[FairfieldLife] Re: Interesting Take on This
this doesn't really apply to what you are saying, but an interesting story, nonetheless. I was Israel when I was around 16 or 17, (so this was many years go.) I was on a beach with my girlfriend taking a walk. There was no one else around and suddenly an Israeli Arab comes up to us and starts aggressively propositioning my girlfriend. It went on for about ten minutes, and although it never escalated to the point where I needed to get violent, I had to continually keep him at bay. there is a fine line, at least for me, between something that is designed to incite a reaction and something that is just a harsh social commentary. going after the prophet in an incendiary way is an example of the first. this was an example of the second. again, just for me. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : of course you enjoyed it, Steve - It was produced to appeal to the Western mindset, without much thought to the population it is exploiting. It is all good fun, until you are one of those at the other end of the jab. Would have been far more appropriate had it been produced by the refugees themselves. To feel it is just fine to tweak a culture that we have only recently discovered, not through diplomatic overtures or appreciation, but by killing them, takes arrogance to a whole new level. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : I know nothing about Charlie Hebdo, except for the occasional cartoons that break through the clutter. You have publications on the right which are always spewing out false stories, you have publications on the left that choose to push cultural buttons. You have comedians on TV every night poking fun at politicians and religious figures. It's just part of the warp and woof. That said, I do think some restraint is in order. I just found this cartoon a lot more funny than offensive. Says something about me, I suppose. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : Another thing to keep in mind is that war breeds extremists, and many in the Middle East, not completely without cause, see the West as the invaders. So, they are flooding into Europe now, displaced, some with nasty intent, and here is this irresponsible little magazine, printing clever little cartoons to inflame it all further. Helpful? Not at all. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : Honestly, I go both ways on it. In many instances I think it's a bad idea to provoke the extremest element like this, but in this case, for whatever reason, I thought it was quite funny and spot on. Plus, and this is unfortunate, it seems right now the extremists are only going to be able to go after the softer targets. Everyone else is on such high alert. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : too clever by half, I think. The world is not an extension of France, or Europe, and media travels at the speed of light now. So, sure, it is clever, but there is a wider audience they are setting themselves against, immediately upon publication. Not all speech is "free", even if permitted by law. If they want to publish this as a newsletter within a university or something, Harvard Lampoon-style, ok, but to blast this type of message globally is inflammatory, not matter how skillfully it is done. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : My take was that it was a lot more nuanced than a straight shot at the "Prophet". That will definitely get you in trouble. On the other hand, I don't know if they, or others are soft pedaling the "Prophet" stuff. Again, I found it very clever. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : Same here. They can point their precious satire at those living in the 14th century, but then be prepared to reap the 14th century consequences. As it is, they are asking for continuous retribution. I wonder if each new employee is issued a kevlar vest?? ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : I personally believe the recent Hebdo cartoon went too far in the wrong direction. I was appalled by it. Here is what one writer thought: http://gulfnews.com/opinion/thinkers/charlie-hebdo-s-refugee-cartoon-isn-t-satirical-it-s-inflammatory-1.1654631 http://gulfnews.com/opinion/thinkers/charlie-hebdo-s-refugee-cartoon-isn-t-satirical-it-s-inflammatory-1.1654631
[FairfieldLife] Re: Interesting Take on This
of course you enjoyed it, Steve - It was produced to appeal to the Western mindset, without much thought to the population it is exploiting. It is all good fun, until you are one of those at the other end of the jab. Would have been far more appropriate had it been produced by the refugees themselves. To feel it is just fine to tweak a culture that we have only recently discovered, not through diplomatic overtures or appreciation, but by killing them, takes arrogance to a whole new level. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : I know nothing about Charlie Hebdo, except for the occasional cartoons that break through the clutter. You have publications on the right which are always spewing out false stories, you have publications on the left that choose to push cultural buttons. You have comedians on TV every night poking fun at politicians and religious figures. It's just part of the warp and woof. That said, I do think some restraint is in order. I just found this cartoon a lot more funny than offensive. Says something about me, I suppose. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : Another thing to keep in mind is that war breeds extremists, and many in the Middle East, not completely without cause, see the West as the invaders. So, they are flooding into Europe now, displaced, some with nasty intent, and here is this irresponsible little magazine, printing clever little cartoons to inflame it all further. Helpful? Not at all. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : Honestly, I go both ways on it. In many instances I think it's a bad idea to provoke the extremest element like this, but in this case, for whatever reason, I thought it was quite funny and spot on. Plus, and this is unfortunate, it seems right now the extremists are only going to be able to go after the softer targets. Everyone else is on such high alert. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : too clever by half, I think. The world is not an extension of France, or Europe, and media travels at the speed of light now. So, sure, it is clever, but there is a wider audience they are setting themselves against, immediately upon publication. Not all speech is "free", even if permitted by law. If they want to publish this as a newsletter within a university or something, Harvard Lampoon-style, ok, but to blast this type of message globally is inflammatory, not matter how skillfully it is done. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : My take was that it was a lot more nuanced than a straight shot at the "Prophet". That will definitely get you in trouble. On the other hand, I don't know if they, or others are soft pedaling the "Prophet" stuff. Again, I found it very clever. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : Same here. They can point their precious satire at those living in the 14th century, but then be prepared to reap the 14th century consequences. As it is, they are asking for continuous retribution. I wonder if each new employee is issued a kevlar vest?? ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : I personally believe the recent Hebdo cartoon went too far in the wrong direction. I was appalled by it. Here is what one writer thought: http://gulfnews.com/opinion/thinkers/charlie-hebdo-s-refugee-cartoon-isn-t-satirical-it-s-inflammatory-1.1654631 http://gulfnews.com/opinion/thinkers/charlie-hebdo-s-refugee-cartoon-isn-t-satirical-it-s-inflammatory-1.1654631
[FairfieldLife] Re: Interesting Take on This
I know nothing about Charlie Hebdo, except for the occasional cartoons that break through the clutter. You have publications on the right which are always spewing out false stories, you have publications on the left that choose to push cultural buttons. You have comedians on TV every night poking fun at politicians and religious figures. It's just part of the warp and woof. That said, I do think some restraint is in order. I just found this cartoon a lot more funny than offensive. Says something about me, I suppose. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : Another thing to keep in mind is that war breeds extremists, and many in the Middle East, not completely without cause, see the West as the invaders. So, they are flooding into Europe now, displaced, some with nasty intent, and here is this irresponsible little magazine, printing clever little cartoons to inflame it all further. Helpful? Not at all. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : Honestly, I go both ways on it. In many instances I think it's a bad idea to provoke the extremest element like this, but in this case, for whatever reason, I thought it was quite funny and spot on. Plus, and this is unfortunate, it seems right now the extremists are only going to be able to go after the softer targets. Everyone else is on such high alert. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : too clever by half, I think. The world is not an extension of France, or Europe, and media travels at the speed of light now. So, sure, it is clever, but there is a wider audience they are setting themselves against, immediately upon publication. Not all speech is "free", even if permitted by law. If they want to publish this as a newsletter within a university or something, Harvard Lampoon-style, ok, but to blast this type of message globally is inflammatory, not matter how skillfully it is done. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : My take was that it was a lot more nuanced than a straight shot at the "Prophet". That will definitely get you in trouble. On the other hand, I don't know if they, or others are soft pedaling the "Prophet" stuff. Again, I found it very clever. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : Same here. They can point their precious satire at those living in the 14th century, but then be prepared to reap the 14th century consequences. As it is, they are asking for continuous retribution. I wonder if each new employee is issued a kevlar vest?? ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : I personally believe the recent Hebdo cartoon went too far in the wrong direction. I was appalled by it. Here is what one writer thought: http://gulfnews.com/opinion/thinkers/charlie-hebdo-s-refugee-cartoon-isn-t-satirical-it-s-inflammatory-1.1654631 http://gulfnews.com/opinion/thinkers/charlie-hebdo-s-refugee-cartoon-isn-t-satirical-it-s-inflammatory-1.1654631
[FairfieldLife] Re: Interesting Take on This
I found there to be a degree of separation between the actual child and the point it was trying to make. I placed it in that larger context, and in my admittedly perverse sense of humor, found it funny. And having grown up as a member of the "tribe", I do find many jokes about the "tribe" funny. Often because there is usually a grain or two of truth in them. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : Actually, it was the Israeli Anti Semitic Cartoon Contest. It's just that many of the cartoons pertained to the Holocaust. It's not that I can't laugh at serious subjects. I don't think there's a subject under the sun that can't be presented as quite hilarious given the correct context and the appropriate delivery. I go by my gut sometimes and my gut didn't like that particular cartoon of Hebdo's. In fact, I am positive there is not a mother or father on the planet who would have found it funny or satirically apropos if that child was their own. Is that lack of objectivity on their part? Maybe. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : I admit, I thought it was brilliant. It reminded me of some of the cartoons from the Israeli Anti Semitic Holocaust Cartoon Contest, many of which I thought were also hilarious. Yea, I know what it probably says about me. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : I personally believe the recent Hebdo cartoon went too far in the wrong direction. I was appalled by it. Here is what one writer thought: http://gulfnews.com/opinion/thinkers/charlie-hebdo-s-refugee-cartoon-isn-t-satirical-it-s-inflammatory-1.1654631 http://gulfnews.com/opinion/thinkers/charlie-hebdo-s-refugee-cartoon-isn-t-satirical-it-s-inflammatory-1.1654631
[FairfieldLife] Re: Interesting Take on This
That (hi-lighted part) is how I felt. If I want tragedy, I can find it a half block from where I live. It may not be as severe, or possibly have the emotional tug, but it's right around the corner. We humans are a screwed up lot, and war is good at bring out the worst. What to do? Try to make a difference in one's little sphere of influence. I also am not so cynical about the goal of the cartoon to make a buck. Charlie Hebdo mission, I don't think has ever been to rake in big dollars. They are there to push the envelope culturally. I probably find most of what they publish tasteless, or at least of little interest, but I don't think the profit motive is what drives their business. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : The cartoon is about how easily manipulated popular opinion is, first you have the dead child that made everyone throw open their arms to take in refugees, then you have an incident that underlines there's a bit of work to do with integration - and everyone is on the streets on anti-immigrant demo's! It's actually rather clever No it's not. It's perverse and they were whoremongers to have used this child to make money and shock people.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Interesting Take on This
Another thing to keep in mind is that war breeds extremists, and many in the Middle East, not completely without cause, see the West as the invaders. So, they are flooding into Europe now, displaced, some with nasty intent, and here is this irresponsible little magazine, printing clever little cartoons to inflame it all further. Helpful? Not at all. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : Honestly, I go both ways on it. In many instances I think it's a bad idea to provoke the extremest element like this, but in this case, for whatever reason, I thought it was quite funny and spot on. Plus, and this is unfortunate, it seems right now the extremists are only going to be able to go after the softer targets. Everyone else is on such high alert. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : too clever by half, I think. The world is not an extension of France, or Europe, and media travels at the speed of light now. So, sure, it is clever, but there is a wider audience they are setting themselves against, immediately upon publication. Not all speech is "free", even if permitted by law. If they want to publish this as a newsletter within a university or something, Harvard Lampoon-style, ok, but to blast this type of message globally is inflammatory, not matter how skillfully it is done. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : My take was that it was a lot more nuanced than a straight shot at the "Prophet". That will definitely get you in trouble. On the other hand, I don't know if they, or others are soft pedaling the "Prophet" stuff. Again, I found it very clever. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : Same here. They can point their precious satire at those living in the 14th century, but then be prepared to reap the 14th century consequences. As it is, they are asking for continuous retribution. I wonder if each new employee is issued a kevlar vest?? ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : I personally believe the recent Hebdo cartoon went too far in the wrong direction. I was appalled by it. Here is what one writer thought: http://gulfnews.com/opinion/thinkers/charlie-hebdo-s-refugee-cartoon-isn-t-satirical-it-s-inflammatory-1.1654631 http://gulfnews.com/opinion/thinkers/charlie-hebdo-s-refugee-cartoon-isn-t-satirical-it-s-inflammatory-1.1654631
[FairfieldLife] Re: Interesting Take on This
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : Actually, it was the Israeli Anti Semitic Cartoon Contest. It's just that many of the cartoons pertained to the Holocaust. It's not that I can't laugh at serious subjects. I don't think there's a subject under the sun that can't be presented as quite hilarious given the correct context and the appropriate delivery. I go by my gut sometimes and my gut didn't like that particular cartoon of Hebdo's. In fact, I am positive there is not a mother or father on the planet who would have found it funny or satirically apropos if that child was their own. Is that lack of objectivity on their part? Maybe. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : I admit, I thought it was brilliant. It reminded me of some of the cartoons from the Israeli Anti Semitic Holocaust Cartoon Contest, many of which I thought were also hilarious. Yea, I know what it probably says about me. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : I personally believe the recent Hebdo cartoon went too far in the wrong direction. I was appalled by it. Here is what one writer thought: http://gulfnews.com/opinion/thinkers/charlie-hebdo-s-refugee-cartoon-isn-t-satirical-it-s-inflammatory-1.1654631 http://gulfnews.com/opinion/thinkers/charlie-hebdo-s-refugee-cartoon-isn-t-satirical-it-s-inflammatory-1.1654631
[FairfieldLife] Re: Interesting Take on This
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : I personally believe the recent Hebdo cartoon went too far in the wrong direction. I was appalled by it. Here is what one writer thought: http://gulfnews.com/opinion/thinkers/charlie-hebdo-s-refugee-cartoon-isn-t-satirical-it-s-inflammatory-1.1654631 http://gulfnews.com/opinion/thinkers/charlie-hebdo-s-refugee-cartoon-isn-t-satirical-it-s-inflammatory-1.1654631 So we shouldn't be satirical in case someone doesn't get it? Not at all. This is not satire for me while, apparently, you found it satirical. That is how it goes. Some things are funny to some, not to others. Some movies/books/songs make one cry, another is unmoved. So it goes. For me, this small body on the beach, this innocent being lying dead before his sixth birthday, should not be depicted as some depraved sexual deviant sometime in the future. That is bullshit. That baby boy was a real person. He was absolutely innocent and to extrapolate that one day he would be some sexual predator is not satire. It is dastardly projection using this small boy to sell magazines. The cartoon is about how easily manipulated popular opinion is, first you have the dead child that made everyone throw open their arms to take in refugees, then you have an incident that underlines there's a bit of work to do with integration - and everyone is on the streets on anti-immigrant demo's! It's actually rather clever No it's not. It's perverse and they were whoremongers to have used this child to make money and shock people.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Interesting Take on This
Honestly, I go both ways on it. In many instances I think it's a bad idea to provoke the extremest element like this, but in this case, for whatever reason, I thought it was quite funny and spot on. Plus, and this is unfortunate, it seems right now the extremists are only going to be able to go after the softer targets. Everyone else is on such high alert. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : too clever by half, I think. The world is not an extension of France, or Europe, and media travels at the speed of light now. So, sure, it is clever, but there is a wider audience they are setting themselves against, immediately upon publication. Not all speech is "free", even if permitted by law. If they want to publish this as a newsletter within a university or something, Harvard Lampoon-style, ok, but to blast this type of message globally is inflammatory, not matter how skillfully it is done. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : My take was that it was a lot more nuanced than a straight shot at the "Prophet". That will definitely get you in trouble. On the other hand, I don't know if they, or others are soft pedaling the "Prophet" stuff. Again, I found it very clever. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : Same here. They can point their precious satire at those living in the 14th century, but then be prepared to reap the 14th century consequences. As it is, they are asking for continuous retribution. I wonder if each new employee is issued a kevlar vest?? ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : I personally believe the recent Hebdo cartoon went too far in the wrong direction. I was appalled by it. Here is what one writer thought: http://gulfnews.com/opinion/thinkers/charlie-hebdo-s-refugee-cartoon-isn-t-satirical-it-s-inflammatory-1.1654631 http://gulfnews.com/opinion/thinkers/charlie-hebdo-s-refugee-cartoon-isn-t-satirical-it-s-inflammatory-1.1654631
[FairfieldLife] Re: Interesting Take on This
too clever by half, I think. The world is not an extension of France, or Europe, and media travels at the speed of light now. So, sure, it is clever, but there is a wider audience they are setting themselves against, immediately upon publication. Not all speech is "free", even if permitted by law. If they want to publish this as a newsletter within a university or something, Harvard Lampoon-style, ok, but to blast this type of message globally is inflammatory, not matter how skillfully it is done. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : My take was that it was a lot more nuanced than a straight shot at the "Prophet". That will definitely get you in trouble. On the other hand, I don't know if they, or others are soft pedaling the "Prophet" stuff. Again, I found it very clever. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : Same here. They can point their precious satire at those living in the 14th century, but then be prepared to reap the 14th century consequences. As it is, they are asking for continuous retribution. I wonder if each new employee is issued a kevlar vest?? ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : I personally believe the recent Hebdo cartoon went too far in the wrong direction. I was appalled by it. Here is what one writer thought: http://gulfnews.com/opinion/thinkers/charlie-hebdo-s-refugee-cartoon-isn-t-satirical-it-s-inflammatory-1.1654631 http://gulfnews.com/opinion/thinkers/charlie-hebdo-s-refugee-cartoon-isn-t-satirical-it-s-inflammatory-1.1654631
[FairfieldLife] Re: Interesting Take on This
My take was that it was a lot more nuanced than a straight shot at the "Prophet". That will definitely get you in trouble. On the other hand, I don't know if they, or others are soft pedaling the "Prophet" stuff. Again, I found it very clever. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : Same here. They can point their precious satire at those living in the 14th century, but then be prepared to reap the 14th century consequences. As it is, they are asking for continuous retribution. I wonder if each new employee is issued a kevlar vest?? ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : I personally believe the recent Hebdo cartoon went too far in the wrong direction. I was appalled by it. Here is what one writer thought: http://gulfnews.com/opinion/thinkers/charlie-hebdo-s-refugee-cartoon-isn-t-satirical-it-s-inflammatory-1.1654631 http://gulfnews.com/opinion/thinkers/charlie-hebdo-s-refugee-cartoon-isn-t-satirical-it-s-inflammatory-1.1654631
[FairfieldLife] Re: Interesting Take on This
Actually, it was the Israeli Anti Semitic Cartoon Contest. It's just that many of the cartoons pertained to the Holocaust. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : I admit, I thought it was brilliant. It reminded me of some of the cartoons from the Israeli Anti Semitic Holocaust Cartoon Contest, many of which I thought were also hilarious. Yea, I know what it probably says about me. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : I personally believe the recent Hebdo cartoon went too far in the wrong direction. I was appalled by it. Here is what one writer thought: http://gulfnews.com/opinion/thinkers/charlie-hebdo-s-refugee-cartoon-isn-t-satirical-it-s-inflammatory-1.1654631 http://gulfnews.com/opinion/thinkers/charlie-hebdo-s-refugee-cartoon-isn-t-satirical-it-s-inflammatory-1.1654631
[FairfieldLife] Re: Interesting Take on This
I admit, I thought it was brilliant. It reminded me of some of the cartoons from the Israeli Anti Semitic Holocaust Cartoon Contest, many of which I thought were also hilarious. Yea, I know what it probably says about me. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : I personally believe the recent Hebdo cartoon went too far in the wrong direction. I was appalled by it. Here is what one writer thought: http://gulfnews.com/opinion/thinkers/charlie-hebdo-s-refugee-cartoon-isn-t-satirical-it-s-inflammatory-1.1654631 http://gulfnews.com/opinion/thinkers/charlie-hebdo-s-refugee-cartoon-isn-t-satirical-it-s-inflammatory-1.1654631
[FairfieldLife] Re: Interesting Take on This
Same here. They can point their precious satire at those living in the 14th century, but then be prepared to reap the 14th century consequences. As it is, they are asking for continuous retribution. I wonder if each new employee is issued a kevlar vest?? ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : I personally believe the recent Hebdo cartoon went too far in the wrong direction. I was appalled by it. Here is what one writer thought: http://gulfnews.com/opinion/thinkers/charlie-hebdo-s-refugee-cartoon-isn-t-satirical-it-s-inflammatory-1.1654631 http://gulfnews.com/opinion/thinkers/charlie-hebdo-s-refugee-cartoon-isn-t-satirical-it-s-inflammatory-1.1654631
[FairfieldLife] Re: Interesting Take on This
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote : I personally believe the recent Hebdo cartoon went too far in the wrong direction. I was appalled by it. Here is what one writer thought: http://gulfnews.com/opinion/thinkers/charlie-hebdo-s-refugee-cartoon-isn-t-satirical-it-s-inflammatory-1.1654631 http://gulfnews.com/opinion/thinkers/charlie-hebdo-s-refugee-cartoon-isn-t-satirical-it-s-inflammatory-1.1654631 So we shouldn't be satirical in case someone doesn't get it? The cartoon is about how easily manipulated popular opinion is, first you have the dead child that made everyone throw open their arms to take in refugees, then you have an incident that underlines there's a bit of work to do with integration - and everyone is on the streets on anti-immigrant demo's! It's actually rather clever
