RE: Re: Re: Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor
From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Michael Jackson Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 9:44 PM To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Re: Re: Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor So come on some of you Livingston Manor guys, What was infamous about Wally? Wally was and probably still is a mischievous, fun-loving character. I can think of two stories, one of which I witnessed personally, the other of which he told me, in which he was riding a motorcycle and managed to elude cops who were chasing him. This is while he was already a “Governor”. I was at a party once where we spent the whole evening telling hilarious Wally stories. Maharishi loved him. _ From: Steve Sundur steve.sun...@yahoo.com mailto:steve.sun...@yahoo.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 8:16 PM Subject: Re: Re: Re: Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor it sounds like you have a pretty sophisticated game. I am more of a meat and potatoes type player with a lot of slams. my serve is decent, but nothing too special. and that is funny that you can go for years without playing and then almost start where you left off in a matter of a few games. I am the current champion at our Thanksgiving day tournament for about 7 years running now. (since it started) From: doctordumb...@rocketmail.com mailto:doctordumb...@rocketmail.com doctordumb...@rocketmail.com mailto:doctordumb...@rocketmail.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 7:11 PM Subject: RE: Re: Re: Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor My serve is good - very fast, and low. I make good corner shots, and good slams, though watch for opponents' spins, too. It is like riding a bicycle. I can go years between games and pick it up pretty quickly, again. I used to play a lot with a Vietnamese guy, who played Chinese style - back from the table, and returned anything. Very rarely beat him. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com , fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com mailto:fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com wrote: how's your slam? do you have a stronger forehand or backhand slam? or maybe you just play far back from the table? From: doctordumbass@... mailto:doctordumbass@... doctordumbass@... mailto:doctordumbass@... To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 7:00 PM Subject: RE: Re: Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor Speaking of side effects from TM, I remember I developed an addiction at El Manor that persists to this day, for oranges, and french bread. Also, ping pong, but I'm not to the point where I break into people's houses to play. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com , fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com mailto:fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com wrote: the course I attended was in Courcheval, France. I was in Livingston Manor sometime after that. And my memory from Livingston Manor, for the short time I was there, was that there was no heat, as has also been related by others. I also remember during that time going into NYC and visiting various U.N. Missions to make our speel. Often we would gain entrée to the ambassador or someone of importance. In my idealism, I thought that really meant something, but I soon realized that often it was just something to fill the schedule for them. You know what I can't understand for the life of me. Why the chicken kebobs are so tasteless in NYC. Sure, they only cost $4.00 or $5.00, but they are chewy and bland. I'd gladly pay $8.00 for one that was more tasty. These are the ones on the street, I'm talking about. From: doctordumbass@... mailto:doctordumbass@... doctordumbass@... mailto:doctordumbass@... To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 6:26 PM Subject: RE: Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor I remember on staff, we had to set up the exercise wheels, and water bottles for you CPs, before program. Clean sawdust, too. There was one fellow there, a Peruvian, management wouldn't let him anywhere near you guys. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com , fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com mailto:fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com wrote: yea, so what? From: s3raphita@... mailto:s3raphita@... s3raphita@... mailto:s3raphita@... To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 10:14 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor I don't know if it's been mentioned on this thread already but one vital point Kapor makes about his time on the six-month sidhi course is that he felt he
[FairfieldLife] Re: Mitchell Kapor
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb no_reply@... wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Michael Jackson mjackson74@ wrote: So during the course nothing substantive was done for these folks? I mean beyond telling them to do more asanas or something? Depends on the course. On small ATR courses, no nothing in particular was really done. On larger courses, they might have been referred to one of the resident quacks...uh...I mean doctors. But it was clear that no real effort was made to help any of these people who were twitching uncontrollably or having symptoms that looked for all the world like Tourette syndrome or worse, because the prevailing myth was always TM is 100% life supporting. No one was willing to go up against that and add, ...for many people, but for others, it may cause problems. Anyone I ever spoke to who was going through this commented on the Blame the victim mentality they were exposed to. It was always, What are YOU doing wrong that this is happening to you? We all 'know' that it 'shouldn't' be happening. Just to follow up, Michael, here's the essential conundrum posed by all of this. I worked for some time in the West Coast Regional Office of the TMO, arranging all the weekend and longer residence courses. On the one hand, we were told by MMY's core dogma that TM was 100% life supporting, and that it could not *possibly* have any negative effects. Simply can't happen. On the other hand, as part of what we did for the TMO, we were asked to tell the course leaders and course participants that while they were on the course, they could not drive, they could not even leave the facility, on longer courses they could not go anywhere even on the facility grounds unless they were accompanied by their buddy, and that they definitely shouldn't make any important decisions while they were on the course because their judgment might be impaired. If a drug had that many admitted side effects, you wouldn't be able to sell it without a prescription.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Mitchell Kapor
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb no_reply@... wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Michael Jackson mjackson74@ wrote: So during the course nothing substantive was done for these folks? I mean beyond telling them to do more asanas or something? Depends on the course. On small ATR courses, no nothing in particular was really done. On larger courses, they might have been referred to one of the resident quacks...uh...I mean doctors. But it was clear that no real effort was made to help any of these people who were twitching uncontrollably or having symptoms that looked for all the world like Tourette syndrome or worse, because the prevailing myth was always TM is 100% life supporting. No one was willing to go up against that and add, ...for many people, but for others, it may cause problems. Anyone I ever spoke to who was going through this commented on the Blame the victim mentality they were exposed to. It was always, What are YOU doing wrong that this is happening to you? We all 'know' that it 'shouldn't' be happening. Just to follow up, Michael, here's the essential conundrum posed by all of this. I worked for some time in the West Coast Regional Office of the TMO, arranging all the weekend and longer residence courses. On the one hand, we were told by MMY's core dogma that TM was 100% life supporting, and that it could not *possibly* have any negative effects. Simply can't happen. On the other hand, as part of what we did for the TMO, we were asked to tell the course leaders and course participants that while they were on the course, they could not drive, they could not even leave the facility, on longer courses they could not go anywhere even on the facility grounds unless they were accompanied by their buddy, and that they definitely shouldn't make any important decisions while they were on the course because their judgment might be impaired. If a drug had that many admitted side effects, you wouldn't be able to sell it without a prescription.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Mitchell Kapor
that is an excellent description, Barry - I never thought of TM as a drug with side effects but I reckon that is what it is. Like a soma pill, with side efects! From: turquoiseb no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 3:30 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Mitchell Kapor --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb no_reply@... wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Michael Jackson mjackson74@ wrote: So during the course nothing substantive was done for these folks? I mean beyond telling them to do more asanas or something? Depends on the course. On small ATR courses, no nothing in particular was really done. On larger courses, they might have been referred to one of the resident quacks...uh...I mean doctors. But it was clear that no real effort was made to help any of these people who were twitching uncontrollably or having symptoms that looked for all the world like Tourette syndrome or worse, because the prevailing myth was always TM is 100% life supporting. No one was willing to go up against that and add, ...for many people, but for others, it may cause problems. Anyone I ever spoke to who was going through this commented on the Blame the victim mentality they were exposed to. It was always, What are YOU doing wrong that this is happening to you? We all 'know' that it 'shouldn't' be happening. Just to follow up, Michael, here's the essential conundrum posed by all of this. I worked for some time in the West Coast Regional Office of the TMO, arranging all the weekend and longer residence courses. On the one hand, we were told by MMY's core dogma that TM was 100% life supporting, and that it could not *possibly* have any negative effects. Simply can't happen. On the other hand, as part of what we did for the TMO, we were asked to tell the course leaders and course participants that while they were on the course, they could not drive, they could not even leave the facility, on longer courses they could not go anywhere even on the facility grounds unless they were accompanied by their buddy, and that they definitely shouldn't make any important decisions while they were on the course because their judgment might be impaired. If a drug had that many admitted side effects, you wouldn't be able to sell it without a prescription.
[FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor
[FairfieldLife] Re: Mitchell Kapor
Buck schticks (at least I hope it's schtick): Kapor evidently gets angry and leaves everything. Story of his life evidently. And, you are using him as a witness against something? You are cherry picking. Did you actually read the Kapor interview through? Rick Archer on his interview show about spirituality, Batgap.com just interviewed a psychiatrist about this kind of thing. This guy Kapor sounds predisposed in life to have problems where ever he goes. 20 minutes twice a day of meditation with liberal pranayama should proly be good enough for him. Buck, you (or your altered-state ego) would have been perfect as course leaders of long residence courses back then. What- ever course participants complain of -- *whatever* it is -- it can be cured by pranayama and more (or less) TM. And I understand. Back when I worked at the Regional Office, I was such a TB that the implications of how we were running those courses never occurred to me. We never -- NEVER -- gave any thought to what we'd do if something serious came up on one of our courses. We had no liability insurance, no doctors on call, and no list of what the course leaders should actually *do* if someone started heavily unstressing, other than the aforementioned more (or less) TM and pranayma. Maybe more asanas. And definitely a checking. Everyone knows that a TM checking can cure anything. In retrospect we were incredibly naive, and dangerously so. But we had all bought into that core dogma thang -- TM is 100% life-supporting. We didn't have to plan for negative situations because by definition on a course on which every- one was practicing TM nothing negative could ever happen. I suspect that some here will dispute this. I further suspect that those doing so didn't spend much time on long rounding courses, and by long I mean in excess of six weeks. Those long courses in Europe didn't have any liability or medical insurance, either, and they certainly didn't have a team of reliable doctors on call. But of course there was no *need* for those things, because by definition on a TM course nothing bad could happen. The Laws Of Nature just wouldn't allow it. And if anything bad *did* happen, no problemo. Whatever it is, it can be cured with pranayama and more (or less) TM. Maybe a checking. --- In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote: that is an excellent description, Barry - I never thought of TM as a drug with side effects but I reckon that is what it is. Like a soma pill, with side efects! From: turquoiseb no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 3:30 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Mitchell Kapor --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb no_reply@... wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Michael Jackson mjackson74@ wrote: So during the course nothing substantive was done for these folks? I mean beyond telling them to do more asanas or something? Depends on the course. On small ATR courses, no nothing in particular was really done. On larger courses, they might have been referred to one of the resident quacks...uh...I mean doctors. But it was clear that no real effort was made to help any of these people who were twitching uncontrollably or having symptoms that looked for all the world like Tourette syndrome or worse, because the prevailing myth was always TM is 100% life supporting. No one was willing to go up against that and add, ...for many people, but for others, it may cause problems. Anyone I ever spoke to who was going through this commented on the Blame the victim mentality they were exposed to. It was always, What are YOU doing wrong that this is happening to you? We all 'know' that it 'shouldn't' be happening. Just to follow up, Michael, here's the essential conundrum posed by all of this. I worked for some time in the West Coast Regional Office of the TMO, arranging all the weekend and longer residence courses. On the one hand, we were told by MMY's core dogma that TM was 100% life supporting, and that it could not *possibly* have any negative effects. Simply can't happen. On the other hand, as part of what we did for the TMO, we were asked to tell the course leaders and course participants that while they were on the course, they could not drive, they could not even leave the facility, on longer courses they could not go anywhere even on the facility grounds unless they were accompanied by their buddy, and that they definitely shouldn't make any important decisions while they were on the course because their judgment might be impaired. If a drug had that many admitted side effects, you wouldn't be able to sell it without a prescription.
RE: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Mitchell Kapor
Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor
In my case, good, logical, sound wisdom, saatvic, supported by all the laws of nature and keeps me in good stead with God (just using TM logic here) From: awoelfleba...@yahoo.com awoelfleba...@yahoo.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 9:32 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor --- In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote: Interesting how when an intelligent and successful man says TM was not for me, in fact it was really not for me. and I post his point of view, I am accused of cherry picking. Yet when the TMO parades some asshole like Russel Brand around yapping about how grand TM is (and look what a fine example of TM success Brand is) it is a sign of the Age of fucking Enlightenment. Of course I am cherry picking - I think TM is not all its cracked up to be, so I share things and people who share my point of view, same as others here do, except my posts in this case have some logic them, unlike the Oh let's praise raja luis when the sun comes up in the east! Its a sure sign of TM making to world a better place. If you are accused of something and it is true what does that make it? From: dhamiltony2k5@... dhamiltony2k5@... To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 8:05 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor Kapor evidently gets angry and leaves everything. Story of his life evidently. And, you are using him as a witness against something? You are cherry picking. Did you actually read the Kapor interview through? Rick Archer on his interview show about spirituality, Batgap.com just interviewed a psychiatrist about this kind of thing. This guy Kapor sounds predisposed in life to have problems where ever he goes. 20 minutes twice a day of meditation with liberal pranayama should proly be good enough for him. -Buck --- In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote: that is an excellent description, Barry - I never thought of TM as a drug with side effects but I reckon that is what it is. Like a soma pill, with side efects! From: turquoiseb no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 3:30 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Mitchell Kapor --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb no_reply@... wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Michael Jackson mjackson74@ wrote: So during the course nothing substantive was done for these folks? I mean beyond telling them to do more asanas or something? Depends on the course. On small ATR courses, no nothing in particular was really done. On larger courses, they might have been referred to one of the resident quacks...uh...I mean doctors. But it was clear that no real effort was made to help any of these people who were twitching uncontrollably or having symptoms that looked for all the world like Tourette syndrome or worse, because the prevailing myth was always TM is 100% life supporting. No one was willing to go up against that and add, ...for many people, but for others, it may cause problems. Anyone I ever spoke to who was going through this commented on the Blame the victim mentality they were exposed to. It was always, What are YOU doing wrong that this is happening to you? We all 'know' that it 'shouldn't' be happening. Just to follow up, Michael, here's the essential conundrum posed by all of this. I worked for some time in the West Coast Regional Office of the TMO, arranging all the weekend and longer residence courses. On the one hand, we were told by MMY's core dogma that TM was 100% life supporting, and that it could not *possibly* have any negative effects. Simply can't happen. On the other hand, as part of what we did for the TMO, we were asked to tell the course leaders and course participants that while they were on the course, they could not drive, they could not even leave the facility, on longer courses they could not go anywhere even on the facility grounds unless they were accompanied by their buddy, and that they definitely shouldn't make any important decisions while they were on the course because their judgment might be impaired. If a drug had that many admitted side effects, you wouldn't be able to sell it without a prescription.
Re: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Mitchell Kapor
I'm not so sure that's true - for me personally the unstressing was something that passed by the time of the end of each course, but I have heard of plenty of people who had problems long after the courses were over, plus the people who were not helped by course leaders and were either kicked off or left on their own. From: authfri...@yahoo.com authfri...@yahoo.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 10:05 AM Subject: RE: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Mitchell Kapor Except that the side effects Barry mentions aren't harmful as long as you follow the course rules. Tthose side effects have dissipated by the end of the course (because the rounding has been tapered down), and all that's left are the beneficial effects. FWIW, Barry's griped about this dozens of times here (and the side effects meme is by no means original with him). He makes a huge deal out of very little, IMHO. I mean, even exercising for fitness has side effects. Of course, you can also be seriously injured during exercise, and apparently some folks have had serious side effects as a result of their TM practice. But that isn't what Barry is fuming about here. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com wrote: that is an excellent description, Barry - I never thought of TM as a drug with side effects but I reckon that is what it is. Like a soma pill, with side efects! From: turquoiseb no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 3:30 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Mitchell Kapor --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb no_reply@... wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Michael Jackson mjackson74@ wrote: So during the course nothing substantive was done for these folks? I mean beyond telling them to do more asanas or something? Depends on the course. On small ATR courses, no nothing in particular was really done. On larger courses, they might have been referred to one of the resident quacks...uh...I mean doctors. But it was clear that no real effort was made to help any of these people who were twitching uncontrollably or having symptoms that looked for all the world like Tourette syndrome or worse, because the prevailing myth was always TM is 100% life supporting. No one was willing to go up against that and add, ...for many people, but for others, it may cause problems. Anyone I ever spoke to who was going through this commented on the Blame the victim mentality they were exposed to. It was always, What are YOU doing wrong that this is happening to you? We all 'know' that it 'shouldn't' be happening. Just to follow up, Michael, here's the essential conundrum posed by all of this. I worked for some time in the West Coast Regional Office of the TMO, arranging all the weekend and longer residence courses. On the one hand, we were told by MMY's core dogma that TM was 100% life supporting, and that it could not *possibly* have any negative effects. Simply can't happen. On the other hand, as part of what we did for the TMO, we were asked to tell the course leaders and course participants that while they were on the course, they could not drive, they could not even leave the facility, on longer courses they could not go anywhere even on the facility grounds unless they were accompanied by their buddy, and that they definitely shouldn't make any important decisions while they were on the course because their judgment might be impaired. If a drug had that many admitted side effects, you wouldn't be able to sell it without a prescription.
RE: Re: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Mitchell Kapor
[FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor
Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor
It's like Mitch went to TTC and taught TM for a few years and then decided to try and become a 'Governor of the Age of Enlightenment', so he took off from his family and job for six months to go over to Switzerland. That doesn't sound like someone who has a real grasp on reality to me. So, what is he doing talking like a Buddhist on Tricycle, when he just rejected a whole yoga program based on Buddhist teachings? Go figure. On 9/20/2013 7:05 AM, dhamiltony...@yahoo.com wrote: *Kapor evidently gets angry and leaves everything. Story of his life evidently. And, you are using him as a witness against something? You are cherry picking. Did you actually read the Kapor interview through? Rick Archer on his interview show about spirituality, Batgap.com just interviewed a psychiatrist about this kind of thing. This guy Kapor sounds predisposed in life to have problems where ever he goes. 20 minutes twice a day of meditation with liberal pranayama should proly be good enough for him.* *-Buck * --- In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote: that is an excellent description, Barry - I never thought of TM as a drug with side effects but I reckon that is what it is. Like a soma pill, with side efects! *From:* turquoiseb no_re...@yahoogroups.com *To:* FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com *Sent:* Friday, September 20, 2013 3:30 AM *Subject:* [FairfieldLife] Re: Mitchell Kapor --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb no_reply@... wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Michael Jackson mjackson74@ wrote: So during the course nothing substantive was done for these folks? I mean beyond telling them to do more asanas or something? Depends on the course. On small ATR courses, no nothing in particular was really done. On larger courses, they might have been referred to one of the resident quacks...uh...I mean doctors. But it was clear that no real effort was made to help any of these people who were twitching uncontrollably or having symptoms that looked for all the world like Tourette syndrome or worse, because the prevailing myth was always TM is 100% life supporting. No one was willing to go up against that and add, ...for many people, but for others, it may cause problems. Anyone I ever spoke to who was going through this commented on the Blame the victim mentality they were exposed to. It was always, What are YOU doing wrong that this is happening to you? We all 'know' that it 'shouldn't' be happening. Just to follow up, Michael, here's the essential conundrum posed by all of this. I worked for some time in the West Coast Regional Office of the TMO, arranging all the weekend and longer residence courses. On the one hand, we were told by MMY's core dogma that TM was 100% life supporting, and that it could not *possibly* have any negative effects. Simply can't happen. On the other hand, as part of what we did for the TMO, we were asked to tell the course leaders and course participants that while they were on the course, they could not drive, they could not even leave the facility, on longer courses they could not go anywhere even on the facility grounds unless they were accompanied by their buddy, and that they definitely shouldn't make any important decisions while they were on the course because their judgment might be impaired. If a drug had that many admitted side effects, you wouldn't be able to sell it without a prescription. .
Re: Re: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Mitchell Kapor
Oh I understand now - you didn't say spaciness, you just said side effects - but I understand now what you meant. From: authfri...@yahoo.com authfri...@yahoo.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 11:06 AM Subject: RE: Re: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Mitchell Kapor Yes, as I believe I said, some people have had very serious side effects. However, my point was that the spaciness during rounding was generally not serious, but the rules about not leaving the facility or making important decisions during the course would have made good sense even if that was the complete extent of the side effects. IOW, the rules didn't constitute a conundrum. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com wrote: I'm not so sure that's true - for me personally the unstressing was something that passed by the time of the end of each course, but I have heard of plenty of people who had problems long after the courses were over, plus the people who were not helped by course leaders and were either kicked off or left on their own. From: authfriend@... authfriend@... To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 10:05 AM Subject: RE: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Mitchell Kapor Except that the side effects Barry mentions aren't harmful as long as you follow the course rules. Tthose side effects have dissipated by the end of the course (because the rounding has been tapered down), and all that's left are the beneficial effects. FWIW, Barry's griped about this dozens of times here (and the side effects meme is by no means original with him). He makes a huge deal out of very little, IMHO. I mean, even exercising for fitness has side effects. Of course, you can also be seriously injured during exercise, and apparently some folks have had serious side effects as a result of their TM practice. But that isn't what Barry is fuming about here. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com wrote: that is an excellent description, Barry - I never thought of TM as a drug with side effects but I reckon that is what it is. Like a soma pill, with side efects! From: turquoiseb no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 3:30 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Mitchell Kapor --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb no_reply@... wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Michael Jackson mjackson74@ wrote: So during the course nothing substantive was done for these folks? I mean beyond telling them to do more asanas or something? Depends on the course. On small ATR courses, no nothing in particular was really done. On larger courses, they might have been referred to one of the resident quacks...uh...I mean doctors. But it was clear that no real effort was made to help any of these people who were twitching uncontrollably or having symptoms that looked for all the world like Tourette syndrome or worse, because the prevailing myth was always TM is 100% life supporting. No one was willing to go up against that and add, ...for many people, but for others, it may cause problems. Anyone I ever spoke to who was going through this commented on the Blame the victim mentality they were exposed to. It was always, What are YOU doing wrong that this is happening to you? We all 'know' that it 'shouldn't' be happening. Just to follow up, Michael, here's the essential conundrum posed by all of this. I worked for some time in the West Coast Regional Office of the TMO, arranging all the weekend and longer residence courses. On the one hand, we were told by MMY's core dogma that TM was 100% life supporting, and that it could not *possibly* have any negative effects. Simply can't happen. On the other hand, as part of what we did for the TMO, we were asked to tell the course leaders and course participants that while they were on the course, they could not drive, they could not even leave the facility, on longer courses they could not go anywhere even on the facility grounds unless they were accompanied by their buddy, and that they definitely shouldn't make any important decisions while they were on the course because their judgment might be impaired. If a drug had that many admitted side effects, you wouldn't be able to sell it without a prescription.
Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor
he probably didn't wear a Buddhist stupa shaped hat on his six month course, that was the problem right there. From: Richard J. Williams pundits...@gmail.com To: Richard J. Williams FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 11:42 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor It's like Mitch went to TTC and taught TM for a few years and then decided to try and become a 'Governor of the Age of Enlightenment', so he took off from his family and job for six months to go over to Switzerland. That doesn't sound like someone who has a real grasp on reality to me. So, what is he doing talking like a Buddhist on Tricycle, when he just rejected a whole yoga program based on Buddhist teachings? Go figure. On 9/20/2013 7:05 AM, dhamiltony...@yahoo.com wrote: Kapor evidently gets angry and leaves everything. Story of his life evidently. And, you are using him as a witness against something? You are cherry picking. Did you actually read the Kapor interview through? Rick Archer on his interview show about spirituality, Batgap.com just interviewed a psychiatrist about this kind of thing. This guy Kapor sounds predisposed in life to have problems where ever he goes. 20 minutes twice a day of meditation with liberal pranayama should proly be good enough for him. -Buck --- In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote: that is an excellent description, Barry - I never thought of TM as a drug with side effects but I reckon that is what it is. Like a soma pill, with side efects! From: turquoiseb no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 3:30 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Mitchell Kapor --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb no_reply@... wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Michael Jackson mjackson74@ wrote: So during the course nothing substantive was done for these folks? I mean beyond telling them to do more asanas or something? Depends on the course. On small ATR courses, no nothing in particular was really done. On larger courses, they might have been referred to one of the resident quacks...uh...I mean doctors. But it was clear that no real effort was made to help any of these people who were twitching uncontrollably or having symptoms that looked for all the world like Tourette syndrome or worse, because the prevailing myth was always TM is 100% life supporting. No one was willing to go up against that and add, ...for many people, but for others, it may cause problems. Anyone I ever spoke to who was going through this commented on the Blame the victim mentality they were exposed to. It was always, What are YOU doing wrong that this is happening to you? We all 'know' that it 'shouldn't' be happening. Just to follow up, Michael, here's the essential conundrum posed by all of this. I worked for some time in the West Coast Regional Office of the TMO, arranging all the weekend and longer residence courses. On the one hand, we were told by MMY's core dogma that TM was 100% life supporting, and that it could not *possibly* have any negative effects. Simply can't happen. On the other hand, as part of what we did for the TMO, we were asked to tell the course leaders and course participants that while they were on the course, they could not drive, they could not even leave the facility, on longer courses they could not go anywhere even on the facility grounds unless they were accompanied by their buddy, and that they definitely shouldn't make any important decisions while they were on the course because
Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor
But Seraphita, a lot of those people were thrilled to be first with the sidhis, etc. From: s3raph...@yahoo.com s3raph...@yahoo.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 10:14 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor I don't know if it's been mentioned on this thread already but one vital point Kapor makes about his time on the six-month sidhi course is that he felt he and the other participants were being used as experimental subjects. That charge carries weight, doesn't it? These early learners were the guinea pigs for the TMO developing its course material. --- In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote: I would be surprised if going to this event was OK with the Guardians of the Doors to the Domes. From: dhamiltony2k5@... dhamiltony2k5@... To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 10:14 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] RE: Re: Mitchell Kapor Yeah, the poor aggravated guy. Of course we know a lot more now than we did then. I was on that course too and it wasn't so bad. It was great actually. Would be good now to also hook someone like that up with a little vipassanaic practice along with the transcendence and then also cultivating more with that part in the checking notes about feeling in to the body more. That could all be very helpful to anyone going through their time of acedia. For instance this person, http://www.timeportalpubs.com/has long been very helpful these ways to the meditating community these ways. The waking down community here, https://sites.google.com/site/wakingdowninfairfield/ has been very helpful these ways too for people who suffer this way. Of course you guys left the movement long before what it is now as a meditating community. -Buck Kapor evidently gets angry and leaves everything. Story of his life evidently. And, you are using him as a witness against something? You are cherry picking. Did you actually read the Kapor interview through? Rick Archer on his interview show about spirituality, Batgap.com just interviewed a psychiatrist about this kind of thing. This guy Kapor sounds predisposed in life to have problems where ever he goes. 20 minutes twice a day of meditation with liberal pranayama should proly be good enough for him. Turq writes; Buck, you (or your altered-state ego) would have been perfect as course leaders of long residence courses back then. What- ever course participants complain of -- *whatever* it is -- it can be cured by pranayama and more (or less) TM. And I understand. Back when I worked at the Regional Office, I was such a TB that the implications of how we were running those courses never occurred to me. We never -- NEVER -- gave any thought to what we'd do if something serious came up on one of our courses. We had no liability insurance, no doctors on call, and no list of what the course leaders should actually *do* if someone started heavily unstressing, other than the aforementioned more (or less) TM and pranayma. Maybe more asanas. And definitely a checking. Everyone knows that a TM checking can cure anything. In retrospect we were incredibly naive, and dangerously so. But we had all bought into that core dogma thang -- TM is 100% life-supporting. We didn't have to plan for negative situations because by definition on a course on which every- one was practicing TM nothing negative could ever happen. I suspect that some here will dispute this. I further suspect that those doing so didn't spend much time on long rounding courses, and by long I mean in excess of six weeks. Those long courses in Europe didn't have any liability or medical insurance, either, and they certainly didn't have a team of reliable doctors on call. But of course there was no *need* for those things, because by definition on a TM course nothing bad could happen. The Laws Of Nature just wouldn't allow it. And if anything bad *did* happen, no problemo. Whatever it is, it can be cured with pranayama and more (or less) TM. Maybe a checking. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com wrote: Buck schticks (at least I hope it's schtick): Kapor evidently gets angry and leaves everything. Story of his life evidently. And, you are using him as a witness against something? You are cherry picking. Did you actually read the Kapor interview through? Rick Archer on his interview show about spirituality, Batgap.com just interviewed a psychiatrist about this kind of thing. This guy Kapor sounds predisposed in life to have problems where ever he goes. 20 minutes twice a day of meditation with liberal pranayama should proly be good enough for him. Buck, you (or your altered-state ego) would have been perfect as course leaders of long residence courses back then. What- ever course participants complain of -- *whatever
[FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor
Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor
yea, so what? From: s3raph...@yahoo.com s3raph...@yahoo.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 10:14 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor I don't know if it's been mentioned on this thread already but one vital point Kapor makes about his time on the six-month sidhi course is that he felt he and the other participants were being used as experimental subjects. That charge carries weight, doesn't it? These early learners were the guinea pigs for the TMO developing its course material. --- In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote I would be surprised if going to this event was OK with the Guardians of the Doors to the Domes. From: dhamiltony2k5@... dhamiltony2k5@... To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 10:14 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] RE: Re: Mitchell Kapor Yeah, the poor aggravated guy. Of course we know a lot more now than we did then. I was on that course too and it wasn't so bad. It was great actually. Would be good now to also hook someone like that up with a little vipassanaic practice along with the transcendence and then also cultivating more with that part in the checking notes about feeling in to the body more. That could all be very helpful to anyone going through their time of acedia. For instance this person, http://www.timeportalpubs.com/has long been very helpful these ways to the meditating community these ways. The waking down community here, https://sites.google.com/site/wakingdowninfairfield/ has been very helpful these ways too for people who suffer this way. Of course you guys left the movement long before what it is now as a meditating community. -Buck Kapor evidently gets angry and leaves everything. Story of his life evidently. And, you are using him as a witness against something? You are cherry picking. Did you actually read the Kapor interview through? Rick Archer on his interview show about spirituality, Batgap.com just interviewed a psychiatrist about this kind of thing. This guy Kapor sounds predisposed in life to have problems where ever he goes. 20 minutes twice a day of meditation with liberal pranayama should proly be good enough for him. Turq writes; Buck, you (or your altered-state ego) would have been perfectas course leaders of long residence courses back then. What-ever course participants complain of -- *whatever* it is -- itcan be cured by pranayama and more (or less) TM. And I understand. Back when I worked at the Regional Office,I was such a TB that the implications of how we were runningthose courses never occurred to me. We never -- NEVER -- gaveany thought to what we'd do if something serious came up onone of our courses. We had no liability insurance, no doctorson call, and no list of what the course leaders should actually*do* if someone started heavily unstressing, other than theaforementioned more (or less) TM and pranayma. Maybe more asanas. And definitely a checking. Everyone knows thata TM checking can cure anything. In retrospect we were incredibly naive, and dangerously so.But we had all bought into that core dogma thang -- TM is100% life-supporting. We didn't have to plan for negativesituations because by definition on a course on which every-one was practicing TM nothing negative could ever happen.I suspect that some here will dispute this. I further suspectthat those doing so didn't spend much time on long roundingcourses, and by long I mean in excess of six weeks. Thoselong courses in Europe didn't have any liability or medicalinsurance, either, and they certainly didn't have a team ofreliable doctors on call. But of course there was no *need* for those things, because by definition on a TM course nothing bad could happen. The Laws Of Nature just wouldn't allow it. And if anything bad *did* happen, no problemo. Whatever it is, it can be cured with pranayama and more (or less) TM.Maybe a checking. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com wrote: Buck schticks (at least I hope it's schtick): Kapor evidently gets angry and leaves everything. Story of his life evidently. And, you are using him as a witness against something? You are cherry picking. Did you actually read the Kapor interview through? Rick Archer on his interview show about spirituality, Batgap.com just interviewed a psychiatrist about this kind of thing. This guy Kapor sounds predisposed in life to have problems where ever he goes. 20 minutes twice a day of meditation with liberal pranayama should proly be good enough for him.Buck, you (or your altered-state ego) would have been perfectas course leaders of long residence courses back then. What-ever course participants complain of -- *whatever* it is -- itcan be cured by pranayama and more (or less) TM. And I understand. Back when I worked
RE: Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor
Re: Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor
the course I attended was in Courcheval, France. I was in Livingston Manor sometime after that. And my memory from Livingston Manor, for the short time I was there, was that there was no heat, as has also been related by others. I also remember during that time going into NYC and visiting various U.N. Missions to make our speel. Often we would gain entrée to the ambassador or someone of importance. In my idealism, I thought that really meant something, but I soon realized that often it was just something to fill the schedule for them. You know what I can't understand for the life of me. Why the chicken kebobs are so tasteless in NYC. Sure, they only cost $4.00 or $5.00, but they are chewy and bland. I'd gladly pay $8.00 for one that was more tasty. These are the ones on the street, I'm talking about. From: doctordumb...@rocketmail.com doctordumb...@rocketmail.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 6:26 PM Subject: RE: Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor I remember on staff, we had to set up the exercise wheels, and water bottles for you CPs, before program. Clean sawdust, too. There was one fellow there, a Peruvian, management wouldn't let him anywhere near you guys. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com wrote: yea, so what? From: s3raphita@... s3raphita@... To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 10:14 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor I don't know if it's been mentioned on this thread already but one vital point Kapor makes about his time on the six-month sidhi course is that he felt he and the other participants were being used as experimental subjects. That charge carries weight, doesn't it? These early learners were the guinea pigs for the TMO developing its course material. --- In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote I would be surprised if going to this event was OK with the Guardians of the Doors to the Domes. From: dhamiltony2k5@... dhamiltony2k5@... To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 10:14 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] RE: Re: Mitchell Kapor Yeah, the poor aggravated guy. Of course we know a lot more now than we did then. I was on that course too and it wasn't so bad. It was great actually. Would be good now to also hook someone like that up with a little vipassanaic practice along with the transcendence and then also cultivating more with that part in the checking notes about feeling in to the body more. That could all be very helpful to anyone going through their time of acedia. For instance this person, http://www.timeportalpubs.com/has long been very helpful these ways to the meditating community these ways. The waking down community here, https://sites.google.com/site/wakingdowninfairfield/ has been very helpful these ways too for people who suffer this way. Of course you guys left the movement long before what it is now as a meditating community. -Buck Kapor evidently gets angry and leaves everything. Story of his life evidently. And, you are using him as a witness against something? You are cherry picking. Did you actually read the Kapor interview through? Rick Archer on his interview show about spirituality, Batgap.com just interviewed a psychiatrist about this kind of thing. This guy Kapor sounds predisposed in life to have problems where ever he goes. 20 minutes twice a day of meditation with liberal pranayama should proly be good enough for him. Turq writes; Buck, you (or your altered-state ego) would have been perfectas course leaders of long residence courses back then. What-ever course participants complain of -- *whatever* it is -- itcan be cured by pranayama and more (or less) TM. And I understand. Back when I worked at the Regional Office,I was such a TB that the implications of how we were runningthose courses never occurred to me. We never -- NEVER -- gaveany thought to what we'd do if something serious came up onone of our courses. We had no liability insurance, no doctorson call, and no list of what the course leaders should actually*do* if someone started heavily unstressing, other than theaforementioned more (or less) TM and pranayma. Maybe more asanas. And definitely a checking. Everyone knows thata TM checking can cure anything. In retrospect we were incredibly naive, and dangerously so.But we had all bought into that core dogma thang -- TM is100% life-supporting. We didn't have to plan for negativesituations because by definition on a course on which every-one was practicing TM nothing negative could ever happen.I suspect that some here will dispute this. I further suspectthat those doing so didn't spend much time on long roundingcourses, and by long I mean in excess of six weeks. Thoselong courses
RE: Re: Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor
Re: Re: Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor
how's your slam? do you have a stronger forehand or backhand slam? or maybe you just play far back from the table? From: doctordumb...@rocketmail.com doctordumb...@rocketmail.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 7:00 PM Subject: RE: Re: Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor Speaking of side effects from TM, I remember I developed an addiction at El Manor that persists to this day, for oranges, and french bread. Also, ping pong, but I'm not to the point where I break into people's houses to play. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com wrote: the course I attended was in Courcheval, France. I was in Livingston Manor sometime after that. And my memory from Livingston Manor, for the short time I was there, was that there was no heat, as has also been related by others. I also remember during that time going into NYC and visiting various U.N. Missions to make our speel. Often we would gain entrée to the ambassador or someone of importance. In my idealism, I thought that really meant something, but I soon realized that often it was just something to fill the schedule for them. You know what I can't understand for the life of me. Why the chicken kebobs are so tasteless in NYC. Sure, they only cost $4.00 or $5.00, but they are chewy and bland. I'd gladly pay $8.00 for one that was more tasty. These are the ones on the street, I'm talking about. From: doctordumbass@... doctordumbass@... To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 6:26 PM Subject: RE: Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor I remember on staff, we had to set up the exercise wheels, and water bottles for you CPs, before program. Clean sawdust, too. There was one fellow there, a Peruvian, management wouldn't let him anywhere near you guys. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com wrote: yea, so what? From: s3raphita@... s3raphita@... To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 10:14 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor I don't know if it's been mentioned on this thread already but one vital point Kapor makes about his time on the six-month sidhi course is that he felt he and the other participants were being used as experimental subjects. That charge carries weight, doesn't it? These early learners were the guinea pigs for the TMO developing its course material. --- In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote I would be surprised if going to this event was OK with the Guardians of the Doors to the Domes. From: dhamiltony2k5@... dhamiltony2k5@... To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 10:14 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] RE: Re: Mitchell Kapor Yeah, the poor aggravated guy. Of course we know a lot more now than we did then. I was on that course too and it wasn't so bad. It was great actually. Would be good now to also hook someone like that up with a little vipassanaic practice along with the transcendence and then also cultivating more with that part in the checking notes about feeling in to the body more. That could all be very helpful to anyone going through their time of acedia. For instance this person, http://www.timeportalpubs.com/has long been very helpful these ways to the meditating community these ways. The waking down community here, https://sites.google.com/site/wakingdowninfairfield/ has been very helpful these ways too for people who suffer this way. Of course you guys left the movement long before what it is now as a meditating community. -Buck Kapor evidently gets angry and leaves everything. Story of his life evidently. And, you are using him as a witness against something? You are cherry picking. Did you actually read the Kapor interview through? Rick Archer on his interview show about spirituality, Batgap.com just interviewed a psychiatrist about this kind of thing. This guy Kapor sounds predisposed in life to have problems where ever he goes. 20 minutes twice a day of meditation with liberal pranayama should proly be good enough for him. Turq writes; Buck, you (or your altered-state ego) would have been perfectas course leaders of long residence courses back then. What-ever course participants complain of -- *whatever* it is -- itcan be cured by pranayama and more (or less) TM. And I understand. Back when I worked at the Regional Office,I was such a TB that the implications of how we were runningthose courses never occurred to me. We never -- NEVER -- gaveany thought to what we'd do if something serious came up onone of our courses. We had no liability insurance, no doctorson call, and no list of what the course leaders should actually*do* if someone started heavily unstressing, other than
RE: Re: Re: Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor
Re: Re: Re: Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor
it sounds like you have a pretty sophisticated game. I am more of a meat and potatoes type player with a lot of slams. my serve is decent, but nothing too special. and that is funny that you can go for years without playing and then almost start where you left off in a matter of a few games. I am the current champion at our Thanksgiving day tournament for about 7 years running now. (since it started) From: doctordumb...@rocketmail.com doctordumb...@rocketmail.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 7:11 PM Subject: RE: Re: Re: Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor My serve is good - very fast, and low. I make good corner shots, and good slams, though watch for opponents' spins, too. It is like riding a bicycle. I can go years between games and pick it up pretty quickly, again. I used to play a lot with a Vietnamese guy, who played Chinese style - back from the table, and returned anything. Very rarely beat him. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com wrote: how's your slam? do you have a stronger forehand or backhand slam? or maybe you just play far back from the table? From: doctordumbass@... doctordumbass@... To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 7:00 PM Subject: RE: Re: Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor Speaking of side effects from TM, I remember I developed an addiction at El Manor that persists to this day, for oranges, and french bread. Also, ping pong, but I'm not to the point where I break into people's houses to play. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com wrote: the course I attended was in Courcheval, France. I was in Livingston Manor sometime after that. And my memory from Livingston Manor, for the short time I was there, was that there was no heat, as has also been related by others. I also remember during that time going into NYC and visiting various U.N. Missions to make our speel. Often we would gain entrée to the ambassador or someone of importance. In my idealism, I thought that really meant something, but I soon realized that often it was just something to fill the schedule for them. You know what I can't understand for the life of me. Why the chicken kebobs are so tasteless in NYC. Sure, they only cost $4.00 or $5.00, but they are chewy and bland. I'd gladly pay $8.00 for one that was more tasty. These are the ones on the street, I'm talking about. From: doctordumbass@... doctordumbass@... To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 6:26 PM Subject: RE: Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor I remember on staff, we had to set up the exercise wheels, and water bottles for you CPs, before program. Clean sawdust, too. There was one fellow there, a Peruvian, management wouldn't let him anywhere near you guys. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com wrote: yea, so what? From: s3raphita@... s3raphita@... To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 10:14 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor I don't know if it's been mentioned on this thread already but one vital point Kapor makes about his time on the six-month sidhi course is that he felt he and the other participants were being used as experimental subjects. That charge carries weight, doesn't it? These early learners were the guinea pigs for the TMO developing its course material. --- In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote I would be surprised if going to this event was OK with the Guardians of the Doors to the Domes. From: dhamiltony2k5@... dhamiltony2k5@... To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 10:14 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] RE: Re: Mitchell Kapor Yeah, the poor aggravated guy. Of course we know a lot more now than we did then. I was on that course too and it wasn't so bad. It was great actually. Would be good now to also hook someone like that up with a little vipassanaic practice along with the transcendence and then also cultivating more with that part in the checking notes about feeling in to the body more. That could all be very helpful to anyone going through their time of acedia. For instance this person, http://www.timeportalpubs.com/has long been very helpful these ways to the meditating community these ways. The waking down community here, https://sites.google.com/site/wakingdowninfairfield/ has been very helpful these ways too for people who suffer this way. Of course you guys left the movement long before what it is now as a meditating community. -Buck Kapor evidently gets angry and leaves everything. Story of his life evidently. And, you are using him as a witness against
Re: Re: Re: Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor
So come on some of you Livingston Manor guys, What was infamous about Wally? From: Steve Sundur steve.sun...@yahoo.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 8:16 PM Subject: Re: Re: Re: Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor it sounds like you have a pretty sophisticated game. I am more of a meat and potatoes type player with a lot of slams. my serve is decent, but nothing too special. and that is funny that you can go for years without playing and then almost start where you left off in a matter of a few games. I am the current champion at our Thanksgiving day tournament for about 7 years running now. (since it started) From: doctordumb...@rocketmail.com doctordumb...@rocketmail.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 7:11 PM Subject: RE: Re: Re: Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor My serve is good - very fast, and low. I make good corner shots, and good slams, though watch for opponents' spins, too. It is like riding a bicycle. I can go years between games and pick it up pretty quickly, again. I used to play a lot with a Vietnamese guy, who played Chinese style - back from the table, and returned anything. Very rarely beat him. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com wrote: how's your slam? do you have a stronger forehand or backhand slam? or maybe you just play far back from the table? From: doctordumbass@... doctordumbass@... To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 7:00 PM Subject: RE: Re: Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor Speaking of side effects from TM, I remember I developed an addiction at El Manor that persists to this day, for oranges, and french bread. Also, ping pong, but I'm not to the point where I break into people's houses to play. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com wrote: the course I attended was in Courcheval, France. I was in Livingston Manor sometime after that. And my memory from Livingston Manor, for the short time I was there, was that there was no heat, as has also been related by others. I also remember during that time going into NYC and visiting various U.N. Missions to make our speel. Often we would gain entrée to the ambassador or someone of importance. In my idealism, I thought that really meant something, but I soon realized that often it was just something to fill the schedule for them. You know what I can't understand for the life of me. Why the chicken kebobs are so tasteless in NYC. Sure, they only cost $4.00 or $5.00, but they are chewy and bland. I'd gladly pay $8.00 for one that was more tasty. These are the ones on the street, I'm talking about. From: doctordumbass@... doctordumbass@... To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 6:26 PM Subject: RE: Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor I remember on staff, we had to set up the exercise wheels, and water bottles for you CPs, before program. Clean sawdust, too. There was one fellow there, a Peruvian, management wouldn't let him anywhere near you guys. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com wrote: yea, so what? From: s3raphita@... s3raphita@... To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 10:14 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor I don't know if it's been mentioned on this thread already but one vital point Kapor makes about his time on the six-month sidhi course is that he felt he and the other participants were being used as experimental subjects. That charge carries weight, doesn't it? These early learners were the guinea pigs for the TMO developing its course material. --- In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote I would be surprised if going to this event was OK with the Guardians of the Doors to the Domes. From: dhamiltony2k5@... dhamiltony2k5@... To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 10:14 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] RE: Re: Mitchell Kapor Yeah, the poor aggravated guy. Of course we know a lot more now than we did then. I was on that course too and it wasn't so bad. It was great actually. Would be good now to also hook someone like that up with a little vipassanaic practice along with the transcendence and then also cultivating more with that part in the checking notes about feeling in to the body more. That could all be very helpful to anyone going through their time of acedia. For instance this person, http://www.timeportalpubs.com/has long been very helpful these ways to the meditating community these ways. The waking down community here, https://sites.google.com/site/wakingdowninfairfield/ has been very helpful these ways too for people who suffer this way. Of course you guys left the movement long before what it is now as a meditating community. -Buck
Re: Re: Re: Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor
I have no first hand info about him. Or even second hand for that matter. Third hand I vaguely recall he was a character From: Michael Jackson mjackso...@yahoo.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 9:44 PM Subject: Re: Re: Re: Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor So come on some of you Livingston Manor guys, What was infamous about Wally? From: Steve Sundur steve.sun...@yahoo.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 8:16 PM Subject: Re: Re: Re: Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor it sounds like you have a pretty sophisticated game. I am more of a meat and potatoes type player with a lot of slams. my serve is decent, but nothing too special. and that is funny that you can go for years without playing and then almost start where you left off in a matter of a few games. I am the current champion at our Thanksgiving day tournament for about 7 years running now. (since it started) From: doctordumb...@rocketmail.com doctordumb...@rocketmail.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 7:11 PM Subject: RE: Re: Re: Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor My serve is good - very fast, and low. I make good corner shots, and good slams, though watch for opponents' spins, too. It is like riding a bicycle. I can go years between games and pick it up pretty quickly, again. I used to play a lot with a Vietnamese guy, who played Chinese style - back from the table, and returned anything. Very rarely beat him. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com wrote: how's your slam? do you have a stronger forehand or backhand slam? or maybe you just play far back from the table? From: doctordumbass@... doctordumbass@... To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 7:00 PM Subject: RE: Re: Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor Speaking of side effects from TM, I remember I developed an addiction at El Manor that persists to this day, for oranges, and french bread. Also, ping pong, but I'm not to the point where I break into people's houses to play. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com wrote: the course I attended was in Courcheval, France. I was in Livingston Manor sometime after that. And my memory from Livingston Manor, for the short time I was there, was that there was no heat, as has also been related by others. I also remember during that time going into NYC and visiting various U.N. Missions to make our speel. Often we would gain entrée to the ambassador or someone of importance. In my idealism, I thought that really meant something, but I soon realized that often it was just something to fill the schedule for them. You know what I can't understand for the life of me. Why the chicken kebobs are so tasteless in NYC. Sure, they only cost $4.00 or $5.00, but they are chewy and bland. I'd gladly pay $8.00 for one that was more tasty. These are the ones on the street, I'm talking about. From: doctordumbass@... doctordumbass@... To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 6:26 PM Subject: RE: Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor I remember on staff, we had to set up the exercise wheels, and water bottles for you CPs, before program. Clean sawdust, too. There was one fellow there, a Peruvian, management wouldn't let him anywhere near you guys. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com wrote: yea, so what? From: s3raphita@... s3raphita@... To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 10:14 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor I don't know if it's been mentioned on this thread already but one vital point Kapor makes about his time on the six-month sidhi course is that he felt he and the other participants were being used as experimental subjects. That charge carries weight, doesn't it? These early learners were the guinea pigs for the TMO developing its course material. --- In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote I would be surprised if going to this event was OK with the Guardians of the Doors to the Domes. From: dhamiltony2k5@... dhamiltony2k5@... To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 10:14 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] RE: Re: Mitchell Kapor Yeah, the poor aggravated guy. Of course we know a lot more now than we did then. I was on that course too and it wasn't so bad. It was great actually. Would be good now to also hook someone like that up with a little vipassanaic practice along with the transcendence
RE: Re: Re: Re: Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor
[FairfieldLife] Re: Mitchell Kapor
So during the course nothing substantive was done for these folks? I mean beyond telling them to do more asanas or something? turquoiseb: twitching uncontrollably or having symptoms that looked for all the world like Tourette syndrome or worse It's a little difficult to diagnose these kinds of problems, even if you are a psychiatrist or an MD. What could go wrong with a guy that one minute is sitting quietly in his room meditating and the next minute he is twitching uncontrollably in public? Or, what would anyone make of a guy that just spent ten hours napping in bed and then at a meeting, he suddenly breaks out shouting curse words at his roommates? I'm not a doctor but I'd probably think there was some kind of preexisting condition and look into that first, before I put the blame on a poor Hindu guy who was just trying to help you sleep. Where is Dr. Pete when we need him? Depends on the course. On small ATR courses, no nothing in particular was really done. On larger courses, they might have been referred to one of the resident quacks...uh...I mean doctors. But it was clear that no real effort was made to help any of these people who were twitching uncontrollably or having symptoms that looked for all the world like Tourette syndrome or worse, because the prevailing myth was always TM is 100% life supporting. No one was willing to go up against that and add, ...for many people, but for others, it may cause problems. Anyone I ever spoke to who was going through this commented on the Blame the victim mentality they were exposed to. It was always, What are YOU doing wrong that this is happening to you? We all 'know' that it 'shouldn't' be happening. From: turquoiseb no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, September 19, 2013 9:15 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: RE: Mitchell Kapor --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Michael Jackson wrote: Well, I wasn't there - but from what I have heard of the heavy unstressing on many courses, it doesn't sound like there was an effective means or program in place to assist those who were going through stuff. If there was I would like to know that and to know what things were put into place to assist people going through the unstressing. Such a thing would make me think more highly of the Movement than I do now. I was on quite a few courses on which participants suffered from heavy unstressing. ALL of the most severe cases I saw occur were dealt with using the same NOPA solution. That is, if none of the standard repeated cliches helped to resolve the problem, the person suffering from the heavy unstressing was sent home, and everyone wiped their hands and said Not Our Problem Anymore. From: Steve Sundur steve.sundur@ To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, September 19, 2013 7:51 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: RE: Mitchell Kapor à Hey Mikey.à How you livin'.à Listen, I was on the six month course.à The first one actually, where the experimentation was rampant.à Enemas, diet control, (or at least many theories to consider).à Rick was on that course too.à I guess for Mitch, it wasn't his cup of tea, so he left.à I think he may have been on a later course.à Or at least I don't remember him on my course. à But I thoroughly enjoyed it, and felt I gained much from it.à I think what Jim is saying, (and really, I just skimmed it), is that if there is such thing as a spiritual path, and you choose to be on it, that as youà move along that path, and you will have to clear awayà any wreckage.à à Now probably, many times you may progress a certain amount, and then decide to take a break.à And of course, so what if you do.à à I don't know what on with Mitch, other than he felt he got all he could from the program and then moved on -à either with prejudice or without prejudice. à I think that's what Jim is saying.à But at some point, if you decide to take up the path again, in a more focused way, then you may well have to engage in some heavy lifting again. à P.S. My favorite part of that course was the hours of reading the Upanishads.à More interesting (and enjoyable) than the Rig Veda readings.à à P.S.S.à The food was...excellent!! From: Michael Jackson mjackson74@ To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, September 19, 2013 6:09 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: RE: Mitchell Kapor à Kapor didn't say he was looking for a magic bullet or a panacea, he was just wanting what Marshy promised and to see if the sidhis was the real deal, if M could really teach anyone to fly. Obviously he couldn't teach anyone to
