Re: [Felvtalk] Pet Sitters
Check with the vet techs at the vet/vets you frequent. On Mar 6, 2012, at 9:08 PM, Katie Marie Armijo wrote: Hi All, I was wondering if anyone one knew of a good pet sitter near Thousand Oaks, CA. We have 3 cats, one who is 6 months and has FELV. Starting next month we will be traveling a lot for the whole summer and need someone to watch our babies while we are gone. If anyone know someone or has any advice on a good way to find someone that would be awesome! Thank you, Katie ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] caboodle ranch - other side of the story links
I thought he did take in ferals at his ranch. Ones that were pulled from animal control or had to be relocated. Heard that years ago so I'm not sure. “I am not interested to know whether vivisection produces results that are profitable to the human race or doesn’t….the pain which it inflicts upon unconsenting animals is the basis of my enmity toward it, and it is to me sufficient justification of the enmity without looking further.” – Mark Twain Date: Tue, 6 Mar 2012 23:17:08 -0500 From: g...@optonline.net To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] caboodle ranch - other side of the story links I know many people who do TNR and have dedicated volunteers taking care of them, even trapping for vet visits. Personally, I don’t like some of the ways that TNR cats are provided or NOT provided for. Some groups spay cats and release them almost immediately, even in freezing weather (when it is a known fact that healing is seriously hindered) , and such consequences as infections, and even disembowelment due to ruptures.Yes, one should expect cats at such a ranch to be provided with medical care!I can’t even imagine how many people are required to seriously care for 700 cats!Natalie From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Marta Gasper Sent: Tuesday, March 06, 2012 10:26 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] caboodle ranch - other side of the story links consider how many times TNR's put domestic cats back on the street if there were feeders? (I'm not one of them, but consider that, before condemning the guy.) You mean the policy of returning cats to a feral colony if the colony has a feeder?..how that fits into this situation? TNR is for ferals not housecats.Though in some cases_such as mine I trap cats on the loose, ferals or not. If feral they go to a feral colony, if not I try to find owner, education goes so far, most people will want to keep the cat in/out but at least the cat is neutered now and won't be making more. If possible I take in the cat, list as found and if it is not claimed I put him up for adoption_taking in all tame cats is just not possible but I do try to bring in the declaweds and kittens._ I don't just abandon the cat out there, I make sure it has shelter and a feeder.I know very well this is considered cruel by a sector of the pop and that's ok, we all have a right to our opinion. But I don't understand how this fits with Caboodle, you mean because he had all these cats roaming the property and they weren't taken care of? If so I would say that since he said Caboodle was a sanctuary that implies the cats are to be taken care of, if sick taken to a vet etc._Very different from a feral colony where the intentions are the same but nobody wants a colony of sick cats and yet there are ferals that will die rather than walk in a trap; I know I had one of these. We tried for half a year to trap him and in his last months it was evident that he would have had to be euthanized. We just could not, and one day we found him dead. It happens often and makes caretakers feel awful. A sanctuary OTOH is expected to treat each and every cat. A sanctuary is not just a place to leave a pet, walk away and forget all about it. That is why a person is expected to fund the cat care. Granted some of the cats could have been dumped at the place and no money to support them. But it wasn't the majority, and if CG couldn't afford them did he ask rescues to take them? I don't know that, I can't side with either story but just wanted to comment on that remark abt TNR and how it fit with the CR situation, I think it doesn't.Martahttp://homelessnomore.webs.com/ ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
[Felvtalk] Fwd: caboodle ranch - other side of the story links
My bf and I take care of over 140 feral/homeless cats on the streets everyday (in over 20 different spots), 365 days a year for several years now, they are spayed and neutered/vaccinated, treated for illnesses as much as we are able (including going to far lengths both medically/financially--when not unkind given their temprament, some are friendly or close--and far lengths to trap them in drainpipes or wherever they might be if they are ill and difficult to trap). We have treated colonies successfully for scabies both multiple cats at a time or individual ones, we have a friendly feral in our bathroom right now recovering (very well!) from liver disease. We have brought in CRF cats to live out their lives, unblocked ferals and continued them healthfully with dietary management and supplements. I live in Florida where fortunately, weather is pretty easy on the cats--it is unfortunately also why there are so many feral cats down here, they can reproduce year round due to the climate, and, the climate of course doesn't control the population otherwise either. I have known about Caboodle Ranch since 2007, back when there were far fewer cats (150 or less I think) and many of my contacts went there with good reports. It seemed to me in the last couple of years from the things I was hearing that there were problems. Caboodle Ranch took in many feral cats from situations/rescuers in Florida who's colonies were otherwise facing death/extermination; they also took in many friendly pets from people who, for whatever reason, were no longer 'able' (or willing, my guess in most cases) to care for them. To me, that would account for the 400 who the ASPCA says (probably correct) were dying for attention and went right into carriers. I am not sticking up for Caboodle, nor the other side, but I would love for even some sort of a misdemeanor neglect/cruelty/stupidity charge to be brought on every person who dumped their friendly pet there, thinking that for $150, they were going to get the love, attention and medical care needed amongst hundreds of others that they themselves were apparently not either willing or able to provide to them on a one-on-one (or two or ten--I doutbt these people had 700 cats) basis. It sucks that we rescuers are dealing with such large volumes and many life and death choices. Since the people on this group are people who chose life for FELV+ cats (which even some rescuers might not), I would hope that choosing to spay/neuter (TNR) and care for a feral cat for their life on the streets would be an act that is respected (there are people who believe that not euthanizing an FELV is cruel as well, unfortunately, or even believe it's wrong for them to take homes from healthy cats--an opinion that really bothers me). We are choosing life for these feral cats, making their lives better, and ensuring they do not contribute to the overpopulation problem. It is a lifetime commitment, some may not do a very good job at it just like some owners do not. We are making the best of a bad situation, and actually doing something to fight the overpopulation problem that results not only in so many living on or being born on the streets, but then also ending up in shelters. The way I see it you are either part of the problem or part of the solution. Whether you think feral cats should live outdoors or not, spaying/neutering (TNR) serves to reduce the number living on the streets. Those practicing TNR are part of the solution. People who haul feral cats in to be killed at shelters, on tax payer dollars, could instead be taking them to a spay/neuter clinic. I have no idea what to make of the differing reports on Caboodle's status in the time leading up to the raid, but I wish the people who dumped their pets at a large scale sanctuary might have to justify their actions rather than just shake their heads and say but we gave him $150 and trusted him. It is sad for those who perhaps were dealing with serious illnesses such as cancer, etc., but I'd be willing to bet a lot of those people were just moving and not taking the cats with them. ** *From:* felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org [mailto: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] *On Behalf Of *Marta Gasper *Sent:* Tuesday, March 06, 2012 10:26 PM *To:* felvtalk@felineleukemia.org *Subject:* Re: [Felvtalk] caboodle ranch - other side of the story links** ** ** ** consider how many times TNR's put domestic cats back on the street if there were feeders? (I'm not one of them, but consider that, before condemning the guy.) You mean the policy of returning cats to a feral colony if the colony has a feeder?..how that fits into this situation? TNR is for ferals not housecats. Though in some cases_such as mine I trap cats on the loose, ferals or not. If feral they go to a feral colony, if not I try to find owner, education goes so far, most people will want to keep the cat in/out but at least the cat is neutered
Re: [Felvtalk] caboodle ranch - other side of the story links
Wouldn't surprise me. Some of the AC's around here send animals to these places to keep their euthanasia rates down. Really sad. Animals would be better off being put down Maureen Olvey molvey...@hotmail.com wrote: I thought he did take in ferals at his ranch. Ones that were pulled from animal control or had to be relocated. Heard that years ago so I'm not sure. “I am not interested to know whether vivisection produces results that are profitable to the human race or doesn’t….the pain which it inflicts upon unconsenting animals is the basis of my enmity toward it, and it is to me sufficient justification of the enmity without looking further.” – Mark Twain Date: Tue, 6 Mar 2012 23:17:08 -0500 From: g...@optonline.net To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] caboodle ranch - other side of the story links I know many people who do TNR and have dedicated volunteers taking care of them, even trapping for vet visits. Personally, I don’t like some of the ways that TNR cats are provided or NOT provided for. Some groups spay cats and release them almost immediately, even in freezing weather (when it is a known fact that healing is seriously hindered) , and such consequences as infections, and even disembowelment due to ruptures.Yes, one should expect cats at such a ranch to be provided with medical care!I can’t even imagine how many people are required to seriously care for 700 cats!Natalie From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Marta Gasper Sent: Tuesday, March 06, 2012 10:26 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] caboodle ranch - other side of the story links consider how many times TNR's put domestic cats back on the street if there were feeders? (I'm not one of them, but consider that, before condemning the guy.) You mean the policy of returning cats to a feral colony if the colony has a feeder?..how that fits into this situation? TNR is for ferals not housecats.Though in some cases_such as mine I trap cats on the loose, ferals or not. If feral they go to a feral colony, if not I try to find owner, education goes so far, most people will want to keep the cat in/out but at least the cat is neutered now and won't be making more. If possible I take in the cat, list as found and if it is not claimed I put him up for adoption_taking in all tame cats is just not possible but I do try to bring in the declaweds and kittens._ I don't just abandon the cat out there, I make sure it has shelter and a feeder.I know very well this is considered cruel by a sector of the pop and that's ok, we all have a right to our opinion. But I don't understand how this fits with Caboodle, you mean because he had all these cats roaming the property and they weren't taken care of? If so I would say that since he said Caboodle was a sanctuary that implies the cats are to be taken care of, if sick taken to a vet etc._Very different from a feral colony where the intentions are the same but nobody wants a colony of sick cats and yet there are ferals that will die rather than walk in a trap; I know I had one of these. We tried for half a year to trap him and in his last months it was evident that he would have had to be euthanized. We just could not, and one day we found him dead. It happens often and makes caretakers feel awful. A sanctuary OTOH is expected to treat each and every cat. A sanctuary is not just a place to leave a pet, walk away and forget all about it. That is why a person is expected to fund the cat care. Granted some of the cats could have been dumped at the place and no money to support them. But it wasn't the majority, and if CG couldn't afford them did he ask rescues to take them? I don't know that, I can't side with either story but just wanted to comment on that remark abt TNR and how it fit with the CR situation, I think it doesn't.Martahttp://homelessnomore.webs.com/ ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] Fwd: caboodle ranch - other side of the story links
There are two sides - at least - to everything. There was an article published by a gentleman nearby in Florida who says he knew the Caboodle situation well, had visited often, had helped when he could. He said that many of the cats were simply dumped there not dropped off with $150 but dumped cause the address was known. That they were in the (continual) process of vetting and trying to identify cats that showed up that needed vetting and/or spay neuter. I think this guy was trying his best. I think he may have been vetting as he could but if people don't help, and continue to dump their unwanted cats what do you do? I don't know what is truly the case cause I never saw the place or met the man but all indications are he had the animals best interest in mind and did what he could til he drowned under the number of animals. As for those who say he paid himself large amounts out of the money donated to use for the cats, I don't see where $1000/month (or $12,000 a year) is a 'large amount' in anyone's book. IF that is true as reported. And if he spend his time trying to do the best for the cats, as a full time job it is legally allowed for him to take enuff to pay electric, groceries, etc. I was living on a very little over that amount for almost 2 years and it is NOT a lot of money. And I am VERY concerned PETA is involved. They are butchers and I will never have anything to do with them except disagree with them. They kill animals and lie thru their teeth. Anyway, right or wrong, I would like to hear it all before judging him guilty. I doubt he is 100% innocent or 100% guilty but as far as the world is concerned he is already judged. Not sure that is right. K. On 3/7/12, Heather furrygi...@gmail.com wrote: My bf and I take care of over 140 feral/homeless cats on the streets everyday (in over 20 different spots), 365 days a year for several years now, they are spayed and neutered/vaccinated, treated for illnesses as much as we are able (including going to far lengths both medically/financially--when not unkind given their temprament, some are friendly or close--and far lengths to trap them in drainpipes or wherever they might be if they are ill and difficult to trap). We have treated colonies successfully for scabies both multiple cats at a time or individual ones, we have a friendly feral in our bathroom right now recovering (very well!) from liver disease. We have brought in CRF cats to live out their lives, unblocked ferals and continued them healthfully with dietary management and supplements. I live in Florida where fortunately, weather is pretty easy on the cats--it is unfortunately also why there are so many feral cats down here, they can reproduce year round due to the climate, and, the climate of course doesn't control the population otherwise either. I have known about Caboodle Ranch since 2007, back when there were far fewer cats (150 or less I think) and many of my contacts went there with good reports. It seemed to me in the last couple of years from the things I was hearing that there were problems. Caboodle Ranch took in many feral cats from situations/rescuers in Florida who's colonies were otherwise facing death/extermination; they also took in many friendly pets from people who, for whatever reason, were no longer 'able' (or willing, my guess in most cases) to care for them. To me, that would account for the 400 who the ASPCA says (probably correct) were dying for attention and went right into carriers. I am not sticking up for Caboodle, nor the other side, but I would love for even some sort of a misdemeanor neglect/cruelty/stupidity charge to be brought on every person who dumped their friendly pet there, thinking that for $150, they were going to get the love, attention and medical care needed amongst hundreds of others that they themselves were apparently not either willing or able to provide to them on a one-on-one (or two or ten--I doutbt these people had 700 cats) basis. It sucks that we rescuers are dealing with such large volumes and many life and death choices. Since the people on this group are people who chose life for FELV+ cats (which even some rescuers might not), I would hope that choosing to spay/neuter (TNR) and care for a feral cat for their life on the streets would be an act that is respected (there are people who believe that not euthanizing an FELV is cruel as well, unfortunately, or even believe it's wrong for them to take homes from healthy cats--an opinion that really bothers me). We are choosing life for these feral cats, making their lives better, and ensuring they do not contribute to the overpopulation problem. It is a lifetime commitment, some may not do a very good job at it just like some owners do not. We are making the best of a bad situation, and actually doing something to fight the overpopulation problem that results not only in so many living on or being born on the streets,
Re: [Felvtalk] Fwd: caboodle ranch - other side of the story links
$150.00 for life long care of a cat is not enough. The place I have chosen for my babies requests $400.00 per year per catX the number of years you expect the cat to live. This seams to be more in line consdering what I put out each year o my cats. If anyone believes $15 total will spport the pet for life is either living in a dream world or just wants a quick, cheap way out of dealing with the cat. I have 7 and have a life insurance policy set up to provide for them. I see people who I don't tink should have children much less pets jusging by the way their children are cared for. I knowI can care for (fiancially and physicaly) for the 7 I have and knowing that I a asucker for a cute fce, have asked my close friends and vet to talk to me when they see I am in danger of taking on more. If I wo the sweepstakes, I would collect as many unwanted pets and children and give them a secure home. All petd would be spayed and neutered before anything else. Then it would be their choice to stay with me in my home or return to the wild, but my experiene with ferals is that given a chance to learn to trust humans, they prefer to stay with their new caregivers. What we have to do is educate humans to adopt a responsible attitude toward aimals. God did make us stewards of the earth and all in it. His intention was not for us to plunder and use the earth and its ihabitants for our own selfish deisres. We have in the most part, failed. Enough of my preaching for the day. May everyone here have a happy future along with thei furbabies. Heather furrygi...@gmail.com wrote: My bf and I take care of over 140 feral/homeless cats on the streets everyday (in over 20 different spots), 365 days a year for several years now, they are spayed and neutered/vaccinated, treated for illnesses as much as we are able (including going to far lengths both medically/financially--when not unkind given their temprament, some are friendly or close--and far lengths to trap them in drainpipes or wherever they might be if they are ill and difficult to trap). We have treated colonies successfully for scabies both multiple cats at a time or individual ones, we have a friendly feral in our bathroom right now recovering (very well!) from liver disease. We have brought in CRF cats to live out their lives, unblocked ferals and continued them healthfully with dietary management and supplements. I live in Florida where fortunately, weather is pretty easy on the cats--it is unfortunately also why there are so many feral cats down here, they can reproduce year round due to the climate, and, the climate of course doesn't control the population otherwise either. I have known about Caboodle Ranch since 2007, back when there were far fewer cats (150 or less I think) and many of my contacts went there with good reports. It seemed to me in the last couple of years from the things I was hearing that there were problems. Caboodle Ranch took in many feral cats from situations/rescuers in Florida who's colonies were otherwise facing death/extermination; they also took in many friendly pets from people who, for whatever reason, were no longer 'able' (or willing, my guess in most cases) to care for them. To me, that would account for the 400 who the ASPCA says (probably correct) were dying for attention and went right into carriers. I am not sticking up for Caboodle, nor the other side, but I would love for even some sort of a misdemeanor neglect/cruelty/stupidity charge to be brought on every person who dumped their friendly pet there, thinking that for $150, they were going to get the love, attention and medical care needed amongst hundreds of others that they themselves were apparently not either willing or able to provide to them on a one-on-one (or two or ten--I doutbt these people had 700 cats) basis. It sucks that we rescuers are dealing with such large volumes and many life and death choices. Since the people on this group are people who chose life for FELV+ cats (which even some rescuers might not), I would hope that choosing to spay/neuter (TNR) and care for a feral cat for their life on the streets would be an act that is respected (there are people who believe that not euthanizing an FELV is cruel as well, unfortunately, or even believe it's wrong for them to take homes from healthy cats--an opinion that really bothers me). We are choosing life for these feral cats, making their lives better, and ensuring they do not contribute to the overpopulation problem. It is a lifetime commitment, some may not do a very good job at it just like some owners do not. We are making the best of a bad situation, and actually doing something to fight the overpopulation problem that results not only in so many living on or being born on the streets, but then also ending up in shelters. The way I see it you are either part of the problem or part of the solution. Whether you
Re: [Felvtalk] Fwd: caboodle ranch - other side of the story links
Amen, I agree 100%. It's time for the dumpers, who are virtually invisible, to start paying the piper. And the people who TRULY have good intentions to stop being persecuted. Take care everyone Marcia Sent from my iPhone On Mar 7, 2012, at 9:22 PM, katskat1 katsk...@gmail.com wrote: There are two sides - at least - to everything. There was an article published by a gentleman nearby in Florida who says he knew the Caboodle situation well, had visited often, had helped when he could. He said that many of the cats were simply dumped there not dropped off with $150 but dumped cause the address was known. That they were in the (continual) process of vetting and trying to identify cats that showed up that needed vetting and/or spay neuter. I think this guy was trying his best. I think he may have been vetting as he could but if people don't help, and continue to dump their unwanted cats what do you do? I don't know what is truly the case cause I never saw the place or met the man but all indications are he had the animals best interest in mind and did what he could til he drowned under the number of animals. As for those who say he paid himself large amounts out of the money donated to use for the cats, I don't see where $1000/month (or $12,000 a year) is a 'large amount' in anyone's book. IF that is true as reported. And if he spend his time trying to do the best for the cats, as a full time job it is legally allowed for him to take enuff to pay electric, groceries, etc. I was living on a very little over that amount for almost 2 years and it is NOT a lot of money. And I am VERY concerned PETA is involved. They are butchers and I will never have anything to do with them except disagree with them. They kill animals and lie thru their teeth. Anyway, right or wrong, I would like to hear it all before judging him guilty. I doubt he is 100% innocent or 100% guilty but as far as the world is concerned he is already judged. Not sure that is right. K. On 3/7/12, Heather furrygi...@gmail.com wrote: My bf and I take care of over 140 feral/homeless cats on the streets everyday (in over 20 different spots), 365 days a year for several years now, they are spayed and neutered/vaccinated, treated for illnesses as much as we are able (including going to far lengths both medically/financially--when not unkind given their temprament, some are friendly or close--and far lengths to trap them in drainpipes or wherever they might be if they are ill and difficult to trap). We have treated colonies successfully for scabies both multiple cats at a time or individual ones, we have a friendly feral in our bathroom right now recovering (very well!) from liver disease. We have brought in CRF cats to live out their lives, unblocked ferals and continued them healthfully with dietary management and supplements. I live in Florida where fortunately, weather is pretty easy on the cats--it is unfortunately also why there are so many feral cats down here, they can reproduce year round due to the climate, and, the climate of course doesn't control the population otherwise either. I have known about Caboodle Ranch since 2007, back when there were far fewer cats (150 or less I think) and many of my contacts went there with good reports. It seemed to me in the last couple of years from the things I was hearing that there were problems. Caboodle Ranch took in many feral cats from situations/rescuers in Florida who's colonies were otherwise facing death/extermination; they also took in many friendly pets from people who, for whatever reason, were no longer 'able' (or willing, my guess in most cases) to care for them. To me, that would account for the 400 who the ASPCA says (probably correct) were dying for attention and went right into carriers. I am not sticking up for Caboodle, nor the other side, but I would love for even some sort of a misdemeanor neglect/cruelty/stupidity charge to be brought on every person who dumped their friendly pet there, thinking that for $150, they were going to get the love, attention and medical care needed amongst hundreds of others that they themselves were apparently not either willing or able to provide to them on a one-on-one (or two or ten--I doutbt these people had 700 cats) basis. It sucks that we rescuers are dealing with such large volumes and many life and death choices. Since the people on this group are people who chose life for FELV+ cats (which even some rescuers might not), I would hope that choosing to spay/neuter (TNR) and care for a feral cat for their life on the streets would be an act that is respected (there are people who believe that not euthanizing an FELV is cruel as well, unfortunately, or even believe it's wrong for them to take homes from healthy cats--an opinion that really bothers me). We are choosing life for these feral cats, making their lives better, and ensuring they do
