Re: Enlightened householders [was Re: [FairfieldLife] Most Absurd Rumor]
Yes, just like that. Good example is Barry's naked and raw envy of my enlightened state. He is at no loss for insults and even screaming in print, about it. He doesn't realize the insights that enlightenment brings to oneself, and would never be able to continue his isolated and nasty existence, along with the deep silence of Being, that accompanies all states of enlightenment. He wants something that he really can't handle, and doesn't know it. It is truly a case of not wanting someone else to have something he cannot accomplish. A sad and frustrating place to be. As they say, it sucks to be him.:-) ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : I never understood envy - what a useless emotion. Envy must be nature's way of saying, "Get off your butt, and Do Something". I think you are absolutely right. Envy could lead to positive action. On the other hand, envy seems to stem from a kind of sense of entitlement. Envy does not take in the complexity of why or how someone has, owns or is what they do, it only seems to originate from the fact that someone wants, free, that as well. I have stopped envying anyone because you never know what things really cost or what someone's reality really is. Something seen from the outside is just the shell of the thing a lot of the time. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : Yep. Seems like the idea of average people like me walking around enlightened, with the ability to act in a spontaneous way, is frightening to some. Must be an ego thing. I think it's lack of vision and, yes, envy. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : So, there has never been a model, of how an enlightened person acts, as a householder. Maharishi brought out a lot of elements regarding diet, architecture, health, and even fashion (saris and crowns, robes and cream colored suits) that although provocative, and even quietly revolutionary, will only be adopted by a tiny minority. The trick is to weave an enlightened life within our own culture, and culture in the West favors the individual, so we are back to square one. :-) This is what I don't get, the idea that some people have that you can know who is "enlightened" and who isn't. The fact that they can have this ingrained set of ideas of how enlightened people act is quite hilarious. I mean, on what are these ideas based? Where did they come from? It seems like if enlightened people were to follow the 'guidelines' of what some here seem to think enlightenment means you'd be the most boring person on the planet. Perhaps their ideas are along the lines of acting like some bookish saint, doing plenty of volunteer time at your local food kitchen and ASPCA, donating a few organs and baking pies and casseroles for the neighborhood after having built your neighbor's barn and knitted a slew of sweaters for the needy. I say most have very old fashioned and limited views on this enlightenment business. What, an enlightened person can show anger or impatience? Pish posh.
Re: Enlightened householders [was Re: [FairfieldLife] Most Absurd Rumor]
Re ENVY: Yes, I've always regarded it as an odd vice! It's really wishing that you weren't who in fact you are. I mean, I can idly fantasize about being a Wimbledon champion but as I'm not fit, I have minimal will power and couldn't be arsed to train every day, I've clearly never been Wimbledon material. So for me to be envious of someone who is a tennis star would be a very superficial and ridiculous reaction. Your remark about what "someone else's reality really is" hits the nail on the head. You have to start from where you are and either settle for it or up your game. The odd thing is that as we live in such a celebrity obsessed age our views are clearly not those of the majority. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : I never understood envy - what a useless emotion. Envy must be nature's way of saying, "Get off your butt, and Do Something". I think you are absolutely right. Envy could lead to positive action. On the other hand, envy seems to stem from a kind of sense of entitlement. Envy does not take in the complexity of why or how someone has, owns or is what they do, it only seems to originate from the fact that someone wants, free, that as well. I have stopped envying anyone because you never know what things really cost or what someone's reality really is. Something seen from the outside is just the shell of the thing a lot of the time. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : Yep. Seems like the idea of average people like me walking around enlightened, with the ability to act in a spontaneous way, is frightening to some. Must be an ego thing. I think it's lack of vision and, yes, envy. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : So, there has never been a model, of how an enlightened person acts, as a householder. Maharishi brought out a lot of elements regarding diet, architecture, health, and even fashion (saris and crowns, robes and cream colored suits) that although provocative, and even quietly revolutionary, will only be adopted by a tiny minority. The trick is to weave an enlightened life within our own culture, and culture in the West favors the individual, so we are back to square one. :-) This is what I don't get, the idea that some people have that you can know who is "enlightened" and who isn't. The fact that they can have this ingrained set of ideas of how enlightened people act is quite hilarious. I mean, on what are these ideas based? Where did they come from? It seems like if enlightened people were to follow the 'guidelines' of what some here seem to think enlightenment means you'd be the most boring person on the planet. Perhaps their ideas are along the lines of acting like some bookish saint, doing plenty of volunteer time at your local food kitchen and ASPCA, donating a few organs and baking pies and casseroles for the neighborhood after having built your neighbor's barn and knitted a slew of sweaters for the needy. I say most have very old fashioned and limited views on this enlightenment business. What, an enlightened person can show anger or impatience? Pish posh.
Re: Enlightened householders [was Re: [FairfieldLife] Most Absurd Rumor]
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : I never understood envy - what a useless emotion. Envy must be nature's way of saying, "Get off your butt, and Do Something". I think you are absolutely right. Envy could lead to positive action. On the other hand, envy seems to stem from a kind of sense of entitlement. Envy does not take in the complexity of why or how someone has, owns or is what they do, it only seems to originate from the fact that someone wants, free, that as well. I have stopped envying anyone because you never know what things really cost or what someone's reality really is. Something seen from the outside is just the shell of the thing a lot of the time. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : Yep. Seems like the idea of average people like me walking around enlightened, with the ability to act in a spontaneous way, is frightening to some. Must be an ego thing. I think it's lack of vision and, yes, envy. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : So, there has never been a model, of how an enlightened person acts, as a householder. Maharishi brought out a lot of elements regarding diet, architecture, health, and even fashion (saris and crowns, robes and cream colored suits) that although provocative, and even quietly revolutionary, will only be adopted by a tiny minority. The trick is to weave an enlightened life within our own culture, and culture in the West favors the individual, so we are back to square one. :-) This is what I don't get, the idea that some people have that you can know who is "enlightened" and who isn't. The fact that they can have this ingrained set of ideas of how enlightened people act is quite hilarious. I mean, on what are these ideas based? Where did they come from? It seems like if enlightened people were to follow the 'guidelines' of what some here seem to think enlightenment means you'd be the most boring person on the planet. Perhaps their ideas are along the lines of acting like some bookish saint, doing plenty of volunteer time at your local food kitchen and ASPCA, donating a few organs and baking pies and casseroles for the neighborhood after having built your neighbor's barn and knitted a slew of sweaters for the needy. I say most have very old fashioned and limited views on this enlightenment business. What, an enlightened person can show anger or impatience? Pish posh.
Re: Enlightened householders [was Re: [FairfieldLife] Most Absurd Rumor]
I never understood envy - what a useless emotion. Envy must be nature's way of saying, "Get off your butt, and Do Something". ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : Yep. Seems like the idea of average people like me walking around enlightened, with the ability to act in a spontaneous way, is frightening to some. Must be an ego thing. I think it's lack of vision and, yes, envy. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : So, there has never been a model, of how an enlightened person acts, as a householder. Maharishi brought out a lot of elements regarding diet, architecture, health, and even fashion (saris and crowns, robes and cream colored suits) that although provocative, and even quietly revolutionary, will only be adopted by a tiny minority. The trick is to weave an enlightened life within our own culture, and culture in the West favors the individual, so we are back to square one. :-) This is what I don't get, the idea that some people have that you can know who is "enlightened" and who isn't. The fact that they can have this ingrained set of ideas of how enlightened people act is quite hilarious. I mean, on what are these ideas based? Where did they come from? It seems like if enlightened people were to follow the 'guidelines' of what some here seem to think enlightenment means you'd be the most boring person on the planet. Perhaps their ideas are along the lines of acting like some bookish saint, doing plenty of volunteer time at your local food kitchen and ASPCA, donating a few organs and baking pies and casseroles for the neighborhood after having built your neighbor's barn and knitted a slew of sweaters for the needy. I say most have very old fashioned and limited views on this enlightenment business. What, an enlightened person can show anger or impatience? Pish posh.
Re: Enlightened householders [was Re: [FairfieldLife] Most Absurd Rumor]
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : Yep. Seems like the idea of average people like me walking around enlightened, with the ability to act in a spontaneous way, is frightening to some. Must be an ego thing. I think it's lack of vision and, yes, envy. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : So, there has never been a model, of how an enlightened person acts, as a householder. Maharishi brought out a lot of elements regarding diet, architecture, health, and even fashion (saris and crowns, robes and cream colored suits) that although provocative, and even quietly revolutionary, will only be adopted by a tiny minority. The trick is to weave an enlightened life within our own culture, and culture in the West favors the individual, so we are back to square one. :-) This is what I don't get, the idea that some people have that you can know who is "enlightened" and who isn't. The fact that they can have this ingrained set of ideas of how enlightened people act is quite hilarious. I mean, on what are these ideas based? Where did they come from? It seems like if enlightened people were to follow the 'guidelines' of what some here seem to think enlightenment means you'd be the most boring person on the planet. Perhaps their ideas are along the lines of acting like some bookish saint, doing plenty of volunteer time at your local food kitchen and ASPCA, donating a few organs and baking pies and casseroles for the neighborhood after having built your neighbor's barn and knitted a slew of sweaters for the needy. I say most have very old fashioned and limited views on this enlightenment business. What, an enlightened person can show anger or impatience? Pish posh.
Re: Enlightened householders [was Re: [FairfieldLife] Most Absurd Rumor]
Yep. Seems like the idea of average people like me walking around enlightened, with the ability to act in a spontaneous way, is frightening to some. Must be an ego thing. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : So, there has never been a model, of how an enlightened person acts, as a householder. Maharishi brought out a lot of elements regarding diet, architecture, health, and even fashion (saris and crowns, robes and cream colored suits) that although provocative, and even quietly revolutionary, will only be adopted by a tiny minority. The trick is to weave an enlightened life within our own culture, and culture in the West favors the individual, so we are back to square one. :-) This is what I don't get, the idea that some people have that you can know who is "enlightened" and who isn't. The fact that they can have this ingrained set of ideas of how enlightened people act is quite hilarious. I mean, on what are these ideas based? Where did they come from? It seems like if enlightened people were to follow the 'guidelines' of what some here seem to think enlightenment means you'd be the most boring person on the planet. Perhaps their ideas are along the lines of acting like some bookish saint, doing plenty of volunteer time at your local food kitchen and ASPCA, donating a few organs and baking pies and casseroles for the neighborhood after having built your neighbor's barn and knitted a slew of sweaters for the needy. I say most have very old fashioned and limited views on this enlightenment business. What, an enlightened person can show anger or impatience? Pish posh.
Re: Enlightened householders [was Re: [FairfieldLife] Most Absurd Rumor]
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : So, there has never been a model, of how an enlightened person acts, as a householder. Maharishi brought out a lot of elements regarding diet, architecture, health, and even fashion (saris and crowns, robes and cream colored suits) that although provocative, and even quietly revolutionary, will only be adopted by a tiny minority. The trick is to weave an enlightened life within our own culture, and culture in the West favors the individual, so we are back to square one. :-) This is what I don't get, the idea that some people have that you can know who is "enlightened" and who isn't. The fact that they can have this ingrained set of ideas of how enlightened people act is quite hilarious. I mean, on what are these ideas based? Where did they come from? It seems like if enlightened people were to follow the 'guidelines' of what some here seem to think enlightenment means you'd be the most boring person on the planet. Perhaps their ideas are along the lines of acting like some bookish saint, doing plenty of volunteer time at your local food kitchen and ASPCA, donating a few organs and baking pies and casseroles for the neighborhood after having built your neighbor's barn and knitted a slew of sweaters for the needy. I say most have very old fashioned and limited views on this enlightenment business. What, an enlightened person can (correction: "can't") show anger or impatience? Pish posh.
Re: Enlightened householders [was Re: [FairfieldLife] Most Absurd Rumor]
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : So, there has never been a model, of how an enlightened person acts, as a householder. Maharishi brought out a lot of elements regarding diet, architecture, health, and even fashion (saris and crowns, robes and cream colored suits) that although provocative, and even quietly revolutionary, will only be adopted by a tiny minority. The trick is to weave an enlightened life within our own culture, and culture in the West favors the individual, so we are back to square one. :-) This is what I don't get, the idea that some people have that you can know who is "enlightened" and who isn't. The fact that they can have this ingrained set of ideas of how enlightened people act is quite hilarious. I mean, on what are these ideas based? Where did they come from? It seems like if enlightened people were to follow the 'guidelines' of what some here seem to think enlightenment means you'd be the most boring person on the planet. Perhaps their ideas are along the lines of acting like some bookish saint, doing plenty of volunteer time at your local food kitchen and ASPCA, donating a few organs and baking pies and casseroles for the neighborhood after having built your neighbor's barn and knitted a slew of sweaters for the needy. I say most have very old fashioned and limited views on this enlightenment business. What, an enlightened person can show anger or impatience? Pish posh.
Enlightened householders [was Re: [FairfieldLife] Most Absurd Rumor]
So, there has never been a model, of how an enlightened person acts, as a householder. Maharishi brought out a lot of elements regarding diet, architecture, health, and even fashion (saris and crowns, robes and cream colored suits) that although provocative, and even quietly revolutionary, will only be adopted by a tiny minority. The trick is to weave an enlightened life within our own culture, and culture in the West favors the individual, so we are back to square one. :-) ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : Barry, The Cave Boy from Leiden, raised by wolves, was the first image that came up - lol seriously, people get locked into all the past pictures of enlightened teachers, and even Maharishi was not exactly a slacks and polo type of guy. And the religions have fucked up the image for good, insisting that solely doing good works (according to them), keeping in line, reading surface prayers, and mouthing platitudes about "helping the poor" and being "nice", will lead to our salvation. So it is a lot of context for us to overcome, to truly gain our freedom, our inner silence, and continue to be ourselves - even though that is the simple end result of enlightenment - fully being ourselves. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : that is funny Jim. a very simple, yet relevant observation. yes, Barry has embarked on the path that has enlightenment as it's conclusion, but just can't handle that someone may have reached the goal. maybe along the lines, "if I can't have it, no one can". really, a childish attitude, indicating one might be stuck in a early stage of development. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : "'I think it's unfortunate that a person can spend hour after hour, day after day, year after year, dedicating his life to enlightenment, and yet the very notion that anybody attains enlightenment is a taboo. We're all going after this; but God forbid somebody says they've realized it. We don't believe them, we're cynical, we have doubt; we go immediately into a semi- (or overt) attack mode. To me, it highlights the fact that people are chasing an awakening they don't believe could happen to them. That's a barrier, and the biggest one..." An excellent insight. I enjoy Adyashanti's clarity. He also comes from a town in the Bay Area that I am very familiar with, so it gives me an insight into his temperament. This is exactly why I talk about enlightenment - It is possible, and even likely, to realize enlightenment, using the TM and TMSP techniques, and not just by saintly folks, but by ordinary schlubs, like me! ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : The Zen trained Adyashanti had this to say about 'enlightenment success': 'When I looked around at the Buddhist tradition, I realized that the success rate was terrible. People were in it for enlightenment, but very few were actually getting enlightened. If this were a business, I thought, we'd be bankrupt.' 'I think it's unfortunate that a person can spend hour after hour, day after day, year after year, dedicating his life to enlightenment, and yet the very notion that anybody attains enlightenment is a taboo. We're all going after this; but God forbid somebody says they've realized it. We don't believe them, we're cynical, we have doubt; we go immediately into a semi- (or overt) attack mode. To me, it highlights the fact that people are chasing an awakening they don't believe could happen to them. That's a barrier, and the biggest one... And when people have breakthroughs and talk about them in public, awakening loses its mystique. Everyone else can see that it's not just special people who have deep awakenings, it's their neighbor or their best friend.' The TMO seemed to do pretty well for a while selling something nobody seems to have found. Perhaps one reason for this is the ideas we have in our heads about what enlightenment is supposed to be. The usual ideas about what enlightenment is, are something out of a comic book, something fantastical. Maybe it is something not quite so interesting to talk about, something so familiar that you discount it entirely. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : MJ, speak for yourself! I was never chasing enlightenment. I simply wanted to fulfill my desires. From: "Michael Jackson mjackson74@... [FairfieldLife]" To: "FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com" Sent: Tuesday, November 18, 2014 1:29 PM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Most Absurd Rumor And yet from the very beginning of the Movement till about the 1980's enlightenment was what we were all chasing and what Marshy emphasized over and over. Till it became obvious that no one was getting enlightened even with the 10,000 times more powerful than TM TMSP program so he switched to world peace. From: "Share Long sharelong60@... [FairfieldLife]" To: "FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com" Sent: Tuesday, N