Re: [josm-dev] Validator
On Thu, 12 Jul 2012, Paul Hartmann wrote: I'd suggest an alternative: Remember the original version of each primitive; on upload run 2 passes for the validator: one for the (reconstructed) original dataset and one for the modified one. This solution isn't necessarily easier to implement, but it solves other problems as well: Currently, if you add a tag to a large number of objects, and later remove that tag, JOSM still keeps the modified flag for these objects, so they get uploaded and get a version bump, although the properties remain unchanged. In addition it would be useful to display the changes made to an object before upload (e.g. for a large relation; much like svn status). The history GUI could be reused for this. This still requires an extension of the data file format used in JOSM, but I think it's inevitable. There are a couple of other things that need to be saved to file, e.g. object histories and edit conflicts. The plain .osm format can be offered as export option instead. I agree that this would be an overall improvement - To keep server version for each changed object. This would allow several improvements including prevention of unnecessary changes. But I still would not reduce the displayed validator warnings. Maybe we could add a this one is new by you, e.g. by different color, but overall I don't want to reduce the impact of the validator. Again having a look at my father. When he changes objects and there are validator warnings, he will fix them (most of the time :-) But he probably never will call validator for the data set to start finding issues. I think the validator helped a lot to improve the current map. I read the discussion in talk-us and especially the crossing ways is not an theoretical issue, but is essential to allow proper routing. We had lots of these issues some years ago, we have only very few which today improving the overall quality a lot. For me the most disturbing warning is missing name and usually this is always right. OSM is missing a lot of names. In my holidays is used Garmin+OSM for routing: * We have very good data (except in south Ireland) * Garmin's routing engine and display of routing commands is crap :-) * We are missing tons of meta-data like street names Users changing data need to be notified about this or the situation will not change. And a user modifying an object may know the name and can fix it. It is not his fault that name is missing, but he may nevertheless be in the position to fix the issue. Todays errors are usually hidden in the data and not clearly visible. And not everybody will add an OpenStreetBugs entry when something wrong happens on routing. I think the validator is an essential tool and I don't want to reduce its impact. And to say it again: We did a lot in the last years to make it more userfriendly and I don't like these discussion coming up again and again which are based on the assumption that the validator is a silly programmers perfection tool. It is not! Ciao -- http://www.dstoecker.eu/ (PGP key available) ___ josm-dev mailing list josm-dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/josm-dev
Re: [josm-dev] Validator
On Jul 13, 2012 3:32 AM, Dirk Stöcker openstreet...@dstoecker.de wrote: Todays errors are usually hidden in the data and not clearly visible. And not everybody will add an OpenStreetBugs entry when something wrong happens on routing. I think the validator is an essential tool and I don't want to reduce its impact. I don't use OpenStreetBugs much anymore because it's a real pain to use, especially via RSS. Mapdust seems to be used by more data consumers, has good RSS feeds and a fairly reliable JOSM plugin. The only major issue is Skobbler makes it a little too easy to make a useless bug report. ___ josm-dev mailing list josm-dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/josm-dev
Re: [josm-dev] New tested version after API change fix?
Hi, I think we should enter in stabilization phase ASAP. I should have some time this week-end to run extensive tests, so a stable version released next week sounds a good idea to me. Vincent 2012/7/12 Paul Hartmann phaau...@googlemail.com Hi, In the process of the license switch, there has been a small change of the OSM API [1]. This causes JOSM to crash in certain situations [2][3]. A fix has been committed (v. 5326), so as a user you might want to update JOSM or at least save often, especially before upload and data update. @team: Do you think we should release an emergency tested version? The fix [5326] might cause a couple of bugs at other places, so in any case no need to rush things. [1] http://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/dev/2012-July/025209.html [2] http://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/rebuild/2012-July/000317.html [3] http://josm.openstreetmap.de/ticket/7847 Paul ___ josm-dev mailing list josm-dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/josm-dev ___ josm-dev mailing list josm-dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/josm-dev
Re: [josm-dev] Validator
On Fri, 13 Jul 2012, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote: Btw.: What could be improved is the stuff validator knows. The more it doesn't know, the less useful it becomes, because with lots of warnings you will not look at the single problem anymore. E.g. validator complains about tags on nodes (that it thinks are for ways only) also in conjunction with traffic_sign tags. When mapping maxspeeds some mappers store the position of the sign (tags: traffic_sign=maxspeed, maxspeed=60) and not just the speed limit implications on the way. For these cases open a ticket describing the exact case and your suggestion to fix it. Usually these tickets are fixed very fast except there is no clear indication that it really is a bug (i.e. if there are different opinions what is right). An attached patch also helps :-) E.g. a lot of unknown tags especially in relations could be fixed by more relation presets. Ciao -- http://www.dstoecker.eu/ (PGP key available) ___ josm-dev mailing list josm-dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/josm-dev
Re: [josm-dev] New tested version after API change fix?
On Fri, 13 Jul 2012, Vincent Privat wrote: I think we should enter in stabilization phase ASAP. I should have some time this week-end to run extensive tests, so a stable version released next week sounds a good idea to me. Volunteers are always accepted. Feel free to modify the wiki schedule pages and do the release. If you have questions, ask Paul or me by mail :-) As we had only few changes I would suggest a short stabilization phase when no problems appear in tests. Ciao -- http://www.dstoecker.eu/ (PGP key available) ___ josm-dev mailing list josm-dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/josm-dev
Re: [josm-dev] New tested version after API change fix?
2012/7/13 Dirk Stöcker openstreet...@dstoecker.de: On Fri, 13 Jul 2012, Vincent Privat wrote: I think we should enter in stabilization phase ASAP. I should have some time this week-end to run extensive tests, so a stable version released next week sounds a good idea to me. Volunteers are always accepted. Feel free to modify the wiki schedule pages and do the release. If you have questions, ask Paul or me by mail :-) As we had only few changes I would suggest a short stabilization phase when no problems appear in tests. +1, if you do extensive testing, you can as well take over the release completely. After all, the main work is to ensure that the software is stable enough for general use. Paul ___ josm-dev mailing list josm-dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/josm-dev
[josm-dev] JOSM Progress
Hello, out of curiosity I read some old mails in josm-dev and found that exactly 4 years ago, in June 2008 I appeared in JOSM world with a set of patches (I usually do so :-) and little knowledge. Frederik soon gave me SVN access to get rid of the task to checkin all my patches and in February 2009 he even convinced me to completely take over maintainership. For software 4 years is a long time and when reading the discussions in this list not everything has been easy but we all have done a great deal of work. JOSM is much much better than it was in 2008. When going from release to release and from bug to bug you don't really see how much it really improved. JOSM is now a mature tool, but still has some dark corners (e.g. the conflict resolution). So I want to say a big THANKS to all of you contributing to JOSM. To the developers and supporters still active as well to those who no longer participate. Ciao -- http://www.dstoecker.eu/ (PGP key available) ___ josm-dev mailing list josm-dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/josm-dev
Re: [josm-dev] New tested version after API change fix?
Alright :) Stabilization begins now. Objective: release on Wednesday. ___ josm-dev mailing list josm-dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/josm-dev
Re: [josm-dev] JOSM Progress
On Fri, Jul 13, 2012 at 5:42 PM, Dirk Stöcker openstreet...@dstoecker.de wrote: ... So I want to say a big THANKS to all of you contributing to JOSM. To the developers and supporters still active as well to those who no longer participate. And a big thanks to you for contributing code, running the site, and generally leading the project. I must say when I started reading your message I thought you were resigning. :) -Josh ___ josm-dev mailing list josm-dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/josm-dev
