Re: [Elecraft] KPA1500 duty cycle

2018-02-15 Thread Richard Lamont 
The FT8 parameters were tweaked slightly during the beta phase prior to
the release of WSJT-X 1.8.0, and the TX time was reduced to 12.64 sec,
so the duty cycle is now about 42%.

73,
Richard G4DYA

On 15/02/18 01:22, Dennis Moore wrote:
> Specification is 13.48 sec TX, 16.52 sec RX, 45% Duty Cycle.
> 
> Source: http://qrznow.com/new-digital-mode-from-k1jt-ft8/
> 
> 73, Dennis NJ6G
> 
> 
> On 2/14/2018 17:07, Tom-KQ5S wrote:
>> I believe FT8 is 13 sec TX, 2 sec decode and then 15 sec RX for a
>> total of
>> 17 sec non-TX so you have 13 sec TX and 17 sec RX.  Much less than 50%.
>>
>> -
>> 73,
>> Tom - KQ5S
>>
>> On Wed, Feb 14, 2018 at 6:51 PM, Jim Brown 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> And even this is conservative -- JT65 is 48 sec TX and 72 sec RX, so 40%
>>> duty cycle. FT8 and MSK144 have equal TX and RX times, so 50% duty
>>> cycle.
>>> The TX period for MSK144 can be varied from 5-30 sec, but TX and RX
>>> times
>>> are always equal.
>>>
>>> 73, Jim K9YC
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Re: [Elecraft] FIRST TIME HOOKUP OF N1MM+ TO K3 VIS MICROHAM USB INTERFACE III

2018-02-15 Thread Jack Brindle 
A little more info. The K3 and K3S default to 38400 bps on the serial port. 
This can be changed in the configuration menu, and you should verify the 
setting in the menu system.
If it is still set to the default, set your PC for 38400 bps (and the MicroHam 
device as well, then give it a try. N1MM works very well with the K3, so it is 
a matter of getting the configuration correct to make it work.

We 73!

Jack, W6FB


> On Feb 15, 2018, at 5:33 PM, Greg Best  wrote:
> 
> I am trying to get N1MM+ to talk to my K3 but will not do it.
> 
> I am setup for 4800 B, Data 8 bits, Parity N, stop bits 1.  DTR and DTS have
> been tried with both Always ON and Always OFF but neither one works.
> 
> I have tried the Radio reset command from N1MM+ with no luck.
> 
> Can anyone help?
> 73¹s
> Greg
> 
> 16100 Outlook Avenue
> Stilwell, KS 66085
> 816-792-2913 
> 
> 
> 
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Re: [Elecraft] FIRST TIME HOOKUP OF N1MM+ TO K3 VIS MICROHAM USB INTERFACE III

2018-02-15 Thread Henrik Stenstrom 
Yes, I believe the baud rate is the problem.

Should be 38400.

de VK2HHS

On Fri, Feb 16, 2018 at 12:57 PM, Jack Brindle  wrote:

> A little more info. The K3 and K3S default to 38400 bps on the serial
> port. This can be changed in the configuration menu, and you should verify
> the setting in the menu system.
> If it is still set to the default, set your PC for 38400 bps (and the
> MicroHam device as well, then give it a try. N1MM works very well with the
> K3, so it is a matter of getting the configuration correct to make it work.
>
> We 73!
>
> Jack, W6FB
>
>
> > On Feb 15, 2018, at 5:33 PM, Greg Best  wrote:
> >
> > I am trying to get N1MM+ to talk to my K3 but will not do it.
> >
> > I am setup for 4800 B, Data 8 bits, Parity N, stop bits 1.  DTR and DTS
> have
> > been tried with both Always ON and Always OFF but neither one works.
> >
> > I have tried the Radio reset command from N1MM+ with no luck.
> >
> > Can anyone help?
> > 73¹s
> > Greg
> >
> > 16100 Outlook Avenue
> > Stilwell, KS 66085
> > 816-792-2913
> >
> >
> >
> > __
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Re: [Elecraft] FIRST TIME HOOKUP OF N1MM+ TO K3 VIS MICROHAM USB INTERFACE III

2018-02-15 Thread greg best 
Rick,

Thanks for advice on Utility. I downloaded and ran but still no joy. I did see 
FW rev 05.38. I don’t know if that cud be the problem?

Greg Best

Sent from my iPhone

> On Feb 15, 2018, at 9:31 PM, Rick Tavan  wrote:
> 
> You got good advice on baud rate. Also, it's wise always to confirm proper 
> operation with K3 Utility first. If it doesn't connect, chances are N1MM 
> won't, either. Utility marches through speeds until it finds one that works. 
> MM requires a specific speed setting.
> 
> 73,
> 
> /Rick N6XI
> 
> 
> Rick Tavan
> Truckee, CA
> 
>> On Thu, Feb 15, 2018 at 5:33 PM, Greg Best  wrote:
>> I am trying to get N1MM+ to talk to my K3 but will not do it.
>> 
>> I am setup for 4800 B, Data 8 bits, Parity N, stop bits 1.  DTR and DTS have
>> been tried with both Always ON and Always OFF but neither one works.
>> 
>> I have tried the Radio reset command from N1MM+ with no luck.
>> 
>> Can anyone help?
>> 73¹s
>> Greg
>> 
>> 16100 Outlook Avenue
>> Stilwell, KS 66085
>> 816-792-2913
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> __
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Re: [Elecraft] FIRST TIME HOOKUP OF N1MM+ TO K3 VIS MICROHAM USB INTERFACE III

2018-02-15 Thread Rick Tavan 
You got good advice on baud rate. Also, it's wise always to confirm proper
operation with K3 Utility first. If it doesn't connect, chances are N1MM
won't, either. Utility marches through speeds until it finds one that
works. MM requires a specific speed setting.

73,

/Rick N6XI


Rick Tavan
Truckee, CA

On Thu, Feb 15, 2018 at 5:33 PM, Greg Best  wrote:

> I am trying to get N1MM+ to talk to my K3 but will not do it.
>
> I am setup for 4800 B, Data 8 bits, Parity N, stop bits 1.  DTR and DTS
> have
> been tried with both Always ON and Always OFF but neither one works.
>
> I have tried the Radio reset command from N1MM+ with no luck.
>
> Can anyone help?
> 73¹s
> Greg
>
> 16100 Outlook Avenue
> Stilwell, KS 66085
> 816-792-2913
>
>
>
> __
> Elecraft mailing list
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[Elecraft] KPA1500 on AM

2018-02-15 Thread Bill 
How well will the KPA1500 do on AM during very long-winded QSOs? I 
currently use my KPA500 on AM and it does fine - albeit a little noisy 
in the fan department. For information only: The K3 garners excellent 
audio reports on AM.


Bill W2BLC K-Line


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[Elecraft] KPA1500 duty cycle

2018-02-15 Thread j...@kk9a.com 
RTTY contesting has a much higher duty cycle, especially when using a
single radio and no one is answering your CQs.

John KK9A


On Feb 15 03:51:39 G4DYA wrote:

The FT8 parameters were tweaked slightly during the beta phase prior to
the release of WSJT-X 1.8.0, and the TX time was reduced to 12.64 sec,
so the duty cycle is now about 42%.

73,
Richard G4DYA

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Re: [Elecraft] KPA1500 on AM

2018-02-15 Thread Richard Lamont 
On 15/02/18 11:12, Bill wrote:

> How well will the KPA1500 do on AM during very long-winded QSOs? I
> currently use my KPA500 on AM and it does fine - albeit a little noisy
> in the fan department. For information only: The K3 garners excellent
> audio reports on AM.

To prevent flat-topping at 100% mod, for AM the carrier power should be
no more than 25% of the peak envelope power. So I would imagine both
amplifiers would do AM without the slightest difficulty. (I don't work
AM myself so haven't tried it.)


73,
Richard G4DYA
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Re: [Elecraft] OT: USB and LSB - How we got there

2018-02-15 Thread Ian White 

In 2003 I researched the subject for my RSGB Q column, 'In
Practice', and was fortunate to be in contact with some amateurs who
were personally involved in the decision to switch sidebands at
10MHz. This decision was made in April 1952 and eventually became an
IARU standard - but its origins are surprisingly technical. The
standard came out of two totally unrelated design decisions, made by
different people on different continents, and at different times in
the late 1940s.

Those post-war years saw a rapid development in intercontinental HF
telephone links. These links used independent-sideband (ISB)
modulation to carry two separate voice channels on opposite
sidebands, and a major manufacturer of ISB equipment at this time
was the Marconi company. The ISB signal was created by up-converting
two separately generated USB and LSB voice channels to the same
suppressed carrier frequency, and the Marconi engineers made the
smart decision to generate the ISB signal on 10.000MHz (a frequency
on which they would never need to transmit, because it was already
occupied by beacons such as WWV). 

For transmitted frequencies above 10MHz, Marconi used a
crystal-controlled LO that was 10MHz below the output frequency; so
the IF frequency was added to the LO and the two independent
sidebands remained "the right way up". But for transmitted
frequencies *below* 10MHz, the LO frequency was 10MHz *above* the
output frequency; so the IF frequency was *subtracted* from the LO
and the opposite sidebands were *inverted*. In an ISB system, that
meant that the two telephone channels might very easily become
swapped, so station engineers all around the world needed to be sure
when to flip the appropriate switches. 

Out of these working arrangements between engineers, a worldwide
CCIR standard emerged that 10MHz would be the frequency where the
sidebands in ISB systems changed over. 

So what has this to do with amateur SSB? Amateur development in the
late 1940s quickly followed the developments in commercial world -
and sometimes involved the same individuals. A major influence was
the W1DX SSB exciter, published in 1949, which automatically
produced a sideband inversion between 80m and 20m. The W1DX design
used the phasing method which allowed easy sideband selection by
flipping a switch at AF, but by the early 1950s there were also many
filter-method exciters that were not so agile.

By 1951-52, experimenters in Europe and the USA were beginning to
talk to each other on 20m, and quickly realised that they were
heading for a mess. Most people were using USB on 20m, but there was
no international agreement on 80m... and what about the other bands?
>From eyewitness accounts, April 1952 was the moment when the
agreement crystallized as we know it today. 

The two key points in this history are: amateurs were *already
aware* of the commercial dividing line at 10MHz; and the popular
W1DX exciter was *already compatible* with the new proposed standard
[1].

And so it was that two entirely separate and obscure design
decisions - by Marconi engineers and by W1DX - came together to
create the standard that we have today.


[1] SSB exciters using 9MHz SSB generation and a 5MHz VFO are not
relevant to this history. They all came *after* the 10MHz standard
was already in place. 

73 from Ian GM3SEK


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Re: [Elecraft] OT: USB and LSB - How we got there

2018-02-15 Thread Ian White 
Clarification: 

W2KUJ first published the design concept for a 20/80m SSB exciter
using 5MHz SSB generation and a 9MHz VFO, in QST for June 1948.

W1DX then expanded W2KUJ's block-diagram concept into a practical
design for others to copy, and this was published in January 1949.

73 from Ian GM3SEK

>-Original Message-
>From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-
>boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Ian White
>Sent: 15 February 2018 10:11
>To: 'Alan'; elecraft@mailman.qth.net
>Subject: Re: [Elecraft] OT: USB and LSB - How we got there
>
>
>In 2003 I researched the subject for my RSGB Q column, 'In
>Practice', and was fortunate to be in contact with some amateurs
who
>were personally involved in the decision to switch sidebands at
>10MHz. This decision was made in April 1952 and eventually became
>an
>IARU standard - but its origins are surprisingly technical. The
>standard came out of two totally unrelated design decisions, made
by
>different people on different continents, and at different times in
>the late 1940s.
>
>Those post-war years saw a rapid development in intercontinental HF
>telephone links. These links used independent-sideband (ISB)
>modulation to carry two separate voice channels on opposite
>sidebands, and a major manufacturer of ISB equipment at this time
>was the Marconi company. The ISB signal was created by up-
>converting
>two separately generated USB and LSB voice channels to the same
>suppressed carrier frequency, and the Marconi engineers made the
>smart decision to generate the ISB signal on 10.000MHz (a frequency
>on which they would never need to transmit, because it was already
>occupied by beacons such as WWV).
>
>For transmitted frequencies above 10MHz, Marconi used a
>crystal-controlled LO that was 10MHz below the output frequency; so
>the IF frequency was added to the LO and the two independent
>sidebands remained "the right way up". But for transmitted
>frequencies *below* 10MHz, the LO frequency was 10MHz *above*
>the
>output frequency; so the IF frequency was *subtracted* from the LO
>and the opposite sidebands were *inverted*. In an ISB system, that
>meant that the two telephone channels might very easily become
>swapped, so station engineers all around the world needed to be
sure
>when to flip the appropriate switches.
>
>Out of these working arrangements between engineers, a worldwide
>CCIR standard emerged that 10MHz would be the frequency where the
>sidebands in ISB systems changed over.
>
>So what has this to do with amateur SSB? Amateur development in the
>late 1940s quickly followed the developments in commercial world -
>and sometimes involved the same individuals. A major influence was
>the W1DX SSB exciter, published in 1949, which automatically
>produced a sideband inversion between 80m and 20m. The W1DX
>design
>used the phasing method which allowed easy sideband selection by
>flipping a switch at AF, but by the early 1950s there were also
many
>filter-method exciters that were not so agile.
>
>By 1951-52, experimenters in Europe and the USA were beginning to
>talk to each other on 20m, and quickly realised that they were
>heading for a mess. Most people were using USB on 20m, but there
>was
>no international agreement on 80m... and what about the other
>bands?
>>From eyewitness accounts, April 1952 was the moment when the
>agreement crystallized as we know it today.
>
>The two key points in this history are: amateurs were *already
>aware* of the commercial dividing line at 10MHz; and the popular
>W1DX exciter was *already compatible* with the new proposed
>standard
>[1].
>
>And so it was that two entirely separate and obscure design
>decisions - by Marconi engineers and by W1DX - came together to
>create the standard that we have today.
>
>
>[1] SSB exciters using 9MHz SSB generation and a 5MHz VFO are not
>relevant to this history. They all came *after* the 10MHz standard
>was already in place.
>
>73 from Ian GM3SEK
>

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[Elecraft] Wanted: Your RFI P3 images...

2018-02-15 Thread Dave Cole (NK7Z) 

Hello,

If you have any images of RFI taken using your P3, and you know for sure 
what caused the RFI please send them to me OFF LIST for the RFI snapshot 
page at:


https://www.nk7z.net/rfi-snapshots

Please be sure to include what caused the RFI, and if you have an audio 
clip please add it as well.


I am trying to grow the page, so I need your RFI shots...
--
73s and thanks,
Dave
NK7Z
https://www.nk7z.net
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Re: [Elecraft] KPA1500 duty cycle

2018-02-15 Thread Nr4c 
And you can affect duty cycle by adjusting the cw repetition rate. If it gets 
too hot increase the delay. 

Sent from my iPhone
...nr4c. bill


> On Feb 15, 2018, at 7:39 AM, "j...@kk9a.com"  wrote:
> 
> RTTY contesting has a much higher duty cycle, especially when using a
> single radio and no one is answering your CQs.
> 
> John KK9A
> 
> 
> On Feb 15 03:51:39 G4DYA wrote:
> 
> The FT8 parameters were tweaked slightly during the beta phase prior to
> the release of WSJT-X 1.8.0, and the TX time was reduced to 12.64 sec,
> so the duty cycle is now about 42%.
> 
> 73,
> Richard G4DYA
> 
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[Elecraft] KPA1500

2018-02-15 Thread AB4IQ 
Just to let everyone know that KPA1500 #29 is now on my desk hooked up and
will turn it on after I read the manual.

 

Ed. AB4IQ

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Re: [Elecraft] KPA1500 duty cycle

2018-02-15 Thread Eric Swartz - WA6HHQ, Elecraft 

Easy to handle for the 1500 on any band. :-)

73,
Eric
/elecraft.com/

On 2/15/2018 12:51 AM, Richard Lamont wrote:

The FT8 parameters were tweaked slightly during the beta phase prior to
the release of WSJT-X 1.8.0, and the TX time was reduced to 12.64 sec,
so the duty cycle is now about 42%.

73,
Richard G4DYA

On 15/02/18 01:22, Dennis Moore wrote:

Specification is 13.48 sec TX, 16.52 sec RX, 45% Duty Cycle.

Source: http://qrznow.com/new-digital-mode-from-k1jt-ft8/

73, Dennis NJ6G


On 2/14/2018 17:07, Tom-KQ5S wrote:

I believe FT8 is 13 sec TX, 2 sec decode and then 15 sec RX for a
total of
17 sec non-TX so you have 13 sec TX and 17 sec RX.  Much less than 50%.

-
73,
Tom - KQ5S

On Wed, Feb 14, 2018 at 6:51 PM, Jim Brown 
wrote:


And even this is conservative -- JT65 is 48 sec TX and 72 sec RX, so 40%
duty cycle. FT8 and MSK144 have equal TX and RX times, so 50% duty
cycle.
The TX period for MSK144 can be varied from 5-30 sec, but TX and RX
times
are always equal.

73, Jim K9YC

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Re: [Elecraft] KPA1500 duty cycle

2018-02-15 Thread Eric Swartz - WA6HHQ, Elecraft 

The KPA1500 can handle 1500W RTTY contest operation with no problem. Same for 
CW.

(One of our Field Testers is W0YK. See his review on eHam.)

73,
Eric
/elecraft.com/

On 2/15/2018 6:48 AM, Nr4c wrote:

And you can affect duty cycle by adjusting the cw repetition rate. If it gets 
too hot increase the delay.

Sent from my iPhone
...nr4c. bill



On Feb 15, 2018, at 7:39 AM, "j...@kk9a.com"  wrote:

RTTY contesting has a much higher duty cycle, especially when using a
single radio and no one is answering your CQs.

John KK9A


On Feb 15 03:51:39 G4DYA wrote:

The FT8 parameters were tweaked slightly during the beta phase prior to
the release of WSJT-X 1.8.0, and the TX time was reduced to 12.64 sec,
so the duty cycle is now about 42%.

73,
Richard G4DYA

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Re: [Elecraft] OT: USB and LSB - How we got there

2018-02-15 Thread donovanf 
The 5.2 MHz SSB exciter construction article that Ian referred to 

in January 1949 QST is here: 



http://p1k.arrl.org/pubs_archive/29327 


73 
Frank 
W3LPL 

- Original Message -

From: donov...@starpower.net 
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net 
Sent: Thursday, February 15, 2018 5:17:57 PM 
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] OT: USB and LSB - How we got there 

Thanks Ian, very interesting reading! 


http://p1k.arrl.org/pubs_archive/28966 


73 
Frank 
W3LPL 

- Original Message - 

From: "Ian White"  
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net 
Sent: Thursday, February 15, 2018 11:27:15 AM 
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] OT: USB and LSB - How we got there 

Clarification: 

W2KUJ first published the design concept for a 20/80m SSB exciter 
using 5MHz SSB generation and a 9MHz VFO, in QST for June 1948. 

W1DX then expanded W2KUJ's block-diagram concept into a practical 
design for others to copy, and this was published in January 1949. 

73 from Ian GM3SEK 

>-Original Message- 
>From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft- 
>boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Ian White 
>Sent: 15 February 2018 10:11 
>To: 'Alan'; elecraft@mailman.qth.net 
>Subject: Re: [Elecraft] OT: USB and LSB - How we got there 
> 
> 
>In 2003 I researched the subject for my RSGB Q column, 'In 
>Practice', and was fortunate to be in contact with some amateurs 
who 
>were personally involved in the decision to switch sidebands at 
>10MHz. This decision was made in April 1952 and eventually became 
>an 
>IARU standard - but its origins are surprisingly technical. The 
>standard came out of two totally unrelated design decisions, made 
by 
>different people on different continents, and at different times in 
>the late 1940s. 
> 
>Those post-war years saw a rapid development in intercontinental HF 
>telephone links. These links used independent-sideband (ISB) 
>modulation to carry two separate voice channels on opposite 
>sidebands, and a major manufacturer of ISB equipment at this time 
>was the Marconi company. The ISB signal was created by up- 
>converting 
>two separately generated USB and LSB voice channels to the same 
>suppressed carrier frequency, and the Marconi engineers made the 
>smart decision to generate the ISB signal on 10.000MHz (a frequency 
>on which they would never need to transmit, because it was already 
>occupied by beacons such as WWV). 
> 
>For transmitted frequencies above 10MHz, Marconi used a 
>crystal-controlled LO that was 10MHz below the output frequency; so 
>the IF frequency was added to the LO and the two independent 
>sidebands remained "the right way up". But for transmitted 
>frequencies *below* 10MHz, the LO frequency was 10MHz *above* 
>the 
>output frequency; so the IF frequency was *subtracted* from the LO 
>and the opposite sidebands were *inverted*. In an ISB system, that 
>meant that the two telephone channels might very easily become 
>swapped, so station engineers all around the world needed to be 
sure 
>when to flip the appropriate switches. 
> 
>Out of these working arrangements between engineers, a worldwide 
>CCIR standard emerged that 10MHz would be the frequency where the 
>sidebands in ISB systems changed over. 
> 
>So what has this to do with amateur SSB? Amateur development in the 
>late 1940s quickly followed the developments in commercial world - 
>and sometimes involved the same individuals. A major influence was 
>the W1DX SSB exciter, published in 1949, which automatically 
>produced a sideband inversion between 80m and 20m. The W1DX 
>design 
>used the phasing method which allowed easy sideband selection by 
>flipping a switch at AF, but by the early 1950s there were also 
many 
>filter-method exciters that were not so agile. 
> 
>By 1951-52, experimenters in Europe and the USA were beginning to 
>talk to each other on 20m, and quickly realised that they were 
>heading for a mess. Most people were using USB on 20m, but there 
>was 
>no international agreement on 80m... and what about the other 
>bands? 
>>From eyewitness accounts, April 1952 was the moment when the 
>agreement crystallized as we know it today. 
> 
>The two key points in this history are: amateurs were *already 
>aware* of the commercial dividing line at 10MHz; and the popular 
>W1DX exciter was *already compatible* with the new proposed 
>standard 
>[1]. 
> 
>And so it was that two entirely separate and obscure design 
>decisions - by Marconi engineers and by W1DX - came together to 
>create the standard that we have today. 
> 
> 
>[1] SSB exciters using 9MHz SSB generation and a 5MHz VFO are not 
>relevant to this history. They all came *after* the 10MHz standard 
>was already in place. 
> 
>73 from Ian GM3SEK 
> 

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Re: [Elecraft] KPA1500 on AM

2018-02-15 Thread Eric Swartz - WA6HHQ, Elecraft 
Agreed. AM with carrier set properly to 25% of peak power (1500 * 0.25 = 375 W 
max carrier ) is no strain for the 1500.  With the normal variations of the AM 
speech envelope between the 235 W carrier and the peaks at 1500W, the amp is 
loafing along at any key down time.  :-)


Eric
/elecraft.com/

On 2/15/2018 3:27 AM, Richard Lamont wrote:

On 15/02/18 11:12, Bill wrote:


How well will the KPA1500 do on AM during very long-winded QSOs? I
currently use my KPA500 on AM and it does fine - albeit a little noisy
in the fan department. For information only: The K3 garners excellent
audio reports on AM.

To prevent flat-topping at 100% mod, for AM the carrier power should be
no more than 25% of the peak envelope power. So I would imagine both
amplifiers would do AM without the slightest difficulty. (I don't work
AM myself so haven't tried it.)


73,
Richard G4DYA
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Re: [Elecraft] OT: USB and LSB - How we got there

2018-02-15 Thread donovanf 
Thanks Ian, very interesting reading! 


http://p1k.arrl.org/pubs_archive/28966 


73 
Frank 
W3LPL 

- Original Message -

From: "Ian White"  
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net 
Sent: Thursday, February 15, 2018 11:27:15 AM 
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] OT: USB and LSB - How we got there 

Clarification: 

W2KUJ first published the design concept for a 20/80m SSB exciter 
using 5MHz SSB generation and a 9MHz VFO, in QST for June 1948. 

W1DX then expanded W2KUJ's block-diagram concept into a practical 
design for others to copy, and this was published in January 1949. 

73 from Ian GM3SEK 

>-Original Message- 
>From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft- 
>boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Ian White 
>Sent: 15 February 2018 10:11 
>To: 'Alan'; elecraft@mailman.qth.net 
>Subject: Re: [Elecraft] OT: USB and LSB - How we got there 
> 
> 
>In 2003 I researched the subject for my RSGB Q column, 'In 
>Practice', and was fortunate to be in contact with some amateurs 
who 
>were personally involved in the decision to switch sidebands at 
>10MHz. This decision was made in April 1952 and eventually became 
>an 
>IARU standard - but its origins are surprisingly technical. The 
>standard came out of two totally unrelated design decisions, made 
by 
>different people on different continents, and at different times in 
>the late 1940s. 
> 
>Those post-war years saw a rapid development in intercontinental HF 
>telephone links. These links used independent-sideband (ISB) 
>modulation to carry two separate voice channels on opposite 
>sidebands, and a major manufacturer of ISB equipment at this time 
>was the Marconi company. The ISB signal was created by up- 
>converting 
>two separately generated USB and LSB voice channels to the same 
>suppressed carrier frequency, and the Marconi engineers made the 
>smart decision to generate the ISB signal on 10.000MHz (a frequency 
>on which they would never need to transmit, because it was already 
>occupied by beacons such as WWV). 
> 
>For transmitted frequencies above 10MHz, Marconi used a 
>crystal-controlled LO that was 10MHz below the output frequency; so 
>the IF frequency was added to the LO and the two independent 
>sidebands remained "the right way up". But for transmitted 
>frequencies *below* 10MHz, the LO frequency was 10MHz *above* 
>the 
>output frequency; so the IF frequency was *subtracted* from the LO 
>and the opposite sidebands were *inverted*. In an ISB system, that 
>meant that the two telephone channels might very easily become 
>swapped, so station engineers all around the world needed to be 
sure 
>when to flip the appropriate switches. 
> 
>Out of these working arrangements between engineers, a worldwide 
>CCIR standard emerged that 10MHz would be the frequency where the 
>sidebands in ISB systems changed over. 
> 
>So what has this to do with amateur SSB? Amateur development in the 
>late 1940s quickly followed the developments in commercial world - 
>and sometimes involved the same individuals. A major influence was 
>the W1DX SSB exciter, published in 1949, which automatically 
>produced a sideband inversion between 80m and 20m. The W1DX 
>design 
>used the phasing method which allowed easy sideband selection by 
>flipping a switch at AF, but by the early 1950s there were also 
many 
>filter-method exciters that were not so agile. 
> 
>By 1951-52, experimenters in Europe and the USA were beginning to 
>talk to each other on 20m, and quickly realised that they were 
>heading for a mess. Most people were using USB on 20m, but there 
>was 
>no international agreement on 80m... and what about the other 
>bands? 
>>From eyewitness accounts, April 1952 was the moment when the 
>agreement crystallized as we know it today. 
> 
>The two key points in this history are: amateurs were *already 
>aware* of the commercial dividing line at 10MHz; and the popular 
>W1DX exciter was *already compatible* with the new proposed 
>standard 
>[1]. 
> 
>And so it was that two entirely separate and obscure design 
>decisions - by Marconi engineers and by W1DX - came together to 
>create the standard that we have today. 
> 
> 
>[1] SSB exciters using 9MHz SSB generation and a 5MHz VFO are not 
>relevant to this history. They all came *after* the 10MHz standard 
>was already in place. 
> 
>73 from Ian GM3SEK 
> 

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Re: [Elecraft] OT: USB and LSB - How we got there

2018-02-15 Thread Fred Jensen 
I have a vague recollection from the early 50s [all recollections from 
then are vague] that sideband generation at 5 MHz became popular as 
phasing rigs began to give way to filter rigs and for some reason, 
crystals in the 5 MHz region were more plentiful and cheaper. ???  The 
"9 and 5" scheme gave you 20 and 80 [and I'm not sure when phone on 40 
was authorized in the US], but rigs such as the Swan 500 in the early 
60's generated SSB at 5.500 MHz with additional VFO frequencies to hit 
40, 15, and 10 as well.


I was originally licensed in '53 but had been listening since mid '51 
and the "LSB below 10 Mcs, USB above" convention was thoroughly and 
firmly established by then.  Nice to know where it came from.


73,

Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW
Sparks NV DM09dn
Washoe County

On 2/15/2018 3:27 AM, Ian White wrote:

Clarification:

W2KUJ first published the design concept for a 20/80m SSB exciter
using 5MHz SSB generation and a 9MHz VFO, in QST for June 1948.

W1DX then expanded W2KUJ's block-diagram concept into a practical
design for others to copy, and this was published in January 1949.

73 from Ian GM3SEK


-Original Message-
From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-
boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Ian White
Sent: 15 February 2018 10:11
To: 'Alan'; elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] OT: USB and LSB - How we got there


In 2003 I researched the subject for my RSGB Q column, 'In
Practice', and was fortunate to be in contact with some amateurs

who

were personally involved in the decision to switch sidebands at
10MHz. This decision was made in April 1952 and eventually became
an
IARU standard - but its origins are surprisingly technical. The
standard came out of two totally unrelated design decisions, made

by

different people on different continents, and at different times in
the late 1940s.

Those post-war years saw a rapid development in intercontinental HF
telephone links. These links used independent-sideband (ISB)
modulation to carry two separate voice channels on opposite
sidebands, and a major manufacturer of ISB equipment at this time
was the Marconi company. The ISB signal was created by up-
converting
two separately generated USB and LSB voice channels to the same
suppressed carrier frequency, and the Marconi engineers made the
smart decision to generate the ISB signal on 10.000MHz (a frequency
on which they would never need to transmit, because it was already
occupied by beacons such as WWV).

For transmitted frequencies above 10MHz, Marconi used a
crystal-controlled LO that was 10MHz below the output frequency; so
the IF frequency was added to the LO and the two independent
sidebands remained "the right way up". But for transmitted
frequencies *below* 10MHz, the LO frequency was 10MHz *above*
the
output frequency; so the IF frequency was *subtracted* from the LO
and the opposite sidebands were *inverted*. In an ISB system, that
meant that the two telephone channels might very easily become
swapped, so station engineers all around the world needed to be

sure

when to flip the appropriate switches.

Out of these working arrangements between engineers, a worldwide
CCIR standard emerged that 10MHz would be the frequency where the
sidebands in ISB systems changed over.

So what has this to do with amateur SSB? Amateur development in the
late 1940s quickly followed the developments in commercial world -
and sometimes involved the same individuals. A major influence was
the W1DX SSB exciter, published in 1949, which automatically
produced a sideband inversion between 80m and 20m. The W1DX
design
used the phasing method which allowed easy sideband selection by
flipping a switch at AF, but by the early 1950s there were also

many

filter-method exciters that were not so agile.

By 1951-52, experimenters in Europe and the USA were beginning to
talk to each other on 20m, and quickly realised that they were
heading for a mess. Most people were using USB on 20m, but there
was
no international agreement on 80m... and what about the other
bands?
>From eyewitness accounts, April 1952 was the moment when the
agreement crystallized as we know it today.

The two key points in this history are: amateurs were *already
aware* of the commercial dividing line at 10MHz; and the popular
W1DX exciter was *already compatible* with the new proposed
standard
[1].

And so it was that two entirely separate and obscure design
decisions - by Marconi engineers and by W1DX - came together to
create the standard that we have today.


[1] SSB exciters using 9MHz SSB generation and a 5MHz VFO are not
relevant to this history. They all came *after* the 10MHz standard
was already in place.

73 from Ian GM3SEK


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Re: [Elecraft] OT: USB and LSB - How we got there

2018-02-15 Thread Mike Harris 

Members only.

Regards,

Mike VP8NO

On 15/02/2018 14:37, donov...@starpower.net wrote:

The 5.2 MHz SSB exciter construction article that Ian referred to

in January 1949 QST is here:



http://p1k.arrl.org/pubs_archive/29327


73
Frank
W3LPL





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[Elecraft] FIRST TIME HOOKUP OF N1MM+ TO K3 VIS MICROHAM USB INTERFACE III

2018-02-15 Thread Greg Best 
I am trying to get N1MM+ to talk to my K3 but will not do it.

I am setup for 4800 B, Data 8 bits, Parity N, stop bits 1.  DTR and DTS have
been tried with both Always ON and Always OFF but neither one works.

I have tried the Radio reset command from N1MM+ with no luck.

Can anyone help?
73¹s
Greg

16100 Outlook Avenue
Stilwell, KS 66085
816-792-2913 



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Re: [Elecraft] FIRST TIME HOOKUP OF N1MM+ TO K3 VIS MICROHAM USB INTERFACE III

2018-02-15 Thread Jack Brindle 
Try 38400 instead of 4800.

Jack, W6FB


> On Feb 15, 2018, at 5:33 PM, Greg Best  wrote:
> 
> I am trying to get N1MM+ to talk to my K3 but will not do it.
> 
> I am setup for 4800 B, Data 8 bits, Parity N, stop bits 1.  DTR and DTS have
> been tried with both Always ON and Always OFF but neither one works.
> 
> I have tried the Radio reset command from N1MM+ with no luck.
> 
> Can anyone help?
> 73¹s
> Greg
> 
> 16100 Outlook Avenue
> Stilwell, KS 66085
> 816-792-2913 
> 
> 
> 
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