Re: Emmentaler letters in LaTeX, kerning -- help wanted
14. August 2019 12:21, "David Kastrup" schrieb: > "Urs Liska" writes: > >> 14. August 2019 11:55, "David Kastrup" schrieb: >> >>> "Urs Liska" writes: >>> >> ... > People write music theory texts with other typesetters than LaTeX. > People even write music with other typesetters than LilyPond. The more > font information is routed via the fonts proper, the easier it also > becomes for LilyPond itself to utilize other fonts rather than to rely > implicitly on working with Emmentaler. I think you're basically right with everything here. But I think that does *not* call for updating Emmentaler with kerning pairs but rather for finally making Emmentaler (and LilyPond) SMuFL compliant by - storing the glyphs in the SMuFL-defined code points - providing them with SMuFL compliant metrics - make LilyPond look them up the SMuFL way and using the metrics (which probably differ from the current ones) With that in place LilyPond's fonts may more generally be used, and LilyPond is more likely to be able to use third-party fonts too. Urs ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: Emmentaler letters in LaTeX, kerning -- help wanted
"Urs Liska" writes: > 14. August 2019 11:55, "David Kastrup" schrieb: > >> "Urs Liska" writes: >> >>> Hi all, >>> >>> I'm currently rewriting my lilyglyphs package >>> ... >> >> Wouldn't it be a lot more generally useful (and likely more efficient >> since the mechanism is made for that) to just add those kerning pairs to >> the Emmentaler font itself? > > a) > How does LilyPond typeset letter combinations, would adding kerning > pairs to the font affect the use *in LilyPond* in any way? Sure: isn't that sort of the point? > If not it may indeed make sense to have the kerning in the font > itself. Why would it only make sense to have the kerning in the font if LilyPond ignored it? > b) > It seems more easy to implement directly in the LaTeX package, > especially concerning contribution, since it doesn't rely on compiling > LilyPond (and even waiting for a release). Sure, as long as you are operating under the theory that nobody except yourself will ever use Emmentaler as a font. But I don't see that LaTeX use is so special that it is reasonable to assume that. > c) > I'm thinking of a fallback solution where kerning pairs are defined > for Emmentaler while other fonts only have to declare deviations from > that. This wouldn't be possible with kerning built into the > font. Plus, the current approach does not require to update an > arbitrary number of fonts. Nobody said that doing things in a proper and generic manner would be less work than hot patches at the current place of need. > d) > What might other use cases beside typesetting in LilyPond and > including in text through lilyglyphs be that benefit from updating the > font itself? > > I'm not sure about this, asking honestly. People write music theory texts with other typesetters than LaTeX. People even write music with other typesetters than LilyPond. The more font information is routed via the fonts proper, the easier it also becomes for LilyPond itself to utilize other fonts rather than to rely implicitly on working with Emmentaler. -- David Kastrup ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: Emmentaler letters in LaTeX, kerning -- help wanted
14. August 2019 11:55, "David Kastrup" schrieb: > "Urs Liska" writes: > >> Hi all, >> >> I'm currently rewriting my lilyglyphs package >> ... > > Wouldn't it be a lot more generally useful (and likely more efficient > since the mechanism is made for that) to just add those kerning pairs to > the Emmentaler font itself? a) How does LilyPond typeset letter combinations, would adding kerning pairs to the font affect the use *in LilyPond* in any way? If not it may indeed make sense to have the kerning in the font itself. b) It seems more easy to implement directly in the LaTeX package, especially concerning contribution, since it doesn't rely on compiling LilyPond (and even waiting for a release). c) I'm thinking of a fallback solution where kerning pairs are defined for Emmentaler while other fonts only have to declare deviations from that. This wouldn't be possible with kerning built into the font. Plus, the current approach does not require to update an arbitrary number of fonts. d) What might other use cases beside typesetting in LilyPond and including in text through lilyglyphs be that benefit from updating the font itself? I'm not sure about this, asking honestly. Best Urs ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: Emmentaler letters in LaTeX, kerning -- help wanted
"Urs Liska" writes:
> Hi all,
>
> I'm currently rewriting my lilyglyphs package
> (http://ctan.org/pkg/lilyglyphs,
> https://github.com/uliska/lualilyglyphs) to make better use of
> advanced Lua functionality, which I hope will be great for future
> extensibility. And right now I've come across a great opportunity for
> someone (or somemultiple) people with little programming background
> but great enthusiasm to help me with that effort.
>
> There has always been a command lilyText{} that simply renders its
> argument using the Emmentaler font, which works for the rather few
> characters in Emmentaler that are at the regular positions in the
> font, namely dynamic letters, numbers and punctuation. In the earlier
> implementation I had added a number of special commands to typeset
> dynamic letter combinations that need kerning, e.g. lilyRFZ. But now
> I've implemented functionality to declare kerning pairs so one can
> simply write lilyText{rfz} and have the necessary kerning between the
> 'r' and the 'f' applied automatically.
Wouldn't it be a lot more generally useful (and likely more efficient
since the mechanism is made for that) to just add those kerning pairs to
the Emmentaler font itself?
--
David Kastrup
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Emmentaler letters in LaTeX, kerning -- help wanted
Hi all,
I'm currently rewriting my lilyglyphs package (http://ctan.org/pkg/lilyglyphs,
https://github.com/uliska/lualilyglyphs) to make better use of advanced Lua
functionality, which I hope will be great for future extensibility. And right
now I've come across a great opportunity for someone (or somemultiple) people
with little programming background but great enthusiasm to help me with that
effort.
There has always been a command lilyText{} that simply renders its argument
using the Emmentaler font, which works for the rather few characters in
Emmentaler that are at the regular positions in the font, namely dynamic
letters, numbers and punctuation. In the earlier implementation I had added a
number of special commands to typeset dynamic letter combinations that need
kerning, e.g. lilyRFZ. But now I've implemented functionality to declare
kerning pairs so one can simply write lilyText{rfz} and have the necessary
kerning between the 'r' and the 'f' applied automatically.
This is a huge improvement because now it's only necessary to define one Lua
table with kerning pairs for each supported notation font (I intend to have
lilyglyphs support all the notation fonts that are available under a free
license). I have created a kerning pair matrix to print all character
combinations, and I've written pairs for all the "fX" pairs in Emmentaler.
Attached you'll find that row before and after applying kerning to see the
effect, and the PDF with the whole matrix for Emmentaler and LilyJAZZ.
However, while this is a very uncomplicated process it is also time consuming,
and I think my time would be better spent continuing with the *programming*. At
the same time it would be a great opportunity for one or more people
contributing to a useful package who don't have a strong programming background
but are enthusiastic about finding the right kerning values at the second or
third fractional digit ;-)
Requirements would only be the capability to fill in a Lua table after a model
(I'd say anyone able to write LilyPond code should qualify) and to set up a
LuaLaTeX system with a few unreleased packages from Github. Essentially what
has to be done is complete this table/file
(https://github.com/uliska/lualilyglyphs/blob/lua-only/lilyglyphs-kern-emmentaler.lua
(https://github.com/uliska/lualilyglyphs/blob/lua-only/lilyglyphs-kern-emmentaler.lua))
and possibly add more for additional fonts.
I'm looking forward to any feedback and assistance
Urs
kerning-pairs.pdf
Description: Adobe PDF document
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