Re: [gentoo-dev] [RFC] C++ herd proposal

[Robin H. Johnson]

On Fri, Sep 16, 2005 at 06:20:57PM -0400, Mark Loeser wrote:
> dev-util/flawfinder (no-herd, aliz?)
> dev-util/rats   (no-herd, robbat2)
I'm a large user of these, but for rats there really isn't any
maintaining to do, upstream hasn't changed the code in 18+ months, and
it works fine still.

-- 
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Re: [gentoo-dev] New developers / polish invasion :)

[Elfyn McBratney]

On Thu, Sep 15, 2005 at 01:52:41AM +0200, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> Hi all.
> 
> We have two new developers from Poland.
> 
> Krzysiek Pawlik (nelchael) is going to help with the influx of
> desktop-misc bugs. I'll let Krzysiek introduce himself:

/me prods nelchael
;)

> "I want to help maintain my distribution of choice. I've been helping
> for some time, reporting bugs, posting patches and ebuilds. I'm also an
> active member of Gentoo forums, where I'm a moderator in Polish forum.
> Also I think that I could do ( (ab)use my skills ;) ) something useful
> for the community by actively developing on the distribution."

*cough* .. someone seems to have forgotten to list perl whore in their
list of Gentoo duties ;)
 
> Marcin Kryczek (mkay) is also from Poland. Marcin is going to help with
> net-p2p stuff. Besides an obvious interest in all things Gentoo, Marcin
> introduces himself as follows:
> 
> "I live in Katowice, Poland. I've just get diploma degree (faculty:
> Computer Science). I work in small company as system administrator for
> about half a year. Besides computers i like to listen to a music (all
> kinds of Rock), watching movies (preferably in cinema) and going to
> pubs with friends (i'm definitly outgoing kind of person)"

Welcome aboard, fellas ! :D

Best,
Elfyn

-- 
Elfyn McBratney
beu/irc.freenode.nethttp://dev.gentoo.org/~beu/
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Re: [gentoo-dev] New infra dev: markm

[Elfyn McBratney]

On Mon, Sep 12, 2005 at 11:35:30PM -0500, Mike Doty wrote:
> All-
> 
> Take a moment to say hi to our newest infra dev, Mark Mahle.  Mark will
> be helping out infra with web, security and nagios related things.
> 
> A little about mark, "I live in Silicon Valley, work insane hours and
> have a 1 year old son. Times are crazy! You can find out alot more about
> me by visiting my personal website at http://www.mahle.us.";

Insane hours and a one year old (nearly teething ?) son.  And now
Gentoo.  Yes.  You are crazy ! ;)

*ducks*

Welcome aboard, Mark ! :D

> Talk about website promotion!

Hah ;)

Best,
Elfyn

-- 
Elfyn McBratney
beu/irc.freenode.nethttp://dev.gentoo.org/~beu/
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Re: [gentoo-dev] first council meeting

[Kevin F. Quinn]

How about if the maintainer wants wider testing, i.e. wants to move
it out of package.mask and into ~arch but isn't confident it's ready
yet for arch, adding a string variable to ebuilds indicating why the
maintainer considers the package unstable, eg:

UNSTABLE="#100435, #100345, unconfirmed break with foo"

The maintainer would simply alter this line as bugs get confirmed or
resolved.  If a package wants to stay ~arch for longer than normal,
even though there are as yet no reports of problems, the maintainer
can just keep it set to something:

UNSTABLE="gaining maturity"

The arch team could consider an ebuild without an UNSTABLE line
as a candidate for stable, and it provides an easy way for maintainers
to communicate what issues are known with a package to the arch team
(and anyone else who is interested).

The 30-day could be calculated from the $Header: of ebuilds that have
no UNSTABLE, or where it's empty.

Kev.

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Re: [gentoo-dev] [RFC] C++ herd proposal

[Kevin F. Quinn]

On 17/9/2005 0:20:57, Mark Loeser ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:

C++ herd is a good idea, especially with that number of packages.

>  I would also like to see many of them, if not all, moved to the dev-cpp
> category:

Is this bit really necessary?


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Re: [gentoo-dev] first council meeting

[Brian Harring]

On Sat, Sep 17, 2005 at 11:28:03AM +0200, Kevin F. Quinn wrote:
> The 30-day could be calculated from the $Header: of ebuilds that have
> no UNSTABLE, or where it's empty.

Doesn't work for N arches keywording, or ebuild dev doing minor 
syntax touch ups.

~harring


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Re: [gentoo-dev] [RFC] C++ herd proposal

[Christian Parpart]

On Saturday 17 September 2005 01:20, Mike Frysinger wrote:
> On Friday 16 September 2005 06:20 pm, Mark Loeser wrote:
> > Since we currently have language herds for other languages such as Ada,
> > Perl, and Java, I don't think C++ should be any different.
>
> it is different, but i dont mind the idea of having a bunch of C++ experts
> looking over a bunch of packages which otherwise may be neglected

And that's the point I see in as well - having some central point for our C++ 
experts/freaks. Of course, a c++ herd would not just be like ADA/Java IMO.

Though, I vote FOR such a herd (and would like to join anyway)

> > dev-libs/STLport(no-herd, vapier?)
>
> vapier/toolchain
>
> > dev-libs/fampp2 (no-herd, vapier)
> > dev-libs/ferrisloki (no-herd, vapier)
> > dev-libs/libferrisstreams   (no-herd, vapier)
> > dev-db/stldb4
>
> generally i dont need help with these as the upstream author is a pretty
> cool guy and gets back to me :)
> -mike

but having some backup is always the safer way, in case some of us is AFK for 
some unobvious reasons and a security patch is to be injected.

Regards,
Christian Parpart


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Re: [gentoo-dev] [RFC] C++ herd proposal

[Christian Parpart]

On Saturday 17 September 2005 11:36, Kevin F. Quinn wrote:
> On 17/9/2005 0:20:57, Mark Loeser ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
>
> C++ herd is a good idea, especially with that number of packages.
>
> >  I would also like to see many of them, if not all, moved to the dev-cpp
> > category:
>
> Is this bit really necessary?

indeed, it at least helps curious c++ devs to browse through some yet unknown 
c++ libs and he maybe finds something useful.

Regards,
Christian Parpart.


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Re: [gentoo-dev] GNOME 2.12.0 Final - Testing

[Phil Richards]

On 2005-09-14, John N. Laliberte <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>  The GNOME herd is now ready for 2.12.0 to be tested.
>  The gnome-2.12.0.ebuild should hit the mirrors shortly. ( just committed)
>  Please see this document for information on how to test:
>  http://dev.gentoo.org/~allanonjl/gnome/2.12.0/testing.instructions.txt

I might be being stupid, but having suitably unmasked what was suggested
I get:

| ~ # emerge -puv --newuse gnome
| 
| These are the packages that I would merge, in order:
| 
| Calculating dependencies \
| !!! All ebuilds that could satisfy "sys-apps/pmount" have been masked.
| !!! One of the following masked packages is required to complete your request:
| - sys-apps/pmount-0.9.3-r3 (masked by: package.mask)
| # Doug Goldstein <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> (7 Sep 2005)
| # Remasking because the Gnome herd is too lazy to look
| # into bugs that are over 4 months old with regards to
| # hal and dbus. Patches provided and everything.
| # When I volunteered to fix it and handle any issues..
| # I received the stock "wait for foser" response.
|
| For more information, see MASKED PACKAGES section in the emerge man page or
| section 2.2 "Software Availability" in the Gentoo Handbook.
| !!!(dependency required by "gnome-base/gnome-vfs-2.12.0" [ebuild])

Normally, I would just unmask pmount, but the comment doesn't exactly
fill me with confidence as regards the stability of pmount (and whereas
I am happy for gnome to crash in a heap, I tend to be a little more
cautious around things that work at lower levels in the system)...

Should I just go ahead and unmask, or what if I want to test out gnome
2.12?

phil
-- 
change name before "@" to "phil" for email

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Re: [gentoo-dev] The tree is now utf-8 clean

[Fernando J. Pereda]

On Sat, Sep 17, 2005 at 02:42:09AM +0100, Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
| Something strange I noticed... Some people are using funny quotes and
| non breaking spaces in ebuilds. Some people are using weird characters
| as substitution delimiters for sed. Don't! It will break on many
| systems. I'm going to go and purge all of those, UTF-8 or not, whenever
| my brain recovers.

I hope ~ is not considered a weird character... if it is, tell me and
I'll fix all my ebuilds.

Cheers,
Ferdy

-- 
Fernando J. Pereda Garcimartín
Gentoo Developer (Alpha,net-mail)
20BB BDC3 761A 4781 E6ED  ED0B 0A48 5B0C 60BD 28D4


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Re: [gentoo-dev] GNOME 2.12.0 Final - Testing

[Aaron Walker]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

Martin Schlemmer wrote:
> 
> Hmm, I still have these as outdated:
> 
> ? dev-cpp/gconfmm/gconfmm-2.12.0.ebuild
> ? dev-cpp/gnome-vfsmm/gnome-vfsmm-2.12.0.ebuild
> ? dev-cpp/libglademm/libglademm-2.6.1.ebuild
> ? dev-cpp/libgnomecanvasmm/libgnomecanvasmm-2.12.0.ebuild
> ? dev-cpp/libgnomemm/libgnomemm-2.12.0.ebuild
> ? dev-cpp/libgnomeuimm/libgnomeuimm-2.12.0.ebuild

The above haven't been committed yet as I've been really busy lately (or I
should say... I've been spending too much time hacking on herdstat instead of
doing my job ;p).

Hopefully I can finish these up today and tomorrow.

Cheers
- --
"It's a dog-eat-dog world out there, and I'm wearing Milkbone underware."
- -- Norm, from _Cheers_

Aaron Walker <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
[ BSD | commonbox | cron | cvs-utils | mips | netmon | shell-tools | vim ]
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Re: [gentoo-dev] GNOME 2.12.0 Final - Testing

[Petteri Räty]

Phil Richards wrote:
> On 2005-09-14, John N. Laliberte <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> 
> Normally, I would just unmask pmount, but the comment doesn't exactly
> fill me with confidence as regards the stability of pmount (and whereas
> I am happy for gnome to crash in a heap, I tend to be a little more
> cautious around things that work at lower levels in the system)...
> 

Actually if you look at the comment you can see that it is dbus and hal
that seem to have the problems. I have used pmount without a problem for
quite a while now. There is one bug open about pmount on bugs.gentoo.org
but for me it looks like a user error.

>
> Should I just go ahead and unmask, or what if I want to test out gnome
> 2.12?

That I leave up to you.

> 
> phil

Regards,
Petteri Räty (Betelgeuse)



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Re: [gentoo-dev] [RFC] C++ herd proposal

[Kevin F. Quinn]

On 17/9/2005 13:33:30, Christian Parpart ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
> On Saturday 17 September 2005 11:36, Kevin F. Quinn wrote:
> > On 17/9/2005 0:20:57, Mark Loeser ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
> >
> > C++ herd is a good idea, especially with that number of packages.
> >
> > >  I would also like to see many of them, if not all, moved to the 
> > > dev-cpp category:
> >
> > Is this bit really necessary?
> 
> indeed, it at least helps curious c++ devs to browse through some yet 
> unknown c++ libs and he maybe finds something useful.

If the only gain is that one group finds one search criteria a little easier,
then I think that is far from sufficient reason to re-categorise.

What about people searching in the application domain (which to be honest
I think is much more likely)?  Under your approach they have to rummage
around in each dev- category, hoping that it'll be obvious from the
package name that it's suitable for their application domain.

What happens when the media, games or net herds come along, and want to
pull stuff into a media-libs, dev-games, net-libs?  We end up in a
tug-of-war between competing interests.

Think also of all the work involved in re-categorising stuff; how everyone
with dependencies on these packages in their overlay will have to rework
stuff in their overlay, all because of one group's nice-to-have.  It's
particularly acute for libraries.

I think we should discourage the idea that filesystem categories and herds
are related at all, and think of filesystem categories simply as convenient
buckets preventing lists of packages getting long.  Resist the urge to
re-categorise as much as possible, because in the end it's pointless.

Instead, add to metadata, and use that to find stuff.  In metadata.xml,
we could have as many search criteria as we like; for example source
language(s), library|application, application domain (sound, games, video)
which can happily cope with many->many relationships.

-- 
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Re: [gentoo-dev] first council meeting

[Kevin F. Quinn]

On 17/9/2005 11:34:56, Brian Harring ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
> On Sat, Sep 17, 2005 at 11:28:03AM +0200, Kevin F. Quinn wrote:
> > The 30-day could be calculated from the $Header: of ebuilds that have
> > no UNSTABLE, or where it's empty.
> 
> Doesn't work for N arches keywording, or ebuild dev doing minor 
> syntax touch ups.

Good point.  The minor touch-up issue could be resolved by setting
the string to the date the last issue was cleared instead of deleting
it:

UNSTABLE="2005/10/04"

but to handle N arches needs a different approach (the 'maint' keyword
idea also falls down here).


My favourite idea so far is mike's '?arch' on the understanding that
we have:

package.mask - 'alpha'
  Not suitable for mainstream testing

?arch - 'beta'
  Works on maintainers systems, worth testing
  Maintainer may not have tried it on arch.

~arch - 'release candidate'
  Maintainer & arch team happy that it's a good candidate for arch
  30-day maturity phase, arch testing in progress

arch - 'released'
  Arch team happy it's stable


In particular it's worth noting that marking ?arch is not restricted
the way marking ~arch is.  Over time I expect the x86 arch team to
impose more rigour on the use of ~x86, so that it behaves similarly
to the other arches.

In general, it would make sense for people to have arch or ~arch in
make.conf, and use package.keywords to grab stuff from ?arch in a
controlled fashion.

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Re: [gentoo-dev] [RFC] C++ herd proposal

[Christian Parpart]

On Saturday 17 September 2005 14:01, Kevin F. Quinn wrote:
> On 17/9/2005 13:33:30, Christian Parpart ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
> > On Saturday 17 September 2005 11:36, Kevin F. Quinn wrote:
> > > On 17/9/2005 0:20:57, Mark Loeser ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
> > >
> > > C++ herd is a good idea, especially with that number of packages.
> > >
> > > >  I would also like to see many of them, if not all, moved to the
> > > > dev-cpp category:
> > >
> > > Is this bit really necessary?
> >
> > indeed, it at least helps curious c++ devs to browse through some yet
> > unknown c++ libs and he maybe finds something useful.
>
> If the only gain is that one group finds one search criteria a little
> easier, then I think that is far from sufficient reason to re-categorise.

errr... I didn't meant "of course" == "indeed", I meant it a way of "that 
might make sense". sorry for the misunderstandings ;)

Regards,
Christian.


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[gentoo-dev] Re: The tree is now utf-8 clean

[Dan Meltzer]

Assuming, as I do... that ~arch is utf-8 clean, it must not be that
wierd a character, and therefore, probably acceptable for sed also.

On 9/17/05, Fernando J. Pereda <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On Sat, Sep 17, 2005 at 02:42:09AM +0100, Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
> | Something strange I noticed... Some people are using funny quotes and
> | non breaking spaces in ebuilds. Some people are using weird characters
> | as substitution delimiters for sed. Don't! It will break on many
> | systems. I'm going to go and purge all of those, UTF-8 or not, whenever
> | my brain recovers.
> 
> I hope ~ is not considered a weird character... if it is, tell me and
> I'll fix all my ebuilds.
> 
> Cheers,
> Ferdy
> 
> -- 
> Fernando J. Pereda Garcimartín
> Gentoo Developer (Alpha,net-mail)
> 20BB BDC3 761A 4781 E6ED  ED0B 0A48 5B0C 60BD 28D4
> 
>

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Re: [gentoo-dev] [RFC] Portability eclass

[Diego 'Flameeyes' Pettenò]

On Friday 16 September 2005 17:42, Diego 'Flameeyes' Pettenò wrote:
> If we'll find other functions needed for portability's sake, they'll
> probably going to be there, too.
Dropped the symcmd function, cleaned up the treecopy function (Martin, take a 
look at cp --parent, what treecopy does is just the same, if someone calls it 
with ${S}, it WILL create ${S} inside ${D}, but that's what they are asking 
for using it), added an eseq option, that would be used on enewuser and 
elsewhere were seq is used.

This does not use ${USERLAND} to find out which command to use, as Darwin can 
have seq installed (and actually someone can have userland-gnu merged on *BSD 
and path changed), so it just look if it's able to find seq, otherwise use 
jot.

If this is ok, I'll commit this tonight changing enewuser according to use it.

-- 
Diego "Flameeyes" Pettenò
Gentoo Developer - http://dev.gentoo.org/~flameeyes/
(Gentoo/FreeBSD, Video, Gentoo/AMD64, Sound, PAM)


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Re: [gentoo-dev] The tree is now utf-8 clean

[Ciaran McCreesh]

On Sat, 17 Sep 2005 12:56:37 +0200 "Fernando J. Pereda"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
| On Sat, Sep 17, 2005 at 02:42:09AM +0100, Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
| | Something strange I noticed... Some people are using funny quotes
| | and non breaking spaces in ebuilds. Some people are using weird
| | characters as substitution delimiters for sed. Don't! It will break
| | on many systems. I'm going to go and purge all of those, UTF-8 or
| | not, whenever my brain recovers.
| 
| I hope ~ is not considered a weird character... if it is, tell me and
| I'll fix all my ebuilds.

No, ~ is fine. Anything with a value below 127 (don't use 127, it's
weird) that sed accepts is ok. There are some ebuilds that use that
curly paragraph marker character (§) and weird curly quotes. Those're
the ones that cause problems.

-- 
Ciaran McCreesh : Gentoo Developer (Vim, Shell tools, Fluxbox, Cron)
Mail: ciaranm at gentoo.org
Web : http://dev.gentoo.org/~ciaranm



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Re: [gentoo-dev] The tree is now utf-8 clean

[Ciaran McCreesh]

On Sat, 17 Sep 2005 18:15:31 +0100 Ciaran McCreesh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
| No, ~ is fine. Anything with a value below 127 (don't use 127, it's
| weird) that sed accepts is ok. There are some ebuilds that use that
| curly paragraph marker character (§) and weird curly quotes. Those're
| the ones that cause problems.

Uhm, where by 127 I of course mean 128...

-- 
Ciaran McCreesh : Gentoo Developer (Vim, Shell tools, Fluxbox, Cron)
Mail: ciaranm at gentoo.org
Web : http://dev.gentoo.org/~ciaranm



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Re: [gentoo-dev] [RFC] C++ herd proposal

[Mark Loeser]

Kevin F. Quinn wrote:
>> I would also like to see many of them, if not all, moved to the dev-cpp
>>category:
> 
> 
> Is this bit really necessary?

The reason for me adding that bit is the metadata from dev-cpp:

The dev-cpp category contains libraries and utilities relevant to the
c++ programming language.

Now to me, that means I can find *all* relevant C++ stuff here.  If we
don't want that to be the case, maybe we should say "miscellaneous", but
why should something be in dev-libs, as compared with dev-cpp?
net-libs, I could understand, and dev-games, as those could be argued to
have a direct relation.  This is really just a matter of categorization,
and isn't as big of a concern for me as it is trying to put all of these
no-herd packages under a herd.

Mark


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Re: [gentoo-dev] GNOME 2.12.0 Final - Testing

[Stefan Jones]

Phil Richards wrote:


| ~ # emerge -puv --newuse gnome

| 
| These are the packages that I would merge, in order:
| 
| Calculating dependencies \

| !!! All ebuilds that could satisfy "sys-apps/pmount" have been masked.
| !!! One of the following masked packages is required to complete your request:
| - sys-apps/pmount-0.9.3-r3 (masked by: package.mask)
| # Doug Goldstein <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> (7 Sep 2005)
| # Remasking because the Gnome herd is too lazy to look
| # into bugs that are over 4 months old with regards to
| # hal and dbus. Patches provided and everything.
| # When I volunteered to fix it and handle any issues..
| # I received the stock "wait for foser" response.
 




Normally, I would just unmask pmount, but the comment doesn't exactly
fill me with confidence as regards the stability of pmount (and whereas
I am happy for gnome to crash in a heap, I tend to be a little more
cautious around things that work at lower levels in the system)...

Should I just go ahead and unmask, or what if I want to test out gnome
2.12?
 



Unmask pmount, it is needed now to get useful hal support where you can 
mount USB drives from nautilus when they are hot plugged. This is 
because with the new hal they have removed the fstab updater.


( or you could just put -hal in your USE flags, but better just 
unmasking it and finding the bugs - I have not found any )


Stefan
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Re: [gentoo-dev] The tree is now utf-8 clean

[Mike Frysinger]

On Saturday 17 September 2005 01:15 pm, Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
> On Sat, 17 Sep 2005 12:56:37 +0200 "Fernando J. Pereda"
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> | On Sat, Sep 17, 2005 at 02:42:09AM +0100, Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
> | | Something strange I noticed... Some people are using funny quotes
> | | and non breaking spaces in ebuilds. Some people are using weird
> | | characters as substitution delimiters for sed. Don't! It will break
> | | on many systems. I'm going to go and purge all of those, UTF-8 or
> | | not, whenever my brain recovers.
> |
> | I hope ~ is not considered a weird character... if it is, tell me and
> | I'll fix all my ebuilds.
>
> No, ~ is fine. Anything with a value below 127 (don't use 127, it's
> weird) that sed accepts is ok.

in other words, ASCII characters are OK.  if in doubt, just run `man ascii` 
and see if your character is in the table
-mike
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Re: [gentoo-dev] [RFC] C++ herd proposal

[Mike Frysinger]

On Saturday 17 September 2005 02:22 pm, Mark Loeser wrote:
> Kevin F. Quinn wrote:
> >> I would also like to see many of them, if not all, moved to the dev-cpp
> >>category:
> >
> > Is this bit really necessary?
>
> The reason for me adding that bit is the metadata from dev-cpp:
>
> The dev-cpp category contains libraries and utilities relevant to the
> c++ programming language.
>
> Now to me, that means I can find *all* relevant C++ stuff here.  If we
> don't want that to be the case, maybe we should say "miscellaneous", but
> why should something be in dev-libs, as compared with dev-cpp?
> net-libs, I could understand, and dev-games, as those could be argued to
> have a direct relation.

for generic C++ packages (STLport/boost for example), i can see them being in 
the dev-cpp category ... but for packages which have specific uses already 
and arent in 'generic' categories, i dont think they should be moved
-mike
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Re: [gentoo-dev] first council meeting

[Mike Frysinger]

On Saturday 17 September 2005 05:28 am, Kevin F. Quinn wrote:
> How about if the maintainer wants wider testing, i.e. wants to move
> it out of package.mask and into ~arch but isn't confident it's ready
> yet for arch, adding a string variable to ebuilds indicating why the
> maintainer considers the package unstable, eg:

i really want to get away from the idea of 'package.mask is for testing 
packages' ... its current dual role as both masking 'testing' packages and 
'broken' packages is wrong imo

we dont want to try reeducating our users to not be afraid of package.mask 
because a lot of things in there they *should* be afraid of
-mike
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Re: [gentoo-dev] [RFC] C++ herd proposal

[Mark Loeser]

Mike Frysinger wrote:
> On Saturday 17 September 2005 02:22 pm, Mark Loeser wrote:
>>The reason for me adding that bit is the metadata from dev-cpp:
>>
>>The dev-cpp category contains libraries and utilities relevant to the
>>c++ programming language.
>>
>>Now to me, that means I can find *all* relevant C++ stuff here.  If we
>>don't want that to be the case, maybe we should say "miscellaneous", but
>>why should something be in dev-libs, as compared with dev-cpp?
>>net-libs, I could understand, and dev-games, as those could be argued to
>>have a direct relation.
> 
> 
> for generic C++ packages (STLport/boost for example), i can see them being in 
> the dev-cpp category ... but for packages which have specific uses already 
> and arent in 'generic' categories, i dont think they should be moved

I agree with this, but I think dev-libs and dev-util are generic
categories, and moving these packages from there would help users in
finding what they need.  I think this is what you are saying atleast :)

Mark


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Re: [gentoo-dev] first council meeting

[Alec Warner]

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Mike Frysinger wrote:
> On Saturday 17 September 2005 05:28 am, Kevin F. Quinn wrote:
> 
>>How about if the maintainer wants wider testing, i.e. wants to move
>>it out of package.mask and into ~arch but isn't confident it's ready
>>yet for arch, adding a string variable to ebuilds indicating why the
>>maintainer considers the package unstable, eg:
> 
> 
> i really want to get away from the idea of 'package.mask is for testing 
> packages' ... its current dual role as both masking 'testing' packages and 
> 'broken' packages is wrong imo
> 
> we dont want to try reeducating our users to not be afraid of package.mask 
> because a lot of things in there they *should* be afraid of
> -mike

Why not merely add an overlay to the main tree and put the testing
packages in the overlay.  Then instruct users to add the overlay to
their portage settings.  Testing overlay for testing, p.mask for broken
packages.

   /usr/portage/overlay/cat/pkg/bla.ebuild
or
   /usr/portage/testing/cat/pkg/bla.ebuild
and so on...

- -Alec Warner
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Re: [gentoo-dev] first council meeting

[Mike Frysinger]

On Saturday 17 September 2005 05:59 pm, Alec Warner wrote:
> Mike Frysinger wrote:
> > On Saturday 17 September 2005 05:28 am, Kevin F. Quinn wrote:
> >>How about if the maintainer wants wider testing, i.e. wants to move
> >>it out of package.mask and into ~arch but isn't confident it's ready
> >>yet for arch, adding a string variable to ebuilds indicating why the
> >>maintainer considers the package unstable, eg:
> >
> > i really want to get away from the idea of 'package.mask is for testing
> > packages' ... its current dual role as both masking 'testing' packages
> > and 'broken' packages is wrong imo
> >
> > we dont want to try reeducating our users to not be afraid of
> > package.mask because a lot of things in there they *should* be afraid of
> > -mike
>
> Why not merely add an overlay to the main tree and put the testing
> packages in the overlay.  Then instruct users to add the overlay to
> their portage settings.  Testing overlay for testing, p.mask for broken
> packages.

that does sound like a pretty quick and clean solution ... the only problem i 
would have with it is that when we move from testing to normal portage tree, 
we lose cvs history ... and we'd have to merge ChangeLogs ...
-mike
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[gentoo-dev] Remove app-emulation/plex86

[Marcelo Góes]

Hello there,

plex86 has many issues and no simple solution to all of them. Considering the
amount of very old kernel code it has, including the way it deals with devfs,
for example, it does not look like it will be easy to fix.

plex86 has three outstanding bugs at the time of this writing: bug 54526 
, bug
29159  and bug 17388 
. I have the feeling that if anybody 
was going to get them
fixed, they would have done so by now.

qemu should fill plex86's role in the future.

I'll probably remove plex86 from the tree very shortly. If anybody feels
different, you're welcome to reopen plex86 bugs and fix them :-)

Cheers,
Marcelo

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Re: [gentoo-dev] Remove app-emulation/plex86

[Mike Frysinger]

On Saturday 17 September 2005 07:14 pm, Marcelo Góes wrote:
> I'll probably remove plex86 from the tree very shortly. If anybody feels
> different, you're welcome to reopen plex86 bugs and fix them :-)

usually we mask for a while before punting ... easier to unmask than to re-add
-mike

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Re: [gentoo-dev] Remove app-emulation/plex86

[Marcelo Góes]

Mike Frysinger wrote:


usually we mask for a while before punting ... easier to unmask than to re-add
-mike
 

It's been masked for a week, but I doubt anyone has been able to compile 
it for much longer than that :-).

Anyway, when I say "remove shortly" I am thinking a couple of weeks.

Cheers,
Marcelo
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[gentoo-dev] Re: GLEP 41: Making Arch Testers official Gentoo Staff

[R Hill]

Homer Parker wrote:

On Mon, 2005-09-12 at 18:47 -0400, Stephen P. Becker wrote:

Let me clarify here.  I'm not concerned about ATs having more
privileges 
at all.  I just want to know why if we're making them full developers 
for all intents and purposes, we don't go the extra step and get them 
commit access after a probationary period?  It seems like this is 
supposed to be the end goal anyway.  Basically, I feel like this GLEP 
goes outside the bounds of what I think of when somebody mentions the 
arch testers.  Maybe it's just me though.


Some people don't want to be a dev. Some people can't commit the
resources to maintain dev status. There's a lot more responsibility in
being a dev then an AT, and some people don't want that. So, becoming an
AT is a way they can contribute without having to worry about all the
extra responsibilities involved with being a dev.


I just wanted to say that this is exactly the situation i'm in.  I've 
applied to the x86 arch tester team because i enjoy working on Gentoo, 
but don't have a lot of time to do it in.  Work carts me about 100 miles 
from an internet connection every Monday and drops me back off in 
civilization every Friday.  Knock off another half-day spent trying to 
catch up on humongoloid GLEP threads and I don't have a bunch of free 
time left. ;]  Arch testing is one way I can contribute without the 
overhead, and I don't fancy becoming a developer any time soon.


--de.

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Re: [gentoo-dev] first council meeting

[Wernfried Haas]

On Sat, Sep 17, 2005 at 04:17:10PM -0400, Mike Frysinger wrote:
> i really want to get away from the idea of 'package.mask is for testing 
> packages' ... its current dual role as both masking 'testing' packages and 
> 'broken' packages is wrong imo
> 
> we dont want to try reeducating our users to not be afraid of package.mask 
> because a lot of things in there they *should* be afraid of

Coming from the user side (forums) i fully agree. Common sense among
the users always used to be:
arch: stable
~arch: testing
p.mask: broken

This is also covered in our current documentation, see
http://www.gentoo.org/doc/en/handbook/hb-portage-branches.xml
--snip--
The Testing Branch

If you want to use more recent software, you can consider using the
testing branch instead. To have Portage use the testing branch, add a
~ in front of your architecture.

The testing branch is exactly what it says - Testing. If a package is
in testing, it means that the developers feel that it is functional
but has not been thoroughly tested. You could very well be the first
to discover a bug in the package in which case you could file a
bugreport to let the developers know about it.

Beware though, you might notice stability issues, imperfect package
handling (for instance wrong/missing dependencies), too frequent
updates (resulting in lots of building) or broken packages. If you do
not know how Gentoo works and how to solve problems, we recommend that
you stick with the stable and tested branch. 
--snip--

Doesn't exactly sound like packages in ~arch should be ready to enter
arch after 30 days (and or the other QA requirements). If someone
wants to change that, that would be a major change to Gentoo,
especially as it affects _every_ user. So it would at least require a
GLEP to do that.
I'd rather like to finally see proper QA applied and those who don't
beaten with a stick than making fundamental changes to existing common
sense just because it is written down somewhere _that_ way.

cheers,
Wernfried

-- 
Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org
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IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org
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Re: [gentoo-dev] first council meeting

[Wernfried Haas]

Oh, and for the sake of completeness, also from
http://www.gentoo.org/doc/en/handbook/hb-portage-branches.xml
--snip--
1.c. Using Masked Packages

The package.unmask file

The Gentoo developers do not support the use of these files. Please
exercise due caution when doing so. Support requests related to
package.unmask and/or package.mask will not be answered. You have been
warned.

When a package has been masked by the Gentoo developers and you still
want to use it despite the reason mentioned in the package.mask file
(situated in /usr/portage/profiles by default), add the exact same
line in /etc/portage/package.unmask. 
--snip--

-- 
Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org
Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org
IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org
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