RE: Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: RE: Pope Francis technique
Share wrote: My questions to emptybill are: what does Cyril of Alexandria mean by the sin of one? He means Eve's disobedience. (I'm sure emptybill will correct me if I get anything wrong.) Also, if all sin is illness, does that mean that the orthodox fathers believe that all illness is indicative of sin? Did you read this part? ...Sickness, suffering and death come and when they do God's grace is able to transform them into life-bearing trials, but are they God's will? Does God punish us when the mood strikes, when our behavior displeases Him or for no reason at all? The answer in the essay to these rhetorical questions is clearly no.
Re: Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: RE: Pope Francis technique
But Judy, earlier in the same paragraph with the Cyril quote Rev Hughes states: the Eastern Fathers assigned full responsibility for the sin in the Garden to Adam and Eve alone. So how is it a sin of one, I still wonder. On Friday, October 18, 2013 12:21 PM, authfri...@yahoo.com authfri...@yahoo.com wrote: Share wrote: My questions to emptybill are: what does Cyril of Alexandria mean by the sin of one? He means Eve's disobedience. (I'm sure emptybill will correct me if I get anything wrong.) Also, if all sin is illness, does that mean that the orthodox fathers believe that all illness is indicative of sin? Did you read this part? ...Sickness, suffering and death come and when they do God's grace is able to transform them into life-bearing trials, but are they God's will? Does God punish us when the mood strikes, when our behavior displeases Him or for no reason at all? The answer in the essay to these rhetorical questions is clearly no.
RE: RE: Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: RE: Pope Francis technique
But again to Judy: Death is the natural result of turning aside from God, says Rev Hughes in the last sentence of the 5th paragraph under Approach of the Orthodox Fathers. From this I would extrapolate that illness, according to the Orthodox Fathers is also a natural result of turning aside from God. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com wrote: Share wrote: My questions to emptybill are: what does Cyril of Alexandria mean by the sin of one? He means Eve's disobedience. (I'm sure emptybill will correct me if I get anything wrong.) Also, if all sin is illness, does that mean that the orthodox fathers believe that all illness is indicative of sin? Did you read this part? ...Sickness, suffering and death come and when they do God's grace is able to transform them into life-bearing trials, but are they God's will? Does God punish us when the mood strikes, when our behavior displeases Him or for no reason at all? The answer in the essay to these rhetorical questions is clearly no.
RE: RE: RE: Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: RE: Pope Francis technique
Share wrote: But again to Judy: Death is the natural result of turning aside from God, says Rev Hughes in the last sentence of the 5th paragraph under Approach of the Orthodox Fathers. From this I would extrapolate that illness, according to the Orthodox Fathers is also a natural result of turning aside from God. Well, you just go right ahead and extrapolate your little brains out, OK? Share wrote: My questions to emptybill are: what does Cyril of Alexandria mean by the sin of one? He means Eve's disobedience. (I'm sure emptybill will correct me if I get anything wrong.) Also, if all sin is illness, does that mean that the orthodox fathers believe that all illness is indicative of sin? Did you read this part? ...Sickness, suffering and death come and when they do God's grace is able to transform them into life-bearing trials, but are they God's will? Does God punish us when the mood strikes, when our behavior displeases Him or for no reason at all? The answer in the essay to these rhetorical questions is clearly no.
RE: RE: RE: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: RE: Pope Francis technique
Dateline: Pope is “Filled with light.” That is good and really mystical. Pope Frances experienced the field of “glow”, of that Unified Field in nature. Maharishi Mahesh Yogi talked [taught] of that as he came out of India to the West. -Buck ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com wrote: can you ask them to compare and contrast the two and get back to us? On Mon, 10/14/13, awoelflebater@... mailto:awoelflebater@... awoelflebater@... mailto:awoelflebater@... wrote: Subject: RE: RE: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: RE: Pope Francis technique To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Date: Monday, October 14, 2013, 3:36 PM ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com mailto:fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com wrote: Centering Prayer description and instructions. This seems to pretty much cover the TM and mindfulness marketplace. Many of my closest six or seven friends moved to Colorado and spent vast amounts of time around Father Thomas Keating in the Benedictine monastery in Snowmass. It is an extraordinary place and Thomas Keating is equally as special. These were my friends 'recovering' from their time around WTS and the trauma they experienced in the last few months in Victoria especially. These are also people who, I believe, reject TM absolutely and yet adopted and practiced and embraced centering prayer. They would probably have an interesting perspective on the differences or similarities of the two practices since most of them did TM for many years and more currently have been practicing centering prayer for probably even more years (25 or more).
RE: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: RE: Pope Francis technique [1 Attachment]
Centering Prayer description and instructions. This seems to pretty much cover the TM and mindfulness marketplace.
RE: RE: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: RE: Pope Francis technique
“Centering Prayer is drawn from ancient prayer practices of the Christian contemplative heritage, notably the Fathers and Mothers of the Desert, Lectio Divina, (praying the scriptures),The Cloud of Unknowing, St. John of the Cross and St. Teresa of Avila. It was distilled into a simple method of prayer [from Transcendental Meditation] in the 1970’s by three Trappist monks - Fr. William Meninger, Fr. Basil Pennington and Abbot Thomas Keating at the Trappist St. Joseph’s Abbey in Spencer, Massachusetts.” http://www.pghcenteringprayer.org/Page_2.html http://www.pghcenteringprayer.org/Page_2.html ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com wrote: Centering Prayer description and instructions. This seems to pretty much cover the TM and mindfulness marketplace.
RE: RE: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: RE: Pope Francis technique
can you ask them to compare and contrast the two and get back to us? On Mon, 10/14/13, awoelfleba...@yahoo.com awoelfleba...@yahoo.com wrote: Subject: RE: RE: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: RE: Pope Francis technique To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Date: Monday, October 14, 2013, 3:36 PM ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com wrote: Centering Prayer description and instructions. This seems to pretty much cover the TM and mindfulness marketplace. Many of my closest six or seven friends moved to Colorado and spent vast amounts of time around Father Thomas Keating in the Benedictine monastery in Snowmass. It is an extraordinary place and Thomas Keating is equally as special. These were my friends 'recovering' from their time around WTS and the trauma they experienced in the last few months in Victoria especially. These are also people who, I believe, reject TM absolutely and yet adopted and practiced and embraced centering prayer. They would probably have an interesting perspective on the differences or similarities of the two practices since most of them did TM for many years and more currently have been practicing centering prayer for probably even more years (25 or more).
RE: RE: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: RE: Pope Francis technique
and WTS refers to? On Mon, 10/14/13, awoelfleba...@yahoo.com awoelfleba...@yahoo.com wrote: Subject: RE: RE: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: RE: Pope Francis technique To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Date: Monday, October 14, 2013, 3:36 PM ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com wrote: Centering Prayer description and instructions. This seems to pretty much cover the TM and mindfulness marketplace. Many of my closest six or seven friends moved to Colorado and spent vast amounts of time around Father Thomas Keating in the Benedictine monastery in Snowmass. It is an extraordinary place and Thomas Keating is equally as special. These were my friends 'recovering' from their time around WTS and the trauma they experienced in the last few months in Victoria especially. These are also people who, I believe, reject TM absolutely and yet adopted and practiced and embraced centering prayer. They would probably have an interesting perspective on the differences or similarities of the two practices since most of them did TM for many years and more currently have been practicing centering prayer for probably even more years (25 or more).
RE: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: RE: Pope Francis technique
Dear Turq; to give credit where credit is due, actually Centering Prayer was drawn from the range of Christian and Eastern mystics but to be more honest and accurate was distilled from Transcendental Meditation in the 1970's by the three monks and their brethren at St. Joseph's Abbey in Spencer Massachusetts. I know, I was there and watched them rip Transcendental Meditation [TM] off for their own purposes. -Buck in the Dome ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote: Centering Prayer is drawn from ancient prayer practices of the Christian contemplative heritage, notably the Fathers and Mothers of the Desert, Lectio Divina, (praying the scriptures),The Cloud of Unknowing, St. John of the Cross and St. Teresa of Avila. It was distilled into a simple method of prayer [from Transcendental Meditation] in the 1970's by three Trappist monks - Fr. William Meninger, Fr. Basil Pennington and Abbot Thomas Keating at the Trappist St. Joseph's Abbey in Spencer, Massachusetts. http://www.pghcenteringprayer.org/Page_2.html http://www.pghcenteringprayer.org/Page_2.html I think we all know that The Corrector will probably rip Buck a new asshole for running this tired and intentionally misleading routine again, but just on the off chance that she doesn't, I will. The bolded section in brackets above comes only from Buck's fevered imagination. Anyone who reads the rest of the descriptions on that page knows that it has nothing to do with TM. Buck's as bad as Willytex at making shit up and presenting it as fact. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com wrote: Centering Prayer description and instructions. This seems to pretty much cover the TM and mindfulness marketplace.
RE: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: RE: Pope Francis technique
You mean the biter was bit? The pot got called black by the kettle? The crooks were hoist on their own petard? Caught in a cleft stick of their own cutting? The rip off artists got ripped off? Karma came home to roost? On Mon, 10/14/13, dhamiltony...@yahoo.com dhamiltony...@yahoo.com wrote: Subject: RE: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: RE: Pope Francis technique To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Date: Monday, October 14, 2013, 4:24 PM Dear Turq; to give credit where credit is due, actually Centering Prayer was drawn from the range of Christian and Eastern mystics but to be more honest and accurate was distilled from Transcendental Meditation in the 1970's by the three monks and their brethren at St. Joseph's Abbey in Spencer Massachusetts. I know, I was there and watched them rip Transcendental Meditation [TM] off for their own purposes. -Buck in the Dome ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote: Centering Prayer is drawn from ancient prayer practices of the Christian contemplative heritage, notably the Fathers and Mothers of the Desert, Lectio Divina, (praying the scriptures),The Cloud of Unknowing, St. John of the Cross and St. Teresa of Avila. It was distilled into a simple method of prayer [from Transcendental Meditation] in the 1970's by three Trappist monks - Fr. William Meninger, Fr. Basil Pennington and Abbot Thomas Keating at the Trappist St. Joseph's Abbey in Spencer, Massachusetts. http://www.pghcenteringprayer.org/Page_2.html I think we all know that The Corrector will probably rip Buck a new asshole for running this tired and intentionally misleading routine again, but just on the off chance that she doesn't, I will. The bolded section in brackets above comes only from Buck's fevered imagination. Anyone who reads the rest of the descriptions on that page knows that it has nothing to do with TM. Buck's as bad as Willytex at making shit up and presenting it as fact. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com wrote: Centering Prayer description and instructions. This seems to pretty much cover the TM and mindfulness marketplace.
RE: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: RE: Pope Francis technique
Dear Turq; to give credit where credit is due, actually Centering Prayer was drawn from the range of Christian and Eastern mystics but to be more honest and accurate was distilled from Transcendental Meditation in the 1970's by the three monks and their brethren at St. Joseph's Abbey in Spencer Massachusetts. I know, I was there and watched them rip Transcendental Meditation [TM] off for their own purposes. -Buck in the Dome ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote: Centering Prayer is drawn from ancient prayer practices of the Christian contemplative heritage, notably the Fathers and Mothers of the Desert, Lectio Divina, (praying the scriptures),The Cloud of Unknowing, St. John of the Cross and St. Teresa of Avila. It was distilled into a simple method of prayer [from Transcendental Meditation] in the 1970's by three Trappist monks - Fr. William Meninger, Fr. Basil Pennington and Abbot Thomas Keating at the Trappist St. Joseph's Abbey in Spencer, Massachusetts. http://www.pghcenteringprayer.org/Page_2.html http://www.pghcenteringprayer.org/Page_2.html I think we all know that The Corrector will probably rip Buck a new asshole for running this tired and intentionally misleading routine again, but just on the off chance that she doesn't, I will. The bolded section in brackets above comes only from Buck's fevered imagination. Anyone who reads the rest of the descriptions on that page knows that it has nothing to do with TM. Buck's as bad as Willytex at making shit up and presenting it as fact. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com wrote: Centering Prayer description and instructions. This seems to pretty much cover the TM and mindfulness marketplace.
RE: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: RE: Pope Francis technique
Dear Turq; to give credit where credit is due, actually Centering Prayer was drawn from the range of Christian and Eastern mystics but to be more honest and accurate was distilled from Transcendental Meditation in the 1970's by the three monks and their brethren at St. Joseph's Abbey in Spencer Massachusetts. I know, I was there and watched them rip Transcendental Meditation [TM] off for their own purposes. -Buck in the Dome ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote: Centering Prayer is drawn from ancient prayer practices of the Christian contemplative heritage, notably the Fathers and Mothers of the Desert, Lectio Divina, (praying the scriptures),The Cloud of Unknowing, St. John of the Cross and St. Teresa of Avila. It was distilled into a simple method of prayer [from Transcendental Meditation] in the 1970's by three Trappist monks - Fr. William Meninger, Fr. Basil Pennington and Abbot Thomas Keating at the Trappist St. Joseph's Abbey in Spencer, Massachusetts. http://www.pghcenteringprayer.org/Page_2.html http://www.pghcenteringprayer.org/Page_2.html I think we all know that The Corrector will probably rip Buck a new asshole for running this tired and intentionally misleading routine again, but just on the off chance that she doesn't, I will. The bolded section in brackets above comes only from Buck's fevered imagination. Anyone who reads the rest of the descriptions on that page knows that it has nothing to do with TM. Buck's as bad as Willytex at making shit up and presenting it as fact. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com wrote: Centering Prayer description and instructions. This seems to pretty much cover the TM and mindfulness marketplace.
RE: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: RE: Pope Francis technique
Buck wrote: Dear Turq; to give credit where credit is due, actually Centering Prayer was drawn from the range of Christian and Eastern mystics but to be more honest and accurate was distilled from Transcendental Meditation in the 1970's by the three monks and their brethren at St. Joseph's Abbey in Spencer Massachusetts. I know, I was there and watched them rip Transcendental Meditation [TM] off for their own purposes. -Buck in the Dome I'll confirm that the assumption among TMers that these three clerics' version of Centering Prayer was based on TM was current back in the late 1970s. It isn't something Buck made up. Photocopies of the chapter entitled TM and Centering Prayer from Pennington's 1977 book Daily We Touch Him were routinely passed around among TMers. Moreover, if Barry had any curiosity at all, or any desire to get his facts straight, he would have checked out the PDF that Xeno uploaded. It would be extremely difficult for anyone familiar with TM instruction to read those two pages on how to do Centering Prayer and claim that it had nothing to do with TM. It's obvious that the clerics did indeed rip off the instructions for TM, just as Buck says above. The mechanics of the techniques are virtually identical. The only two significant differences are (1) that TM uses a teacher-assigned Sanskrit mantra, whereas Centering Prayer uses a self-chosen sacred word from the Christian tradition; and (2) that the explicit context of Centering Prayer is Christian, whereas TM's is either secular, religious/nondenominational, or Hindu, depending on one's approach. --The Corrector Barry wrote: (snip) I think we all know that The Corrector will probably rip Buck a new asshole for running this tired and intentionally misleading routine again, but just on the off chance that she doesn't, I will. The bolded section in brackets above comes only from Buck's fevered imagination. Anyone who reads the rest of the descriptions on that page knows that it has nothing to do with TM. Buck's as bad as Willytex at making shit up and presenting it as fact.
RE: RE: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: RE: Pope Francis technique
And that's the truth. -Buck ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com wrote: Buck wrote: Dear Turq; to give credit where credit is due, actually Centering Prayer was drawn from the range of Christian and Eastern mystics but to be more honest and accurate was distilled from Transcendental Meditation in the 1970's by the three monks and their brethren at St. Joseph's Abbey in Spencer Massachusetts. I know, I was there and watched them rip Transcendental Meditation [TM] off for their own purposes. -Buck in the Dome I'll confirm that the assumption among TMers that these three clerics' version of Centering Prayer was based on TM was current back in the late 1970s. It isn't something Buck made up. Photocopies of the chapter entitled TM and Centering Prayer from Pennington's 1977 book Daily We Touch Him were routinely passed around among TMers. Moreover, if Barry had any curiosity at all, or any desire to get his facts straight, he would have checked out the PDF that Xeno uploaded. It would be extremely difficult for anyone familiar with TM instruction to read those two pages on how to do Centering Prayer and claim that it had nothing to do with TM. It's obvious that the clerics did indeed rip off the instructions for TM, just as Buck says above. The mechanics of the techniques are virtually identical. The only two significant differences are (1) that TM uses a teacher-assigned Sanskrit mantra, whereas Centering Prayer uses a self-chosen sacred word from the Christian tradition; and (2) that the explicit context of Centering Prayer is Christian, whereas TM's is either secular, religious/nondenominational, or Hindu, depending on one's approach. --The Corrector Barry wrote: (snip) I think we all know that The Corrector will probably rip Buck a new asshole for running this tired and intentionally misleading routine again, but just on the off chance that she doesn't, I will. The bolded section in brackets above comes only from Buck's fevered imagination. Anyone who reads the rest of the descriptions on that page knows that it has nothing to do with TM. Buck's as bad as Willytex at making shit up and presenting it as fact.
RE: RE: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: RE: Pope Francis technique
Minor correction. I wrote: Photocopies of the chapter entitled TM and Centering Prayer from Pennington's 1977 book Daily We Touch Him were routinely passed around among TMers. The chapter title was TM and Christian Prayer, but it was about Centering Prayer specifically. BTW, Centering Prayer, even as taught by Catholic monks and priests, tends to be viewed with alarm by more doctrinaire Catholics because of its close association with Eastern meditation techniques and especially with TM.
RE: RE: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: RE: Pope Francis technique
And that's the truth. -Buck ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com wrote: Buck wrote: Dear Turq; to give credit where credit is due, actually Centering Prayer was drawn from the range of Christian and Eastern mystics but to be more honest and accurate was distilled from Transcendental Meditation in the 1970's by the three monks and their brethren at St. Joseph's Abbey in Spencer Massachusetts. I know, I was there and watched them rip Transcendental Meditation [TM] off for their own purposes. -Buck in the Dome I'll confirm that the assumption among TMers that these three clerics' version of Centering Prayer was based on TM was current back in the late 1970s. It isn't something Buck made up. Photocopies of the chapter entitled TM and Centering Prayer from Pennington's 1977 book Daily We Touch Him were routinely passed around among TMers. Moreover, if Barry had any curiosity at all, or any desire to get his facts straight, he would have checked out the PDF that Xeno uploaded. It would be extremely difficult for anyone familiar with TM instruction to read those two pages on how to do Centering Prayer and claim that it had nothing to do with TM. It's obvious that the clerics did indeed rip off the instructions for TM, just as Buck says above. The mechanics of the techniques are virtually identical. The only two significant differences are (1) that TM uses a teacher-assigned Sanskrit mantra, whereas Centering Prayer uses a self-chosen sacred word from the Christian tradition; and (2) that the explicit context of Centering Prayer is Christian, whereas TM's is either secular, religious/nondenominational, or Hindu, depending on one's approach. --The Corrector Barry wrote: (snip) I think we all know that The Corrector will probably rip Buck a new asshole for running this tired and intentionally misleading routine again, but just on the off chance that she doesn't, I will. The bolded section in brackets above comes only from Buck's fevered imagination. Anyone who reads the rest of the descriptions on that page knows that it has nothing to do with TM. Buck's as bad as Willytex at making shit up and presenting it as fact.
RE: Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Re: Pope Francis technique
Do a Google search for “Contemplative Outreach”. The odds are much greater the modern Sancta Sedes practices “Centering Prayer” as widely taught by his church. It is now a huge meditation movement that dwarfs the other trademarked version we are familiar with in the marketplace of meditations. http://www.centeringprayer.com/ http://www.centeringprayer.com/ ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com wrote: If you are implying that effortless meditation is unique to TM, it isn't. On 10/13/2013 07:32 AM, srijau@... mailto:srijau@... wrote: I do as I was instructed so Im not trying and neither is the The Holy Father ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com mailto:fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, srijau@... wrote: what a friend we have in Francis, uses the most well researched, the effective technique, not for me to spell out better to just connect dots please and than-you If you're trying to imply that Pope Francis practices TM, I for one suspect you may be correct: http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/WeirdNews/2013/10/11/21190631.html http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/WeirdNews/2013/10/11/21190631.html
RE: RE: Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Re: Pope Francis technique
Heck, everybody is offering instruction in effortless “Centering Prayer” meditation; protestants, catholics, jews, even methodists; http://www.centenary-ws.org/SF http://www.centenary-ws.org/SF ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com wrote: Do a Google search for “Contemplative Outreach”. The odds are much greater the modern Sancta Sedes practices “Centering Prayer” as widely taught by his church. It is now a huge meditation movement that dwarfs the other trademarked version we are familiar with in the marketplace of meditations. http://www.centeringprayer.com/ http://www.centeringprayer.com/ ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com wrote: If you are implying that effortless meditation is unique to TM, it isn't. On 10/13/2013 07:32 AM, srijau@... mailto:srijau@... wrote: I do as I was instructed so Im not trying and neither is the The Holy Father ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com mailto:fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, srijau@... wrote: what a friend we have in Francis, uses the most well researched, the effective technique, not for me to spell out better to just connect dots please and than-you If you're trying to imply that Pope Francis practices TM, I for one suspect you may be correct: http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/WeirdNews/2013/10/11/21190631.html http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/WeirdNews/2013/10/11/21190631.html
