Since it came down to making openssl actually useful for something or
taking it out of the tree, we accelerated progress somewhat on the
openssh integration work. This is using the rsarefglue stubs I've
been talking about for the last couple of days to "abstract" rsaref
away so we don't have any
As a workaround for a static binary, you should be able to use
-Xlinker -Bstatic
instead of
-static
Actually, it appears that just -Xlinker is necessary; it works
fine in conjunction with -static. Thanks for this most helpful
tip! I can see a *lot* of scenarios where I'll be using
And how exactly are you going to tell /usr/bin/login, /usr/bin/chpass,
/usr/local/bin/wu-ftpd, etc., where to find that file? Remember, if
it's ports that read the setup file, it can be moved around anywhere
by changing PREFIX -- but for files that are read by the system, it is
If it's
When is the estimated release of the FreeBSD-current 4.0?
First week of March.
- Jordan
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root@zippy- cc -fPIC -c stub.c
root@zippy- ld -shared -o stub.so stub.o
root@zippy- cc -static test.c -o test stub.so
root@zippy- ./test
ELF interpreter /usr/lib/libc.so.1 not found
Abort trap
root@zippy- cc -static test.c -o test stub.o
root@zippy- ./test
Now in the client, calling doit()
You
Yes, a clean install.
No, the sysinstall version of /etc/group did not have the tag.
Ok, that's bad. I'm cc'ing Jordan so he can look into it. Thanks for th
e
report. These are the little things that really need to be tested.
I'm not sure I understand this - sysinstall doesn't
On Sat, Feb 19, 2000 at 08:34:42PM -0800, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote:
1. They're in Canada
What does that buy them? They have the same restrictions on rsaref since
it originated from the USA.
I don't believe they're under the same legal gun when it comes to the
patent issues. This isn't
The /compat symlink should just die. compat bits should not be on the
root partition, so why are we pretending? /usr/compat should be the only
supported place. Peroid.
You miss the point entirely. Compat bits aren't intended for the root
partition, they're intended for wherever you happen
Jordan, please approve this patch.
It seems not good to have FTP_PASSIVE_MODE On as default while ftp program
itself have it Off by default. Lets either change ftp program defaults to
Passive On or login.conf defaults to Passive Off. I prefer second variant:
Um, the point of turning
0. RSA situation
[ a very nice point-for-point analysis of the situation elided ]
Christian,
Thank you for this summary; it helps a lot to have all the relevant
information presented in one place like this. Now we can begin
cutting to the heart of this matter, which I'll do in the form of
OK, I've dinked around with this some more and I think I might have at
least a partial solution to this whole mess (it still doesn't make
openssl actually useful to us, it just makes it less annoying :).
First, apply the following patch:
Index: Makefile
So do I. Unfortunately our hands are tied - the version of FreeBSD
distributed in the US must not contain these because they are patented
technologies and not available for unrestricted use. Unfortunately this is
also the same version distributed worldwide on FreeBSD CDs, install
At this
It already does this if you get your crypto from internat. US mirror sites
only carry the neutered (no-RSA) version, but internat carries RSA and
builds it conditional on USA_RESIDENT.
And why don't the USA sites have the RSAREF version? I'm still not
sure I understand the
openssl becomes a "distribution" like the DES bits are. Depending on
external packages is actually something I'm trying to wean sysinstall
away from because the dependency is a PITA and the creation of the
packages collection is not automated in the same way that distribution
building
Building with rsaref can't be the default case, because it's restrictively
licensed and not legal for some people to use.
It's trying to figure out who "some" people are and how to address the
needs of people who don't fit that category that I'm still having a
hard time with here. If I have
Kris Kennaway wrote:
On Sat, 19 Feb 2000, Victor Salaman wrote:
I personally think that it's braindead to add openssl to the system
and stripout parts of it (RSA IDEA). Don't get me wrong, I love to
have
Pardon me for coming late to the party, but what was the rationale
Having _a_ general-purpose cryptography toolkit in the base system allows
us to add in all sorts of cool things to FreeBSD (https support for fetch,
openssh, random cryptographic enhancements elsewhere). OpenSSL just
happens to be the only decent freely-available (BSDL) toolkit.
And I still
How does OpenBSD do it? Cant we do what they do?
1. They're in Canada
2. What they do appears to be kind of icky, e.g. it requires more
"hand work" than I think the average FreeBSD user would be willing
to accept (or the average developer would be willing to see in the
tree in such a
it makes sense to slice it that way. Also, as far as teaching new users how
to install it, I _always_ show them the custom route. While this may sound
harsh, its used to familarize them with all of sub-components, and
I really kinda wish you'd point them to Novice^H^H^H^H^HStandard
instead
Perhaps the release notes, or hardware file need to note you really do need
more than 8M ?
The CD boxes all say 16MB and the release notes/hardware guide don't
say anything at all about this. :)
- Jordan
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"Install" button and things proceeded to install with no hitches--however, i
t
seemed that randomly (because I couldn't pick out any pattern to it) the
screen would flash back to the "FreeBSD Configuration Menu" as it cycled
through new packages to install. The gray dialog that shows
Primary:
ftp://ftp.freebsd.org/pub/FreeBSD/snapshots/i386/4.0-2214-CURRENT/
ftp://ftp.freebsd.org/pub/FreeBSD/snapshots/ISO-IMAGES/4.0-2214-CURRENT/install-i386.iso
[bootable ISO installation image]
Alternate:
They've simply been renamed - it's no biggie. I have some patches
in my inbox for adding the new acd devices, I just haven't gotten to
them yet since it's still easy enough to edit them in the "unknown"
category if one really needs to.
- Jordan
Hi all
I've been trying out FreeBSD
I have been having some problems gettign Mozilla to start up under
FreeBSD-4.0-CURRENT .. and the comments given in the Bugzilla forum
all seem to blaim my problems to having a gcc 2.9.5.2 compiler and an (old)
2.9.1 assembler.
That's odd, I have M13 working just great here under -current
Are there any plan to distribute USA_RESIDENT=NO version of
des binary distribution?
I have no current plans to build such a thing and am USA_RESIDENT
myself so it would be a questionable thing from a legal standpoint, I
think. I can hardly wait until September when the RSA patent expires! :)
Well, I'd first be very interested to know if anyone has even seen
this work. :)
I have seen regrettably little feedback about it so far.
- Jordan
* David E. Cross [EMAIL PROTECTED] [000211 16:50] wrote:
I realize that we are all very busy and the coming 4.0-RELEASE has also
compounded
I have rebuilt sysinstall inside the 0207-SNAP area and can
recreate the problem by simply running sysinstall as root and
running an installation to /install. Also, previously, I was
using a cdrom as the media, I am now using ftp.
Thanks for your debugging work so far. I just got back
Having passive mode on by default *across the board* is truly the
right thing to do in this day in age and there's no reason not to
default to it now. We've received too many tech support emails (and
phone calls) from people with firewalls who were confused with the
previous default.
- Jordan
approved
Hi,
would it be ok to commit the following patch to
/usr/src/sys/boot/i386/loader/Makefile so that we can build
a smaller loader without Forth support, which is still useful
to boot a picobsd kernel ?
cheers
luigi
rizzo# diff -ubwr Makefile.40RC Makefile
---
1. sysinstall forgot to write my hostname to /etc/rc.conf . I had gone
into the options menu and selected "DHCP"; when I picked my network
interface it looked for and found a DHCP server and popped up the
network configuration box with most of the fields filled in (including
domain name);
IMHO, that is the wrong assumption. Most DHCP servers I've seen aren't
setup to provide hostnames to the requrestor.
Seems they're set up incorrectly then. You can't be a good "network
citizen" these days without a resolvable hostname that also matches
your primary IP address or, among other
Why not check to see what the hostname is after dhclient is run and then
stick that name in the network setup dialog box. If the user does edit
the hostname themselves, then you can flag that event.
That would work in that one specific case with that specific dhcp server.
Now change the dhcp
=== libexec/getNAME
cc -O -pipe -I/usr/obj/usr/src/i386/usr/include -c /usr/src/libexec/getNAME/ge
tNAME.c
cc -O -pipe -I/usr/obj/usr/src/i386/usr/include -o getNAME getNAME.o
gzip -cn /usr/src/libexec/getNAME/getNAME.1 getNAME.1.gz
=== libexec/getty
cc -O -pipe
That's not correct; your DHCP configuration should reflect the hostname.
Sysinstall doesn't fill in the hostname field because the crunched binary
is missing the hostname(1) command. If we were to add that, it's just
possible that we'd get hostnames working too.
Actually, that's not
Jordan, I believe this change should go into 4.0-RELEASE rather than
happening afterwards so that we have a minimal number of people
(hopefully none) using TUNSLMODE. TUNSLMODE was never MFC'd.
Do it. :)
- Jordan
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Not yet, but it should. If someone can help me out here it would be
greatly appreciated.
"Setting it in sysinstall" is easy. Deciding where and how to set it
in response to questions at certain stages of the installations(s)
is more the sticking point.
- Jordan
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Can we please end this discussion? End it now.
It's of no importance to me or, I venture to say, the postmaster
whether or not someone wishes to use an alias in these mailing lists
and it's certainly not a topic which follows the charter for the
FreeBSD-current mailing list. In fact, the only
Doesn't this statement make the entire thread about IPv6 + PC-Card support
entirely moot? Feature freezes don't mean we can't improve those two areas,
right? Right? :-)
PC-card, perhaps, but I think IPv6 still needs "improvement" far less
that it needs significant integration. :)
- Jordan
I think you'd do far better to stop bitching and simply start helping.
The people I've heard yell the very loudest in this discussion are
also the people who:
a) Have not helped Yoshinobu Inoue to any great extent during his
calls for patch testing.
b) Have not volunteered to help with the
If I stick an audio CD in my SCSI (rebadged Toshiba) CDRW drive
and try to read data off of it, I get the following behavior:
root@zippy- dd if=/dev/rcd0c bs=2k of=/dev/null
dd: /dev/rcd0c: Invalid argument
0+0 records in
0+0 records out
and on the console at the same time
(cd0:ahc0:0:4:0):
It's a feature freeze, sorry. I still expect the loose-ends that are
in place as of that date to be tied up afterwards.
- Jordan
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Get IPv6 into the tree. Now. Thank you.
Start helping and stop asking. Now. Thank you.
- Jordan
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You mean an Adaptec controller, right?
Yes, I guess Adaptec did buy those guys.
Try tosha or cdda2wav and report back on whether or not it works. dd has
never been a supported way to read audio tracks, for the reasons outlined
above. It may be possible in some situations, but it was
I think what is actually going on is that it doesn't like the 0x82 density
code that most other drives use. So that's what the first error message
likely tells us. (the density is given in the mode select parameter list,
thus the invalid field)
The second error message likely means that
Also, I can now add that cdda2wav does work (hurrah), but it does yelp
that it can't read the CD TOC.
Of course, the mystery is that tosha no longer works yet was not
changed, nor was the ripit script I call tosha from, so something on
our side of the fence also moved with respect to this drive.
In addition to trying cdda2wav, here's something else you can try in your
tosharc:
"SAF" "" "" 0x28 1 0x82 0 10 0
or:
"SAF" "" "" 0x28 0 0x00 0 10 0
Yep, tried both - no go.
The first produces:
(pass0:ahc0:0:4:0): MODE SELECT(06). CDB: 15 10 0 0 c 0
I'm reading this thread, and no, I have no idea. :-)
To be honest, I've never heard about an "SAF" drive.
It's a "Smart and Friendly CD-R8020", also sold as the "CD Rocket
Recorder" here in the U.S. It does 20X reads, 8X writes and 4X
re-writes. And no, I don't usually waste my CDR heads on
And given that we've already slipped from December 15th, I think you
can treat this as a pretty hard deadline, to be further slipped only
grudgingly and in response to clear and dire need.
10 days, folks! Make 'em count.. :)
The code freeze will last for 15 days, during which time the 4.0
Dear friends,
I know that many of you may feel slightly let-down by the fact that
nothing truly significant seems to have happened during our transition
to the year 2000, a good many button-clicks on www.cnn.com having gone
for naught as the hour approached and receded, nothing following yet
Everything that sysinstall does WRT devs is abstracted by libdisk.
On Fri, Dec 31, 1999 at 03:15:02PM -0500, Chuck Robey wrote:
On Fri, 31 Dec 1999, Wilko Bulte wrote:
Why are "certain" devices wildly different than all other ones? I've
never encountered that kind of syntax
XFree86 3.9.xxx was cvsup on December 24th I am sorry but this is
sufficient information to reproduce the problem.
Not if you actually want the problem solved. There's this thing
called "making it easy on the people you're demanding things of" in
order that they might have some chance of
Sending out an attachment of that size to a public mailing list was
hardly necessary, and the increasing stridency of your posts leading
up to this only serve to indicate that you may be heading in the truly
wrong direction with all this and seriously need to rethink your
strategy before you do
Thats nice . Now we have a compiler which fails to build X.
This seems like hyperbole. I'm able to build X just fine with the
-current compiler, so to directly imply that we can't do so flies in
the face of common sense and experience.
- Jordan
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Frankly, Poul, I strongly, *STRONGLY* recommend that you simply not
reply to any of my postings. Not a single one, because I am wholely
sick and tired of your superiority complex. This thread was not meant
This is unwontedly personal and has no place in a public mailing list.
Hi,
I tried to install a SNAP which I built early this morning
and ran into some trouble (4.0-19991220-SNAP).
I accepted some changes to libdisk which, in retrospect,
were too draconian. I'll back 'em out.
- Jordan
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Is Qt going to be put into the base system in this case? If
I can wrestle along with figuring out a few little problems with
Qt (ones that I could even somehow more easily solve with
Motif!), then I'll continue to develop my system administration
tool(s) with it.
No, I don't envision
Call it Inuit. (rationale: Inuit feed on pinguins (right?))
How about PolarBear in that case? :)
- Jordan
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I was under the impression that Polar Bears are native to the
North Pole and penguins are from the South Pole.
Really? What eats penguins then? Maybe walrus?
- Jordan
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Polar bears and Inuits are found near the North Pole (Alaska,
Greenland, etc).
Penguins are typically only found in Antarctica. Their only natural
enemies are killer whales and leopard seals.
I knew we'd get to the bottom of this eventually. We're hackers,
not naturalists! :-)
OK, I
As far as the successor to sysinstall goes, I think it would be
nice to have both a console version and an X version, with some X
tookit such as Lesstif or Qt, or Tcl/Tk. It could be a lot like
RedHat's "linuxconf", where you can use it as both an installer
or system administration tool.
Just in case somebody is curious, here's a screenshot:
http://www.fromme.com/propellers/
That looks very interesting... It's just screaming for some kind of
mechanism which allows you to kldload the propeller code in as an
extention rather than linking it into the kernel. :)
- Jordan
To
I have never programmed a KLD before (though I will have a
look into this when I have some spare time left), but it is
my understanding that KLDs are appropriate for parts of the
kernel which can be reasonably easy separated from the rest
of the kernel. This is not the case for the
I'm not yet 100% convinced that it would make sense to separate
the propellers code into a module. Is 5 Kbyte of kernel code
really that much of a problem? Please note that
I certainly wouldn't argue this based on size, no. To understand the
point I was arguing, consider what would have
I know Jordan mentioned Qt before his over-enthusiastic hand-waving
made him over-balance, but Lesstif and Qt (or anything else related to
X11) have a number of serious problems.
That's ok; He also said it could be back-ended by TurboVision, with
the decision of which GUI to use
Personally, I like the speed of the current installation and wouldn't
want to wait for X to start. It will triple my install setup time
since right now I'm hardware speed limited (nearly) with sysinstall.
It is much faster to draw the dialog boxes with libdialog than to
start X.
It will
And: how many people would volunteer for such a job?
Or is it assumed that since this appears suspiciously like Real Work
it will be a paid-for job?
It will be a paid-for job, naturally.
Something we also have to stay aware of in this discussion is the fact
that even if most hackers could
My interest lies in exactly the opposite direction: I want to stick
a floppy in and have a box find an install server and follow a
pre-defined recipe for building itself, ala Jumpstart or Kickstart.
And you're far from alone in wanting this, another reason I've been
wanting to go to a
If we follow jkh's outline, making another "front end target" for the
script shouldn't be that hard. You have X, VESA Syscons, and Text
Syscons.
The script says "ok, prompt user for blah", under X it opens a window,
under Text some ASCII dialog, and under VESA a little window.
VESA
that "This product is currently at the end of its life cycle and will
eventually
be replaced."
The handy thing about "eventually" is that it can be a long time. :)
Amusingly, the man page author (Jordan?) says, "This utility is a
prototype which lasted approximately 3 years past its
Jordan, I don't understand your answer. Using the new MAKEDEV is what
causes vinum to fail. Won't -release be using the new MAKEDEV?
Sorry, I evidently didn't read the message the same way. If the
problem is indeed as you say then vinum has been broken; I thought
he was talking about using
I think the latter. In 'theory' there should be no discernable
difference between functionality from a KLD vs. the same functionality
compiled directly into the kernel.
Only in theory, of course. :)
As Andrzej has already pointed out, modules can also be loaded and
unloaded, creating a
In other words, it's not a problem specific to KLD's .. but
it's still a problem :-)
Which raises an important issue - other than walking the sysctl tree
regularly looking for changes, how does such an application become
aware that the sysctl space has changed? The same holds true for a
Perhaps a modtime on the sysctl tree as a gross hack? Inside of sysctl() and
the SYSCTL() macros you would update the time every time a write was made, no
de
added, node removed, etc. However, it is a gross hack.
You're right, it would be a gross hack. :) Also, I can see where it
would be
Since the recent block device vanishment, MAKEDEV all and my vinum
volumes have failed to start.
Please read /usr/src/UPDATING if you're going to track -current
these days. The reason for this is clearly documented at the
top of that file and won't be a problem in -release since the
correct
The same thing is about to apply to the woxware sound code, we have a
new shiny system that works and is much better designed...
Actually, I'm sad to say that our shiny new sound system does *not*
work for some of the most popular audio chipsets on the market today
(where the older "luigi"
The ATA driver went golden now, and to make sure nobody is distracted
from testing it before 4.0-RELEASE is cut, the wd driver will be
removed.
It's really that simple.
Well, I'm not sure that's really true yet and I would honestly prefer
it if you wouldn't make "conclusive statements"
cc -O -pipe -D_GNU_SOURCE -I- -I. -I/usr/src/gnu/usr.bin/binutils/gasp -I/usr/sr
c/gnu/usr.bin/binutils/gasp/../libbfd/alpha -I/usr/src/gnu/usr.bin/binutils/gasp
/../../../../contrib/binutils/include -I/usr/src/gnu/usr.bin/binutils/gasp/../..
/../../contrib/binutils
It looks like they distribute RSA to everyone, including the US mirrors,
and it's not built by default unless you take explicit action to enable it
(i.e. it just builds a subset of the full distribution). Last time I
Hmm, according to their own press, there's some mechanism more clever
than
cc -O -pipe -I/usr/obj/usr/src/tmp/usr/include -c /usr/src/usr.bin/yacc/reader.c
cc -O -pipe -I/usr/obj/usr/src/tmp/usr/include -c /usr/src/usr.bin/yacc/skeleton.c
cc -O -pipe -I/usr/obj/usr/src/tmp/usr/include -c /usr/src/usr.bin/yacc/symtab.c
cc -O -pipe
What is beast? I was happily able to build -current at about 5 this
morning on a pc164.
It's an Aspen systems DEC Durango PC164 motherboard based system.
- Jordan
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I think you should look at exactly how OpenBSD 2.6 has integrated it
and then report back with your amended proposal. :-)
- Jordan
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Also useful would be a review status of the freebsd tree. So (approved)
people can "sign off" on a particular file or directory as having been
reviewed as of a certain date, and we can work in a coordinated fashion.
Well, IMHO what you guys most significantly need is a "tinderbox"
style page
I'm certainly willing to do what I can to help, although I have
to admit that I may need a bit of help identifying what I can do. ;-)
That's Mark's job - he's the security leader. :)
- Jordan
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This means nothing out of context. I hope we don't go on a witch hunt.
No, but there is some merit to simply replacing these so that they
don't show up on our radar later. I don't see any reason, for
example, why anyone should still be using gets() and our
implementation even gets whiney
Yes, I'm sure you all never expected it, but we're actually on the
road for a 4.0 release in Q1 2000 (hopefully early January) and before
we can realistically begin that process, we have to stop throwing
kitchen sinks into -current and start making it work again instead. :-)
To that end, we'll
The last of the new millennium celebrations are still more than a year away.
Well, if you want to get technical, some people have already started early. :)
- Jordan
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I am quite well aware of the mailing list etiquette. I read through many of
them frequently.
Then you're aware that cross posts are also strongly frowned upon,
especially on both -current and -hackers. Only one mailing list at a
time please, no cross posts.
- Jordan
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if they used an MII transceiver, then it should work okay, but if
not you could be in for trouble. I wish I didn't have to say that,
but I just don't have the hardware to test with.
You know what I tell people who use that excuse... ;)
- Jordan
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Months. :)
Any idea of when 4.0-RELEASE will be out, in terms of months or years?
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I don't agree with any of this, I'm afraid. The specific model we have
today was evolved with reasonable purpose.
- Jordan
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Hmmm, I can understand the build/install portion but will it boot
since one machine is -CURRENT from 3/99 and the other is 3.3-RELEASE.
Are you still running current, Vince? I thought we established over a
year a go that -current was *not* for you since you don't take the
requisite time
I think a lot of the people who run older versions of -current, and
upgrade sporadically, have done so because there are particular things
missing out of -STABLE that they need (or want).
Which is a fair point, and hopefully we'll be branching 4.0 sooner
this time so the wait is not so long.
I don't want to get nasty here, but was it _really_ necessary to forward
the entire, original, humungous mail to add a few lines of commentary to
Sorry, but as I already commented to another person, I actually only
read the first two paragraphs of Matt's message before replying and
didn't even
From current.freebsd.org's release build log:
linking BOOTMFS
if_ed_isa.o: In function `ed_isa_probe':
if_ed_isa.o(.text+0x45): undefined reference to `ed_probe_WD80x3'
if_ed_isa.o(.text+0x54): undefined reference to `ed_release_resources'
if_ed_isa.o(.text+0x5a): undefined reference to
Suppose I need to install on a bunch of machines. What I'd do, is
install once, get all the pieces/ports/customizations right and then
make a tarball of the system. To install the next machine, I'd use
sysinstall to partition and label the new machine and then just nfs
mount the machine
I don't think any of the authors would mind if it went into /usr/games,
I certainly wouldn't. It would be an old game returning home to the
Berkeley world, and I also used to play it a lot on the HP-2000.
The 'ol HP 2000 access, now that brings back memories... Did you know
I once wrote
I guess the real question is: /usr/games or /usr/ports? I don't care
which, but I would personally prefer /usr/games because it really is
an old-time berkeley program.
Perhaps we should ask Kirk... ;)
- Jordan
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No. Make it a port. Policy, remember? 8)
I guess the anti-bloatists would have a point on this one...
I would not object to a port. It certainly eliminates the
bike shed arguments over it.
- Jordan
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See the mails from October 15th, esp. the ones from Marcel Moolenaar
and Sheldon Hearn.
I did, but they don't fix the XFree86 3.3.5 build problem.
- Jordan
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I've got a box running yesterday's -current and it can't compile
or install things like XFree86 or ImageMagik due to syntax errors
in this file. Investigating further, I find that the trouble begins
around line 127, where we see:
#if defined(_P1003_1B_VISIBLE) || defined(KERNEL)
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