[Felvtalk] Section 1983

[Kat Parker]

Hiya Kathryn and everyone.   The federal statute you were referring to,
Kathryn, is Section 1983, and my step-brother, Sheldon Eisenberg, is the
one who wrote the "Section 1983 to the rescue", on Nathan's site you found,
and Sheldon used it in court representing Cathy Nguyen and Nathan against
Los Angeles County Dept of Animal Care and Control, which he won a
stipulated order from the judge in that lawsuit. (Not that it does any good
at all, now, but ...  whatever.   lol)

I did not intend to correct any person in particular, just wanted to
mention the name of the law, which is really easy to forget, actually, but
really wonderful to be able to use for all being a FEDERAL STATUTE, and
there are a lot of rescuers in here.

~Kat~


> -- Forwarded message --
> From: Kathryn Hargreaves 
> To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
> Cc:
> Date: Sun, 3 Jun 2012 18:21:00 -0800
> Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Fwd: Cat shelters
> What do you mean by ``rules''?   Laws?   If they are not in compliance
> with laws, then turn them in.   (Of course, if you're a rescuer pulling
> from these pounds, then you have to protect yourself using the federal law
> Section 1982: http://www.nathanwinograd.com/?p=728
>
> As for the citizens, put ads in the papers, and maybe even send out
> informative flyers (ask for the money to do so via a Chipin).
>
> You can also try to get social media attention via the various animal
> blogs that push shelter reform, e.g., YesBiscuit!.
>
> Who holds the contract with the pound?
>
> Don't give up.   It may take years, and we're seeing progress even in TX.
>
> Probably the moderator would like us to take this offline by now. . .
>
> On Sun, Jun 3, 2012 at 2:50 PM, Lee Evans  wrote:
>
>> The problem here is that I'm in Texas.  Killing is the State Sport.
>> Unfortunately, most of the Animal Control Officers don't even know the new
>> rules, which include acceptance of TNR as a way to control outside cats.
>> They are still terrorizing people who have a small batch of backyard cats
>> who are spayed/neutered and have their rabies shots. They are counting
>> these cats in the 8 cat limit when the new code states specifically that
>> they are NOT included in the cat limit rule.  They recently reduced the
>> number of cats/dogs allowed to 8 from 10.  This makes no sense except when
>> you realize that they will now charge for an "excess animal permit".  Then
>> it makes sense to reduce the legal limit so that a number of people are now
>> over the limit and have to purchase the permit.  Nasty little tricks.
>> People who have received a citation in the past for having over the
>> permissible limit of cats/dogs are prohibited from purchasing the permit.
>> More nonsense.  It would help if all the ACO's were required to read the
>> new codes and then be tested on whether or not they understand them.  The
>> citizens of this city don't know the rules either.  Cat haters are
>> terrorizing cat caring neighbors, threatening them with reporting them when
>> there's nothing to report because the cat caregivers are actually in
>> compliance.  I think that ignorance is our worst enemy. Even when we get
>> good ordinances, they don't work because no one knows about them.
>>
>>
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Re: [Felvtalk] rENaVAST (FROM tANYA'AS crf SITE)

[Natalie]

But don't we all take supplements that are not "drugs", and are not approved
by FDA (which really doesn't mean much - my husband worked for Pfizer his
whole life, I now the inside dope.).  My vet has had some very good results
with it. Since the 90s, the FDA has made it worse for any vitamin companies
to even mention what certain vitamins are good for (as they used to). Now,
when we buy vitamins, we have to learn ourselves what which is good for.
Just recently, Senator Durbin was attempting to screw around with vitamins
.didn't succeed! This is not going to deter me from using RenAvast - it
certainly won't hurt the cat(s).  If it helps - great, if it doesn't,
nothing lost.

 

From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org
[mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Kat Parker
Sent: Tuesday, June 05, 2012 1:01 AM
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] rENaVAST (FROM tANYA'AS crf SITE)

 

RenAvast  (FROM tANYA'S SITE)

  _  

  RenAvast was launched in the USA in summer 2011 and
contains something called Avastamine (AB070597). Avastamine is said to
consist of "naturally occurring biomolecules", which apparently means it is
a proprietary mix of seven specific amino acids or peptides, though they do
not state which ones. 

 

Amino acids are the components of protein. Peptides are the molecules formed
when two or more amino acids are joined together. There are 23 amino acids
which cats need, and they can manufacture twelve of these themselves, but
the other eleven must be obtained from food.
 Taurine is
one example of an amino acid which cats must obtain from food.

Virginia-Maryland Regional College of Veterinary Medicine explains more
about cats and amino acids. 

 

RenAvast is marketed as a dietary supplement. Dietary supplements do not
need US Food and Drug Administration approval but the manufacturers make the
bold claims that RenAvast "can halt the progression of chronic renal failure
in cats" and that "unlike other products and drugs, RenAvast does not treat
the symptoms of renal failure, it treats the cause." The
 FDA states that "a product sold as a dietary supplement and
promoted on its label or in labeling as a treatment, prevention or cure for
a specific disease or condition would be considered an unapproved - and thus
illegal - drug."

 

RenAvast is being widely promoted online. The marketing literature for
RenAvast focuses heavily on a study published online by the manufacturers
(rather than in a veterinary journal),

AB070597 and its effect on declining renal function in felines (2007) Archer
J, published online. This reports on 19 cats who were given RenAvast over a
two year period. Cats joined and left the study during this period so it is
not known over how long a period the results for individual cats were
measured. No cats in the trial were on sub-Q fluids or a prescription diet,
but it is not known if they were receiving other treatments such as
phosphorus binders or Azodyl. Many of the cats were in early stage CKD
(Stage 2 of IRIS), and it is not uncommon for cats in this stage to survive
for years.

 

An unrelated study,   Plasma
amino acid profiles in cats with naturally acquired chronic renal failure
(1999) Goldstein RE, Marks SL, Cowgill LD, Kass PH & Rogers QR American
Journal of Veterinary Research 60(1) pp109-13, found that CKD cats in all
stages of the disease had lower levels of amino acids than healthy cats.
However, they concluded "the magnitude of these changes is mild and of
little clinical relevance." This is an older study, and it might eventually
be shown that supplementary amino acids are in fact helpful to CKD cats, but
currently there is no evidence that RenAvast is the miracle cure it claims
to be.

 

What do I think of RenAvast? My hunch is that RenAvast contains widely
available and inexpensive unpatented amino acids packaged together and
subjected to some clever marketing. If it only contains amino acids and
peptides, it is probably not going to do any harm, but without knowing
exactly what it contains, I cannot say for sure. It might be a good product,
it might not, but it is unlikely to be as effective as its manufacturers
claim, and it is certainly not cheap at over US$30 a month. 

 

Based on the information currently available, I would save my money  and put
it towards more proven treatments than RenAvast.

  

 

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Re: [Felvtalk] rENaVAST (FROM tANYA'AS crf SITE)

[Kat Parker]

*RenAvast  (FROM tANYA'S SITE)
*
--

RenAvast  was launched in the USA in summer 2011 and
contains something called Avastamine (AB070597). Avastamine is said to
consist of "naturally occurring biomolecules", which apparently means it is
a proprietary mix of seven specific amino acids or peptides, though they do
not state which ones.



Amino acids are the components of protein. Peptides are the molecules
formed when two or more amino acids are joined together. There are 23 amino
acids which cats need, and they can manufacture twelve of these themselves,
but the other eleven must be obtained from food.
Taurineis
one example of an amino acid which cats must obtain from food.
Virginia-Maryland
Regional College of Veterinary
Medicine
explains
more about cats and amino acids.



RenAvast is marketed as a dietary supplement. Dietary supplements do not
need US Food and Drug Administration approval but the manufacturers make
the bold claims that RenAvast "can halt the progression of chronic renal
failure in cats" and that "unlike other products and drugs, RenAvast does
not treat the symptoms of renal failure, it treats the cause." The
FDA
states
that "a product sold as a dietary supplement and promoted on its label or
in labeling as a treatment, prevention or cure for a specific disease or
condition would be considered an unapproved - and thus illegal - drug."



RenAvast is being widely promoted online. The marketing literature for
RenAvast focuses heavily on a study published online by the manufacturers
(rather than in a veterinary journal), AB070597 and its effect on declining
renal function in
felines(2007)
Archer J, published online. This reports on 19 cats who were given
RenAvast over a two year period. Cats joined and left the study during this
period so it is not known over how long a period the results for individual
cats were measured. No cats in the trial were on sub-Q fluids or a
prescription diet, but it is not known if they were receiving other
treatments such as phosphorus binders or Azodyl. Many of the cats were in
early stage CKD (Stage 2 of IRIS), and it is not uncommon for cats in this
stage to survive for years.



An unrelated study, Plasma amino acid profiles in cats with naturally
acquired chronic renal failure
 (1999)
Goldstein RE, Marks SL, Cowgill LD, Kass PH & Rogers QR *American Journal
of Veterinary Research* *60(1)* pp109-13, found that CKD cats in all stages
of the disease had lower levels of amino acids than healthy cats. However,
they concluded "the magnitude of these changes is mild and of little
clinical relevance." This is an older study, and it might eventually be
shown that supplementary amino acids are in fact helpful to CKD cats, but
currently there is no evidence that RenAvast is the miracle cure it claims
to be.



What do I think of RenAvast? My hunch is that RenAvast contains widely
available and inexpensive unpatented amino acids packaged together and
subjected to some clever marketing. If it only contains amino acids and
peptides, it is probably not going to do any harm, but without knowing
exactly what it contains, I cannot say for sure. It might be a good
product, it might not, but it is unlikely to be as effective as its
manufacturers claim, and it is certainly not cheap at over US$30 a month.



Based on the information currently available, I would save my money  and
put it towards more proven treatments than RenAvast.
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Re: [Felvtalk] Fwd: Cat shelters

[Marcia Baronda]

Lee
You said this so well. Thank you. I always tell people that that particular 
life is important to the being that is living it. I don't know if it sinks in, 
but it's actually very simple! Crazy as it may sound, I was in the theatre 21 
years ago watching city slickers. When billy crystal was trying to save Norman 
the calf I decided to quit eating meat. His life was worth being saved, just 
because it is a life, not because he is dollars in someone else's eyes. I know 
it was just a movie, but the insinuations in that movie had a huge impact on 
me. Life is life, no matter what form that life takes. Then when they herded 
all the cattle in and the rancher informed them that the cattle were headed for 
slaughter "because their life isn't a very good life anyway". That sealed the 
deal for me. How can ANYONE decide that? Even though we're still talking about 
a movie, this is the general mindset. So anyway, thank you so much for the 
beautiful way you wrote this.

Marcia

Sent from my iPad that my most awesome kids surprised me with, Christmas 2010. 

On Jun 3, 2012, at 6:22 PM, Lee Evans  wrote:

> It's so much easier to slap a label on someone then to ask them why they are 
> doing what they are doing.  The problem is that they don't see that the life 
> force that is in humans is also in every other living being.  To them, cats 
> are rocks.  They can't see beyond their own bare hide to the spirit inside 
> the furry hide of a cat, wolf, dog, cow, sheep and other animals.  Even non 
> furry beings have a right to live.  They can't seem to get the message that 
> there's nothing crazy about caring about or for other individuals on this 
> planet.  Lack of awareness is the basis for all racism, ageism and misogyny.  
> It's unfortunate that the brain is fast becoming a vestigial organ.  More 
> soap from my soapbox.  
> 
> From: "dlg...@windstream.net" 
> To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
> Cc: Lee Evans  
> Sent: Sunday, June 3, 2012 6:09 PM
> Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Fwd: Cat shelters
> 
> That sounds like Lincoln County, Mo.  Everyone thinks I am crazy for having 7 
> cats and actually taking them to the vet when they are ill.  And I let them 
> come into the house!  My nickname around here is Crazy Cat Lady.  
> 
> 
>  Lee Evans  wrote: 
> > The problem here is that I'm in Texas.  Killing is the State Sport. 
> > Unfortunately, most of the Animal Control Officers don't even know the new 
> > rules, which include acceptance of TNR as a way to control outside cats.  
> > They are still terrorizing people who have a small batch of backyard cats 
> > who are spayed/neutered and have their rabies shots. They are counting 
> > these cats in the 8 cat limit when the new code states specifically that 
> > they are NOT included in the cat limit rule.  They recently reduced the 
> > number of cats/dogs allowed to 8 from 10.  This makes no sense except when 
> > you realize that they will now charge for an "excess animal permit".  Then 
> > it makes sense to reduce the legal limit so that a number of people are now 
> > over the limit and have to purchase the permit.  Nasty little tricks.  
> > People who have received a citation in the past for having over the 
> > permissible limit of cats/dogs are prohibited from purchasing the permit.  
> > More
> >  nonsense. 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From: Kathryn Hargreaves 
> To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
> Sent: Sunday, June 3, 2012 5:28 PM
> Subject: [Felvtalk] Fwd:  Cat shelters
> 
> 
> I trimmed this so maybe it will go through. . .
> 
> 
> -- Forwarded message --
> From: Kathryn Hargreaves 
> Date: Sun, Jun 3, 2012 at 2:24 PM
> Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Cat shelters
> To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
> 
> 
> One approach you can take with the bosses (usually the city councils) of the 
> pounds is to point out that the current staff is most likely permanently 
> mentally damaged by participating in the old methods---much the way soldiers 
> are by combat---and that they either need intensive (life-long?) counseling 
> to change their attitudes, or retirement.   This I gleaned from HSUS' (not a 
> big proponent of No Kill) book on compassion fatigue in the animal care 
> community: 
> http://www.amazon.com/Compassion-Fatigue-Animal-Care-Community-Charles/dp/0974840076
>   
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> >
> >
> >
> > 
> >
> -- 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
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Re: [Felvtalk] FW: RACCOON GETTING INTO CAT STATION/REPLY/thanks reply

[dot winkler]

Thank you all for all of your input and advice.  I do plan on moving the 
feeding station soon.  I had planned on it anyway this spring for other reasons 
and cleaning it good or getting a new bin altogether. Yeah, you're right - the 
cats know to stay away from the raccoons.  So, I think that they are leary to 
go in b/c they wouldn't want a close encounter with that guy!  The feed station 
is behind some boards in a lean-to structure.  I haven't seen the big guy for 
about 3 weeks now though so maybe it moved on along.

What I'd like to do is ask the owner of the property (it's on land with a 
nearby restaraunt) if my husband can build a larger type shed on the property 
with shelves and hang-out areas for the cats - insulate it.  So that they have 
a place that is better to go in the winter months and all can hang out there - 
like a mini-barn.  Of course, my husband is balking at that idea already, not 
to mention the cost!  He is a carpenter and could build anything.  And i 
don't know how the owner of the property would like it either since he is not 
that thrilled at the whole thing anyway - just tolerating me and the cats.  But 
it would look a lot better than all the little houses and lean-to's we 
constructed for them around the grounds.  



 From: Lee Evans 
To: "felvtalk@felineleukemia.org"  
Sent: Sunday, June 3, 2012 10:23 PM
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] FW:  RACCOON GETTING INTO CAT STATION/REPLY
 

It probably IS the raccoon.  They took one look and said to themselves, "Don't 
mess with that guy!!"  You might want to spray something like At Ease on the 
new feeder but don't get it into the food.  Just give the outside walls of the 
bin a little spritz.  I spray At Ease in my cat carriers an hour or so before I 
put a cat in to go to the vet.  It really makes a difference.  I don't think 
it's the skunks. Mostly, cats don't mind that odor because they are too 
intelligent and polite to get themselves sprayed.  It's dogs who will bounce up 
to a skunk, barking like crazy and end up having to take a bath in tomato 
juice. :-)




 From: dot winkler 
To: "felvtalk@felineleukemia.org"  
Sent: Sunday, June 3, 2012 7:50 PM
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] FW:  RACCOON GETTING INTO CAT STATION/REPLY
 

Hi.  I was the one who wrote that e-mail.  I just read your response.  I'm 
telling you that the cats are afraid to go in there now - into the bin with the 
dry food now that I have started refilling it.  They are not even eating it.  
It is fresh food  as i just refilled it.  I tried to coax one of the cats to go 
in and he backed off.  They are skittish lately.  Because that raccoon was so 
large and not afraid of anything - it was running around in the area where 
their little houses were and coming right up to their meat while they were 
eating in daytime hours.  Perhaps it is the skunk smell that also is around but 
that never seemed to bother them in the past.  ???Dotty


 From: Lee Evans 
To: "felvtalk@felineleukemia.org"  
Sent: Saturday, June 2, 2012 1:18 PM
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] FW:  RACCOON GETTING INTO CAT STATION
 

I can't find the email from someone who thinks that the cats are avoiding the 
food because the feeding dish/station smells from raccoon.  This is definitely 
NOT the cause of the cats avoiding the food.  It's probably the food.  It may 
be stale or they are just tired of the flavor.  When I was feeding colonies, 
the cats and raccoons were eating side by side, except when a raccoon got too 
greedy and chased the cats away.  But the cats always returned to what was left 
of the food and finished it off.


From: MaiMaiPG 
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Sent: Friday, June 1, 2012 9:20 PM
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] FW: RACCOON GETTING INTO CAT STATION


Door on a timer?  However, my bet is on the coons.


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Re: [Felvtalk] RACCOON GETTING INTO CAT STATION

[GRAS]

Since we have cat condos in the garage, I leave it open when the weather is 
nice, for airing out.

One night, after I closed the door, I noticed a huge  “mother of all possums”, 
in the garage near the cat condos.  Didn’t want to budge.  I coaxed him, 
offered goodies, he just looked at me and sort-of hissed.  Lots of sharp little 
teeth! I finally put a large trap in front of him, gingerly pushed him in with 
a snow shovel, and carried him/her out.

 

From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org 
[mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Lee Evans
Sent: Monday, June 04, 2012 11:27 AM
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] RACCOON GETTING INTO CAT STATION

 

The added benefit of possums is that since they are marsupials, they are not 
carriers of rabies!  They are simply weird looking.  I saw my first possum 
about 10 years ago.  We mutually scared each other out of our skins.  Then we 
tip-toed back around the corner of the house and stared at each other for a 
while.  We both decided that the other was just strange looking but not 
dangerous and from then on they had a place at my backyard feeding station.

 

  _  

From: Marcia Baronda 
To: "felvtalk@felineleukemia.org"  
Sent: Monday, June 4, 2012 8:48 AM
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] RACCOON GETTING INTO CAT STATION


I love the possums too! They used to eat with my inside outers on my front 
porch, and would sit in the squirrel feeding box that I had in the front yard. 
I love em and the fact that they are marsupials make them all the more 
fascinating(-:

Sent from my iPad that my most awesome kids surprised me with, Christmas 2010. 

On Jun 1, 2012, at 9:56 PM, MaiMaiPG  wrote:

> Possums don't bother me but the coons do.  I have trapped and relocated both 
> (not during baby season) because they were raiding my mother's house, 
> threatening her ferals and endangering themselves thanks to the problems they 
> were causing neighbors.  They were relocated to a farm I own.  I brought the 
> coons over immediately because they were vicious and very likely to hurt 
> themselves trying to escape (can't blame them).  They get/carry a lot of 
> diseases including canine distemper which makes people think they are rabid 
> when they are not but they do carry rabies.  As noted, they can easily kill 
> cats and dogs, even hunting (read fairly large dogs).  They are extremely 
> messy and destructive and can get into about anything.  I know, and knew, 
> from personal experience but was not willing to turn the captives over to 
> hunters or to locate them where there wasn't an appropriate environment.
> 
> Possums will defend themselves if they have to but are fairly calm...again 
> from personal experience.  They are wonderful at insect control and I have 
> watched them under the porch lights on the farm...inhaling the insects.
> 
> Just FYI:  The coons are very cute and charming.not so much with the 
> possums but they are actually darlings in my world.
> On Jun 1, 2012, at 8:54 AM, Natalie wrote:
> 
>> Whenever someone dumps a cat around here, I always see them eating together 
>> with possums - it's amazing.  The first time I saw it, I was really 
>> terrified for the cat!
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org 
>> [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of 
>> dlg...@windstream.net
>> Sent: Friday, June 01, 2012 12:22 AM
>> To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
>> Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] RACCOON GETTING INTO CAT STATION
>> 
>> cats and possums getting along.  That was one worry I had about feeding the 
>> birds, that the cats could be hurt by them.  So far, all my cats have enough 
>> good sense to back off when they and the coons come up to eat.  Somehow they 
>> seem to know they could not win a fight with either one of them.  Coons can 
>> kill a full grown dog, especially if they get them in enough water to hold 
>> their head down until the drown them.
>>  Dana Giordano  wrote:
>>> I feed mine on the ground inside a bin which I have cut out the sides of so 
>>> they can pass through. I lean boards up  Against the sides. It's low 
>>> perfect for a cat and opossums but apparently too low and awkward for a 
>>> raccoon to get in there. I put a large deep square plastic food bin inside 
>>> and a piece of styrofoam on the floor inside to wedge the food bin into one 
>>> place. Opossums and cats get along fine so I let them share. My main issues 
>>> end up being ants and slugs which I use food grade diacetemous earth and 
>>> sandpaper to deter. I also have a rope light out there - dunno if that 
>>> deters so wanted to mention it. Hope that helps.
> 
> Don't Litter, Fix Your Critter! www.Furkids.org
> 
> “I am not interested to know whether vivisection produces results that 
> are profitable to the human race or doesn’t….the pain which it inflicts 
> upon unconsenting animals is the basis of my enmity toward it, and it is 
> to me 

Re: [Felvtalk] RACCOON GETTING INTO CAT STATION

[Lee Evans]

The added benefit of possums is that since they are marsupials, they are not 
carriers of rabies!  They are simply weird looking.  I saw my first possum 
about 10 years ago.  We mutually scared each other out of our skins.  Then we 
tip-toed back around the corner of the house and stared at each other for a 
while.  We both decided that the other was just strange looking but not 
dangerous and from then on they had a place at my backyard feeding station.




 From: Marcia Baronda 
To: "felvtalk@felineleukemia.org"  
Sent: Monday, June 4, 2012 8:48 AM
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] RACCOON GETTING INTO CAT STATION
 
I love the possums too! They used to eat with my inside outers on my front 
porch, and would sit in the squirrel feeding box that I had in the front yard. 
I love em and the fact that they are marsupials make them all the more 
fascinating(-:

Sent from my iPad that my most awesome kids surprised me with, Christmas 2010. 

On Jun 1, 2012, at 9:56 PM, MaiMaiPG  wrote:

> Possums don't bother me but the coons do.  I have trapped and relocated both 
> (not during baby season) because they were raiding my mother's house, 
> threatening her ferals and endangering themselves thanks to the problems they 
> were causing neighbors.  They were relocated to a farm I own.  I brought the 
> coons over immediately because they were vicious and very likely to hurt 
> themselves trying to escape (can't blame them).  They get/carry a lot of 
> diseases including canine distemper which makes people think they are rabid 
> when they are not but they do carry rabies.  As noted, they can easily kill 
> cats and dogs, even hunting (read fairly large dogs).  They are extremely 
> messy and destructive and can get into about anything.  I know, and knew, 
> from personal experience but was not willing to turn the captives over to 
> hunters or to locate them where there wasn't an appropriate environment.
> 
> Possums will defend themselves if they have to but are fairly calm...again 
> from personal experience.  They are wonderful at insect control and I have 
> watched them under the porch lights on the farm...inhaling the insects.
> 
> Just FYI:  The coons are very cute and charming.not so much with the 
> possums but they are actually darlings in my world.
> On Jun 1, 2012, at 8:54 AM, Natalie wrote:
> 
>> Whenever someone dumps a cat around here, I always see them eating together 
>> with possums - it's amazing.  The first time I saw it, I was really 
>> terrified for the cat!
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org 
>> [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of 
>> dlg...@windstream.net
>> Sent: Friday, June 01, 2012 12:22 AM
>> To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
>> Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] RACCOON GETTING INTO CAT STATION
>> 
>> cats and possums getting along.  That was one worry I had about feeding the 
>> birds, that the cats could be hurt by them.  So far, all my cats have enough 
>> good sense to back off when they and the coons come up to eat.  Somehow they 
>> seem to know they could not win a fight with either one of them.  Coons can 
>> kill a full grown dog, especially if they get them in enough water to hold 
>> their head down until the drown them.
>>  Dana Giordano  wrote:
>>> I feed mine on the ground inside a bin which I have cut out the sides of so 
>>> they can pass through. I lean boards up   Against the sides. It's low 
>>> perfect for a cat and opossums but apparently too low and awkward for a 
>>> raccoon to get in there. I put a large deep square plastic food bin inside 
>>> and a piece of styrofoam on the floor inside to wedge the food bin into one 
>>> place. Opossums and cats get along fine so I let them share. My main issues 
>>> end up being ants and slugs which I use food grade diacetemous earth and 
>>> sandpaper to deter. I also have a rope light out there - dunno if that 
>>> deters so wanted to mention it. Hope that helps.
> 
> Don't Litter, Fix Your Critter! www.Furkids.org
> 
> “I am not interested to know whether vivisection produces results that 
> are profitable to the human race or doesn’t….the pain which it inflicts 
> upon unconsenting animals is the basis of my enmity toward it, and it is 
> to me sufficient justification of the enmity without looking further.” – 
> Mark Twain
>> 
>> 
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Fel

Re: [Felvtalk] RACCOON GETTING INTO CAT STATION

[Marcia Baronda]

I love the possums too! They used to eat with my inside outers on my front 
porch, and would sit in the squirrel feeding box that I had in the front yard. 
I love em and the fact that they are marsupials make them all the more 
fascinating(-:

Sent from my iPad that my most awesome kids surprised me with, Christmas 2010. 

On Jun 1, 2012, at 9:56 PM, MaiMaiPG  wrote:

> Possums don't bother me but the coons do.  I have trapped and relocated both 
> (not during baby season) because they were raiding my mother's house, 
> threatening her ferals and endangering themselves thanks to the problems they 
> were causing neighbors.  They were relocated to a farm I own.  I brought the 
> coons over immediately because they were vicious and very likely to hurt 
> themselves trying to escape (can't blame them).  They get/carry a lot of 
> diseases including canine distemper which makes people think they are rabid 
> when they are not but they do carry rabies.  As noted, they can easily kill 
> cats and dogs, even hunting (read fairly large dogs).  They are extremely 
> messy and destructive and can get into about anything.  I know, and knew, 
> from personal experience but was not willing to turn the captives over to 
> hunters or to locate them where there wasn't an appropriate environment.
> 
> Possums will defend themselves if they have to but are fairly calm...again 
> from personal experience.  They are wonderful at insect control and I have 
> watched them under the porch lights on the farm...inhaling the insects.
> 
> Just FYI:  The coons are very cute and charming.not so much with the 
> possums but they are actually darlings in my world.
> On Jun 1, 2012, at 8:54 AM, Natalie wrote:
> 
>> Whenever someone dumps a cat around here, I always see them eating together 
>> with possums - it's amazing.  The first time I saw it, I was really 
>> terrified for the cat!
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org 
>> [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of 
>> dlg...@windstream.net
>> Sent: Friday, June 01, 2012 12:22 AM
>> To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
>> Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] RACCOON GETTING INTO CAT STATION
>> 
>> cats and possums getting along.  That was one worry I had about feeding the 
>> birds, that the cats could be hurt by them.  So far, all my cats have enough 
>> good sense to back off when they and the coons come up to eat.  Somehow they 
>> seem to know they could not win a fight with either one of them.  Coons can 
>> kill a full grown dog, especially if they get them in enough water to hold 
>> their head down until the drown them.
>>  Dana Giordano  wrote:
>>> I feed mine on the ground inside a bin which I have cut out the sides of so 
>>> they can pass through. I lean boards up   Against the sides. It's low 
>>> perfect for a cat and opossums but apparently too low and awkward for a 
>>> raccoon to get in there. I put a large deep square plastic food bin inside 
>>> and a piece of styrofoam on the floor inside to wedge the food bin into one 
>>> place. Opossums and cats get along fine so I let them share. My main issues 
>>> end up being ants and slugs which I use food grade diacetemous earth and 
>>> sandpaper to deter. I also have a rope light out there - dunno if that 
>>> deters so wanted to mention it. Hope that helps.
> 
> Don't Litter, Fix Your Critter! www.Furkids.org
> 
> “I am not interested to know whether vivisection produces results that 
> are profitable to the human race or doesn’t….the pain which it inflicts 
> upon unconsenting animals is the basis of my enmity toward it, and it is 
> to me sufficient justification of the enmity without looking further.” – 
> Mark Twain
>> 
>> 
>> ___
>> Felvtalk mailing list
>> Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
>> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
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> 
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