Re: Bruno, question
Thank you. m.a. From: Quentin Anciaux To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Tue, February 28, 2012 9:22:38 AM Subject: Re: Bruno, question It's the first. 2012/2/28 marty684 The sentence underlined below can be read in two ways: Which is correct? > >1. You can no longer believe that ...etc. > >2. (Idiomatic) You can no more believe ...computation at some level than you >can believe... > > > > > From: Bruno Marchal >To: everything-list@googlegroups.com >Sent: Tue, February 28, 2012 6:07:34 AM >Subject: Re: Bruno, question > > >Marty, > > > > >On 27 Feb 2012, at 17:11, marty684 wrote: > >I've been reading The Origin of Physical Laws...and have a question about the >following quote:"you can modify the device in such a way that the amount of >physical activity involved isarbitrarily low, and even null for dreaming >experience which has no inputs and no outputs". >> >> >>It seems to me that physical activity can never be arbitrarily low or null >>because there will always be atomic motion going on, even in a corpse. But comp assumes a level where that activity is not relevant, and that is enough for making the physical supervenience thesis absurd. If such a level is relevant, then lower the comp subst level, until the reasoning can be applied. If such a level does not exist, then matter can exist primitively, OK, but you can no more believe that you will survive an artificial brain transplant in virtue of the fact that it enacts the right computation at some correct level. Bruno >http://iridia.ulb.ac.be/%7Emarchal/ > > > >-- >You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >"Everything List" group. >To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. >To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >For more options, visit this group at >http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list?hl=en. > >-- >You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >"Everything List" group. >To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. >To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >For more options, visit this group at >http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list?hl=en. > -- All those moments will be lost in time, like tears in rain. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list?hl=en.
Re: Bruno, question
It's the first. 2012/2/28 marty684 > The sentence underlined below can be read in two ways: Which is correct? > > > > 1. You can no longer believe that ...etc. > > > > 2. (Idiomatic) You can no more believe ...computation at some level *than > you can believe...* > > > -- > *From:* Bruno Marchal > *To:* everything-list@googlegroups.com > *Sent:* Tue, February 28, 2012 6:07:34 AM > *Subject:* Re: Bruno, question > > Marty, > > > On 27 Feb 2012, at 17:11, marty684 wrote: > > *I've been reading The Origin of Physical Laws...and have a question > about the following quote:* > "you can modify the device in such a way that the amount of physical > activity involved is > > *arbitrarily low, and even null for dreaming experience which has no > inputs and no outputs".* > > ** > > ** > > *It seems to me that physical activity can never be arbitrarily low or > null because there will always be atomic motion going on, even in a corpse. > * > > > But comp assumes a level where that activity is not relevant, and that is > enough for making the physical supervenience thesis absurd. If such a level > is relevant, then lower the comp subst level, until the reasoning can be > applied. If such a level does not exist, then matter can exist primitively, > OK, but *you can no more believe that you will survive an artificial > brain transplant in virtue of the fact that it enacts the right computation > at some correct level.* > > Bruno > > > http://iridia.ulb.ac.be/~marchal/ > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list?hl=en. > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list?hl=en. > -- All those moments will be lost in time, like tears in rain. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list?hl=en.
Re: Bruno, question
The sentence underlined below can be read in two ways: Which is correct? 1. You can no longer believe that ...etc. 2. (Idiomatic) You can no more believe ...computation at some level than you can believe... From: Bruno Marchal To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Tue, February 28, 2012 6:07:34 AM Subject: Re: Bruno, question Marty, On 27 Feb 2012, at 17:11, marty684 wrote: I've been reading The Origin of Physical Laws...and have a question about the following quote:"you can modify the device in such a way that the amount of physical activity involved isarbitrarily low, and even null for dreaming experience which has no inputs and no outputs". > > >It seems to me that physical activity can never be arbitrarily low or null >because there will always be atomic motion going on, even in a corpse. But comp assumes a level where that activity is not relevant, and that is enough for making the physical supervenience thesis absurd. If such a level is relevant, then lower the comp subst level, until the reasoning can be applied. If such a level does not exist, then matter can exist primitively, OK, but you can no more believe that you will survive an artificial brain transplant in virtue of the fact that it enacts the right computation at some correct level. Bruno http://iridia.ulb.ac.be/~marchal/ -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list?hl=en.
Re: Bruno, question
Marty, On 27 Feb 2012, at 17:11, marty684 wrote: I've been reading The Origin of Physical Laws...and have a question about the following quote: "you can modify the device in such a way that the amount of physical activity involved is arbitrarily low, and even null for dreaming experience which has no inputs and no outputs". It seems to me that physical activity can never be arbitrarily low or null because there will always be atomic motion going on, even in a corpse. But comp assumes a level where that activity is not relevant, and that is enough for making the physical supervenience thesis absurd. If such a level is relevant, then lower the comp subst level, until the reasoning can be applied. If such a level does not exist, then matter can exist primitively, OK, but you can no more believe that you will survive an artificial brain transplant in virtue of the fact that it enacts the right computation at some correct level. Bruno http://iridia.ulb.ac.be/~marchal/ -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list?hl=en.
Re: Bruno, question
I've been reading The Origin of Physical Laws...and have a question about the following quote: you can modify the device in such a way that the amount of physical activity involved is arbitrarily low, and even null for dreaming experience which has no inputs and no outputs. It seems to me that physical activity can never be arbitrarily low or null because there will always be atomic motion going on, even in a corpse. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list?hl=en.
