[Elecraft] Pecker blanking, NB NR
Breaking out what KA1J said in reply to ex-VR2BG/p in another thread: As to the OTHR, I can't say I have been aware of it at my QTH and that may be a result on none locally or maybe a lack of adequate antennae (all wire antennas hung in trees). But, my second radio was a Drake TR7 and the Russian Woodpecker was horrible back then and Drake had a modification to their noise blanker that was predictive for that and it worked wonders! It may be asking too much to think that Elecraft will improve their noise blanking functions to meet this need. I'm not an engineer and don't understand the limitations between difficult and impossible in this regard. I do know power line noise from Amtrak's catenary overhead power lines is killing my reception and there is nothing I can do with NB NR settings in the K3 to mitigate it. Something more repetitive as OTHR might have better success at resolution. Still, if there were a better way to reduce the effects of power line noise or digital RF producing devices, that would certainly be of benefit to almost all of us. I've heard OTHR from W1/W2/W4 on remote receivers at what I would consider lesser stations than yours, Gary. If you were chasing XR0YG or T2YY on 17m around 14-15 GMT 2013-03-14 you might have been able to hear one. Have a look at what was spotted - several EUs saying it was ZC4 yet again a W4 not sure if it was radar. It's out there, you'll hear it if you're in the right place, at the right time, should one be QRV, the band is open you know what it is. Take one of those away it might as well not exist. As far as that one observer is concerned. Oh, if we all were so lucky to be blissfully oblivious to what's actually going on on the bands... ;^) The mod you mention for the TR7 were component changes that changed time constants of the rig's REACTIVE blanker to better respond to what the original U-land woodpecker's pulses were like. The only PREDICTIVE blanker I'm aware of was the one we did at AEA. A pulse generator that the operator could sync with the OTHR (and vary blanking width) would chop off the antenna using a DBM for a gate (the blanker was external, sat in front of radio in line with the feeder). The K3 already has the gate, figuring out when to wiggle something isn't a major task - it's more a matter of whether there's a way to bring the wiggle to the gate the user interface for controlling the wiggles. Nearly daily OTHR on 40 80m from my country that can be heard in W6/W7 has been around longer than the K3, so it might have crossed somebody's mind - or maybe not. The problem with noise like you're suffering is if it isn't something that a reactive blanker is meant to react to, it won't help as you've found. Likewise if the noise - or the crud you also mention - isn't like something the NR is meant to chew on, that won't help either. To be honest, NR isn't something that will ever touch the crud - so yes, you're probably asking too much with that one. There are more effective ways to deal with both (starting with fixing the sources), though I believe I have seen chatter here suggesting that some rigs have better blankers or NR than Brand-K's. So let me suggest asking some mates with other rigs to come around see what they're like. If there is one that does better, then that suggests there's probably room for improvement of the K3. Report back here, don't get discouraged by the user community's usual reaction to anything said to be anything other than perfection perhaps it'll kick something off in the end everybody ends up with something that works better. 73, ex-VR2BG/p. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Is ham radio a sport ??
W5TVW asked: TOO MUCH, especially on weekends! Shouldn't there be a small segment of the bands set aside for non contest use? Or would this be asking too much?? It takes the level of activity of a contest to keep amateur allocations free of over-the-horizon radar. On 2013-03-17 - during the Russian DX Contest, one of few phone/CW events - I have only 65 entries in my OTHR SWL log. Compare that to today - with about 6 hours left to go: 270 entries in the log already. Sadly, that's typical for a weekday, based on about two months of nearly daily observation. Within minutes of contests ending, I've seen the VK OTHR return to 15m. Contest activity can also push the OTHRs around the band - I've seen this happen with both VK what probably was ZC4, working their way up the band over the course of a few hours, away from the contest activity as it increased as the band opened to a populated part of the world - and then back again as the band started to close down. During the RDXC contest I also logged a LOT less of the Bravoland OTHRs, so activity is GOOD. It keeps these nastiest of intruders - with ERPs of ~60 dBW across 10,/20/50 kc or more of the band at one go - away. These things are literally electromagnetic weapons of mass destruction they're used on amateurs daily. Is very clear from here: use it or loose it. Amateur service activity - even if it isn't particularly your cup of tea - is better than radiolocation service activity in allocations where there should be no radiolocation. At least IMHO. Nothing else keeps OTHR away - only contests do. I'll say this again - it would be really neat if the K3 had a predictive blanker for OTHR. 73, ex-VR2BG/p. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] OT-P3 capture of a 17M intruder
AK5X asked: Anyone have any ideas as to what this is? http://www.flickr.com/photos/ak5x/8380898512/in/photostream It's over-the-horizon radar. West from W5 is consistent with what I saw from XV out of the SE (last August) from JA3 just a bit west of south (last November). Intersection of bearings: VK. Dirty little secret: a lot of the OTHR in amateur service allocations comes from VK ZC4. 73, ex-VR2BG/p. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] XV144 - does it power spike
W8ZN shared: Most of the YaKeIc I've ever worked with have this issue. Anytime you use ALC to control the power output there is a chance that that can happen if you are turning the power way down. When the rig is first keyed, there is a window before the ALC voltage is set properly that can allow this. It may be only milliseconds but with solid state devices, that could be all it takes. I think this might be product specific, as ! never experienced this with any Brand-I or Brand-K only with one Brand-Y product I have had or used over the years. On that particular Brand-Y product, there is overshoot only when reducing power from the front panel control - not when the rear panel spigot is pulled negative - the exact opposite of what is mentioned above. Probably best to check, as Terry says that little overshoot can damage - or if one of those rigs were driving something like a KPA500, spit out a bit of splatter that isn't nice. 73, ex-VR2BG/p. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 spurious radiation?
M0TRN replied to K8AZT: I had this happen to me a few days ago where I was calling CQ on 7.015 and was spotted on 14.0614 by Tim KQ8M's skimmer. I emailed KQ8M to ask him if there was a problem with his skimmer. He replied that he wouldn't rule out that the problem was in his Rx setup, but it was tuned to 20m. Now I was running through the linear and an ATU, and I can't see any logical relationship between the two frequencies, so I'm leaning to the theory that his receiver was the culprit, although I did find it very strange. I think a lot of RBN skimmers use SoftRock receivers, and I'm guessing that if his VFO was tuned to 14.050 using the 2nd harmonic of a 7.025 fundamental, it would kind of fit, but I'm still surprised that my 300W signal to an inverted V was 6dB over the noise on the wrong band in Ohio, 3800 miles away on the other side of the Atlantic... I'm not sure exactly because I don't know what receiver he was using, but it did have me puzzled and when I saw John's post I thought I'd mention it. Here's the spot in question: de dx freq cq/dx snr speed time M0TRN 14061.4 CQ [LoTW] 6 dB 22 wpm 1952z 22 Jan KQ8M M0TRN 7015.0 CQ [LoTW] 14 dB 21 wpm 1952z 22 Jan S50ARX M0TRN 7015.0 CQ [LoTW] 14 dB 19 wpm 1952z 22 Jan W3LPL M0TRN 7015.0 CQ [LoTW] 14 dB 19 wpm 1952z 22 Jan W3LPL This from only a very quick look at RBN spots from the day I believe K8AZT's wrong-band RBN spot happened on - but all of the 14 wrong-band RBN spots from that skimmer had a relationship between the wrong-band spotted the actual frequencies the stations were on (based on where all the other skimmers were spotting those 14 stations at the time). In the course of looking those up, I noticed another wrong-band RBN spot from KQ8M's skimmer that wrong-band spotted M0TRN above. Also found in the course of looking at not quite all of the 13 calls spotted on 10m by the skimmer that wrong-band spotted K8AZT (coincidentally another K3 owner), were three wrong-band RBN spots from yet another skimmer. Not sure, but I think all three skimmers concerned use Softrock SDRs (standalone, not IF). Well spotted, gentlemen. No worries about your K3s, but anyone into RBN might bear in mind I see about at least 3% of what was RBN spotted on one day by one of these three skimmers (together roughly 2.5% of skimmers QRV in the past 7 days) was spotted on 10, 15 or 20 when the station was actually on 40m. I even found two of these skimmers saying one station's CQ was on both 28031 14043 at the same time (not a multi-multi contest station it was a GMT Monday). A more thorough look into all the possible Softrock spurious response RBN spots might be interesting, but beyond me. I'm rather surprised at how many of these apparently LO harmonic related ones I found in such short order. 73/HLNY, ex-VR2BG/p. On 24 January 2012 13:08, John/K8AZT k8azt...@sbcglobal.net wrote: I have not been monitoring this mail list much recently so I apologize if this subject has been discussed previously. I like to monitor the reversebeacon.net website while calling cq or just monitoring looking for a qso. Recently I have discovered a situation which has me puzzled and I am hoping someone here might be able to give me some insight what might be happening. When calling cq (CW) on 7.0 MHz cw, I see several hits on the reverse beacon website on 7.0 MHz, however I have also seen a couple stations allegedly hearing me on 10.1 MHz (2 occurrences) and a station hearing me on 28 MHz bands (1 occurrence). I am hoping this is a problem with the skimmers, but want to check out if there is anything which might not be right with my K3 and/or antenna which might be generating unwanted radiations. At the moment I do not have exact frequencies where I was being monitored. I just thought someone might have a suggestion where do I proceed. At the moment I do not have access to a frequency analyzer, but hope I can find one to borrow locally. Thank you for any suggestions/comments anyone in the reflector might have. 73, John/K8AZT __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Fw: K3/K144XV/P3 Signal Strength Readings
N1AL said: I realize that IARU Region 1 recommendations officially apply only to Region 1 (Europe, Africa, Middle East, N. Asia) but since I don't know of any other official recommendation that's the one I used for the P3. Not sure who has adopted the Recommendation. As GM4ESD mentioned, what IARU models itself on has another step to the overall process - though this has more to do with regulatory matters. The bits of that organization that do standardization stuff like this involves stakeholders the process is one where they all agree on something, rather than just some of them then the rest of the world endorses that. Also note that since 1978, this is not one of the things that has made the rounds of the IARU Regions. Since the Recommendation is more like an endorsement of an existing industry standard, the industry association might be a better reference. To be honest, it seems with transverter conversion gains ranging from under 15 to over 25 dB since they also can be cascaded, maybe with products like the K3 P3 where the signal strength indication now means something, the best solution is something the user can set. This seems necessary just for the XVs/K144XV alone. Or maybe just put a sticker below the meter: Signals in the meter may/may not be as strong as they appear. ;^) 73, ex-VR2BG/p. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Fw: K3/K144XV/P3 Signal Strength Readings
G3UCK now at least has ex-VR2BG to talk to: Very interesting, Brett, and thank you for your comments and the research you have done. I *was* beginning to feel a little isolated by lack of comment from anyone hihi! Although I did receive one reply offlist reporting experience similiar to mine. The Brand-E community is rather USA-centric, in case you have not noticed ;^). You bring up something that falls in the something-is-other-than-fantastic category that is not conducive to cheerleading or provides an opportunity to express economic patriotism, hence you were ignored. Hence your posts, my post nothing else but somebody saying Yeah, I noticed the same thing to you directly. Is a bit of a shame, because it gets in the way of sorting out a product that has things that need sorting out. I was not aware of the 1990 Torremolinos recommendation as such but a recent thread here on the reflector http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/elecraft/2011-January/143651.html noted the ambiguity about 6m and Alan Bloom of Elecraft concluded that it was generally accepted that it should be treated as in the -93dbm category like 2m. However, you are correct to point out that it is a Region 1 (ie EU) recommendation and I have not been able find out whether or not there are similar or different recommendations for Regions 2 and 3. Compared with my FT847 (another rig that straddles the -73/-93dbm boundary) the S meter on the K144XV/K3 reads low on 2m and there have been a number of postings on the reflector from at least two of the IARU regions, if not all three, by people who feel that at present it reads low compared with what they are used to on other rigs. This suggests to me that other commercial rigs for 2m do use the -93dbm standard - as the P3 now does. Unfortunately I do not have any test gear that will produce a known 50 microvolts or 5 microvolts on 2m to do some checking. I accept that this doesn't seem to accord with your findings on your rig, Brett, if I properly understand them. As general comment, though, the rig doesn't seem to show enough difference in db between S1 and S9 on the bands you mention. It was the FT-847 that I was describing - one product from one manufacturer with Brand-Y's rather peculiar approach to RD is obviously not the best way to judge overall state-of-play of the industry, but it is a start I believe a more thorough look at how products are set up how they actually perform will find not many following this Recommendation (do the likes of the really good, long established respected transverter manufacturers really add 20 dB gain to the output of their products in order to comply?). S-meters are of course S-meters, we both I suspect are long enough in the tooth to understand their limitations, but a 20 dB delta is not insignificant I really do wonder about this Recommendation that is so old, may not be followed we cannot now see for ourselves why it is we were told things should be this way. It merits looking at further, especially if as I suspect (though my experience is only from IARU R3 what they get up to in their conferences), there was zero involvement of anyone other than national societies in drafting it. To anyone with a relevant professional background, this point alone is a bit of a show-stopper. 73, ex-VR2BG/p. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Fw: K3/K144XV/P3 Signal Strength Readings
A lonely G3UCK said, seemingly talking to himself: No comments from Elecraft or elsewhere on my posting below, so perhaps my conclusions are wrong or maybe I'm just expecting results too quickly. Any views anyone? I have wondered about this IARU R1 Recommendation about S-meters. In order to comply, it means transverters have to be 20 dB hotter on the output for the same input signal level, as the transverter is usually used with a radio where S9 is -73 dBm not -93 dBm. Or all radios have some means to make the S-meter seem 20 dB hotter when used with a transverter. I am not aware of any that do. None that I have do this, so I guess transverters are that way. For radios that straddle R1's -73/-93 dBm S9 boundary, we should also see signs of compliance with the Recommendation. A quick check of one such reasonably current product from one of The Big Three I own that I do not recall acting like it complies with the Recommendation shows that indeed, it does not. It is has one of these new-fangled light bulb S-meters, where S1 is set to light up at different levels on 70cm, 2m, 6m, 10/20m 80m (total spread between them: 9 dB). S9 is set to 31, 31, 28, 25 22 dB above S1 on those bands, respectively. From S9 to S9+60 is 60 dB. The narrative for this Recommendation, found at http://iaru-r1.org/index.php?option=com_remositoryItemid=173func=downloadid=178chk=b8ce4681621e009741d6eabdce8eef20no_html=1 At the IARU Region 1 Conference in Hungary 1978 the need for a harmonised standard for the S-meter scale was expressed and a proposal was accepted for publication in society journals. The essential recommendation was 1 S-point is 6 dB . At the Brighton Conference in 1981 the recommendation was formally adopted as a standard for amateur radio equipment manufacturers. At the 1990 Torremolinos conference an amendment was adopted which reconfirmed the -93 dBm reference level for frequencies above 144 MHz, but no statement was issued for the bands between 30 and 144 MHz. Although not explicitly stated the implication of the recommendation is that on VHF and higher frequencies the S-meter will deviate on the thermal noise only ( S2 in 3 kHz bandwidth, S3 in 12 kHz bandwidth). Although the recommendation is not too complex it seems to be rather difficult to implement by commercial manufacturers. A good Recommendation would make sense on its own - not need a narrative perhaps not one that says what this one does. A good Recommendation would be followed might also be something that we could look back at see why it was we are told things should be done that way. This was just a quick look, but my impression is that if S-meters are to work this way, it should be like an IARU bandplan apply to just R1. 73, ex-VR2BG/p. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 Link to QRQ CW RECORDING
N4LQ said: This file was made about a year ago and sent to Elecraft. A Winkeyer USB was used to generate 45 wpm and key the K3. This playback has been slowed so you can hear the uneven elements. The second half shows how the problem goes away when the K3 is locked in Transmit mode. http://docs.google.com/leaf?id=0By_pJYMIPoenM2FhNDE0ZDQtNzdkMy00ZjIyLWJmOWItNGFjZTI0ZWJhYWMyhl=en Acoustically coupled way over driven, has what I hope is echo on trailing edges. Presumably from another receiver? There looks to variation in some element lengths inter-element spacing (bother either shortened or lengthened by about 10 ms?) before N4LQ asserts PTT by pressing the front panel XMIT button. After that, no variations consistent dot/dot-space/dash ratio near 1:1:2.5. Radio following keying I would have thought is basic stuff 45 wpm isn't really all that fast. This must be something that was introduced after new/old QSK selection, as would have expected somebody to have noticed at the time, as folks then were looking at key closure transmitted RF with 'scope, also with an eye on receiver recovery. 73, ex-VR2BG/p. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] USB Converter Cables
To a computer, USB devices have vendor, product revision IDs. But we seem to differentiate them by chipset. I'll bet that folks' experiences (good bad) would make sense if looked at from how the computer sees things... 73, ex-VR2BG/p. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Explanation why Thailand bans hf transceivers with 6 m capability: military use of 6 m
The discussion in this thread completely misses the point: there are administrations who do not allow people to be in possession of radio equipment capable of operating on frequencies those people aren't allowed to use. This is probably more common in Asia now than anywhere else. Singapore is one place that comes to mind that until recently was quite strict it is far from being a backwards place. Likewise here in Hongkong, our existing law regulations were almost applied in the strictest sense, the result would have been that no radio could be used by any amateur as there has been, nor is there currently any product on the market that would not operate one cycle outside of the frequencies we are allowed to use. Even more so on 50 Mc. Pity those in the province of Taiwan, where if you have something less than the highest class of amateur licence, the local telecom authority insists that your equipment not be capable of operating beyond the restrictions of that licence. On the bright side, it does help these guys from doing things they aren't allowed to do - from my own experience being called by Ws well outside the frequencies allowed for phone operation in USA, perhaps this is something the FCC should do, too. If a company wants to sell its products into other markets, the product needs to be suitable for that market. Other manufacturers have adapted to these requirements, perhaps it will not be possible for Elecraft to do the same. Ultimately, the looser will be Elecraft. A good example of this is the motor market, which used to be dominated by Detroit. But then they stopped making RHD vehicles although that is no longer the case, we don't buy your cars anymore. 73, ex-VR2BG/p. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] (no subject), from K3 NB discussion
K2AV replied to AE6RH, who described a situation on 75m where it appears he was hearing the Hainan woodpecker the K3's NB took it down by two S-units, following some previous posts about the K3's NB effectiveness on this type of impulse noise: NOTHING removes ALL noise. The K3 can pretty much nail key clicks. It also completely kills whatever my neighbor beyond my neighbor does in cold weather that I can see all the way up to VHF analog TV. I'll take those two and smile about anything else only moderately reduced. I note at one point some had complained they couldn't eliminate some of the (Chinese?) jamming signals. I would note that those signals were specifically DESIGNED to resist elimination. Yes, no NB removes all the noise, but I doubt any manufacturer has such a determined user group that tries to explain anything untoward away. The best example of this is the K2's screwdriver scratch blanker. Now we are told a simple, repetitive impulse train somehow can be made not blankable, though perhaps K2AV is referring to something else. My other radios blanked the British over-the-horizon radar quite well. They also blanked the Chinese OTHR quite well, as long as the pulses don't seem mushed up (we're close enough here that we can hear the pulse that pulse coming a little later, not off a target, I guess from the backscatter we also use sometimes to work people, all the OTHRs that use the amateur bands have the sort of umph for it). If I can't make out the pulses myself, the NB can't therefore little if any blanking action with any NB. These were old radios, like IC-765 TS-950S. Something about old NBs, I recall a bloke here once found the FTDX-400's (or something of that vintage) to have a combination of simplicity performance that is probably worthy of copying outright as a replacement for the KNB2. However a predictable impulse noise train (like OTHR) is best blanked by feeding a noise gate with pulses of the same repetition rate, with pulse width phase of the train adjustable by the operator. We did such a product at AEA something like a quarter century ago. A trivial task for a DSP radio like the K3, I would imagine. It is unfortunate that accuracy of the front panel clock or further blurring of the distinction between SSB CW modes seems more important to the user community. Maybe as more more countries fire up their OTHRs on the amateur bands conditions return so that they can be heard over there, the community will change its tune. 73, ex-VR2BG/p. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3: Shipping Costs to Australia
W9DHI suggested, after NZ0T asked VK5ABQ if it would have to be shipped up-side-down: No but it goes down the drain anti-clockwise. snip For all you guys in the US, I have listed below the alternative shipping costs for my K3 order which I'll place soon. I live in South Australia. US Postal Priority Mail International = $131 US Postal Express Mail International = $164 UPS Worldwide Expedited = $372 UPS Worldwide Express = $410 How risky is it to use the US Postal service? I'm worried about the delivery taking a month or two and the package arriving in more bits than when it was sent. Correct: anti-clockwise as opposed to counter-clockwise. ;^) Amazingly, I have yet to have USPS destroy anything I used to bring a lot of stuff out this way. Can't say the same about QSLs, though. ;^( Ask for the manual to be left out (very heavy) if you really do not trust USPS wish to insure for the full amount, have something packed separately - such as the KPA. 73, VR2/KBrett7Graham/p. ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Re: Firmware Fatigue - was K2 v K3
Software isn't bug free until you stop using it. 73, VR2/KBrett7Graham/p. ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] K3 - Linking the VFOs for CW - SSB switching
Someone replied to a query to Elecraft posted to the list: First of all, nothing has been implemented yet. Second, let's not complicate things here. The only thing being suggested is that the K3 be capable of CW while one is operating SSB. This feature is currently found on several Yaesu and Icom rigs (don't know about Kenwood). The paddle/key would be in parallel with the microphone (so to speak). Hitting the paddle would automatically put the rig into CW mode and when key-up occurs, the rig automatically reverts back to SSB mode. No switch fiddling, button pushing, or other operator input would be required. No change in frequency would occur EXCEPT that during key-down the standard CW offset would happen. By necessity, the feature would be enabled and disabled through a menu option. If CW is not your thing, don't worry about it -- you won't need it anyway. Thankfully, although above we are told nothing has been implemented, what was just released is user selectable. To hear from somebody so 'in the know' is greatly appreciated. The root problem being addressed is some not knowing where CW ends up in relation to where the radio was tuned for SSB. If CW/CW-R placed CW in the correct place in relation to LSB/USB then the radio, when mode switched, selected the appropriate CW mode for the sideband previously selected, the root problem would be addressed without the apparently not complicated process of the radio on its own changing modes moving CW when the key line is asserted in SSB. To have requested this change, CW is not in the right place to simply switch from either LSB/USB to begin with, otherwise there would have been no need for the suggestion of how to achieve same (see subject-field of this thread) nor the request to implement functionality that goes beyond addressing the root problem. However, since that root problem merited a change, then perhaps the far greater problem of folks not being able to get to grips with where LSB/USB end up in relation to band edges will be addressed shortly. -VR2/KBrett7Graham/p. ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] K3 - Linking the VFOs for CW - SSB switching
WA6HHQ reported: We're testing this right now. Which was later clarified to be not VE3QF's A2-approach. Would you be so kind as to confirm that what has been implemented is triggered by keying input whilst in SSB? If so, will this new feature be user selectable? If not, can it be? Switching modes on a radio is usually something that comes as a result of the operator deciding to switch modes having to do something specific to achieve that. Presumption that the keying line is only asserted when CW is to be sent is asking a bit much. Making the input for sending CW also trigger a mode change is a significant change in behavior, one that normally would not be expected of a radio - kind of like not expecting that switching on the main beam headlamps causes a car to change lanes switch gears by itself. Having CW in the right place so that there is no need to move the VFO from where tuned for a SSB signal seems to be a more reasonable solution without adding feature that causes radio to go on form of walkabout on the unsuspecting. I seem to recall switching from USB to CW in QSO on FT-726R required no retuning. I don't recall ever changing from LSB to CW in QSO when on satellite, but today in radio with CW/CW-R carrier in right place, the requested functionality could be had by the radio selecting CW/CW-R as appropriate for the SSB mode switched from. Not sure how to deal with direction of tuning - would seem a bit odd for sophisticated new radio like K3 to have what looked to be high/low-side injection change on some bands. 73, VR2/KBrett7Graham/p. ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] OT: the value of accurate measures for ham radio
KR2Q asked: I have received some good (private) replies to my query about the need for accuracy and I've learned a lot about how other think. Shown below is one reply that I feel is worth sharing. I'm not an engineer, so I found this to be especially enlightening. I assume some (many?) will cry sacrilege, but since this is not me speaking, don't yell at me. I'm only the piano player! snip story about Bird 43 accuracy Comments? The Bird 43 is a product that was designed some 50-odd years ago, with rated accuracy of +/- 5% at full scale. The slugs themselves add to that, how much I can't find - maybe another +/- 5%? A characterized Bird 43 (or any other piece of TM kit) used with appropriate care understanding, has the potential of providing results similar to what it was characterized against. 73, VR2/KBrett7Graham/p. ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] [K2] : Laptop UPS
G3RXQ asked F4FNT about the Dell OEM UPS (probably meaning power supply) for his laptop that made noise G4ILO then added: By any chance was the UPS manufactured in China ? That's not a very fair bet; almost every bit of consumer electronics is manufactured in China or has most of its components manufactured there. However, if the suggestion is the responsibility for poor EMC lies in China, that's not true. A lot of the responsibility comes down to the purchasers, who want minimum prices and do not care about features that only benefit non-purchasers. An OEM laptop supply originally sold into EU will have had to conform with EN-something-I-can't-recall-now (conducted radiated emissions standard). Either that standard is not sufficient for F4FNT's circumstances or that particular supply conducts and/or radiates more than it should. Where a product is assembled generally has nothing to do with its design. This particular kind of product will have little room for assembly to impact EMC performance, whilst the design will. G4ILO is spot on - basically you get what you pay for if there is a demand for cheaper products, then somebody is going to supply them. EMC is an area where it is easy to cut BOM costs get away with it, as for the vast majority of consumers it does not matter many countries don't seem to bother to make sure product delivered actually meets the standards insisted upon. 73, VR2/KBrett7Graham/p. ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] K3 Firmware Update (MCU 1.68, DSP 1.53)
Brett Howard said: Poof! As much as K3 owners have been having fun with the new Elecraft invented mode of CW to RTTY now there is yet another new mode in amateur radio! CW-to-RTTY isn't new - the AEA MBA-RC was able to convert CW to Baudot ASCII RTTY vice versa. Not sure, there may have been another box that could do some of this, too. Was quite cool to use, especially given the alternatives to work digital modes at the time. Pleased to see how with the relative ease of working them now that a Morse interface is still of interest. Maybe we'll see that Morse UI PDA yet? http://marc.info/?l=elecraftm=111600319308527w=2 73 HLNY, VR2BrettGraham. ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
RE: [Elecraft] K3 Convergence
W4TV continued: CI-V also allows for multiple controllers, though I have yet to see any other application that appears to properly implement its CSMA/CD protocol. There is no carrier switching or collision detection in the CI-V protocol. The data packets do not carry any checksum or sequence number both of which are required for CSMA/CD. CI-V is a pure aloha protocol - if the packet gets lost or damaged the originator must resend if it does not get the expected reply. CI-V does have collision detection, as every device can see the serial bus as it sends. That also makes a checksum unnecessary. It is intended that a controller resend a command if a collision is detected, so there is no need for sequence numbers, either. Carrier sense multiple access with collision detection does not mean any more than that - but what I was responding to was the assertion that there is not a single radio that is capable- in either hardware or software - of reliably servicing two different radio control applications. Maybe there isn't, especially if one insists on not working with the radio as the manufacturer intended. 73 HLNY, VR2BrettGraham. ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
RE: [Elecraft] K3 Convergence
W4TV further continued: CI-V does have collision detection, as every device can see the serial bus as it sends. That also makes a checksum unnecessary. CI-V can only see the data it is sending. Depending on the hardware, it is entirely possible for two devices to be sending on the bus at the same time with the local data masking the remote data. There are no hardware differences involved - a serial bus with one device trying to pull the bus low another device trying to pull the bus high will result in at least one device not seeing what it was expecting to see on the bus. What you describe could happen if the serial bus has been changed, but then that deviates from how the manufacturer intended the product to be used. 73 HLNY, VR2BrettGraham. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of VR2BrettGraham Sent: Thursday, February 14, 2008 7:39 PM To: 'Elecraft Reflector' Subject: RE: [Elecraft] K3 Convergence W4TV continued: CI-V also allows for multiple controllers, though I have yet to see any other application that appears to properly implement its CSMA/CD protocol. There is no carrier switching or collision detection in the CI-V protocol. The data packets do not carry any checksum or sequence number both of which are required for CSMA/CD. CI-V is a pure aloha protocol - if the packet gets lost or damaged the originator must resend if it does not get the expected reply. CI-V does have collision detection, as every device can see the serial bus as it sends. That also makes a checksum unnecessary. It is intended that a controller resend a command if a collision is detected, so there is no need for sequence numbers, either. Carrier sense multiple access with collision detection does not mean any more than that - but what I was responding to was the assertion that there is not a single radio that is capable- in either hardware or software - of reliably servicing two different radio control applications. Maybe there isn't, especially if one insists on not working with the radio as the manufacturer intended. 73 HLNY, VR2BrettGraham. ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] K3 Convergence
W4TV suggested to N1EU: I'd add one more development that I feel is necessary. Software that interfaces to rigs over the single RS-232 port need to learn to play with each other. That is not an application software matter - it is something the radio manufacturers will need to fix in their CAT implementations. There is not a single radio that is capable- in either hardware or software - of reliably servicing two different radio control applications. Yes there is - any radio with CI-V. Just about all of us providing the HF packet mail link from NA into Asia-Pacific were using ICOMs so that we could auto-QSY multiple rigs without using up precious serial ports (this was about 20 years ago). CI-V also allows for multiple controllers, though I have yet to see any other application that appears to properly implement its CSMA/CD protocol. 73 HLNY, ex-VS6UP. ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Strange behaviour in K2
LA2MOA noted undesirable behavior in his K2's receiver, the reason for which was suggested by GM4ESD. This behavior is due to an environment that apparently the K2 was not really meant to be used in - one with plenty of strong signals about. Yet this is one of the things that many folks rave about the rig is one of the main reasons why I got one myself - its strong signal-handling ability. Sadly, the K2 wilts here - with what LA2MOA observed, but even more so from its AGC image response. Also unfortunate is that it appears that mods developed in EU to address these two issues are not sufficient for the environment here. I sincerely hope that the K3 will not be like American or some European cars that can't deal with extreme cold/heat/ humidity/whatever is only found out by unwitting customers after it is too late - after all, the K3 is meant to be a real radio, not something for backpacking. Hans: I suspect you will find the aggregate energy at the input of your new K2 to be higher now than your when using your previous K2. Just like the SteppIR antenna here, there are days when things are pedestrian enough that these problems do not manifest themselves in my K2. If you have a spectrum analyzer, it is very clear what is going on. Oh, how I hope the K3 is suitable for other than just those in ITU Region 2. ;^) 73, VR2BrettGraham. ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] OT Lunar Echo Experiment.
I had asked: Which reminds me, I do not recall seeing any useful feedback here as to how well the K3's noise blanker deals with all the OTHRs on the ham bands nowadays. The British Chinese woodpeckers can be heard just about every day on 80-10m, so somebody must have had an opportunity by now... Thanks to AC7AC, K2VCO W6NIA for your responses. Last time I asked, somebody suggested you can just crank down the receiver's bandwidth that should suffice. Not living next to one of these things at the bottom of the solar cycle must be nice. Out here, it's often only the transition to the stopband of the OTHR that is less than S-meter pegging. On 40m, there is 200+ kc of S-meter pegging b'cast in your face, too. Probably the only more extreme environment is faced by those poor 5B4s within spitting distance of Akrotiri. It is how well the K3's NB works in those situations that is of interest. I believe, just like how what 10m has become in SE Asia only became a concern to the rest of the world when conditions returned, in time the importance of the NB will become evident in Elecraft's domestic market. Hopefully they got it right - so far it's hard to tell, but it seems during development apparently so far no customer has had an opportunity to try one in such an environment, as it does not exist in NA. Perhaps with K3s arriving in UK, one of the Gs will take one on holiday to 5B have a go. 73, VR2BrettGraham. ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] OT Lunar Echo Experiment.
GM4ESD shared with us: Sorry for using bandwidth. I thought that the following message received from the ARRL was worth posting in case somebody who might be interested has not seen it. I should have posted it yesterday. snip * Lunar Echo Experiment looking for Amateur Radio Participants: The HF Active Auroral Research Program (HAARP) in Alaska and the Long Wavelength Array (LWA) in New Mexico are planning an additional lunar echo experiment for January 19-20. Interested radio amateurs are invited to participate in this experiment by listening for the lunar echoes and submitting reports. On January 19, listen on 6.7925 MHz from 0500-0600 UTC, and on 7.4075 MHz from 0600-0700 UTC. On January 20, listen on 6.7925 MHz from 0630-0730 UTC, and on 7.4075 MHz from 0730-0830 UTC (depending on frequency occupancy at the time of operation, it may be necessary to adjust the frequency slightly). Hopefully for those who have a go, the Hainan woodpecker won't rear its ugly head. Which reminds me, I do not recall seeing any useful feedback here as to how well the K3's noise blanker deals with all the OTHRs on the ham bands nowadays. The British Chinese woodpeckers can be heard just about every day on 80-10m, so somebody must have had an opportunity by now... 73, VR2BrettGraham. ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] OT: Motorola buys Yeasu. Wow!
W6FB added: Actually there were two separate companies created from what was Motorola Semiconductor Group. The first was On Semiconductor, which makes all sorts of transistors, logic and analog ICs. Th second was Freescale, consisting mostly of the microprocessors and microcontrollers, plus a few other things. On Nov 6, 2007, at 7:35 PM, VR2BrettGraham wrote: WA6VNN responded to K7SVV: Did any of you see the ARRL bulletin about Motorola buying Vertex? It has been a long time since I have seen a U.S. company buying a foreign company. Maybe now we'll be able to get the HF Power transistors that they quit supplying for the FT100s that have been failing The semiconductor business of Motorola was sold off a few years ago - it's now known as Freescale. 73, VR2BrettGraham. Odd, it was Freescale who could talk to me about an RF MOSFET Yaesu is rather fond of using but Motorola discontinued. On knows nothing of it. Doesn't matter, no part = no working radio. Rather doubt this will change as a result of the acquisition, though perhaps in future Yaesu will know not to use such EOL components to begin with. 73, VR2BrettGraham. ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] K2 Problem and new elecraft kit proposal
F6DRO: Rodent urine can be very corrosive - the combination of rodent urine fecal matter even more so the former often comes with the latter. If not cleaned immediately - and cleaned properly - can come back to haunt you. GL. 73, VR2BrettGraham. ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] K3 NB
AE6WA said: OTHR is a big problem in NA, at least on the west coast. On 40M in the early AM it can prevent operation over the entire CW segment using my current equipment (no noise blanker). This is a primary focus of my wanting NB capability. I have yet to hear a report of any tester on the efficacy of the K3 NB on OTHR. Perhaps this is because the NB is late-arrival functionality and the summer QRN has just about shut the band down here during the early dark hours. For example this morning; I can't hear one CW signal through the noise at 5:00am local. During winter up through late July this was prime DX time except when the OTHR was present. When it was I just turn the radio off. It's odd, depending on who you are talking to, on the east coast of NA the ZC4 woodpecker is/isn't a problem; likewise on the west coast BY7. Maybe this is a sign of how active one is, as these things are hard to miss (ZC4 can be 20-40 over S9 here by itself on a band with no other signals; BY7 taking out the entirety [for much of the rest of the world, at least] of 40m should also be hard not to notice). With the K3 hardware NB having just been finished, I guess we'll have to wait a while to see how well it works, at least from NA. With a synchronous string of pulses, it should be easy to generate synchronize same to drive an upstream noise gate not have to detect when to blank in the presence of numerous signals pushing the better part of -10 dBm. Otherwise, not much use for that ID timer if we're switching the rig off giving it all a miss. ;^) 73, VR10BrettGraham/p. ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Fwd: Re: [Elecraft] K3 rx
Rejected originally on basis it was spam. Date: Mon, 03 Sep 2007 00:44:12 + To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net From: VR2BrettGraham [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 rx N6TR replied: Wonder if any of the K3 beta-testers have a strong out-of-band energy environment comment on how well it deals with the sort of power the likes of close-by SW b'cast can produce? I mean really strong OOB, as in -20 dBm or louder stuff at the end of the feeder. When I receive on 160 with my TS850 with my inverted vee, there is a 50KW AM station about 3 miles away that trashes the receiver. I hear nothing bothering the K3. How much power does that carrier put across the input of the receiver? Instead of just one loud carrier, the situation here is like a half dozen or more loud carriers just OOB. I suspect there is a bit of a difference in the aggregate power we have to deal with here. How is the K3's AGC image response compared to the K2? I found that the mod for that will not suffice here, suggesting that even EU situation might be a bit pedestrian compared to what we seem to have around these parts now. There is simply no comparison. The AGC is probably one of the best kept secrets in the K3. No phantom S-meter responses, nor noise floor changing as you tune across the band? That would be nice. Forgot - one more thing - can you hear RS-232 activity in the receiver like the K2? In situations like ARRL 28 Mc test, have wished for no poll on RX option in logging program. ;^) 73, VR10BrettGraham/p. ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Fwd: Re: [Elecraft] K3 NB
Rejected originally on basis it was spam. Date: Mon, 03 Sep 2007 00:58:34 + To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net From: VR2BrettGraham [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 NB K6DGW replied to N6RY's apparently somewhat-not-serious response: How about some simple countermeasures (for a future firmware release): Blank, then transmit an equal length pulse (on a clear frequency, of course), with optional automatic ID every N minutes. If it's anything like the Russian woodpecker, it likely transmits a string of bits using a psuedo-random code in each pulse', and the radar RX can separate it's own echoes from fake ones. One suggestion we had from RAAF's 1RSU (VK air force's unit that runs their OTHR systems) early on was that the Hainan woodpecker might be a comms system. A constant pulse train on HF would be hard to use to convey any data with either amplitude or phase. And no one has yet to see anything but the pulses that make the woodpecker sound. The reason why we could force the Russian woodpecker to move back in the late 70s/early 80s was because they apparently could not differentiate between echoes from their pulses anything else that looked like them. Since then, technology has come a long way it is easy to imagine the computing horsepower DSP now available would make most active countermeasures useless. And in practice, that seems to be the case. I get the impression here that OTHR isn't a problem in NA. You lot are very lucky then. In ITU Regions 1 3, it is a _big_ problem. 73, VR10BrettGraham/p. ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
[Elecraft] K3 rx
Wonder if any of the K3 beta-testers have a strong out-of-band energy environment comment on how well it deals with the sort of power the likes of close-by SW b'cast can produce? I mean really strong OOB, as in -20 dBm or louder stuff at the end of the feeder. How is the K3's AGC image response compared to the K2? I found that the mod for that will not suffice here, suggesting that even EU situation might be a bit pedestrian compared to what we seem to have around these parts now. 73, VR10BrettGraham/p. ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
[Elecraft] K3 NB
Some time back, somebody asked about how the K3's NB handles the Hainan woodpecker. I don't think I saw any response, though may have missed it. Hainan is QRV 24/7 whenever there is something they want to watch going on, such as the recent VK/W war games in VK4. Several pulse rates are used either some of rates and/or combination of propagation results in pulses that none of the NBs in rigs here can put much of a dent in; other times they can take a healthy bite out of it. The rest of the time, it pops up intermittently has pretty much rendered 40m useless when I turn the radio on nowadays (as well as 80 sometimes 30 even 20m). With the British now Chinese woodpeckers seemingly here to stay with us, I wonder if it might be possible to do some 'predictive' blanking with the hardware NB gate (does anyone remember the AEA WB-1)? On a good day, these things are only 20 over - but usually stronger 'detected' blanking with 100-or-more kc of S-meter pegging OTHR is a bit of a challenge... 73, VR10BrettGraham/p. ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] 73 Mag
We should all be so lucky to live long enough for Oldtimer's Disease to eventually kick in whilst we are still active doing something. ;^) Cut the poor bloke some slack... 73, VR2BrettGraham. ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] 40 M interference
W1TF continued: Thanks to K6DGW K6PJV, G3YMC, WB1HGA, K7UP, K6DGW and others that responded to my query. I suspect it is OTH radar, the suggestion of K6DGW. Do a Goggle search using oth radar, lots of interesting leads, including these: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Over-the-horizon_radar http://www.agu.org/sci_soc/prrl/prrl9825.html This racket is not always on 7040 KHz, it varies but the spacing of signals seems to be 10.66 KHz. I now remember such signals back in the 60s and 70s. What you described is most likely _not_ OTHR. The OTHRs you will find in the ham bands (run by the British, the Australians, the Ukrainians, the Iranians the Chinese) blanket a portion of the band (some number of dozens of kcs) with a ticking sound - which is why when the Russians put theirs on the air back in the 70s it was called the woodpecker. If others are hearing it, likely to have been reported to IARU Region 2 Monitoring System - a good place to start if you think it is not some local thing: http://www.iaruregion2.org/ IARU Region 1 MS web page has sample recordings other resources that can help identify things we hear on the bands: http://www.iarums-r1.org/ There is a tremendous amount of use of amateur service spectrum contrary to provisions of the ITU - the R1 boys are very good at exposing just who is doing what... 73, VR2BrettGraham (450 km from Hainan woodpecker, heard world-wide on 40m). ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
[Elecraft] Re: INRAD will be soon making custom RX filters for the K2?
Some radios require some extra effort to tame filter blow-by (especially when the filter physically cannot fit in place of what it replaces). The K2 just doesn't seem to lend itself to after- market filters - both as a result of the above (this should have warned us all who have tried) by the firmware not allowing selection of anything but the OEM filter. 73, VR2BrettGraham. ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] IF shift
N7XY queried: One of the strengths of the K2 is its single-conversion design. That is, in part, responsible for the extremely good specifications the receiver enjoys. However, i.f. shift such as other rigs often feature require a multiple-conversion design with all the issues that come with additional mixers, oscillators and complexity. Well, I'm not sure this is totally true. Before I got my first K2, I used a Kenwood TS-180S which had a very nice IF shift feature. It was also a single conversion radio, with an IF of about 8.3 MHz. I loaned the manual to Eric and Wayne so they could see how it was done. Sure wish there was a way to implement it in the K2. TS-820S is another example of single conversion with IF shift. You can do with K2, but bit too granular with current front panel interface. I believe it is even mentioned in the manual. Making a knob into interface for IF shift is entirely possible, since knobs are already used as interface to change frequencies of stuff inside. Firmware says no (apologies to Little Britain ;^) Saying it can't be done not appreciating what IF shift is good for probably helps keep it that way. ;^( 73 HLNY, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] K2 frequencyh stability
KI6WX added: I believe the N1KO data was that he observed a drift of 80 Hz, not 800 Hz. A drift that large would indicate something seriously wrong in one of the oscillators. The current K2 design is not as good as a TCXO, but it is a lot better than an unstabilized crystal oscillator. It should be possible to reduce the drift to significantly less than 100 Hz over a temperature range of 10-50C with adjustment of resistor RA in the temperature compensation circuit. No, N1KO's post clearly said 800 cycles. Some hours later that was then revised to 80. By then I was out backpacking, I think. Since then, I see that we have been told that another manufacturer could not have sold a product to amateurs in the quantity they appear to have with both frequency accuracy stability of less than +/- 0.5 ppm (-10 to 50C) due to use of single reference for everything inside. I also could not be using another product this very moment that uses only crystals is spec'd for stability of +/- 5 ppm (-10 to 50C). From cold, 20C ambient, 45 minute drift of ~12 cycles - though could very well be the beacon it was tuned to drifts my computer probably is not really a good frequency counter to begin with. Invalid points of reference, apparently (pun not intended ;^). Usual disclaimer - one's operations may or may not suffer from some number of dozens of cycles of drift due to temperature, likewise LSD (or next-to-LSD) uncertainty may not be a problem if you do not need to be absolutely certain you are inside the band. Now time for another hike. 73, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] K2 frequencyh stability
For a point of reference for N1KO's observed 800 cycle drift as his K2 warms up with use, I looked up the specs for one of my non-TCXOd radios (IC-765) overall the radio can drift +/- 350 cycles from 0 to 50C after 1 minute from switch on, +/- 200 cycles in the first hour. Bung in a 0.5 ppm TCXO the 0-50C drift goes down to +/- 100 cycles. Again, my 765 does not have one. Unlike some other rigs also in use here, the 765 does not use this reference to derive everything it needs inside (the BFOs are simple crystal oscillators). Both the 765 my K2 with the all the drift mods were tweaked on an HP5350B then left to soak. The 5350B is a relatively modern 20 Gc counter after 30 minutes from applying mains is in +/- 1 ppm range by itself, even better with fitted option reference or external references handy at the time (ultimately a R+S rubidium house reference, model which escapes me now) - essentially down to it's own +/- one least significant digit accuracy spec. Drift observed was therefore essentially just that of the radios. I have yet to get the K2 to indicate the frequency it is actually on (say 200 cycles) stay that way based on gut feeling from side-by-side operation of the two rigs over a number of years of contesting. And the 765's walkabout is glaringly obvious when compared to a TS-950S without TXCO (but uses that common reference for everything, I believe - can't find manual at the moment). With the K2, there is roughly +/- 500 cycle window that must be considered when near band edges or trying to find some DX station somebody else has spotted. Depending on what one's operations are like, the accuracy of the K2's frequency readout amount of drift observed may or may not be of concern. It is unrealistic to expect performance in these areas like some radios, as it was clearly not intended originally with mods, is still probably a bit shy of what might have been possible if was a design goal - though it certainly beats any backpack type radio I have had or used. 73, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] The K2 and RTTY
K0WA asked: Could somebody who has used the K2 on RTTY and PSK31 eludicate me on their experience with the rig and the mode? Compared to the other two rigs I use for RTTY operating (mostly contests): 1. KPA gets warm pretty easily if you need more than 35 watts from it, especially if duty cycle goes up (say a string of unanswered CQs). Small fan is not enough, especially if room temp warm to begin with. Easy to deal with, but so important must be mentioned. 2. The difference between where you transmit where you receive becomes a bit obvious when running on the K2 - I use the RIT on the other rigs for the occasional guy who comes back slightly off... on the K2 the RIT is used all the time as everybody is slightly off. Nature-of-beast issue, tends to get you when you forget start calling others, who then do not hear you so well as now you're the one slightly off. 3. Unless you can change the mark/space tones for whatever does the RTTY stuff, you are not likely to be able to set the K2's filters for say four increasingly narrower BWs be able to use those on all bands. About 1 kc (displayed) is the limit on my K2. 4. By far away the reason to use a rig with FSK on RTTY (mentioned by K0WA, but snipped from above) is the ability (on all the rigs I have, at least) to use the rig's CW filters. The Big Three's OEM filters are probably a tad bit better than the K2's if you have fitted after-market filters then this difference is even greater. Depending on how you operate, these points may or may not be a concern might not even be noticed. None of my RTTY operation is pedestrian I must admit item #4 is very, very obvious more than just a bit annoying when combined with #3. 73, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Morse test elimination
N8OHU added: I'd rather say it's the fault of the ITU, if you want the truth. They were the ones to let the code go back in 2003. Not quite - the ITU does what its members decide. And the end of Morse as licensing requirement probably started with the JA no-code license - the first ITU member that found a way to get around the requirement. The amateur population in JA is now contracting, but the effect of their no-code license was quite positive on amateur radio in Japan when it was introduced. The effect that had on equipment suppliers is still obvious today. I wonder what things would be like now if there was no Incentive Licensing, or if international opinion would have allowed dropping the Morse requirement around that time? ;^) 73, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Noise Blanker
VK3HE commented: I have compared it to several other radios. One radio in particular the TS830S has one of the most amazing all round noise blankers. All the noise the Elecraft noise blanker struggles on the TS830S noise blanker will handle on the low threshold setting. The same results can be had on my FT1000D, my mobile TS480 also handles the noise in a more able manner. The TS830S's noise blanker is a killer on rain static on a yagi, the K2's struggles to cope in comparison. Careful, it is not valid to compare the functionality of the NB against other radios. NBs do not work on some noises all cause the receiver to wilt from IMDs. Or so we hear each time somebody wonders why the K2 NB doesn't seem to do anything. Strange, I also find other radios' NBs to work fine on a wide range of noises will do so without adding much of anything untoward. None of them require scratching a transistor case with a screwdriver to establish that the NB works - just flick the front panel switch will suffice. They can take a bite out of some atmospherics even stuff like power line noise the British or Chinese woodpeckers - not completely, but often enough to be able to hear what I need to hear through it. But not on the K2. The K2's NB either does nothing or makes things worse - exactly what we are told here is what all NBs do. My other radios do not have AGC image responses, nor are they so inconsistent with amount of AGC response for a constant level signal on the various bands. My other radios may have NB threshold knobs, but I rarely have to touch them. Turn on NB, noise is reduced or goes away, without introducing anything untoward. IMHO, much of the problem with the K2's NB has to do with this variability in gain across the band, between bands the additional variable of AGC image response. The efforts to explain it away will not change the fact that the K2's NB is the worst performing NB of any radio I have ever used. That the subject keeps coming up here does suggest there might be room for improvement, but again this is based on the invalid comparison with other radios, so we had best shut up, mate. 73, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Why no IF shift ?
The TS-820 is single conversion has IF shift, does it not? IF shift is handiest I find for CW, as chance to move passband such that unwanted signal outside or down the skirt. IF shift on SSB tends to result in moving passband on to another signal. Much prefer the good skirts from cascaded filters on CW, rather than upper skirt of one filter lower skirt of other with variable bandwidth tuning. And much prefer VBT on SSB, as can cut down to just enough to understand what is being said if need be. The K2 is a nice rig, but really wasn't intended for something demanding like (c-word deleted). I have yet to turn in a top ten world score in a (c-word deleted) with the K2, but can do so with TS-950/IC-765. K2 only used as substitute if one of those dies. I find IF gymnastics indispensable even for (d-word deleted), as well as well as good IF filtering - something in mainstream rigs now for decades. Neither really needed for something with say backpacking in mind - K2 rather lacking in latter, but more than adequate for more pedestrian-like operation therefore many will not agree at all. Hopefully one day Elecraft will come up with a product that is something like an all solid-state kit form of a modernized TS-820, provided it has decent IF filters or chance to put something better (preferably plural) in that would make it possible to not need VBT. 73, VU/VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] How to test noise blanker
KD1E added to another comment: The NB was optimized to block out ignition noise from UPS trucks. Proper testing requires you order more stuff from Elecraft so UPS will return. Actually, it was quite tricky coming up with a circuit to block out the ignition noise from a diesel engine I would hate to imagine what the running costs are of that petrol cement lorry N3CSY blanked out - they probably have the most dear product around! I believe there was mention in the past that the K2's NB was optimized to some extent on a VW Transporter (replace with model name used in your market) of vintage I have forgotten. The state of motor vehicle ignition systems in NA must have deteriorated significantly in the past 20 years, as here in maintenance-prevention-not-preventative-maintenance Asia it's not much worse than back there back then it's other noise (like power) where a NB gets the most use. Or presumably there are a lot of VW-based buggies or other less quiet petrol internal combustion engine powered devices to be encountered in the great NA outdoors nowadays. Remember, there is nothing wrong with the NB - you just need to have the right noise. Perhaps it would be better to call it something else, as NB does imply something of what it will do based on what other rigs' NBs do (unlike AUX I/O ;^). Then there would not need to for the ever repeating defend-the-NB thread here, usually starting with somebody wondering in a post if their recently completed NB works as it doesn't seem to behave as they expected it to (read last sentence of last paragraph again). 73, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] New Elecraft Products
Sometime last night K2TA posted what I was thinking: As long as we are dreaming...I wish the KPA800 photo had a K2 or some other way of determining the size/dimentions. If the KPA800/1500 is not much larger than a Ten-Tec Orion then I would love to see a K3 that matched the amp in size. Make it modular and expandable. Have slots on the motherboard for 2nd rcvr, 6M/2M/220/440 transverter modules etc. I don't think doing an internalized set of XVs makes sense, but the basic approach is neat (though as K2VCO pointed out, perhaps a bit on the large side). Hopefully more of a kit than the new KPAs, it might be reasonable to expect doing one or two significant additional features to the basic radio in a post-K2 product. Take general coverage. BPFs as a module gives choice of not having to pay for cost of feature one might not need, or change to something even more robust for more demanding ham-band-only use. Enough room in that cabinet to transplant some of those FT9k preselectors? ;^) A sub-RX isn't entirely a rabid contester feature - I use it more DXing realize if we had it in the past, it would have been handy when NCSing 7RN. Perfect thing to make into a module. All sorts of interesting possibilities. Hopefully starting with a good, solid radio. Keeping kit serviceability in mind, maybe unlikely to have things like IF DSP. More remote controllability please, though remember every knob on an encoder is significantly more expensive. Something more like as N8LP described. Some of the features mentioned here are probably not practical. I see some of it driven by Brand-K/I/Y domestic market, something Elecraft probably now has the momentum to go against. An SO2R-ready-out-of-the-box K3 is the last thing this contester would like to see a modernized TR7 as Larry mentioned or something starting from like an OMNI6-as- a-kit - that would go down well with a far wider market, too. N2TK - I'm thinking all solid-state TS820/830-like performance in a kit, maybe even use an IF so that filters can be recycled from other rigs. Are you with me? Divide-from-VHF PLL is start towards Tony's W4ZV's previous mention of close-in performance - GM4ESD, got any other ideas? Then add some first-string big-box features based on modules there's something for everybody. Nice to dream, isn't it? ;^) 73, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] RF Ground (WAS: KAT100 on 30 Meters)
W3FPR continued from K9YC: Well said - for years now I have been trying to convince folks that there is a strong need for considering 2 'grounds' at a station. The first is the Safety Ground which should be a low impedance path to earth - large conductors, lots of heavy guage wire buried in the earth and ground rods, and this must also be connected to the utility ground. Properly implemented it should serve a a lightning protection ground. The second is the RF Ground - and the Safety Ground may or may not suffice. Consider a good Safety Ground with an 8 foot connection from the antenna connection at the tuner - that combintion will likely produce a high impedance for RF at 10 meters, thus there will be no RF Ground at that frequency. In such conditions, the use of quarterwave counterpoises for each troublesome band is in order. Yes, important distinction worth mentioning! When not physically close to ground level, that safety ground in the shack can bite you in the bum, such as in Don's example. Few here can establish shack safety or antenna safety grounds that are not going to do something untoward. And antennas usually require roof access, a roof that often has to be directly over your head (top floor flat). This makes RF in shack a big problem. Computer keying, mic switching voice keyers don't like RF. In such an extreme environment, usually with no option to move anything around, I have yet to try an artificial ground. This despite four feeders plus few control cables running straight into shack from series-fed roof tower as low band vertical - common-mode chokes have always done the trick. They also help keep noises from shack from getting back into the antennas. I could drop all the bonding between major boxes in the shack (rigs, amps, switching gear), but that is my solution for redundant safety ground when operating as total disconnect is also practiced inside during lightning. The bonding also helps a bit with computer keying (often only way to keep from latching key down when transmitting into the roof tower vertical). Few solar cycles of experience from two to 39 floors up here that may help those in more pedestrian situations. The artificial ground is like what I am trying to avoid in the station, so would really be a last resort one that has yet to be needed. Saying that, I also will not use any end-fed wire or similar antenna that is certain to be problematic - for a temporary set-up where I had to use that sort of antenna then an artificial ground could be the ticket but then certain to hear that computer, telly, etc... unless near field dominates, choke that common-mode stuff you're likely to prevail. 73, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Ideas - new Elecraft Products
A general comment (N3CSY gave me something to ponder over this morning's tea - cheers ;^)... The trend in amps results in nifty products coming out like the big KPAs, but some of the extra features beyond the core function of amplifying add fair amount to BOM cost drive prices higher. Likewise radios. I sure hope any future K3-like product doesn't go that way, too (unless I work again, that would be only thing I probably will be able to afford ;^(... Plug 'n play SO2R in an amp is probably about as important to most of market as some potential features in a future Elecraft radio. A transfer relay little bit of logic I can SO2R a Hercules, an amp that can drive higher SWRs safely - no tuner, thank you (if I need one, I already have - besides, really don't put power into any antenna that needs matching close to shack-in-flat). Likewise sniff-n-switch bandswitching. Nice features, but wish they could have been options. To keep up with the market, that Herc is unlikely to be retired anytime soon. There's nothing solid-state, moderate power, robust not quite dear. The same for radios, they've snowballed not much choice in really good radios that aren't dear. Being able to fix the rig keep it going are becoming even more important, as already have had a reasonably recent rig from major brand pop a now-obsolete part. A very popular first-string performance radio already has a critical unable-to- obtain part - I shudder to think what I will do when some of the custom-but-currently-still-available critical bits in some of my other radios finally go. Affordability (sp?), core function performance serviceability are the key attractions with Brand-E to me hopefully can be kept in mind with future products. At first it might not sound so flash or appealing, but for something beyond the K2 a divide down-from-VHF PLL or more significant IF filtering trickery is generally of benefit to more compared to what it might cost compared to some other feature (say adding VHF/UHF). For general coverage receive to work not wilt in some environments without a significant beefing up of things in general is another example (something I would like but not at expense of BOM cost or OOB rejection performance - increasingly important for everyone). Though for all I know, I'm in an insignificant market demographic - but I hope someday there will be a reason to have to ration precious rice money for a killer post-K2 rig! 73, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
RE: [Elecraft] RF Ground (WAS: KAT100 on 30 Meters)
W3FPR added: I did not intend to say that you should disconnect your equipment from the safety gound - only that you may need to supplment it with an RF ground at the place where your equipment connects to the antenna system. In other words, both are necessary, and can work in conjunction with each other. No, I don't think you did. I have found RF ground to be pretty elusive, so don't bother. Safety ground beyond mains leads sometimes makes things worse, though has obvious downside. With 220 volt mains, a failure is more dangerous, though also more obvious. The overall situation must be kept in mind, but what I am saying is that grounding as everyone thinks it has to be done is not done here therefore might be kept in mind when having to tame RF nastiness in some situations. Frequency of lightning even this far north drives the need for total disconnect, so that mains lead safety ground already there could be the place to stop attention turned to choking if near field isn't dominate. Bonding of major bits at least keeps case of failed box tied to a safety ground that I keep an eye on (and usually helps tame the nasties). A compromise, but workable where no way to really build for no-need-to-disconnect. I don't think I'm implying giving up the safety ground (at least not when operating), either. If it gets too exciting, will have already yanked everything, as the 1N5711s become dominate. ;^) Artificial ground plus choking could still be the ticket for end-fed wires, etc. I just find ground makes things worse sometimes I sit right under my antennas. Like black magic, RF is. Extra grounding might not be your friend. 73, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
[Elecraft] K2 AGC mod
I'd previously credited LA3ZA with the AGC image mod. That should go to TF3MA. Cheers to LA3ZA for gathering up the myriad of K2 mods together in one well organized place, though! 73 HNY/HLNY, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] A question about low sensitivity
Compared against other rigs here, my K2 (24xx) seems deaf more so on some bands. Much less so now after aligning the BPFs with spec-an tracking gen - but still noticeable. This was before narrowing BPFs so as to avoid AGC responding to out-of-band energy may still be due in part to AGC even after trying LA3ZA mod (a noticeable improvement, but seems to need _much_ more help than that, at least in this part of R3 with decent antennas). It became very obvious tuning across the band after adding LA3ZA mod that sensitivity varies depending on energy level at the AGC image frequency. But this apparently is not an issue in either R1 or R2. 73 HNY/HLNY, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
RE: [Elecraft] A question about low sensitivity
W3FPR suggested: Since you suspect that the receiver is being de-sensed by the AGC, try turning the AGC off and controlling the level with the RF Gain. If things seem more 'normal' that way, I suggest you try adding a filter to the AGC IF - see LA3ZA's mod page for 2 examples of how to do that. As I mentioned below, both BPFs have been tightened up (DL7ARJ?) selectivity in AGC chain (LA3ZA) have been implemented. Where the AGC does not seem to be choking my K2, all I need is switch to another rig in order to copy the desired signal. When the AGC dominates, obviously things get better on another rig. Disabling the AGC on the K2 - where I know the AGC is not responding to an image - results in only the slightest change, so presumably it's close to where it needs to be. On the bench, MDS is somewhere below lowest output level of my sig gen (Marconi 2017... -131 dBm) although it's just an indication, once set there's quite a variation in what it takes to achieve the same S-meter reading on different bands. Nothing untoward seen when sweeping/peaking the BPFs, yet the rig seems somewhat deaf without the AGC image response rearing its ugly head that deafness varies between bands - almost like there's some sort of suck-out downstream of the BPFs or other difference in response that is not necessarily proportional to frequency. Not sure what's wrong with my K2 - perhaps this is actually normal behavior my expectations of its performance are unrealistic - but one thing I can say is that I wish I had peaked the BPFs with spec-an/tracking-gen earlier as doing so has made a big difference over what can be achieved otherwise this may also be something others may want to keep in mind (most bands picked up about a dB more importantly, response across some bands flattened by 3-5 dB). But my K2 still is inferior to a TS-950S with its horrific audio IMD spurs across the output that is as good as torture to listen to - those really weak long path signals at bottom of cycle simply are below what this K2 can hear. 73 HNY/HLNY, VR2BrettGraham -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of VR2BrettGraham Sent: Thursday, December 29, 2005 7:39 AM To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] A question about low sensitivity Compared against other rigs here, my K2 (24xx) seems deaf more so on some bands. Much less so now after aligning the BPFs with spec-an tracking gen - but still noticeable. This was before narrowing BPFs so as to avoid AGC responding to out-of-band energy may still be due in part to AGC even after trying LA3ZA mod (a noticeable improvement, but seems to need _much_ more help than that, at least in this part of R3 with decent antennas). It became very obvious tuning across the band after adding LA3ZA mod that sensitivity varies depending on energy level at the AGC image frequency. But this apparently is not an issue in either R1 or R2. 73 HNY/HLNY, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
RE: [Elecraft] K2 Anomaly
Don: A switch from VFO A to VFO B is unrelated to any pot sitting at a switchpoint. Yes, they are unrelated. Same thread, different message mentioned noisy pots. I replied to both as they are both of interest here. You should be looking for some other cause of this 'flakiness' - something is causing the microprocessor to execute a routine that it should not - it could be coming from a glitch on the pushbutton matrix, a bad solder joint at the switch that is just now showing up, or even RF getting into the K2 - these are just a few things immeditaely off the top of my head. You might try loosening the microprocessor a bit and reseating it. It is possible for slight corrosion to develop at the socket to IC pin pressure connection, and the wiping action created by re-seating the socketed chips can often make the problem disappear - it certainly will not hurt anything to re-seat the uP. If it happens again I might be able to get a feel for something I do before that might bring it on (like VFO knob spin, then stop perhaps in a moment or two the power display comes up on its own), but since the rig is being polled for frequency info about every second I think this might be another AuxBus timing thing. I gave everything socketed a push last time the covers were off reseat the CPU next time I'm in there. 73, VR2BrettGraham -Original Message- I now have the rig jumping from VFO A to VFO B, in addition to phantom displays of power level (the latter more likely to happen shortly after stopping spinning the VFO). These do _not_ necessarily happen during transmit, or during transition from transmit to receive or vice versa, so unlikely to be RFI. The VFO A to VFO B switch happened twice this morning - both times during period of receive with no operator interaction with the rig. 73, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] K2 Anomaly
The pots that are used frequently on my K2 have gone flaky. This includes the AF GAIN control, which _does_ have the mod. Flakiness in the POWER control can be rather dangerous if the K2 is driving something that does not want to be driven too hard. As changing the front panel pots is something I do _not_ consider to be acceptable (even as preventative maintenance), anybody have any experience with potential replacements that stand up better to use? 73, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] K2 Anomaly
I now have the rig jumping from VFO A to VFO B, in addition to phantom displays of power level (the latter more likely to happen shortly after stopping spinning the VFO). These do _not_ necessarily happen during transmit, or during transition from transmit to receive or vice versa, so unlikely to be RFI. The VFO A to VFO B switch happened twice this morning - both times during period of receive with no operator interaction with the rig. 73, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] RE: ARRL November Sweepstakes CW
AC7AC commented: There's no rules against nets like the ECN meeting on 30 meters either. The 10, 18 24 Mc allocations to amateur service were originally secondary. Today, the 10 Mc allocation to the amateur service remains secondary. There is no rule or anything of that nature to my knowledge as Ron implies. There are, however, ITU-RR requirements of services depending on their status an IARU recommendation against sponsoring of major radiosporting events on the 10/18/24 Mc bands no doubt are really the reasons why this is so. Some rather interesting at same time disappointing reading in this thread - in particular the applicability of skills honed through radiosport to non-radiosport operation in general the characterization of radiosporting enthusiasts. 73, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] K2 Problem
W3FPR replied to K0ARO, who noticed nasties on transmit when K2 switches to KPA100: You could be correct that rectification in the TR switch in the KPA100 is at fault, BUT that should not take place under normal conditions. Check the bias voltage to the TR switch (junction of R11 and R12) if it is lower than 90 volts, that is your problem - trace it back to the origin. A non-functioning Q6 or Q7 could also cause similar problems. The diodes themselves are likely OK unless they have suffered abuse resulting from some other problem. What perfect timing - I put my K2 into service after about a year it does same thing, as well as now making other undesirable noises when I plug in SO2R mic switching system that is same as when K2 was last used - right down to the cable that plugs into the radio itself or the radio the K2 was to replace. Hopefully some similarities here - cheers! 73, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
RE: [Elecraft] K2 Problem
W3FPR continued: Rather than looking for similarities, you may want to look for potential ground loop sources. Those ground loops are really 'sneaky' and can cause strange effects. Locating the real source can be a grand problem in itself because there are so many possible 'sneak' paths. I wish you luck and good troubleshooting. One 'help' I can offer -- see what happens when transmitting into a dummy load -- that will eliminate the possibility that RF-in-the-shack could be the root of your problems. Sorry, but there are no 'simple' answers. Yes, not simple - change nothing but the radio problems start. Not the thing one wants to experience in the heat of doing something important. Difference between K2 at max KPA100 at minimum should not result in significant difference in RF environment. Two radio contest station in apartment is pretty extreme, but K2 with no special precautions has been fine - could never do SSB with OMNI-6 without an isolation transformer serious work on rear panel spigot EMC improvements. I still believe the rig has developed a fault whilst in storage perhaps it's all related. BTW, I have posted to the list before my observations of noise as result of computer control of the radio. In listening to myself on second rig when frantically trying to find some new cabling-related fault, it was clear there is a significant amount of noise being transmitted by K2 that is the direct result of KIO activity. Mine, after small 400 watt amp, puts out what looks to be several watts whenever K2 is polled for frequency info. Now I know I can't use computer control when on SSB until I find the root cause of that. Transmit audio also sounds lousy in general as compared to after I changed compression ratios a bit - all combined, if not so busy trying to keep run going whilst troubleshooting, probably would have chucked K2 out third floor window. But last time when in use, same K2 in same side of console with same cables, same this, same that same the other, didn't do any of this (except transmitted KIO noises). Bit busy with other things need good CW rig for CQ WW CW, so fingers crossed part of problem here is like that at K0ARO therefore may help get to the bottom of it all in time. 73, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Two Band Moxon/wire beam
Okay, found it - WA1X's technique for tuning a Moxon rectangle: http://lists.contesting.com/archives//html/Towertalk/2005-03/msg00852.html My apologies for not finding it sooner. 73, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Two Band Moxon/wire beam
W1CG replied: one big snip Presumably you know the dielectric constant of that insulation, verified that the wire you have is in the same neighborhood done all your modelling based on that figure? I have previously assumed that any wire insulated or not, in space, has the same velocity factor as bare wire. Why wouldn't it? I can see that a twisted pair, or feed line would be affected by velocity factor. Because, quite simply, it does. You are not above the laws of RF black magic - never were never will be, full stop. Shorten things by 2-3% - perhaps more - in your model see what happens. That is what happens when you use insulated wire without taking into consideration the effect of the insulation. On 40m somewhere around about a quarter-wave above ground - without any consideration for the insulation - IMHO nothing will be where you expect it to be. It never is for me. snip again Remind me what WA1X's approach is again. Tune elements such that they are resonant reasonably close to where they need to be - both driver reflector. In a nutshell, not really possible to make a Moxon without a bit of tweaking. Mine - made of wire that has very little dielectric in contact with it (just the end insulators) - required quite a bit of trimming before it showed reasonable match _and_ performance based on pattern. Remember, this was a 10m Moxon at a height of wavelengths greater than yours above ground. Get higher up things should change, but I really believe you are taking a hit from these two very significant factors (with ground _so_ close that it might be greater than the insulation). Compare against another antenna I suspect you will see - as I did. As for simultaneous operation, other than harmonics spurs, the other concern is phase noise K2 is quite good in that department. Harmonics usually are more of a problem on CW due to relationship of bands (less so in ITU R2, where 2 x 40m SSB band is mostly above 14.35 Mc). But as this all has to do with evil competitive operation judging from lack of interest from the list, best to terminate this discussion. GL. 73, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Two Band Moxon/wire beam
W1CG continued: To answer your question, I am using stranded, silver plated, teflon insulated #16 wire. It is plenty strong. I have a 3/16 Dacron line between the two poles to take the strain off the wires. This also decreases the vertical bend and completely eliminates the horizontal bend of the two poles. Presumably you know the dielectric constant of that insulation, verified that the wire you have is in the same neighborhood done all your modelling based on that figure? If so, then you can see how ground dominates if not, then between both ground insulation your elements are nowhere near where you think they are. (To review, the antenna is a 40 meter Moxon wire beam with a 2 element 20 wire meter beam inside. There are two supports, 22' long fiberglass poles at each end, spaced 45 '. There are two feed lines.) We put the antenna up today for our annual special event at for the Harvest Faire at the Norman Bird Sanctuary in Middletown, RI for this weekend. Listen for us on 20 and 40. Call is W1SYE, Newport County Radio Club. (See Sept QST, special events). The antenna is about 30' high on one end and about 25' on the other, from a portable mast to a tree. The Fo and Zo is not much different from what it was at 21'. Fo is about 14.00/7.00 MHZ . SWR is 1:1, 50 ohms on both bands per MFJ 159B. 2:1 band width is (top frequency) 14.4 MHz and 7.25 MHz resp. I still want to move it up to 14.2 and 7.25 MHz. It's a very nice beam; doesn't sag much and it is easy to erect. The weight is about 18# which includes everything supported. Not many 2-element 40m beams that can be robust only weigh that much - not to mention less wingspan far better F/R than a yagi. The feed lines are two lengths of double shielded RG-58 (TRF-58). I am going to try simultaneous operation on 40 and 20 using 20 and 40 meter bandpass filters by Array Solutions. The 40M filter has an insertion loss of 70 dB on 14 MHz and the 20M filter has an insertion loss of 35 dB on 7 MHz. I will use my K2/100 with a LDG Z-11 tuner and the club's Ten Tec Jupiter with its LDG tuner. I will try my other K2 with KAT2 in case the Jupiter overloads on receive. I don't know how this will work out. Calculations say it won't work at 100 watts as there is not enough attenuation, but I will try it and report results. There must be some power level of the transmitters that will work. It would be handy for field day, but if it doesn't work we will just have to put the second transceiver on 80 meters using another antenna. Or else use separate receiving antennas. The K2 with the KAT2 can do this; I don't know about a K2/100 with a KAT100. Maybe someone can enlighten me. With two 400 watt rigs into two bands of a tribander simultaneously, those filters will work - though without stubs the 2nd harmonic of the 40m station will render some number of dozens of kilocycles on the higher band useless. Be sure to decouple the feeders at the feedpoints, too. Look at how each driver looks as you connect, disconnect or short the far end of the feeder to the other driver. I would imagine that your antenna probably has the two bands' drivers electrically closer therefore you will have far greater interaction between the two bands than on my tribander. Hairpins seem to work pretty good on that, but that means more trimming. Anyway, I think the key point is the wire like I said about my bare wire Moxon, there's a bit of mucking about in practice to get it to work. I would not make another Moxon unless I'm exactly duplicating something else (right down to the wire) - otherwise both elements need trimming WA1X's approach (I think it was) is probably the best way to go about it. Enjoy! 73, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] FT100 Knob
W3FPR replied to N2DH: The allen wrench size for the FT-100 knob is metric and as I recall it is 2mm, I could be wrong (blame fuzzy memory), but it is very close to that size - I do know 2.5 mm is too big. Yes - 1.5 mm. 73, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Optimized Field-Day mini log and dupe sheets
NZ0R added: You only have to report callsigns on each band. So if you really want to compact it, drop time and exchg, don't mix bands on one page, and record only callsigns. IOW, a well-designed dupe sheet is sufficient. That technique proved problematic not too long after WPX got interesting in the late 70s. A serious FD effort that might make 1k QSOs on a band/mode could easily be done on that old A3-sized ARRL dupe sheet, but it all got messy after WD. Worked great as long as you remember not to swat mosquitos that land on the log, no matter how tempting - that gets even messier. ;^) Everybody have fun on FD. We don't have anything like it out here, so as I tune the bands hoping to work a KH6 or W6 if I'm really lucky, the last weekend of June usually means a time to reflect on memories of FDs past. I think it was '77 (last FD before 2x1s were introduced?) that FD for me was at Seattle's Space Needle. Anybody try /pm there with a KX1 yet? The 80m inverted-vee 40m full sloper we had strung from the very top would be fun with _any_ rig if it were possible to do something like that again! 73, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] setting power via RS232 with KPA100
VE7NGR noted: When setting the power via the serial port using basic mode, whichever PA is in use will remain in use, regardless of the output set via the serial port. The K2 will not switch according to the power level like it does with the front panel knob. This means: - If the K2 PA is in use (power is set to 10 W or less with the front panel knob), then power cannot be set above 15 W via serial. - If the KPA 100 PA is in use (power is set 10 W with the front panel knob), then power can be set as low as 1 W, but it does not switch to the K2 PA. This seems like rather odd behaviour to me (and it isn't documented, BTW). I would suggest this is a nature-of-beast issue. One must leave RIT knob centered, otherwise clearing it by remote control results in RIT going back to where knob is pointing (I drive RIT up down by remote). Makes sense when you think about how the knobs are read. No idea if the reaction is immediate on return to receive (didn't bother to check), but display changes on next update. 73, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
[Elecraft] KIO2/KPA100 cricket chirp
I would be interested to hear from anyone with K2 KIO2 (not KPA100) whether or not they can hear in either receive or transmit audio what sounds like the chirp a cricket makes the radio sees data coming in on the serial port. I would also be interested to hear from anyone with KPA100 or KPA100 KAT100 mounted externally to their K2, too. The sound isn't loud, but can be really annoying after 48 hours of listening to it happen every time the radio is polled by the logging computer over a contest weekend. My guess is that it's crosstalk in the ribbon, which should happen with a KIO could be even more noticeable with an external KPA100. Theories on why one can see more spikes with a 'scope probe near the ribbon cable when data is coming into the K2 than when the K2 sends data out would also be welcome (why would rise time of TTL-level serial data coming out of CPU be different than rise time of essentially the same thing coming in from some sort of external device?). Maybe the K2 shapes the data like a CW waveform? ;^) 73, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re:[Elecraft] KIO2/KPA100 Serial Comm Problems
N0SS continued: Well, I think I've found the culprit of my K2 serial comms problem... and it's the laptop!!! Unfortunately! My IBM ThinkPad 380D shown the following voltages: Voltages: TXD line (from K2PA100): Quiescent: -15VDC Sending data: +5VDC RXD line (from IBM ThinkPad 380D): Quiescent: -5VDC Sending Data: +1.0VDC Given data provided by Jack Brindle, W6FB, the TXD line appears to be about 1.4VDC under the minimum required voltage. That is likely to remain flaky. I can't find my copy of EIA/TIA-232-F, but ITU-T V.28 mentions the 3 volts as the minimum that I always remember. 5 volts may be what a driver should produce, as I did find some mention of 2 volts allowance for noise at the far end. Interesting - the usual culprit is something to do with a software driver, as had been suggested. Now is this some sort of intermittent hardware fault, or could it be that one can't assume that an IBM ThinkPad's RS-232 port(s) don't do real RS-232? I was counting on getting a ThinkPad as it's on of the few decent laptops that can still be had with a real serial port! Speaking of serial control of the K2, a few months ago I was looking at the chirp (cricket sound when polled for frequency data by a computer) the data received by the K2 does get serious radiated by the ribbon cable - though no amount of dressing of the cable made a difference, suggesting rather than induced by the ribbon into surrounding circuitry, it's induced into the lines in the ribbon itself (power?). Have a look with a 'scope probe around the ribbon note the difference in RXD TXD-induced spikes coming from the ribbon. Anybody have any idea why RS232-in-converted-to-TTL should be worse than TTL-converted-into-RS232-out? 73, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
RE: [Elecraft] KIO2/KPA100 Serial Comm Problems
W3FPR asked: Are you asking about spikes on the TTL level side or the RS-232 level side? If it is on the TTL side, and the RS-232 side at the same time period has a voltage beyond the 'region of uncertainty' between +3 volts and -3 volts, one can only blame the receiving device, but I do believe the problem goes further than that. In the proper RS-232 world, the minimum levels (+/- 3 volts) are the minimum that can/should be expected at the receiver end, while the driver voltage can go anywhere greater than those values (up to +/-25 volts) and still meet the spec. The designer of the driving circuits have to make a decision about how much cable they want to drive and what the safety margin they want to use above the minimum. Some laptops are limited on the power supply end of things and may chose to drive the positive signal with only 5 volts but will usually drive the negative with something like -12 or -15 volts. They lose some noise immunity on the positive side by doing that, but since in RS-232 signalling the negative voltage is the logical 1 (or ON signal), they can usually get away with it unless the noise source puts extra negative going spikes on the cable. I would tend to believe that something has failed in Tom's laptop rather than thinking that it is a design flaw - yes, most laptops cannot drive the 200 ft. cables that used to be common in the RS-232 world, but that world was usually not driven by laptop serial ports anyway. In a typical home or small office setup, the 5 volt positive level still provides more tha a volt of noise imunity on the positive signalling level, and since the negative signalling level is driven to a -12 volt level, there is plenty of margin for noise on the level that will register a logical 1 at the receiving end. The spikes have nothing to do with N0SS's laptop - sorry for the misunderstanding. Tom's follow-up post reminded me of having looked at this a while ago. I hope N0SS has a dickie serial port it isn't indicative of ThinkPads in general (hard to get real serial ports on modern laptops hope one day to find another one with two all the other goodies one day - have some things to do that really can't be done any other way... will be keenly watching for any final post from Tom). The spikes I think are where the chirp (low level sound of cricket in both receive transmit audio - numerous reports here of it on receive) when a K2 is being talked to. Incoming data on KIO causes huge spikes with 'scope probe in the vicinity of level far greater than spikes seen when the K2 is sending data. Haven't tried breaking out that line shielding it, or doing something to clean up the power to the interface chip - not sure why 232TTL would cause this TTL232 wouldn't. 73, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Single versus Dual Lever Paddles
By slapping, perhaps W4ZV meant a greater movement of fingers than is really necessary to work a paddle. At least that's the way I took it in the last shot of Chip sending, it looked like he could have been getting into character, with more exaggerated finger movement as a bug - at least for me - seems to encourage. 73, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Balanced tuners
OH9NB shared with us: Another very clever (with memories and all) can be seen in www.hamware.de and is available in 200W and 1000W versions. That was originally made for a starshape multi-V-beams. EUD1.6k, or even EUD450 for 200 watt kit version. Nice, but ouch. Would take saving a lot of rice money to be able to afford that. ;^) Never thought much of auto tuners, though they do open up some interesting antenna possibilities if remoted. Instead of a SteppIR dipole, I would love to take an old 40m beam element (without the linear loading) feed that with a proper tuner - essentially Cebik's 44-foot doublet, hopefully without any of the potential difficulties in feeding it. Automatic or just remote control of the knobs, I don't care as long as it works good. It's easy to beef up an L/C/relay tuner for higher power, but I always come back to putting motors on a Johnson kW matchbox don't get any further than that. It's good to see tuned feeders being rediscovered; it's unfortunate that it's so dear to treat them right nowadays that the market has skewed so far away from balanced in general (not to mention transmitting components themselves - I hope my stash of ARC-5s is still safe back in Dad's basement ;^). 73, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] K2 EXTERNAL VFO CONTROL
G4BUE asked: Has anyone built an external VFO for the K2, please? I took the plunge last Sunday and sold my UK main station transceiver, a Ten-Tec Omni VI, and have replaced it with one of my K2s. I am now an all Elecraft K2 station at both my UK and at my Florida QTHs (SO2R in Florida and shortly SO2R in the UK). The only thing I miss with the Omni is the external VFO control (Ten- Tec model 301) and wondered if anyone has built an external VFO for the K2? Perhaps one of our technically minded members on the Reflector can tell us if it would be possible and/or very difficult to build such a control for the K2, possibly from Elecraft spare parts? I found a short thread in the Reflector Archives in July 2000 about it but without any firm conclusions. I didn't realise just how much I have come to use and depend on the external VFO of the Omni, especially in contests, until operating without it this week! If you don't go too far keep the lines clean, it will work. You need to switch between the two encoders, however. Looks like the V- lead of Z1 is used to implement dial lock, so the external knob can have its own local lock you only need to deal with the two encoder lines power, if K2 encoder's lock is used as trigger for enabling switching to external encoder. If encoder isn't plugged in, K2 still stops tuning when locked - seems easy... probably forgot about something. ;^) 73, VR2BrettGraham 73, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] KPA800 @ $2.8k: count me in/out
N6XI added: I don't think the Elecraft amp is targetting the budget end of the market. You can't do that with a solid state amp - tubes are still a decidedly cheaper way to go high power. This amp is really two separate products - a very light, yet high quality expedition amp and a state-of-the-art, full power, fully automated home station amp capable of SO2R1A. (That's running two transceivers with a single, time-shared amp.) I believe it will be competing initially in a field of one in both categories. Perhaps out-of-the-box field-of-one. A transfer relay a little band switching logic can make any solid-state amp suitable for SO2R1A - just watch the duty cycle. Full power, of course, is somewhat relative - for much of the world market, many existing solid-state amps are already somewhat like Alphas - capable of a number of dB more than one is allowed not break a sweat. Amplifiers are products where I have felt the multiplier from BOM to MSRP is hard to justify, as there is little room for adding apparent value. One of these is output matching - after years of driving my Ten-Tec 420E (export Hercules II) into ugly loads, I'm tempted to say I wish Elecraft current-limited the transistors too not add cost to the product for something not exactly necessary. Or, since the K2 is like this, could it be that any fancy output matching is an option one could leave out? Wish we knew more. Between now Dayton the design will not change if the product is to go into production soon. A frustrating little tease for those who are right now in the process of, or could be induced into making a purchase decision. ;^) 73, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Fw: Need winding machine?
G3VVT suggested to K6SE: Interestingly I received the same mail here. I suspect that as we were both in this group when the discussion about toroid winders took place over a year ago and many of us were looking at various sites to do with these machines, this is probably targeted advertising rather than blind spam:-) I would not be surprised to find many of the regulars targeted the same way if they don't use a spam trap whilst on this list. (This is the only list I don't use a spam trap on and I intend to keep it that way:-) Not quite sure what Trev means by a spam trap, but folks just up the road from here are pretty sharp nowadays this company in Namhoi is probably not any different. I too received a few unsolicited e-mails from Kwang Yat in the pursuit of socialism with Chinese characteristics, it comes as no surprise. The winding of torroids is often discussed on this list given some of the classic spam I receive, there is a lot of creativity going into finding addresses to send stuff to. Partially serious, partially humorous somewhat relevant - cheers, Earl. 73, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] XV-50 LNA problems
There are parallels here to two-radio operation for radiosport at lower frequencies. Bandpass filtering not only keeps dangerous energy from blowing things up, but also makes it possible to operate on 1 band simultaneously, not hear phase noise from the other rig, etc. And unless VHF activity exploded in the Pacific NW since I left, for those times one goes out on your own, you're then one radio away from having a lot more fun than you would otherwise have. Same filtering could also be moved over to the full-blown station in the multi-op situation Greg described. For the power levels distances involved (in wavelengths), this should be a piece of cake when at HF folks are pumping 1.5 kW into one driver of a triband yagi whilst listening on another driver of the same antenna on another band (separation being a dozen or two of centimeters at most). 73, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Phase noise suggestions
G4BJM may have been talking to himself: Probably the main factor is screening of the VCO/PLL. I'm not sure how feasible that would be? Geoffrey GM4SID suspects the sidetone modulates the VCO, and if so what other internal signals can effect it? He also suggests D8 and D13 as possible noise sources - is there a feasible lower noise alternative? The numerous reports of what appears to be the MPU getting into the receive audio (cricket like sound [as in the insect] often heard in receive audio when K2 responds to frequency polling via KIO) may be worth considering, as I have found the same on transmit [cricket like sound is heard in transmitted audio]). I would think that this sort of thing needs to be sorted before it's possible to pursue other nastiness. Lack of power supply rail decoupling has been the source of countless problems in another life dealing with digital TV set-top boxes, but it used to be a fairly reasonable assumption that sh*te on the rail stayed there. Perhaps not so with the K2 - as it's the first rig I can hear responding to remote control commands by just listening to the receive audio... but perhaps my expectations are unreasonable this has been the correct behavior all along. 73, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Phase noise suggestions
G3RXQ mentioned: The problem of a power transformer close to a K2 such as to cause problems on SSB has oft been reported. What I have not seen so far, is, that because it is the PLL that is affected the problem can also be observed on receive. Receive only, KSB in path/not in path - no difference: same-same. 73, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Re: a K2 thought
W6FB queried: How can an unsoldered connection even remotely be considered a problem with a plated-through hole? There are no reports of problems with plated-through holes in Elecraft boards. This is definitely not one, either. Please re-read W4BQPs comments again. About as much as magnetic fields induce phase noise. I figured somebody would bite - thank you. (apologies to K6SE ;^) 73, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Speech processing
There were a number of external RF speech processor products available in the early 80s. I can't find the schematic for my Kenpro KP-601, but popping the cover I see something potentially home-brewable (all this discussion drove me to find it, as after changing compression ratios of the KSB2's compressor, it still doesn't sound like I would like it to). This one could turn a RF processor-less rig into something that sounds like a TS-830S with a D-104 - clean, punchy audio - and change the peak-to-average ratio enough that I once baked the paint off the cabinet of an amplifier. Not recommended for audiophiles or those who are interested in more casual operation. 73, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] KSB2-Filter Measurements
G3RXQ shared with us some measurements he made commented: This performance was very much better than I expected. The passband has, however about a 2dB ripple in it. I think it is this ripple that makes using my K2 on SSB seem tiring to listen to as compared to other rigs. Reducing the bandwidth on the K2 makes it even more tiring as compared to other radios that derive variable bandwidth filtering with two filters the usual IF gymnastics. G3RXQ's comment that the KSB's filter working about as well as it is probably spot on. The same could probably be said for the CW filter. The ripple - along with ultimate rejection (either due to filter or layout) - could be much better become obvious when using the K2 in more demanding situations. After a weekend of contesting, I get a headache listening to a TS-950S - but I just can't pull some things through on the K2 that I can with the 950 fitted with decent after-market filters. Even with the nasty high-frequency crud that comes from its SCAF CW audio filter, I find I gravitate towards the 950 more than the K2 as my running rig. Whilst there are number of things about the 950 that stick out as being inferior to the K2 (like phase noise), IMHO the filters make a big difference - making me wonder what a K2 would be like if we could INRAD it like other rigs. Again, maybe not an issue for some, depending on one's operating interests. I agree with W3ICT - such criticisms come only because the K2 is a history making radio in most other respects. 73, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
RE: [Elecraft] SO2R setup
W3FPR continued: True, and thanks for the clarification. My CW PTT for the K2 does not address a situation where the K2 is keyed by its internal commands - it only works with hardwired inputs to the K2 key jack. How many folks using or contemplating SO2R are using the KY commands for keying? I suspect you will find the answer to that question to be zero. Though I have not used KY commands yet, I would not be surprised if it would be possible to get everything to work - whilst at the same time polling the radio for frequency information - to rely on KY commands keying the radio consistently in time. In SO2R operation, timing is important if one is to try squeeze a contact on the second rig whilst running on the other at any reasonable clip. Spend too much time on the second rig one may even loose the run frequency to someone else. I believe KY is unique to Elecraft. To key the rig via the serial port when there is a key line available already only increases the novelty factor should someone out there be doing it. It's that novelty factor that suggests the answer is close to zero to begin with likely to remain in that vicinity. KY may be a concern to the remote base crowd, or at least those in USA if deregulation hasn't gone so far as to allow stuff to be put on HF without any form of additional control. Accommodating this in firmware would be tough. But as for making the radio stop transmitting after 'PTT' is lifted, one might still be able to do something along the lines of hardware modification you put forward by using the CE line. It gets easier if one doesn't have to worry about the internal keyer I suspect no serious SO2Rer uses the internal keyer on any radio, but even with the keyer it might be possible to stop the radio after it completes the current code element after 'PTT' is lifted. In any event, I suspect the rest of the radiosporting community is keenly waiting for the firmware fix as I am. Radios are radios. They tend to have the same connectors. The K2 is missing an important one that is an absolute must for interfacing radios in a serious contest station. And unlike my grandfather's SX-71/AF-67, there are contesters interested in buying K2s now. 73 HLNY, VR2BrettGraham -Original Message- Don replied (and I trust will not mind my keeping it on the list, as my intention is more than helping him): Thanks for your analysis. One point though worthy of mentioning - the K2 will not produce RF until keying takes place, so my solution does the job quite nicely by simply inhibiting the keying. In many applications where the computer does both the keying and the 'PTT', everything will sequence fine if the 'PTT' is simply not connected to the K2 (but connected to everything else - The RF path will be completed before the program begins keying). The only problem that will occur is when the K2 is keyed directly by the paddles instead of through the computer control. Bottom line, many situations do not really need the CW PTT, but unfortunately, SO2R operation where the steering is done through PTT is not one of those situations. Effectively ANDing a 'PTT' line with the key line doesn't do much towards stopping the radio from transmitting when 'PTT' is unasserted if the radio is doing the keying. A possible situation for this is where the K2 is used as a remote base one wants to have a fail-safe should one want to not keep transmitting into something that has gotten ugly (failed amp, antenna, antenna switch, etc). Even this radiosporting enthusiast can envision using his K2 with the KY command this way - I may one day soon only be able to operate with such a remote station is one reason I bought a K2. Such a summary unhappiness alarm could also be used to implement the sort of positive control I think I would have to have on a remote base if I were to do this back in USA (though the rules may have changed since I left, it really is a good thing to do any way). I use a popular antenna matrix switching product that I think could tell me when it hasn't really switched due to how its way of doing interlock between its two ports (used for two radios) can become intermittent. I would like use this to stop _all_ of my radios from transmitting under _any_ circumstances when I get around to figuring out a way of putting an unhappy light in the matrix. Some folks do not use logging programs that send CW for them. A toggle or foot switch can just as easily drive switching of key, mic, PTT audio between two rigs in an SO2R contesting station. Other folks - at one time, myself included - will have nothing other than a foot switch determining if their station is in transmit or receive mode. So like how radios might be used, there is more to CW 'PTT' to consider. That's why I didn't go further with the mod you have kindly put forward - it's better done in code. Another one high on my list is filter selection
RE: [Elecraft] SO2R setup
Don replied (and I trust will not mind my keeping it on the list, as my intention is more than helping him): Thanks for your analysis. One point though worthy of mentioning - the K2 will not produce RF until keying takes place, so my solution does the job quite nicely by simply inhibiting the keying. In many applications where the computer does both the keying and the 'PTT', everything will sequence fine if the 'PTT' is simply not connected to the K2 (but connected to everything else - The RF path will be completed before the program begins keying). The only problem that will occur is when the K2 is keyed directly by the paddles instead of through the computer control. Bottom line, many situations do not really need the CW PTT, but unfortunately, SO2R operation where the steering is done through PTT is not one of those situations. Effectively ANDing a 'PTT' line with the key line doesn't do much towards stopping the radio from transmitting when 'PTT' is unasserted if the radio is doing the keying. A possible situation for this is where the K2 is used as a remote base one wants to have a fail-safe should one want to not keep transmitting into something that has gotten ugly (failed amp, antenna, antenna switch, etc). Even this radiosporting enthusiast can envision using his K2 with the KY command this way - I may one day soon only be able to operate with such a remote station is one reason I bought a K2. Such a summary unhappiness alarm could also be used to implement the sort of positive control I think I would have to have on a remote base if I were to do this back in USA (though the rules may have changed since I left, it really is a good thing to do any way). I use a popular antenna matrix switching product that I think could tell me when it hasn't really switched due to how its way of doing interlock between its two ports (used for two radios) can become intermittent. I would like use this to stop _all_ of my radios from transmitting under _any_ circumstances when I get around to figuring out a way of putting an unhappy light in the matrix. Some folks do not use logging programs that send CW for them. A toggle or foot switch can just as easily drive switching of key, mic, PTT audio between two rigs in an SO2R contesting station. Other folks - at one time, myself included - will have nothing other than a foot switch determining if their station is in transmit or receive mode. So like how radios might be used, there is more to CW 'PTT' to consider. That's why I didn't go further with the mod you have kindly put forward - it's better done in code. Another one high on my list is filter selection - anyone who has heard what after-market filters can do to a radio can probably appreciate what it's like to sit on an INRAD prototype for the K2 not be able to use it. ;^( 73, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] what should I hear using cw reverse vs
AC7AC replied to N2WN, concerning use of CWr: There is really only one reason for switching sidebands in CW: to help you avoid QRM. If another signal is close but not zero beat with the signal you are copying, changing sidebands (CWn to CWr or vice versa) will change the amount of separation between them. Another (admittedly not so obvious) reason is that as you tune across the band search pouncing on stations (like I think Julian mentioned), if you use CWr you could tune the band in the opposite direction from others still have signals falling in tone as you tune across them (direction of tuning that I suspect we all prefer). If you are tuning across the band the same station keeps beating you each time you stop to call somebody, this trick could help get you out of sync with him much of everybody else (probably even more so if you are just chasing DX during a contest with a QRP Elecraft rig, or with marginal antennas or whatever). 73, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] SO2R setup
W3FPR posted: Just as a reminder to those of you who are contemplating SO2R operation with the K2 - the stock K2 cannot properly use PTT for steering between the transceivers when in CW mode because the PTT line is the same as the DOT input. If the SO2R enabled program steer CW by switching the keying, things will work fine, but I believe there are some that key both rigs and depend on the PTT routing to select the proper transceiver. I am investigating the methods used by various programs right now. As one may be using any of a variety of radios, amplifiers, antenna switching the like, the way it is done is by forcing the radio into transmit mode first. Amplifiers anything else downstream has T-R switching driven by the radio. The logging program then goes key down after a short period of time. The process is reversed when going from transmit back to receive. The transition from transmit to receive on one radio may be followed immediately by the second radio doing the opposite (operator CQs on one band whilst listening for replies to just finished CQ on the other). If during the CQ on the second band a reply is heard to the CQ on the first band, the second CQ is aborted the logging program jumps back to first radio. As different radios behave somewhat differently timing is critical, some logging programs allow tweaking of PTT-to-key-down delay, as well as adjustable timing for polling the radio for frequency information (or to even not poll the radio during transmit as some just cannot keep up with everything that is going on). Ultimately, all the major contest logging programs implemented CW PTT to avoid hot switching amplifiers, though there is more to it than that. Little things matter add up after a while if you are running stations at a fair clip (like 100/hour average for an entire weekend, with peaks well over 200 - short spurts of up to six QSOs/minute are even possible from my apartment station). Some logging programs even vary PTT-to-key-down delays based on whether the operator is sending with the paddles instead of from the program's memories, optimizing timing of the station's T-R switching times whilst also trying to minimize unnecessary T-R transitions on relays in the amplifier. This is all done by asserting the two lines that the vast majority of radios have - even my first station that wasn't even a transceiver (SX-100/Viking II) - one to put the radio into transmit mode the other to go key-down. The three major logging programs do it this way. If something out there achieves this functionality in another way, I doubt you will find it in use by other than a few most likely even fewer who are serious about radiosport. Like serious VHF above work, what we do relies on being able to _control_ T-R switching CW keying externally - an analogy might be T-R switching in a radio itself: various bits need to do certain things in the correct sequence with correct timing. Just like inside the K2 itself, switching between transmit receive in a radiosporting station can't really be done in any other way. This is why, although I was thinking of something like Don has done up with the 74AC153, this treats only treats the symptom by keeping CW keying from getting to the K2 unless PTT is asserted. I look forward to the firmware fix that addresses the disease. Hopefully Elecraft will include CW PTT in any future products that might be of interest to the radiosporting segment of the market. In the consumer electronic product industry, usually the product is designed to interface like similar products where that product is used, as opposed to the product requiring the consumer to adopt everything to that product. An exception to this is SONY, but one can only get away with being so unique if you are as dominant in the market as they are. The amateur equipment portion of the consumer electronics industry really isn't a good place to do mainstream products like radios so differently, unless one wants to stay out of the mainstream (where most of the water flows ;^). It's good to see radiosporting applications of the K2 being better embraced here by the Elecraft community. Like the car one drives, there are a lot of improvements refinements to the product for those with more pedestrian applications that can come about from competitive use of the product. With the keen interest the K2 has created in the radiosporting community, hopefully any future products might take advantage of this interest to catch stuff like CW PTT earlier on. 73, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Question about KNB2 Noise Blanker
W3FPR added: W3FPR replied to KH6AT that gated noise blankers cannot be expected to work when the noise pulse is insufficient to reach the gating threshold that more signal might improve performance when blanking weak noise. Sounds reasonable, but... I believe my other radios have gated noise blankers. They behave far better than the KNB2 in my K2 - even on noise that presumably is what the KNB2 was designed for (chain saws, dirt bikes similar stuff that might be encountered by backpackers) - regardless of strength. Outside of the type of noise the blanker is tailored for, why would it be that a number of folks using one particular radio with a gated noise blanker (K2 with KNB2) find the performance to be lacking compared to other radios also with gated noise blankers? OTOH, many have reported that the K2 blanker is better. I don't know the real answer, but I can guess that the gain of a particular receiver ahead of the noise blanker would make a big difference. Multi-conversion receiver designers have a lot more places to put the noise blanker (and more control over the gain at that point) than is possible in a single conversion receiver like the K2. Try the K2 NB with the preamp set on to see if that makes any difference, you may be surprised. My impression is that whenever there is mention of the KNB2, there are more posts about its ineffectiveness than anything else, as is the case with this current thread. I cannot recall any other rig using anything other than a gated noise blanker, including those with single conversion receivers, such as the TS-820. I do not have an 820 here, but from my recollection of using one with a vertical in an urban W7 environment, its noise blanker performed better overall than the KNB2 in my K2/100. Combinations of PREAMP NB LEVEL settings on the K2 here tends to have one of two results: no effect on noise, or totally trashing the receiver. My current QTH is in the middle of a mixed residential/industrial area, with garages work yards just next door doing plenty of arc welding other unsociable electromagnetic activities going on all around me - the KNB2 is useless on most of it even my lowly IC-706 does better. I would suggest it is more a matter of the design of the KNB2 than the fact that the K2 is a single conversion receiver. I would agree with you that variation in gain between K2s may be part of the problem, though that really comes back to the design in the first place (consistency, repeatability ease of assembly alignment being desirable in any product, even a kit). I also suspect that there are other factors that are involved or at least aggravate things, as I find the KNB2 to be especially useless during times that the AGC is responding to out of band energy (the EU 17m problem recently noted in a post here by a bloke in NA - I experience this on 15, 17, 20 sometimes 30m). But as the KNB2's performance continues to surface here from time to time, there must be something behind it - we have enjoyed far better performance from noise blankers in products with single, double or however number of conversions in the receiver for decades. I for one hope that in any future products, Elecraft can improve upon this other attributes of their products that are lacking in comparison to others on the market. 73, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Question about KNB2 Noise Blanker
[EMAIL PROTECTED] added: Er, I think people who don't have any trouble with it have no inclination to respond. While I don't think it's the best noise blanker I've ever used, my K2 is unusuable at my urban location without it. True - as well as folks who are fortunate not to need to use the noise blanker much, if not at all (my situation when I first started using my K2). On the noise here (power line noise and also some weird industrial electrical noise) the noise blanker on the K2 works better than the noise blanker on the IC-706MKIIG. I am frustrated this morning in not being able to measure the duration of the noise pulses I have on 15 that the KNB2 will not touch but a TS-950S' blanker does, which I suspect is from a power line as things have been very cold dry here (3-11C 30-40% RH) recently. As the bands are not so good, I do not have constant S-meter indication from out of band energy, so the noise amp should not be choked by the AGC. Is it not triggering, or is it that the noise gate is not triggered to coincide with the pulses? It is like it does nothing this is the kind of noise that from my experience is well within the capability of noise blankers of other radios. My KNB2 has blanked noise (so it probably is working normally), but is very finicky about what it will work on. It is likely I would not be able to hear much of anything with my K2 from where I operate in 9M6, as last time I was there there was S9 noise just like this everywhere. This is unfortunate, as there are other attributes of the K2 that are far superior to my other equipment. 73, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] K2/100 burn-in
K2TA asked: Has anyone really hammered their K2/100 with high CQ or QSO rates for a 24 hour period without a secondary fan? I'd be curious how it held up and were you successful in cooking eggs on it? It might make a good George Forman portable contest grill. http://www.ac6rm.net/mailarchive/html/elecraft-list/2003-07/msg00508.html 73, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Re: K1 on USB CW
N2EY said: The bigger point, and the reason for all the bandwidth, is that we do ourselves and amateur radio a disservice if we blindly accept such stories without checking out the facts. The difference between high side low side injection is something I'm always having to explain over over again to satellite equipment vendors who should really be the ones that have to explain it to their customers - so not surprising to see spectrum perversion throwing a googlie at amateurs. 73, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft You must subscribe to post. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, Unsub etc): http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] New convert
KC0QZX mentioned: I work on a ship that goes to Japan, China, Taiwan and Korea. I am presently getting my tickets to run from these countries while I'm dockside. I hope to see a lot of you on 20-40 meters in the future. In Taiwan the mainland, I believe the best you can do will be a permit to operate an existing station... seriously doubt you will be able to lawfully operate your own station on board a foreign flagged ship from dockside in either place. 73, VR2BrettGraham ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft You must subscribe to post. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, Unsub etc): http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft page: http://www.elecraft.com
