Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2023-08-29 Thread bruno . decraene
For the record, -04 published last week adequately addresses my comments. -- Bruno Orange Restricted -Original Message- From: DECRAENE Bruno INNOV/NET Sent: Monday, July 31, 2023 11:12 AM To: Peter Psenak Cc: lsr Subject: RE: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce Thanks

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2023-07-31 Thread bruno . decraene
Thanks Peter. -- Bruno Orange Restricted > -Original Message- > From: Peter Psenak > Sent: Sunday, July 30, 2023 8:04 PM > > Hi Bruno, > > I will update the draft. > > thanks, > Peter > > On 28/07/2023 14:32, bruno.decra...@orange.com wrote: > > Peter, > > > >> From: Peter Psenak >

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2023-07-30 Thread Peter Psenak
Hi Bruno, I will update the draft. thanks, Peter On 28/07/2023 14:32, bruno.decra...@orange.com wrote: Peter, From: Peter Psenak Sent: Thursday, July 27, 2023 8:00 PM Bruno, On 27/07/2023 16:12, bruno.decra...@orange.com wrote: Bottom line: - we see that this can be problematic in

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2023-07-28 Thread bruno . decraene
Peter, > From: Peter Psenak > Sent: Thursday, July 27, 2023 8:00 PM > > Bruno, > > On 27/07/2023 16:12, bruno.decra...@orange.com wrote: > > > > > Bottom line: > > - we see that this can be problematic in some cases > > - it's very easy to fix by mandating the use of the flags(s). > > I

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2023-07-27 Thread Peter Psenak
Bruno, On 27/07/2023 16:12, bruno.decra...@orange.com wrote: Bottom line: - we see that this can be problematic in some cases - it's very easy to fix by mandating the use of the flags(s). I believe we understand each other. I even believe we are in a violent agreement, although we have

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2023-07-27 Thread Gyan Mishra
27, 2023 at 9:31 AM wrote: > Hi Gyan, > > > > Please see inline. > > > > > > *From:* Gyan Mishra > *Sent:* Thursday, July 27, 2023 6:38 AM > *To:* DECRAENE Bruno INNOV/NET > *Cc:* Peter Psenak ; lsr > *Subject:* Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2023-07-27 Thread bruno . decraene
Peter, Please see inline (##Bruno2) > From: Peter Psenak > > Bruno, > > please see inline (##PP2): disclaimer: to ease further reading I took the liberty to edit some #PP into #PP2 (if I made some errors, they were not intentional) > > On 26/07/2023 23:34, bruno.decra...@orange.com

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2023-07-27 Thread bruno . decraene
Hi Gyan, Please see inline. From: Gyan Mishra Sent: Thursday, July 27, 2023 6:38 AM To: DECRAENE Bruno INNOV/NET Cc: Peter Psenak ; lsr Subject: Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce Hi Bruno Can you give an example of an application or scenario where you are forwarding

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2023-07-27 Thread Gyan Mishra
Understood. Thanks for clarification. Thanks Gyan On Thu, Jul 27, 2023 at 2:14 AM Robert Raszuk wrote: > > where you are forwarding hop by hop routing simultaneously with end to > end encapsulation. > > That is not the point here. What you said above is mutually exclusive. > > The issue

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2023-07-27 Thread Robert Raszuk
> where you are forwarding hop by hop routing simultaneously with end to end encapsulation. That is not the point here. What you said above is mutually exclusive. The issue arise when you are not doing end to end encapsulation as current UPA draft does not preclude using UPA for such networks

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2023-07-26 Thread Gyan Mishra
Hi Bruno Can you give an example of an application or scenario where you are forwarding hop by hop routing simultaneously with end to end encapsulation. So the end to end encapsulation would be MPLS, SR-MPLS or SRv6 and both global table routing and L3 VPN instances and even simultaneously all

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2023-07-26 Thread Robert Raszuk
Peter, I am with you that enabling signalling UPA to the application is up to the operator. But going with Bruno's concern, the app (say BGP) on vendor X may use UPA in a completely different way that on vendor Y then again on vendor Z. One may invalidate a path with a given next hop for 5 sec

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2023-07-26 Thread Peter Psenak
Bruno, please see inline (##PP2): On 26/07/2023 23:34, bruno.decra...@orange.com wrote: Peter, From: Peter Psenak Sent: Wednesday, July 26, 2023 11:26 PM Bruno, please see inline (##PP): On 26/07/2023 22:46, bruno.decra...@orange.com wrote: Peter, Please see inline From: Peter

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2023-07-26 Thread bruno . decraene
Peter, > From: Peter Psenak > Sent: Wednesday, July 26, 2023 11:26 PM > > Bruno, > > please see inline (##PP): > > On 26/07/2023 22:46, bruno.decra...@orange.com wrote: > > Peter, > > > > Please see inline > > > >> From: Peter Psenak > >> > >> Bruno, > >> > >> please see inline: > >>

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2023-07-26 Thread Peter Psenak
Bruno, please see inline (##PP): On 26/07/2023 22:46, bruno.decra...@orange.com wrote: Peter, Please see inline From: Peter Psenak Bruno, please see inline: On 25/07/2023 21:11, bruno.decra...@orange.com wrote: Peter, Please see inline From: Peter Psenak Sent: Tuesday, July

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2023-07-26 Thread bruno . decraene
Peter, Please see inline > From: Peter Psenak > > Bruno, > > please see inline: > > On 25/07/2023 21:11, bruno.decra...@orange.com wrote: > > Peter, > > > > Please see inline > > > >> From: Peter Psenak > >> Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2023 6:49 PM > >> > >> Bruno, > >> > >> please see

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2023-07-26 Thread bruno . decraene
Hi Peter, Please see inline. > From: Peter Psenak > Sent: Wednesday, July 26, 2023 5:41 PM > > Hi Bruno, > > please see inline: > > On 26/07/2023 16:38, bruno.decra...@orange.com wrote: > > Peter, > > > > please see inline > > > > > >> From: Peter Psenak > >> Sent: Tuesday, July 25,

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2023-07-26 Thread Peter Psenak
Hi Bruno, please see inline: On 26/07/2023 16:38, bruno.decra...@orange.com wrote: Peter, please see inline From: Peter Psenak Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2023 10:04 PM Bruno, please see inline: On 25/07/2023 20:58, bruno.decra...@orange.com wrote: Peter, Thank for you answer. Please

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2023-07-26 Thread bruno . decraene
Peter, please see inline > From: Peter Psenak > Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2023 10:04 PM > > Bruno, > > please see inline: > > On 25/07/2023 20:58, bruno.decra...@orange.com wrote: > > Peter, > > > > Thank for you answer. Please see inline [Bruno] > > > > > >> From: Peter Psenak >

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2023-07-25 Thread Peter Psenak
Bruno, please see inline: On 25/07/2023 21:11, bruno.decra...@orange.com wrote: Peter, Please see inline From: Peter Psenak Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2023 6:49 PM Bruno, please see inline: On 25/07/2023 18:36, bruno.decra...@orange.com wrote: Peter, Thanks for your answer. Please see

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2023-07-25 Thread Peter Psenak
Bruno, please see inline: On 25/07/2023 20:58, bruno.decra...@orange.com wrote: Peter, Thank for you answer. Please see inline [Bruno] From: Peter Psenak Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2023 6:11 PM Bruno, On 25/07/2023 14:39, bruno.decra...@orange.com wrote: Hi all, IP reachability

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2023-07-25 Thread bruno . decraene
Peter, > From: Peter Psenak > Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2023 7:38 PM > To: Robert Raszuk > > Hi Robert, > > > > On 25/07/2023 18:51, Robert Raszuk wrote: > > Hey Peter, > > > > I think the point Bruno is making is valid ... Imagine dual or triple > > vendor network and hop by hop routing (no end

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2023-07-25 Thread bruno . decraene
Thanks Robert, you got my point. More inline. From: Robert Raszuk Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2023 7:51 PM To: Peter Psenak Cc: DECRAENE Bruno INNOV/NET ; lsr Subject: Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce Hi, > So we have a way to achieve consistency if it is ever needed. W

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2023-07-25 Thread bruno . decraene
Peter, Please see inline > From: Peter Psenak > Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2023 6:49 PM > > Bruno, > > please see inline: > > On 25/07/2023 18:36, bruno.decra...@orange.com wrote: > > Peter, > > > > Thanks for your answer. > > Please see inline [Bruno] > > > > > >> From: Peter Psenak

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2023-07-25 Thread bruno . decraene
Peter, Thank for you answer. Please see inline [Bruno] > From: Peter Psenak > Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2023 6:11 PM > > Bruno, > > On 25/07/2023 14:39, bruno.decra...@orange.com wrote: > > Hi all, > > > > IP reachability advertised by IS-IS is often used by other routing and > >

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2023-07-25 Thread Peter Psenak
Robert, On 25/07/2023 19:50, Robert Raszuk wrote: Hi, > So we have a way to achieve consistency if it is ever needed. Well you do not have any protocol way to assure that operational configuration mistakes will not result in inconsistent routing. But overall I do agree that for the vast

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2023-07-25 Thread Robert Raszuk
Hi, > So we have a way to achieve consistency if it is ever needed. Well you do not have any protocol way to assure that operational configuration mistakes will not result in inconsistent routing. But overall I do agree that for the vast majority of applications that concern is not really

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2023-07-25 Thread Peter Psenak
Hi Robert, On 25/07/2023 18:51, Robert Raszuk wrote: Hey Peter, I think the point Bruno is making is valid ... Imagine dual or triple vendor network and hop by hop routing (no end to end SAFI). That means that all nodes should be in synch in terms to react on UPA, chapter 7 of the draft

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2023-07-25 Thread Robert Raszuk
Hey Peter, I think the point Bruno is making is valid ... Imagine dual or triple vendor network and hop by hop routing (no end to end SAFI). That means that all nodes should be in synch in terms to react on UPA, Of course you will say that this is up to wise operator to enable it only when it

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2023-07-25 Thread Peter Psenak
Bruno, please see inline: On 25/07/2023 18:36, bruno.decra...@orange.com wrote: Peter, Thanks for your answer. Please see inline [Bruno] From: Peter Psenak Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2023 6:05 PM Bruno, On 25/07/2023 14:39, bruno.decra...@orange.com wrote: Hi all, With RC5305, in

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2023-07-25 Thread bruno . decraene
Peter, Thanks for your answer. Please see inline [Bruno] > From: Peter Psenak > Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2023 6:05 PM > > Bruno, > > On 25/07/2023 14:39, bruno.decra...@orange.com wrote: > > Hi all, > > > > With RC5305, in IS-IS we can advertise two states for a prefix IP1: > > > > *

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2023-07-25 Thread Peter Psenak
Bruno, On 25/07/2023 14:39, bruno.decra...@orange.com wrote: Hi all, IP reachability advertised by IS-IS is often used by other routing and signaling protocols (e.g., BGP, PIM (rpf vector) LDP, RSVP-TE...). As such, UPA may affect those protocols. Has UPA been presented in other WGs in the

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2023-07-25 Thread Peter Psenak
Bruno, On 25/07/2023 14:39, bruno.decra...@orange.com wrote: Hi all, With RC5305, in IS-IS we can advertise two states for a prefix IP1: * Positive reachability (state “1”), by advertising IP1 in TLV 135 with a metric lower than 0xFE00 * No reachability (state “0”) by either:

[Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2023-07-25 Thread bruno . decraene
Hi all, IP reachability advertised by IS-IS is often used by other routing and signaling protocols (e.g., BGP, PIM (rpf vector) LDP, RSVP-TE...). As such, UPA may affect those protocols. Has UPA been presented in other WGs in the routing areas? I believe this would be prudent if not required.

[Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2023-07-25 Thread bruno . decraene
Hi all, With RC5305, in IS-IS we can advertise two states for a prefix IP1: * Positive reachability (state "1"), by advertising IP1 in TLV 135 with a metric lower than 0xFE00 * No reachability (state "0") by either: * Not advertising IP1 in TLV 135 * Advertising IP1

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2023-03-27 Thread Peter Psenak
Robert, On 27/03/2023 17:18, Robert Raszuk wrote: > All it does that it advertises UPA for  prefixes that are summarized on it and change from reachable to unreachable Ok but this is a bit too vague, If my ABR disconnects from an area nodes it should remove the summary and not inject

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2023-03-27 Thread Robert Raszuk
> All it does that it advertises UPA for prefixes that are summarized on it and change from reachable to unreachable Ok but this is a bit too vague, If my ABR disconnects from an area nodes it should remove the summary and not inject possibly 100s or 1000s of UPAs. And IMO the draft should

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2023-03-27 Thread Peter Psenak
Robert, On 27/03/2023 16:57, Robert Raszuk wrote: Hi Peter, >  4. Is an UPA for a /24 equivalent to 255 UPA for /32? (i.e. will >     trigger BGP PIC edge for 255 /32) no. For BGP PIC to be triggered by UPA, the UPA must be sent for the prefix that is used to resolve BGP

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2023-03-27 Thread Robert Raszuk
> > Hi Peter, > > > 4. Is an UPA for a /24 equivalent to 255 UPA for /32? (i.e. will > > trigger BGP PIC edge for 255 /32) > > no. For BGP PIC to be triggered by UPA, the UPA must be sent for the > prefix that is used to resolve BGP prefixes. But the treatment of the > UPA is outside of the

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2023-03-27 Thread Peter Psenak
Hi Bruno, On 27/03/2023 06:59, bruno.decra...@orange.com wrote: Hi authors, Please find below some questions. 1. Assuming ABR1 advertises IP1 with metric 10 while ABR2 advertises IP1 with MAX metric. Is this prefix reachable or unreachable (or both)? UPA is meant to be sent only for

[Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2023-03-26 Thread bruno.decraene
Hi authors, Please find below some questions. 1. Assuming ABR1 advertises IP1 with metric 10 while ABR2 advertises IP1 with MAX metric. Is this prefix reachable or unreachable (or both)? 2. Assuming ABR1 advertises a summary address but ABR2 does not. If ABR2 advertises IP1 with MAX

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce / UPA IS-IS semantics

2022-11-14 Thread Christian Hopps
"Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" writes: Chris/David - I was replying to Peter saying that implementations are using the max metric announcements to avoid sending traffic to overload routers. [LES:] Are you claiming this because you know this to be true - or are you just speculating that an

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce / UPA IS-IS semantics

2022-11-13 Thread Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)
Chris/David - > > I was replying to Peter saying that implementations are using the max metric > announcements to avoid sending traffic to overload routers. [LES:] Are you claiming this because you know this to be true - or are you just speculating that an implementation "might" do this? If

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce / UPA IS-IS semantics

2022-11-13 Thread Peter Psenak
On 12/11/2022 06:45, Christian Hopps wrote: On Nov 9, 2022, at 2:13 PM, Peter Psenak wrote: On 09/11/2022 14:56, David Lamparter wrote: On Wed, Nov 09, 2022 at 01:27:41PM +, Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: I guess I'd like to understand what one would accomplish with further specification

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce / UPA IS-IS semantics

2022-11-13 Thread Robert Raszuk
Hi Chris, > If that means they are installing a negative route then they are modifying the IP routing table. > If he meant they don't do anything with the announcement, well then that's in spec. There are lots of options between installing negative route in IP routing table and not doing

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce / UPA IS-IS semantics

2022-11-13 Thread Christian Hopps
Robert Raszuk writes: Chris, unreachable routes in the IP routing table That quote leaves zero context at all for what I was saying. I was replying to Peter saying that implementations are using the max metric announcements to avoid sending traffic to overload routers. If that means

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce / UPA IS-IS semantics

2022-11-12 Thread Aijun Wang
Hi, Robert: > "other than building the normal IP routing table" There may be different purposes, so advertise the “unreachable within the summary address” should be signed explicitly. Aijun Wang China Telecom > On Nov 12, 2022, at 11:59, Robert Raszuk wrote: > >  > Chris, > > >

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce / UPA IS-IS semantics

2022-11-12 Thread Robert Raszuk
Chris, > unreachable routes in the IP routing table I don't see anywhere in the UPA spec even a hint that those unreachable pulses would be installed in the IP routing table. It seems to be a local implementation choice how ISIS or OSPF would inform other protocols about them. In fact the quote

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce / UPA IS-IS semantics

2022-11-11 Thread Christian Hopps
> On Nov 9, 2022, at 2:13 PM, Peter Psenak > wrote: > > On 09/11/2022 14:56, David Lamparter wrote: >> On Wed, Nov 09, 2022 at 01:27:41PM +, Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: >>> I guess I'd like to understand what one would accomplish with further >>> specification of prefix reachable? What

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce / UPA IS-IS semantics

2022-11-10 Thread Robert Raszuk
> > > > I think the point of this was that it could be other applications where > > an ephemeral unreachability notification is useful. For this type of > > notification, recursive route resolution is the primary application. > > However, I’ll defer to the authors. > > that is correct indeed. >

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce / UPA IS-IS semantics

2022-11-10 Thread Peter Psenak
On 10/11/2022 11:59, Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: Hi Robert, *From: *Robert Raszuk *Date: *Thursday, November 10, 2022 at 10:51 AM *To: *Acee Lindem *Cc: *Peter Psenak , Bruno Decraene , David Lamparter , "lsr@ietf.org" *Subject: *Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-anno

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce / UPA IS-IS semantics

2022-11-10 Thread Acee Lindem (acee)
Hi Robert, From: Robert Raszuk Date: Thursday, November 10, 2022 at 10:51 AM To: Acee Lindem Cc: Peter Psenak , Bruno Decraene , David Lamparter , "lsr@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce / UPA IS-IS semantics > But BGP service PIC is

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce / UPA IS-IS semantics

2022-11-10 Thread Aijun Wang
Hi, Peter: I suggest that you consider such problems and the solutions from the broader viewpoint, not just the behavior of one single device, or only from the vendor side. To deploy the mechanism into the network, the operator must assure it will not conflict with other possible usages, and

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce / UPA IS-IS semantics

2022-11-10 Thread Robert Raszuk
, David Lamparter < > equi...@diac24.net>, Acee Lindem , "lsr@ietf.org" < > lsr@ietf.org> > *Subject: *Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce / UPA > IS-IS semantics > > > > Peter, > > > > > But: > > - that is none

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce / UPA IS-IS semantics

2022-11-10 Thread Acee Lindem (acee)
Hi Robert, From: Robert Raszuk Date: Thursday, November 10, 2022 at 9:41 AM To: Peter Psenak Cc: Bruno Decraene , David Lamparter , Acee Lindem , "lsr@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce / UPA IS-IS semantics Peter, > But: > - tha

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce / UPA IS-IS semantics

2022-11-10 Thread Peter Psenak
On 09/11/2022 22:51, Aijun Wang wrote: Hi, Peter: Actually, the “unreachable” meaning of LSInfinity in current standard is not the same as the “unreachable” meaning that we are supposed to act: 1) In current standard, the “unreachable” is meant that the related prefix will not be in the

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce / UPA IS-IS semantics

2022-11-10 Thread Robert Raszuk
Peter, > But: > > - that is nonetheless a change which is non backward compatible with > people currently using such high metric without the intention to mean UPA > > - to differentiate different usages (e.g. your UPA, my other usage such > as "graceful shutdown" (still reachable but will

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce / UPA IS-IS semantics

2022-11-10 Thread Peter Psenak
Bruno, On 10/11/2022 02:18, bruno.decra...@orange.com wrote: Peter, From: Peter Psenak Sent: Wednesday, November 9, 2022 2:13 PM On 09/11/2022 14:56, David Lamparter wrote: On Wed, Nov 09, 2022 at 01:27:41PM +, Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: I guess I'd like to understand what one would

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce / UPA IS-IS semantics

2022-11-09 Thread bruno.decraene
Peter, > From: Peter Psenak > Sent: Wednesday, November 9, 2022 2:13 PM > > On 09/11/2022 14:56, David Lamparter wrote: > > On Wed, Nov 09, 2022 at 01:27:41PM +, Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: > >> I guess I'd like to understand what one would accomplish with further > >> specification of

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce / UPA IS-IS semantics

2022-11-09 Thread Robert Raszuk
Aijun, > there is another summary address that covers it is in the FIB. You keep bringing this point over and over. But what you are not aware of is that service route validation or invalidation can be set and tracked for reachability with specific length of the next hop. Both validation and

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce / UPA IS-IS semantics

2022-11-09 Thread Aijun Wang
Hi, Peter: Actually, the “unreachable” meaning of LSInfinity in current standard is not the same as the “unreachable” meaning that we are supposed to act: 1) In current standard, the “unreachable” is meant that the related prefix will not be in the FIB.(you can read again and again

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce / UPA IS-IS semantics

2022-11-09 Thread Peter Psenak
On 09/11/2022 16:32, David Lamparter wrote: On Wed, Nov 09, 2022 at 03:16:11PM +, Peter Psenak wrote: On 09/11/2022 15:48, David Lamparter wrote: On Wed, Nov 09, 2022 at 02:32:35PM +, Peter Psenak wrote: as far as that /128 is not used as BGP next-hop (which obviously is not the

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce / UPA IS-IS semantics

2022-11-09 Thread David Lamparter
On Wed, Nov 09, 2022 at 03:16:11PM +, Peter Psenak wrote: > On 09/11/2022 15:48, David Lamparter wrote: > > On Wed, Nov 09, 2022 at 02:32:35PM +, Peter Psenak wrote: > >> as far as that /128 is not used as BGP next-hop (which obviously is not > >> the case), > > > > You keep saying things

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce / UPA IS-IS semantics

2022-11-09 Thread Peter Psenak
On 09/11/2022 15:48, David Lamparter wrote: On Wed, Nov 09, 2022 at 02:32:35PM +, Peter Psenak wrote: On 09/11/2022 15:26, David Lamparter wrote: On Wed, Nov 09, 2022 at 02:13:17PM +, Peter Psenak wrote: and why that would be a problem? Such prefix would never be used to for

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce / UPA IS-IS semantics

2022-11-09 Thread David Lamparter
On Wed, Nov 09, 2022 at 02:32:35PM +, Peter Psenak wrote: > On 09/11/2022 15:26, David Lamparter wrote: > > On Wed, Nov 09, 2022 at 02:13:17PM +, Peter Psenak wrote: > >> and why that would be a problem? Such prefix would never be used to for > >> resolution of the BGP prefix. > > > >

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce / UPA IS-IS semantics

2022-11-09 Thread Peter Psenak
On 09/11/2022 15:26, David Lamparter wrote: On Wed, Nov 09, 2022 at 02:13:17PM +, Peter Psenak wrote: On 09/11/2022 14:56, David Lamparter wrote: On Wed, Nov 09, 2022 at 01:27:41PM +, Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: The problem is that a prefix with metric > 0xfe00 isn't actually an

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce / UPA IS-IS semantics

2022-11-09 Thread David Lamparter
On Wed, Nov 09, 2022 at 02:13:17PM +, Peter Psenak wrote: > On 09/11/2022 14:56, David Lamparter wrote: > > On Wed, Nov 09, 2022 at 01:27:41PM +, Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: > > The problem is that a prefix with metric > 0xfe00 isn't actually an > > unreachable prefix, it's a prefix that

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce / UPA IS-IS semantics

2022-11-09 Thread Peter Psenak
On 09/11/2022 14:56, David Lamparter wrote: On Wed, Nov 09, 2022 at 01:27:41PM +, Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: I guess I'd like to understand what one would accomplish with further specification of prefix reachable? What requirement would this satisfy? For the use case UPA is designed to

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce / UPA IS-IS semantics

2022-11-09 Thread Peter Psenak
Aijun, On 09/11/2022 13:21, Aijun Wang wrote: Hi, Peter: I think you over explain the meaning of “LSInfinity”. I concur with David: A less specific prefix may cover it Then, you conclusion that: when a prefix is "not considered during the normal Shortest Path First (SPF) computation",

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce / UPA IS-IS semantics

2022-11-09 Thread David Lamparter
On Wed, Nov 09, 2022 at 01:27:41PM +, Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: > I guess I'd like to understand what one would accomplish with further > specification of prefix reachable? What requirement would this > satisfy? For the use case UPA is designed to handle (triggering BGP > PIC or other local

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce / UPA IS-IS semantics

2022-11-09 Thread Aijun Wang
One more information: The explicit solution, https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-wang-lsr-prefix-unreachable-annoucement-10 does not require all the nodes be upgraded simultaneously. Aijun Wang China Telecom > On Nov 9, 2022, at 12:06, Peter Psenak > Using a new Sub-TLV to signal

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce / UPA IS-IS semantics

2022-11-09 Thread Acee Lindem (acee)
Speaking as WG Participant: Hi Bruno, David, I guess I'd like to understand what one would accomplish with further specification of prefix reachable? What requirement would this satisfy? For the use case UPA is designed to handle (triggering BGP PIC or other local action) , I can't see that

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce / UPA IS-IS semantics

2022-11-09 Thread Aijun Wang
Hi, Peter: I think you over explain the meaning of “LSInfinity”. I concur with David: >> A less specific prefix may cover it Then, you conclusion that: > when a prefix is "not considered during the normal Shortest Path First (SPF) > computation", the result will be that the prefix will become

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce / UPA IS-IS semantics

2022-11-09 Thread Peter Psenak
Hi David, On 09/11/2022 11:44, David Lamparter wrote: Hi Peter, hi all, to iterate on the comment I made on the mic a few minutes ago, I apparently have a rather different understanding of existing IS-IS behaviour. Reading 5305/5308, ... "if a prefix is advertised with a

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce / UPA IS-IS semantics

2022-11-09 Thread David Lamparter
On Wed, Nov 09, 2022 at 10:55:38AM +, bruno.decra...@orange.com wrote: > > From: Lsr On Behalf Of David Lamparter > > I'd rather not do that and just add > > a sub-TLV for it. > > I'm fine to use max_prefix as per RFC 5305 (prefix not considered > during SPF) as this allow for incremental

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce / UPA IS-IS semantics

2022-11-09 Thread bruno.decraene
> From: Lsr On Behalf Of David Lamparter > Sent: Wednesday, November 9, 2022 10:45 AM > Hi Peter, hi all, > > > to iterate on the comment I made on the mic a few minutes ago, I > apparently have a rather different understanding of existing IS-IS > behaviour. Reading 5305/5308, > > ...

[Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce / UPA IS-IS semantics

2022-11-09 Thread David Lamparter
Hi Peter, hi all, to iterate on the comment I made on the mic a few minutes ago, I apparently have a rather different understanding of existing IS-IS behaviour. Reading 5305/5308, ... "if a prefix is advertised with a metric larger than MAX_V6_PATH_METRIC (0xFE00),

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2022-06-16 Thread Peter Psenak
; lsr@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce Hi Bruno, thanks for your feedback, please see inline (##PP): On 15/06/2022 16:09, bruno.decra...@orange.com wrote: Hi Peter, authors, all Thanks for the draft. I find it a useful contribution to the problem space

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2022-06-16 Thread bruno.decraene
Hi Peter, Thanks for your reply. Please see inline [Bruno2] Orange Restricted > -Original Message- > From: Peter Psenak > Sent: Thursday, June 16, 2022 11:22 AM > To: DECRAENE Bruno INNOV/NET ; lsr@ietf.org > Subject: Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-a

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2022-06-16 Thread Robert Raszuk
Bruno, Actually I like your flag suggestion for an additional and different reason. If someone does not need to flood UPAs in any remote area it is trivial to filter those on the ABRs connecting those areas to the core. Otherwise such filtering could be more difficult if at all possible. Thx,

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2022-06-16 Thread Peter Psenak
Hi Bruno, thanks for your feedback, please see inline (##PP): On 15/06/2022 16:09, bruno.decra...@orange.com wrote: Hi Peter, authors, all Thanks for the draft. I find it a useful contribution to the problem space. IMHO the use of MAX_PATH_METRIC is a good idea in particular since it can be

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2022-06-16 Thread bruno.decraene
Daniel, inline Orange Restricted From: Voyer, Daniel Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2022 9:43 PM To: DECRAENE Bruno INNOV/NET ; lsr@ietf.org Subject: RE: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce Bruno, inline From: Bruno Decraene mailto:bruno.decra...@orange.com>> Date: Wednesday

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2022-06-16 Thread bruno.decraene
Hi Aijun, Orange Restricted From: Aijun Wang Sent: Thursday, June 16, 2022 1:59 AM To: DECRAENE Bruno INNOV/NET Cc: lsr@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce Hi, Bruno: I agree with your thoughts on the solutions to this questions. Actually

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2022-06-15 Thread Aijun Wang
Hi, Bruno: I agree with your thoughts on the solutions to this questions. Actually, this is the reason that we brought up the thread “Convergence of Prefixes Unreachable Announcement Proposal” and I think you can review the discussion of this thread again. And, in the mail

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2022-06-15 Thread Voyer, Daniel
Bruno, inline From: Bruno Decraene Date: Wednesday, June 15, 2022 at 12:27 PM To: Dan Voyer , "lsr@ietf.org" Subject: [EXT]RE: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce Hi Daniel, I agree that the draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce, is presented as “

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2022-06-15 Thread bruno.decraene
: DECRAENE Bruno INNOV/NET ; lsr@ietf.org Subject: RE: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce Hi Bruno, Thanks for your comment on the draft. I too, have a minor disagreement on your disagreement. The draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce, is really presented as "a use case

Re: [Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2022-06-15 Thread Voyer, Daniel
: Wednesday, June 15, 2022 at 10:09 AM To: "lsr@ietf.org" Subject: [EXT][Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce Hi Peter, authors, all Thanks for the draft. I find it a useful contribution to the problem space. IMHO the use of MAX_PATH_METRIC is a good idea in particular since it ca

[Lsr] draft-ppsenak-lsr-igp-ureach-prefix-announce

2022-06-15 Thread bruno.decraene
Hi Peter, authors, all Thanks for the draft. I find it a useful contribution to the problem space. IMHO the use of MAX_PATH_METRIC is a good idea in particular since it can be made backward compatible and provides incremental benefits with incremental deployment. I also have two disagreements