RE: [hlcoders] Counter-Strike : Condition Zero
Me again, Just to steer this back towards my original question, is there a time interval when the CZ tech will be released for mod makers? (ie 3 months after the game goes retail?) Thanks! Georges -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Chris Blane Sent: Tuesday, March 27, 2001 11:09 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [hlcoders] Counter-Strike : Condition Zero Coming from a design point of view you can't rely on models very much for world geometry since they are lighted universally when placed in the world. Strangely enough I've noticed that while fixed light that are compiled in RAD universally light models the temporary lights casued by explosions and gunshot will light the models correctly. It's a real shame that Valve or Gearbox never made proper use of that with the flashlight or the normal lights. - Original Message - From: Ken Birdwell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2002 5:09 AM Subject: RE: [hlcoders] Counter-Strike : Condition Zero > If you have models that don't animate - such as lamps, trash cans, etc. - > then even making them "cyclers" is expensive. Just encoding the > pev->animtime and pev->frame can eat up tons of network (even single player) > and CPU bandwidth when you have a lot of them visible. To get that overhead > back, make a version of "cycler" that doesn't ever call StudioFrameAdvance() > and use it for all your models that don't move. > > Each bone used by a model also eats performance. Depending on the specifics > of your CPU and graphics hardware, each bone can cost the performance > equivalent of anywhere from 5 to 30 polygons. If you're building simple > models, be sure to create them with as few bones as possible. > > Each time a model changes texture it costs performance. If you're fond of > using lots of small textures on models then you may be wasting graphics > performance on switching textures instead of drawing polygons. > > -Original Message- > From: ryan [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > Sent: Monday, March 25, 2002 6:35 PM > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: [hlcoders] Counter-Strike : Condition Zero > > > Well, my problem is sorta on both world poly and model poly counts. Because > my mod requires large map areas, though not so detailed. The amount of > models that will be on screen causes me to have a limited amount of polys > per model. > > In other words, there will be too much going on to have nice detailed > models. =\ > ___ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders > > ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders
Re: [hlcoders] Counter-Strike : Condition Zero
Coming from a design point of view you can't rely on models very much for world geometry since they are lighted universally when placed in the world. Strangely enough I've noticed that while fixed light that are compiled in RAD universally light models the temporary lights casued by explosions and gunshot will light the models correctly. It's a real shame that Valve or Gearbox never made proper use of that with the flashlight or the normal lights. - Original Message - From: Ken Birdwell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2002 5:09 AM Subject: RE: [hlcoders] Counter-Strike : Condition Zero > If you have models that don't animate - such as lamps, trash cans, etc. - > then even making them "cyclers" is expensive. Just encoding the > pev->animtime and pev->frame can eat up tons of network (even single player) > and CPU bandwidth when you have a lot of them visible. To get that overhead > back, make a version of "cycler" that doesn't ever call StudioFrameAdvance() > and use it for all your models that don't move. > > Each bone used by a model also eats performance. Depending on the specifics > of your CPU and graphics hardware, each bone can cost the performance > equivalent of anywhere from 5 to 30 polygons. If you're building simple > models, be sure to create them with as few bones as possible. > > Each time a model changes texture it costs performance. If you're fond of > using lots of small textures on models then you may be wasting graphics > performance on switching textures instead of drawing polygons. > > -Original Message- > From: ryan [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > Sent: Monday, March 25, 2002 6:35 PM > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: [hlcoders] Counter-Strike : Condition Zero > > > Well, my problem is sorta on both world poly and model poly counts. Because > my mod requires large map areas, though not so detailed. The amount of > models that will be on screen causes me to have a limited amount of polys > per model. > > In other words, there will be too much going on to have nice detailed > models. =\ > ___ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders > > ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders
RE: [hlcoders] Counter-Strike : Condition Zero
If you have models that don't animate - such as lamps, trash cans, etc. - then even making them "cyclers" is expensive. Just encoding the pev->animtime and pev->frame can eat up tons of network (even single player) and CPU bandwidth when you have a lot of them visible. To get that overhead back, make a version of "cycler" that doesn't ever call StudioFrameAdvance() and use it for all your models that don't move. Each bone used by a model also eats performance. Depending on the specifics of your CPU and graphics hardware, each bone can cost the performance equivalent of anywhere from 5 to 30 polygons. If you're building simple models, be sure to create them with as few bones as possible. Each time a model changes texture it costs performance. If you're fond of using lots of small textures on models then you may be wasting graphics performance on switching textures instead of drawing polygons. -Original Message- From: ryan [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Monday, March 25, 2002 6:35 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [hlcoders] Counter-Strike : Condition Zero Well, my problem is sorta on both world poly and model poly counts. Because my mod requires large map areas, though not so detailed. The amount of models that will be on screen causes me to have a limited amount of polys per model. In other words, there will be too much going on to have nice detailed models. =\ ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders
Re: [hlcoders] Counter-Strike : Condition Zero
Are you referring to the poly count in your models or in your levels? If your having problems hitting limits when compiling your models, usually you can just change the model compiler and the engine will accept the new models just fine. I think the most common limit people hit, is their model file size goes over 2 megs (I think thats the limit). several people on this list have, been able to raise this succesfully though, so im sure if you ask you will be able to find out. Condition Zero doesnt modify the half-life engine to allow for any higher poly counts in the world geometry, however, it just uses lots of models, which render faster than world geometry, to supplement the world geometry. - Original Message - From: "ryan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Monday, March 25, 2002 1:33 PM Subject: [hlcoders] Counter-Strike : Condition Zero Ya, i'm interested in when it might be available to us. Because my mod really requires higher poly count, cause right now it looks like crap but runs good. So if i could mak it look a bit better and still run good that would be great :D - Original Message - From: "Georges Giroux" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Monday, March 25, 2002 12:42 PM Subject: Re: [hlcoders] Counter-Strike : Condition Zero Hey there, Is there a rough date when the CZ tech will be available to mods? That way mods can take into account what kind of polycounts will be allowed for the models.. Georges - Original Message - From: "Adrian Finol" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Monday, March 25, 2002 2:35 AM Subject: RE: [hlcoders] Counter-Strike : Condition Zero Most of the tech will indeed be avaliable for people to use since most changes where done in the engine. Stuff like the use of masked textures on models and stuff like that. I've been working on moving the whole particle system into a separate .dll so that can be distributed and mod authors can just plug that in and use it. We'll see how it goes. -Original Message----- From: Chris Blane To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 3/25/2001 5:28 PM Subject: Re: [hlcoders] Counter-Strike : Condition Zero Hehhe maybe I should try to talk nicely to Marc Schröder and see what I can get out of him. :) I doubt I'll get anywhere though but he's the only guy on the team I've spoken with alot. LOL! - Original Message - From: Philip (Fiber) <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Sunday, March 24, 2002 7:40 AM Subject: RE: [hlcoders] Counter-Strike : Condition Zero > From CSNation - > > "The current models are 750 polygons each. The ones in Condition Zero > are 1,250 polygons each, meaning there's a 66% increase in the amount of > polygons per model. All the models will have full lip-synching with the > sounds and some facial animation to go with it. The skins on those > models don't disappoint, either. > > The new model system supports alpha blending. Along with RGB values in > colors, systems that allow for 32-bit rendering have 8-bits set aside > for an alpha channel, which controls attributes like transparency or > opacity. A good use would be glass or eye-holes on a mask. This will be > used in the "window" of the shield, which will actually hold glass. > Another place it will be used, for sure, is the molotov cocktail. You'll > be able to see inside the bottle and can see the liquid move around. > > Condition Zero includes a level of detail system so the the high detail > of models will be scaled down to the benefit of your framerate, while > those with fast computers can experience full detail. > > Since you can change the face, skin tone, and other attributes of a > model, there are over 160 different combinations." > > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of Georges > Giroux > Sent: Sunday, March 24, 2002 6:09 PM > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: [hlcoders] Counter-Strike : Condition Zero > > Hey guys, > > Short and sweet, I was just wondering, will the graphical > improvements of Condition Zero be eventually available to Half-Life > mod makers? > > Georges > ___ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > please visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders > > > ___ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders > > ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valveso
Re: [hlcoders] Counter-Strike : Condition Zero
Hey there, Is there a rough date when the CZ tech will be available to mods? That way mods can take into account what kind of polycounts will be allowed for the models.. Georges - Original Message - From: "Adrian Finol" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Monday, March 25, 2002 2:35 AM Subject: RE: [hlcoders] Counter-Strike : Condition Zero Most of the tech will indeed be avaliable for people to use since most changes where done in the engine. Stuff like the use of masked textures on models and stuff like that. I've been working on moving the whole particle system into a separate .dll so that can be distributed and mod authors can just plug that in and use it. We'll see how it goes. -Original Message- From: Chris Blane To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 3/25/2001 5:28 PM Subject: Re: [hlcoders] Counter-Strike : Condition Zero Hehhe maybe I should try to talk nicely to Marc Schröder and see what I can get out of him. :) I doubt I'll get anywhere though but he's the only guy on the team I've spoken with alot. LOL! - Original Message - From: Philip (Fiber) <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Sunday, March 24, 2002 7:40 AM Subject: RE: [hlcoders] Counter-Strike : Condition Zero > From CSNation - > > "The current models are 750 polygons each. The ones in Condition Zero > are 1,250 polygons each, meaning there's a 66% increase in the amount of > polygons per model. All the models will have full lip-synching with the > sounds and some facial animation to go with it. The skins on those > models don't disappoint, either. > > The new model system supports alpha blending. Along with RGB values in > colors, systems that allow for 32-bit rendering have 8-bits set aside > for an alpha channel, which controls attributes like transparency or > opacity. A good use would be glass or eye-holes on a mask. This will be > used in the "window" of the shield, which will actually hold glass. > Another place it will be used, for sure, is the molotov cocktail. You'll > be able to see inside the bottle and can see the liquid move around. > > Condition Zero includes a level of detail system so the the high detail > of models will be scaled down to the benefit of your framerate, while > those with fast computers can experience full detail. > > Since you can change the face, skin tone, and other attributes of a > model, there are over 160 different combinations." > > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of Georges > Giroux > Sent: Sunday, March 24, 2002 6:09 PM > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: [hlcoders] Counter-Strike : Condition Zero > > Hey guys, > > Short and sweet, I was just wondering, will the graphical > improvements of Condition Zero be eventually available to Half-Life > mod makers? > > Georges > ___ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > please visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders > > > ___ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders > > ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders
RE: [hlcoders] Counter-Strike : Condition Zero
Most of the tech will indeed be avaliable for people to use since most changes where done in the engine. Stuff like the use of masked textures on models and stuff like that. I've been working on moving the whole particle system into a separate .dll so that can be distributed and mod authors can just plug that in and use it. We'll see how it goes. -Original Message- From: Chris Blane To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 3/25/2001 5:28 PM Subject: Re: [hlcoders] Counter-Strike : Condition Zero Hehhe maybe I should try to talk nicely to Marc Schröder and see what I can get out of him. :) I doubt I'll get anywhere though but he's the only guy on the team I've spoken with alot. LOL! - Original Message - From: Philip (Fiber) <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Sunday, March 24, 2002 7:40 AM Subject: RE: [hlcoders] Counter-Strike : Condition Zero > From CSNation - > > "The current models are 750 polygons each. The ones in Condition Zero > are 1,250 polygons each, meaning there's a 66% increase in the amount of > polygons per model. All the models will have full lip-synching with the > sounds and some facial animation to go with it. The skins on those > models don't disappoint, either. > > The new model system supports alpha blending. Along with RGB values in > colors, systems that allow for 32-bit rendering have 8-bits set aside > for an alpha channel, which controls attributes like transparency or > opacity. A good use would be glass or eye-holes on a mask. This will be > used in the "window" of the shield, which will actually hold glass. > Another place it will be used, for sure, is the molotov cocktail. You'll > be able to see inside the bottle and can see the liquid move around. > > Condition Zero includes a level of detail system so the the high detail > of models will be scaled down to the benefit of your framerate, while > those with fast computers can experience full detail. > > Since you can change the face, skin tone, and other attributes of a > model, there are over 160 different combinations." > > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of Georges > Giroux > Sent: Sunday, March 24, 2002 6:09 PM > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: [hlcoders] Counter-Strike : Condition Zero > > Hey guys, > > Short and sweet, I was just wondering, will the graphical > improvements of Condition Zero be eventually available to Half-Life > mod makers? > > Georges > ___ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > please visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders > > > ___ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders > > ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders
Re: [hlcoders] Counter-Strike : Condition Zero
Hehhe maybe I should try to talk nicely to Marc Schröder and see what I can get out of him. :) I doubt I'll get anywhere though but he's the only guy on the team I've spoken with alot. LOL! - Original Message - From: Philip (Fiber) <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Sunday, March 24, 2002 7:40 AM Subject: RE: [hlcoders] Counter-Strike : Condition Zero > From CSNation - > > "The current models are 750 polygons each. The ones in Condition Zero > are 1,250 polygons each, meaning there's a 66% increase in the amount of > polygons per model. All the models will have full lip-synching with the > sounds and some facial animation to go with it. The skins on those > models don't disappoint, either. > > The new model system supports alpha blending. Along with RGB values in > colors, systems that allow for 32-bit rendering have 8-bits set aside > for an alpha channel, which controls attributes like transparency or > opacity. A good use would be glass or eye-holes on a mask. This will be > used in the "window" of the shield, which will actually hold glass. > Another place it will be used, for sure, is the molotov cocktail. You'll > be able to see inside the bottle and can see the liquid move around. > > Condition Zero includes a level of detail system so the the high detail > of models will be scaled down to the benefit of your framerate, while > those with fast computers can experience full detail. > > Since you can change the face, skin tone, and other attributes of a > model, there are over 160 different combinations." > > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of Georges > Giroux > Sent: Sunday, March 24, 2002 6:09 PM > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: [hlcoders] Counter-Strike : Condition Zero > > Hey guys, > > Short and sweet, I was just wondering, will the graphical > improvements of Condition Zero be eventually available to Half-Life > mod makers? > > Georges > ___ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > please visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders > > > ___ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders > > ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders
Re: [hlcoders] Counter-Strike : Condition Zero
-- [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] Okay you just made me want to play CSCZ. I have sinned and must be stoned... - Original Message - From: Philip (Fiber) Sent: Sunday, March 24, 2002 1:41 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [hlcoders] Counter-Strike : Condition Zero >From CSNation - "The current models are 750 polygons each. The ones in Condition Zero are 1,250 polygons each, meaning there's a 66% increase in the amount of polygons per model. All the models will have full lip-synching with the sounds and some facial animation to go with it. The skins on those models don't disappoint, either. The new model system supports alpha blending. Along with RGB values in colors, systems that allow for 32-bit rendering have 8-bits set aside for an alpha channel, which controls attributes like transparency or opacity. A good use would be glass or eye-holes on a mask. This will be used in the "window" of the shield, which will actually hold glass. Another place it will be used, for sure, is the molotov cocktail. You'll be able to see inside the bottle and can see the liquid move around. Condition Zero includes a level of detail system so the the high detail of models will be scaled down to the benefit of your framerate, while those with fast computers can experience full detail. Since you can change the face, skin tone, and other attributes of a model, there are over 160 different combinations." -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of Georges Giroux Sent: Sunday, March 24, 2002 6:09 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [hlcoders] Counter-Strike : Condition Zero Hey guys, Short and sweet, I was just wondering, will the graphical improvements of Condition Zero be eventually available to Half-Life mod makers? Georges ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcodersGet more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.com ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders
RE: [hlcoders] Counter-Strike : Condition Zero
>From CSNation - "The current models are 750 polygons each. The ones in Condition Zero are 1,250 polygons each, meaning there's a 66% increase in the amount of polygons per model. All the models will have full lip-synching with the sounds and some facial animation to go with it. The skins on those models don't disappoint, either. The new model system supports alpha blending. Along with RGB values in colors, systems that allow for 32-bit rendering have 8-bits set aside for an alpha channel, which controls attributes like transparency or opacity. A good use would be glass or eye-holes on a mask. This will be used in the "window" of the shield, which will actually hold glass. Another place it will be used, for sure, is the molotov cocktail. You'll be able to see inside the bottle and can see the liquid move around. Condition Zero includes a level of detail system so the the high detail of models will be scaled down to the benefit of your framerate, while those with fast computers can experience full detail. Since you can change the face, skin tone, and other attributes of a model, there are over 160 different combinations." -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of Georges Giroux Sent: Sunday, March 24, 2002 6:09 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [hlcoders] Counter-Strike : Condition Zero Hey guys, Short and sweet, I was just wondering, will the graphical improvements of Condition Zero be eventually available to Half-Life mod makers? Georges ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders
