Re: [PSES] Ground Bond Tests

2021-05-13 Thread Richard Nute 
 

Hi Steve:

 

First, one of my clients has been told by their 3rd party NRTL that a ground 
bond test is required as part of factory/production routine tests, even though 
it is not required by 61010-1.  I have never run into this requirement in my 
work history and I would be interested in hearing if any of you have. 

 

In my experience, which dates back to UL1244 and UL478, no standard specified 
routine production tests.  Nevertheless, our contract with UL and CSA required 
hi-pot and grounding continuity tests.  These production tests have been 
implemented ever since then.  Regardless of the standard, the NRTL can demand, 
through its contract with the manufacturer, production-line tests.  

 

Second, just to be sure my interpretation is correct, 61010-1, section 6.5.2.4, 
Impedance of protective bonding of plug-connected equipment, in the fist 
sentence, it has a limit of 100 mOhms impedance and my read is that this is for 
equipment with a power cord that has a plug on one end and a receptacle on the 
other. 

 

In my experience, the protective bonding impedance measured from any grounded 
part (whether accessible or not) to the main protective bonding terminal (where 
the power cord terminates on the equipment end) is 0.1 ohm maximum.  The power 
cord protective conductor resistance is not included in the equipment bonding 
impedance measurement.   (8 feet of #18 stranded copper wire is 0.051 ohms, 
half of the 0.1 ohm requirement.)  

 

(Back in the “old days” for me, the bonding impedance, including the power 
cord, was 0.5 ohm.)  

 

In the May, 2014, Symposium, I presented “Equipotentiality and Grounding, 
Derivation of grounding resistance for equipment.”  If you don’t have a copy, I 
will be happy to forward a copy of either the presentation or the paper or 
both.  

 

(As an aside, only the fault current path need meet the impedance criterion.   
Those grounded parts that are not in the fault-current path need not be tested. 
 And, those grounded parts that are separated from mains by double or 
reinforced insulation are not required to have 0.1-ohm impedance to the PE 
terminal or subject to the routine test.  However, such testing may be 
expedient for a production-line test.)  

 

(I had a ground impedance failure on a PCB by a NRTL.  The test was not the 
current path.  We pointed this out; the test was repeated on the actual current 
path and passed.)

 

Then, in the same section, still under the title of plug-connected equipment, 
it says for equipment that has a non-detachable power cord  the limit is 200 
mOhms.  My interpretation is that plug-connected equipment with a 
non-detachable power cord is when the power cord is hard wired to the unit 
under test, but still has a plug for mains connection. 

 

The 0.2 ohm limit accounts for both the resistance of the power cord and the 
impedance of the equipment.  I agree with you that a non-detachable power cord 
is hard-wired the equipment.  

 

Stay safe, and best regards,

Rich

 

 

 

 


-

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Re: [PSES] Ground Bond Tests

2021-05-12 Thread Wiseman, Joshua 
An ohmmeter would be a ground continuity test just to determine if the ground 
terminal is connected. It doesn't ensure the efficacy of the bond though. 
Ground bond ensures there is a bond from the ground lead to the chassis.

Which test is performed during production is determined by the standard. Some 
standards require 100% ground bond.

I have seen a ground lead fastened to the chassis by tightening fastening it 
with a screw, but the screw was not tightened in place. An ohmmeter shows the 
ground lead is connected to the chassis, but the ground bond shows an impedance 
greater than 0.1 ohms. Properly tightening the screw corrected the issue. In 
this situation, it passed ground continuity but failed ground bond.

Josh


From: Brian Kunde 
Sent: Wednesday, May 12, 2021 3:06 PM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: Re: [PSES] Ground Bond Tests

EXTERNAL SENDER: Verify links, attachments and sender before taking action


John,

I think you are getting your tests mixed up.  The Ohm Meter is a Ground Bond 
Test but at a very low current. As I said in my earlier email, Annex F doesn't 
specify a current value for this test so technically an ohm meter will do the 
job and meet the requirement of the 61010-1.

The HiPot test puts a high voltage potential between Line (or neutral) to 
chassis ground to test the Dielectric Strength of your insulation. This test is 
typically performed at 1500Vac and/or 2100Vdc for electrical equipment 
operating up to the 230-volt range, but I have seen lower voltage levels used 
also.   This is a different test than the Ground Bond test and is also required 
for 100% of production.

I hope this was helpful.

The Other Brian

On Wed, May 12, 2021 at 2:09 PM John Cochran 
mailto:jcoch...@strongarm.com>> wrote:
I'm interested in these answers, but UL and Intertek do not require us to do 
more than Ground Continuity testing on 100% of the products.  The UL/cUL 
certified product is an Industrial LCD Monitor (NWGQ, NWGQ7) evaluated to the 
ITE standard IEC 60950-1 & CAN/CSA C22.2 No. 60950-1-07, with a detachable 
power cord.  The Intertek certified product is a mobile cart with a permanently 
attached 3/c cord with plug.  It is evaluated to UL 61010-1 & CSA 
C22.2#61010-1-12.  Both have an input range of 100-240VAC @ 15A.  We use a 
Hi-Pot tester with a Ground Continuity, Open/Short and Dielectric tests.  
Neither NRTL requires more than a buzzer/ohm-meter test of all exposed metal 
surfaces, which the Hi-Pot tester does.  The responses to this email challenge 
these requirements, but if not required, it is hard to convince management that 
we need to invest in more test equipment.  I feel more assured of the grounding 
on a system when we use our 25A Ground Bond Tester, but we only have one for 
engineering purposes.  We have never been required to do Ground Bond testing, 
only Ground Continuity.

John Cochran
jcoch...@strongarm.com<mailto:jcoch...@strongarm.com>
215-443-3400 x219

From: MIKE SHERMAN mailto:msherma...@comcast.net>>
Sent: Wednesday, May 12, 2021 11:08 AM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG<mailto:EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG>
Subject: Re: [PSES] Ground Bond Tests

Rich Nute has 3 Technically Speaking columns on this that can be found at the 
In Compliance magazine website. The first is here
https://incompliancemag.com/article/derivation-of-ground-impedance/<https://nam11.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fincompliancemag.com%2Farticle%2Fderivation-of-ground-impedance%2F=04%7C01%7Cjoshua.wiseman%40orthoclinicaldiagnostics.com%7C8dabd7a7595a44685dcf08d91578fd51%7C6e63ffc0c2fc4cc4b6c4666b2ce89d92%7C0%7C0%7C637564431675575287%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C2000=5QmHkOi0su4j%2FJ6wjN1kxmXuzYBcB0EF4ytzWgdSbWg%3D=0>
and I find it quite informative.
Mike Sherman
Graco Inc.

On 05/12/2021 8:01 AM Wiseman, Joshua 
mailto:joshua.wise...@orthoclinicaldiagnostics.com>>
 wrote:


I agree with Brian. I've been involved with product safety over 20 yrs and 
worked for an NRTL for about 6 of those.

The 40 A requirement came from the Canadian electrical code and all the NRTLs.

The only exemptions I've seen to the 100 % ground bond requirement has been for 
Class II and Class III devices or devices using an external power supply (brick 
or wall-wart styles.)

Josh

From: Brian Kunde mailto:bkundew...@gmail.com>>
Sent: Wednesday, May 12, 2021 8:42 AM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG<mailto:EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG>
Subject: Re: [PSES] Ground Bond Tests

EXTERNAL SENDER: Verify links, attachments and sender before taking action


61010-1 § 4.1 says,  "Tests in this standard are TYPE TESTS to be carried out 
on samples of equipment or parts. Their only purpose is to check that the 
design and construction ensure conformity with this standard. In addition, 
manufacturers shall perform the ROUTINE TESTS of Annex F on 100 % of equipment 
produced which

Re: [PSES] Ground Bond Tests

2021-05-12 Thread Brian Kunde 
John,

I think you are getting your tests mixed up.  The Ohm Meter is a Ground
Bond Test but at a very low current. As I said in my earlier email, Annex F
doesn't specify a current value for this test so technically an ohm meter
will do the job and meet the requirement of the 61010-1.

The HiPot test puts a high voltage potential between Line (or neutral) to
chassis ground to test the Dielectric Strength of your insulation. This
test is typically performed at 1500Vac and/or 2100Vdc for electrical
equipment operating up to the 230-volt range, but I have seen lower voltage
levels used also.   This is a different test than the Ground Bond test and
is also required for 100% of production.

I hope this was helpful.

The Other Brian

On Wed, May 12, 2021 at 2:09 PM John Cochran  wrote:

> I’m interested in these answers, but UL and Intertek do not require us to
> do more than Ground Continuity testing on 100% of the products.  The UL/cUL
> certified product is an Industrial LCD Monitor (NWGQ, NWGQ7) evaluated to
> the ITE standard IEC 60950-1 & CAN/CSA C22.2 No. 60950-1-07, with a
> detachable power cord.  The Intertek certified product is a mobile cart
> with a permanently attached 3/c cord with plug.  It is evaluated to UL
> 61010-1 & CSA C22.2#61010-1-12.  Both have an input range of 100-240VAC @
> 15A.  We use a Hi-Pot tester with a Ground Continuity, Open/Short and
> Dielectric tests.  Neither NRTL requires more than a buzzer/ohm-meter test
> of all exposed metal surfaces, which the Hi-Pot tester does.  The responses
> to this email challenge these requirements, but if not required, it is hard
> to convince management that we need to invest in more test equipment.  I
> feel more assured of the grounding on a system when we use our 25A Ground
> Bond Tester, but we only have one for engineering purposes.  We have never
> been required to do Ground Bond testing, only Ground Continuity.
>
>
>
> *John Cochran*
>
> *jcoch...@strongarm.com *
>
> 215-443-3400 x219
>
>
>
> *From:* MIKE SHERMAN 
> *Sent:* Wednesday, May 12, 2021 11:08 AM
> *To:* EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
> *Subject:* Re: [PSES] Ground Bond Tests
>
>
>
> Rich Nute has 3 Technically Speaking columns on this that can be found at
> the In Compliance magazine website. The first is here
>
> https://incompliancemag.com/article/derivation-of-ground-impedance/
>
> and I find it quite informative.
>
> Mike Sherman
>
> Graco Inc.
>
>
>
> On 05/12/2021 8:01 AM Wiseman, Joshua <
> joshua.wise...@orthoclinicaldiagnostics.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> I agree with Brian. I’ve been involved with product safety over 20 yrs and
> worked for an NRTL for about 6 of those.
>
>
>
> The 40 A requirement came from the Canadian electrical code and all the
> NRTLs.
>
>
>
> The only exemptions I’ve seen to the 100 % ground bond requirement has
> been for Class II and Class III devices or devices using an external power
> supply (brick or wall-wart styles.)
>
>
>
> Josh
>
>
>
> *From:* Brian Kunde 
> *Sent:* Wednesday, May 12, 2021 8:42 AM
> *To:* EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
> *Subject:* Re: [PSES] Ground Bond Tests
>
>
>
> *EXTERNAL SENDER: Verify links, attachments and sender before taking
> action*
>
>
>
> 61010-1 § 4.1 says,  "Tests in this standard are TYPE TESTS to be carried
> out on samples of equipment or parts. Their only purpose is to check that
> the design and construction ensure conformity with this standard. In
> addition, *manufacturers shall perform the ROUTINE TESTS of Annex F on
> 100 % of equipment produced* which has both HAZARDOUS LIVE parts and
> ACCESSIBLE conductive parts."
>
>
>
> 61010-1 Annex F, § F2 calls out the "Protective earth" test, also known as
> the Ground Bond Test, as a required test to be performed on 100% of
> production.  Note the "NOTE" that says, "No value is specified for the test
> current.".   So some NRTL inspectors allow the ground bond test in
> production to be performed at any reasonable current value, but most will
> follow the requirements of 6.5.2.
>
>
>
>
>
> I have been doing Product Safety for over 30 years and have worked with
> UL, CSA, TUV, NEMKO, EOLAS, etc., and all of them require 100% testing of
> production units to both the Highpot test and the Ground Bond test.
>
>
>
> Regarding the 100mΩ verses 200mΩ question, all the NRTL inspectors I have
> worked with require the measured impedance of the Power Cord to be no more
> than 100mΩ.  Note the UL/ANSI/CSA Deviation to 6.5.2.4 that instead of the
> 100mΩ requirement has a "shall not cause a potential drop of more than 4
> V".  At a minimum 40 A ground bond test,

Re: [PSES] Ground Bond Tests

2021-05-12 Thread John Cochran 
I’m interested in these answers, but UL and Intertek do not require us to do 
more than Ground Continuity testing on 100% of the products.  The UL/cUL 
certified product is an Industrial LCD Monitor (NWGQ, NWGQ7) evaluated to the 
ITE standard IEC 60950-1 & CAN/CSA C22.2 No. 60950-1-07, with a detachable 
power cord.  The Intertek certified product is a mobile cart with a permanently 
attached 3/c cord with plug.  It is evaluated to UL 61010-1 & CSA 
C22.2#61010-1-12.  Both have an input range of 100-240VAC @ 15A.  We use a 
Hi-Pot tester with a Ground Continuity, Open/Short and Dielectric tests.  
Neither NRTL requires more than a buzzer/ohm-meter test of all exposed metal 
surfaces, which the Hi-Pot tester does.  The responses to this email challenge 
these requirements, but if not required, it is hard to convince management that 
we need to invest in more test equipment.  I feel more assured of the grounding 
on a system when we use our 25A Ground Bond Tester, but we only have one for 
engineering purposes.  We have never been required to do Ground Bond testing, 
only Ground Continuity.

John Cochran
jcoch...@strongarm.com<mailto:jcoch...@strongarm.com>
215-443-3400 x219

From: MIKE SHERMAN 
Sent: Wednesday, May 12, 2021 11:08 AM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: Re: [PSES] Ground Bond Tests

Rich Nute has 3 Technically Speaking columns on this that can be found at the 
In Compliance magazine website. The first is here
https://incompliancemag.com/article/derivation-of-ground-impedance/
and I find it quite informative.
Mike Sherman
Graco Inc.

On 05/12/2021 8:01 AM Wiseman, Joshua 
mailto:joshua.wise...@orthoclinicaldiagnostics.com>>
 wrote:


I agree with Brian. I’ve been involved with product safety over 20 yrs and 
worked for an NRTL for about 6 of those.

The 40 A requirement came from the Canadian electrical code and all the NRTLs.

The only exemptions I’ve seen to the 100 % ground bond requirement has been for 
Class II and Class III devices or devices using an external power supply (brick 
or wall-wart styles.)

Josh

From: Brian Kunde mailto:bkundew...@gmail.com>>
Sent: Wednesday, May 12, 2021 8:42 AM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG<mailto:EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG>
Subject: Re: [PSES] Ground Bond Tests

EXTERNAL SENDER: Verify links, attachments and sender before taking action


61010-1 § 4.1 says,  "Tests in this standard are TYPE TESTS to be carried out 
on samples of equipment or parts. Their only purpose is to check that the 
design and construction ensure conformity with this standard. In addition, 
manufacturers shall perform the ROUTINE TESTS of Annex F on 100 % of equipment 
produced which has both HAZARDOUS LIVE parts and ACCESSIBLE conductive parts."

61010-1 Annex F, § F2 calls out the "Protective earth" test, also known as the 
Ground Bond Test, as a required test to be performed on 100% of production.  
Note the "NOTE" that says, "No value is specified for the test current.".   So 
some NRTL inspectors allow the ground bond test in production to be performed 
at any reasonable current value, but most will follow the requirements of 6.5.2.


I have been doing Product Safety for over 30 years and have worked with UL, 
CSA, TUV, NEMKO, EOLAS, etc., and all of them require 100% testing of 
production units to both the Highpot test and the Ground Bond test.

Regarding the 100mΩ verses 200mΩ question, all the NRTL inspectors I have 
worked with require the measured impedance of the Power Cord to be no more than 
100mΩ.  Note the UL/ANSI/CSA Deviation to 6.5.2.4 that instead of the 100mΩ 
requirement has a "shall not cause a potential drop of more than 4 V".  At a 
minimum 40 A ground bond test, a 100mΩ impedance would give you a 4V drop.  It 
doesn't say anything about an 8V drop for non-detachable power cords.  So NRTLs 
are going to stick with the 100mΩ across the board, I believe (this is opinion).

Hope this information is helpful.

The Other Brian


On Tue, May 11, 2021 at 11:27 PM Steve Brody 
mailto:sgbr...@comcast.net>> wrote:
So here is my question, or actually two of them:

First, one of my clients has been told by their 3rd party NRTL that a ground 
bond test is required as part of factory/production routine tests, even though 
it is not required by 61010-1.  I have never run into this requirement in my 
work history and I would be interested in hearing if any of you have.

Second, just to be sure my interpretation is correct, 61010-1, section 6.5.2.4, 
Impedance of protective bonding of plug-connected equipment, in the fist 
sentence, it has a limit of 100 mOhms impedance and my read is that this is for 
equipment with a power cord that has a plug on one end and a receptacle on the 
other.

Then, in the same section, still under the title of plug-connected equipment, 
it says for equipment that has a non-detachable power cord  the limit is 200 
mOhms.  My interpretation is that p

Re: [PSES] Ground Bond Tests

2021-05-12 Thread MIKE SHERMAN 
Rich Nute has 3 Technically Speaking columns on this that can be found at the 
In Compliance magazine website. The first is here
https://incompliancemag.com/article/derivation-of-ground-impedance/
and I find it quite informative.
Mike Sherman
Graco Inc.


> On 05/12/2021 8:01 AM Wiseman, Joshua 
>  wrote:
>  
>  
> 
> I agree with Brian. I’ve been involved with product safety over 20 yrs 
> and worked for an NRTL for about 6 of those.
> 
>  
> 
> The 40 A requirement came from the Canadian electrical code and all the 
> NRTLs.
> 
>  
> 
> The only exemptions I’ve seen to the 100 % ground bond requirement has 
> been for Class II and Class III devices or devices using an external power 
> supply (brick or wall-wart styles.)
> 
>  
> 
> Josh
> 
>  
> 
> From: Brian Kunde 
> Sent: Wednesday, May 12, 2021 8:42 AM
> To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
> Subject: Re: [PSES] Ground Bond Tests
> 
>  
> 
> EXTERNAL SENDER: Verify links, attachments and sender before taking action
> 
>  
> 
> 61010-1 § 4.1 says,  "Tests in this standard are TYPE TESTS to be carried 
> out on samples of equipment or parts. Their only purpose is to check that the 
> design and construction ensure conformity with this standard. In addition, 
> manufacturers shall perform the ROUTINE TESTS of Annex F on 100 % of 
> equipment produced which has both HAZARDOUS LIVE parts and ACCESSIBLE 
> conductive parts."
> 
>  
> 
> 61010-1 Annex F, § F2 calls out the "Protective earth" test, also known 
> as the Ground Bond Test, as a required test to be performed on 100% of 
> production.  Note the "NOTE" that says, "No value is specified for the test 
> current.".   So some NRTL inspectors allow the ground bond test in production 
> to be performed at any reasonable current value, but most will follow the 
> requirements of 6.5.2.  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
> I have been doing Product Safety for over 30 years and have worked with 
> UL, CSA, TUV, NEMKO, EOLAS, etc., and all of them require 100% testing of 
> production units to both the Highpot test and the Ground Bond test.  
> 
>  
> 
> Regarding the 100mΩ verses 200mΩ question, all the NRTL inspectors I have 
> worked with require the measured impedance of the Power Cord to be no more 
> than 100mΩ.  Note the UL/ANSI/CSA Deviation to 6.5.2.4 that instead of the 
> 100mΩ requirement has a "shall not cause a potential drop of more than 4 V".  
> At a minimum 40 A ground bond test, a 100mΩ impedance would give you a 4V 
> drop.  It doesn't say anything about an 8V drop for non-detachable power 
> cords.  So NRTLs are going to stick with the 100mΩ across the board, I 
> believe (this is opinion).  
> 
>  
> 
> Hope this information is helpful.
> 
>  
> 
> The Other Brian
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
> On Tue, May 11, 2021 at 11:27 PM Steve Brody  mailto:sgbr...@comcast.net > wrote:
> 
> > > 
> > So here is my question, or actually two of them:
> > 
> >  
> > 
> > First, one of my clients has been told by their 3rd party NRTL that 
> > a ground bond test is required as part of factory/production routine tests, 
> > even though it is not required by 61010-1.  I have never run into this 
> > requirement in my work history and I would be interested in hearing if any 
> > of you have.
> > 
> >  
> > 
> > Second, just to be sure my interpretation is correct, 61010-1, 
> > section 6.5.2.4, Impedance of protective bonding of plug-connected 
> > equipment, in the fist sentence, it has a limit of 100 mOhms impedance and 
> > my read is that this is for equipment with a power cord that has a plug on 
> > one end and a receptacle on the other.
> > 
> >  
> > 
> > Then, in the same section, still under the title of plug-connected 
> > equipment, it says for equipment that has a non-detachable power cord  the 
> > limit is 200 mOhms.  My interpretation is that plug-connected equipment 
> > with a non-detachable power cord is when the power cord is hard wired to 
> > the unit under test, but still has a plug for mains connection.
> > 
> >  
> > 
> > Thoughts?
> > 
> >  
> > 
> > Thanks in advance and you can reply here or privately to 
> > stev...@productehsconsulting.com mailto:stev...@productehsconsulting.com
> > 
> >  
> > 
> >  
> > 
> >

Re: [PSES] Ground Bond Tests

2021-05-12 Thread Wiseman, Joshua 
I agree with Brian. I've been involved with product safety over 20 yrs and 
worked for an NRTL for about 6 of those.

The 40 A requirement came from the Canadian electrical code and all the NRTLs.

The only exemptions I've seen to the 100 % ground bond requirement has been for 
Class II and Class III devices or devices using an external power supply (brick 
or wall-wart styles.)

Josh

From: Brian Kunde 
Sent: Wednesday, May 12, 2021 8:42 AM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: Re: [PSES] Ground Bond Tests

EXTERNAL SENDER: Verify links, attachments and sender before taking action


61010-1 § 4.1 says,  "Tests in this standard are TYPE TESTS to be carried out 
on samples of equipment or parts. Their only purpose is to check that the 
design and construction ensure conformity with this standard. In addition, 
manufacturers shall perform the ROUTINE TESTS of Annex F on 100 % of equipment 
produced which has both HAZARDOUS LIVE parts and ACCESSIBLE conductive parts."

61010-1 Annex F, § F2 calls out the "Protective earth" test, also known as the 
Ground Bond Test, as a required test to be performed on 100% of production.  
Note the "NOTE" that says, "No value is specified for the test current.".   So 
some NRTL inspectors allow the ground bond test in production to be performed 
at any reasonable current value, but most will follow the requirements of 6.5.2.


I have been doing Product Safety for over 30 years and have worked with UL, 
CSA, TUV, NEMKO, EOLAS, etc., and all of them require 100% testing of 
production units to both the Highpot test and the Ground Bond test.

Regarding the 100mΩ verses 200mΩ question, all the NRTL inspectors I have 
worked with require the measured impedance of the Power Cord to be no more than 
100mΩ.  Note the UL/ANSI/CSA Deviation to 6.5.2.4 that instead of the 100mΩ 
requirement has a "shall not cause a potential drop of more than 4 V".  At a 
minimum 40 A ground bond test, a 100mΩ impedance would give you a 4V drop.  It 
doesn't say anything about an 8V drop for non-detachable power cords.  So NRTLs 
are going to stick with the 100mΩ across the board, I believe (this is opinion).

Hope this information is helpful.

The Other Brian


On Tue, May 11, 2021 at 11:27 PM Steve Brody 
mailto:sgbr...@comcast.net>> wrote:
So here is my question, or actually two of them:

First, one of my clients has been told by their 3rd party NRTL that a ground 
bond test is required as part of factory/production routine tests, even though 
it is not required by 61010-1.  I have never run into this requirement in my 
work history and I would be interested in hearing if any of you have.

Second, just to be sure my interpretation is correct, 61010-1, section 6.5.2.4, 
Impedance of protective bonding of plug-connected equipment, in the fist 
sentence, it has a limit of 100 mOhms impedance and my read is that this is for 
equipment with a power cord that has a plug on one end and a receptacle on the 
other.

Then, in the same section, still under the title of plug-connected equipment, 
it says for equipment that has a non-detachable power cord  the limit is 200 
mOhms.  My interpretation is that plug-connected equipment with a 
non-detachable power cord is when the power cord is hard wired to the unit 
under test, but still has a plug for mains connection.

Thoughts?

Thanks in advance and you can reply here or privately to 
stev...@productehsconsulting.com<mailto:stev...@productehsconsulting.com>


Steve Brody
sgbr...@comcast.net<mailto:sgbr...@comcast.net>
C - 603 617 9116
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Re: [PSES] Ground Bond Tests

2021-05-12 Thread Brian Kunde 
61010-1 § 4.1 says,  "Tests in this standard are TYPE TESTS to be carried
out on samples of equipment or parts. Their only purpose is to check that
the design and construction ensure conformity with this standard. In
addition, *manufacturers shall perform the ROUTINE TESTS of Annex F on 100
% of equipment produced *which has both HAZARDOUS LIVE parts and ACCESSIBLE
conductive parts."

61010-1 Annex F, § F2 calls out the "Protective earth" test, also known as
the Ground Bond Test, as a required test to be performed on 100% of
production.  Note the "NOTE" that says, "No value is specified for the test
current.".   So some NRTL inspectors allow the ground bond test in
production to be performed at any reasonable current value, but most will
follow the requirements of 6.5.2.


I have been doing Product Safety for over 30 years and have worked with UL,
CSA, TUV, NEMKO, EOLAS, etc., and all of them require 100% testing of
production units to both the Highpot test and the Ground Bond test.

Regarding the 100mΩ verses 200mΩ question, all the NRTL inspectors I have
worked with require the measured impedance of the Power Cord to be no more
than 100mΩ.  Note the UL/ANSI/CSA Deviation to 6.5.2.4 that instead of the
100mΩ requirement has a "shall not cause a potential drop of more than 4
V".  At a minimum 40 A ground bond test, a 100mΩ impedance would give you a
4V drop.  It doesn't say anything about an 8V drop for non-detachable power
cords.  So NRTLs are going to stick with the 100mΩ across the board, I
believe (this is opinion).

Hope this information is helpful.

The Other Brian


On Tue, May 11, 2021 at 11:27 PM Steve Brody  wrote:

> So here is my question, or actually two of them:
>
> First, one of my clients has been told by their 3rd party NRTL that a
> ground bond test is required as part of factory/production routine tests,
> even though it is not required by 61010-1.  I have never run into this
> requirement in my work history and I would be interested in hearing if any
> of you have.
>
> Second, just to be sure my interpretation is correct, 61010-1, section
> 6.5.2.4, Impedance of protective bonding of plug-connected equipment, in
> the fist sentence, it has a limit of 100 mOhms impedance and my read is
> that this is for equipment with a power cord that has a plug on one end and
> a receptacle on the other.
>
> Then, in the same section, still under the title of plug-connected
> equipment, it says for equipment that has a non-detachable power cord  the
> limit is 200 mOhms.  My interpretation is that plug-connected equipment
> with a non-detachable power cord is when the power cord is hard wired to
> the unit under test, but still has a plug for mains connection.
>
> Thoughts?
>
> Thanks in advance and you can reply here or privately to
> stev...@productehsconsulting.com
>
>
> Steve Brody
> sgbr...@comcast.net
> C - 603 617 9116
> -
> 
>
> This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc
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This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc 
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