[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_reply@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine salsunshine@ wrote: Judy, You've finally convinced me...Barry has never been right, never will be, and can only spout lies, and not even very good ones at that. On the other hand, what Barry seems to be very good at is playing with his wind-up toys. A few generalized comments, and the toys go crazy and dance around doing exactly what he wanted them to. When you pull wings off flies, do they run i funny circles too? He's especially good at making the wind-up toys go crazy trying to get him to respond to their dances, and then never responding. Winds them up even more. No human is ever harmed by pulling wings off flies, eh? Therefore, I hereby decree that Barry Wright be known from this day on as Barry Wrong. Case closed. I can live with that. You can get just as many laughs in bars introducing yourself to women as Mr. Wrong. Women often have a remarkable capacity for self-destruction, just as men do. Dude, YOU are the person who was making excuses for the TMO having illegal policies, not me. All I did was set a couple of TBs up to do so, knowing they would be unable *not* to. The assumption that the TMO is correct came first. The excuses for *why* they are correct came later. *That* is the nature of True Believerism IMO. *That* is what you tend to do, on a regular basis. *That* is all I wanted to point out. If your wings are feeling a little sore, I would suggest that that's because you grew the TB wings in the first place.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig LEnglish5@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_reply@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine salsunshine@ wrote: Judy, You've finally convinced me...Barry has never been right, never will be, and can only spout lies, and not even very good ones at that. On the other hand, what Barry seems to be very good at is playing with his wind-up toys. A few generalized comments, and the toys go crazy and dance around doing exactly what he wanted them to. When you pull wings off flies, do they run i funny circles too? He's especially good at making the wind-up toys go crazy trying to get him to respond to their dances, and then never responding. Winds them up even more. No human is ever harmed by pulling wings off flies, eh? Therefore, I hereby decree that Barry Wright be known from this day on as Barry Wrong. Case closed. I can live with that. You can get just as many laughs in bars introducing yourself to women as Mr. Wrong. Women often have a remarkable capacity for self-destruction, just as men do. Dude, YOU are the person who was making excuses for the TMO having illegal policies, not me. All I did was set a couple of TBs up to do so, knowing they would be unable *not* to. The assumption that the TMO is correct came first. The excuses for *why* they are correct came later. *That* is the nature of True Believerism IMO. *That* is what you tend to do, on a regular basis. *That* is all I wanted to point out. If your wings are feeling a little sore, I would suggest that that's because you grew the TB wings in the first place. As one of the flies, I sincerely thank you... L
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: snip Dude, YOU are the person who was making excuses for the TMO having illegal policies, not me. Actually, of course, we don't know that the TMO's policies are illegal; that's just Barry's assumption. The three cases Barry mentioned don't even begin to show that, and he won't do any of the work necessary to determine whether the laws in question apply to the TMO's policies, because all he was interested in doing was bashing the TMO, Lawson, and me, not in making a legitimate point. For example, he can't cite the specific laws under which the cases he mentioned were decided. He doesn't even know if they were decided under state or federal law. He doesn't know whether these laws apply to a company's sales force. He also doesn't know whether they apply to independent contractors, which many TM teachers are. Independent contractors are not covered by much of the law that applies to salaried employees. He doesn't know whether the laws in question apply to nonprofits, which the TMO is. In other words, Barry doesn't know what he's talking about, nor does he care. All I did was set a couple of TBs up to do so, knowing they would be unable *not* to. The assumption that the TMO is correct came first. The excuses for *why* they are correct came later. Nor does Barry know this, unless he's perfected the mind-reading siddhi. Nor does that even matter, if the excuses (he means reasons) are valid. But that, again, isn't what Barry's interested in. His purpose is merely to find something with which to demonize anyone who defends the TMO on any basis: *That* is the nature of True Believerism IMO. *That* is what you tend to do, on a regular basis. Translation: Barry's assumption that Lawson and I are True Believers came first; the excuses for *why* we are True Believers came later. snicker *That* is all I wanted to point out. Barry can do all the pointing-out he wants, but that doesn't mean his points have any value. They rarely do, and certainly don't in this case.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
nab wrote: I simply don't get it; why on earth is anyone taking what this Turk writes, who is so obviously disturbed, seriously ? It's been years since I had a dialog with the Turq. He has a very prejudice opinion of anyone living in Texas. So, I've avoided dialoging with him for a long time. But, you shouldn't be too hard on the Turq - he's over there in a foreign land and obviously there's not much to do. Some people just feel better when they have someone to talk to. I certainly don't and also see no reason whatever for others to bother about the rubbish and games he is playing here on FFL. Just leave him alone to heal. Just leave him alone to troll.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Richard J. Williams [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: nab wrote: I simply don't get it; why on earth is anyone taking what this Turk writes, who is so obviously disturbed, seriously ? It's been years since I had a dialog with the Turq. He has a very prejudice opinion of anyone living in Texas. So, I've avoided dialoging with him for a long time. But, you shouldn't be too hard on the Turq - he's over there in a foreign land and obviously there's not much to do. Some people just feel better when they have someone to talk to. I certainly don't and also see no reason whatever for others to bother about the rubbish and games he is playing here on FFL. Just leave him alone to heal. Just leave him alone to troll. He's a potbellied, tired looking man past his prime who does not know what to do with his life, who hates his past and has no Present life apart from scraping by, presenting an imaginary understanding of Buddhist knowledge, sitting alone in bars somewhere sending off 50 long posts full of nothing to FFL every week. You are right, he deserves everybodys sympathy. Or contempt.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
It's all about the Purity of the Teaching. If eclectic behaviour is tolerated, then it could get to the point where an introductory lecture on TM is coming from somebody who benefited from a variety of traditions, techniques, tools or teachers... and The Purity, at that point, could easily be watered down with a quotation from the course in miracles, or a reference to the I Ching. Also, if somebody was eclectic and they have their stuff together, you got no way to connect that togetherness with the one Effortless Technique. God forbid, what if somebody actually got enlightened as a result of multiple teachings? Then all of those influences would be validated. Not good. There aint no way to prove nothing unless we scare people into becoming robots. Will they get enlightened? No. So what? If people do get enlightened you gotta kick them out ASAP. They might say something conscious to people still chasing the carrot... bad influence. Enlightenment will destroy the purity, we gotta prevent that. MMY knew that people would say, If mantra mediation is so helpful, then please explain why India had so much poverty? The Answer: Yes, India has had mantra mediation for ages. At one time it was extremely effective. Yet, the purity was lost. You can get a mantra for free in India so it has no special value, etc. People in India are allowed to select their mantras, oftentimes with the guidence of a hindu priest. We will will stay with the Saraswati vibration for millions of repetitions. That is the purity. Promoting the Saraswati (grounding creativity) vibration and resist the rest of the pantheon. The typical poverty-stricken seeker in India has multiple teachers. Hinduism allows and encourages this. That's why they're messed up. The paranoia and non-tolorence comes from those concerns. Also, he's dealing with college graduates and smart people... the logic had to be tight and flawless. The problem is, that almost nobody has achieved enlightenment from three to four decades of running the Saraswati vibration. And there's no reversal of biological aging. It only took a few years of watching TM-sidhas age to dispell that fantasy. Diet and exercise, are obviously ten times more effective. I want somebody else to post about the million dollar course. I got the story from a friend of the Kaplans... they're biased with a particularly negative assessment of MMY. Here's the short version: You didn't miss anything. Even the accomodations were a bummer. The Kaplans and Ken Kastle have the perception that MMY selected the cheapest hotel in Holland. Less than one star. That was probably part of the point: you should be able to get comfortable anywhere, irregardless of conditions. Regarding enlightenment, MMY explained that it's simple: When you're feeling peaceful and content insider yourself, that's enlightenment. I got the impression that anybody who took this course was very disappointed... I assume that many were finally able to get a clue, and start detaching.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, gullible fool [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I know of a governor who got banned because he was overheard talking about Ravi Shankar in the dining hall and a person who worked in the course office overheard and called him in for the inquisition. This after he retired from his assistant professorship in his early 50s in order to round on CCP for life. He was able to get back into the dome a few months later, but was unsure enough of his future with the TMO during those months that he looked into leaving ff and moving in with his sister in Florida. I think the bottom line in this discussion is that two people who have never been TM teachers, have never lived in Fairfield and been subject to these Inquisitions, and for that matter have never done diddleysquat for MMY or the TM move- ment in their entire lives are saying that it's OK for the TM movement to make lifestyle demands. After all, it's not *their* lifestyle that is being impacted. People who make excuses for tyrants have rarely experienced tyranny themselves. Please remember, no matter how much doubletalk is thrown out, that what these two people are essentially saying is that the TM movement is RIGHT in saying that seeing any other spiritual teacher is a crime punishable by banishment. They'll try to dazzle you with nitpicky argu- ments and distractions, but that's really the stance they're taking. They're *defending* the people who think they have the right to control other people's lives.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Michael James Flatley [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It's all about the Purity of the Teaching. If eclectic behaviour is tolerated, then it could get to the point where an introductory lecture on TM is coming from somebody who benefited from a variety of traditions, techniques, tools or teachers... and The Purity, at that point, could easily be watered down with a quotation from the course in miracles, or a reference to the I Ching. Also, if somebody was eclectic and they have their stuff together, you got no way to connect that togetherness with the one Effortless Technique. God forbid, what if somebody actually got enlightened as a result of multiple teachings? Then all of those influences would be validated.Not good. There aint no way to prove nothing unless we scare people into becoming robots. Will they get enlightened? No. So what? If people do get enlightened you gotta kick them out ASAP. They might say something conscious to people still chasing the carrot... bad influence. Enlightenment will destroy the purity, we gotta prevent that. Essentially, I think it's much simpler than that. Maharishi didn't want anyone reading from real spiritual traditions or seeing real spiritual teachers because they'd figure out that he was a bullshit artist from Day One, with no cred- entials, no knowledge other than what he stole from others and mixed together in a pastiche of de-Hinduized Hinduism, and no *clue* as to how to help anyone realize their enlightenment. Throw in a 40-year history of becoming jealous and flying into rages when any of his students or any other teacher (or even the Beatles) got more attention than he did, and you have a far less benevolent set of reasons for his tyrannical policies than the purity of the teaching. I think it would be good (did you notice my TM-speak there :-)) to remember that purity of tradition has been used as an excuse for all sorts of things in the past. Probably the most recent examples were in Nazi Germany. A lot of people there made excuses for the Inquisition squads and for the ethics of denouncing their neighbors to them as well. A lot of people in that environment had as little problem with their neighbors' lives being shattered by this tyrannical intoler- ance as the defenders of the TMO policies here do. After all, *they* toe the line and never think for themselves; why should any- one else do less. Fuck 'em if they don't follow the rules. The problem is with the rules. They are bogus, and indefensible. No human being on earth has the right to tell someone else how to think and who they can see and who they can't, and what they can read and what they can't. And these people are defending that as if it is a perfectly reasonable policy. To provide a little balance, I think that there are a grand total of three people on this forum who actually support and defend the TMO's actions with regard to banning people for seeing other teachers. Two of them have studiously avoided ever participating in the TM movement enough for these policies to ever affect them in any way, and the other person is currently mouthing the TM Party Line while having been declared persona non grata from the TM movement himself. Forget the way they'd LIKE to be seen and the image they would LIKE you to have of them; that is really who they are. Everyone else seems to get it. There IS no excuse for limiting a human being's right to explore spirituality in any form, and for making that exploration a crime punishable by banishment. In *every* instance in human history in which it has appeared it has been a mistake, and an instance of tyranny. Those who support and defend it are supporting and defending tyrants. End of story.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
It's all about the Purity of the Teaching. Purity of the BRAND. One of Maharishi's greatest skills was his intuitive understanding of the value of the brand with its recognizable trademarks. TBs and detractors can both give him his props here. Regarding enlightenment, MMY explained that it's simple: When you're feeling peaceful and content insider yourself, that's enlightenment. The old drawing the circle around the arrow trick! He also tried this move on one of the first 6 month courses before he came out with his new carrot, the siddhis.(misspelled to protect the trademark of course) It goes back to one of my favorite themes. Maharishis was selling peace of mind to young people, but young people don't have much peace of mind, which is a good thing because they need to try a bunch of shit in life to find their way. As we age we get peace of mind because we know what is going on and can relax a bit. I came into TM a happy active person. I enjoyed TM and was active and happy in the movement. I left the movement and am active and happy. Is is genes, upbringing? I don't know. But we all know people in the movement who wouldn't describe their journey that way. And TM didn't change it. Or maybe for some it did. I just know that every center has the people who, no matter how many times you check them, their lives are a mess and they are not happy. I am still reassessing the value of TM. I enjoy it. But then I enjoy everything, I am wired that way. Maharishi sold me a technique that promised the benifits that people get by aging, and sure enough, as I aged I got benifits. I got them with TM and I got them without TM. So if Maharishi really did define-down enlightenment as feeling peaceful and content inside yourself, I would say, I wish you had told me that in the first place before I spent all my time in Europe and India with my eyes closed instead of going out to expand my mind by interacting with the world beyond the inside of my eyelids. I basically missed out on a lot of great food to gain the state of mind I already have. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Michael James Flatley [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It's all about the Purity of the Teaching. If eclectic behaviour is tolerated, then it could get to the point where an introductory lecture on TM is coming from somebody who benefited from a variety of traditions, techniques, tools or teachers... and The Purity, at that point, could easily be watered down with a quotation from the course in miracles, or a reference to the I Ching. Also, if somebody was eclectic and they have their stuff together, you got no way to connect that togetherness with the one Effortless Technique. God forbid, what if somebody actually got enlightened as a result of multiple teachings? Then all of those influences would be validated. Not good. There aint no way to prove nothing unless we scare people into becoming robots. Will they get enlightened? No. So what? If people do get enlightened you gotta kick them out ASAP. They might say something conscious to people still chasing the carrot... bad influence. Enlightenment will destroy the purity, we gotta prevent that. MMY knew that people would say, If mantra mediation is so helpful, then please explain why India had so much poverty? The Answer: Yes, India has had mantra mediation for ages. At one time it was extremely effective. Yet, the purity was lost. You can get a mantra for free in India so it has no special value, etc. People in India are allowed to select their mantras, oftentimes with the guidence of a hindu priest. We will will stay with the Saraswati vibration for millions of repetitions. That is the purity. Promoting the Saraswati (grounding creativity) vibration and resist the rest of the pantheon. The typical poverty-stricken seeker in India has multiple teachers. Hinduism allows and encourages this. That's why they're messed up. The paranoia and non-tolorence comes from those concerns. Also, he's dealing with college graduates and smart people... the logic had to be tight and flawless. The problem is, that almost nobody has achieved enlightenment from three to four decades of running the Saraswati vibration. And there's no reversal of biological aging. It only took a few years of watching TM-sidhas age to dispell that fantasy. Diet and exercise, are obviously ten times more effective. I want somebody else to post about the million dollar course. I got the story from a friend of the Kaplans... they're biased with a particularly negative assessment of MMY. Here's the short version: You didn't miss anything. Even the accomodations were a bummer. The Kaplans and Ken Kastle have the perception that MMY selected the cheapest hotel in Holland. Less than one star. That was probably part of the point: you should be able to get
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
On Aug 6, 2008, at 2:01 AM, Michael James Flatley wrote: --- MMY knew that people would say, If mantra mediation is so helpful, then please explain why India had so much poverty? The Answer: Yes, India has had mantra mediation for ages. At one time it was extremely effective. Yet, the purity was lost. You can get a mantra for free in India so it has no special value, etc. People in India are allowed to select their mantras, oftentimes with the guidence of a hindu priest. We will will stay with the Saraswati vibration for millions of repetitions. That is the purity. Promoting the Saraswati (grounding creativity) vibration and resist the rest of the pantheon. The typical poverty-stricken seeker in India has multiple teachers. Hinduism allows and encourages this. That's why they're messed up. The paranoia and non-tolorence comes from those concerns. Also, he's dealing with college graduates and smart people... the logic had to be tight and flawless. The problem is, that almost nobody has achieved enlightenment from three to four decades of running the Saraswati vibration. And there's no reversal of biological aging. It only took a few years of watching TM-sidhas age to dispell that fantasy. Diet and exercise, are obviously ten times more effective. I want somebody else to post about the million dollar course. I got the story from a friend of the Kaplans... they're biased with a particularly negative assessment of MMY. Or an accurate perception depending on your POV. Since no one else has come forth with details of the enlightenment course, I suspect if you do not share your insights, we'll never hear of it and it won't become part of the public record.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
Curtis wrote: So if Maharishi really did define-down enlightenment as feeling peaceful and content inside yourself, I would say, I wish you had told me that in the first place before I spent all my time in Europe and India with my eyes closed instead of going out to expand my mind by interacting with the world beyond the inside of my eyelids. So, exactly, how many years did you waste? And for what purpose, if you were already happy and active? I mean, why would anyone who is happy and active want to sit on their ass for years if they already had a state of happy and active state of mind? Didn't the Marshy tell you at the beginning that the purpose of TM and TTC was to be happy and active? I basically missed out on a lot of great food to gain the state of mind I already have. This doesn't even make any sense. You must have been sleeping when he told everyone else that TM was all about being happy and active. Go figure.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
Is life in Texas that God-awful to cause one to incessantly reveal one's misery by taunting in the manner displayed here ? --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Richard J. Williams [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Curtis wrote: So if Maharishi really did define-down enlightenment as feeling peaceful and content inside yourself, I would say, I wish you had told me that in the first place before I spent all my time in Europe and India with my eyes closed instead of going out to expand my mind by interacting with the world beyond the inside of my eyelids. So, exactly, how many years did you waste? And for what purpose, if you were already happy and active? I mean, why would anyone who is happy and active want to sit on their ass for years if they already had a state of happy and active state of mind? Didn't the Marshy tell you at the beginning that the purpose of TM and TTC was to be happy and active? I basically missed out on a lot of great food to gain the state of mind I already have. This doesn't even make any sense. You must have been sleeping when he told everyone else that TM was all about being happy and active. Go figure.
RE: [FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of dhamiltony2k5 Sent: Tuesday, August 05, 2008 6:34 PM To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress From e-mail inbox: Is this LB SHRIVER's translation? He said he was going to come out with something like this.. LB didn't do any actual translating, but he gave Paul Mason his GD material.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
mainstream wrote: Is life in Texas that God-awful to cause one to incessantly reveal one's misery by taunting in the manner displayed here ? So, exactly, how many years did YOU waste? Be honest. Curtis wrote: So if Maharishi really did define-down enlightenment as feeling peaceful and content inside yourself, I would say, I wish you had told me that in the first place before I spent all my time in Europe and India with my eyes closed instead of going out to expand my mind by interacting with the world beyond the inside of my eyelids. So, exactly, how many years did you waste? And for what purpose, if you were already happy and active? I mean, why would anyone who is happy and active want to sit on their ass for years if they already had a state of happy and active state of mind? Didn't the Marshy tell you at the beginning that the purpose of TM and TTC was to be happy and active? I basically missed out on a lot of great food to gain the state of mind I already have. This doesn't even make any sense. You must have been sleeping when he told everyone else that TM was all about being happy and active. Go figure.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: snip Maharishi didn't want anyone reading from real spiritual traditions or seeing real spiritual teachers because they'd figure out that he was a bullshit artist from Day One, with no cred- entials, no knowledge other than what he stole from others and mixed together in a pastiche of de-Hinduized Hinduism, and no *clue* as to how to help anyone realize their enlightenment. Oopsie, Barry forgot to add in my opinion. Throw in a 40-year history of becoming jealous and flying into rages when any of his students or any other teacher (or even the Beatles) got more attention than he did, and you have a far less benevolent set of reasons for his tyrannical policies than the purity of the teaching. Every time? Really? Barry has a way of knowing everything MMY did and said even when he hadn't been near the movement for decades? I think it would be good (did you notice my TM-speak there :-)) to remember that purity of tradition has been used as an excuse for all sorts of things in the past. Probably the most recent examples were in Nazi Germany. Sez Barry, invoking Godwin's Law, the last resort of someone who knows they have a shaky argument. A lot of people there made excuses for the Inquisition squads and for the ethics of denouncing their neighbors to them as well. A lot of people in that environment had as little problem with their neighbors' lives being shattered by this tyrannical intoler- ance as the defenders of the TMO policies here do. There's just a *wee* bit of difference, actually. Millions of people were *slaughtered* as a result in the case of the Nazis. Trivializing the Holocaust, as Barry does here, by equating it with something vastly less serious is the surest way to make room for its happening again. After all, *they* toe the line and never think for themselves; why should any- one else do less. Fuck 'em if they don't follow the rules. Lawson and I toe the line and follow the rules?? Jeez, poor Barry. The problem is with the rules. They are bogus, and indefensible. No human being on earth has the right to tell someone else how to think and who they can see and who they can't, and what they can read and what they can't. And these people are defending that as if it is a perfectly reasonable policy. Neither Lawson nor I, of course, is defending such a thing. One more time: What we're defending is the right of an organization to require its official representatives not to engage in public behavior that casts the organization in what the organization considers a bad light. To provide a little balance, I think that there are a grand total of three people on this forum who actually support and defend the TMO's actions with regard to banning people for seeing other teachers. Two of them have studiously avoided ever participating in the TM movement enough for these policies to ever affect them in any way, Not true, as Barry knows, as I pointed out in my earlier post. and the other person is currently mouthing the TM Party Line while having been declared persona non grata from the TM movement himself. Nabby has denied this categorically, and Barry has no evidence for it whatsoever, so we can assume he's just lying here. Forget the way they'd LIKE to be seen and the image they would LIKE you to have of them; that is really who they are. Translation: Barry would like Lawson, Nabby, and myself to be seen as his image of us, not as who we really are. Everyone else seems to get it. There IS no excuse for limiting a human being's right to explore spirituality in any form, and for making that exploration a crime punishable by banishment. In *every* instance in human history in which it has appeared it has been a mistake, and an instance of tyranny. Those who support and defend it are supporting and defending tyrants. End of story. I wish I thought Barry knows he's engaging in the wildest hyperbole, but I don't. He is absolutely convinced that his fantasies are reality, just as he described so well recently: When this syndrome appears in people who may NOT have a 'following,' I don't know what to think. WHAT on earth is going on there? As I said, I am not convinced that they are consciously lying to people; I just think that they no longer have a strong enough connec- tion with reality to realize when they're overstepping its bounds. - My plan is to lay low, and say nothing either to [Judy] or about her. I may or may not succeed at this... --Barry Wright, 7/23/08
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
On Aug 6, 2008, at 11:21 AM, authfriend wrote: Translation: Barry would like Lawson, Nabby, and myself to be seen as his image of us, not as who we really are. Everyone else seems to get it. There IS no excuse for limiting a human being's right to explore spirituality in any form, and for making that exploration a crime punishable by banishment. In *every* instance in human history in which it has appeared it has been a mistake, and an instance of tyranny. Those who support and defend it are supporting and defending tyrants. End of story. I wish I thought Barry knows he's engaging in the wildest hyperbole, but I don't. He is absolutely convinced that his fantasies are reality, just as he described so well recently: When this syndrome appears in people who may NOT have a 'following,' I don't know what to think. WHAT on earth is going on there? As I said, I am not convinced that they are consciously lying to people; I just think that they no longer have a strong enough connec- tion with reality to realize when they're overstepping its bounds. - My plan is to lay low, and say nothing either to [Judy] or about her. I may or may not succeed at this... --Barry Wright, 7/23/08 Judy, You've finally convinced me...Barry has never been right, never will be, and can only spout lies, and not even very good ones at that. Therefore, I hereby decree that Barry Wright be known from this day on as Barry Wrong. Case closed. Sal
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
Sal wrote: You've finally convinced me...Barry has never been right, never will be, and can only spout lies, and not even very good ones at that. Finally, after four years, you see the light! Therefore, I hereby decree that Barry Wright be known from this day on as Barry Wrong. Or, Shoki, or Uncle Tantra, or TurquoiseB.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Judy, You've finally convinced me...Barry has never been right, never will be, and can only spout lies, and not even very good ones at that. On the other hand, what Barry seems to be very good at is playing with his wind-up toys. A few generalized comments, and the toys go crazy and dance around doing exactly what he wanted them to. He's especially good at making the wind-up toys go crazy trying to get him to respond to their dances, and then never responding. Winds them up even more. Therefore, I hereby decree that Barry Wright be known from this day on as Barry Wrong. Case closed. I can live with that. You can get just as many laughs in bars introducing yourself to women as Mr. Wrong.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_reply@ and the other person is currently mouthing the TM Party Line while having been declared persona non grata from the TM movement himself. Nabby has denied this categorically, and Barry has no evidence for it whatsoever, so we can assume he's just lying here. I simply don't get it; why on earth is anyone taking what this Turk writes, who is so obviously disturbed, seriously ? I certainly don't and also see no reason whatever for others to bother about the rubbish and games he is playing here on FFL. Just leave him alone to heal.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Richard J. Williams [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Curtis wrote: So if Maharishi really did define-down enlightenment as feeling peaceful and content inside yourself, I would say, I wish you had told me that in the first place before I spent all my time in Europe and India with my eyes closed instead of going out to expand my mind by interacting with the world beyond the inside of my eyelids. So, exactly, how many years did you waste? None, I had a good time behind my eyelids, I just wish I had done more site seeing. And for what purpose, if you were already happy and active? For the purpose of having enjoyable experiences behind my eyelids. I mean, why would anyone who is happy and active want to sit on their ass for years if they already had a state of happy and active state of mind? Because enlightenment was pitched as more than that. Didn't the Marshy tell you at the beginning that the purpose of TM and TTC was to be happy and active? It was one of the purposes. I basically missed out on a lot of great food to gain the state of mind I already have. This doesn't even make any sense. We weren't allowed to eat in local restaurants where I would eat local food. You must have been sleeping when he told everyone else that TM was all about being happy and active. Go figure. That was not all it was about according to Maharishis which was the point of my post which you, as usual, missed,
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mainstream20016 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Is life in Texas that God-awful to cause one to incessantly reveal one's misery by taunting in the manner displayed here ? Good call Main. I'm gunna have to go with a yes on this one based on the consistency of Richard running this program. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Richard J. Williams willytex@ wrote: Curtis wrote: So if Maharishi really did define-down enlightenment as feeling peaceful and content inside yourself, I would say, I wish you had told me that in the first place before I spent all my time in Europe and India with my eyes closed instead of going out to expand my mind by interacting with the world beyond the inside of my eyelids. So, exactly, how many years did you waste? And for what purpose, if you were already happy and active? I mean, why would anyone who is happy and active want to sit on their ass for years if they already had a state of happy and active state of mind? Didn't the Marshy tell you at the beginning that the purpose of TM and TTC was to be happy and active? I basically missed out on a lot of great food to gain the state of mind I already have. This doesn't even make any sense. You must have been sleeping when he told everyone else that TM was all about being happy and active. Go figure.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
Therefore, I hereby decree that Barry Wright be known from this day on as Barry Wrong. Case closed. I can live with that. You can get just as many laughs in bars introducing yourself to women as Mr. Wrong. I was going to use... I have a 'member' named Mr. Wright. Moderator privilege, you know. ...but mountain doesn't move! --- On Wed, 8/6/08, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: From: TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Date: Wednesday, August 6, 2008, 1:02 PM --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Judy, You've finally convinced me...Barry has never been right, never will be, and can only spout lies, and not even very good ones at that. On the other hand, what Barry seems to be very good at is playing with his wind-up toys. A few generalized comments, and the toys go crazy and dance around doing exactly what he wanted them to. He's especially good at making the wind-up toys go crazy trying to get him to respond to their dances, and then never responding. Winds them up even more. Therefore, I hereby decree that Barry Wright be known from this day on as Barry Wrong. Case closed. I can live with that. You can get just as many laughs in bars introducing yourself to women as Mr. Wrong. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!'Yahoo! Groups Links
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine salsunshine@ wrote: Judy, You've finally convinced me...Barry has never been right, never will be, and can only spout lies, and not even very good ones at that. On the other hand, what Barry seems to be very good at is playing with his wind-up toys. Actually, Willytex has Barry beat by miles. A few generalized comments, and the toys go crazy and dance around doing exactly what he wanted them to. He's especially good at making the wind-up toys go crazy trying to get him to respond to their dances, and then never responding. Winds them up even more. Barry on solipsism, May 2008: I don't see that much difference between a baby crying for the tit or Aleister Crowley saying, 'I have never grown out of the infantile belief that the universe was made for me to suck.' Solipsism is a pampered shut-in's belief system. You can only believe in it if you don't interact with the world much, and then primarily in your imagination. Fairly well- to-do, pampered people who have protected themselves from the world around them ever affecting them much can come to believe that they create it. But one quick shoto strike to the solar plexus, and the truth of interdependent origination is made clear. :-) Time for somebody to give Barry a quick shoto strike to the solar plexus...
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
This is Judy's way of saying, Ooops. I've just been suckered into defending illegal behavior on the part of the TM organization. As I said before: On the other hand, what Barry seems to be very good at is playing with his wind-up toys. A few generalized comments, and the toys go crazy and dance around doing exactly what he wanted them to. My lawyer friends told me about the illegality of the TM policies shortly after Lawson made his first post. This has all been one long setup. I knew that she wouldn't be able to resist. Fade to black. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_reply@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine salsunshine@ wrote: Judy, You've finally convinced me...Barry has never been right, never will be, and can only spout lies, and not even very good ones at that. On the other hand, what Barry seems to be very good at is playing with his wind-up toys. Actually, Willytex has Barry beat by miles. A few generalized comments, and the toys go crazy and dance around doing exactly what he wanted them to. He's especially good at making the wind-up toys go crazy trying to get him to respond to their dances, and then never responding. Winds them up even more. Barry on solipsism, May 2008: I don't see that much difference between a baby crying for the tit or Aleister Crowley saying, 'I have never grown out of the infantile belief that the universe was made for me to suck.' Solipsism is a pampered shut-in's belief system. You can only believe in it if you don't interact with the world much, and then primarily in your imagination. Fairly well- to-do, pampered people who have protected themselves from the world around them ever affecting them much can come to believe that they create it. But one quick shoto strike to the solar plexus, and the truth of interdependent origination is made clear. :-) Time for somebody to give Barry a quick shoto strike to the solar plexus...
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This is Judy's way of saying, Ooops. I've just been suckered into defending illegal behavior on the part of the TM organization. Actually, this is Barry's way of saying, Ooops. I don't know whether the employees in question were salespeople; I don't know whether what the companies did would be illegal if they were. It never occurred to me to ask, because I'm incapable of making logical distinctions and anyway all I wanted was an excuse to bash Judy and Lawson. As I said before: On the other hand, what Barry seems to be very good at is playing with his wind-up toys. A few generalized comments, and the toys go crazy and dance around doing exactly what he wanted them to. My lawyer friends told me about the illegality of the TM policies shortly after Lawson made his first post. This has all been one long setup. I knew that she wouldn't be able to resist. Fade to black. Solipsism becoming more extreme by the second.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, gullible fool fflmod@ wrote: I know of a governor who got banned because he was overheard talking about Ravi Shankar in the dining hall and a person who worked in the course office overheard and called him in for the inquisition. This after he retired from his�assistant professorship in his early 50s in order to round on CCP for life. He was able to get back into the dome a few months later, but was unsure enough of his future with the TMO during those months that he looked into leaving ff and moving in with his sister in Florida.�� I think the bottom line in this discussion is that two people who have never been TM teachers, have never lived in Fairfield and been subject to these Inquisitions, and for that matter have never done diddleysquat for MMY or the TM move- ment in their entire lives are saying that it's OK for the TM movement to make lifestyle demands. After all, it's not *their* lifestyle that is being impacted. People who make excuses for tyrants have rarely experienced tyranny themselves. Please remember, no matter how much doubletalk is thrown out, that what these two people are essentially saying is that the TM movement is RIGHT in saying that seeing any other spiritual teacher is a crime punishable by banishment. They'll try to dazzle you with nitpicky argu- ments and distractions, but that's really the stance they're taking. They're *defending* the people who think they have the right to control other people's lives. Interesting take on my response to what was originally said. Lawson
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine salsunshine@ wrote: Judy, You've finally convinced me...Barry has never been right, never will be, and can only spout lies, and not even very good ones at that. On the other hand, what Barry seems to be very good at is playing with his wind-up toys. A few generalized comments, and the toys go crazy and dance around doing exactly what he wanted them to. When you pull wings off flies, do they run i funny circles too? He's especially good at making the wind-up toys go crazy trying to get him to respond to their dances, and then never responding. Winds them up even more. No human is ever harmed by pulling wings off flies, eh? Therefore, I hereby decree that Barry Wright be known from this day on as Barry Wrong. Case closed. I can live with that. You can get just as many laughs in bars introducing yourself to women as Mr. Wrong. Women often have a remarkable capacity for self-destruction, just as men do. Lawson
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
Everyone else seems to get it. There IS no excuse for limiting a human being's right to explore spirituality in any form, and for making that exploration a crime punishable by banishment. In *every* instance in human history in which it has appeared it has been a mistake, and an instance of tyranny. Those who support and defend it are supporting and defending tyrants. End of story. Thanks Turk. The story has ended and we are in the early stages of the aftermath, with diverse points of view. MUM, with an all time high of 1200 students will keep the wheels turning. And the nephew should have $900 million cash to promote the TMO in India. Aftermath. Each year, some number of robots get sufficiently frustrated with the tyrany to throw in the towell... We're in the after time. Some things could develop, and the story could, over the next few decades gradually congeal as more of the leaders default. Once the die-hards from the '70s are all in their seventies, more disclosure will be presented, and a more complete picture will emerge. The Saraswati vibration does have an influence, and possibly... a huge benefit to the planet. We don't know. We can't measure this. We can only observe the well being of those who are sticking it out for there entire adult life, and perhaps with that, make some grounded assessments, or at least statistics. Kieth Wallace has been practicing 45+ years. If he had selected another set of tools, we don't know where he would be... could be more or less, in well being, and expanded awareness. Technology of Consciousness. That sound bite could infiltrate the mainstream by 2020, and if they ever choose to drop the mantra price to around $100 there could be another wave of interest in the future. Or things could fizzle out gradually, as people become conscious and self-reliant. We'll see. I really like the Guru Dev quote. It's affirming. It's the type of thing I like to hear from a spiritual teacher: To each, their own... it kicks ass. If indeed, MMY's behaviour was tyrannical, more disclosure of the particulars from reliable sources could be helpful to those contemplating a devotional path, with his system as the focus of their devotion. -MJF
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: More mail from the Inbox: What a stupid trip the leadership here laid on everyone for so long. I was in the Dome one night for a meeting roughly 10 years ago. Around that time I had gone in earlier for program and there was a very big sign at the entrance saying DON'T GO SEE THIS KARUNAMAYI!. The meeting was not on this topic, but it did come up. Hagelin, Keith, and others were there. Someone asked about the other guru question, since countless people had been blackballed or forced out of the movement quite unnecessarily. I heard Hagelin say the following with my own ears This is something WE (the folks on the stage) came up with. It did not come from MMY or GD. But sometimes it *did* come from MMY. *Directly* from him. On my TTC we had whole lectures on how we were NEVER to be seen attending any talks by other spiritual teachers, or reading their books. The rap (or wrap...an attempt to program or control) went, If one of my teachers is seen at someone else's centers or lectures, that implies that my teachers feel that they have something to *learn* from this person, something they cannot get at home in the TM organization. It implies that TM is not the highest path. Well, it isn't. It's just another path. That Maharishi didn't want any of his students to know this is the issue, and always was. The people putting up that sign weren't working on their own; they were doing what they had been taught to do.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_reply@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5 dhamiltony2k5@ wrote: More mail from the Inbox: What a stupid trip the leadership here laid on everyone for so long. I was in the Dome one night for a meeting roughly 10 years ago. Around that time I had gone in earlier for program and there was a very big sign at the entrance saying DON'T GO SEE THIS KARUNAMAYI!. The meeting was not on this topic, but it did come up. Hagelin, Keith, and others were there. Someone asked about the other guru question, since countless people had been blackballed or forced out of the movement quite unnecessarily. I heard Hagelin say the following with my own ears This is something WE (the folks on the stage) came up with. It did not come from MMY or GD. But sometimes it *did* come from MMY. *Directly* from him. On my TTC we had whole lectures on how we were NEVER to be seen attending any talks by other spiritual teachers, or reading their books. The rap (or wrap...an attempt to program or control) went, If one of my teachers is seen at someone else's centers or lectures, that implies that my teachers feel that they have something to *learn* from this person, something they cannot get at home in the TM organization. It implies that TM is not the highest path. Well, it isn't. It's just another path. That Maharishi didn't want any of his students to know this is the issue, and always was. The people putting up that sign weren't working on their own; they were doing what they had been taught to do. But that's a TM teacher instruction, which is a separate issue from the thing about Sidhas at Fairfield visiting other gurus. You're being an apologist again, Lawson. The point is that this instruction is inappropriate in ANY context, when said BY anyone, when said TO anyone. Neither Maharishi nor any of his toadies have or have ever had the right to make such demands on ANYONE, be they TM teacher, Citizen Siddha, or Bozo the Clown. *Telling* someone who they can see and who they can't is the issue. *Submitting* to someone who is telling you who you can see and who you can't is the issue. The fact that you CAN make excuses for someone (ANYONE) telling another human being who they can see and who they can't is the issue. Forget about spirituality or higher evolution or advanced states of conscious- ness or any of that Woo Woo shit. Being able to excuse such behavior on the part of jealous tyrants indicates an almost complete lack of character and integrity in my book.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig LEnglish5@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_reply@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5 dhamiltony2k5@ wrote: More mail from the Inbox: What a stupid trip the leadership here laid on everyone for so long. I was in the Dome one night for a meeting roughly 10 years ago. Around that time I had gone in earlier for program and there was a very big sign at the entrance saying DON'T GO SEE THIS KARUNAMAYI!. The meeting was not on this topic, but it did come up. Hagelin, Keith, and others were there. Someone asked about the other guru question, since countless people had been blackballed or forced out of the movement quite unnecessarily. I heard Hagelin say the following with my own ears This is something WE (the folks on the stage) came up with. It did not come from MMY or GD. But sometimes it *did* come from MMY. *Directly* from him. On my TTC we had whole lectures on how we were NEVER to be seen attending any talks by other spiritual teachers, or reading their books. The rap (or wrap...an attempt to program or control) went, If one of my teachers is seen at someone else's centers or lectures, that implies that my teachers feel that they have something to *learn* from this person, something they cannot get at home in the TM organization. It implies that TM is not the highest path. Well, it isn't. It's just another path. That Maharishi didn't want any of his students to know this is the issue, and always was. The people putting up that sign weren't working on their own; they were doing what they had been taught to do. But that's a TM teacher instruction, which is a separate issue from the thing about Sidhas at Fairfield visiting other gurus. You're being an apologist again, Lawson. Oh bull. The point is that this instruction is inappropriate in ANY context, when said BY anyone, when said TO anyone. Bull again. Neither Maharishi nor any of his toadies have or have ever had the right to make such demands on ANYONE, be they TM teacher, Citizen Siddha, or Bozo the Clown. Thrice bullshit. The rationale was given explicitly and anyone who disagreed with it quite literaly had no business being a TM teacher because they were claiming quite clearly that they were certain that TM was the hghest path and if they didn't agree with what they were saying, they had no business saying it. MMY was simply establishing how to walk the walk in the public eye. *Telling* someone who they can see and who they can't is the issue. *Submitting* to someone who is telling you who you can see and who you can't is the issue. The fact that you CAN make excuses for someone (ANYONE) telling another human being who they can see and who they can't is the issue. In the context of being a TM teacher? Not at all. If they didn't want to play the game, they could hang up the shingle and do whatever they wantedm in public or not. Forget about spirituality or higher evolution or advanced states of conscious- ness or any of that Woo Woo shit. Being able to excuse such behavior on the part of jealous tyrants indicates an almost complete lack of character and integrity in my book. Your projection reminds me of John McCain's calling Barack Obama racist for mocking McCain's own use of Obama's picture on a $100 dollar bill. Fact is, MMY set up specific guidelines for the public behavior of TM teachers who wanted to be TM teachers in good standing with the organization. If they didn't like the guidelines, they didn't have to participate in being a TM teacher. Lawson
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
But that's a TM teacher instruction, which is a separate issue from the thing about Sidhas at Fairfield visiting other gurus. You're being an apologist again, Lawson. Oh bull. The point is that this instruction is inappropriate in ANY context, when said BY anyone, when said TO anyone. Bull again. Neither Maharishi nor any of his toadies have or have ever had the right to make such demands on ANYONE, be they TM teacher, Citizen Siddha, or Bozo the Clown. Thrice bullshit. The rationale was given explicitly and anyone who disagreed with it quite literaly had no business being a TM teacher because they were claiming quite clearly that they were certain that TM was the hghest path and if they didn't agree with what they were saying, they had no business saying it. MMY was simply establishing how to walk the walk in the public eye. *Telling* someone who they can see and who they can't is the issue. *Submitting* to someone who is telling you who you can see and who you can't is the issue. The fact that you CAN make excuses for someone (ANYONE) telling another human being who they can see and who they can't is the issue. In the context of being a TM teacher? Not at all. If they didn't want to play the game, they could hang up the shingle and do whatever they wantedm in public or not. Forget about spirituality or higher evolution or advanced states of conscious- ness or any of that Woo Woo shit. Being able to excuse such behavior on the part of jealous tyrants indicates an almost complete lack of character and integrity in my book. Your projection reminds me of John McCain's calling Barack Obama racist for mocking McCain's own use of Obama's picture on a $100 dollar bill. Fact is, MMY set up specific guidelines for the public behavior of TM teachers who wanted to be TM teachers in good standing with the organization. If they didn't like the guidelines, they didn't have to participate in being a TM teacher. Lawson, I'm not going to get into this with you. Did you notice the in my book part in what I wrote earlier, and below? That's the same as saying in my opinion. My opinion hasn't changed as a result of you throwing a hissy fit and screaming Bull. And it's not likely to. You are obviously COMFORTABLE with someone having the right to tell you what to do and who you can see and who you can't and (essentially) what you are permitted to think and what you are not (because you are not allowed access to any heretical ideas). I am not, and will never be. In ANY context, but especially in a spiritual context, which is theoretically supposed to be about helping some- one to liberation. One does not achieve that goal by imprisoning people in my opinion. Your mileage may vary, and obviously does. I stand on my original statement: Being able to excuse such behavior on the part of jealous tyrants indicates an almost complete lack of character and integrity in my book. End of discussion.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [...] Your mileage may vary, and obviously does. I stand on my original statement: Being able to excuse such behavior on the part of jealous tyrants indicates an almost complete lack of character and integrity in my book. End of discussion. Eh, in MY book, throwing out characterizations like an almost complete lack of character and integrity is definitely meant to provoke a hostile reaction. You then calling my reaction a hissy fit when in fact, twas provoked by your deliberately antagonizing tone, is pure Rovian sophistry, reminiscent of McCain's current campaign strategy against Obama, as I already pointed out. Lawson
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_reply@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5 dhamiltony2k5@ wrote: More mail from the Inbox: What a stupid trip the leadership here laid on everyone for so long. I was in the Dome one night for a meeting roughly 10 years ago. Around that time I had gone in earlier for program and there was a very big sign at the entrance saying DON'T GO SEE THIS KARUNAMAYI!. The meeting was not on this topic, but it did come up. Hagelin, Keith, and others were there. Someone asked about the other guru question, since countless people had been blackballed or forced out of the movement quite unnecessarily. I heard Hagelin say the following with my own ears This is something WE (the folks on the stage) came up with. It did not come from MMY or GD. But sometimes it *did* come from MMY. *Directly* from him. On my TTC we had whole lectures on how we were NEVER to be seen attending any talks by other spiritual teachers, or reading their books. The rap (or wrap...an attempt to program or control) went, If one of my teachers is seen at someone else's centers or lectures, that implies that my teachers feel that they have something to *learn* from this person, something they cannot get at home in the TM organization. It implies that TM is not the highest path. Well, it isn't. It's just another path. That Maharishi didn't want any of his students to know this is the issue, and always was. The people putting up that sign weren't working on their own; they were doing what they had been taught to do. But that's a TM teacher instruction, which is a separate issue from the thing about Sidhas at Fairfield visiting other gurus. How can it be a seperate issue? It amounts to the same thing and obviously comes from the same place. I know someone who won't even tell me what NLP course he went on in case he gets banned from the dome. Who'd want to live in a climate of fear like that? Lawson
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
of the movement quite unnecessarily. I heard Hagelin say the following with my own ears This is something WE (the folks on the stage) came up with. It did not come from MMY or GD. But sometimes it *did* come from MMY. *Directly* from him. On my TTC we had whole lectures on how we were NEVER to be seen attending any talks by other spiritual teachers, or reading their books. The rap (or wrap...an attempt to program or control) went, If one of my teachers is seen at someone else's centers or lectures, that implies that my teachers feel that they have something to *learn* from this person, something they cannot get at home in the TM organization. It implies that TM is not the highest path. Well, it isn't. It's just another path. That Maharishi didn't want any of his students to know this is the issue, and always was. The people putting up that sign weren't working on their own; they were doing what they had been taught to do. But that's a TM teacher instruction, which is a separate issue from the thing about Sidhas at Fairfield visiting other gurus. How can it be a seperate issue? It amounts to the same thing and obviously comes from the same place. I think what Lawson is proposing is called the Wal-Mart Defense. He's essentially saying that he agrees with their right to send out strong memos and hold mandatory meetings with their employees telling them to vote Republican, and implying heavily that they are jeapardizing their jobs if they do not. Or is that another separate issue? :-) Somehow I think not. I know someone who won't even tell me what NLP course he went on in case he gets banned from the dome. Who'd want to live in a climate of fear like that? Lawson's stance seems to be that he would not only be willing to live in such a climate of fear, but that he is willing to step up to the plate and defend the fear creators' right to create and perpetuate such an environment. And, it is important to note, he's taking this stance without ever once having walked the walk of his own talk. Unless I am mistaken, he never became a TM teacher (and thus has no earthly idea the pressures and lifestyle demands that were placed on them) and he's never lived in Fairfield (and thus had any first-hand experience with what it feels like TO live in such a climate of fear). All he seems to be able to do is repeat over and over that Wal-Mart/the TMO has the absolute right to tell its employees how to live. If the employees don't like it, they can quit. I'm sorry, Lawson, but that IS what you're saying. And it IS called being an apologist.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5 dhamiltony2k5@ wrote: More mail from the Inbox: What a stupid trip the leadership here laid on everyone for so long. I was in the Dome one night for a meeting roughly 10 years ago. Around that time I had gone in earlier for program and there was a very big sign at the entrance saying DON'T GO SEE THIS KARUNAMAYI!. The meeting was not on this topic, but it did come up. Hagelin, Keith, and others were there. Someone asked about the other guru question, since countless people had been blackballed or forced out of the movement quite unnecessarily. I heard Hagelin say the following with my own ears This is something WE (the folks on the stage) came up with. It did not come from MMY or GD. But sometimes it *did* come from MMY. *Directly* from him. On my TTC we had whole lectures on how we were NEVER to be seen attending any talks by other spiritual teachers, or reading their books. The rap (or wrap...an attempt to program or control) went, If one of my teachers is seen at someone else's centers or lectures, that implies that my teachers feel that they have something to *learn* from this person, something they cannot get at home in the TM organization. It implies that TM is not the highest path. Well, it isn't. It's just another path. That Maharishi didn't want any of his students to know this is the issue, and always was. The people putting up that sign weren't working on their own; they were doing what they had been taught to do. But that's a TM teacher instruction, which is a separate issue from the thing about Sidhas at Fairfield visiting other gurus. Lawson
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
--- On Tue, 8/5/08, Hugo [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: From: Hugo [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Date: Tuesday, August 5, 2008, 6:52 AM --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_reply@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5 dhamiltony2k5@ wrote: More mail from the Inbox: What a stupid trip the leadership here laid on everyone for so long. I was in the Dome one night for a meeting roughly 10 years ago. Around that time I had gone in earlier for program and there was a very big sign at the entrance saying DON'T GO SEE THIS KARUNAMAYI!. The meeting was not on this topic, but it did come up. Hagelin, Keith, and others were there. Someone asked about the other guru question, since countless people had been blackballed or forced out of the movement quite unnecessarily. I heard Hagelin say the following with my own ears This is something WE (the folks on the stage) came up with. It did not come from MMY or GD. But sometimes it *did* come from MMY. *Directly* from him. On my TTC we had whole lectures on how we were NEVER to be seen attending any talks by other spiritual teachers, or reading their books. The rap (or wrap...an attempt to program or control) went, If one of my teachers is seen at someone else's centers or lectures, that implies that my teachers feel that they have something to *learn* from this person, something they cannot get at home in the TM organization. It implies that TM is not the highest path. Well, it isn't. It's just another path. That Maharishi didn't want any of his students to know this is the issue, and always was. The people putting up that sign weren't working on their own; they were doing what they had been taught to do. But that's a TM teacher instruction, which is a separate issue from the thing about Sidhas at Fairfield visiting other gurus. How can it be a seperate issue? It amounts to the same thing and obviously comes from the same place. I know someone who won't even tell me what NLP course he went on in case he gets banned from the dome. Who'd want to live in a climate of fear like that? Lawson The benefit of all this is that you are forced to be strong and self-referral when you seek spiritual teachers. This is a test that only the strong pass. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!'Yahoo! Groups Links
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: of the movement quite unnecessarily. I heard Hagelin say the following with my own ears This is something WE (the folks on the stage) came up with. It did not come from MMY or GD. But sometimes it *did* come from MMY. *Directly* from him. On my TTC we had whole lectures on how we were NEVER to be seen attending any talks by other spiritual teachers, or reading their books. The rap (or wrap...an attempt to program or control) went, If one of my teachers is seen at someone else's centers or lectures, that implies that my teachers feel that they have something to *learn* from this person, something they cannot get at home in the TM organization. It implies that TM is not the highest path. Well, it isn't. It's just another path. That Maharishi didn't want any of his students to know this is the issue, and always was. The people putting up that sign weren't working on their own; they were doing what they had been taught to do. But that's a TM teacher instruction, which is a separate issue from the thing about Sidhas at Fairfield visiting other gurus. How can it be a seperate issue? It amounts to the same thing and obviously comes from the same place. Lawson explained why it's a separate issue in a later post. I think what Lawson is proposing is called the Wal-Mart Defense. He's essentially saying that he agrees with their right to send out strong memos and hold mandatory meetings with their employees telling them to vote Republican, and implying heavily that they are jeapardizing their jobs if they do not. Or is that another separate issue? :-) Somehow I think not. Actually it's a thoroughly bogus analogy. A more appropriate one would be telling managers that they mustn't be seen shopping at Target. Note as well that even in Barry's account, the prohibition was against being *seen* doing any of these things. It had to do with the public image of the TMO. I know someone who won't even tell me what NLP course he went on in case he gets banned from the dome. Who'd want to live in a climate of fear like that? Lawson's stance seems to be that he would not only be willing to live in such a climate of fear, but that he is willing to step up to the plate and defend the fear creators' right to create and perpetuate such an environment. With regard to TM teachers, it isn't a climate of fear. That's a thought-stopper. And note that Barry himself was perfectly willing to live with MMY's instructions. snip All he seems to be able to do is repeat over and over No, he hasn't been repeating it over and over. He explained exactly what he meant and why, but Barry doesn't want to address his logic. that Wal-Mart/the TMO has the absolute right to tell its employees how to live. If the employees don't like it, they can quit. Basically, that's true: If you represent a company, the company gets to tell you that if you want to keep your job, you don't go around doing things that reflect badly on the company or its product. Perfectly normal. Barry's faux outrage here is simply an excuse to bash Lawson. I'm sorry, Lawson, but that IS what you're saying. And it IS called being an apologist. Apologist is used by people like Barry as if it were a pejorative, but of course it isn't. Barry himself is an apologist for all kinds of things.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: But that's a TM teacher instruction, which is a separate issue from the thing about Sidhas at Fairfield visiting other gurus. You're being an apologist again, Lawson. Oh bull. The point is that this instruction is inappropriate in ANY context, when said BY anyone, when said TO anyone. Bull again. Neither Maharishi nor any of his toadies have or have ever had the right to make such demands on ANYONE, be they TM teacher, Citizen Siddha, or Bozo the Clown. Thrice bullshit. The rationale was given explicitly and anyone who disagreed with it quite literaly had no business being a TM teacher because they were claiming quite clearly that they were certain that TM was the hghest path and if they didn't agree with what they were saying, they had no business saying it. MMY was simply establishing how to walk the walk in the public eye. *Telling* someone who they can see and who they can't is the issue. *Submitting* to someone who is telling you who you can see and who you can't is the issue. The fact that you CAN make excuses for someone (ANYONE) telling another human being who they can see and who they can't is the issue. In the context of being a TM teacher? Not at all. If they didn't want to play the game, they could hang up the shingle and do whatever they wantedm in public or not. Forget about spirituality or higher evolution or advanced states of conscious- ness or any of that Woo Woo shit. Being able to excuse such behavior on the part of jealous tyrants indicates an almost complete lack of character and integrity in my book. Your projection reminds me of John McCain's calling Barack Obama racist for mocking McCain's own use of Obama's picture on a $100 dollar bill. Fact is, MMY set up specific guidelines for the public behavior of TM teachers who wanted to be TM teachers in good standing with the organization. If they didn't like the guidelines, they didn't have to participate in being a TM teacher. Lawson, I'm not going to get into this with you. Of course Barry's not going to get into it. Lawson is making perfect sense, and Barry, as usual, is not. Did you notice the in my book part in what I wrote earlier, and below? That's the same as saying in my opinion. My opinion hasn't changed as a result of you throwing a hissy fit and screaming Bull. And it's not likely to. Lawson didn't throw a hissy fit, and he didn't scream. He pointed out that Barry's opinion made no sense and backed it up with a thoroughly logical argument, which Barry doesn't dare try to address. My mind is made up, don't confuse me with the facts. You are obviously COMFORTABLE with someone having the right to tell you what to do and who you can see and who you can't and (essentially) what you are permitted to think and what you are not (because you are not allowed access to any heretical ideas). Barry may want to rewrite his account of what MMY said on his TTC, because it wasn't about not being allowed access to heretical (read: different) ideas, it was about *not being seen* reading or listening to them. I am not, and will never be. But, obviously, was for some years, or at least was willing to go along with it.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
Judy wrote: Your projection reminds me of John McCain's calling Barack Obama racist for mocking McCain's own use of Obama's picture on a $100 dollar bill. Er, there's only *one* president on the dollar bill, not all those presidents and the president on the dollar bill is not black, so Obama IS different from the president on the dollar bill, who is white. But there are not more than one president on the dollar bill, black or white. That's what McCain was mocking - that Obama was trying to inject race into politics, but Obama didn't even realize that there is only one president on the dollar bill. After all, it is quite obvious that Barack Obama does not look like those presidents on the dollar bills--George Washington has longish white hair and is wearing a bandage around his neck held together with a frilly handkerchief. Read more: 'Poll shows voters think Obama's 'dollar bill' comment racist' By Ethel C. Fenig American Thinkewr, August 04, 2008 http://tinyurl.com/69z62h You're being an apologist again, Lawson. Oh bull. The point is that this instruction is inappropriate in ANY context, when said BY anyone, when said TO anyone. Bull again. Neither Maharishi nor any of his toadies have or have ever had the right to make such demands on ANYONE, be they TM teacher, Citizen Siddha, or Bozo the Clown. Thrice bullshit. The rationale was given explicitly and anyone who disagreed with it quite literaly had no business being a TM teacher because they were claiming quite clearly that they were certain that TM was the hghest path and if they didn't agree with what they were saying, they had no business saying it. MMY was simply establishing how to walk the walk in the public eye. *Telling* someone who they can see and who they can't is the issue. *Submitting* to someone who is telling you who you can see and who you can't is the issue. The fact that you CAN make excuses for someone (ANYONE) telling another human being who they can see and who they can't is the issue. In the context of being a TM teacher? Not at all. If they didn't want to play the game, they could hang up the shingle and do whatever they wantedm in public or not. Forget about spirituality or higher evolution or advanced states of conscious- ness or any of that Woo Woo shit. Being able to excuse such behavior on the part of jealous tyrants indicates an almost complete lack of character and integrity in my book. Your projection reminds me of John McCain's calling Barack Obama racist for mocking McCain's own use of Obama's picture on a $100 dollar bill. Fact is, MMY set up specific guidelines for the public behavior of TM teachers who wanted to be TM teachers in good standing with the organization. If they didn't like the guidelines, they didn't have to participate in being a TM teacher. Lawson, I'm not going to get into this with you. Of course Barry's not going to get into it. Lawson is making perfect sense, and Barry, as usual, is not. Did you notice the in my book part in what I wrote earlier, and below? That's the same as saying in my opinion. My opinion hasn't changed as a result of you throwing a hissy fit and screaming Bull. And it's not likely to. Lawson didn't throw a hissy fit, and he didn't scream. He pointed out that Barry's opinion made no sense and backed it up with a thoroughly logical argument, which Barry doesn't dare try to address. My mind is made up, don't confuse me with the facts. You are obviously COMFORTABLE with someone having the right to tell you what to do and who you can see and who you can't and (essentially) what you are permitted to think and what you are not (because you are not allowed access to any heretical ideas). Barry may want to rewrite his account of what MMY said on his TTC, because it wasn't about not being allowed access to heretical (read: different) ideas, it was about *not being seen* reading or listening to them. I am not, and will never be. But, obviously, was for some years, or at least was willing to go along with it.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: People with power often like to tell others what they should do. A very nasty trait indeed. Why people in the movement allowed John, Bevan, et al to have power over one of the most intimate decisions a person could make (i.e., who to take spiritual counsel from) is beyond me. What do they know about your life and spiritual need? Absolutely fucking nothing! Why would anyone listen to them. Time to kill one's sheep nature, a nasty trait indeed. Om, most folks actually don't. like Sal mentioned recently. Peter, folks do know their experience as meditators and they know their experience of meditating in groups. So they do come here. On a practical level, folks mostly take what is useful to them by experience. With the case of the FF meditating community, if there wasn't some spiritual energy/experience in the middle of it, only just meditating, then folks would go easily on to something else. Mostly folks just look out for their own selves in going to the domes, which has meant having to live with and listen to the TM administration, like it or not. Most figure out how to live under it to their own benefit. The sad thing is when folks who have earnestly moved and lived here run in to or cross the underlying hardline spiritual fascism of the administration here. That has been a long problem as the e-mail below reminds about it. Lot of folks living here in the meditating community just stay away from it. You'd be encouraged by the nature of the larger meditating community living here. Jai Guru Dev, -Doug in FF Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Date: Monday, August 4, 2008, 8:57 PM More mail from the Inbox: What a stupid trip the leadership here laid on everyone for so long. I was in the Dome one night for a meeting roughly 10 years ago. Around that time I had gone in earlier for program and there was a very big sign at the entrance saying DON'T GO SEE THIS KARUNAMAYI!. The meeting was not on this topic, but it did come up. Hagelin, Keith, and others were there. Someone asked about the other guru question, since countless people had been blackballed or forced out of the movement quite unnecessarily. I heard Hagelin say the following with my own ears This is something WE (the folks on the stage) came up with. It did not come from MMY or GD. Thanks for sending this info out. Jeez, these movement fanatics have destroyed their own movement. TOO BAD. . JGD, Guru Dev's Directives, Guidelines for Spiritual Progress: From: Shankaracharya Swami Brahmananda Saraswati, (The `Guru Dev' of the TMorg). The Guru Dev Biography page has translations from Guru Dev's QA sessions: QA #69: Guru Dev: 'Having taken one guru, another you should not' - this is all rubbish talk and is obstructive to the welfare. Some people say that having taken one guru you should not make another. But this doctrine is not of the shaastra, this is [just] minds imagination. The guru is gone to for happiness. Up until when bhagavaad (God) is gained - up until then you can go and change guru. So then we haven't seen any guru-bhakta (devotee) fearful of shifting, always studying in the very same class of the very same guru. Actually, to transfer class and to transfer guru is natural. It is not disrespectful to the former guru, actually respect has been done the guru, but in future you get the promise of discipleship of fresh gurus. Vyasa's son Shukadeva ji acquired knowledge from his own father, then he gained knowledge from Shankara ji and also gained knowledge from Narada ji. In the end he took instruction from Janaka ji. Therefore, 'Having taken one guru, another you should not' - this is all rubbish talk and is obstructive to the welfare. You should not ruin your life with this kind of empty words. Many lives have been caused to live in births, now then be alert to attain the human birth. Understanding the method of upaasanaa (worship) from higher and higher gurus, having been doing actions according to Veda shaastra, be doing chanting and puja of Bhagavan, then it is certain you will cross the sea of saMsaara (worldly existence). [Shri Shankaracharya UpadeshAmrita kaNa 69 of 108] translation - Paul Mason © 2006, 2007 Jai Guru Dev, http://www.paulmason.info/gurudev/gurudev.htm Om
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: But that's a TM teacher instruction, which is a separate issue from the thing about Sidhas at Fairfield visiting other gurus. Lawson Dear Lawson, you evidently don't live here. Well, in fact just last week a lowly common citizen-sidha old-time meditator got informed on, called in and the dome badge taken away. Banned. It happens. The sad thing around it was to learn how active they still are in developing files on people. Like a secret police. In the case of this person the capital administration had learned through tips that the person was at a Ganapati concert in NYC Lincoln Center the week before while on vacation and had also received a hug from Ammachi another time. A chiropractor had even called informing that the person had visited a different saint another time. Both tips came from the direction of licensed professional people in the community reporting what probably should have been patient-client confidential. Is kind of scary what people can do to others. Stuff like this energy has been cankerous to the movement community and the domes for at least 20 years. Is sad for the community generally. Sad too that some few would still collaborate this way with TM, the state of fascist spirituality. No wonder is so hard to freely get the numbers they'd really like. Even paying people to go. It is a sad story in utopia. Jai Guru Dev, -Doug in FF --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter drpetersutphen@ wrote: People with power often like to tell others what they should do. A very nasty trait indeed. Why people in the movement allowed John, Bevan, et al to have power over one of the most intimate decisions a person could make (i.e., who to take spiritual counsel from) is beyond me. What do they know about your life and spiritual need? Absolutely fucking nothing! Why would anyone listen to them. Time to kill one's sheep nature, a nasty trait indeed. Om, most folks actually don't. like Sal mentioned recently. Peter, folks do know their experience as meditators and they know their experience of meditating in groups. So they do come here. On a practical level, folks mostly take what is useful to them by experience. With the case of the FF meditating community, if there wasn't some spiritual energy/experience in the middle of it, only just meditating, then folks would go easily on to something else. Mostly folks just look out for their own selves in going to the domes, which has meant having to live with and listen to the TM administration, like it or not. Most figure out how to live under it to their own benefit. The sad thing is when folks who have earnestly moved and lived here run in to or cross the underlying hardline spiritual fascism of the administration here. That has been a long problem as the e-mail below reminds about it. Lot of folks living here in the meditating community just stay away from it. You'd be encouraged by the nature of the larger meditating community living here. Jai Guru Dev, -Doug in FF Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Date: Monday, August 4, 2008, 8:57 PM More mail from the Inbox: What a stupid trip the leadership here laid on everyone for so long. I was in the Dome one night for a meeting roughly 10 years ago. Around that time I had gone in earlier for program and there was a very big sign at the entrance saying DON'T GO SEE THIS KARUNAMAYI!. The meeting was not on this topic, but it did come up. Hagelin, Keith, and others were there. Someone asked about the other guru question, since countless people had been blackballed or forced out of the movement quite unnecessarily. I heard Hagelin say the following with my own ears This is something WE (the folks on the stage) came up with. It did not come from MMY or GD. Thanks for sending this info out. Jeez, these movement fanatics have destroyed their own movement. TOO BAD. . JGD, Guru Dev's Directives, Guidelines for Spiritual Progress: From: Shankaracharya Swami Brahmananda Saraswati, (The `Guru Dev' of the TMorg). The Guru Dev Biography page has translations from Guru Dev's QA sessions: QA #69: Guru Dev: 'Having taken one guru, another you should not' - this is all rubbish talk and is obstructive to the welfare. Some people say that having taken one guru you should not make another. But this doctrine is not of the shaastra, this is [just] minds imagination. The guru is gone to for happiness. Up until when bhagavaad (God) is gained - up until then you can go and change guru
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [...] Apologist is used by people like Barry as if it were a pejorative, but of course it isn't. Barry himself is an apologist for all kinds of things. Uncle T's original remark was basically calling me a Nazi, or at least, a Nazi-sympathizer. Apologist is ever-so-much more low-key. Lawson
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Richard J. Williams [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Judy wrote: Your projection reminds me of John McCain's calling Barack Obama racist for mocking McCain's own use of Obama's picture on a $100 dollar bill. Er, there's only *one* president on the dollar bill, not all those presidents and the president on the dollar bill is not black, so Obama IS different from the president on the dollar bill, who is white. But there are not more than one president on the dollar bill, black or white. That's what McCain was mocking - that Obama was trying to inject race into politics, but Obama didn't even realize that there is only one president on the dollar bill. After all, it is quite obvious that Barack Obama does not look like those presidents on the dollar bills--George Washington has longish white hair and is wearing a bandage around his neck held together with a frilly handkerchief. Read more: 'Poll shows voters think Obama's 'dollar bill' comment racist' By Ethel C. Fenig American Thinkewr, August 04, 2008 http://tinyurl.com/69z62h Of course they think its racist. They didn't know about McCain's youtube ad from the month before. Of course, Obama himself may not have actually seen the ad either, so he may have only recalled that it had his face on money, not which denomination. Lawson
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig LEnglish5@ wrote: But that's a TM teacher instruction, which is a separate issue from the thing about Sidhas at Fairfield visiting other gurus. Lawson Dear Lawson, you evidently don't live here. Well, in fact just last week a lowly common citizen-sidha old-time meditator got informed on, called in and the dome badge taken away. Banned. It happens. The sad thing around it was to learn how active they still are in developing files on people. Like a secret police. In the case of this person the capital administration had learned through tips that the person was at a Ganapati concert in NYC Lincoln Center the week before while on vacation and had also received a hug from Ammachi another time. A chiropractor had even called informing that the person had visited a different saint another time. Both tips came from the direction of licensed professional people in the community reporting what probably should have been patient-client confidential. Is kind of scary what people can do to others. Stuff like this energy has been cankerous to the movement community and the domes for at least 20 years. Is sad for the community generally. Sad too that some few would still collaborate this way with TM, the state of fascist spirituality. No wonder is so hard to freely get the numbers they'd really like. Even paying people to go. It is a sad story in utopia. But, as I said, the isntruction to TM teachers is a separate issue than people getting banned from the Domes. What you cited was the extremism that the TMO often descends into, but it still doesn't take away from my point. Lawson
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Richard J. Williams willytex@ wrote: Judy wrote: Your projection reminds me of John McCain's calling Barack Obama racist for mocking McCain's own use of Obama's picture on a $100 dollar bill. I didn't write any of this. Er, there's only *one* president on the dollar bill, not all those presidents and the president on the dollar bill is not black, so Obama IS different from the president on the dollar bill, who is white. But there are not more than one president on the dollar bill, black or white. That's what McCain was mocking - that Obama was trying to inject race into politics, but Obama didn't even realize that there is only one president on the dollar bill. After all, it is quite obvious that Barack Obama does not look like those presidents on the dollar bills--George Washington has longish white hair and is wearing a bandage around his neck held together with a frilly handkerchief. Read more: 'Poll shows voters think Obama's 'dollar bill' comment racist' By Ethel C. Fenig American Thinkewr, August 04, 2008 http://tinyurl.com/69z62h Of course they think its racist. They didn't know about McCain's youtube ad from the month before. Of course, Obama himself may not have actually seen the ad either, so he may have only recalled that it had his face on money, not which denomination. Lawson
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
From e-mail inbox: Is this LB SHRIVER's translation? He said he was going to come out with something like this . JGD, Guru Dev's Directives, Guidelines for Spiritual Progress: From: Shankaracharya Swami Brahmananda Saraswati, (The `Guru Dev' of the TMorg). The Guru Dev Biography page has translations from Guru Dev's QA sessions: QA #69: Guru Dev: 'Having taken one guru, another you should not' - this is all rubbish talk and is obstructive to the welfare. Some people say that having taken one guru you should not make another. But this doctrine is not of the shaastra, this is [just] minds imagination. The guru is gone to for happiness. Up until when bhagavaad (God) is gained - up until then you can go and change guru. So then we haven't seen any guru-bhakta (devotee) fearful of shifting, always studying in the very same class of the very same guru. Actually, to transfer class and to transfer guru is natural. It is not disrespectful to the former guru, actually respect has been done the guru, but in future you get the promise of discipleship of fresh gurus. Vyasa's son Shukadeva ji acquired knowledge from his own father, then he gained knowledge from Shankara ji and also gained knowledge from Narada ji. In the end he took instruction from Janaka ji. Therefore, 'Having taken one guru, another you should not' - this is all rubbish talk and is obstructive to the welfare. You should not ruin your life with this kind of empty words. Many lives have been caused to live in births, now then be alert to attain the human birth. Understanding the method of upaasanaa (worship) from higher and higher gurus, having been doing actions according to Veda shaastra, be doing chanting and puja of Bhagavan, then it is certain you will cross the sea of saMsaara (worldly existence). [Shri Shankaracharya UpadeshAmrita kaNa 69 of 108] translation - Paul Mason © 2006, 2007 Jai Guru Dev, http://www.paulmason.info/gurudev/gurudev.htm
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Dear Lawson, you evidently don't live here. Well, in fact just last week a lowly common citizen-sidha old-time meditator got informed on, called in and the dome badge taken away. Banned. Can we have a name? It makes a stronger point.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, lurkernomore20002000 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5 dhamiltony2k5@ wrote: Dear Lawson, you evidently don't live here. Well, in fact just last week a lowly common citizen-sidha old-time meditator got informed on, called in and the dome badge taken away. Banned. Can we have a name? It makes a stronger point. It makes no point at all. Sorry you can't see that, but it seems par for the course amongst people on this forum. LKawson
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, lurkernomore20002000 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5 dhamiltony2k5@ wrote: Dear Lawson, you evidently don't live here. Well, in fact just last week a lowly common citizen-sidha old-time meditator got informed on, called in and the dome badge taken away. Banned. Can we have a name? It makes a stronger point. No, it doesn't. Doug's comment to Lawson was an utter non sequitur to the point Lawson was making, which was that making TM teachers toe the party line and making meditators/citizen sidhas toe the party line are two different things, done for different reasons. The former is perfectly reasonable, the latter is often, maybe always, not. Doug just ignored what Lawson had said and cited an instance that had nothing to do with teachers having to toe the party line, pretending that disproved what Lawson was saying.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, lurkernomore20002000 steve.sundur@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5 dhamiltony2k5@ wrote: Dear Lawson, you evidently don't live here. Well, in fact just last week a lowly common citizen-sidha old-time meditator got informed on, called in and the dome badge taken away. Banned. Can we have a name? It makes a stronger point. No, it doesn't. Doug's comment to Lawson was an utter non sequitur to the point Lawson was making, which was that making TM teachers toe the party line and making meditators/citizen sidhas toe the party line are two different things, done for different reasons. The former is perfectly reasonable, the latter is often, maybe always, not. Doug just ignored what Lawson had said and cited an instance that had nothing to do with teachers having to toe the party line, pretending that disproved what Lawson was saying.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, lurkernomore20002000 steve.sundur@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5 dhamiltony2k5@ wrote: Dear Lawson, you evidently don't live here. Well, in fact just last week a lowly common citizen-sidha old-time meditator got informed on, called in and the dome badge taken away. Banned. Can we have a name? It makes a stronger point. No, it doesn't. Doug's comment to Lawson was an utter non sequitur to the point Lawson was making, which was that making TM teachers toe the party line and making meditators/citizen sidhas toe the party line are two different things, done for different reasons. The former is perfectly reasonable, the latter is often, maybe always, not. Doug just ignored what Lawson had said and cited an instance that had nothing to do with teachers having to toe the party line, pretending that disproved what Lawson was saying.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, lurkernomore20002000 steve.sundur@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5 dhamiltony2k5@ wrote: Dear Lawson, you evidently don't live here. Well, in fact just last week a lowly common citizen-sidha old-time meditator got informed on, called in and the dome badge taken away. Banned. Can we have a name? It makes a stronger point. No, it doesn't. Doug's comment to Lawson was an utter non sequitur to the point Lawson was making, which was that making TM teachers toe the party line and making meditators/citizen sidhas toe the party line are two different things, done for different reasons. The former is perfectly reasonable, the latter is often, maybe always, not. Doug just ignored what Lawson had said and cited an instance that had nothing to do with teachers having to toe the party line, pretending that disproved what Lawson was saying.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
Judy, I'm in awe of your capacity to read well. -Mainstream --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, lurkernomore20002000 steve.sundur@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5 dhamiltony2k5@ wrote: Dear Lawson, you evidently don't live here. Well, in fact just last week a lowly common citizen-sidha old-time meditator got informed on, called in and the dome badge taken away. Banned. Can we have a name? It makes a stronger point. No, it doesn't. Doug's comment to Lawson was an utter non sequitur to the point Lawson was making, which was that making TM teachers toe the party line and making meditators/citizen sidhas toe the party line are two different things, done for different reasons. The former is perfectly reasonable, the latter is often, maybe always, not. Doug just ignored what Lawson had said and cited an instance that had nothing to do with teachers having to toe the party line, pretending that disproved what Lawson was saying.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
I know of a governor who got banned because he was overheard talking about Ravi Shankar in the dining hall and a person who worked in the course office overheard and called him in for the inquisition. This after he retired from his assistant professorship in his early 50s in order to round on CCP for life. He was able to get back into the dome a few months later, but was unsure enough of his future with the TMO during those months that he looked into leaving ff and moving in with his sister in Florida. ...but mountain doesn't move! --- On Tue, 8/5/08, lurkernomore20002000 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: From: lurkernomore20002000 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Date: Tuesday, August 5, 2008, 7:40 PM --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Dear Lawson, you evidently don't live here. Well, in fact just last week a lowly common citizen-sidha old-time meditator got informed on, called in and the dome badge taken away. Banned. Can we have a name? It makes a stronger point. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!'Yahoo! Groups Links
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mainstream20016 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Judy, I'm in awe of your capacity to read well. No, sorry, there's no special capacity involved. It's a matter of not letting your biases get so in your way that you see stuff that isn't there or don't see stuff that is there. Supposedly y'all were able to overcome your biases well enough to recognize MMY and the TMO for what they were and get out. But really all that seems to have happened is that the biases got switched around. -Mainstream --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, lurkernomore20002000 steve.sundur@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5 dhamiltony2k5@ wrote: Dear Lawson, you evidently don't live here. Well, in fact just last week a lowly common citizen-sidha old-time meditator got informed on, called in and the dome badge taken away. Banned. Can we have a name? It makes a stronger point. No, it doesn't. Doug's comment to Lawson was an utter non sequitur to the point Lawson was making, which was that making TM teachers toe the party line and making meditators/citizen sidhas toe the party line are two different things, done for different reasons. The former is perfectly reasonable, the latter is often, maybe always, not. Doug just ignored what Lawson had said and cited an instance that had nothing to do with teachers having to toe the party line, pretending that disproved what Lawson was saying.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, gullible fool [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I know of a governor who got banned because he was overheard talking about Ravi Shankar in the dining hall and a person who worked in the course office overheard and called him in for the inquisition. This after he retired from his assistant professorship in his early 50s in order to round on CCP for life. He was able to get back into the dome a few months later, but was unsure enough of his future with the TMO during those months that he looked into leaving ff and moving in with his sister in Florida. Yeah, this kind of stuff is extremely discouraging to the TM community. Is interesting to sitdown with folks in FF eateries and watch people scale who is who in the room around. Is serious survival skillset for some people who are still dependent on the movement in different ways. Still some lot of people in the domes who are seeing the saints or who are more tightly dependent with jobs or financial aid for children from campus or the TM movement.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
Mail from inbox: thanks...and we know it's true Guru Dev's Directives, Guidelines for Spiritual Progress: From: Shankaracharya Swami Brahmananda Saraswati, (The `Guru Dev' of the TMorg). The Guru Dev Biography page has translations from Guru Dev's QA sessions: QA #69: Guru Dev: 'Having taken one guru, another you should not' - this is all rubbish talk and is obstructive to the welfare. Some people say that having taken one guru you should not make another. But this doctrine is not of the shaastra, this is [just] minds imagination. The guru is gone to for happiness. Up until when bhagavaad (God) is gained - up until then you can go and change guru. So then we haven't seen any guru-bhakta (devotee) fearful of shifting, always studying in the very same class of the very same guru. Actually, to transfer class and to transfer guru is natural. It is not disrespectful to the former guru, actually respect has been done the guru, but in future you get the promise of discipleship of fresh gurus. Vyasa's son Shukadeva ji acquired knowledge from his own father, then he gained knowledge from Shankara ji and also gained knowledge from Narada ji. In the end he took instruction from Janaka ji. Therefore, 'Having taken one guru, another you should not' - this is all rubbish talk and is obstructive to the welfare. You should not ruin your life with this kind of empty words. Many lives have been caused to live in births, now then be alert to attain the human birth. Understanding the method of upaasanaa (worship) from higher and higher gurus, having been doing actions according to Veda shaastra, be doing chanting and puja of Bhagavan, then it is certain you will cross the sea of saMsaara (worldly existence). [Shri Shankaracharya UpadeshAmrita kaNa 69 of 108] translation - Paul Mason © 2006, 2007 Jai Guru Dev, http://www.paulmason.info/gurudev/gurudev.htm
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
More mail from the Inbox: What a stupid trip the leadership here laid on everyone for so long. I was in the Dome one night for a meeting roughly 10 years ago. Around that time I had gone in earlier for program and there was a very big sign at the entrance saying DON'T GO SEE THIS KARUNAMAYI!. The meeting was not on this topic, but it did come up. Hagelin, Keith, and others were there. Someone asked about the other guru question, since countless people had been blackballed or forced out of the movement quite unnecessarily. I heard Hagelin say the following with my own ears This is something WE (the folks on the stage) came up with. It did not come from MMY or GD. Thanks for sending this info out. Jeez, these movement fanatics have destroyed their own movement. TOO BAD. . JGD, Guru Dev's Directives, Guidelines for Spiritual Progress: From: Shankaracharya Swami Brahmananda Saraswati, (The `Guru Dev' of the TMorg). The Guru Dev Biography page has translations from Guru Dev's QA sessions: QA #69: Guru Dev: 'Having taken one guru, another you should not' - this is all rubbish talk and is obstructive to the welfare. Some people say that having taken one guru you should not make another. But this doctrine is not of the shaastra, this is [just] minds imagination. The guru is gone to for happiness. Up until when bhagavaad (God) is gained - up until then you can go and change guru. So then we haven't seen any guru-bhakta (devotee) fearful of shifting, always studying in the very same class of the very same guru. Actually, to transfer class and to transfer guru is natural. It is not disrespectful to the former guru, actually respect has been done the guru, but in future you get the promise of discipleship of fresh gurus. Vyasa's son Shukadeva ji acquired knowledge from his own father, then he gained knowledge from Shankara ji and also gained knowledge from Narada ji. In the end he took instruction from Janaka ji. Therefore, 'Having taken one guru, another you should not' - this is all rubbish talk and is obstructive to the welfare. You should not ruin your life with this kind of empty words. Many lives have been caused to live in births, now then be alert to attain the human birth. Understanding the method of upaasanaa (worship) from higher and higher gurus, having been doing actions according to Veda shaastra, be doing chanting and puja of Bhagavan, then it is certain you will cross the sea of saMsaara (worldly existence). [Shri Shankaracharya UpadeshAmrita kaNa 69 of 108] translation - Paul Mason © 2006, 2007 Jai Guru Dev, http://www.paulmason.info/gurudev/gurudev.htm
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
People with power often like to tell others what they should do. A very nasty trait indeed. Why people in the movement allowed John, Bevan, et al to have power over one of the most intimate decisions a person could make (i.e., who to take spiritual counsel from) is beyond me. What do they know about your life and spiritual need? Absolutely fucking nothing! Why would anyone listen to them. Time to kill one's sheep nature, a nasty trait indeed. --- On Mon, 8/4/08, dhamiltony2k5 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: From: dhamiltony2k5 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Date: Monday, August 4, 2008, 8:57 PM More mail from the Inbox: What a stupid trip the leadership here laid on everyone for so long. I was in the Dome one night for a meeting roughly 10 years ago. Around that time I had gone in earlier for program and there was a very big sign at the entrance saying DON'T GO SEE THIS KARUNAMAYI!. The meeting was not on this topic, but it did come up. Hagelin, Keith, and others were there. Someone asked about the other guru question, since countless people had been blackballed or forced out of the movement quite unnecessarily. I heard Hagelin say the following with my own ears This is something WE (the folks on the stage) came up with. It did not come from MMY or GD. Thanks for sending this info out. Jeez, these movement fanatics have destroyed their own movement. TOO BAD. . JGD, Guru Dev's Directives, Guidelines for Spiritual Progress: From: Shankaracharya Swami Brahmananda Saraswati, (The `Guru Dev' of the TMorg). The Guru Dev Biography page has translations from Guru Dev's QA sessions: QA #69: Guru Dev: 'Having taken one guru, another you should not' - this is all rubbish talk and is obstructive to the welfare. Some people say that having taken one guru you should not make another. But this doctrine is not of the shaastra, this is [just] minds imagination. The guru is gone to for happiness. Up until when bhagavaad (God) is gained - up until then you can go and change guru. So then we haven't seen any guru-bhakta (devotee) fearful of shifting, always studying in the very same class of the very same guru. Actually, to transfer class and to transfer guru is natural. It is not disrespectful to the former guru, actually respect has been done the guru, but in future you get the promise of discipleship of fresh gurus. Vyasa's son Shukadeva ji acquired knowledge from his own father, then he gained knowledge from Shankara ji and also gained knowledge from Narada ji. In the end he took instruction from Janaka ji. Therefore, 'Having taken one guru, another you should not' - this is all rubbish talk and is obstructive to the welfare. You should not ruin your life with this kind of empty words. Many lives have been caused to live in births, now then be alert to attain the human birth. Understanding the method of upaasanaa (worship) from higher and higher gurus, having been doing actions according to Veda shaastra, be doing chanting and puja of Bhagavan, then it is certain you will cross the sea of saMsaara (worldly existence). [Shri Shankaracharya UpadeshAmrita kaNa 69 of 108] translation - Paul Mason © 2006, 2007 Jai Guru Dev, http://www.paulmason.info/gurudev/gurudev.htm To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!'Yahoo! Groups Links
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, shempmcgurk [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, nablusoss1008 no_reply@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5 dhamiltony2k5@ wrote: Guru Dev's Directives, Guidelines for Spiritual Progress: From: Shankaracharya Swami Brahmananda Saraswati, (The `Guru Dev' of the TMorg). The Guru Dev Biography page has translations from Guru Dev's QA sessions: QA #69: Guru Dev: 'Having taken one guru, another you should not' - this is all rubbish talk and is obstructive to the welfare. translation - Paul Mason � 2006, 2007 And who on this earth would take a translation done by P.Mason, a fellow bent on making a few bucks and a living on denouncing a true saint of these times, seriously ? I am not privy to how much Paul made on the biography of Maharishi that he wrote but I suspect, like most writers, it was probably a labor of love and, in the end, worked out to be the equivalent of less than minimum wage for all the hours he put into it. Labor of love, or labor of anger? Lawson
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, shempmcgurk shempmcgurk@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, nablusoss1008 no_reply@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5 dhamiltony2k5@ wrote: Guru Dev's Directives, Guidelines for Spiritual Progress: From: Shankaracharya Swami Brahmananda Saraswati, (The `Guru Dev' of the TMorg). The Guru Dev Biography page has translations from Guru Dev's QA sessions: QA #69: Guru Dev: 'Having taken one guru, another you should not' - this is all rubbish talk and is obstructive to the welfare. translation - Paul Mason � 2006, 2007 And who on this earth would take a translation done by P.Mason, a fellow bent on making a few bucks and a living on denouncing a true saint of these times, seriously ? I am not privy to how much Paul made on the biography of Maharishi that he wrote but I suspect, like most writers, it was probably a labor of love and, in the end, worked out to be the equivalent of less than minimum wage for all the hours he put into it. Labor of love, or labor of anger? Lawson Have you read Paul's book? I have and I certainly didn't feel a whole lot of anger there...did you?
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, shempmcgurk [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig LEnglish5@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, shempmcgurk shempmcgurk@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, nablusoss1008 no_reply@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5 dhamiltony2k5@ wrote: Guru Dev's Directives, Guidelines for Spiritual Progress: From: Shankaracharya Swami Brahmananda Saraswati, (The `Guru Dev' of the TMorg). The Guru Dev Biography page has translations from Guru Dev's QA sessions: QA #69: Guru Dev: 'Having taken one guru, another you should not' - this is all rubbish talk and is obstructive to the welfare. translation - Paul Mason � 2006, 2007 And who on this earth would take a translation done by P.Mason, a fellow bent on making a few bucks and a living on denouncing a true saint of these times, seriously ? I am not privy to how much Paul made on the biography of Maharishi that he wrote but I suspect, like most writers, it was probably a labor of love and, in the end, worked out to be the equivalent of less than minimum wage for all the hours he put into it. Labor of love, or labor of anger? Lawson Have you read Paul's book? I have and I certainly didn't feel a whole lot of anger there...did you? He seeems to be someowhat angry towards MMY, the times I've seen his personal posting. Lawson
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Guru Dev's Directives, Guidelines for Spiritual Progress: From: Shankaracharya Swami Brahmananda Saraswati, (The `Guru Dev' of the TMorg). The Guru Dev Biography page has translations from Guru Dev's QA sessions: QA #69: Guru Dev: 'Having taken one guru, another you should not' - this is all rubbish talk and is obstructive to the welfare. translation - Paul Mason © 2006, 2007 And who on this earth would take a translation done by P.Mason, a fellow bent on making a few bucks and a living on denouncing a true saint of these times, seriously ?
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, nablusoss1008 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5 dhamiltony2k5@ wrote: Guru Dev's Directives, Guidelines for Spiritual Progress: From: Shankaracharya Swami Brahmananda Saraswati, (The `Guru Dev' of the TMorg). The Guru Dev Biography page has translations from Guru Dev's QA sessions: QA #69: Guru Dev: 'Having taken one guru, another you should not' - this is all rubbish talk and is obstructive to the welfare. translation - Paul Mason © 2006, 2007 And who on this earth would take a translation done by P.Mason, a fellow bent on making a few bucks and a living on denouncing a true saint of these times, seriously ? I am not privy to how much Paul made on the biography of Maharishi that he wrote but I suspect, like most writers, it was probably a labor of love and, in the end, worked out to be the equivalent of less than minimum wage for all the hours he put into it.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, shempmcgurk [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I am not privy to how much Paul made on the biography of Maharishi that he wrote but I suspect, like most writers, it was probably a labor of love and, in the end, worked out to be the equivalent of less than minimum wage for all the hours he put into it. Perhaps you are right, though I would rule out the word love from the vocabulary about this fellow. His project is now expanding. It seems obvious that P.Mason has wider ambitions as he obviously understands the outline of Maharishis historical role in the shaping of the Age of Enlightenment. P.Mason is not an authority on Maharishi or Guru Dev. He is someone who wants to make money.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
Nabby, okay, so you got the Ad hominid attack launched. So, what you think about the ideas of what he translated? Any merit to what Guru Dev might be saying in the translation? I spose next the actual translation should be open for attack now that the Ad hminid has been put on the table. We'll probably be hearing from the movement staff vedic scholar Egness with an official translation by the TMorg at some point. If they are really worried it will be Vernon Katz back from retirement to re-butt. However, any merit to what Guru Dev might be saying in the translation? Seems like a precedent that could be directly adopted in to guidelines generally for the Tm meditating community. Might even significantly increase the Fairfield dome numbers pretty quick. Could just simply ask people to do the TM-sidhi program in the dome forget the ongoing inquisition and related administrative stuff about people visiting saints or holy people. The guideline precedent from Guru Dev is pretty clear that way. Could be quite helpful to the community to cut the TM spiritual fascism out that way. Jai Guru Dev, -Doug in FF --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, nablusoss1008 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, shempmcgurk shempmcgurk@ wrote: I am not privy to how much Paul made on the biography of Maharishi that he wrote but I suspect, like most writers, it was probably a labor of love and, in the end, worked out to be the equivalent of less than minimum wage for all the hours he put into it. Perhaps you are right, though I would rule out the word love from the vocabulary about this fellow. His project is now expanding. It seems obvious that P.Mason has wider ambitions as he obviously understands the outline of Maharishis historical role in the shaping of the Age of Enlightenment. P.Mason is not an authority on Maharishi or Guru Dev. He is someone who wants to make money.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev's Guidelines, for Spiritual Progress
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Nabby, okay, so you got the Ad hominid attack launched. So, what you think about the ideas of what he translated? These ideas originated not from Guru Dev but from P.Mason. Mason next project will be to convince you that what you yourself heard in person, sitting at the feet of Maharishi or listening to His tapes was wrong. He will present ever more of his interpretations as the words of Maharishi himself. That is why I said not to believe a single word from that fellow. He is a thief with one sole ambition; to capitalize on the greatness of others, to make money and to seek recognition of his own ego.
