Re: [Freedos-user] FreeDOS or DOS based mail clients
My understanding is that there are two major differences between POP and IMAP. The first is that POP only allows one-way communication (downloading from the server to the client) so there is no synchronization mechanism. If you download the same e-mail to multiple devices, each one can be set up differently (specifically in terms of folders). When you want to send mail, you must use a different protocol (SMTP). The second difference is that IMAP is designed to be used in a client-server configuration where the e-mails stay stored on the server and are never actually downloaded (at least not permanently) to the client. That allows access to the same e-mail account from multiple devices and there is only one "real" copy of the e-mail (stored on the server). Programs like MS Outlook can store a local cached version of the e-mail, and there can be a lot of complication involved in making sure the cache stays synchronized with reality (what's on the server is "reality"). There are advantages and disadvantages to each approach. ___ Freedos-user mailing list Freedos-user@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-user
Re: [Freedos-user] FreeDOS or DOS based mail clients
Hi Jose, > PS: The older POP3 only allowed access to the inbox, > while IMAP also allows access to your other mail folders, > so I expect most mail providers to support IMAP now. I thought that folders were a client-side convention, and mail (POP3, IMAP) servers kept all incoming mail to one address together. Folders are something managed on the server and you can use either IMAP or webmail to access them. With POP3, you can only access the inbox, so you would have to use the client to move individual mails to folders stored on your local disk. The mails in those client side folders would not be visible on other devices or webmail, so I assume and hope that most providers support IMAP today, so all devices can share the same folders :-) According to the google support website, IMAP will always be active for gmail in the future. No idea how old the article is - probably the future already is now :-) In the past, one had to manually enable it using some online menu. The google support website recommends that you do not store sent mail on the server manually, as sending mails via google will automatically do that already. It also recommends to save drafts, but not deleted mails on the server and it recommends to not move deleted mails to the trash can folder, as they would get permanently deletted after a month in the trash can and google prefers old mails to stay forever :-p It recommends that you set your client to just mark deleted mails as deleted where they are. Servers for Gmail: smtp.gmail.com TLS port 587 or SSL port 465. imap.gmail.com SSL port 993. pop.gmail.com SSL port 995 (but IMAP is better). Use the email address as user name to log in. Regards, Eric ___ Freedos-user mailing list Freedos-user@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-user
Re: [Freedos-user] FreeDOS or DOS based mail clients
This is not strictly a DOS remark; it applies to any e-mail but I think it can appear here. Eric Auer said: > PS: The older POP3 only allowed access to the inbox, > while IMAP also allows access to your other mail folders, > so I expect most mail providers to support IMAP now. I thought that folders were a client-side convention, and mail (POP3, IMAP) servers kept all incoming mail to one address together. Webmail, that uses http(s) to access mail as links in a webpage is another story. ___ Freedos-user mailing list Freedos-user@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-user
Re: [Freedos-user] freedos, or dos based mail clients?
Karen also asked about this on the lynx-dev mailing list. They reported that panix.com tested squirrelmail and roundcube in lynx and found that neither works because certain controls in both apps are proprietary controls not standard web controls. I don't do email on DOS, but if i did, i would probably telnet or SSH into an Internet-enabled BBS and mail from there. Below are links to DOS email applications. I cannot recommend any of these because they are old versions and i have no experience using them on DOS. http://www.ibiblio.org/pub/micro/pc-stuff/freedos/files/net/mutt/ https://darrengoossens.wordpress.com/2023/07/01/email-on-freedos-in-2023-pegasus-mail/ http://www.dendarii.co.uk/FAQs/HOWTO-Install-Pegasus.html https://mirrorservice.org/sites/ftp.cac.washington.edu/mail/windows/old/PC-PINE-3.96/pcp_wat.zip http://www.ii.com/internet/messaging/pine/ ___ Freedos-user mailing list Freedos-user@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-user
Re: [Freedos-user] freedos, or dos based mail clients?
Hi mart, Eric and all. Sharing more details, thanks for all these ideas. Because there is no direct inclusive tool for me with the combination of adaptive technology I use in Linux, I ssh telnet from my DOS computer into shellworld using the recently updated sshdos program. Further, I use ssh from within shellworld itself to reach the dreamhost workspaces that they provide curtain up distribution INC. For the record, dreamhost does not really support the programs they provide on their hosting shells, they simply put them there. Shellworld, on the other hand, has a vested interest in inclusion, so incorporates more of a blending, Ubuntu mixed with other tools, some of which like e-links are compiled with a bit more graphics, same for Links, and Lynx..the latter has a keystroke that can submit JavaScript only buttons for example. In sum, here, not all the text tools are strictly text so to speak. now for my gmail needs. mart, my karen.lewel...@gmail.com address not only existed for several professional services, it provided an inclusive way for me to manage files, safely communicate on lists, even serve on organization boards. I have contacts there, files there, data there that losing would be hard to articulate for me personally. What that means in terms of mail forwarding is that, for this email, that door would not be enough. I have a second email account, lewellen...@gmail.com That I lost basic html access too after a library visit. That account has been forwarding to my personal website email, but because I do not actually see all the email there, like what google may decide is spam, nor have access to the full inbox, allot of research has been lost. I do not want to suffer that again. if I am forthright, I am unsure I have the emotional bondage to deal with that loss just now. While I agree with Eric that graphical might not be the solution, I add the qualifier that it depends on how that tool is constructed. I use graphical DOS software all the time, wordperfect for example, which presents stuff to my adaptive tools that lets me read them. I may download this package and see if it can speak. especially if that gives me what I require here. command line does not automatically equal text, or non graphical as it were. So, to sum 1. My requirements are a tool that once configured gives me full access to my gmail information, inbox, sent mail, contacts and the like. If I am importing that to another service, that is fine, so long as that provider gives me a tool that blends well with my combination of adaptive tools. If not, then I will still need, at least for a while, to send email using my gmail address, its not just about reading things, its about well established interactions, personal legal, and professional. We do have mutt, pine, and alpine here at shellworld. using them for this goal would depend on 1, if mutt once configured will present my gmail contents in full the way pine and alpine can, and 2, if I can configure alpine or pine here for gmail, instead of just setting up a forward..mutt as well I suppose. Personally, I do not care for alpine, but that is due to the mayhem using it via dreamhost has been for years, everything from my inbox closing..all the time, to lost emails, and timeout errors. Anyway, based on these details, what should be my best next step? I may need to locate, possibly compensate someone to do the configuring, I am no programmer to be sure. With appreciation, Kare On Wed, 22 Nov 2023, Mart Zirnask via Freedos-user wrote: Hi, On 22/11/2023, Eric Auer via Freedos-user wrote: Does anybody here have experience with using a squirrelmail or roundcoube webmail in links? Might need less java script compared to gmail to use those, and one could forward the gmail mail to a mail provider with squirrelmail or roundcube. I did use SquirrelMail in Links & text-mode Linux 1-2 years ago. IIRC, Navigating frames (which SM uses) was slightly annoying, but doable. Because it is simple HTML, it should be possible to skip SM's side pane altogether and only display the mailbox view, though. Even if it was (due to the frames) not exactly a streamlined experience, I was definitely able to read and write mails, so for smaller workloads, it is fine. There is also the w3m text browser, which had handy vi-like keybindings etc, but the tables and frames rendering is not as good as in Links. Apparently there has been a DJGPP-based port, but (after some googling) it might have been from ~20 years ago. http://w3m.rocks/ https://github.com/albfan/w3m/blob/master/doc/README (confirmation on the DOS port) I can't remember if I ever tried to use Gmail with w3m, though. In any case, Links was better at this. I was actually going to suggest the exact same solution (forwarding Gmail to a SM-based account). I'll very probably have to go the same route myself, because Gmail's default view always feels a bit "too much of everything". Or ditch
Re: [Freedos-user] freedos, or dos based mail clients?
As I physically cannot use Linux outside of the shell services I use, that door is possible, just not from my desktop. I do have a question though. Does your configuration give you total access to email contents, folders sent mail, contact lists and the like? I may need to pay someone to do the configuring for me here at shellworld for my gmail account. On Tue, 21 Nov 2023, Nicholas Bernhard via Freedos-user wrote: I'm using Mutt right now, a command-line email client for Linux. On Tue, Nov 21, 2023 at 07:01:11PM -0600, Rugxulo via Freedos-user wrote: Hi, On Mon, Nov 20, 2023 at 4:17 PM Karen Lewellen via Freedos-user wrote: Google intends removing all access to basic HTML, and is forcing the issue as of today. Did they state a reason? Maintenance burden? Or just better security? Because email was always plain text and pretty insecure. Realistically, I wonder if there are supported Chromebooks for sale with good accessibility options for basic tasks (emails, word processing, browsing the web). (In some ways, I feel they aren't tested well or aren't supported for long or just scattered in obscure locations with little promotion.) A second option would be a command line browser tool that substituted for the gmail interface, but that, if I could not use it directly from DOS, could be set up in the Ubuntu shell I have with shellworld. I assume Ubuntu is much, much better supported. Surely somebody on Linux (or BSD) does email via terminal / commandline. My question is this. is there a DOS only based email client, in freedos, in djppp or something that might meet this need? Text-based? Probably not. Though I always say it's not impossible ... but, in reality, there are so few DJGPP volunteers that a lot doesn't get done. Georg Potthast did a graphical (FLTK) FLmail a while back. I never tested it (and it's probably somewhat unstable), but I bet that mostly works. "FLMAIL91.zipFlMail email client version 0.91" "FLMAIL91.zip2014-11-145.2 MB" * https://sourceforge.net/projects/fltk-dos/files/Applications/Binary%20versions%20of%20FLTK%20applications/ ___ Freedos-user mailing list Freedos-user@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-user ___ Freedos-user mailing list Freedos-user@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-user ___ Freedos-user mailing list Freedos-user@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-user
Re: [Freedos-user] freedos, or dos based mail clients?
Hi, On 22/11/2023, Eric Auer via Freedos-user wrote: > Does anybody here have experience with using a squirrelmail > or roundcoube webmail in links? Might need less java script > compared to gmail to use those, and one could forward the > gmail mail to a mail provider with squirrelmail or roundcube. I did use SquirrelMail in Links & text-mode Linux 1-2 years ago. IIRC, Navigating frames (which SM uses) was slightly annoying, but doable. Because it is simple HTML, it should be possible to skip SM's side pane altogether and only display the mailbox view, though. Even if it was (due to the frames) not exactly a streamlined experience, I was definitely able to read and write mails, so for smaller workloads, it is fine. There is also the w3m text browser, which had handy vi-like keybindings etc, but the tables and frames rendering is not as good as in Links. Apparently there has been a DJGPP-based port, but (after some googling) it might have been from ~20 years ago. http://w3m.rocks/ https://github.com/albfan/w3m/blob/master/doc/README (confirmation on the DOS port) I can't remember if I ever tried to use Gmail with w3m, though. In any case, Links was better at this. I was actually going to suggest the exact same solution (forwarding Gmail to a SM-based account). I'll very probably have to go the same route myself, because Gmail's default view always feels a bit "too much of everything". Or ditch Gmail altogether, finally... :) Not easy, because it is already tied to a bunch of online services. FWIW, I have an Unix shell account at sdf.org -- they are using NetBSD, and here are the mail tools available from the command line: http://sdf.lonestar.org/index.cgi?faq?EMAIL?02 (I've only used SquirrelMail from them, though, and maybe tested Pine.) Might be a DOS History 101 level question, but I'm definitely more of an end-user, so I dare :) -- Historically, what was actually the reason why DOS didn't catch up with networking (as compared to Unix-land)? Security issues, the system being single-user, etc? I remember being somewhat surprised when I realized there really aren't that many simple mail clients for DOS available. Best, Mart ___ Freedos-user mailing list Freedos-user@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-user
Re: [Freedos-user] freedos, or dos based mail clients?
Hi! As it seems that sshdos (ssh) and the links text mode browser for DOS support current security protocols and https: Does anybody here have experience with using a squirrelmail or roundcoube webmail in links? Might need less java script compared to gmail to use those, and one could forward the gmail mail to a mail provider with squirrelmail or roundcube. Another option, given that shellworld offers access to Ubuntu Linux servers, would be to use any of the current or less current text mode email clients. As long as they support imap (or pop3) etc. they should work with gmail? For example mutt, pine, alpine, cone, or the old mailx. Graphical mail clients for DOS are not the answer here. Regards, Eric PS: I also wonder whether it is an option to run a Linux email client in a shell directly on the router at home? ___ Freedos-user mailing list Freedos-user@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-user
Re: [Freedos-user] freedos, or dos based mail clients?
I'm using Mutt right now, a command-line email client for Linux. On Tue, Nov 21, 2023 at 07:01:11PM -0600, Rugxulo via Freedos-user wrote: > Hi, > > On Mon, Nov 20, 2023 at 4:17 PM Karen Lewellen via Freedos-user > wrote: > > > > Google intends removing all access to basic HTML, and is forcing the issue > > as of today. > > Did they state a reason? Maintenance burden? Or just better security? > Because email was always plain text and pretty insecure. > > Realistically, I wonder if there are supported Chromebooks for sale > with good accessibility options for basic tasks (emails, word > processing, browsing the web). (In some ways, I feel they aren't > tested well or aren't supported for long or just scattered in obscure > locations with little promotion.) > > > A second option would be a command line browser tool that substituted > > for the gmail interface, but that, if I could not use it directly from > > DOS, could be set up in the Ubuntu shell I have with shellworld. > > I assume Ubuntu is much, much better supported. Surely somebody on > Linux (or BSD) does email via terminal / commandline. > > > My question is this. > > is there a DOS only based email client, in freedos, in djppp or something > > that might meet this need? > > Text-based? Probably not. Though I always say it's not impossible ... > but, in reality, there are so few DJGPP volunteers that a lot doesn't > get done. > > Georg Potthast did a graphical (FLTK) FLmail a while back. I never > tested it (and it's probably somewhat unstable), but I bet that mostly > works. > > "FLMAIL91.zipFlMail email client version 0.91" > "FLMAIL91.zip2014-11-145.2 MB" > > * > https://sourceforge.net/projects/fltk-dos/files/Applications/Binary%20versions%20of%20FLTK%20applications/ > > > ___ > Freedos-user mailing list > Freedos-user@lists.sourceforge.net > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-user ___ Freedos-user mailing list Freedos-user@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-user
Re: [Freedos-user] freedos, or dos based mail clients?
Hi, On Mon, Nov 20, 2023 at 4:17 PM Karen Lewellen via Freedos-user wrote: > > Google intends removing all access to basic HTML, and is forcing the issue > as of today. Did they state a reason? Maintenance burden? Or just better security? Because email was always plain text and pretty insecure. Realistically, I wonder if there are supported Chromebooks for sale with good accessibility options for basic tasks (emails, word processing, browsing the web). (In some ways, I feel they aren't tested well or aren't supported for long or just scattered in obscure locations with little promotion.) > A second option would be a command line browser tool that substituted > for the gmail interface, but that, if I could not use it directly from > DOS, could be set up in the Ubuntu shell I have with shellworld. I assume Ubuntu is much, much better supported. Surely somebody on Linux (or BSD) does email via terminal / commandline. > My question is this. > is there a DOS only based email client, in freedos, in djppp or something > that might meet this need? Text-based? Probably not. Though I always say it's not impossible ... but, in reality, there are so few DJGPP volunteers that a lot doesn't get done. Georg Potthast did a graphical (FLTK) FLmail a while back. I never tested it (and it's probably somewhat unstable), but I bet that mostly works. "FLMAIL91.zipFlMail email client version 0.91" "FLMAIL91.zip2014-11-145.2 MB" * https://sourceforge.net/projects/fltk-dos/files/Applications/Binary%20versions%20of%20FLTK%20applications/ ___ Freedos-user mailing list Freedos-user@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-user
[Freedos-user] freedos, or dos based mail clients?
Hi folks, Google intends removing all access to basic HTML, and is forcing the issue as of today. Because I keep a great deal of content in my personal gmail account, even using their web interface to convert documents I must sometimes read, I am seeking alternatives. If I am honest, my preference would be an email client I can incorporate with Links for DOS and run from my desktop, that would pass gmail's noninclusive for me due to my combination of disability experiences verification process. Or something I can set up that gives me access to all of my content. A second option would be a command line browser tool that substituted for the gmail interface, but that, if I could not use it directly from DOS, could be set up in the Ubuntu shell I have with shellworld. My question is this. is there a DOS only based email client, in freedos, in djppp or something that might meet this need? Thanks for ideas and questions, Kare ___ Freedos-user mailing list Freedos-user@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-user
