.
 Therefore save our planet and don't buy these e-waste.

 Well give it a try in some shop and I bet you will judge it
 differently then. I also thought exactly the same about such small pcs
 that they are unusable and wasted money, but now I think I was wrong
 after having tested one...

 Kind regards,
 --Anselm



What's the advantage compared to the thinkpad x series? Or is it just
because of the price?



Re: [dwm] DockBox - A Tiling Window Manager for Windows

2008-07-30 Thread hiro
Thanks, that's interesting.



Re: [dwm] New website launch

2008-07-16 Thread hiro
cangratiolations, you have reached the next level.



Re: [dwm] Freedom (was: Re: sic ipv6 patch)

2008-05-21 Thread hiro
  That's our freedom (in your definition). Szabolcs and I can use terms in
  another way than you, you hiro can curse on public mailing lists, and I
  can decide to stop discussing with people who swear and get personal.

This is not politics, it's the internet, boy. Though you could nee
some political understanding. I hope you will stay in the software
business only.

-- 
hiro



Re: [dwm] Freedom (was: Re: sic ipv6 patch)

2008-05-20 Thread hiro
 She's not public domain. :P

SHE is public domain. And you can probably get all her stuff from bittorrent.
Some people here better give this a try. This is more benefit than
reading stupid LICENSEs



Re: [dwm] Freedom (was: Re: sic ipv6 patch)

2008-05-20 Thread hiro
 What do you think about the freedom to remove the freedom from the code?

You don't get it, do you? It's elementary for freedom in society to
cut others freedom.
But this what you're speaking about is not society. You can think
whatever you want, create whatever code you want. But this will never
cut any other's freedom. On the other hand everyone could use your
code, and noone would even notice. It does *no* harm to others.

I could understand if you were fighting for real freedom, but this is
an imaginary fight about intellectual nonsense.

Code has no freedom. people in society want to be free, but the code
doesn't mind. It is just letters and stuff. neither free nor unfree.

Leave it simple!

-- 
hiro



Re: [dwm] Freedom (was: Re: sic ipv6 patch)

2008-05-20 Thread hiro
On 5/20/08, Kurt H Maier [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 On Tue, May 20, 2008 at 8:43 AM, Matthias Kirschner [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
   Why do you think a user who gets DWM in a binary on some device knows a)
   that this is DWM and b) knows that DWM is licensed under MIT? So this
   user does not have the freedom to use, study, share and improve the
   software.


 You think their ability to hack on dwm is destroyed by the fact that
  they can't identify it as dwm?

  I don't see how this follows.  Googling tiling window manager turns
  up a ton of results, most of which are descended from dwm.


  --

 # Kurt H Maier



Perfectly right. Even such closed source adds up, but does not
destroys the original software. It even gives a bigger choice to the
user. More freedom in this sense.



Re: [dwm] Freedom (was: Re: sic ipv6 patch)

2008-05-20 Thread hiro
On 5/20/08, Sylvain Bertrand [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 On Tue, May 20, 2008 at 4:52 PM, hiro [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
   Hu? There is another license as secure than the GPL to protect against
code closing?
  
   You mix everything up. There is no need for protection of open code.


 Well many disagree with you, many think there is such a need.

I would feel ashamed if everyone would agree with me. And keep in
mind, that quantity of thoughts is not quality.

 Me first.

Haha, It's an honour for me, that *you* were first.


   Everyone has the right of closed code. Just like anybody has the right
   of privacy.


 You are right, that's why the GPL protects against code closing only
  when distribution occurs.

  Damn this license is well done!

Yeah it will probably save the world from demise. It probably saved
thousands of lifes already.

  Sorry, Anselm for feeding the troll... but this one is hungry...

You seem like having a lot of social connections. Talking a lot about
all that people who are supposedly on your side.

If you want me to go, just say so. I will definitely do so in this case.

Good luck to you on your path.

-- 
hiro



Re: [dwm] Freedom (was: Re: sic ipv6 patch)

2008-05-20 Thread hiro
 yes
  lack of knowledge can mean lack of freedom (with my definition)

So you have you own definition? Fucking nice!

   Ignorance != lack of freedom (which demonstrates, again, how some
   people try to attribute an incorrect meaning to the word freedom).


 the point is that ppl have no way to determine the origin.
  they are not ignorant, but mislead.

And you, wise man, are able to force them to sanity. That's again, Fucking nice!

  of course it is an indirect consequence of the ruleset, but still a 
 consequence.

better try and look at *all* consequences.

   You're talking about restrictions of the new product, not of the
   original source (see my comments above).


 yes, but this new product is the result of the permissive license.
  in my opinion it makes sense to track the effects of a license further
  than direct usage.

Some people even think communism must make sense. Because with this
great invention you can track effects even of more than just licenses.


   - so removing restriction might mean less freedom
  
   _Never_ for the original source. Btw, I really hope that you can see
   the contradiction in your own statement.


 well i'm talking about the resulting sum of freedom of ppl (for whom
  the original src might not be available (lack of knowledge, false
  advertisment  etc..))

  (the example was a proof by contradiction to show that number of
  restriction is not always a good measure of freedom, so the
  contradiction is fine there)

Well, you *are* a communist, aren't you?

   MIT/BSD just make software free.
  
   GPL on the other hand is not just trying to make software free, but
   also to govern in what way the receiver can use it. Now this may or
   may not be morally right, but that's a discussion all in itself. What
   isn't a discussion is that it's a restriction of freedom.
  
   In some situations, a benevolent dictator may be better for the people
   than total freedom, perhaps even better than democracy. Regardless of
   the level of benevolence though, a benevolent dictator is still a
   dictator, no matter what way you put it.


 yes, we are talking about different terms
  i deliberately used an alternative definition of freedom (and included
  all the dictatorship), because it makes sense to me.

  the restrictions in GPL may have moral/political/game theoretical
  roots but imho it's valid to call it freedom.

Oh so it's valid, because it makes sense to you? Fucking nice!

  yet another example (driving rules):

  (a) everyone should drive on the right side of the road
  (b) any side of the road can be used

  by usual freedom definition (b) is more free, it allows one to use
  _either_ side of the road.
  in reality with (b) one can use _neither_ side of the road (instant
  traffic jam, deadlocks at crossroads).

  with all the restrictions, (a) makes sure that ppl actually can use at
  least one side of the road, thus globally (a) provides more free
  choices (1 insted of 0).

The difference is, you can offer an unlimited amount of software apps
in closed source and it will not hinder anyone in doing what he'd like
to do. Even if they are all copys of the same public domain code...

-- 
hiro



Re: [dwm] Freedom (was: Re: sic ipv6 patch)

2008-05-20 Thread hiro
On 5/20/08, Matthias Kirschner [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 * Sander van Dijk [EMAIL PROTECTED] [2008-05-20 18:23:43 +0200]:


   On Tue, May 20, 2008 at 3:43 PM, Matthias Kirschner [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 wrote:
Why do you think a user who gets DWM in a binary on some device knows a)
that this is DWM and b) knows that DWM is licensed under MIT? So this
user does not have the freedom to use, study, share and improve the
software.
  
   So now software is only free when each and every distributor is forced
   to educate his customers about all the wonderful things they are
   allowed to do with it?


 For the record: I did not say that. Software is free, when the user has
  the freedom to use, study, share and improve it.


   This is just another display of your misunderstanding of the concept
   freedom. Really, buy a dictionary...


 Thanks for the advise :)

Yeah, very funny. This is plain ridiculous

-- 
hiro



Re: [dwm] sic ipv6 patch

2008-05-19 Thread hiro
Why don't you just use the beerware license? It's really easy to
understand. And you will get a lot more out of it.



Re: [dwm] sic ipv6 patch

2008-05-19 Thread hiro
 use single GPL licensed software, use Linux and secure your digital freedom!

You think this is freedom?



Re: [dwm] Freedom (was: Re: sic ipv6 patch)

2008-05-19 Thread hiro
it's so easy guys.
freedom is when you don't mind looking into LICENSE.
Ever heard of pipi langstrumpf?



Re: [dwm] snapping bugs with multiple screens

2008-05-06 Thread hiro
btw. what naming convention do bx, by, bw,wx,... follow?



Re: [dwm] snapping bugs with multiple screens

2008-05-05 Thread hiro
Polls are stupid.

All these recently added features seemed to me as if they are rather a
matter of popularity, not sanity.

Dwm got off course and needs some clear objectives again!



Re: [dwm] snapping bugs with multiple screens

2008-05-05 Thread hiro
  There is this stupid idea called democracy (just in case you heard of
  it) and I tried to establish just a tiny fraction of it here in the dwm
  development process. Shame on me!

At the beginning dwm was Anselm's baby, and he said it shall only fit
his needs. He made this very clear and I fully respected this. Dwm
never really fit my own needs, but it was still an interesting
approach. And, like you said, Matthias, there is always the
possibility of an own branch.

  For me it the dwm development process seems to be kind of fair, Anselm
  mainly tries improve dwm based on the needs (and patches) of the people
  here on the mailing list unless they don't interfere with the
  development philosophy.

  But due to the development philosophy of dwm you can't make everyone
  happy and integrate every feature.

Yes, what is the development philosophy? If i remember correctly it
was all about being small, simple and elitist.
But there are always compromises. So, there has to be a decision about
what features to support.
Recently there were all these changes with monocle and xinerama; And
of course things get more difficult this way, so i would have
respected i.e. not including such features at all.
But at some point the decision was made about Xinerama support, and
since then development seemed going forwards and backwards, aimlessly
and probably startled from all these bad X dependencies.
Dwm shouldn't focus so much on *how much* X features suck, but rather
on doing one thing (whatever this is), and then of course, doing it
good.



Re: [dwm] snapping bugs with multiple screens

2008-05-05 Thread hiro
 Yes, of course. And this has to be discussed (with a certain framework
  of course - you can't come along and expect someone to integrate cairo
  or so). And this is why we have to make clear what exactly sucks less.
  I mean the term itself suggest that we're not developing software on a
  solid basis and have to make the best out of it.

Yeah, well, we have this framework. We even used to have gods
punishing people who suck too much.

   Recently there were all these changes with monocle and xinerama; And
   of course things get more difficult this way, so i would have
   respected i.e. not including such features at all.


 Well, this depends on your viewpoint, more precisely what you consider
  superfluous and what not. For some people xinerama and monocle may have
  been a great improvement for a relatively small amount of source code.

Yes, exactly, this is ultimately dependant on my viewpoint. And it has
nothing to do with whatever it would be an improvement or not.
At this point I have *not* said anything against the feature yet.

 Well, X11 is a monster and really sucks. All we do here is to tame it so
  it doesn't eat us. We have to make the best out of it.
  Certainly everyone agrees that X11 should be replaced, but this takes
  time and needs people. And because we have none of these resources, we
  have to stick to it.
  I mean do you think GNU/Linux is the holy grail of operating systems?

I don't really care about X11 and my only real use of GNU is viewing
multiple rickrolling videos at the same time, of course in tiled
windows, non-overlapping.

  The aim of dwm is to be simple, small and clear, but sometimes you have
  to make trade-offs. And I think in this case multiple monitor support
  was a relatively good trade-off.

And you are measuring the value of trade-offs in lines of codes. That
does not in any way help objective decisions.
If there is a feature, which one decides to support, probably because
of it's big value, one should not make any more trade-offs but fully
support it.
This can of course be made in an other branch.
The current state is, in my view a really bad compromise (Nichts
Halbes und nichts Ganzes).

 You don't do polls in fashion - normally it's unconsciously communicated
  dictatorship.

Fashion is better described with democracy than dictatorship.

  Well and in politics (at leat in Germany) you don't do polls very often
  (usually every four years).
  [Just by the way.]

The results of the polls are still bad, that's also no real point.

  It works usually that way on the mailing list, doesn't it?

-9e99
I don't think so. It's still a discussion you want.

-- 
hiro



Re: [dwm] snapping bugs with multiple screens

2008-05-05 Thread hiro
 Come on it's enough now. Do you remember how this pointless discussion
  started:

  | Polls are stupid.

  I just wanted to involve the users a bit on this issue. And in fact this
  statement is stupid and not polls.

 Yes, of course. And this has to be discussed (with a certain framework
  of course - you can't come along and expect someone to integrate cairo
  or so). And this is why we have to make clear what exactly sucks less.

 So what's so offensive about this statement that it causes such a noise?
  Why don't we just shut up, concentrate on the problem and perhaps
  propose a solution, because I think the criticism on dwm's behaviour is
  valid.

Because you can't come along and expect polls on the dwm mailing list.
Like I said, there is a clear and strict framework*g*



Re: [dwm] [OT] minimalistic bbs/forum

2008-04-11 Thread hiro
you don't like mailing lists? I can't see the use of a forum...

-- 
hiro



Re: [dwm] [OT] minimalistic bbs/forum

2008-04-11 Thread hiro
how about a web interface to a mailing list? you could tell them to
get a google account...



Re: [dwm] A rather radical thought

2008-04-02 Thread hiro
it would be hilariously great.
i've tried it, but never saw the point of this not-so-revolutionary concept.



Re: [dwm] A rather radical thought

2008-04-02 Thread hiro
I am still eager to sea a really acme-like *interface* additionally to
only it's layout. But i assume this is not your ambition.



Re: [dwm] DWM Tricot

2008-03-24 Thread hiro
You wouldn't need all these different ones if you had my I suck shirt.

--
hiro



Re: [dwm] recent changes

2008-03-13 Thread hiro
Two 1600x1200 monitors will give you 3200x1200 for less than 400
euros. It's not only cheap, but I haven't seen any monitor with that
much pixels at all.
Of course Laptops are becoming more and more common these days, and a
lot of people add bigger monitors to it.
I think It's ok if you say dwm is not made for xinerama. But it used
to be on the todo list...

-- 
hiro



Re: [dwm] Some things about dmenu...

2008-03-08 Thread hiro
Well, thanks for pointing that out, then.
I'm happy you don't want it.

On 3/8/08, Antoni Grzymala [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 hiro dixit (2008-03-08, 09:30):


   this is not this unix convention's purpose.
   I don't see any use of that feature in dmenu. You could always write a
   wrapper around it, if you so want have case insensitivity  so badly.


 If you had read our mails carefully you'd find out we *don't* want this
  feature. It was just a suggestion for those who need it so badly as
  you put it.

  --

 [a]

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  Version: GnuPG v2.0.7 (GNU/Linux)

  iD8DBQFH0q2QL69KEesxVYMRApIAAJ94bljix0AqVWK/cbDFq0pz8pwtbgCffsrc
  hykxHn9ZPltoNk87OQEgg2E=
  =BKjG
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-- 
hiro



Re: [dwm] [OT] vimperator

2008-03-05 Thread hiro
The web is full of visual bloat. That's why your web browser must be
compatible, thus be bloat, too.
Vimperator is no big win. If you want a better web, provide mountable
interfaces to the important services...
And regarding firefox: I tried to print ten pages from firefox
yesterday. It slowly grew to 200mb in ram, and used all the cpu power,
before i killed it and instantly installed opera. Congratulations to
firefox and all those oss fine arts suckers.



Re: [dwm] xinerama, things get more and more useful

2008-03-01 Thread hiro
On 3/1/08, Nicolas Martyanoff [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 On Thu, 28 Feb 2008 23:01:39 +0100

 Anselm R. Garbe [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


  There are kind a lot of caveats in current hg tip, but I
   encourage early adaptors to give it a try and to update from
   time to time, and to report bugs.
  
   The worst caveat atm is that the focus handling among different
   views (screens) might need mouse assistance in some cases, so
   I'm aware of this already.
  
   http://www.suckless.org/shots/dwm-xinerama-new.png
  
   Kind regards,


 I just tried the last hg version, and I am a bit disappointed.
  The idea to divide up the tags between the screens isn't really
  ergonomic.

  A dual (or more) screen, is particulary useful to have two or more
  applications on a single view, for example a coding window and a pdf
  research paper. With the new system, navigating between the tags is
  really tedious; with wmii, I knew that my coding windows (editor,
  doc...) were on tag '2'. A simple alt-2 and it was restaured. With dwm
  old xinerama system, I had to press alt-2 foreach screen which was ok
  though less practical. Now I have to remember two tag, on per screen,
  for each couple of application.

  The only advantage of this system is to remove the need to manually
  toggle between the screens.

  Furthermore, if it was possible before to use a window covering the
  whole display (blender for example) by switching to float mode, the by
  enabling the same tag on each screen (yes it was painful), it's not
  possible anymore.

  I really hope this is gonna change :(

  Regards,


  --
  Nicolas Martyanoff
http://codemore.org
[EMAIL PROTECTED]



Try xmonad, it's usable for the things i'm doing

-- 
hiro



Re: [dwm] xinerama, things get more and more useful

2008-02-29 Thread hiro
doesn't compile, see attachment.
On 2/28/08, Anselm R. Garbe [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 There are kind a lot of caveats in current hg tip, but I
  encourage early adaptors to give it a try and to update from
  time to time, and to report bugs.

  The worst caveat atm is that the focus handling among different
  views (screens) might need mouse assistance in some cases, so
  I'm aware of this already.

  http://www.suckless.org/shots/dwm-xinerama-new.png

  Kind regards,

 --
   Anselm R. Garbe  http://www.suckless.org/  GPG key: 0D73F361




-- 
hiro


2log
Description: Binary data


Re: [dwm] We need a different Xinerama implementation

2008-02-21 Thread hiro
I'm using xmonad now, because hg tip isn't usable with Xinerama yet.
And their model is what i wanted, except window swapping



Re: [dwm] We need a different Xinerama implementation

2008-02-16 Thread hiro
On 2/15/08, Ralph E. Carter [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

  I'm not sure about this idea. I don't like this idea so much
  because it would increase complexity and decrease
  predictability.
 
  Kind regards,
  --
   Anselm R. Garbe http://www.suckless.org/ GPG key: 0D73F361
 

 Yes.
 I vote for simplicity and predictability.
 Thanks.
 _
 Climb to the top of the charts! Play the word scramble challenge with star 
 power.
 http://club.live.com/star_shuffle.aspx?icid=starshuffle_wlmailtextlink_jan


Simplicity has become too much of a religion here. The differences are
quite small, and the only really simple solution is not changing
everything. You shouldn't just believe!
I vote for thoughtfulness.

-- 
hiro



Re: [dwm] Xinerama and multihead support

2008-02-14 Thread hiro
Nicolas, i haven't seen this use case yet, but it's a good point.

I have hg tip running now and no crashes yet. I'm glad that i can test
arg's interpretation of this issue.
Well, now i'm sure david's version is beneficial, because it allows
you to control a lot only by tagging. It's natural and a lot simpler.

You won't need:

1. no new command (to move windows to another monitor).
2. no new memory in your brain (selecting a tag will bring everything
you associate with it to your view).

Perhaps it's only my limited memory;). I definitely don't easily
remember the tag AND monitor of the apps I'm trying to get on view.
But now it is like having 9 additional tags, all named in a confusing
way.

Now finally, my proposal:
Normally each monitor should show everything associated with the selected tag.
If there are multiple selected tags, dwm should regard these as one
monitor, so that we can use the whole capabilities of Xinerama. Here
you are, Nicolas.

hiro



Re: [dwm] We need a different Xinerama implementation

2008-02-14 Thread hiro
  I consider different tagsets for each screen, which can't be
  selected in a join way, to prevent the basic problem of  being
  unable to display the same window on different screens.

It doesn't really fix that problem, but limits the user to make it
seem more logically.
And specially if one of your monitor is bigger than the other, you
sometimes want to move your clients between them.

  Maybe somewhat into the direction of having a 2D tagset, with y
  addressing different screens (yiyus or pancake came up with this
  idea if I remember correctly) for the Xinerama case, and y
  addressing different virtual screens for the non Xinerama case.

This visualization makes things more complicated than they are.
It definitely doesn't fit with numbered tags.

  Hence, say tags 1-4 address screen 1, tags 5-9 address screen 2
  or so, but tagging a client 1+5 is not possible. This should
  give you a rough idea.

This solves problems of the current approach, but i.e. not being able
to tag a client 1+5 will bring other confusion instead.

Moreover, how will that work with 3 screens?

I remembered, that a lot of you use the keyboard only. Your version
would make it easier to change focus to an other monitor, whereas with
david's patch you would either have to use the mouse, or bind a
special key for that.



Re: [dwm] [PATCH] slock with DPMS.

2008-02-11 Thread hiro
What do you people do so that others won't just ctrl-alt-backspace
back to the open console session?



Re: [dwm] rfc: patch: xinerama support

2008-02-07 Thread hiro
Hi,

For a few weeks now i'm using a thinkpad x60s and a 1600x1200 external
tft on my desk. My old machine will probably have a lot of fun with
glenda in the cellar.
I don't know whether Kris started implementing support for xinerama in
wmii. It was talked about last year, but now, that i'm setting up my
screens, this patch is the first i found to serve a working xinerama
environment. And it feels great.
Even though i don't like dwm's strict 2-column design, this patch
shows a lot of potential, very well done!

-- 
hiro