Frame 9: Improved CMYK - Save as Pdf
G'day all,
earlier I had posted a query re. the improved CMYK support for colour
definitions ('views') in Frame 9. Save as Pdf will indeed maintain the
CMYK numbers without giving the colour view the RBG make-over
inflicted by earlier versions; so will printing to file + distilling.
Printing directly to pdf will RGBify the colour view. Of course, we've
all been told to keep our distance from save as pdf, but those pdfs
now seem to be safe.Here's Dov Isaac's note to one of the user fora
last week. Since it is probably of interest to quite a few of us here,
I take the liberty of quoting it verbatim below.
Cheers,
Mike
(1) Beginning with FrameMaker 7.0, the save as PDF feature in
FrameMaker was at least viable compared to failed efforts prior to
7.0.
(2) To be very clear, what the save as PDF feature does is to
internally create PostScript via the AdobePDF PostScript PostScript
printer driver instance, funnels same to the Distiller with the
user-specified job options, deletes the PostScript file, and then
optionally calls Acrobat or Reader to display the resultant PDF.
FrameMaker does NOT natively generate PDF (unlike InDesign,
Illustrator, and Photoshop).
(3) The save as PDF feature in recent versions of FrameMaker is much
more stable than in 7.0. Added stability is provided for save as PDF
by applying the Microsoft Windows OS fix that resolves the problem of
missing text.
(4) There is no logical difference between printing to the AdobePDF
PostScript printer driver instance and manually creating PostScript
and saving to FILE: and then distilling same. The results and
stability are the same. As such, advice to manually create PostScript
and distill as oppose to printing directly to the AdobePDF PostScript
printer driver instance is pure poppycock / bubbameiser / urban
legend!
Michael Heine
London, ON
Canada
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Frame 9: Improved CMYK - Save as Pdf
G'day all,
earlier I had posted a query re. the improved CMYK support for colour
definitions ('views') in Frame 9. Save as Pdf will indeed maintain the
CMYK numbers without giving the colour view the RBG make-over
inflicted by earlier versions; so will printing to file + distilling.
Printing directly to pdf will RGBify the colour view. Of course, we've
all been told to keep our distance from save as pdf, but those pdfs
now seem to be safe.Here's Dov Isaac's note to one of the user fora
last week. Since it is probably of interest to quite a few of us here,
I take the liberty of quoting it verbatim below.
Cheers,
Mike
>>>
(1) Beginning with FrameMaker 7.0, the "save as PDF" feature in
FrameMaker was at least viable compared to failed efforts prior to
7.0.
(2) To be very clear, what the "save as PDF" feature does is to
internally create PostScript via the AdobePDF PostScript PostScript
printer driver instance, funnels same to the Distiller with the
user-specified job options, deletes the PostScript file, and then
optionally calls Acrobat or Reader to display the resultant PDF.
FrameMaker does NOT natively generate PDF (unlike InDesign,
Illustrator, and Photoshop).
(3) The "save as PDF" feature in recent versions of FrameMaker is much
more stable than in 7.0. Added stability is provided for "save as PDF"
by applying the Microsoft Windows OS fix that resolves the problem of
"missing text."
(4) There is no logical difference between printing to the AdobePDF
PostScript printer driver instance and manually creating PostScript
and saving to FILE: and then distilling same. The results and
stability are the same. As such, advice to manually create PostScript
and distill as oppose to printing directly to the AdobePDF PostScript
printer driver instance is pure poppycock / bubbameiser / urban
legend!
<<<
Michael Heine
London, ON
Canada
Re: Frame 9: improved CMYK
To put this on context... In 9, using SaveAs to create a PDF with CMYK works, EXCEPT when the FM file contains embedded PDFs -- in effect, nesting the PDFs. So it's partially whacked, but if you don't nest PDFs as imported graphics in FM, it works. Art Art Campbell art.campb...@gmail.com ... In my opinion, there's nothing in this world beats a '52 Vincent and a redheaded girl. -- Richard Thompson No disclaimers apply. DoD 358 On Wed, Jan 28, 2009 at 2:52 AM, Reng, Winfried wr...@tycoint.com wrote: Hi, Here is another post from Arnis Gubins from the Adobe FrameMaker forum: ... After extensive testing with his files and others, using imported PDFs with the new CMYK SaveAsPDF is broken from the get go. When using imported PDFs in FM, the CMYK SaveAsPDF option renders these imported PDFs as low-res RGB TIFFs on output. Yuck! A major foobar in the latest point version of this release. HOWEVER, using EPS files works just fine! So converting the PDFs to EPS before import is a workaround for now. --- Best regards Winfried -Original Message- From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Art Campbell Sent: Tuesday, January 27, 2009 6:04 PM To: Mike H Cc: framers@lists.frameusers.com Subject: Re: Frame 9: improved CMYK Mike, There are a couple of threads about CMYK support on the Adobe User Forum for Frame. According to one of the moderators there (Arnis, who I'm not sure is on this list), who has played with this a bit: Yes, CMYK (and spot colours too) works when doing the Save As PDF (Adobe somehow manages to slip in a different postscript header that isn't available when you manually print to the Adobe PDF printer instance). The Save As PDF works very well when everything is configured correctly. So the trick seems to be electing the SaveAs option rather than Printing, which is the default for many of us. I would have done it the other way around, but ... Cheers, Art Art Campbell art.campb...@gmail.com ... In my opinion, there's nothing in this world beats a '52 Vincent and a redheaded girl. -- Richard Thompson No disclaimers apply. DoD 358 On Tue, Jan 27, 2009 at 10:40 AM, Mike H sene...@gmail.com wrote: Hmm - what does the 'improved CMYK support' in Frame 9 entail? MY CMYK colour definitions (Pantone Process) still get converted to RGB if I set the joboptions to, 'leave colour as is.' - And I just note that p. 446 of the manual still says that the default is CMYK - RGB conversion. However, the next paragraph tells me: if you deselect this option [which one?] Framemaker preserves CMYK colours. What am I missing, what option can I deselect to preserve my CMYK views (I only import *.eps, so that's not the issue.)? I know that in the pdf joboptions I can turn on, convert all colours to cmyk, but that gives me CMYK (colour 'view') - RGB - CMYK, and my Pantone percentages get all mixed up in the process. How do I preserve my CMYK colour definitions without going through RGB? Cheers, Mike - Michael Heine London, ON Canada ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as art.campb...@gmail.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/art.campbell%40gmail.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Frame 9: improved CMYK
Hi, Here is another post from Arnis Gubins from the Adobe FrameMaker forum: ... After extensive testing with his files and others, using imported PDFs with the new CMYK SaveAsPDF is broken from the get go. When using imported PDFs in FM, the CMYK SaveAsPDF option renders these imported PDFs as low-res RGB TIFFs on output. Yuck! A major foobar in the latest point version of this release. HOWEVER, using EPS files works just fine! So converting the PDFs to EPS before import is a workaround for now. --- Best regards Winfried > -Original Message- > From: framers-bounces at lists.frameusers.com > [mailto:framers-bounces at lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of > Art Campbell > Sent: Tuesday, January 27, 2009 6:04 PM > To: Mike H > Cc: framers at lists.frameusers.com > Subject: Re: Frame 9: improved CMYK > > Mike, > There are a couple of threads about CMYK support on the Adobe > User Forum for > Frame. > According to one of the moderators there (Arnis, who I'm not > sure is on this > list), who has played with this a bit: > > "Yes, CMYK (and spot colours too) works when doing the Save As PDF > (Adobe somehow manages to slip in a different postscript header that > isn't available when you manually print to the Adobe PDF printer > instance). The Save As PDF works very well when everything is > configured correctly." > > So the trick seems to be electing the SaveAs option rather > than Printing, > which is the default for many of us. > I would have done it the other way around, but ... > > Cheers, > Art > > Art Campbell > art.campbell at gmail.com > "... In my opinion, there's nothing in this world beats a > '52 Vincent and a > redheaded girl." -- Richard Thompson > No > disclaimers apply. > DoD 358 > > > On Tue, Jan 27, 2009 at 10:40 AM, Mike H wrote: > > > Hmm - > > what does the 'improved CMYK support' in Frame 9 entail? MY CMYK > > colour definitions (Pantone Process) still get converted to RGB if I > > set the joboptions to, 'leave colour as is.' - And I just > note that p. > > 446 of the manual still says that the default is CMYK -> RGB > > conversion. However, the next paragraph tells me: "if you deselect > > this option [which one?] Framemaker preserves CMYK > colours." What am I > > missing, what option can I deselect to preserve my CMYK > views (I only > > import *.eps, so that's not the issue.)? > > > > I know that in the pdf joboptions I can turn on, "convert > all colours > > to cmyk", but that gives me CMYK (colour 'view') -> RGB -> CMYK, and > > my Pantone percentages get all mixed up in the process. How do I > > preserve my CMYK colour definitions without going through RGB? > > > > Cheers, > > Mike > > > > - > > Michael Heine > > London, ON > > Canada
Frame 9: improved CMYK
To put this on context... In 9, using SaveAs to create a PDF with CMYK works, EXCEPT when the FM file contains embedded PDFs -- in effect, nesting the PDFs. So it's partially whacked, but if you don't nest PDFs as imported graphics in FM, it works. Art Art Campbell art.campbell at gmail.com "... In my opinion, there's nothing in this world beats a '52 Vincent and a redheaded girl." -- Richard Thompson No disclaimers apply. DoD 358 On Wed, Jan 28, 2009 at 2:52 AM, Reng, Winfried wrote: > Hi, > > Here is another post from Arnis Gubins from the Adobe FrameMaker > forum: > > ... After extensive testing with his files and others, using > imported PDFs with the new CMYK SaveAsPDF is broken from the get go. > > When using imported PDFs in FM, the CMYK SaveAsPDF option renders > these imported PDFs as low-res RGB TIFFs on output. Yuck! A major > foobar in the latest point version of this release. > > HOWEVER, using EPS files works just fine! So converting the PDFs to > EPS before import is a workaround for now. > > --- > > Best regards > > Winfried > > > -Original Message- > > From: framers-bounces at lists.frameusers.com > > [mailto:framers-bounces at lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of > > Art Campbell > > Sent: Tuesday, January 27, 2009 6:04 PM > > To: Mike H > > Cc: framers at lists.frameusers.com > > Subject: Re: Frame 9: improved CMYK > > > > Mike, > > There are a couple of threads about CMYK support on the Adobe > > User Forum for > > Frame. > > According to one of the moderators there (Arnis, who I'm not > > sure is on this > > list), who has played with this a bit: > > > > "Yes, CMYK (and spot colours too) works when doing the Save As PDF > > (Adobe somehow manages to slip in a different postscript header that > > isn't available when you manually print to the Adobe PDF printer > > instance). The Save As PDF works very well when everything is > > configured correctly." > > > > So the trick seems to be electing the SaveAs option rather > > than Printing, > > which is the default for many of us. > > I would have done it the other way around, but ... > > > > Cheers, > > Art > > > > Art Campbell > > art.campbell at gmail.com > > "... In my opinion, there's nothing in this world beats a > > '52 Vincent and a > > redheaded girl." -- Richard Thompson > > No > > disclaimers apply. > > DoD 358 > > > > > > On Tue, Jan 27, 2009 at 10:40 AM, Mike H wrote: > > > > > Hmm - > > > what does the 'improved CMYK support' in Frame 9 entail? MY CMYK > > > colour definitions (Pantone Process) still get converted to RGB if I > > > set the joboptions to, 'leave colour as is.' - And I just > > note that p. > > > 446 of the manual still says that the default is CMYK -> RGB > > > conversion. However, the next paragraph tells me: "if you deselect > > > this option [which one?] Framemaker preserves CMYK > > colours." What am I > > > missing, what option can I deselect to preserve my CMYK > > views (I only > > > import *.eps, so that's not the issue.)? > > > > > > I know that in the pdf joboptions I can turn on, "convert > > all colours > > > to cmyk", but that gives me CMYK (colour 'view') -> RGB -> CMYK, and > > > my Pantone percentages get all mixed up in the process. How do I > > > preserve my CMYK colour definitions without going through RGB? > > > > > > Cheers, > > > Mike > > > > > > - > > > Michael Heine > > > London, ON > > > Canada > ___ > > > You are currently subscribed to Framers as art.campbell at gmail.com. > > Send list messages to framers at lists.frameusers.com. > > To unsubscribe send a blank email to > framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com > or visit > http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/art.campbell%40gmail.com > > Send administrative questions to listadmin at frameusers.com. Visit > http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. >
Frame 9: improved CMYK
Hmm - what does the 'improved CMYK support' in Frame 9 entail? MY CMYK colour definitions (Pantone Process) still get converted to RGB if I set the joboptions to, 'leave colour as is.' - And I just note that p. 446 of the manual still says that the default is CMYK - RGB conversion. However, the next paragraph tells me: if you deselect this option [which one?] Framemaker preserves CMYK colours. What am I missing, what option can I deselect to preserve my CMYK views (I only import *.eps, so that's not the issue.)? I know that in the pdf joboptions I can turn on, convert all colours to cmyk, but that gives me CMYK (colour 'view') - RGB - CMYK, and my Pantone percentages get all mixed up in the process. How do I preserve my CMYK colour definitions without going through RGB? Cheers, Mike - Michael Heine London, ON Canada ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Re: Frame 9: improved CMYK
Mike, There are a couple of threads about CMYK support on the Adobe User Forum for Frame. According to one of the moderators there (Arnis, who I'm not sure is on this list), who has played with this a bit: Yes, CMYK (and spot colours too) works when doing the Save As PDF (Adobe somehow manages to slip in a different postscript header that isn't available when you manually print to the Adobe PDF printer instance). The Save As PDF works very well when everything is configured correctly. So the trick seems to be electing the SaveAs option rather than Printing, which is the default for many of us. I would have done it the other way around, but ... Cheers, Art Art Campbell art.campb...@gmail.com ... In my opinion, there's nothing in this world beats a '52 Vincent and a redheaded girl. -- Richard Thompson No disclaimers apply. DoD 358 On Tue, Jan 27, 2009 at 10:40 AM, Mike H sene...@gmail.com wrote: Hmm - what does the 'improved CMYK support' in Frame 9 entail? MY CMYK colour definitions (Pantone Process) still get converted to RGB if I set the joboptions to, 'leave colour as is.' - And I just note that p. 446 of the manual still says that the default is CMYK - RGB conversion. However, the next paragraph tells me: if you deselect this option [which one?] Framemaker preserves CMYK colours. What am I missing, what option can I deselect to preserve my CMYK views (I only import *.eps, so that's not the issue.)? I know that in the pdf joboptions I can turn on, convert all colours to cmyk, but that gives me CMYK (colour 'view') - RGB - CMYK, and my Pantone percentages get all mixed up in the process. How do I preserve my CMYK colour definitions without going through RGB? Cheers, Mike - Michael Heine London, ON Canada ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as art.campb...@gmail.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/art.campbell%40gmail.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
RE: Frame 9: improved CMYK
Hi, Here is another post from Arnis Gubins from the Adobe FrameMaker forum: ... After extensive testing with his files and others, using imported PDFs with the new CMYK SaveAsPDF is broken from the get go. When using imported PDFs in FM, the CMYK SaveAsPDF option renders these imported PDFs as low-res RGB TIFFs on output. Yuck! A major foobar in the latest point version of this release. HOWEVER, using EPS files works just fine! So converting the PDFs to EPS before import is a workaround for now. --- Best regards Winfried -Original Message- From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Art Campbell Sent: Tuesday, January 27, 2009 6:04 PM To: Mike H Cc: framers@lists.frameusers.com Subject: Re: Frame 9: improved CMYK Mike, There are a couple of threads about CMYK support on the Adobe User Forum for Frame. According to one of the moderators there (Arnis, who I'm not sure is on this list), who has played with this a bit: Yes, CMYK (and spot colours too) works when doing the Save As PDF (Adobe somehow manages to slip in a different postscript header that isn't available when you manually print to the Adobe PDF printer instance). The Save As PDF works very well when everything is configured correctly. So the trick seems to be electing the SaveAs option rather than Printing, which is the default for many of us. I would have done it the other way around, but ... Cheers, Art Art Campbell art.campb...@gmail.com ... In my opinion, there's nothing in this world beats a '52 Vincent and a redheaded girl. -- Richard Thompson No disclaimers apply. DoD 358 On Tue, Jan 27, 2009 at 10:40 AM, Mike H sene...@gmail.com wrote: Hmm - what does the 'improved CMYK support' in Frame 9 entail? MY CMYK colour definitions (Pantone Process) still get converted to RGB if I set the joboptions to, 'leave colour as is.' - And I just note that p. 446 of the manual still says that the default is CMYK - RGB conversion. However, the next paragraph tells me: if you deselect this option [which one?] Framemaker preserves CMYK colours. What am I missing, what option can I deselect to preserve my CMYK views (I only import *.eps, so that's not the issue.)? I know that in the pdf joboptions I can turn on, convert all colours to cmyk, but that gives me CMYK (colour 'view') - RGB - CMYK, and my Pantone percentages get all mixed up in the process. How do I preserve my CMYK colour definitions without going through RGB? Cheers, Mike - Michael Heine London, ON Canada ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Frame 9: improved CMYK
Hmm - what does the 'improved CMYK support' in Frame 9 entail? MY CMYK colour definitions (Pantone Process) still get converted to RGB if I set the joboptions to, 'leave colour as is.' - And I just note that p. 446 of the manual still says that the default is CMYK -> RGB conversion. However, the next paragraph tells me: "if you deselect this option [which one?] Framemaker preserves CMYK colours." What am I missing, what option can I deselect to preserve my CMYK views (I only import *.eps, so that's not the issue.)? I know that in the pdf joboptions I can turn on, "convert all colours to cmyk", but that gives me CMYK (colour 'view') -> RGB -> CMYK, and my Pantone percentages get all mixed up in the process. How do I preserve my CMYK colour definitions without going through RGB? Cheers, Mike - Michael Heine London, ON Canada
Frame 9: improved CMYK
Mike, There are a couple of threads about CMYK support on the Adobe User Forum for Frame. According to one of the moderators there (Arnis, who I'm not sure is on this list), who has played with this a bit: "Yes, CMYK (and spot colours too) works when doing the Save As PDF (Adobe somehow manages to slip in a different postscript header that isn't available when you manually print to the Adobe PDF printer instance). The Save As PDF works very well when everything is configured correctly." So the trick seems to be electing the SaveAs option rather than Printing, which is the default for many of us. I would have done it the other way around, but ... Cheers, Art Art Campbell art.campbell at gmail.com "... In my opinion, there's nothing in this world beats a '52 Vincent and a redheaded girl." -- Richard Thompson No disclaimers apply. DoD 358 On Tue, Jan 27, 2009 at 10:40 AM, Mike H wrote: > Hmm - > what does the 'improved CMYK support' in Frame 9 entail? MY CMYK > colour definitions (Pantone Process) still get converted to RGB if I > set the joboptions to, 'leave colour as is.' - And I just note that p. > 446 of the manual still says that the default is CMYK -> RGB > conversion. However, the next paragraph tells me: "if you deselect > this option [which one?] Framemaker preserves CMYK colours." What am I > missing, what option can I deselect to preserve my CMYK views (I only > import *.eps, so that's not the issue.)? > > I know that in the pdf joboptions I can turn on, "convert all colours > to cmyk", but that gives me CMYK (colour 'view') -> RGB -> CMYK, and > my Pantone percentages get all mixed up in the process. How do I > preserve my CMYK colour definitions without going through RGB? > > Cheers, > Mike > > - > Michael Heine > London, ON > Canada > ___ > > > You are currently subscribed to Framers as art.campbell at gmail.com. > > Send list messages to framers at lists.frameusers.com. > > To unsubscribe send a blank email to > framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com > or visit > http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/art.campbell%40gmail.com > > Send administrative questions to listadmin at frameusers.com. Visit > http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. >
