Re: [EVDL] EVLN: Buying An Electric Car: Why Charging Rate, DC Quick-Charging Matter
I am sure this practice is not followed everywhere, in a previous building if I plugged my EV in to charge at level 1 from a 120V outlet in the front of the building, the actual outlet voltage dropped from 120V to 105V (measured at the duplex contacts) and my underrated extension cord added another 15V drop so I would only get 90V at the charger, so this 1400W charger was drawing over 15A in an attempt to still get the power through that 1 + 1 Ohm voltage drop that was passing for wiring! Moved the car around the back plugged into an outlet near the transformer serving the building and got close to 120V and less than 12A current draw... Cor van de Water Chief Scientist Proxim Wireless office +1 408 383 7626 Skype: cor_van_de_water XoIP +31 87 784 1130 private: cvandewater.info www.proxim.com This email message (including any attachments) contains confidential and proprietary information of Proxim Wireless Corporation. If you received this message in error, please delete it and notify the sender. Any unauthorized use, disclosure, distribution, or copying of any part of this message is prohibited. -Original Message- From: EV [mailto:ev-boun...@lists.evdl.org] On Behalf Of Roland via EV Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2015 4:08 PM To: Ben Goren; Electric Vehicle Discussion List Subject: Re: [EVDL] EVLN: Buying An Electric Car: Why Charging Rate,DC Quick-Charging Matter You can install a 15 or 20 amp 125 volt rated receptacle on a 20 amp circuit breaker. The continuous rated ampere load is 12 amps on the 15 amp receptacle and 16 amps on the 20 amp receptacle which is 80% of the device and/or circuit breaker. For both 15 and 20 amp receptacles, the minimum size wire is No. 12 AWG rated at 60 C. for a length of circuit of 42 feet. A higher temperature rated wire in the 90 C to 115 C range, we run up to 50 feet. The volt drop shall not go below 1% for lighting and up to 3% for power circuits. If the circuit distance to 20 amp receptacle is over 50 feet up to 70 feet total, we will a 30 amp rated wire, a No. 10 AWG 90 C. rated copper wire for the first 50 feet and 20 amp rated wire, a No. 12 AWG 90 C. rated copper for the next 20 feet or you could run the 30 amp rated wire for the entire length of 70 feet for a maximum of 16 amp load on a 20 amp circuit breaker. You have to calculated the maximum voltage drop of a wire which is between 1 to 3 percent of the incoming unloaded voltage at the circuit breaker to the actual voltage at the load end. A electrical worker say he has install a 30 amp circuit, may only mean that the wire size is rated for 24 amps at 50 foot circuit run or 16 amps at a 70 foot run for a 1 percent voltage drop. Roland - Original Message - From: Ben Goren via EV<mailto:ev@lists.evdl.org> To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List<mailto:ev@lists.evdl.org> Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2015 10:43 AM Subject: Re: [EVDL] EVLN: Buying An Electric Car: Why Charging Rate,DC Quick-Charging Matter On Oct 20, 2015, at 11:05 PM, Mike Nickerson via EV mailto:ev@lists.evdl.org>> wrote: > True. I actually meant I've only seen 20A outlets in commercial > installations. My house is wired with 20A circuits and 15A outlets. Hmmm...I may well be confused. I just checked my panel. Most of the regular outlets have 15A breakers. The one for the shop that I thought was 30A is 20A. The patio has a 30A breaker. Appliances have 20A, 30A, or 50A breakers as necessary. I know I've got unconnected wire going to an empty box ready for at least a 30A circuit at the outside corner where I'll be plugging in the EV...I had an electrician string that when he was doing some other work and before the attic insulation was blown in b& -- next part -- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 801 bytes Desc: Message signed with OpenPGP using GPGMail URL: <http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20151021/4e2844de/attachment.pgp<http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20151021/4e2844de/attachment.pgp>> ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub<http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub> http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org<http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org> Read EVAngel's EV News at http://evdl.org/evln/<http://evdl.org/evln/> Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA>) -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20151021/4620a2e6/attachment.htm> ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://list
[EVDL] Cool 'Back to the Future' Totoya FCV commercial...
Although I'm not fan of the 'Fool Cell'; this commercial is really good, and the way they fool the people about using trash to produce biomass to product (don't know what) to produce hydrogen to put it into their cars... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xFyY7_hc-14 Good for their marketing area... Ing. Marco Gaxiola Director General Juarez #18, Col. Bachoco Tel: (662)301.1070 Skype: info.energyev <http://www.energyev.com/> www.energyev.com --- El software de antivirus Avast ha analizado este correo electrónico en busca de virus. https://www.avast.com/antivirus -- next part -- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: winmail.dat Type: application/ms-tnef Size: 4430 bytes Desc: not available URL: <http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20151021/ddcb4555/attachment.bin> ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org Read EVAngel's EV News at http://evdl.org/evln/ Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] EVLN: Buying An Electric Car: Why Charging Rate, DC Quick-Charging Matter
On Oct 21, 2015, at 4:08 PM, Roland wrote: > A electrical worker say he has install a 30 amp circuit, may only mean that > the wire size is rated for 24 amps at 50 foot circuit run or 16 amps at a 70 > foot run for a 1 percent voltage drop. I don't remember the actual gauge wire he ran -- this was a few years ago -- but I do remember that there was a calculation based on current and length and the rest, and that the cost of the wire was significant. I'll find out when I finally have an outlet hooked up to the connectionless box he put in, but I'm reasonably confident I won't be cursing him when that time comes. b& -- next part -- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 801 bytes Desc: Message signed with OpenPGP using GPGMail URL: <http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20151021/a2429944/attachment.pgp> ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org Read EVAngel's EV News at http://evdl.org/evln/ Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] EVLN: Buying An Electric Car: Why Charging Rate, DC Quick-Charging Matter
You can install a 15 or 20 amp 125 volt rated receptacle on a 20 amp circuit breaker. The continuous rated ampere load is 12 amps on the 15 amp receptacle and 16 amps on the 20 amp receptacle which is 80% of the device and/or circuit breaker. For both 15 and 20 amp receptacles, the minimum size wire is No. 12 AWG rated at 60 C. for a length of circuit of 42 feet. A higher temperature rated wire in the 90 C to 115 C range, we run up to 50 feet. The volt drop shall not go below 1% for lighting and up to 3% for power circuits. If the circuit distance to 20 amp receptacle is over 50 feet up to 70 feet total, we will a 30 amp rated wire, a No. 10 AWG 90 C. rated copper wire for the first 50 feet and 20 amp rated wire, a No. 12 AWG 90 C. rated copper for the next 20 feet or you could run the 30 amp rated wire for the entire length of 70 feet for a maximum of 16 amp load on a 20 amp circuit breaker. You have to calculated the maximum voltage drop of a wire which is between 1 to 3 percent of the incoming unloaded voltage at the circuit breaker to the actual voltage at the load end. A electrical worker say he has install a 30 amp circuit, may only mean that the wire size is rated for 24 amps at 50 foot circuit run or 16 amps at a 70 foot run for a 1 percent voltage drop. Roland - Original Message - From: Ben Goren via EV<mailto:ev@lists.evdl.org> To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List<mailto:ev@lists.evdl.org> Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2015 10:43 AM Subject: Re: [EVDL] EVLN: Buying An Electric Car: Why Charging Rate,DC Quick-Charging Matter On Oct 20, 2015, at 11:05 PM, Mike Nickerson via EV mailto:ev@lists.evdl.org>> wrote: > True. I actually meant I've only seen 20A outlets in commercial > installations. My house is wired with 20A circuits and 15A outlets. Hmmm...I may well be confused. I just checked my panel. Most of the regular outlets have 15A breakers. The one for the shop that I thought was 30A is 20A. The patio has a 30A breaker. Appliances have 20A, 30A, or 50A breakers as necessary. I know I've got unconnected wire going to an empty box ready for at least a 30A circuit at the outside corner where I'll be plugging in the EV...I had an electrician string that when he was doing some other work and before the attic insulation was blown in b& -- next part -- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 801 bytes Desc: Message signed with OpenPGP using GPGMail URL: <http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20151021/4e2844de/attachment.pgp<http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20151021/4e2844de/attachment.pgp>> ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub<http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub> http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org<http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org> Read EVAngel's EV News at http://evdl.org/evln/<http://evdl.org/evln/> Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA>) -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20151021/4620a2e6/attachment.htm> ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org Read EVAngel's EV News at http://evdl.org/evln/ Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] EVLN: Buying An Electric Car: Why Charging Rate, DC Quick-Charging Matter
In residences it is indeed uncommon to see the "cross-blade" 20A outlet (NEMA 5-20), it is common to see the two straight blades of a NEMA 5-15 even if wired from a 20A circuit. That is how it is in my home. Walk into a commercial building (checking the kitchen and the cubicles at work) it is still common to see the NEMA 5-15 but occasionally there will be an outlet that allows either 5-15 or 5-20 plug. Cor van de Water Chief Scientist Proxim Wireless office +1 408 383 7626 Skype: cor_van_de_water XoIP +31 87 784 1130 private: cvandewater.info www.proxim.com This email message (including any attachments) contains confidential and proprietary information of Proxim Wireless Corporation. If you received this message in error, please delete it and notify the sender. Any unauthorized use, disclosure, distribution, or copying of any part of this message is prohibited. -Original Message- From: EV [mailto:ev-boun...@lists.evdl.org] On Behalf Of Ben Goren via EV Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2015 9:43 AM To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List Subject: Re: [EVDL] EVLN: Buying An Electric Car: Why Charging Rate,DC Quick-Charging Matter On Oct 20, 2015, at 11:05 PM, Mike Nickerson via EV wrote: > True. I actually meant I've only seen 20A outlets in commercial > installations. My house is wired with 20A circuits and 15A outlets. Hmmm...I may well be confused. I just checked my panel. Most of the regular outlets have 15A breakers. The one for the shop that I thought was 30A is 20A. The patio has a 30A breaker. Appliances have 20A, 30A, or 50A breakers as necessary. I know I've got unconnected wire going to an empty box ready for at least a 30A circuit at the outside corner where I'll be plugging in the EV...I had an electrician string that when he was doing some other work and before the attic insulation was blown in b& -- next part -- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 801 bytes Desc: Message signed with OpenPGP using GPGMail URL: <http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20151021/4e2844de/attachment.pgp> ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org Read EVAngel's EV News at http://evdl.org/evln/ Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org Read EVAngel's EV News at http://evdl.org/evln/ Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] EVLN: Watt-if Nissan aimed a GT-R production EV solely for performance
On 21 Oct 2015 at 10:48, Ben Goren via EV wrote: > This some over-unity reference? >From the EVDL conventions ( http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#conv ) "Don't post about overunity devices, magnetic motors, free energy, perpetual motion machines, or anything else that appears to violate the laws of classical physics." David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA EVDL Administrator = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = EVDL Information: http://www.evdl.org/help/ = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Note: mail sent to "evpost" and "etpost" addresses will not reach me. To send a private message, please obtain my email address from the webpage http://www.evdl.org/help/ . = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org Read EVAngel's EV News at http://evdl.org/evln/ Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] EVLN: Watt-if Nissan aimed a GT-R production EV solely for performance
On Oct 21, 2015, at 10:41 AM, Curt Coleman wrote: > Interested in a no battery solution? Huh? This some over-unity reference? b& -- next part -- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 801 bytes Desc: Message signed with OpenPGP using GPGMail URL: <http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20151021/1c38fd14/attachment.pgp> ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org Read EVAngel's EV News at http://evdl.org/evln/ Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] EVLN: Watt-if Nissan aimed a GT-R production EV solely for performance
On Oct 21, 2015, at 10:03 AM, EVDL Administrator via EV wrote: >> "We can't build an electric GT-R today. But do I want to? I'd love to." > > I'll bet Elon Musk LOVES reading statements like that. I don't think he does. Tesla shareholders focused on quarterly earnings statements likely do, but I think Musk himself would much prefer a world in which ICEV manufacturers made a rapid transition to EVs than one in which Tesla remained the dominant player in a niche market. Never mind the electrification of Teslas; ignoring the drivetrain, they're cranking out innovations left and right that could just as well go in ICEVs but which still set Teslas beyond the competition. Even if Teslas had a conventional drivetrain they'd be the talk of the town. If all the major manufacturers went electric overnight, Tesla would still be every bit as competitive as they are today...but we would _all_ breathe easier b& -- next part -- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 801 bytes Desc: Message signed with OpenPGP using GPGMail URL: <http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20151021/72813d34/attachment.pgp> ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org Read EVAngel's EV News at http://evdl.org/evln/ Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] EVLN: Watt-if Nissan aimed a GT-R production EV solely for performance
On Oct 21, 2015, at 3:02 AM, brucedp5 via EV wrote: > "We can't build an electric GT-R today. But do I want to? I'd love to." I'll bet Elon Musk LOVES reading statements like that. David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA EVDL Administrator = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = EVDL Information: http://www.evdl.org/help/ = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Note: mail sent to "evpost" and "etpost" addresses will not reach me. To send a private message, please obtain my email address from the webpage http://www.evdl.org/help/ . = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org Read EVAngel's EV News at http://evdl.org/evln/ Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] EVLN: Watt-if Nissan aimed a GT-R production EV solely for performance
On Oct 21, 2015, at 3:02 AM, brucedp5 via EV wrote: > “We can’t build an electric GT-R today. But do I want to? I’d love to.” I _still_ say this would be a major tipping point. And I don't buy that Nissan, maker of the world's best-selling full-sized electric vehicle, can't make an high performance electric vehicle. The cheapest GT-R listed on Nissan's Web site is six figures. With that kind of budget, any competent hobbyist can do an electric conversion of a classic sports car that would mop the floor with any of Nissan's GT-Rs. And do it with Leaf battery modules, too! b& -- next part -- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 801 bytes Desc: Message signed with OpenPGP using GPGMail URL: <http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20151021/2502e35f/attachment.pgp> ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org Read EVAngel's EV News at http://evdl.org/evln/ Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] EVLN: Buying An Electric Car: Why Charging Rate, DC Quick-Charging Matter
On Oct 20, 2015, at 11:05 PM, Mike Nickerson via EV wrote: > True. I actually meant I've only seen 20A outlets in commercial > installations. My house is wired with 20A circuits and 15A outlets. Hmmm...I may well be confused. I just checked my panel. Most of the regular outlets have 15A breakers. The one for the shop that I thought was 30A is 20A. The patio has a 30A breaker. Appliances have 20A, 30A, or 50A breakers as necessary. I know I've got unconnected wire going to an empty box ready for at least a 30A circuit at the outside corner where I'll be plugging in the EV...I had an electrician string that when he was doing some other work and before the attic insulation was blown in b& -- next part -- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 801 bytes Desc: Message signed with OpenPGP using GPGMail URL: <http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20151021/4e2844de/attachment.pgp> ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org Read EVAngel's EV News at http://evdl.org/evln/ Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] EVLN: i-MiEV is America’s lowest cost EV, for a reason
Wow, I read the review very differently. I saw no negativity on anything related to it being an EV. The reviewer just thought it was cheaply made throughout. Sent from my iPhone > On Oct 21, 2015, at 6:15 AM, EVDL Administrator via EV > wrote: > >> On 21 Oct 2015 at 3:04, brucedp5 via EV wrote: >> >> In my week with the car, the >> meter consistently showed 72 miles and I observed mile-per-mile equal to the >> meter. > > And then the author quickly moves on to bash the car further, instead of > noting that range meter accuracy is something of a holy grail among EVs. > >> The 0-60 time for the Mitsubishi i-MiEV is in the 13-15 second range. > > How times change - or is it just perceptions that do? I remember 1976, when > Volkwagen advertisements bragged about the 12-second 0-60 time for their > (ICEV) Rabbit. > > I don't dispute the review overall, but I think it could have been a little > more positive. > > David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA > EVDL Administrator > > = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = > EVDL Information: http://www.evdl.org/help/ > = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = > Note: mail sent to "evpost" and "etpost" addresses will not > reach me. To send a private message, please obtain my > email address from the webpage http://www.evdl.org/help/ . > = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = > > > ___ > UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub > http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org > Read EVAngel's EV News at http://evdl.org/evln/ > Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) > > ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org Read EVAngel's EV News at http://evdl.org/evln/ Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] EVLN: i-MiEV is America’s lowest cost EV, for a reason
On 21 Oct 2015 at 3:04, brucedp5 via EV wrote: > In my week with the car, the > meter consistently showed 72 miles and I observed mile-per-mile equal to the > meter. And then the author quickly moves on to bash the car further, instead of noting that range meter accuracy is something of a holy grail among EVs. > The 0-60 time for the Mitsubishi i-MiEV is in the 13-15 second range. How times change - or is it just perceptions that do? I remember 1976, when Volkwagen advertisements bragged about the 12-second 0-60 time for their (ICEV) Rabbit. I don't dispute the review overall, but I think it could have been a little more positive. David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA EVDL Administrator = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = EVDL Information: http://www.evdl.org/help/ = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Note: mail sent to "evpost" and "etpost" addresses will not reach me. To send a private message, please obtain my email address from the webpage http://www.evdl.org/help/ . = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org Read EVAngel's EV News at http://evdl.org/evln/ Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] EVLN: i-MiEV is America’s lowest cost EV, for a reason
What I think Willie was saying is that the news site (URL) that he mentioned did not allow comments, nor did I see a way to contact the writer. Some media outlets shy-away-from/don't want to be bothered with allowing comments nor responding to the writer. But there is another way around this besides commenting here on the evdl.org which is saved on archives that search engines will find. That is to search using key words from the story's headline. I found one, that Willie could place his experiences on: http://www.topix.com/forum/autos/toyota/TB5I8VI6F22DG619T Since there are going to be copy-cat re-postings of the same copy by other media outlets calling it their own, Willie could search once a day for a few days for those, so as to leave his comment on those as well. Use https://www.google.com/search?q=i-MiEV+America’s+lowest+cost For EVLN EV-newswire posts use: http://evdl.org/evln/ {brucedp.150m.com} -- View this message in context: http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/Re-EVLN-i-MiEV-is-America-s-lowest-cost-EV-for-a-reason-tp4678237p4678238.html Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org Read EVAngel's EV News at http://evdl.org/evln/ Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] EVLN: i-MiEV is America’s lowest cost EV, for a reason
On 10/21/2015 05:04 AM, brucedp5 via EV wrote: http://www.boston.com/cars/news-and-reviews/2015/10/16/mitsubishi-miev-america-lowest-cost-electric-for-reason/vl7y92uWJVpjEgPrKPHJcO/story.html Mitsubishi i-MiEV is America’s lowest cost electric, for a reason October 17, 2015 Keith Griffin I wish I had found a place to publicly comment on this. It does a horrible disservice to the imiev. There are probably few people that have both a Tesla S and an imiev; I am one. Yes, the imiev has rather crappy instrumentation. Though not nearly as crappy as a Leaf. Yes, the range is limited. Other than those two items, I prefer to drive my imiev over the Tesla. The load capacity is about 60% of that of the Tesla. It is much easier to drive due to the smaller size. It has door handles that work and it has sufficient ground clearance. Two short comings of the Tesla. I do love both my Tesla and my imiev but, if the imiev had a 200 mile range, I probably would not have the Tesla. OTOH, I was very happy with my Leaf for the first 20k miles until Nissan refused to fix battery problems. So far, I have only about 5k miles on the imiev and 65k miles on the Tesla. ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org Read EVAngel's EV News at http://evdl.org/evln/ Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
[EVDL] Thrice-stabbing thief of Leaf EVr comes to trial after 10 months
http://myedmondsnews.com/2015/10/trial-in-stabbing-of-dominos-pizza-employee-begins-monday/ Trial in stabbing of Domino’s Pizza employee begins Monday October 18, 2015 Larry Vogel [images http://i2.wp.com/myedmondsnews.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/DominosStore.jpg The stabbing took place behind this Domino’s Pizza location at 22914 Highway 99 in Edmonds ] The trial of a 34-year-old Shoreline man in connection with the Jan. 17, 2015 stabbing of a Domino’s Pizza employee [ http://myedmondsnews.com/2015/01/edmonds-police-looking-suspect-stabbed-pizza-employee-highway-99-late-saturday ] begins Monday in Snohomish County Superior Court. The suspect, Christopher V. Cowan, faces multiple charges including attempted murder, assault with a deadly weapon and armed robbery in connection with the incident that sent 40-year-old Mike Brenick to Harborview with potentially life-threatening injuries. According to charging documents, on the night in question Brenick parked his electric vehicle behind his workplace located in the Brentwood Plaza strip mall at 22914 Highway 99 in Edmonds near a power outlet in order to charge the battery while he was at work. Upon returning to the vehicle, he found a male inside the car who was appearing to be taking property from it. Brenick opened the door, pulled him out, and in the ensuing scuffle was stabbed three times. Brenick was rushed to Harborview Hospital, where he underwent surgery for his injuries. He has since been released, and according to Edmonds police is doing fine. The assailant fled on foot. A K-9 track by Edmonds police — with assistance from Lynnwood, Mountlake Terrace and Mill Creek police, the Snohomish County Sheriff’s Office and the Washington State Patrol — was unable to locate him. Subsequent investigation led police to Cowan, who was apprehended and arrested on Jan. 21 while walking on Highway 99 [ http://myedmondsnews.com/2015/01/suspect-dominos-pizza-employee-stabbing-arrested-early-wednesday/ ]. Formal charges of attempted first-degree murder, first-degree assault and first-degree robbery were filed by the Snohomish County Prosecutor on Aug. 13. [© myedmondsnews.com] ... [dated] http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/EVLN-Thief-twice-stabs-pizza-delivering-Leaf-EV-owner-v-tp4673551.html EVLN: Thief twice-stabs pizza-delivering Leaf EV owner (v) Jan 20 2015 ... http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/template/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=search_page&node=413529&query=Domino&days=0 More Domino posts on the evdl.org archive For EVLN EV-newswire posts use: http://evdl.org/evln/ {brucedp.150m.com} -- View this message in context: http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/Thrice-stabbing-thief-of-Leaf-EVr-comes-to-trial-after-10-months-tp4678231.html Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org Read EVAngel's EV News at http://evdl.org/evln/ Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
[EVDL] EVLN: CEO sez Apple-poaching Killed SF's Mission Motors' e-motorcycle
http://www.engadget.com/2015/10/19/mission-motorcycles-apple-poaching/ E-bike company blames Apple poaching for its demise blogger-avatar by Steve Dent | Oct 19, 2015 [images http://o.aolcdn.com/hss/storage/midas/fdabeec095e1883987f889fe65c0c58d/202642160/missionbike2.jpg (e-motorcycle) ] When promising EV company Mission Motorcycles went bankrupt last month, it said that "we have not earned any cash (or) revenue of any kind." However, it's now putting part of the blame on Apple, claiming that it poached several of its top engineers at a critical time. Mission told Reuters that an investor withdrew crucial funding after two of its key engineers left for Apple, and the company ran out of cash shortly afterwards. "Mission had a great group of of engineers... Apple knew that -- they wanted it, and they went and got it," said CEO Derek Kaufman. Apple has never acknowledged that it's even working on an electric car, though it reportedly hired engineers away from established automakers. Tesla CEO Elon Musk recently chided the company for the practice, saying that "they have hired people we've fired." That said, Mission admitted that it failed to find stable investors like rival Zero Motorcycles, despite developing a pair of good-looking, high-performance E-bikes. And it was clearly having troubles well before it went bankrupt, as it sued one of its co-founders and delayed production numerous times. [© engadget.com] http://9to5mac.com/2015/10/19/apple-poaching-electric-vehicle-engineers-contributed-to-mission-motorcycles-bankruptcy-says-ceo/ Apple poaching electric vehicle engineers contributed to Mission Motorcycles’ bankruptcy says CEO Fred Lambert - 2015/10/19 ... http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/10/19/us-apple-motorcycle-idUSKCN0SD0ND20151019# Apple's auto ambitions sideswipe electric motorcycle startup Oct 19, 2015 SAN FRANCISCO | By Julia Love ... Some close to Mission Motors said it had reached a point of no return by last fall, when departures to Apple, and other companies, accelerated after a long struggle to find funding and a sound business model ... ... http://www.trustedreviews.com/news/apple-car-poaching-killed-electric-motorcycle-start-up-says-ceo Apple Car poaching killed electric motorcycle start-up, says CEO by Sean Keach 19 October 2015 ... http://www.jewocity.com/blog/electric-motorcycle-startup-mission-motors-ceases-operations-after-losing/108151 Electric Motorcycle Startup Mission Motors Ceases Operations After Losing By Emily Henderson on Oct 19, 2015 For EVLN EV-newswire posts use: http://evdl.org/evln/ {brucedp.150m.com} -- View this message in context: http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/EVLN-CEO-sez-Apple-poaching-Killed-SF-s-Mission-Motors-e-motorcycle-tp4678230.html Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org Read EVAngel's EV News at http://evdl.org/evln/ Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
[EVDL] EVLN: £24.5k 2015 Nissan Leaf 30kWh review r:120mi
http://www.whatcar.com/car-news/nissan/leaf/2015-nissan-leaf-30kwh-review/1367060 2015 Nissan Leaf 30kWh review John Howell Oct 17, 2015 The Nissan Leaf is the world's best-selling electric car, and this new 30kWh version has a longer 155-mile range. We've been finding out what it's like and what else is new In case you’ve missed it, the electric revolution is underway. We’ve already got electric super saloons such as the Tesla Model S ... If you want to sign-up to this revolution but can’t afford their hefty price tags, the Nissan Leaf 24kWh has offered you membership to the electric vehicle (EV) club since 2010 - and still does, from just £20,790. However, if the 24kWh version’s claimed range of 124 miles (which in the real-world is nearer 70 to 80 miles) isn't enough for you, then you'll be interested to hear that the world’s most popular EV can now go 25% farther. It's thanks to the bigger battery in this new 30kWh model, which sits alongside the existing line up. Nissan reckons it’ll manage a maximum of 155 miles on a single charge, which in general driving will be more like 100 to 120 miles. The bigger battery is only available from the mid-level Acenta trim upwards, so prices start from £24,490 if you include the £5000 government subsidy. For that price you also get a warranty that covers the battery for up to eight years or 100,000 miles. Curiously, the warranty for the 24kWh version remains at five years or 60,000 miles. It’s 21kg heavier than the 24kWh car, but that shouldn’t make too much difference to how it feels on the road. Indeed, the performance is identical, taking 11.5sec to reach 62mph, before heading to a top speed of just under 90mph. Whether you chose the existing 24kWh or the 30kWH version, all Leafs from Acenta trim up benefit from an improved infotainment system called Nissanconnect EV. This includes a DAB radio, 7.0in touchscreen and sat-nav, plus a host of new features. For instance, it can tell you how far you are from the nearest charging point – of which there are currently an estimated 9384 spread across the UK, including 500 30-minute rapid chargers - and whether or not it’s occupied. Using an App on your smartphone you can also check remotely on the Leaf’s charge status, or, if you’ve forgotten where you left it, locate it on a map. On frosty mornings you can even use your phone to switch on the car’s heater, making it nice and toasty before the morning commute. There are alternatives to the Leaf, which includes the Kia Soul EV and the Volkswagen e-Golf. However, with its new battery pack, neither can boast the new range potential of the Nissan. What’s the 2015 Nissan Leaf 30kWh like inside? Apart from the infotainment it’s exactly the same as before. Up front the seats provide the cushioning of a softly sprung armchair, but with plenty of support for longer trips. You don’t get a reach adjustable steering wheel and the driving seat is missing that last inch of travel to satisfy really tall drivers, but nevertheless the Leaf still offers a decent driving position. Forward visibility is slightly restricted by the thick, angled windscreen pillars. The wide rear pillars also limit your over-the-shoulder vision, but the standard rear-parking camera means it’s not too much of an issue. While the Leaf’s cabin is perfectly functional and well laid out, anyone used to the plusher-feeling materials in an e-Golf or Soul EV will find the Nissan a bit sparse; there’s hardly any soft-touch surfaces and a proliferation of scratchy plastics. That said, Nissan’s excellent showing in our latest reliability survey suggests it should be durable and withstand the rigors of family use. The new infotainment system is loaded with features and simple to use. It’s got clear graphics and intuitive menus, and the only complaint is a slight lag after pressing some of the onscreen icons. In the rear the legroom is excellent bearing in mind the Leaf’s size, but tall folks may find the headroom a bit tight. It’ll still fit two adults or three kids, but they would have more room to relax in the back of the EV Soul. The Leaf does regain points for the biggest boot, though. There’s some intrusion from the rear suspension mountings, but it’s still deep and easily big enough to swallow a couple of pushchairs. What’s the 2015 Nissan Leaf 30kWh like to drive? If you think 0-62mph in 11.5sec sounds slow, you need to drive a Leaf before passing judgment. EVs have an instantaneous surge off the line, which means the Nissan feels sprightlier away from the lights than many regularly powered hatchbacks. This makes zipping around town easy and fun, and only when you get past 50mph does this sense of urgency begin to wane. The other magical aspect of e-power is the serenity that ditching an old-school combustion engine brings. Around town the Leaf’s as quiet as the proverbial church mouse, while at higher speeds all you hear is mostly wind and road noise. There is a fair bit of suspension noise
[EVDL] EVLN: 1,000th Renault Kangoo Z.E. e-Van Delivered To ERDF
http://insideevs.com/1000th-renault-kangoo-z-e-delivered-erdf/ 1,000th Renault Kangoo Z.E. Delivered To ERDF [2015/10/17] by Mark Kane [images http://insideevs.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/RenaultGroup_71778_global_en-750x576.jpg Renault Kangoo Z.E. electric vans in the fleet of ERDF http://insideevs.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/Renault_47068_global_en-350x233.jpg Renault Kangoo Z.E. e-van ] ERDF, the French electric utility, reached a milestone of 1,000 Renault Kangoo Z.E. all-electric vans in its fleet. Pretty impressive indeed! “ERDF chief Philippe Monloubou in person took delivery of number 1,000 on 25 September 2015 as it rolled out of the Renault MCA plant in Maubeuge.” The plan for next year is to increase the number to 1,500 Kangoo ZEz and a total of 2,000 electric cars, including other models in the fleet. “ERDF, the company that manages France’s electricity distribution network, is set to run one of the country’s largest electric vehicle fleets. Under its ECOFLOT project, ERDF plans to have 2,000 electric vehicles running by the end of 2016, including 1,500 Kangoo ZEs.” But if you think that ERDF’s EV fleet is as big as it gets, think twice, as no one can match La Poste, French post, which a year ago celebrated 5,000 Kangoo Z.E. electric vans in its fleet. [© insideevs.com] For EVLN EV-newswire posts use: http://evdl.org/evln/ {brucedp.150m.com} -- View this message in context: http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/EVLN-1-000th-Renault-Kangoo-Z-E-e-Van-Delivered-To-ERDF-tp4678228.html Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org Read EVAngel's EV News at http://evdl.org/evln/ Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
[EVDL] EVLN: i-MiEV is America’s lowest cost EV, for a reason
http://www.boston.com/cars/news-and-reviews/2015/10/16/mitsubishi-miev-america-lowest-cost-electric-for-reason/vl7y92uWJVpjEgPrKPHJcO/story.html Mitsubishi i-MiEV is America’s lowest cost electric, for a reason October 17, 2015 Keith Griffin [images / Wieck http://p.o0bc.com/rf/image_700w/Boston/2011-2020/2015/10/15/Boston.com/BCOM/Images/10.17.2016_Mitsubishi_iMiEV.jpg 2014 i-MiEV Silver http://p.o0bc.com/rf/image_700w/Boston/2011-2020/2015/10/15/Boston.com/BCOM/Images/10.17.2014_Mitsubishi_iMiEV_Interior.jpg ] You get what you pay for. On a stand-alone basis, one could tolerate the 2016 Mitsubishi i-MiEV. With nothing to compare it to, it’s not a bad little car and there is the added appeal that it runs on electricity. That was the case when it was introduced in 2012. Its only competition was the Nissan Leaf, but so much has changed in the electric vehicle universe since then. Unfortunately, the Mitsubishi i-MiEV has stood still and is being outpaced by the competition. Mitsubishi points out the i-MiEV is the least expensive electric vehicle on the road with a starting price of $22,995 (before an $850 destination charge). The company also cites the $7,500 federal tax credit. Massachusetts has a $2,500 rebate available. You need to talk to a tax professional, though, to understand how the tax credit and rebate work. It’s the price of the batteries that turn what is basically a $12,000 vehicle into one with a price tag of $23,000. The Mitsubishi i-MiEV just feels cheap with doors that seem to have the heft of cat food cans and an interior filled with hard plastic surfaces. Mitsubishi might have been smart to not seek the “lowest priced EV” title and instead funneled additional upscale materials into this car even if it meant a higher MSRP. Other sedans like the electric Ford Focus, Volkswagen eGolf, and the Nissan Leaf cost more yet are substantially nicer inside. They also get additional range, which justifies their higher prices. For those interested in the numbers, the lithium-ion main drive battery pack consists of 88 individual battery cells. Its total energy storage capacity is 16 kWh. The EPA says it has a range of 62 miles. In my week with the car, the meter consistently showed 72 miles and I observed mile-per-mile equal to the meter. My wife drove the Mitsubishi to work and back, a distance of about 46 miles round trip. It went out with a full charge and came back with about 27 miles left. She sacrificed air conditioning only because we weren’t sure if she could use it and make it home. It turned out to be an unjustified concern. Charging was at first confusing because the Mitsubishi i-MiEV has ports on both sides of the car. One side is for the more traditional charging offered at a home through either your standard household outlet or a more powerful home charging station. The other is for high-speed charging. The standard outlet will bring the car to full charge in 14 hours, but you would have to be way down in juice to need that long. A Level 2 charging station will get the job done in 7 hours. A high-speed charger can bring the i-MiEV up to 80 percent charge in less than 30 minutes. Once on the road, the Mitsubishi i-MiEV drives pleasantly enough. It has three drive modes. D provides the highest performance. Eco gets you the most bang for your charge while B helps you recharge your batteries through regenerative braking. B is best used when you are braking frequently. On the highway, you need to be in D to stand any chance of changing lanes. The 0-60 time for the Mitsubishi i-MiEV is in the 13-15 second range. As mentioned, the interior of the Mitsubishi i-MiEV leaves a lot to be desired but is not without some redeeming touches. The diamond patterned seats are nice looking and the center stack is easy to use. The HVAC vents and door handles are well designed. One flaw is the instrument gauges. Too much space is devoted to a faux fuel gauge that shows remaining charge. Because the miles-left gauge is what people are going to rely on, it should be more prominent. The model we drove had the optional navigation package for $2,000. It includes a seven-inch screen and navigation package, hands-free link system with Bluetooth, USB, redundant steering wheel controls, and rearview camera system. Without the nav package, the Mitsubishi i-MiEV is lacking in technology beyond the heated seats. For conservation reasons, heated seats are a must-have in any electric vehicle. They help reduce the need for energy-draining heating that warms the entire cabin, even when the driver is solo. The Mitsubishi i-MiEV, while loaded with airbags, gets only four stars overall from the National Highway Transportation Safety Administration. Its side crash rating is three stars. Those scores need to be higher in a subcompact car. THE BASICS Price, base (with destination): $23,845. Fuel economy (equivalent): 126 city/99 highway/112 combined. Drivetrain: Single-speed transmission electric vehicle. Bod
[EVDL] EVLN: Watt-if Nissan aimed a GT-R production EV solely for performance
'We can’t build an electric GT-R today. But I’d love to' http://www.autoblog.com/2015/10/16/nissan-wants-build-electric-gtr/ Nissan would love to build an all-electric GT-R Oct 16th 2015 Chris Bruce [images / Jonathom Ramsey http://o.aolcdn.com/dims-global/dims3/GLOB/legacy_thumbnail/750x422/quality/95/http://www.blogcdn.com/slideshows/images/slides/159/663/3/S1596633/slug/l/03-2015-nissan-gt-r-fd-1.jpg 2016 GT-R 2016 Nissan GT-R [ice] MSRP $101,770 http://o.aolcdn.com/dims-global/dims3/GLOB/legacy_thumbnail/750x422/quality/95/http://www.blogcdn.com/slideshows/images/slides/159/663/4/S1596634/slug/l/04-2015-nissan-gt-r-fd-1.jpg http://o.aolcdn.com/dims-global/dims3/GLOB/legacy_thumbnail/750x422/quality/95/http://www.blogcdn.com/slideshows/images/slides/159/663/1/S1596631/slug/l/01-2015-nissan-gt-r-fd-1.jpg http://o.aolcdn.com/dims-global/dims3/GLOB/legacy_thumbnail/750x422/quality/95/http://www.blogcdn.com/slideshows/images/slides/159/663/2/S1596632/slug/l/02-2015-nissan-gt-r-fd-1.jpg http://o.aolcdn.com/dims-global/dims3/GLOB/legacy_thumbnail/750x422/quality/95/http://www.blogcdn.com/slideshows/images/slides/159/665/6/S1596656/slug/l/26-2015-nissan-gt-r-fd-1.jpg http://o.aolcdn.com/dims-global/dims3/GLOB/legacy_thumbnail/750x422/quality/95/http://www.blogcdn.com/slideshows/images/slides/159/665/8/S1596658/slug/l/28-2015-nissan-gt-r-fd-1.jpg ] As the current Nissan GT-R gets older, rumors seem to be popping up with increasing frequency about what tech might be in store for the next generation. Hopping right over all of that speculation, one Nissan exec is now talking about his dreams for the company's halo model even further into the future. Regardless of whether a hybrid GT-R could be on the way, European EV Director Gareth Dunsmore thinks a fully electric version could happen one day. "I can't see a technical reason why we wouldn't be able to implement electric vehicle technology in something like a performance vehicle," Dunsmore said to Top Gear. Although don't get too excited yet, Godzilla fans. "We can't build an electric GT-R today," he admitted. "But do I want to? I'd love to." According to Dunsmore, there're still many steps before the GT-R could go fully electric. The team and Nissan would need to prove than an EV could really take on the best performance cars out there. "It needs to be a world beater," he said to Top Gear. The dream actually echoes rumors from years ago. As far back as 2010, Nissan was reportedly at least toying with the idea of making the GT-R into an EV, among some other options. The concern then was that Godzilla might be silenced by tightening emissions standards. In 2010, an electric GT-R was probably still too avant-garde to actually happen, but things have changed. A Tesla Model S in Ludicrous mode can hit 60 in a claimed 2.8 seconds, and it's not designed to be a laser-focused sports car. Imagine what could be possible, if Nissan aimed a production EV solely for performance. [© autoblog.com] ... http://www.topgear.com/car-news/electric/watch-out-tesla-all-electric-nissan-gt-r-could-be-coming Watch out Tesla: the all-electric Nissan GT-R could be coming Stephen Dobie 16 Oct 2015 ... http://www.indiancarsbikes.in/electric-vehicles/nissan-open-to-the-idea-of-building-electric-gt-r-131666/ Nissan open to the idea of building electric GT-R by sourabhon October 17, 2015 ... http://www.i4u.com/2015/10/95814/nissan-plans-build-all-electric-gt-r Nissan Plans to Build an All-Electric GT-R Oct 17 2015 | by M. Affan ... http://www.topspeed.com/cars/car-news/nissan-would-love-an-electric-gt-r-ar171507.html Nissan Would Love An Electric GT-R 10.16.2015 by Robert Moore ... “We can’t build an electric GT-R today. But do I want to? I’d love to.” For EVLN EV-newswire posts use: http://evdl.org/evln/ {brucedp.150m.com} -- View this message in context: http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/EVLN-Watt-if-Nissan-aimed-a-GT-R-production-EV-solely-for-performance-tp4678226.html Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org Read EVAngel's EV News at http://evdl.org/evln/ Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] EVLN: Buying An Electric Car: Why Charging Rate, DC Quick-Charging Matter
On 20 Oct 2015 at 22:41, SLPinfo.org via EV wrote: > They have been debating since day 1 whether to add a 220v outlet in their > garage. The debate is because it would be an expensive install (awkward > placement of breaker box, not in garage). That can make a HUGE difference. For my current house, getting 240v to the detached garage involved trenching for direct burial cable and installing a 60a subpanel. I probably couldn't have managed the cost if I'd had to hire a pro to do it. Fortunately, I was able to do the work myself. > they realized recently that they really don't need it. 110v charging > seems to work just fine for their needs. Bravo! It's good to hear that they're able to make it work that way. I suspect that many people have the idea that they need expensive and complex wiring to use an EV, just because they've read that, and there are times that it's just not necessary. Whether any given person or family can get by on low power charging depends on many factors. How far do they drive daily? How regular is that routine? Are they always at home in the evening, with the EV charging, or do they go out often? If the EV only charges when they're sleeping, how long is that - 8 hours, 6, 5? Is a second vehicle always available in case they need to make a trip when the EV isn't sufficiently charged? David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA EVDL Administrator = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = EVDL Information: http://www.evdl.org/help/ = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Note: mail sent to "evpost" and "etpost" addresses will not reach me. To send a private message, please obtain my email address from the webpage http://www.evdl.org/help/ . = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org Read EVAngel's EV News at http://evdl.org/evln/ Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)