Re: [Emc-users] query: how long was your longes G-Code program ever?
On Saturday 20 July 2013 04:37:17 Jon Elson did opine: Gene Heskett wrote: Tell me something Jon? How much an hour are you guys making while contemplating this reversion to 1960's technology? Sorry, just had to ask about the picture this thread is painting. ;-) I'm just SO GLAD that technology has moved forward! Punched cards, paper tape, even the old 1/2 9-track magnetic tape were such a pain! My old microVAX is right next to me, it was SUCH a hot machine in 1986 when I got it. Now, it is 1000 X slower than my desktop, and that is a literal performance measure! Jon I have a TRS-80 Color Computer 3 in the basement, running right now because me a fellow in .au land are trying to sort out the remaining errors in building its os to run on ALL the variations of the 'coco' that the shack several other vendors were selling back in the '80's. Mine is a bit hot rodded from the stock version which came with 128k of ram as this one has 2 megs of dram in it, and it was found by us, the users, that the hitachi aftermarket replacement for the motorola MC6809EP, the HD6309EP, wasn't a clone of moto's masks, but a from the ground up reverse engineered version done in CMOS that had its microcode map filled up with additional, much smarter instructions. Transplant one of those into the coco, and re-write the OS to take advantage of it and its nearly 200% faster without playing with the clock speed. I had a hand in that conversion myself, and even wrote a new driver for it to handle a serial mouse since the OEM shack mouse is spastic when its feeling good. Mine also has a pair of 1Gb (huge) scsi drives on it, so storage is definitely not a problem. But today, we actually build the OS on a linux box, which takes this one about 7 minutes. That OS is a smaller version of linux, 7 or 8 years before Linus went public in '91. And its why I don't touch a windows machine without sterile gloves, I don't want to take a chance catch any of that 10 day old carcass's bugs. Off topic of course. :) -- See everything from the browser to the database with AppDynamics Get end-to-end visibility with application monitoring from AppDynamics Isolate bottlenecks and diagnose root cause in seconds. Start your free trial of AppDynamics Pro today! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=48808831iu=/4140/ostg.clk trk ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users Cheers, Gene -- There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order. -Ed Howdershelt (Author) My web page: http://coyoteden.dyndns-free.com:85/gene is up! My views http://www.armchairpatriot.com/What%20Has%20America%20Become.shtml With YOU, I can be MYSELF ... We don't NEED Dan Rather ... A pen in the hand of this president is far more dangerous than 200 million guns in the hands of law-abiding citizens. -- See everything from the browser to the database with AppDynamics Get end-to-end visibility with application monitoring from AppDynamics Isolate bottlenecks and diagnose root cause in seconds. Start your free trial of AppDynamics Pro today! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=48808831iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] query: how long was your longes G-Code program ever?
If you wound the tape onto a single spool, it would be 13 feet in diameter and weigh about 700 lbs. How do you calculate the diameter of the spool? -- See everything from the browser to the database with AppDynamics Get end-to-end visibility with application monitoring from AppDynamics Isolate bottlenecks and diagnose root cause in seconds. Start your free trial of AppDynamics Pro today! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=48808831iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] query: how long was your longes G-Code program ever?
On Sat, Jul 20, 2013, at 06:09 AM, Belli Button wrote: If you wound the tape onto a single spool, it would be 13 feet in diameter and weigh about 700 lbs. How do you calculate the diameter of the spool? Number of bytes divided by bytes per inch gives length of tape. Length of tape times thickness of tape gives the area of the tape as viewed from the side. (10 bytes per inch, and 0.1mm thick, from the Wikipedia article on paper tape.) The area viewed from the side is the same no matter what shape the tape is in. So I calculated the diameter of a circle with the same area. -- John Kasunich jmkasun...@fastmail.fm -- See everything from the browser to the database with AppDynamics Get end-to-end visibility with application monitoring from AppDynamics Isolate bottlenecks and diagnose root cause in seconds. Start your free trial of AppDynamics Pro today! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=48808831iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] query: how long was your longes G-Code program ever?
Hello Michael, the longest gcode program i've cut ( and still have ) is 3.9Meg, 157199 lines, 650K after txz-ing it Lemme know if you want the file i dont think i can attach in this mail list, esp that large. it was a lithophane, so is a translation of a pic to a heightmap regards tomp -- See everything from the browser to the database with AppDynamics Get end-to-end visibility with application monitoring from AppDynamics Isolate bottlenecks and diagnose root cause in seconds. Start your free trial of AppDynamics Pro today! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=48808831iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] query: how long was your longes G-Code program ever?
On Thu, 7/18/13, John Kasunich jmkasun...@fastmail.fm wrote: Subject: Re: [Emc-users] query: how long was your longes G-Code program ever? To: emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net Date: Thursday, July 18, 2013, 7:48 PM On Thu, Jul 18, 2013, at 02:04 PM, Stuart Stevenson wrote: I had a handful of mylar dots from a tape punch. Andy P called them antibits. 1/2 million lines would be a large pile of it - :) And Mike Payson wrote: Like others have said, gcode files for 3d printers van get BIG. I export all my gcode to a single directory I checked, and the largest file there is 1,708,605 lines and 51,650,578 characters long. Geek that I am, I just had to do the math: If that file was punched onto paper tape, the tape would be 81 miles long. The pile of anti-bits would weigh about 25 lbs. If you wound the tape onto a single spool, it would be 13 feet in diameter and weigh about 700 lbs. Hey Stuart, we have a new program to load into the Haas. Bring that forklift over here! --- How many hours would it take to load? -- See everything from the browser to the database with AppDynamics Get end-to-end visibility with application monitoring from AppDynamics Isolate bottlenecks and diagnose root cause in seconds. Start your free trial of AppDynamics Pro today! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=48808831iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] query: how long was your longes G-Code program ever?
John, HEH - Thank you for the geek input. :) Stuart On Thu, Jul 18, 2013 at 8:48 PM, John Kasunich jmkasun...@fastmail.fmwrote: On Thu, Jul 18, 2013, at 02:04 PM, Stuart Stevenson wrote: I had a handful of mylar dots from a tape punch. Andy P called them antibits. 1/2 million lines would be a large pile of it - :) And Mike Payson wrote: Like others have said, gcode files for 3d printers van get BIG. I export all my gcode to a single directory I checked, and the largest file there is 1,708,605 lines and 51,650,578 characters long. Geek that I am, I just had to do the math: If that file was punched onto paper tape, the tape would be 81 miles long. The pile of anti-bits would weigh about 25 lbs. If you wound the tape onto a single spool, it would be 13 feet in diameter and weigh about 700 lbs. Hey Stuart, we have a new program to load into the Haas. Bring that forklift over here! -- John Kasunich jmkasun...@fastmail.fm -- See everything from the browser to the database with AppDynamics Get end-to-end visibility with application monitoring from AppDynamics Isolate bottlenecks and diagnose root cause in seconds. Start your free trial of AppDynamics Pro today! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=48808831iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users -- Addressee is the intended audience. If you are not the addressee then my consent is not given for you to read this email furthermore it is my wish you would close this without saving or reading, and cease and desist from saving or opening my private correspondence. Thank you for honoring my wish. -- See everything from the browser to the database with AppDynamics Get end-to-end visibility with application monitoring from AppDynamics Isolate bottlenecks and diagnose root cause in seconds. Start your free trial of AppDynamics Pro today! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=48808831iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] query: how long was your longes G-Code program ever?
On 07/18/2013 02:04 PM, Stuart Stevenson wrote: I had a handful of mylar dots from a tape punch. A long time ago in a universe far away, our ancient college dorm had a huge in-wall vent fan blowing air from the corridor across the top of the shower stalls. Perhaps that was easier than routing electrical conduit across the room to put the fan in the outside window? Once upon a time, I poured a box of punch card flakes through that (running) fan, thoroughly coating one of my cronies in the first shower stall. Seemed like a good idea at the time, is all I can say... -- Ed softsolder.com -- See everything from the browser to the database with AppDynamics Get end-to-end visibility with application monitoring from AppDynamics Isolate bottlenecks and diagnose root cause in seconds. Start your free trial of AppDynamics Pro today! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=48808831iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] query: how long was your longes G-Code program ever?
Yes; and in an even further corner of the forgotten empire, we had one of the early PDP-8 minis which stopped one day. It was located in a very small cupboard, and extensive, expensive, investigation finally revealed that the hard disk had stopped because tiny cluster flies (with which the building was infested, in a major way) had been sucked from outside, through a large ventilation fan and had lodged in the warmest place they could find (and presumably breed) - inside the hard disk. Sheer weight and numbers of dead bodies had fouled the whole thing up. As I recall, the disk was large and had a retracting shield or shutter which was pushed back as the drive was inserted. Or something. It was a very long time ago, in a university far, far away (demolished last year - and the PDP-8 was still in there, as I remember). Marcus On 19 Jul 2013, at 12:58, Ed Nisley wrote: On 07/18/2013 02:04 PM, Stuart Stevenson wrote: I had a handful of mylar dots from a tape punch. A long time ago in a universe far away, our ancient college dorm had a huge in-wall vent fan blowing air from the corridor across the top of the shower stalls. Perhaps that was easier than routing electrical conduit across the room to put the fan in the outside window? Once upon a time, I poured a box of punch card flakes through that (running) fan, thoroughly coating one of my cronies in the first shower stall. Seemed like a good idea at the time, is all I can say... -- Ed softsolder.com -- See everything from the browser to the database with AppDynamics Get end-to-end visibility with application monitoring from AppDynamics Isolate bottlenecks and diagnose root cause in seconds. Start your free trial of AppDynamics Pro today! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=48808831iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users -- See everything from the browser to the database with AppDynamics Get end-to-end visibility with application monitoring from AppDynamics Isolate bottlenecks and diagnose root cause in seconds. Start your free trial of AppDynamics Pro today! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=48808831iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] query: how long was your longes G-Code program ever?
On 7/19/2013 5:33 AM, Gregg Eshelman wrote: On Thu, 7/18/13, John Kasunich jmkasun...@fastmail.fm wrote: Subject: Re: [Emc-users] query: how long was your longes G-Code program ever? To: emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net Date: Thursday, July 18, 2013, 7:48 PM On Thu, Jul 18, 2013, at 02:04 PM, Stuart Stevenson wrote: I had a handful of mylar dots from a tape punch. Andy P called them antibits. 1/2 million lines would be a large pile of it - :) And Mike Payson wrote: Like others have said, gcode files for 3d printers van get BIG. I export all my gcode to a single directory I checked, and the largest file there is 1,708,605 lines and 51,650,578 characters long. Geek that I am, I just had to do the math: If that file was punched onto paper tape, the tape would be 81 miles long. The pile of anti-bits would weigh about 25 lbs. If you wound the tape onto a single spool, it would be 13 feet in diameter and weigh about 700 lbs. Hey Stuart, we have a new program to load into the Haas. Bring that forklift over here! --- How many hours would it take to load? Obviously you guys never had to depend on punched paper tape. I ran through roughly a shipping pallet of blank tape---both rolled oiled tape and folded dry tape varieties--- when I was using minicomputers to gather experimental data in the early 1970s on the way to my PhD. With just that small amount of tape processed, I had several times to field strip and repair the mechanical punch and reader mechanisms on my Teletype ASR33 (10 cps read/punch) and the mechanical punch mechanism on my DEC high Speed Paper Tape Reader/Punch (300 cps read, 50 cps punch). 1. The high speed unit would take ca 277 hours to punch this job and ca 48 hours to read it running continuously at full speed. Later mylar-tape versions might have reduced these times by as much as 50 percent(?). 2. The chance of reading 51 million characters without error is small, but the chance of punching them all cleanly is zero. Incomplete punches (remember the famous swinging chad?) were the least of my problems. Mispunches and missing punches were a constant threat. Teletype provided a hand punch/block for repairing bad punches, which meant punching out all the holes in a row to make it a delete/rubout character. This brute-force solution may have been adequate for Western Union, but it's a nonstarter for a data system. Mylar tape was a much better medium than paper tape but not an ideal medium either. There would still be errors. Regards, Kent -- See everything from the browser to the database with AppDynamics Get end-to-end visibility with application monitoring from AppDynamics Isolate bottlenecks and diagnose root cause in seconds. Start your free trial of AppDynamics Pro today! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=48808831iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] query: how long was your longes G-Code program ever?
Gregg Eshelman wrote: And Mike Payson wrote: I checked, and the largest file there is 1,708,605 lines and 51,650,578 characters long. How many hours would it take to load? Hmm, let's see, good paper tape readers were 100 - 300 characters/second. So, 1.75 million / 300 = 5833 seconds, or 97 hours. If you had an ASR-33 to read it in, then it would take 2917 hours, or 121 days! And, you better make sure the tape doesn't break! Jon -- See everything from the browser to the database with AppDynamics Get end-to-end visibility with application monitoring from AppDynamics Isolate bottlenecks and diagnose root cause in seconds. Start your free trial of AppDynamics Pro today! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=48808831iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] query: how long was your longes G-Code program ever?
On Friday 19 July 2013 15:58:09 Jon Elson did opine: Gregg Eshelman wrote: And Mike Payson wrote: I checked, and the largest file there is 1,708,605 lines and 51,650,578 characters long. How many hours would it take to load? Hmm, let's see, good paper tape readers were 100 - 300 characters/second. So, 1.75 million / 300 = 5833 seconds, or 97 hours. If you had an ASR-33 to read it in, then it would take 2917 hours, or 121 days! And, you better make sure the tape doesn't break! Jon Tell me something Jon? How much an hour are you guys making while contemplating this reversion to 1960's technology? Sorry, just had to ask about the picture this thread is painting. ;-) -- See everything from the browser to the database with AppDynamics Get end-to-end visibility with application monitoring from AppDynamics Isolate bottlenecks and diagnose root cause in seconds. Start your free trial of AppDynamics Pro today! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=48808831iu=/4140/ostg.clk trk ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users Cheers, Gene -- There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order. -Ed Howdershelt (Author) My web page: http://coyoteden.dyndns-free.com:85/gene is up! My views http://www.armchairpatriot.com/What%20Has%20America%20Become.shtml Cynic, n.: Experienced. A pen in the hand of this president is far more dangerous than 200 million guns in the hands of law-abiding citizens. -- See everything from the browser to the database with AppDynamics Get end-to-end visibility with application monitoring from AppDynamics Isolate bottlenecks and diagnose root cause in seconds. Start your free trial of AppDynamics Pro today! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=48808831iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] query: how long was your longes G-Code program ever?
Fanuc used to give their memory capacity in feet of tape. I cant remember an amount that was common. Terry On Jul 19, 2013, at 11:58 AM, dave dengv...@charter.net wrote: On Fri, 2013-07-19 at 11:45 -0500, Jon Elson wrote: Gregg Eshelman wrote: And Mike Payson wrote: I checked, and the largest file there is 1,708,605 lines and 51,650,578 characters long. How many hours would it take to load? Hmm, let's see, good paper tape readers were 100 - 300 characters/second. So, 1.75 million / 300 = 5833 seconds, or 97 hours. If you had an ASR-33 to read it in, then it would take 2917 hours, or 121 days! And, you better make sure the tape doesn't break! Jon It doesn't get any better if you shift media to punched cards. 1750 boxes (if one assumes 1000 cards/box). Unbelievably bulky and expensive. We sometimes forget how far the technology has come. Dave -- See everything from the browser to the database with AppDynamics Get end-to-end visibility with application monitoring from AppDynamics Isolate bottlenecks and diagnose root cause in seconds. Start your free trial of AppDynamics Pro today! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=48808831iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users -- See everything from the browser to the database with AppDynamics Get end-to-end visibility with application monitoring from AppDynamics Isolate bottlenecks and diagnose root cause in seconds. Start your free trial of AppDynamics Pro today! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=48808831iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users -- See everything from the browser to the database with AppDynamics Get end-to-end visibility with application monitoring from AppDynamics Isolate bottlenecks and diagnose root cause in seconds. Start your free trial of AppDynamics Pro today! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=48808831iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] query: how long was your longes G-Code program ever?
Bari: Why not just go CAD to AMF? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Additive_Manufacturing_File_Format And then just import AMF right into the interpreter and skip using G-code. Or, do as Shapeways does - use X3D. AMF does seem to have some issues with surface division, from what I have read. I was thinking of supporting it in my Android App, but I think my time is better spent on other parts of it, at least for now. (Yes, Shapeways uses X3D internally - I have a colleague/friend who is *very* involved with Shapeways technically, and have been following his progress since the beginnings of the company. My acquaintence and I both have been involved in the X3D standard creation process. I expect to be seeing him again next week, and I have a few questions to ask) John A. Stewart. -- See everything from the browser to the database with AppDynamics Get end-to-end visibility with application monitoring from AppDynamics Isolate bottlenecks and diagnose root cause in seconds. Start your free trial of AppDynamics Pro today! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=48808831iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] query: how long was your longes G-Code program ever?
On Fri, 2013-07-19 at 11:45 -0500, Jon Elson wrote: Gregg Eshelman wrote: And Mike Payson wrote: I checked, and the largest file there is 1,708,605 lines and 51,650,578 characters long. How many hours would it take to load? Hmm, let's see, good paper tape readers were 100 - 300 characters/second. So, 1.75 million / 300 = 5833 seconds, or 97 hours. If you had an ASR-33 to read it in, then it would take 2917 hours, or 121 days! And, you better make sure the tape doesn't break! Jon It doesn't get any better if you shift media to punched cards. 1750 boxes (if one assumes 1000 cards/box). Unbelievably bulky and expensive. We sometimes forget how far the technology has come. Dave -- See everything from the browser to the database with AppDynamics Get end-to-end visibility with application monitoring from AppDynamics Isolate bottlenecks and diagnose root cause in seconds. Start your free trial of AppDynamics Pro today! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=48808831iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users -- See everything from the browser to the database with AppDynamics Get end-to-end visibility with application monitoring from AppDynamics Isolate bottlenecks and diagnose root cause in seconds. Start your free trial of AppDynamics Pro today! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=48808831iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] query: how long was your longes G-Code program ever?
Gene Heskett wrote: Tell me something Jon? How much an hour are you guys making while contemplating this reversion to 1960's technology? Sorry, just had to ask about the picture this thread is painting. ;-) I'm just SO GLAD that technology has moved forward! Punched cards, paper tape, even the old 1/2 9-track magnetic tape were such a pain! My old microVAX is right next to me, it was SUCH a hot machine in 1986 when I got it. Now, it is 1000 X slower than my desktop, and that is a literal performance measure! Jon -- See everything from the browser to the database with AppDynamics Get end-to-end visibility with application monitoring from AppDynamics Isolate bottlenecks and diagnose root cause in seconds. Start your free trial of AppDynamics Pro today! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=48808831iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
[Emc-users] query: how long was your longes G-Code program ever?
I'd be interested in what was your biggest-sized G-code program ever good enough: file size, number of lines - just a rough indication is fine --- background: I am considering alternative internal representations of G-code and want to get a handle on the problem size thanks! - Michael -- See everything from the browser to the database with AppDynamics Get end-to-end visibility with application monitoring from AppDynamics Isolate bottlenecks and diagnose root cause in seconds. Start your free trial of AppDynamics Pro today! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=48808831iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] query: how long was your longes G-Code program ever?
From the 3D printer side of things, I just created a file 2.5M, 100K lines. I can easily see needing to print files 5 times this size, On Thu, Jul 18, 2013 at 9:33 AM, Michael Haberler mai...@mah.priv.atwrote: I'd be interested in what was your biggest-sized G-code program ever good enough: file size, number of lines - just a rough indication is fine --- background: I am considering alternative internal representations of G-code and want to get a handle on the problem size thanks! - Michael -- See everything from the browser to the database with AppDynamics Get end-to-end visibility with application monitoring from AppDynamics Isolate bottlenecks and diagnose root cause in seconds. Start your free trial of AppDynamics Pro today! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=48808831iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users -- See everything from the browser to the database with AppDynamics Get end-to-end visibility with application monitoring from AppDynamics Isolate bottlenecks and diagnose root cause in seconds. Start your free trial of AppDynamics Pro today! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=48808831iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] query: how long was your longes G-Code program ever?
On Thursday 18 July 2013 10:44:58 Michael Haberler did opine: I'd be interested in what was your biggest-sized G-code program ever good enough: file size, number of lines - just a rough indication is fine --- background: I am considering alternative internal representations of G-code and want to get a handle on the problem size thanks! - Michael The answer to that is likely highly dependent on whether it was hand carved code, or generated by some of our less intelligent code generators. I have seen code that I could write in nested loops in 150 LOC maximum, occupy 10,000+ LOC when generated by a poor generator. IMO when one does not have a tool changer, which I don't on either machine, functions that require their own tool should be broken out into a function file per tool. This is of course not a working proposition for a production line machine with a multiple tool auto changing rack. There, 1,000k+ LOC might not be out of reach. I believe the practical limit is probably the initial scan for errors since I believe it all has to be loaded into memory. I know I get rather bored when it takes 20 minutes to do this initial scan for 200 lines of recursive code. I've been known to reset the machine because its not interruptible, and edit the code to take a bigger byte than my toy mill is comfortable with since its not exactly a paragon of either horse power or rigidity. Probably the most complex files I have ATM that were auto-generated, were generated by pcb2gcode. A fairly small board, 1.3x2.15 both 'etch' files are under 7,000 LOC each according to wc -l. But I'd hate to see the files that carved that toyota engine block I saw being carved on youtube. I could believe a million or more LOC for that. And of course that means gigabytes of dram if its all pulled into memory at load/scan time. I don't envy what you are undertaking to do, simply because the answers are going to be VERY wide ranging. Cheers, Gene -- There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order. -Ed Howdershelt (Author) My web page: http://coyoteden.dyndns-free.com:85/gene is up! My views http://www.armchairpatriot.com/What%20Has%20America%20Become.shtml * dpkg ponders: 'C++' should have been called 'D' -- #Debian A pen in the hand of this president is far more dangerous than 200 million guns in the hands of law-abiding citizens. -- See everything from the browser to the database with AppDynamics Get end-to-end visibility with application monitoring from AppDynamics Isolate bottlenecks and diagnose root cause in seconds. Start your free trial of AppDynamics Pro today! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=48808831iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] query: how long was your longes G-Code program ever?
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 7/18/2013 10:17 AM, Troy Jacobson wrote: From the 3D printer side of things, I just created a file 2.5M, 100K lines. I can easily see needing to print files 5 times this size, Most of my 3D printer ngc files are in the 3-5 MByte range, but I've got several over 10 Meg and many files are routinely over 5 Meg. For reference, the woman gcode I printed in Wichita is 7.4M and apx 244,000 lines. I assume the files for real machining are significantly larger, but perhaps not. - -- Charles Steinkuehler char...@steinkuehler.net -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.11 (MingW32) Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://www.enigmail.net/ iEYEARECAAYFAlHoCgwACgkQLywbqEHdNFweTwCg+cxslQda8NnRF70hVvzFASvV VA4An3Bc1P2qKIsmrGaxAv4yZEqMW8Vf =gFg1 -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- See everything from the browser to the database with AppDynamics Get end-to-end visibility with application monitoring from AppDynamics Isolate bottlenecks and diagnose root cause in seconds. Start your free trial of AppDynamics Pro today! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=48808831iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] query: how long was your longes G-Code program ever?
200-500k lines in 3d milling. Michael W dniu 18.07.2013 17:19, Gene Heskett pisze: On Thursday 18 July 2013 10:44:58 Michael Haberler did opine: I'd be interested in what was your biggest-sized G-code program ever good enough: file size, number of lines - just a rough indication is fine --- background: I am considering alternative internal representations of G-code and want to get a handle on the problem size thanks! - Michael The answer to that is likely highly dependent on whether it was hand carved code, or generated by some of our less intelligent code generators. I have seen code that I could write in nested loops in 150 LOC maximum, occupy 10,000+ LOC when generated by a poor generator. IMO when one does not have a tool changer, which I don't on either machine, functions that require their own tool should be broken out into a function file per tool. This is of course not a working proposition for a production line machine with a multiple tool auto changing rack. There, 1,000k+ LOC might not be out of reach. I believe the practical limit is probably the initial scan for errors since I believe it all has to be loaded into memory. I know I get rather bored when it takes 20 minutes to do this initial scan for 200 lines of recursive code. I've been known to reset the machine because its not interruptible, and edit the code to take a bigger byte than my toy mill is comfortable with since its not exactly a paragon of either horse power or rigidity. Probably the most complex files I have ATM that were auto-generated, were generated by pcb2gcode. A fairly small board, 1.3x2.15 both 'etch' files are under 7,000 LOC each according to wc -l. But I'd hate to see the files that carved that toyota engine block I saw being carved on youtube. I could believe a million or more LOC for that. And of course that means gigabytes of dram if its all pulled into memory at load/scan time. I don't envy what you are undertaking to do, simply because the answers are going to be VERY wide ranging. Cheers, Gene -- See everything from the browser to the database with AppDynamics Get end-to-end visibility with application monitoring from AppDynamics Isolate bottlenecks and diagnose root cause in seconds. Start your free trial of AppDynamics Pro today! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=48808831iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] query: how long was your longes G-Code program ever?
We have 5 axis files and 3D contouring files that regularly approach if not exceed 100K lines. I don't know the maximum we have had but I am sure it was more than 100K lines. This number of lines does not occur often but it does happen once or twice a year. I don't know the file size. 5 axis files are Xxxx. Yyyy. Zzzz. Aaa.aaa Bbb.bbb Ffff. 3D contour files are Xxxx. Yyyy. Zzzz. for each line of the tool motion code. On Thu, Jul 18, 2013 at 9:33 AM, Michael Haberler mai...@mah.priv.atwrote: I'd be interested in what was your biggest-sized G-code program ever good enough: file size, number of lines - just a rough indication is fine --- background: I am considering alternative internal representations of G-code and want to get a handle on the problem size thanks! - Michael -- See everything from the browser to the database with AppDynamics Get end-to-end visibility with application monitoring from AppDynamics Isolate bottlenecks and diagnose root cause in seconds. Start your free trial of AppDynamics Pro today! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=48808831iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users -- Addressee is the intended audience. If you are not the addressee then my consent is not given for you to read this email furthermore it is my wish you would close this without saving or reading, and cease and desist from saving or opening my private correspondence. Thank you for honoring my wish. -- See everything from the browser to the database with AppDynamics Get end-to-end visibility with application monitoring from AppDynamics Isolate bottlenecks and diagnose root cause in seconds. Start your free trial of AppDynamics Pro today! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=48808831iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] query: how long was your longes G-Code program ever?
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 7/18/2013 9:33 AM, Michael Haberler wrote: I'd be interested in what was your biggest-sized G-code program ever good enough: file size, number of lines - just a rough indication is fine --- background: I am considering alternative internal representations of G-code and want to get a handle on the problem size Question: Would you design something in today's world that had any sort of hard-coded limit (other than maybe native memory size)? If so, why? I envision a future where gcode files are split into 1 Gig chunks because Microsoft^H LinuxCNC can't handle files bigger than that(*). Also, if I'm not the only one seeing load-time issues with gcode files, perhaps the validation and loading of a gcode file could be split. I like validating the gcode, but don't feel like it's necessary to perform that step every time I load the same file into Axis to run a job over again. I was blaming the gcode load times on the sluggish 1 GHz ARM on the BeagleBone, but it sounds like the gcode files for 3D printing are towards the larger end of typical for LinuxCNC. (*) Obscure reference to the DVD format, and why it uses a collection of 1G VOB files instead of a single large video file. - -- Charles Steinkuehler char...@steinkuehler.net -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.11 (MingW32) Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://www.enigmail.net/ iEYEARECAAYFAlHoEFQACgkQLywbqEHdNFyqcwCfTsKFbs7hxhOj9aBNC6tXePh1 1ggAmQH9M1i0Ou5ikhvHRQmfieEyDvyr =/Hpv -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- See everything from the browser to the database with AppDynamics Get end-to-end visibility with application monitoring from AppDynamics Isolate bottlenecks and diagnose root cause in seconds. Start your free trial of AppDynamics Pro today! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=48808831iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] query: how long was your longes G-Code program ever?
On 07/18/2013 10:33 AM, Michael Haberler wrote: your biggest-sized G-code program ever Slicer programs for 3D printing spit out astonishingly long files; the biggest ones seem to be in the 10 to 15 MB range, with around half a million lines. Nothing very complicated, but a whole pile of it... -- Ed softsolder.com -- See everything from the browser to the database with AppDynamics Get end-to-end visibility with application monitoring from AppDynamics Isolate bottlenecks and diagnose root cause in seconds. Start your free trial of AppDynamics Pro today! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=48808831iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] query: how long was your longes G-Code program ever?
On Thu, Jul 18, 2013 at 11:08 AM, Ed Nisley ed.08.nis...@pobox.com wrote: On 07/18/2013 10:33 AM, Michael Haberler wrote: your biggest-sized G-code program ever Slicer programs for 3D printing spit out astonishingly long files; the biggest ones seem to be in the 10 to 15 MB range, with around half a million lines. Nothing very complicated, but a whole pile of it... I had a handful of mylar dots from a tape punch. Andy P called them antibits. 1/2 million lines would be a large pile of it - :) -- Addressee is the intended audience. If you are not the addressee then my consent is not given for you to read this email furthermore it is my wish you would close this without saving or reading, and cease and desist from saving or opening my private correspondence. Thank you for honoring my wish. -- See everything from the browser to the database with AppDynamics Get end-to-end visibility with application monitoring from AppDynamics Isolate bottlenecks and diagnose root cause in seconds. Start your free trial of AppDynamics Pro today! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=48808831iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] query: how long was your longes G-Code program ever?
Like others have said, gcode files for 3d printers van get BIG. I export all my gcode to a single directory, so here the top of that directory, sorted by size: https://www.dropbox.com/s/ljq8zfewru1oy45/Big%20Gcode.PNG I checked, and the largest file there is 1,708,605 lines and 51,650,578 characters long. On Thu, Jul 18, 2013 at 11:04 AM, Stuart Stevenson stus...@gmail.comwrote: On Thu, Jul 18, 2013 at 11:08 AM, Ed Nisley ed.08.nis...@pobox.com wrote: On 07/18/2013 10:33 AM, Michael Haberler wrote: your biggest-sized G-code program ever Slicer programs for 3D printing spit out astonishingly long files; the biggest ones seem to be in the 10 to 15 MB range, with around half a million lines. Nothing very complicated, but a whole pile of it... I had a handful of mylar dots from a tape punch. Andy P called them antibits. 1/2 million lines would be a large pile of it - :) -- Addressee is the intended audience. If you are not the addressee then my consent is not given for you to read this email furthermore it is my wish you would close this without saving or reading, and cease and desist from saving or opening my private correspondence. Thank you for honoring my wish. -- See everything from the browser to the database with AppDynamics Get end-to-end visibility with application monitoring from AppDynamics Isolate bottlenecks and diagnose root cause in seconds. Start your free trial of AppDynamics Pro today! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=48808831iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users -- See everything from the browser to the database with AppDynamics Get end-to-end visibility with application monitoring from AppDynamics Isolate bottlenecks and diagnose root cause in seconds. Start your free trial of AppDynamics Pro today! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=48808831iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] query: how long was your longes G-Code program ever?
Maybe it's time to consider dropping the use of G-code and STL for additive manufacturing? Why not just go CAD to AMF? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Additive_Manufacturing_File_Format And then just import AMF right into the interpreter and skip using G-code. The problem with having only one small nozzle (besides having only one small nozzle) is that it has to travel over the entire part. It's the same for only one laser using SLA so the G-code for motion is large and if the part has lots of on/off for deposition the G-code gets even larger. It works right now on 3-axis glue guns with only one or two nozzles and one or two materials. It gets further complicated if printheads or a micro-valve array is used since they might only have 25um nozzles and interlace hundreds or thousands of them with multiple materials. On 07/18/2013 10:57 AM, Charles Steinkuehler wrote: background: I am considering alternative internal representations of G-code and want to get a handle on the problem size Question: Would you design something in today's world that had any sort of hard-coded limit (other than maybe native memory size)? If so, why? I envision a future where gcode files are split into 1 Gig chunks because Microsoft^H LinuxCNC can't handle files bigger than that(*). -- See everything from the browser to the database with AppDynamics Get end-to-end visibility with application monitoring from AppDynamics Isolate bottlenecks and diagnose root cause in seconds. Start your free trial of AppDynamics Pro today! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=48808831iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] query: how long was your longes G-Code program ever?
On Thu, 7/18/13, Gene Heskett ghesk...@wdtv.com wrote: background: I am considering alternative internal representations of G-code and want to get a handle on the problem size thanks! - Michael Something like an optimizer that finds repeated motions, condenses them to one subroutine and replaces redundant repeats with jumps to and from the subroutine? Then there's pre-scanning the entire file to optimize speed everywhere instead of doing limited lookahead while actually cutting. Some waterjet cutting software does that. -- See everything from the browser to the database with AppDynamics Get end-to-end visibility with application monitoring from AppDynamics Isolate bottlenecks and diagnose root cause in seconds. Start your free trial of AppDynamics Pro today! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=48808831iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] query: how long was your longes G-Code program ever?
On Thu, 7/18/13, Charles Steinkuehler char...@steinkuehler.net wrote: Question: Would you design something in today's world that had any sort of hard-coded limit (other than maybe native memory size)? If so, why? I envision a future where gcode files are split into 1 Gig chunks because Microsoft^H LinuxCNC can't handle files bigger than that(*). (*) Obscure reference to the DVD format, and why it uses a collection of 1G VOB files instead of a single large video file. - DVD for video came out circa 1996. 1x speed DVD-ROM drives for computers hit the scene in 1997. Development work started some years earlier. Back then, the most popular hard drive size was a gigantic two gigabytes *unformatted capacity* and 16 *megabytes* of RAM was a mainstream amount though 32 megabytes was becoming popular as RAM hungry Windows 95 gained market share. By the time Windows 98SE was released, 256 megabytes was considered low end but 2 gig hard drives were still very popular due to being much less expensive than drives with larger capacity, like those monster sized 8 gig ones which tended to require special formatting software to trick creaky old BIOS code into working with them. DVD video has been stuck with the same limitations for 17+ years because to ensure every Digital Video Disc will work in every DVD player, no matter how old, it must stay with that old standard, in spite of all the anti-copying tricks the publishers try. Some of the latest attempts have somewhat busted compatibility with some players. The organization that oversees the standard is considering disallowing such discs to bear the official DVD logos and recommending a warning on them that they may not work in all players. P.S. My first hard drive was a *five megabyte* 5.25 full height MFM Tandon. After installing MS-DOS 2.2 and *all* of the software I owned (on 360K floppies) it was half full. Then I did a full backup - onto 360K floppies. As the stack rose above the height of the IBM 5150 PC's case, I said to myself I'm never doing this again!. -- See everything from the browser to the database with AppDynamics Get end-to-end visibility with application monitoring from AppDynamics Isolate bottlenecks and diagnose root cause in seconds. Start your free trial of AppDynamics Pro today! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=48808831iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] query: how long was your longes G-Code program ever?
On Thursday 18 July 2013 22:07:44 John Kasunich did opine: On Thu, Jul 18, 2013, at 02:04 PM, Stuart Stevenson wrote: I had a handful of mylar dots from a tape punch. Andy P called them antibits. 1/2 million lines would be a large pile of it - :) And Mike Payson wrote: Like others have said, gcode files for 3d printers van get BIG. I export all my gcode to a single directory I checked, and the largest file there is 1,708,605 lines and 51,650,578 characters long. Geek that I am, I just had to do the math: If that file was punched onto paper tape, the tape would be 81 miles long. The pile of anti-bits would weigh about 25 lbs. If you wound the tape onto a single spool, it would be 13 feet in diameter and weigh about 700 lbs. Hey Stuart, we have a new program to load into the Haas. Bring that forklift over here! PPt! Thanks John, I needed a good laugh. ;-) Cheers, Gene -- There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order. -Ed Howdershelt (Author) My web page: http://coyoteden.dyndns-free.com:85/gene is up! My views http://www.armchairpatriot.com/What%20Has%20America%20Become.shtml We gave you an atomic bomb, what do you want, mermaids? -- I. I. Rabi to the Atomic Energy Commission A pen in the hand of this president is far more dangerous than 200 million guns in the hands of law-abiding citizens. -- See everything from the browser to the database with AppDynamics Get end-to-end visibility with application monitoring from AppDynamics Isolate bottlenecks and diagnose root cause in seconds. Start your free trial of AppDynamics Pro today! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=48808831iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] query: how long was your longes G-Code program ever?
The largest files I've used were over 400k lines of code (ran on a Fanuc control not Linuxcnc). The largest on Linuxcnc was around 300k. Both were doing 2.5-D engraving of large amounts of text. The largest was an entire page from the Bible blown up to 4ft wide and 6ft tall. - Original Message - From: Michael Haberler mai...@mah.priv.at To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net Sent: Thursday, July 18, 2013 10:33:13 AM Subject: [Emc-users] query: how long was your longes G-Code program ever? I'd be interested in what was your biggest-sized G-code program ever good enough: file size, number of lines - just a rough indication is fine --- background: I am considering alternative internal representations of G-code and want to get a handle on the problem size thanks! - Michael -- See everything from the browser to the database with AppDynamics Get end-to-end visibility with application monitoring from AppDynamics Isolate bottlenecks and diagnose root cause in seconds. Start your free trial of AppDynamics Pro today! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=48808831iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users -- See everything from the browser to the database with AppDynamics Get end-to-end visibility with application monitoring from AppDynamics Isolate bottlenecks and diagnose root cause in seconds. Start your free trial of AppDynamics Pro today! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=48808831iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] query: how long was your longes G-Code program ever?
On Thu, 2013-07-18 at 22:12 -0400, Gene Heskett wrote: On Thursday 18 July 2013 22:07:44 John Kasunich did opine: On Thu, Jul 18, 2013, at 02:04 PM, Stuart Stevenson wrote: I had a handful of mylar dots from a tape punch. Andy P called them antibits. 1/2 million lines would be a large pile of it - :) And Mike Payson wrote: Like others have said, gcode files for 3d printers van get BIG. I export all my gcode to a single directory I checked, and the largest file there is 1,708,605 lines and 51,650,578 characters long. Geek that I am, I just had to do the math: If that file was punched onto paper tape, the tape would be 81 miles long. The pile of anti-bits would weigh about 25 lbs. If you wound the tape onto a single spool, it would be 13 feet in diameter and weigh about 700 lbs. Hey Stuart, we have a new program to load into the Haas. Bring that forklift over here! PPt! Thanks John, I needed a good laugh. ;-) A good belly laugh is good for the soul. ROFLOL! Dave Cheers, Gene -- See everything from the browser to the database with AppDynamics Get end-to-end visibility with application monitoring from AppDynamics Isolate bottlenecks and diagnose root cause in seconds. Start your free trial of AppDynamics Pro today! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=48808831iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
