[FRIAM] SIR+HD model in JavaScript + Herd Immunity question.

I'm sure many have seen this... if not scroll to the bottom for the JS model (you can download/inspect/modify the code if you like)...   It doesn't stop at SIR but adds H(ospitalization) and D(eath)...   and is parameterized with sliders.     https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/03/25/opinion/

[FRIAM] Pro-Sociality, self-organization and nudge theory

Pro-Sociality, self organization and Nudge theory It seems that Nudge Theory is getting a little bit of a bad rep due to the UK's appeal/deference to it in their aborted "herd immunity" strategy...   and while it may have been misapplied or presumed to be "enough" when it was patently not, I don't

Re: [FRIAM] tom did you ditch the meeting

On 4/3/20 12:51 PM, thompnicks...@gmail.com wrote: > > No.  apparently steve grabbed the host role/  I don’t know how he did > that.  > He is a Morlock > >   > > n > >   > > Nicholas Thompson > > Emeritus Professor of Ethology and Psychology > > Clark University > > thompnicks...@gmail.com

[FRIAM] COVID19 Trend Charting

Some more for the chart-wonks to chew on... https://public.tableau.com/profile/jonas.nart#!/vizhome/COVID19_15844962693420/COVID19-TrendTracker -- --- .-. . .-.. --- -.-. -.- ... / --- ..-. / ..-. .-. .. .- -- / ..- -. .. - . FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Zoom meeting Fridays 9:30a-12

[FRIAM] SarsCoV-2 meta-list

I'm trying to build a list of parallel or complementary efforts to the SimTable/RedFish efforts...  Once this list gets semi-populated I will share it out here as  well. The focus is on groups/teams we might join, collaborate with, obtain data from, etc.   this is a pretty broad spec and I may be

Re: [FRIAM] YIKES!: Coronavirus New Mexico numbers.xlsx

On 4/2/20 10:20 AM, uǝlƃ ☣ wrote: > I think she does, indirectly. Homeostasis might be easier to maintain with a > diversity of strategies preserved in the milieu. Authoritarianism is a > monotonic forcing structure. As long as there's a vibrant ecology of > revolutionaries throbbing underneath

Re: [FRIAM] YIKES!: Coronavirus New Mexico numbers.xlsx

This just in via Guerin from LocoTopia: Comparative Resilience: 8 Principles for Post-COVID Reconstruction http://michaelhshuman.com/?p=456 On 4/2/20 10:20 AM, uǝlƃ ☣ wrote: > I think she does, indirectly. Homeostasis might be easier to maintain with a > diversity of strategies preserved in th

Re: [FRIAM] YIKES!: Coronavirus New Mexico numbers.xlsx

On 4/2/20 10:09 AM, Marcus Daniels wrote: > Dave writes: > > < There are 30,000 known coronaviruses in the animal population just > waiting for the opportune moment to jump species. > > I knew there was a way to solve the climate problem. > > > I don't think Ms. Gaia cares too much about the autho

Re: [FRIAM] YIKES!: Coronavirus New Mexico numbers.xlsx

My observation is that from Dickens' "best of times, worst of times".   I think as an inflection/bifurcation point,   many things are possible.  "sensitive dependence on initial conditions".   In the spirit of "creative visualization" and "self-fulfilling prophecies" there are risks and opportuniti

[FRIAM] Flee to Barsoom!

I wonder if Musk is ramping up his efforts to take 1M people to colonize Mars...  These smartie-pants are selling deeds to an acre (not even a metric hectare?) of land on Mars at a groupon discount of $12 (limited time only?). https://www.groupon.com/deals/buy-planet-mars-1?p=3&utm_source=channel

Re: [FRIAM] covid question

> Nick writes: > > < If we just agreed that we won't intubate anybody over 60, we could > have this thing over in a jiffy. > > Oh yeh... and I think for each of us, we should insert: "won't intubate anyone over " to think this through with the right attitude.   And maybe even consider "won't admit

Re: [FRIAM] covid question

> Nick writes: > > < If we just agreed that we won't intubate anybody over 60, we could > have this thing over in a jiffy. > > > And they've had *all their lives* to buy one and have in their > garage.  So irresponsible! > > Marcus It turns out I do have an O2 Cylinder, a full-face snorkel mask

Re: [FRIAM] covid question

> Given that 23-30 percent (US estimated numbers) up to 50 percent (Iceland > reported numbers) of Covid positives are asymptomatic: I believe that "asymptomatic" is a blurry concept in this case.   There is "presymptomatic" and "subsymptomatic" and "cryptosymptomatic" even "cosymptomatic".   

Re: [FRIAM] Good leading indicator and good news

This just in...  I haven't had a chance to parse through what is available but it promises to be as expansive as any such list? https://cloudblog.withgoogle.com/products/data-analytics/free-public-datasets-for-covid19/amp/ FRIAM Applie

Re: [FRIAM] Good leading indicator and good news

Barry - > See > https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/30/health/coronavirus-restrictions-fevers.html?smid=nytcore-ios-share > > Internet-connected fever thermometers indicate that isolation is > beginning to work. > This "barometer" of health-weather is promising in general...  I am wondering if the fit

Re: [FRIAM] Coronavirus New Mexico numbers.xlsx

This is of interest/value to the Epidemic Intelligence work going on at SimTable/Redfish...   our scope is technically just NM and are parsing the same file, but would always be thankful for any automated data sources as they come available... On 3/30/20 5:02 PM, uǝlƃ ☣ wrote: > Excellent! Please

Re: [FRIAM] idle questions while in self-quarantine

Dave - Your list of idle questions represents *quite a span*. And I thought *I* was prone to flying off (thinking about and sharing) in all directions at once! There is at least one "great american novel" in there... and maybe a few alternate histories or closer to Gibson's recent pair (Peripher

Re: [FRIAM] Coronavirus New Mexico numbers.xlsx

Barry - > Here is a cheaper option (attached) > I already have one of those... it turns out that with the hose in the sun, you can get a couple of "warm ones" in a row come summertime however, there is a risk of scalding if you don't put most of the hose in the shade. > On 28 Mar 2020, at 21:

Re: [FRIAM] talk about rabbit holes ...

manities", which I think takes a good step toward "what comes after". But > this isn't my domain. So, that's the only recommendation I have. I'll put that in my associative memory and look forward when it gets reactivated again... I haven't even begun to follow

Re: [FRIAM] talk about rabbit holes ...

Glen - Not just any ole rabbit hole but a very convoluted/complex (albeit interesting) one. I dove into your last link (only) because I've been wanting to understand more better what YOUR view of postmoderism is...   on the whole I like what I read.   I don't have the focus nor bandwidth right no

Re: [FRIAM] Antiviral and Vaccine development and immune profiling from one of many insiders in the fray..

c!  Carry on,  - Steve > Alrighty, let's return attention to those genetically-engineered babies! > ---- > *From:* Friam on behalf of Steven A Smith > > *Sent:* Tuesday, March 24, 2020 12:16 PM > *To:* friam

Re: [FRIAM] Pragmaticism and puritanism

I'm thinking the symptoms of COVID19 might be closer to those of a "dodgy drug" in this case...  some fever dreams for all who are symptomatic? On 3/11/20 11:01 AM, Marcus Daniels wrote: > Temporary refrigeration for some FRIAM members? Just until it all blows > over? > > On 3/11/20, 9:30 AM,

Re: [FRIAM] wifi repeaters?!

I have a handful of MeshPotato s  that I am currently not using.  They are designed to be cheap, robust, and potentially solar-powered... they are now out-of-production and somewhat old but still viable tech. Some of the places I was testing them, I replaced

[FRIAM] Antiviral and Vaccine development and immune profiling from one of many insiders in the fray..

FWIW - This just in from my daughter, molecularBio/Virologist at OHSU on the topic of antivirals and vaccines and human samples for immune profiling: Also, this concept of targeting the host rather than the virus for antiviral development is not a new one, has lots of complications, a

Re: [FRIAM] Choroquine-phosphate Death

“unusual” or > “bizarre”:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Didier_Raoult#Citations > >   > > Amicalement > > Michel Bloch > > /http://mountvernon.fr// > > /06 80 57 3398/ > >   > > *De :* Friam <mailto:friam-boun...@redfish.co

Re: [FRIAM] Choroquine-phosphate Death

ations > >   > > Amicalement > > Michel Bloch > > /http://mountvernon.fr// > > /06 80 57 3398/ > >   > > *De :* Friam *De la part de* Steven A Smith > *Envoyé :* mardi 24 mars 2020 16:27 > *À :* friam@redfish.com > *Objet :* Re: [FRIAM] Choro

Re: [FRIAM] Choroquine-phosphate Death

at 2:53 PM, Barry MacKichan wrote: >> >> Elon Musk had a serious brush with malaria about 20 years ago, and is >> evidently one of the insistent sources pushing for chloroquine. >> Sorry, I don’t have references. >> >> —Barry >> >> On 24 Mar 2020, at 0:42

Re: [FRIAM] Papers on asymptomatic transmission and serology

>> doses would be much smaller than therapeutic doses. This makes sense, since >> the infecting inoculum is likely to be much smaller than the viral burden >> during severe disease. > > > On 3/23/20 6:15 PM, Steven A Smith wrote: >> Glen>The convalescent

[FRIAM] Choroquine-phosphate Death

My first reaction to this was:  THANK YOU DEAR LEADER! https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/briannasacks/man-died-chloroquine-phosphate-coronavirus But, I don't know if we can attribute this kind of accident to POTUS45 or not... my gut instinct is that his constant raving about it is what trigger

Re: [FRIAM] Papers on asymptomatic transmission and serology

Thanks for the two references: Glen> The convalescent sera option for containing COVID-19 https://www.jci.org/articles/view/138003 Barry> https://www.globalhealthnow.org/2020-03/covid-19s-stop-gap-solution-until-vaccines-and-antivirals-are-ready This is particularly promising, especially the

Re: [FRIAM] Papers on asymptomatic transmission and serology

Barry - Really great writeup from your daughter in Wellington.   It reinforces and adds well to what I've been hearing from my own daughter (Molecular Biologist in FlaviVirus lab at OHSU in Oregon) who have actually run PCR based tests using the WHO information on themselves (a dozen or so scienti

Re: [FRIAM] Outbreak Simulation

While I'm sympathetic with the idea that the relative magnitude of this threat *might* be on the same order as "hit by a car", and that to the extent that panic behaviour has it's own risks and unintended consequences, I think  there is a qualitative issue at hand as well. It is as if the number

Re: [FRIAM] Equanimous Equinox!

Just now returning from most of a week of wandering the back country of NM/AZ/UT from 10k ft to 3k, my lilacs and cottonwoods were budding, my apricot had started blooming and was frozen off, my apples just did the same last night (froze back) I think.   The grasses are peeking up through the dry l

Re: [FRIAM] science privilege — fork from acid epistemology

Dave - I myself am having an ineffable experience just now, as my drive through the big-rock country has taken on a Mad Max quality (simile borrowed from a friend on his own Hellride back up the coast of CA after retrieving his college son, with counties closing down behind him as he rolls through

Re: [FRIAM] to the local congregation

FWIW, Mary and I are traveling the back roads of NM/AZ, having re-routed from a trip to visit my 92 year old mother, meeting my 18mo and 8yr old grandchildren traveling in from OR and CO. OR waved off entirely, while CO chose also to drive backroads, camping instead. We scored a $400 room at

Re: [FRIAM] Acid epistemology - restarting a previous conversation

Nick - Yesterday we went to the documentary "Fantastic Fungi" at CCA and I highly recommend it to you.  It is relatively short (just over an hour) but did not feel that way. While it was nominally about fungi the Kingdom, it was primarily about human's relationship to fungi and in particular the

Re: [FRIAM] Acid epistemology - restarting a previous conversation

Dave - > 1) I am fascinated by the field of scientific visualization, using imagery to > present complex data sets. Recently I "observed" the precise moment of > sperm-egg fertilization. A whole lot was going on inside the egg cell > boundary immediately upon contact (not penetration) with the

Re: [FRIAM] trolling, 'hidden' to 'touch' and 'contact'

27;t enough like it, then we > should just give up and stay in our fantasy worlds. > > So, if you wouldn't claim that reality is deeply structured by metaphor, but > our reasoning *is* deeply structured by metaphor, then where do the 2 meet? > Or are you, as Nick repeats li

[FRIAM] Devs

I just watched the first episode of Devs on Hulu/FX... primarily because Mary and I are fans of Nick Offerman.  I was more satisfied than usual with it's representation of tech and science, though such has gotten better and better over the decades.

Re: [FRIAM] trolling, 'hidden' to 'touch' and 'contact'

> Perhaps coincidentally ... or maybe cause I'm triggered ...: > > Do Atoms Ever Touch? > https://youtu.be/P0TNJrTlbBQ > > They go 'round and 'round about the definitions and *finally* arrive at the > conclusion that "the analogy breaks down". So, the answer to "are emotional > states hidden

Re: [FRIAM] Acid epistemology - restarting a previous conversation

Dave - As for me, I'm not irritated with your keeping these discussions going.  I *am* irritated with the larger (cross-domain, national/global) discussion of "Truthiness" and the various bimodal fallacies introduced thereby. Science and the Scientific Method, for example, have built into them a

Re: [FRIAM] Acid epistemology - restarting a previous conversation

We all have the propensity (at different times) to conflate our greatest hopes and worse fears with "Truth".   In the shadow of this we have various forms of ignorance:   Simple lack of knowledge of some phenomena or observation, through the full spectrum to the most willful ignorance (or ignorant

Re: [FRIAM] A longer response to Dave's question

/On the Utility of Perception/Mood/Judgement/Inhibition-Altering conditions and Reality/ It feels as if this subset of FriAM has begun to converge on a common discussion, albeit from different perspectives with different assumptions and different judgements.  Let me add my own subroutine to the an

Re: [FRIAM] Graal VM

Glen - > I suppose the fault is mine for not *emphasizing* the inspiration for my use > of the term. Here it is again if anyone might care. > > https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/wJutA2czyFg6HbYoW/what-are-trigger-action-plans-taps, >> trigger - The simple, specific sight/sound/smell/thought/feeling

Re: [FRIAM] Graal VM

With this example, I understand why Glen prefers triggers and actions to be distinct, if/when/as I might use this language for agent modeling I would prefer the same. In my naive version of pop psych, I am used to "triggers" and "reactions" being somewhat convolved.  The firearm metaphor is quite

Re: [FRIAM] A longer response to Dave's question

Nick - > What I object to is the notion that such experiences in extremis are > èin principleç more likely to be true than ordinary ones, or, further, > that there is any way to confirm the implications of one experience > except through further experiences.  > I believe that  /experiences en extr

Re: [FRIAM] Graal VM

Glen - >> I'm surprised (but welcome more introspection) that you would prescribe >> *installing triggers* in the light of your proscription against >> *premature binding* in general.  I'm sure there are plenty of nuances >> I'm missing here. > That's a good point. I suppose I should distinguish be

[FRIAM] trypophobia

Dewd! > I suspect I have trypophobia > . > But having a *name* for the trigger helps me a lot, even if I can't help > that my heart races and I start sweat

Re: [FRIAM] Graal VM

Glen - > Hm. I must have dropped the ball, here. I'm talking about a) being *aware* of > one's triggers and b) where there are none, *installing* them. You're talking > about triggering the way the right wingers talk about it ... as if it's a bad > thing. My point in arguing with Steve's positio

Re: [FRIAM] Graal VM

Marcus - Thanks for that great example...   I didn't want to invoke Quantum Superposition, but this very real/practical application from the domain of QC makes it less esoteric.   It reminds me that the last time I looked very closely at QC, it was all pretty nascent and theoretical and that there

Re: [FRIAM] Graal VM

ial innuendo in the original response on this thread is that (collectively if not individually) the "powers that be" understand this very well and manipulate it (premature reduction/collapse of dimensionality) to their own benefit. - Steve > On 2/20/20 10:07 AM, Steven A Smith wrote: &

Re: [FRIAM] Graal VM

Great discussions as always (or at least often) here.   What I find missing in both this thread and the Peirce/Pragmatist one Dave started is the structural aspects of our sociopolitical scene that creates a low-dimensional (often just one), polarizing landscape where those with more power (econom

Re: [FRIAM] on stupidity

Marcus - > < I tend to agree with your intuition that something that seems > egregiously "stupid" might well simply be registered in a different > basis space... or more aptly "a different value system". > > > Indeed, like a provincial value system. One that optimizes for local > in

Re: [FRIAM] on stupidity

glen - I tend to agree with your intuition that something that seems egregiously "stupid" might well simply be registered in a different basis space...  or more aptly "a different value system".  It is easy/convenient enough to just "discount it" and move on, but if the subject is important enough

Re: [FRIAM] is it possible that ...

Damn!  I need that T-Shirt for my campaigning! */"a 3D foam of camouflaged steel traps waiting to lop off the fractal tendrils of our squidlike Leviathans" /* */ /* > On 2/13/20 8:13 AM, Marcus Daniels wrote: >> I do wonder about Warren, Klobuchar, Sanders, and Buttigieg and their >> rhetoric

Re: [FRIAM] Eric Smith's interview on Jim Rutt's podcast

> Thanks for this, Steve, > > Yes, it was Grinspoon.  Sara Walker told me that at the last AbSciCon > meeting, but in the running stream of conversation with Jim I had > forgotten it. > > Your Freudian typo was fun, unless it was your computer that did it. >  A mixture of Grinspoon and Greenspan.

Re: [FRIAM] Eric Smith's interview on Jim Rutt's podcast

Eric - /There’s a quote and I can’t remember the source, I should, he’s a member of the astrobiology community, but it’s pithy and elegant. The quote was that the origin of life is not something that happens on a planet, it’s something that happens to a planet. That was really

Re: [FRIAM] Eric Smith's interview on Jim Rutt's podcast

Eric- Great interview! /*Eric*//: You know what I like on this though, I think back to the, I guess it was AlphaGo competition with Lee Sedol in the computer human contest for Go playing. I really loved Lee’s comment at the end of it, where he was saying that of course those had b

Re: [FRIAM] Eric Smith's interview on Jim Rutt's podcast

Stephen - Thanks for turning me onto Rutt's show a while back... I've been working my way into some of the meat there.   I've met Jim before but this really exposes his style and personality while pulling some amazing things out of his interviewees.   Cory Doctorow and Lee Smolin come most recentl

Re: [FRIAM] Abduction and Introspection

☣ - > Well, your abstract seems to assume something akin to coherence, the idea > that whatever's doing the introspection is a whole/atomic thing perceiving > that whole/atomic thing. I think we know that established types of > self-perception (proprio-, entero-) consist of one sub-component mo

[FRIAM] Doomsday Clock

Just ticked down to an all time low of 100 seconds. https://thebulletin.org/doomsday-clock/ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo

Re: [FRIAM] Murdoch and Trump

Too much (IMO) of our contemporary (public and private?) discourse seems to be high on confirmation bias.    The ensemble of possible futures (trajectories through?) has exploded (see Kauffman's "Adjacent Possible") both with the growth of technological complexity and with the shift in distributio

Re: [FRIAM] Climate Modeling

Oh... also an interesting report on the Shared Socioeconomic Pathways (SSPs) as canonical scenarios to be used with these models. > > Eric - > > Great back-of-envelop summary/speculation and I second your desire for > someone well-steeped in these modeling/assessment issues. > > We (speaking out o

[FRIAM] Climate Modeling

Eric - Great back-of-envelop summary/speculation and I second your desire for someone well-steeped in these modeling/assessment issues. We (speaking out of school for Merle, Stephen, and the team that went to and met with the Stockholm Team last month) would love to find someone with that depth/b

[FRIAM] BohmDialog was: NO LANL IN SANTA FE!

> conterarian tweet on the same stream.  In fact, how about a retweet > limit on all messages.  No message can be retweeted more than > ten-thousand times.    > >   > > Nick > > Nicholas Thompson > > Emeritus Professor of Ethology and Psychology > > Clark University

Re: [FRIAM] Fwd: NO LANL IN SANTA FE! Wednesday, 12; 00 outside SF City Hall; bring friends

Merle, et al - Though I reject most of the extreme arguments I hear on both sides of this issue, my instinct is that it would be better if Santa Fe did NOT invite LANL/NNSA into the development of this critical/central/prime location in the heart of *greater* Santa Fe.   I've been living in a var

Re: [FRIAM] more Epstein fallout

A good friend makes the distinction: "Power does not corrupt, Power IS Corruption!" Money is a highly liquid (or even volatile?) form of power.   The issues many/most raise around cryptocurrency (untraceable transfer of wealth) seems to revolve around the extreme case that "you can buy anythi

Re: [FRIAM] Fwd: Question from Merle

> Lars, Merle, Nick, and FRIAM members, > > Thank you for taking the time to respond, Lars! It's an important > first spark of interaction between two groups with Stockholm and Santa > Fe as nexus. Just to second Stephen's praise for both Lars' and Merle's "shepherding" our group so deftly.   Kudo

[FRIAM] Fwd: climate change questions

Merle - Thanks for introducing the Complexity and Climate meeting you organized last month to the Friam contingent.   The meeting was a transformative experience for me.   While I was already highly attuned to the challenges addressed at the meeting both personally and professionally, meeting our

Re: [FRIAM] climate change questions

See the Medea Hypothesis vs the Gaia Hypothesis vs the Fermi Paradox (as anot

Re: [FRIAM] A PolyMath by any other name...

Oh Nick!  Let me "chastise" you again .   This was so far from trash (your original observation, my "chastisement", and your polite but unnecessary "apology").   I was, of course, friendly-teasing you about your use of the term "bored" while trying to acknowledge that PolyBores abound (esp. on thi

Re: [FRIAM] A PolyMath by any other name...

I believe that Bruce (if you mean Sherwood) went AWOL from this list, expatriating to WedTech when it was formed (5 or more years ago?), along with a few others.  I heard rumors of a contingent getting overly tired of our endless philosophical maunderings here, in favor of a more "actionable" set o

Re: [FRIAM] Celeste Kidd - How to Know

Marcus - I do like the idea that a good "comedy team" might effectively de-weaponize deep-fakes...   like The Yes Men or SNL perhaps...   there is the risk that such "normalizes" deep fakes, but to the extent that it is already on it's way...  comedy-ifying may be the best (least-worst) alternativ

Re: [FRIAM] Celeste Kidd - How to Know

REC - Good find! I am not closely following the development and results of GAN work, but it seems like this kind of study explicates at least ONE GOOD REASON for worrying about AI changing the nature of the world as we know it (even if it isn't a precise existential threat).   Convolved with Carl

Re: [FRIAM] belly of the beast

glen sed: > Bah! The shiny objects are for diachronics. We episodics dream of storming a > bunker and finding alien versions of ourselves. Tangenting off of the (unintended?) resonance with the "Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep?": Why just bend a thread when you can give it a good twist and a

Re: [FRIAM] belly of the beast

tion models in social networks, in particular self-modifying social networks.   Insight into these very general and underspecified domains would be welcome. - Steve - > > On Fri, Dec 27, 2019 at 10:37 AM Steven A Smith <mailto:sasm...@swcp.com>> wrote: > > N

Re: [FRIAM] description - explanation - metaphor - model

Glen - Well found.   I am digging into it now.  Thanks to both you and Eric S. for this acute but interesting/relevant bend to the thread at hand. A fascinating twist in our "Climate Complexity Summit" in Stockholm earlier this month (thanks Merle for instigating/organizing) was what felt to me

[FRIAM] belly of the beast

Nick - > > Our Own Lee Rudolph, was there as well.  In the belly of Net Logo, I > think. > >   > > Lee Are you out there?  > That is an interesting factoid...  I would not have guessed/recognized that legacy.  Net/Logo is definitely an interesting beast. "We all got to be the way we are, someh

Re: [FRIAM] description - explanation - metaphor - model

gt; So, the question for the Platonist becomes "which parts do we hold > constant and which parts vary". I'm still a Platonist ... simply one > that's skeptical of anyone's assertion that some part should be held > constant/universal. > > > > > > As

Re: [FRIAM] IT is Not Sustainable

; Frank > > --- > Frank Wimberly > > My memoir: > https://www.amazon.com/author/frankwimberly > > My scientific publications: > https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Frank_Wimberly2 > > Phone (505) 670-9918 > > On Thu, Dec 26,

Re: [FRIAM] IT is Not Sustainable

Frank - It is fascinating to hear that you were in the "belly of the beast" if only for a short while.  I suppose we have all been in the belly of *some* beast in our various times. My earliest years were without a telephone in the house (camp-trailer in the woods) followed by several party lines

Re: [FRIAM] description - explanation - metaphor - model

> > So truth is not only tremendously useful (even Fox agrees with that) but it > actually exists, even though we can see it only in the asymptotes of our > sucessful guesses. > > Joyous X, Steve, for whatever value of X you care to adopt. > > Nick > Nicholas Tho

Re: [FRIAM] description - explanation - metaphor - model

Dave (et al) - I haven't had the bandwidth/focus to follow this line of discussion closely nor well, much less stick my fat foot in the middle of it, however your synopsis/redux/refactor here is very well presented and while I have some pause with some of your assertions/conclusions, overall rings

Re: [FRIAM] Ineffable

Not to put too fine of a point on it, but THAT is " eFFing ineffable"... On 12/19/19 10:32 AM, Frank Wimberly wrote: > I just heard the word "ineffable" outside the context of Friam.  The > speaker was reviewing the film "Uncut Gems" starring Adam Sandler.  He > said that Sandler's ability to play

Re: [FRIAM] [EXT] Re: A pluralistic model of the mind?

FriAMsketeers and Correspondents en Ineffablia - I am traveling in Sweden right now where every other young man I meet is named "Torbjorn"  which roughly translates to "Thunder-Bear" or more specifically "god-of-thunder/bear".   In every case, I actually do feel as if I have spoken with a God and

Re: [FRIAM] means of production take 2

aking. And the core distinction you've made (ingrained vs. > contrived) is solid, which is not to say I agree or disagree, only that it > helps me be better at listening. In fact, going any further, might inhibit me > from listening to the phrase-user with empathy. I might preem

Re: [FRIAM] means of production take 2

ts in the individual but it appears this is almost exclusively a storyline and misdirection by Capital to undermine Unions to maintain their ability to exploit the labor of Labor at-will.  This battle, I would claim, has squeezed out everything but the thinnest of illusions than an individual migh

Re: [FRIAM] means of production take 3

Dave - I really appreciate this offering.   Your simplified model of exchange here  fits my own anecdotal experience well enough and might provide a good armature for a expanded notional model of exchange:commons:symbiosis that I've been thinking/working around.  Please do send your full paper.

Re: [FRIAM] FYI: John Dobson on Tariffs and Trade – Santa Fe Council on International Relations

TJ/GD - Thanks for the link and an introduction to CIR and the World Affairs Councils in general. Dobson's work in this area looks interesting... a nice alternative to mere hand wringing on the topic! - SS On 11/23/19 11:26 AM, George Duncan wrote: > Tom,  > > We will go and we have joined CIR.

Re: [FRIAM] post you seem to have missed from FRIAM

Nick - I'll second Glen's suggestion that you delineate as best you can, specific things you don't understand and iterate with one or more of us an those as best you can.   As evidenced by my discussion with Glen on "means of production", it can be rather grueling for both sides, but since I have

Re: [FRIAM] post you seem to have missed from FRIAM

Nick - I think the "overclocking" analogy is not entirely fitting to the larger discussion of "altered states" because it merely invokes a quantitative increase, but might be a good starting point to continue the discussion.  I *don't* find the appeal of a 30% faster CPU very compelling, so am no

Re: [FRIAM] means of production take 2

gt; atomic units (doable because of their hard boundaries). Herds of goats are > harder, but till doable as long as you allow for mating, nurturing, milk > production, etc. Humans and streams are more difficult to divide. > > How am I doing so far? Is this better or worse? > > &g

Re: [FRIAM] means of production take 2

understand which aspects are unequivocal and which are not.  The notion of destructionability as ownership is perhaps the most unequivocal.   Simply denying access to others (holding tight, placing inside of a safe bolted to the bedrock, building a castle around, etc.) and therefore "use&qu

Re: [FRIAM] means of production take 2

xchange (camels for dates)...   likely creating a positive feedback loop speciating their cultures even more. "just so" here not because I think anything precisely like this ever occurred as described but more to circumscribe how different contexts could easily yield different "right

[FRIAM] Collapse of the Information Ecosystem/Noosphere

Glen - I chose not to respond specifically to the link/point you offered in my last response because I felt this was a (useful) tangent and wanted to address it more directly.  I do appreciate the analogy drawn between our physical ecosystem and what the author calls the Information ecosystem and

Re: [FRIAM] post you seem to have missed from FRIAM

Nick - I'm suspect that my own habits around indentation, /italicization/, etc.   are not explicit enough to make things clear enough as to who is speaking to whom.   I also tend to trust/defer to my mailtool (thunderbird) which *seems* to add very limited HTML markup of included sections.  I do t

Re: [FRIAM] means of production take 2

Glen - Thanks for circling around on this one.   I had not forgotten the frayed thread I left with you on this, but as you suggest, might be lacking the tools/perspective to explain.  I take this to mean that your questions are requiring me to think deeper/differently. 1) I *don't* think I am usi

Re: [FRIAM] So disjointed

It is interesting to speculate as to how much of the disjointedness of our discussions/threads here are the result of lossy communications at the remailer/spam-filter level. After trying various spam-filter tools and heuristics back in the day when they first emerged, I settled on using Thunderbir

Re: [FRIAM] flattening -isms

t Steve responded to. > >   > > Nick > >   > >   Nicholas S. Thompson > > Emeritus Professor of Psychology and Biology > > Clark University > > http://home.earthlink.net/~nickthompson/naturaldesigns/ > >   > > *From:*Friam [mailto:friam-boun...

Re: [FRIAM] flattening -isms

On 11/18/19 5:13 AM, Prof David West wrote: > Nick said: > > /"What struck me about them was how many of them held the view that > reality was beyond experience: i.e., that our experience provided > clues to reality, but the thing itself was beyond experience.  I never > could convince them that t

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