Re: [FRIAM] The World Turned Upside Down (and what to do about it)

There may be collaborators who would be eager to help in such a project: http://kingjamesprogramming.tumblr.com/ Eric > On Sep 15, 2017, at 8:49 PM, Marcus Daniels wrote: > > I wonder if a Trump-like candidate bot could be built using a genetic program > and some

Re: [FRIAM] The World Turned Upside Down (and what to do about it)

Roger writes: "In the Peircian ecology of political ideas, the electorate (or someone) must act as the conscience of politics, the politician flails around trying to move the world away from the horrible things that already exist, and the electorate tries to keep us from moving to places

Re: [FRIAM] The World Turned Upside Down (and what to do about it)

I guess the point is that politicians are guaranteed to try these lies out, to the limit that their consciences (assuming there is one) allow, so you have to keep shouting back at them that they lie, not only is it a lie, it's a horrible lie which hurts these people this way and you should be

Re: [FRIAM] The World Turned Upside Down (and what to do about it)

Roger writes: "The lies that bind political coalitions together, the art of the possible fiction which might be brought to horrible life, ... " It is ugly, but it is irresponsible to pretend it could be otherwise. Marcus From: Friam

Re: [FRIAM] The World Turned Upside Down (and what to do about it)

The lies that bind political coalitions together, the art of the possible fiction which might be brought to horrible life, ... -- rec -- On Fri, Sep 15, 2017 at 12:41 PM, gⅼеɳ ☣ wrote: > But did the Mexican Repatriation also include things like rape, burning > villages,

Re: [FRIAM] The World Turned Upside Down (and what to do about it)

But did the Mexican Repatriation also include things like rape, burning villages, and indiscriminant execution? I can imagine it did, but would rather not believe it. It's still so jarring to me, given the cultural appropriation of Buddhism in Western developed countries, to hear phrases like

Re: [FRIAM] The World Turned Upside Down (and what to do about it)

Right here in River City (well, mostly California, but throughout the US) the 1930's "Mexican Repatriation Act" deported on the order of 1-2M US Citizens because of their ethnicity (along with a smaller number of non-Citizens more recently immigrated from Mexico), qualifying for our modern

Re: [FRIAM] The World Turned Upside Down (and what to do about it)

Hmm, my NPR station was talking about how Myanmar is committed to the lie that there is no Rohingya minority to be persecuted, only illegal Bengali immigrants who are being deported back to Bangladesh, this despite historical evidence that the earliest Bengali settlements began in the 15th century

Re: [FRIAM] The World Turned Upside Down (and what to do about it)

Nope. However, it's important to realize that the metaphors of the shambling zombies (Romero's and The Walking Dead's) are substantively different from those metaphors of the fast-moving zombies, especially the ones that learn to think and can sometimes be cured (Helix, Resident Evil, Z, Game

Re: [FRIAM] The World Turned Upside Down (and what to do about it)

"I prefer the relatively common metaphor of the zombie as a typical shambling idiot who is dangerous precisely because he doesn't think and can infect you with his lack of thought. Typical red state voters *are* the zombies." And here I thought the zombies were the brown-skinned immigrants

Re: [FRIAM] The World Turned Upside Down (and what to do about it)

Nah. I prefer the relatively common metaphor of the zombie as a typical shambling idiot who is dangerous precisely because he doesn't think and can infect you with his lack of thought. Typical red state voters *are* the zombies. The Walking Dead, as a TV show, is about how those of us who

Re: [FRIAM] The World Turned Upside Down (and what to do about it)

Cautionary tales are nothing to be afraid of. I think this is something completely misunderstood by people who don't watch enough horror movies. You don't watch The Walking Dead and think "Don't open that door! Don't open the door" You watch it and *know* that if you were there, you'd

Re: [FRIAM] The World Turned Upside Down (and what to do about it)

Merle - By some measure, didn't we just experience a "bloodless" revolution just under a year ago? Didn't the 1% and the Evangelicals enlist the mainstream Conservatives to rally the unwashed masses to help them put a manipulable (if not predictable or exactly controllable) clown on deck to

Re: [FRIAM] The World Turned Upside Down (and what to do about it)

Have any of you been watching the t.v. Hulu series of Margaret Atwood's "The Handmaid's Tale"? I read it three decades ago and it is spooking me out once more because the understory is the normalization of a subversive societal move toward a dystopian fascist state. It's promoted as science

Re: [FRIAM] The World Turned Upside Down (and what to do about it)

Well, Republicans aren't so bad. It's the conservative wing of their party that's bad. Similarly, Democrats aren't as bad as the Bernie-bros make them out. It's the conservative wing of the Democrats that's bad. So, to be clear, I like the majority of the Republicans I know. And I like the

Re: [FRIAM] The World Turned Upside Down (and what to do about it)

Glen goes, "Other than Trump and the last dying gasps of the traits that got him elected, the rest of us believe the country was (and kinda still is) on a very good track!" I wish I could be that optimistic. The Republicans have managed to get control of the majority of state governments, which

Re: [FRIAM] The World Turned Upside Down (and what to do about it)

Stuff like--maybe revolution? On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 10:32 AM, Marcus Daniels wrote: > Russ writes: > > > "I say exactly what Roberts said: that identifying yet more example of > Trump's dishonest won't convince anyone on either side. So perhaps we > should get beyond

Re: [FRIAM] The World Turned Upside Down (and what to do about it)

Ha! Perfectamundo! On 09/14/2017 10:16 AM, Gillian Densmore wrote: > /*Illegitimi non carborundum*/ -- ☣ gⅼеɳ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College to unsubscribe

Re: [FRIAM] The World Turned Upside Down (and what to do about it)

*Illegitimi non carborundum* On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 11:05 AM, gⅼеɳ ☣ wrote: > Roberts says: "The country is on the wrong track. (Everyone believes this > one)." > > This sentence and the parenthetical convinced me of what RussA's already > said, that Roberts is too

Re: [FRIAM] The World Turned Upside Down (and what to do about it)

Roberts says: "The country is on the wrong track. (Everyone believes this one)." This sentence and the parenthetical convinced me of what RussA's already said, that Roberts is too trapped by his fear-based conservatism to see the asymmetry. What Roberts is saying is utter garbage. Everyone?

Re: [FRIAM] The World Turned Upside Down (and what to do about it)

Nick, Daughter Diane says, "No. Either "calore" (singular) or "caloribus" (plural). You probably want singular." Sorry, Frank Frank Wimberly Phone (505) 670-9918 On Sep 14, 2017 9:11 AM, "Nick Thompson" wrote: > Dear Marcus, Owen > > > > Allow me to heckle, if

Re: [FRIAM] The World Turned Upside Down (and what to do about it)

Marcus wrote, "Yeah, time for lawyers, boycotts, and stuff like that." Agree. Eventually one reaches the point that one has to fight back. On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 9:32 AM Marcus Daniels wrote: > Russ writes: > > > "I say exactly what Roberts said: that identifying yet

Re: [FRIAM] The World Turned Upside Down (and what to do about it)

Russ writes: "I say exactly what Roberts said: that identifying yet more example of Trump's dishonest won't convince anyone on either side. So perhaps we should get beyond that." Yeah, time for lawyers, boycotts, and stuff like that. Marcus From: Friam

Re: [FRIAM] The World Turned Upside Down (and what to do about it)

Nick noted, "Nobody claimed that civility would solve *every *problem, did they?" I can't answer that question. If someone did, I disagree; I agree with those who would deny such a claim. On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 9:28 AM Douglass Carmichael wrote: > The word *truth*

Re: [FRIAM] The World Turned Upside Down (and what to do about it)

The word truth has an interesting history begins in feudalism (same as troth, as in “i pledge thee my troth”) as a relation between two people (as in the knighthood ceremony) moves on to the nature of tools, “this blade is true” moves on to the relationship of things to things, true material

Re: [FRIAM] The World Turned Upside Down (and what to do about it)

Continuing in my heckle-mode: Russ Rote, … striving for civility in the face of rampant aggression and evil makes no sense. … Civility does not solve every problem. Is there a gap between “makes no sense” and “does not solve every problem” Nobody claimed that civility would solve

Re: [FRIAM] The World Turned Upside Down (and what to do about it)

Now that I've actually read the article I wouldn't change what I wrote, but I'd like to add a brief comment. I agree with Roberts that "it’s been a long time since I felt the thinness of the veneer of civilization and our vulnerability to a sequence of events that might threaten not just the

Re: [FRIAM] The World Turned Upside Down (and what to do about it)

What do we do about it? Their's a problem right? Looks like a bunch of issues. How do we go about improving things? How do we do we start being helpful? be inpsiring and joy-full? How do we say wups! And better yet When are we going to say yea we've been jerks to each other? Why is housing and

Re: [FRIAM] The World Turned Upside Down (and what to do about it)

There was a good TED talk by two women who remained friends even though they differed significantly politically. It's important, I believe, to be able to stay friends

Re: [FRIAM] The World Turned Upside Down (and what to do about it)

Nick writes: "Allow me to heckle, if you will. Marcus, your post exemplifies a theory of human nature which is summarized by the motto, in caloris veritas. It is the idea that we speak the truth when we speak in the heat of the moment. Trump is a wonderful demonstration of the weakness of

Re: [FRIAM] The World Turned Upside Down (and what to do about it)

Owen - Thanks for the link to something I would otherwise not have found. I particularly appreciated his quote of Yeats, and cherry-picking from his other text, I was particularly taken by: /subtlety is not our strong suit as human beings. We like simple stories without too much

Re: [FRIAM] The World Turned Upside Down (and what to do about it)

Dear Marcus, Owen Allow me to heckle, if you will. Marcus, your post exemplifies a theory of human nature which is summarized by the motto, in caloris veritas. It is the idea that we speak the truth when we speak in the heat of the moment. Trump is a wonderful demonstration of the

Re: [FRIAM] The World Turned Upside Down (and what to do about it)

Owen, On several occasions over the years, I have been advised by `neural third parties' that the content of my writing can be edgy, but that in person I'm "Not that way" or "He's fine." Now, some people think that in-person interactions are more representative of a person's character.

[FRIAM] The World Turned Upside Down (and what to do about it)

Medium, my current outlet of choice, has an interesting "story" (Medium deals in Stories, not Tech nor Politics nor ...). It echos a lot of what we've been dealing with. ​​ https://medium.com/@russroberts/the-world-turned-upside-down-and-what-to-do- about-it-2dc27d1cf5f5 ​Somewhat dark, but